>> How our Kentucky College kids Fairing in comparison to the rest of the nation.

What's the message?

The head of the agency charged with getting more college degrees in the hands of Kentuckians ascending.

We'll have a conversation with the president of the Kentucky Council on Post-secondary education.

Aaron Thompson about what he's got his eye on this route upcoming legislative session.

That's now on connections.

♪ ♪ Thank you for joining me for connections today.

I'm Renee Shaw, along with making sure more Kentuckians are ready for college and career.

>> The Kentucky Council on post-secondary education is also engaged and ensuring.

>> That more than their academic needs are met when it comes to being a college student.

Recent research finds that more than half of all college students across the nation struggle to have their needs met for food, housing and other basic necessities, which can really affect their ability to succeed in school.

So how is Kentucky poised to fill those gaps and what has Aaron Thompson, who is the president of the Kentucky Council on post-secondary education has his eye on when it comes to part 2 of the legislative session that is already under way as air this conversation take not so much.

But when we air it, they're already be in session.

Doctor Thompson, good to see you.

>> Good to see you.

And I as always, yeah.

>> So let's let's talk about the session for so when Ms Ayers, they probably will have maybe a week or so under their belt after part to his resume, February 7th, what's in it for higher education this time around.

What do you really have your eye on?

>> Well, they told us that the budget won't be open.

You know, if the budget was open, I would probably ask, but they seriously consider how we KET our campus is moving with some base dollars to give birth faculty and staff some races.

Now we can try to KET tuition low or as always, how we can really get to a point where by that we KET producing.

Well, we have been produced over the last many years and that's the it's a small payment in degrees and credentials that matter.

>> Let me interrupt you just for a moment to go back to the Rays part.

So we know that the General Assembly provided raises for state workers is out on include those who work in higher education is a real it doesn't know.

And that's an excellent point and we've got I mean, if you think about it from a standpoint of our performance funding.

>> You know, it goes to those that perform be on, quote, unquote.

The average Maribor.

Colleges and universities, you know, having received any of that.

That's number one.

Number 2, the money isn't reoccur.

You know, it goes back to the pot to be redistributed.

So there's no dollars on the table that comes from the state and that passion to produce the race is so but dollars have to come from tuition.

And I'll talk about that a little bit.

If you like.

But what needs in place for rates, 8, 9%.

That's on the, you know, just KET the doors open.

My so we're really are are in an interesting time.

So I would hope that we have failed for the budget that we could have that conversation.

Baffert campuses for CP.

I mean, we want to KET pushing those elements that help students to be successful.

We've got some money last year and from the General Assembly with her health care.

And boy, is that ever working?

You're right.

I mean, and and building out that pipeline.

But we have tons of mail h*** and behavioral health issues.

We have.

So a lot of that we're going to be pushing.

We also have to push this P 20 connection.

We don't have an and this is the preschool through preschool through post-secondary.

Absolutely.

I mean low college-going rate.

We'll talk about that.

If you like.

But there are some things that our forefront that we would be asking for if the budget is open but just not open.

We're looking at like a tuition bill was an exam.

>> OK, so not a bad situation.

Jail.

Who sponsor?

What does it do?

>> You the sponsor is a House He's been there a short while out long.

The tuition bill basically says this that it will invest.

2 part good bill really allows campuses every year to raise tuition by percent.

But only on the incoming class.

Then they have to KET then stay for the next 4 years.

So literally or you could have a freshman coming in and by the time him or her get to the senior year, they could be paying, you know, 15%.

Last been the freshman.

But there are there So this is not something we're for for a lot of reasons.

One is I mean, I guess you can say they have some pretty good for predictability.

But the other thing that has is a situation whereby that you're going to have a disparity so much so and those.

Classes that is going to create a situation whereby I feel that my neighbor, low-income students, students of color.

We'll be in a situation where they can continue to afford because this is a lot higher than what we've done the last 4, 5 years.

Yeah.

Income.

You only had what to 4% increase.

Is it that?

Well, we've we've only averaged a year.

We've had the lowest tuition in history.

>> So what's the rationale for Doctor Thompson?

What's the end goal here?

The in goal?

I think the sponsors saying that it offers predictability and limits tuition.

>> Well, you can look at, you know, Illinois, Texas, you know, some other places that have done this, really, it hasn't done that.

I mean, went out of control a little bit.

And in many cases, it could cause the state to not even fund as some of our states have And, you know where we're at here, you know, in 1999, the state was paying for 70%.

The college-going for student mask paying 29 or 30%.

You know for us to KET tuition bound.

We need more state input argument also is that you need to understand the flexibility of the market to force a bill that will do this without consideration of the market.

Well, you've done is created a situation that's not manageable.

Our campuses, my office, who we separate tuition ceiling.

We look at all these market forces and we look at how we think people portability and plays while keeping their doors >> So essentially it has 2 effects.

It takes away some power from the council on post-secondary education to to set those rates.

But it seems like it's permissive for the public higher institutions.

It's not a mandate, right?

It's may.

And that shout.

>> Yeah, but I would mayor night shall let me just far, right.

And I have around the as a president.

If I know that I won't have to KET book.

I don't have to look at market forces in place and everything else.

And I KET that I was going to have to get that student the same tuition for 4 years.

I would raise it 5% right now at the that if you're all offer predictability of that's so no more than no less than 5%.

Why the U.S. it could be less.

But why would I take less with the unpredictability?

Not understanding the market forces.

They're not understanding the last the city, right?

Not understanding all the pull elements of the students I have coming in.

Right?

So a student would look as am I willing to pay for sure.

Probably for sure.

About 5% more income in.

I ask of, you know, I'm not for this mill for more reasons.

Then won the second part of the bill, though it talks about putting more students the words campuses you know, governing boards.

Right?

And I am for an argument is, well, there's all kinds of different students.

There could be more representation.

Well, even if you expand student song, it still that represent the entire popping population of students on the campus.

Not only that, but the student goes on the board.

That student is now governing member.

They're no longer representing because a constituency there representing the campus.

So that part was being pushed by student voice.

>> Team or some of uh students.

You know.

>> I'm sure there's some students that are engaged.

I think there's one student at a It's really pushing it.

>> A little bit.

But, you know, I'm not necessarily boy saying all my complaints there.

I would just say if you get to maybe students, faculty and staff think you have an accreditation problem because you have internal operating the one great thing about having a gubernatorial and Senate approved board is that they're truly from outside representing the needs of that community of the campus and to some degree of that state.

you know, I our presidents are surely not for you to one of these and many of our board members that I've talked to aren't either now we've had representation on their boards for a long time with students.

We've been that group, as you know, I even have it on my board.

So the argument.

Is that, you know, if we need more representation, we need to provide more.

They have more analytics to give a student to really look at how all students are being represented at that institution.

All right.

>> We'll see if the budget is over.

Not we know that they are going up supply 60 million dollars in Bowling Green veteran Center.

You have to open up the budget to do that.

I don't know how much more of a gateway can come from that.

But I think there might be other things in the works to open up the budget that may limit how much how wide they open it right?

>> Well, that's right.

And, you know, I have to represent what's good for higher education estate.

I want to be clear.

I represent what's good for the economy and the state to because you can't have a thriving economy without having to educated How educated is our workforce?

So where do we stand when it comes to college degree attainment?

Well.

I'm happy to report even during COVID Kentucky, one of the few states.

But we We're at now 50.5.

Percent of all of our population with her credential.

That matters.

I read from the bench all that matters.

So we've increased tremendously and happy to say with our a degree and credential output.

We just got the data back to a national clearinghouse.

Kentucky is number 2 in the country.

So we've come a long way.

So I'm happy to report now.

There's some issues only arise and roll months down, been down for the last many years down again this past year.

We can't KET this up unless we can get this college going rate.

will be on the FORTY-SEVEN 0.8% for the reasons why college enrollment is declining is because the economy is doing fairly well.

And there's a lot of jobs to pick from.

Is that the reason that's partially a recent?

I think there's a value proposition to.

We have to still argue.

>> Many, many people don't see the value of a college credential.

And please understand that.

Not all of those that I should be clear about their percentage.

>> It's to 5% really goes out of state.

So it's like over 50% that are going to college, right?

Might not all of those 50%.

That's not going to college.

Are working.

You understand what I mean.

And and that they're not they're going to end up in some place where you have to support, you know, whether man-cave, whether it's on unemployment hate to say whether it's in jail.

I mean, so the idea that we have to work to increase this college-going rates important, but we have to get more adult learners back in because we've lost a lot of those 2 that many of those have found jobs and probably are working.

But we know in today's economy, 90% of those jobs are going to have some skill The post-secondary.

So we need to prepare a process to get them back in place, too.

And we are.

But both of those are issues for us.

>> So of all the proselytizing you're doing to communities and families about the value of a higher education, credential or degree.

>> You send that same message to the lawmakers because it seems maybe they're taking a divergent.

>> Path for may be what the messages coming from the C p?

>> Well, yeah, I don't think all our I think many are listening now more than ever.

I mean The connections between the economy and how educated workforce and the pipeline.

You know, I Tipton, as matter of fact, is working on us abuse bill to help us to really address some of those.

So I don't think.

All are not listening.

I think some are.

But that's what my job is.

Right.

This provide a vast amount of data guy.

>> Was that the business community?

Right?

Because you have partners with the chamber, which is the law be the largest business lobbying group in the in the state.

So certainly that connection has been made and they have a lot of influence.

>> They do have a lot of employees.

Well, go directly to give, you example of a healthcare collaborative, but we're creating workforce collaborative.

You know, we've got 8 million dollars last from from the Legislature.

We've got 49 partners morning that healthcare partners.

We just scattered data back.

That's going to be a couple to for years.

What we know what's happening with that nursing because it takes a while, you know, to get and so on.

But all the other areas that we can actually increase its way through the roof.

So that kind of partnership we're working with direct with you so much so that I redesign cpe and creative and Economic Development partnership in the workforce area.

The focus on that also creativity, 20 area to work on it.

So I think it's important for higher Ed to be in this game.

I think it's important for us to work with the legislature and other partners like employers to make sure that we're doing what's good for Kentucky.

>> Do you believe that?

We're tracking to get to your goal of 2030 and remind us with that goal is.

>> It is to have 60% of our citizens.

That's in the workforce and have had a degree or credential that matters.

And that's correlated with us.

Having a thriving economy.

We are actually above the tracking that the trajectory is above.

The problem is that I'm smart enough to be able to look that my predictive analytics with all the input.

worry we we have to get the college-going rate up again.

We have to get more adult learners involved.

We have to get more out of state students to come to Kentuckyian stay in Kentucky.

We're going to have to close gaps.

And, you know, I've been on a bash about 04:00AM on that.

Got some good news there, too.

But the idea that we're going have to do all of those to stay on track and unless we somehow are able to truly we invest in that it's including the campuses and those incentives that we're doing and relationship building.

I think we will be in trouble.

>> Yeah.

So let's talk about the gaps are closing.

Are you talking just racial geographic, socio, economic?

What gaps you making progress in narrowing?

>> Well, you know, if you look at the Roman and credential out let me just start.

We've been down enrollment, but her credentials are up.

However, our low incomes outpacing the overall credentials, but that not nearly as much as we should be worried about that.

But to give an example, the holy population that was up in enrollment over the last 5 years and over the last year was are underrepresented we who are who are mainly >> African Americans and Latinx population in this state, right?

Right.

And mixed race along those lines.

When we look at our credential output, I'm really happy to say that although we put 10% overall.

On the line, we've got 30% of our underrepresented minorities.

We're closing gaps and and a hero.

But we're closing gaps and retention closing gaps in graduation rates and closing gaps in credential out puts one of the fastest in the But we KET that's intentional.

R**** and and the argument is that if we're going to create this process and dialogue about the importance of this, we can't do it.

It will leave people behind.

That's why we're going have to double down on the low-income.

We're going to double down many of the population groups from where I'm from, like Eastern Kentucky.

So these are items that we have in our performance funding model as well as our policies, locker diversity policy in our strategic agenda.

So all of those are very intentional that are campuses the ball into and thank goodness.

Yeah.

>> So let's talk about the emotional and social emotional needs of students.

We know that's been a big concern even before COVID, but particularly on the other side of COVID.

I want to say we're over COVID, but wherever we are with COVID now.

So let's talk about what you're seeing when it comes to the mental health standpoint of kids are the challenges or are they more severe?

What's the picture and what's the strategy to help them?

>> Yes, and Bows and not certain but yes, on the last.

In other words.

You know, when you think about the success of any student, you have to look at it.

That student in the holistic it's not just academic success.

Only about 20% of our students drop out because of academic reasons.

But you look at the social emotional but cultural, right, right, and behavioral mental health.

And so on what we found is this growing concern around mental health in COVID exacerbated that you may remember several years ago, Kentucky was on the forefront out of my office.

We start talking about this before everybody else was.

And so we have us incentivize campuses.

The bill.

Where based process ease online, that process ease and more mental health and behavior, health counselors on our campuses.

So we are addressing it.

But we don't even know fully.

We have some idea.

35 40% all are dealing with some issue that for rains.

We talk about mental health and they could be all the way from just coping to some severe issues.

Yeah, right.

But we know that if you don't address them while they're here, they will be severe.

our data shows that so many of our students have been even back knows.

But we know.

Input.

No help.

All right.

So the idea that we it's hard to measure.

All of those elements, but we are, in fact measurement.

But you also have to understand there's other issues that people don't talk about is often like housing insecurity.

Many of her students don't have that.

I mean, they have housing insecurity and other words.

Where are they going to stay app or how do they find dollars to even stay on campus?

In many cases we have food insecurity.

Big issue are all of our campuses now have food pantries.

Thank goodness and partnering with different.

>> And it actually gets to the kids who needs it absolutely gets to the cancer needs it.

Now.

>> How they identify them?

Well, in many cases, their identified with 3rd visors and some other folks in areas.

But part of it is we just open it up to anyone that say they need it because we also don't want a statement.

I all right, right?

I mean, same way with mental health issues.

That's why we've been able to triage Mary, where students and a very private way that they can identify.

So but if we sell about yes, maybe there's people that won't have been security.

That's still coming.

The food pantry and getting stuff so far.

This is also about providing what's needed for those that need it.

Most.

And so we're addressing those.

But I want to be clear, this has to be an issue that the state picks up with us.

This has to be an issue that we all look at as fairly severe.

If people don't know what.

Look at the look at suicide rates.

Look at the students that are suffering in many other different ways.

Him live in just a minute or faculty and staff.

Our 2 and COVID exacerbated that we really saw it during that time.

>> So are their mental health services on campus to connect both faculty, staff and students or do they need to go off campus to seek the proper treatment?

Both >> there are you can do some triage on campus if you are.

But, you know, our health insurance is are covering them with off campus argument is they're still not good You know, when you think about being nice to go somewhere and be fixed in about 4 visit right, you know, and and the thing about it is we all are suffering from some level.

Of this and how we're treated, how we're dealing with it.

And many of us who are, quote, unquote, healthy.

It's like having physical hill.

I mean, I got a call like a week and half ago and immediately I KET all the things to do to try to combat that cold.

That mean, I still didn't have a cough, right, right.

So we've got to look at mental health in this way.

And now the stigma that should be applied to it.

So where we're looking at all of those items were But we know that this is different than what we used to just think about what we're building are on campus.

Help right here is about academic services, right?

We still have to do that, right?

Right.

Especially the learning loss and so on.

But now we're going to have to build out the entire student support system that includes >> I want to ask you in their time having about learning loss and remediation, we know that's always been a word in the higher Ed lexicon remediation.

But how much more?

So is it more intense because of COVID?

Because those kids who are and their high school years and and they had maybe what, 3 years of total academic years of lost, perhaps how our Kentucky institutions trying to remediate that.

>> Great question.

You may remember when I took over this position like my second day, I got rid of Belmont away.

It's okay, Jen, Most 0 credit.

Our courses do high school radiation.

But what we created was a system where all students have the wraparound services that that they need the mentoring, the tutoring, all of those things that we really saw success, hugely increase in students that have been failing out are now being successful across the board.

However, during the COVID years, we have seen less preparedness for college.

So that's one of the reasons why we were able to get some of the federal dollars Kentucky Department of Education to create all all of these bridge programming.

All right.

Around the state are campuses work with local communities and and really addressed it over the summer.

We're going to have to have this put in place.

No doubt about it because I I don't know when this learning loss going stop.

No matter what you hear, how know how we measure learning a lost cause.

The problem is you have to assume that everybody was already fully ready.

That's right.

For listen.

That wasn't the case.

Yeah, right.

So now you're building with an issue that's really been exacerbated.

>> Because of the power it we've taken this on our There's only so much we can do, though.

So some of this has to pull be fully addressed as they're still in high school and elementary and middle school.

>> So adult learners, I want to hit that point again, because KET has also been committed from the P through 20 educational experience.

So what do you do specifically to target adult learners and who is an adult learner?

And is there an age limit by which you think it's a not necessarily something that they should strive for?

Kentucky were on the first base, the move away from the traditional 25.

>> Age that being said that before that are traditional?

Well, first of all, if you're 20 year-old, you've got 2 kids, but you have to support.

You can go to college.

Come on.

You're going to have a lot of those adult factors that better there with you.

So what we've done is we've looked at those that we've lost in a way that if you come out of high school, go to college, will claim your traditional ways, quote, unquote.

But if there's any kind of a lapse or if you've got some college, there's a lapse.

We're going to treat you as if you're an adult learning.

What does that mean?

Well, in some cases we go 400,000 people in the state, but some college with no I call it low hanging fruit.

That's not really low hanging.

But it's the low hanging fruit.

So how do we reach out to them?

Well, what we know we've got to get employers in Gates.

Some of them are in jobs that may not be sustainable or Friday.

So we have to reach out to them do that.

We have to offer the services that they need at the time they needed to be between 8 and 5 to maybe it's that night, right?

Right.

It may be in a situation we have to offer programs that they need academic programs, all of those thing.

But we have to be able to also offer a portal or something that they can get into and know how to be triaged to get where they need to go.

Yeah.

So we're building all of that.

In addition you know, competency based education in this in a credit for prior learning.

All of those that go to that adult learner, we're targeting your own.

See a lot of this government.

I love our unit and the next year or so.

>> Well, we know that in Glendale, in Hardin County area, they got about what, 5,000 jobs and have field.

That's what that battery plant and more elsewhere, Bowling Green.

So there's a lot of job opportunities out there.

And we hope that Kentuckians can be the ones to fill them.

Well, thank you, Doctor.

Aaron Thompson is always a pleasure.

Always learn a lot.

He's a fast talker.

He knows so much about higher education, committed his life to it.

You can tell it by just listen to him.

Thank you so very much for joining us today on connections.

If you will learn more about the CP can certainly look on their Web site to do so and connect with me on Twitter, Facebook and there are programs on podcast until I see you again.

Take really good care.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪