JIM: THIS WEEK ON "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT," THE WANING DAYS OF THE LIVELY ASSEMBLY FEATURE A FLOOD OF BILLS.

AND WILL THE U.S. SUPREME COURT DECISION HAVE ANY EFFECT ON RECENTLY PASSED GUN LEGISLATION HERE?

>> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- >> HI, I AM JOHN HAYES AND JUNIOR, "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT INTO POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.

I AM A PROUD SUPPORTER OF THE PROGRAM AND RHODE ISLAND PBS.

JIM: JOINING US ON THE PANEL, PABLO RODRIGUEZ, RETIRED PROFESSOR AT THE ALPERT MEDICAL SCHOOL.

FORMER RHODE ISLAND ATTORNEY GENERAL ARLENE VIOLET.

AND BOSTON GLOBE REPORTER ED FITZPATRICK.

I AM JIM HUMMEL.

WE APPRECIATE YOU SPENDING PART OF YOUR WEEKEND WITH US.

A $13.6 BILLION BUDGET, DRIVERS PERMITS FOR UNDOCUMENTED RESIDENTS, AND AN EARLY PHASE OUT OF THE CAR TAX.

THOSE ARE A FEW OF THE HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY SESSION IN ITS LAST WEEKS, CONSUMED BY GUN LEGISLATION.

ED FITZPATRICK CAME OVER FROM THE SESSION.

HE WAS THERE LATE THURSDAY NIGHT.

I WAS GOING TO SAY, GIVE ME A RECAP.

A SURPRISE WAS THE HEADLINE FROM THURSDAY NIGHT.

ED: I CAME DIRECTLY FROM THE STATE HOUSE AND THAT WAS THE LATE NIGHT SURPRISE, REPRESENTATIVE CHIPPENDALE ANNOUNCED THAT BLAKE WOULD NOT BE RUNNING FOR REELECTION, AND CHIPPENDALE BECAME THE NEW MINORITY LEADER RIGHT AWAY.

DAVID IS TAKING HIS PLACE AS A HOUSE MINORITY WHIP.

NOBODY SAW THAT COMING.

JIM: WERE YOU ABLE TO FIND OUT IN INTERVIEWS AFTERWARDS, OR IS THAT GOING TO ROLL OUT THE NEXT COUPLE OF DAYS?

ED: I TALKED TO FILIPPI AFTERWARDS.

HE DID NOT GIVE A SPECIFIC DECISION.

HE KNOWS THE TIME IS RIGHT.

HE FELT IT WAS THE TIME TO MAKE THE MOVE, AND HE WOULD TALK ABOUT IT MORE.

CHIPPENDALE MADE IT CLEAR THAT IT WAS A GOOD REASON HE WAS LEAVING.

IT WAS NOT ANYTHING TO DO WITH FRICTION WITH THE PARTY.

IT DID NOT HAVE TO DO WITH HEALTH CONCERNS.

HE MIGHT HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY THAT HE IS GOING TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF.

JIM: IS HE GOING TO RUN FOR GOVERNOR OR AS INDEPENDENT?

IS THAT ONE OF THE OPPORTUNITIES?

ED: PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT HIM AS A POTENTIAL CANDIDATE FOR GOVERNOR, AND HE DECIDED NOT TO DO THAT.

I DON'T SEE THAT.

JIM: ARLENE?

ARLENE: I DON'T THINK HE WILL BE A CANDIDATE BECAUSE HE WOULD NOT HAVE NEXT IT TO START WITH.

IT IS PROBABLY -- NNIXED IT TO START WITH.

PABLO, YOU ARE ON THE BOARD OF PBS, SO WE -- JIM: PABLO, YOU ARE ON THE BOARD OF PBS, WE WANTED TO DISCLOSE THAT.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

PABLO: THIS IS A NEW LEGISLATURE, AND THIS BUDGET DOESN'T SHOW A NUMBER OF PRIORITIES THAT YEARS BACK WOULD NEVER HAVE HAPPENED AND DID NOT HAPPEN, JUST LIKE DRIVERS LICENSE FOR UNDOCUMENTED.

AND A NUMBER OF INVESTMENTS IN PUBLIC HEALTH AND MATERNAL CHILD HEALTH THAT ARE ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC AND ADVOCATES HAVE BEEN FIGHTING FOR FOR A LONG TIME.

THE FACT THAT WE HAVE EXPANDED MEDICAID FOR PREGNANT WOMEN, FOR A WHOLE YEAR, REGARDLESS OF YOUR IMMIGRATION STATUS, FOR THE MOTHER AND THE CHILD, IS JUST AN INCREDIBLE DEVELOPMENT AND SOMETHING THAT MAKES ME VERY HAPPY.

JIM: WHERE THERE ANY OTHER SURPRISES?

HE KIND OF TOOK THE HEADLINE, BUT AS THINGS WERE GOING ALONG, WAS IT PRETTY PRO FORMA OR DID ANYTHING STRIKE YOU?

ED: IT LOOKED PRETTY MUCH PRO FORMA.

THE SENATE PASSED THE BUDGET.

THERE WAS A SIMILAR DEBATE TO WHAT WE SAW IN THE HOUSE.

LATE IN THE SESSION AND THEN IN THE SENATE, THERE WAS SOME DISPUTE ABOUT A BILL THAT CAME OVER THAT SUSPENDED THE PENALTIES THAT WERE BEING APPLIED TO NURSING HOMES THAT DID NOT MEET STAFFING LEVELS.

THERE WAS A LOT OF FRICTION OVER THAT.

THAT WAS TAKEN UP BY THE MEDIA CONSIDERATION, AND IT INCLUDED NAMING THE CCRI CAMPUS FOR THE FORMER SENATE PRESIDENT.

JIM: I WONDER, ARLENE, THE PRESIDENT RECENTLY CALLED FOR A SUSPENSION OF THE FEDERAL GAS TAX.

WHETHER THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN OR NOT BECAUSE HE IS GETTING RESISTANCE.

THE LEADERSHIP HAS BEEN HESITANT TO DO THAT IN RHODE ISLAND.

MAYBE IT IS A FEEL-GOOD, WE HAVE A $900 BILLION SURPLUS, WOULD YOU FAVOR THAT?

ARLENE: FOR THE THREE MONTHS, CERTAINLY, I THINK IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN CONSIDERED AND PERHAPS PASSED.

THE ARGUMENT AGAINST IT IS, FIRST OF ALL, IT CREATES CONSUMPTION BECAUSE THEN PEOPLE DON'T WATCH THEIR GASEOUS, SO THEY KEEP GOING EVERY PLACE.

WE REALLY SHOULD BE CONSERVING.

THE OTHER ASPECT, THIS IS LIKE A GIFT TO RICH PEOPLE BECAUSE THE MERCEDES ARE DRIVING IS A GAS GUZZLER, ETC.

BY THE SAME TOKEN, FORGIVENESS FALLS IN THAT CATEGORY.

THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE TO PAY THE CONTACT.

THE ARGUMENT DOES NOT REALLY HOLD WEIGHT WHEN YOU SEE WHAT PASS SOMETHING LIKE MAKING THE CAR TAX EARLY.

I THOUGHT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN A GOOD IDEA FOR AT LEAST THREE MONTHS DURING THIS UPCOMING SEASON.

PABLO: I THINK IT IS ESSENTIAL.

I THINK POOR PEOPLE DRIVE TO WORK.

THEY DON'T HAVE REMOTE WORK, SO, FOR EXAMPLE, A GAS TAX HOLIDAY WAS ALSO CALLED FOR TO SAVE $8.50 OFF YOUR F-150 TRUCK EVERY TIME YOU FILLED IT UP.

IF YOU COMBINE THAT WITH BIDEN'S SUGGESTION, YOU ARE TALKING $13.50, THAT IN F-150 TRUCK WOULD SAY FILLING UP.

THOSE ARE THE VEHICLES WORKING PEOPLE USE.

I REMEMBER MY FATHER WORKING AND RUNNING OUT OF MONEY AT THE END OF THE MONTH.

IF WE HAD HAD 13.50 DOLLARS EVERY WEEK, WE WOULD HAVE FELT RICH.

ED: LAST NIGHT, AN AMENDMENT WAS PROPOSED TO SUSPEND THE GAS TAX FOR THREE MONTHS.

SHE SAID, PUT THAT TOGETHER WITH WHAT BIDEN IS SUGGESTING, AND IT WOULD BE SUBSTANTIAL SAVINGS, BUT IT WAS REJECTED.

YOU CANNOT GUARANTEE THAT THE SAVINGS ARE GOING TO GO TO THE CUSTOMER.

HE SAID IN OTHER STATES, UP TO 80% HAS GONE TO OIL COMPANIES.

HE SAID ENFORCEMENT MECHANISMS WERE DIFFICULT.

ARLENE: IF THAT WERE TRUE, THEN WE SHOULD NOT HAVE THE TAX ADULT IF WE REALLY CANNOT VERIFY -- TAX AT ALL IF WE CANNOT VERIFY THAT AS GOING INTO THE CAUCUS TO FIX THE ROADS.

THE OTHER PART IS, IT HURTS THE ECONOMY.

MANY PEOPLE ARE WEIGHING AND MEASURING WHERE THEY GO.

THEY DON'T GO TO A RESTAURANT AND THEN GO SOMEPLACE.

OR OWNER DOES NOT HAVE THOSE PEOPLE COMING INTO -- THAT MEANS THE OWNER DOES NOT HAVE THOSE PEOPLE COMING INTO BUSINESS.

I THOUGHT IT WAS SHORTSIGHTED THEY DID NOT DO IT FOR THREE MONTHS.

ED: FOUR YEARS AGO, THE BUDGET WAS 9 BILLION.

IT HAS BEEN INFLATED.

-- JIM: FOUR YEARS AGO, THE BUDGET WAS 9 BILLION.

IT HAS BEEN INFLATED.

THE ADDED TO WHAT THE GOVERNOR REQUESTED, SO YOU WONDER WHERE WE ARE GOING TO BE THE FOLLOWING YEAR.

PABLO: IT IS A LONG TRADITION IN RHODE ISLAND TO KICK THE CAN DOWN THE ROAD OF ALL THE EXPENDITURES.

IN REALITY, WE REALLY NEED TO START THINKING ABOUT THOSE YEARS BECAUSE IF WE GO INTO A RECESSION, WHICH MANY ECONOMISTS ARE PREDICTING, WE COULD BE IN SAD SHAPE.

AS FAST AS THE DEFICIT DISAPPEARED THIS YEAR, IT CAN GROW NEXT YEAR IF ALL OF THE TAX REVENUES ARE NOT COMING IN.

REMOVING THE CAR TAX, EVERYTHING ELSE, AND KEEPING UP WITH ALL THE PROMISES THE GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATES ARE MAKING.

FORGET IT.

ARLENE: YEAH, THE HOUSE SPEAKER -- ED: YEAH, THE HOUSE SPEAKER WAS ASKED ABOUT THAT.

HE SAID I'M NOT GOING TO TURN DOWN THE FEDERAL MONEY.

IT COULD HOPE RHODE ISLAND.

IT HAS GROWN SUBSTANTIALLY.

JIM: WHAT ABOUT THE PROVIDENCE PENSION BAILOUT?

SPRINGFIELD PASSED A SIMILAR THING.

THEY ARE BACKING OFF ON IT BECAUSE INTEREST RATES ARE SKYROCKETING.

THEY DON'T HAVE TO BORROW THAT MONEY, THERE DID NOT SEEM TO BE AS MUCH RESISTANCE AS I THOUGHT.

IS THAT BECAUSE THE PROVIDENCE DELEGATION WAS BEHIND THAT AND THEY WOULD REFER TO THEM OR WHAT WAS YOUR SENSE?

ED: YOU HAD MEMBERS OF THE PROVIDENCE DELEGATION GOING TO BAT FOR THAT, TALKING OUT IN FAVOR OF VOTING FOR THAT WHEN IT CAME TO A REFERENDUM FOR PROVIDENCE VOTERS.

YEAH, THAT WENT FORWARD.

ARLENE: THAT IS THE QUINTESSENTIAL EXAMPLE OF WHAT DR. RODRIGUEZ SAID, KICKING THE CAN.

IT REALLY DOES NOT HELP.

THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT SYSTEM HAS TO BE REFORMED, AND RATHER THAN TAKE THE BULL BY THE HORNS, THEY ARE DELAYING THE INEVITABLE.

FRANKLY, I THINK THAT REFERENDUM IS STUPID.

PABLO: THIS WAS A GREAT OPPORTUNITY.

YOU SHOULD HAVE USED THE FACT THAT WE ARE GOING TO GET THIS MONEY, SHORT UP THE SYSTEM FOR THE FUTURE -- SHORE UP THE SYSTEM FOR THE FUTURE, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, LET'S FIX SOME OF THE LOOPHOLES ACHING PEOPLE 200,000 -- MAKING PEOPLE $200,000 A YEAR IN RETIREMENT.

IT IS UNSUSTAINABLE.

EVEN WITH THIS INFLUX OF MONEY.

JIM: GUN LEGISLATION.

WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IT HERE THE LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS.

IT IS INTERESTING.

THE SUPREME COURT CASE MAY AFFECT WHAT IS GOING ON IN RHODE ISLAND OR NOT.

ARLENE, THE ATTORNEY GENERAL SAID WE ARE READY TO DEFEND THE LAWS RAISING THE AGE FROM 18 TO 21, I THINK IS PRETTY BULLETPROOF -- NO PUN INTENDED.

THE LARGER MAGAZINE CAPACITY AND THE LONG RIFLES.

YOU SEE ANY LEGAL PROBLEMS?

ARLENE: I THINK PETER IS CORRECT, EVEN WITH THE SUPREME COURT DECISION FROM THE U.S. THAT WAS RENDERED.

AND IT IS A LANGUAGE IN THE DECISION THAT TALKS ABOUT THE FACT THAT THIS DOES NOT REMOVE ALL REGULATION.

AND THEN CALIFORNIA AND NEW JERSEY COURTS OF APPEALS ACTUALLY HAD THE ISSUE OF A MAGAZINE AND HOW MANY BULLETS YOU COULD PUT IN IT, AND THEY UPHELD THE LIMITATIONS BECAUSE THE RECESSES, WHILE THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT SAYS YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO DEFEND YOURSELF, THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO DEFEND YOURSELF WITH A NEWSY.

SO HAVING A GUN THAT IS A SO-CALLED REGULAR GUN IS ENOUGH DIFFERENCE, WHICH THOSE TWO COURTS RULED BACK THEN, SO THEY UPHELD MAGAZINE LIMITATIONS IN BOTH THOSE STATES.

I THINK PETER IS CORRECT THAT WHAT WAS PASSED BY THE RHODE ISLAND GENERAL ASSEMBLY WILL ULTIMATELY BE SUSTAINED AS CONSTITUTIONAL.

JIM: THIS LEGISLATION WAS ALL BUT DEAD UNTIL UVALDE.

THEY REALLY WERE NOT TALKING ABOUT GUN CONTROL AT ALL, WERE THEY?

ED: I DO THINK THAT TURNED THE TIDE, I THINK THERE WAS GOING TO BE COME UNTIL MOVEMENT ON GUN LEGISLATION UNTIL THAT HAPPENED.

AND THEN YOU HAD A POWERFUL RALLY OUTSIDE, SO ALL THE GENERAL OFFICERS WITH UNION LEADERS STEPPING UP AND SAYING, THEY WANTED TO SEE THOSE THREE PIECES OF GUN LEGISLATION PASSED.

I DO THINK THEY WILL BE CHALLENGED, BUT I THINK THAT IS SEPARATE FROM WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE SUPREME COURT.

THAT HAD TO DO WITH CONCEALED CARRY.

WE WERE ONE OF THE SIX STATES THAT HAD SIMILAR LAWS TO NEW YORK.

ALSO LOWER GUN VIOLENCE RATES.

I THINK WE COULD SEE A CHALLENGE ON CONCEALED CARRY HERE IN RHODE ISLAND COMING FROM THAT SUPREME COURT CASE.

ARLENE: WHEN I WAS ON LAST, WE TALKED ABOUT WHAT WE CONSIDER RHODE ISLAND'S CONSTITUTION'S SECOND AMENDMENT THAT YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO A GUN.

WHEN I WAS ATTORNEY GENERAL, UNLIKE MY BROTHER BEFORE ME AND AFTER ME, I THOUGHT PEOPLE DID HAVE A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO CARRY AND DEFEND THEMSELVES.

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THE SUPREME COURT DECISION FINALLY HAS COME OUT ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL SAYING, SO HAVING SAID THAT, I THINK WHAT WE DEFINITELY CHANGE IS NO LONGER CAN ATTORNEYS GENERAL OR POLICE CHIEFS, FOR THAT MATTER, DENY THE RIGHT FOR A GUN PERMIT OR TO CARRY A GUN TO PEOPLE AND JUST SAY, WELL, YOU HAVE TO SHOW NEED.

I NEVER THOUGHT YOU HAD TO SHOW NEED TO START WITH.

THIS DECISION CERTAINLY AMPLIFIES YOU DON'T NEED NEED TO HAVE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO DEFEND YOURSELF.

JIM: I DID A STORY ON THIS AND I TALKED TO A LOCAL CHIEF.

YOU CAN GO TO YOUR LOCAL CHIEF TO GET THE CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT.

HE ROUTINELY TURNED THEM DOWN.

HE SAID -- HE GOES, OUR MEN AND WOMEN ARE TRAINED, BUT I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE HAVING CIVILIANS CARRY GUNS WHO ARE NOT TRAINED.

I'M LIKE, THAT IS NOT NOW PASSING CONSTITUTIONAL MUSTER.

PABLO: I DON'T TRUST THE SUPREME COURT AS FAR AS I CAN THROW THEM.

JIM: WE HAVE A COUPLE OTHER DECISIONS YOU ARE LOOKING AT, TOO.

PABLO:PABLO: EXACTLY RIGHT.

WHO WOULD HAVE -- PABLO: EXACTLY RIGHT.

WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT ROE V. WADE WAS AT RISK?

AND THE DECISION 50 YEARS HAD BEEN REAFFIRMED MULTIPLE TIMES WOULD BE AT RISK?

I DO NOT TRUST THEM.

I THINK THAT ALL GUN LEGISLATION ARE AT RISK WITH THE SUPREME COURT.

ED: IRONY IS THE DECISION COMES BEFORE CONGRESS MOVED LEGISLATION.

DESPITE THAT LONG WAIT FOR ACTION ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL, IT MIGHT BE A LOSS FOR GUN RIGHTS OR GUN-CONTROL ADVOCATES.

IT WILL BE INTERESTING.

WITH THE SUPREME COURT DECISION, THE CAVEAT IS YOU CANNOT HAVE CONCEALED CARRY IN SENSITIVE AREAS, WHAT ARE THOSE, SCHOOLS?

IS IT THE SUPREME COURT?

I BET IT IS NOT.

JIM: MY RECOLLECTION -- IT IS FUN YOU TALK ABOUT THAT WITH NICK.

NICK SAID THAT THERE IS NO ABRIDGMENT OF THE CONSTITUTION.

ARLENE: CASE LAW TALKS ABOUT THE FACT OF REASONABLE REGULATION, SO ALL THAT LEGISLATION THAT TALKS ABOUT RED FLAG LAWS, I THINK ALL OF THAT WILL BE CONSTITUTIONAL.

AGES.

DISTINCTIONS.

ALL OF THAT WILL BE OK BECAUSE THAT IS NOT A FUNDAMENTAL AND BRIDGEMAN -- ABRIDGMENT IF YOU HAVE A CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT, PEOPLE ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO SAY, YOU NEED TO SHOW ME.

YOU EITHER HAVE IT OR YOU DON'T.

AS DR. RODRIGUEZ POINTED OUT, THE COURT DEFINITELY LOOKS LIKE IT IS NOT GOING TO FOLLOW THROUGH WHEN IT COMES TO THE ISSUE OF WOMEN'S RIGHTS TO CHOOSE.

YOU HAVE ONE CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO CARRY A GUN, BUT YOU HAVE NO CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO DECIDE ABOUT YOUR BODY.

THERE IS A DISCONNECT, I THINK, IN THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT.

QUITE FRIENDLY, I DON'T TRUST THEM EITHER.

JIM: DON'T GO BACK FOR THE FIRST AMENDMENT.

ED: STAY AWAY FROM THE FIRST AMENDMENT.

JIM: WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THE STATE TREASURER'S RACE WOULD HAVE A LITTLE SPICE TO IT.

FOR THOSE OF YOU NOT KEEPING YOUR SCORECARD, MAYOR JAMES THE OSA, A DEMOCRAT, IS BEING CHALLENGED ON THE DEMOCRATIC SIDE BY A FORMER CONGRESS SECRETARY.

PABLO, WE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE.

IF WE CAN PUT UP ON THE SCREEN, DIOSSA PUT UP A TWITTER ACCOUNT THAT SAYS PRYER FOR RHODE ISLAND.

IT IS A LOT OF FOOLISHNESS.

PABLO: THE PROBLEM WITH SOCIAL MEDIA AND POLITICS.

EVERYBODY WANTS TO BE CUTE AND SMARTER THAN THE OTHER GUY.

THAT DOES NOT DO ANYTHING OTHER THAN GETTING THE TWITTER-SPHERE IN THE RUNAROUND.

IT IS NOT SMART.

AND IT HAS BECOME THE NEWS AS OPPOSED TO WHAT AM I FOR AND WHAT AM I GOING TO DO FOR RHODE ISLAND?

JIM: AND HE PUTS A LOT OF RE-TWEETS.

THERE WAS A PICTURE OF DIOSSA WITH HIS KID ON FATHER'S DAY, AND IT SAYS PRYER FOR RHODE ISLAND AND IT RE-TREATED THAT HE LIKED IT.

DRIVES ME CRAZY.

ARLENE: AS ONLY CANDIDATE WHO HAS RUN FOR OFFICE, I WAS DISAPPOINTED HE DID THAT.

I THINK IT IS DIRTY.

I REALLY DO.

IT DOES FEED THE TWITTER MANIA THAT EXISTS IN THE WORLD, BUT I JUST THOUGHT HE WOULD BE BETTER THAN THAT AS A CANDIDATE.

ED: THIS WEEK, DIOSSA FILED A HATCH ACT COMPLAINT AGAINST PRYER, SAYING HE WAS A STATE EMPLOYEE AND -- PRYOR, SAYING HE WAS A STATE EMPLOYEE, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, A LOT OF ATTENTION WAS FOCUSED ON THE TWITTER ACCOUNT.

AS YOU SAID, IT CAME ACROSS AS TOMFOOLERY.

JIM: I THINK THAT HATCH ACT IS A REACH.

I DON'T KNOW THE LAST TIME SOMEONE WAS PROSECUTED FOR A HATCH ACT.

GINA RAIMONDO WAS HEADLINER AT BRETT SMILEY'S FUNDRAISER FOR MAYOR, SO, I MEAN, REALLY.

WHAT DISAPPOINTS ME IS THIS BRACE, ULTIMATELY, THE REPUBLICAN ON THE OTHER SIDE, WHO THEY EVENTUALLY GET TO, THINK OF THE CONSEQUENCES OF HAVING SOMEBODY IN THE TREASURERS OFFICE WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING FINANCIALLY.

ARLENE: DIDN'T THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY JUST NOW REMOVE THE CLASSIFIED EMPLOYEES THAT USED TO BE BANNED UNDER RHODE ISLAND'S VERSION OF THE HATCH ACT?

THEY JUST REMOVE THAT AS AN OBSTACLE, SO IT IS EVEN FOOLISH.

JIM: WE WILL SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

THE GOVERNORS RACE CONTINUES TO PLUG ALONG.

THE SECRETARY OF STATE, NELLIE GORBEA, CAME UP WITH HER FIRST AD.

SHE IS AN INCREASE ON THE CORPORATIONS -- SHE IS PROPOSING AN INCREASE ON THE CORPORATIONS TAX.

OPPONENTS JUMPED ON THAT.

WE HAVE NOT TALKED MUCH ABOUT THE GOVERNORS RACE.

YOUR THOUGHT?

WE ARE GETTING CLOSE TO THE PRIMARY.

ED: IT IS NOT THAT FAR AWAY.

YEAH, THAT AD WENT UP, AND SHE GOT A LOT OF CRITICISM, ESPECIALLY FROM GOVERNOR MCKEE AND HELENA FOULKES, SOME MODERATES, AND NOT SO MUCH FROM MORE PROGRESSIVE CANDIDATES.

SHE TOOK A LOT OF CRITICISM FOR IT.

DID SHE GET THE VALUE OF IT?

PABLO: WELL, THE VALUE WILL BE OBTAINED ONCE SHE STARTS TALKING ABOUT IT.

AS A PERCENTAGE OF TOTAL REVENUE, ADS RELY ON CORPORATE TAX LESS THAN THE NATIONAL AVERAGE AND ONLY HALF AS MUCH AS CONNECTICUT AND MASSACHUSETTS.

SO, BRINGING US TO THE LEVEL OF MASSACHUSETTS IS NOT GOING TO BE THE END OF THE WORLD.

PROBABLY THE WHOLE PROCESS IS GOING TO RAISE MAY BE $55 MILLION.

IT IS THE PRINCIPLE OF THE THING.

IF YOU ARE DOING WELL, YOU SHOULD PAY YOUR FAIR SHARE.

WE HAVE A CRISIS IN RHODE ISLAND OF HOUSING THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED.

AND IT BENEFITS CORPORATIONS FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD.

JIM: A TOUGH SELL WHEN WE ARE AWASH WITH FEDERAL MONEY.

THAT IS WHAT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY LEADERS SAID.

THAT MIGHT BE AN IDEA TO CONSIDER, BUT AT THIS SNAPSHOT IN TIME, I DON'T KNOW.

PABLO: IT IS LOOKING AT THE FUTURE, NOT DEPENDING ON ONE-SHOT DEALS THAT WE ARE DOING NOW AND TRYING TO WORK FOR THE FUTURE.

AND PAYING FOR WHAT YOU ARE PROMISING BECAUSE THE PROBLEM WITH POLITICIANS TODAY IS THAT THEY ALL PROMISE THESE GOODIES, WE ARE GOING TO DO THIS, THAT, BUT THEY DON'T SHOW ANY WAY TO PAY THEM.

SHE IS SAYING, I AM GOING TO HELP FIX HOUSING AND START PAYING FOR IT.

ARLENE: IT WAS IMPORTANT FOR HER TO FINALLY COME OUT BECAUSE THE OTHER WOMEN RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR, WHETHER ASHLEY, MISS FOULKES, THEY HAVE THEIR ADS.

I KEPT SAYING, WHEN IS NELLIE GOING TO START?

I THING IT A TACTICAL MISTAKE.

THE CORPORATE TAX ISSUE WAS -- THE CORPORATE TAX WAS AN ISSUE, BUT SHE STUMBLED BY SAYING I DON'T COME FROM AN INFLUENTIAL FAMILY AS A SHOT AGAINST HELENA FOULKES, ETC., AND THEN OF COURSE, THE WHOLE THING ABOUT, OH, YEAH, YOUR DAD IS A BIG GUY IN PUERTO RICO, ETC.

SHE CAME UP, A GOOD THING.

THE BAD THING WAS THE CONTENT OF THE AD AS HER FIRST DRY.

ED: I CAN SEE SOME -- FIRST TRY.

ED: I CAN SEE SOME CANDIDATES HAVE PROPOSED TAXING THE RICH 1%, SO THE DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY, THAT MIGHT BE ATTRACTIVE IN SOME WAYS.

I DO THINK HE GAVE A LINE OF ATTACK.

FOLKS ARE ALREADY USING THE NELLIE TAX PHRASE, AND HE GAVE A LINE OF ATTACK FOR FOLKS IN THAT CONTEST.

JIM: WE HAVE NOT HAD YOU ON SINCE THE WPRI POLL.

I THINK SHE SHOWED A LOT MORE THAN OTHER PEOPLE TO.

IT IS VIRTUALLY THE.

THAT WAS A MONTH -- IT WAS VIRTUALLY THENECK AND NECK.

SHE IS WORKING BEHIND-THE-SCENES.

ED: THE CRITICISM -- DAN HAD A COLUMN THIS MORNING, SHOWS THAT SHE IS BEING TREATED AS A FRONT-RUNNER OR TIED.

MATT BROWN HAS SIMILAR PROPOSALS.

HE IS NOT GETTING CRITICIZED FOR THAT.

PABLO: IT IS A LEFT-LEANING PRIMARY.

PEOPLE WHO VOTE IN DEMOCRATIC PRIMARIES ARE MOSTLY LEFT.

TACTICALLY, YOU KNOW, YOU LOOK AT YOUR CONSTITUENCY, AND YOU PLAY FOR THEM.

JIM: LET'S DO OUTRAGEOUS AND KUDOS.

DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING?

ED: I HAVE A JOURNALISM-RELATED ONE.

SOMEONE THREW A BRICK IN MASSACHUSETTS AND WROTE "THIS IS JUST THE BEGINNING."

I HOPE IT IS THE END OF POLITICIANS OR POLITICAL ADVOCATES TRYING TO INTIMIDATE REPORTERS.

JIM: GOOD ONE, SHORT AND SWEET.

ARLENE: THIS IS JUST AN OBSERVATION.

LITTLE IN MY LIFETIME DID I KNOW ANYBODY WITHOUT NIXON, BUT DONALD TRUMP HAS.

JIM: YOU ARE SMILING.

PABLO: I AM TIRED OF BEING OUTRAGED.

I WILL BREAK MY STREAK AND GIVE A KUDOS TO BLAKE FILIPPI FOR, YOU KNOW, SAYING THAT LICENSE AND DOCUMENTED PEOPLE MAKES SENSE.

IT IS RIDICULOUS -- LICENSE FOR UNDOCUMENTED PEOPLE MAKE SENSE.

IT IS RIDICULOUS TO SAY I AM NOT GOING TO GIVE THIS TO MY FRIENDS.

TO BREAK WITH HIS PARTY AND SHOW WE CAN HAVE BIPARTISANSHIP IN THIS COUNTRY AND GOOD REPUBLICANS LIKE WE USED TO HAVE.

[LAUGHTER] JIM: THERE ARE STILL A COUPLE OF GOOD ONES AROUND.

LET'S TALK ABOUT THAT JANUARY 6 COMMITTEE.

I HAVE READ AN AWFUL LOT.

I WILL BE HONEST WITH YOU, I WATCHED IN AND OUT ON THE HEARINGS AND MAINLY RED RECAPS.

THE DEPTHS TO WHICH -- READ RECAPS.

THE DEPTHS TO WHERE DONALD TRUMP WENT THIS CHILLING, AND A LOT OF REPUBLICANS DON'T WANT TO SEE IT.

ARLENE: IT IS VERY DISTURBING FROM MY PERSPECTIVE TO SEE THE LINKS THAT HE WENT TO CONTINUE THE BIG LIE.

THE WORST PART, OF COURSE, IS HIS ATTEMPT TO REALLY BASTARDIZE THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT ATTORNEY GENERAL ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THE JUSTICE OF THE PEOPLE, THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THE PEOPLE'S LAWYERS ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL.

FOR HIM TO TRY THAT PLOY AND PUT IN AN ENVIRONMENTAL LAWYER WHO WOULD DO HIS BIDDING BY THE FALSE NARRATIVE, NOTHING IS MORE HURTFUL TO THE REPUBLIC THAN THAT LAST EXPOSE ON WHAT HE DID.

YOU KNOW, I HOPE IN HISTORY, WHEN HISTORY IS WRITTEN, AND I KNOW IT GETS WRITTEN BY THE VICTORS RATHER THAN THE VANQUISHED, BUT I THINK HE SHOULD GO DOWN IN HISTORY AS REALLY SOMEONE WHO COLD HAVE BROUGHT ON THIS COUNTRY.

ED: YOU TALK ABOUT OUTRAGES.

YOU SHOULD BE OUTRAGED WHEN YOU HEARD RICHARD DONOGHUE TESTIFY BEFORE THE JANUARY 6 COMMITTEE'S DEPUTY ATTORNEY GENERAL.

HE SAID, TRUMP SAID TO HIM, YOU TELL ME IT WAS CORRUPT, AND I WILL TAKE IT FROM THERE WITH THE REPUBLICAN CONGRESS.

THAT IS CORRUPTION.

WE SHOULD BE OUTRAGED.

PABLO: ALL OF THESE REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES THAT ARE TRYING TO OUT-TRUMP TRUMP THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY, THAT IS THE REAL PROBLEM RIGHT NOW.

BECAUSE TRUMP IS GOING TO BE GONE EVENTUALLY.

JIM: AND THAT IS ALREADY SHOWING.

PABLO: BUT HIS STREAK OF VICIOUSNESS THAT IS BEING DEMONSTRATED IN PRIMARIES -- REPUBLICAN PRIMARIES --IS SOMETHING THAT WILL LAST FOR A WHILE.

ED: YOU HAVE GUYS LIKE -- JIM: YOU HAVE GUYS LIKE RON DESANTIS, TRUMP 2.0.

TRUMP IS NOW UPSET WITH KEVIN MCCARTHY, WHO HAS BEEN TRYING TO BE SPEAKER FOR HOW LONG?

KIND OF LUKEWARM ON HIS SUPPORT.

HE IS UPSET MCCARTHY PULLED THE REPUBLICANS OFF OF THAT COMMITTEE.

ORIGINALLY FIVE, INCLUDING JIM JORDAN, TIED UP TO HIS NECK WITH IT, AND NOW THEY ARE SAYING, WE SHOULD HAVE HAD REPUBLICANS WE LIKE, NOT LIZ CHENEY.

WHICH I FIND FASCINATING BECAUSE THEN MAYBE THEY COULD DO MORE CROSS-EXAMINATION.

A FASCINATING POLITICAL DYNAMIC.

ED: IT IS.

THE REPUBLICAN PARTY CENSORED LIZ CHENEY FOR TAKING PART IN THAT, SO IT IS FASCINATING.

ARLENE: THEY DECIDED ACTUALLY TO BOARD THE BOAT, AND I FEEL AWFUL AS A REPUBLICAN CANDIDATE IN THE PAST OF WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

THEY ARE A PARTY OF DISCRIMINATION.

THEY ARE A PARTY OF ANTI-IMMIGRANT.

IT IS JUST PROFOUNDLY DISTURBING THAT THEY ARE NOT FOR THE PRINCIPLES WHICH MADE THIS COUNTRY GREAT.

FRANKLY, MANY OF THESE PARTISAN REPUBLICANS ARE REALLY DESTROYING THE UNITED IN UNITED STATES.

JIM: YOU WONDER HOW THIS IS, YOU KNOW, WITH INFLATION, GAS PRICES AND EVERYTHING, EVERYONE HAS BEEN TALKING ABOUT THE MIDTERMS.

I THINK PEOPLE ARE LOOKING AT WHAT IS IN FRONT OF THEIR FACE.

WILL THIS HAVE ANY EFFECT TO SAY, LOOK, THIS IS WHAT THE REPUBLICANS DID?

DO WE WANT THAT?

THIS IS A CRYSTAL BALL QUESTION FOR THE FALL, BUT WHAT DO YOU THINK?

PABLO: I WISH THAT WAS THE CASE.

I THINK PEOPLE ARE MORE CONCERNED ABOUT INFLATION AND GAS PRICES.

PEOPLE ARE TIRED OF TALKING ABOUT 2020.

THEY WANT TO MOVE FORWARD.

UNFORTUNATELY, IT IS WORKING FOR THIS PRIMARY, REPUBLICANS, TO BE TRUMP 2.0.

JIM: YOU WONDER, QUICKLY, IF THE REPUBLICANS DO TAKE OVER THE HOUSE, THEN WE GET INTO THAT GRIDLOCK THAT WE HAD THE LAST TWO YEARS OF DONALD TRUMP'S PRESIDENCY.

ARLENE: I THINK REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO REGAIN CONTROL IN CONGRESS BECAUSE OF THE BREAD-AND-BUTTER ISSUES.

JIM: FOLKS, THAT IS ALL THE TIME WE HAVE.

PABLO, GOOD TO SEE YOU.

ED, GET SOME SLEEP.

ARLENE, ALWAYS GREAT TO SEE YOU.

IF YOU DON'T CATCH IS FRIDAY AT 7:00 OR SUNDAY AT NOON, WE ARE ALL OVER SOCIAL MEDIA.

CHECK OUT OUR FACEBOOK PAGE, TWITTER ACCOUNT, AND WE ARCHIVE OUR SHOWS AT RIPBS.ORG/LIVELY AND WHEREVER YOU GET YOUR FAVORITE PODCAST.

WE WILL BE BACK HERE WITH ALL THE LATEST, KIND OF A WEEK'S RETROSPECTIVE ON THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, AND WHATEVER ELSE COMES UP.

COME BACK NEXT WEEK AS "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" CONTINUES.

HAVE A GREAT WEEK.

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VISIT NCICAP.ORG] >> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- >> FOR OVER 30 YEARS, "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS TO POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.