♪ >> ABORTION CARE PROVIDERS CHALLENGE INDIANA'S ABORTION BAN.

TOM MCDERMOTT'S POLL SHOWS A CLOSE SENATE RACE.

PLUS, EQUITY IN ELECTRIC VEHICLE CHARGING PLANS AND MORE ON INDIANA WEEK IN REVIEW FOR THE WEEK ENDING SEPTEMBER 2, 2022.

♪ >> INDIANA WEEK IN REVIEW IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORTERS OF INDIANA PUBLIC BROADCASTING STATIONS.

>> THIS WEEK, INDIANA ABORTION CARE PROVIDERS ARE TRYING TO STOP THE STATE'S NEAR-TOTAL ABORTION BAN FROM TAKING EFFECT.

A LAWSUIT FILED IN STATE COURT TUESDAY SAYS THE BAN VIOLATES THE INDIANA CONSTTUTION.

>> PLANNED PARENTHOOD, WHOLE WOMAN'S HEALTH AND ALL-OPTIONS PREGNANCY RESOURCE CENTER ARE INDIANA'S PRIMARY PROVIDERS OF ABORTION CARE.

THEY'LL BE FORCED TO STOP PROVIDING THAT CARE SEPTEMBER 15, WHEN THE STATE'S ABORTION BAN IS SET TO TAKE EFFECT.

THEY'RE NOW CHALLENGING THE BAN IN COURT.

THE LAW LIMITS ABORTION TO ONLY HOSPITALS AND SURGICAL CENTERS OWNED BY HOSPITALS - AND SPECIFICALLY BANS ABORTION CLINICS.

THE HEALTH CARE ORGANIZATIONS ARGUE THAT'S UNLAWFUL DISCRIMINATION UNDER THE STATE CONSTITUTION.

THEY ALSO ARGUE THAT AN EXCEPTION IN THE BILL - ALLOWING ABORTIONS WHEN THE SERIOUS HEALTH OR LIFE OF THE PREGNANT PERSON IS AT RISK - IS UNCONSTITUTIONALLY VAGUE.

THEY ALLEGE A CONFLICT ABOUT WHEN THAT EXCEPTION CAN BE USED.

ONE PROVISION SUGGESTS IT'S AT ANY TIME DURING PREGNANCY; ANOTHER SUGGESTS IT'S LIMITED TO 22 WEEKS OF PREGNANCY.

THE PROVIDERS WANT THE COURT TO AT LEAST TEMPORARILY HALT THE LAW BEFORE IT TAKES EFFECT.

>> WILL THIS LAWSUIT HALT INDIANA'S ABORTION BAN?

IT'S THE FIRST QUESTION FOR OUR INDIANA WEEK IN REVIEW PANEL: DEMOCRAT GREG STOWERS, REPUBLICAN JENNIFER HALLOWELL, JON SCHWANTES, HOST OF INDIANA LAWMAKERS, AND NIKI KELLY, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF OF THE INDIANA CAPITAL CHRONICLE.

I'M INDIANA PUBLIC BROADCASTING STATEHOUSE BUREAU CHIEF BRANDON SMITH.

JENNIFER HALLOWELL, IN LIGHT OF THIS LAWSUIT, WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO HOOSIERS WONDERING IF INDIANA'S ABORTION BAN WILL TAKE EFFECT SEPT. 15?

>> WELL, WE'RE CERTAINLY GOING TO HAVE TO WAIT FOR THE COURT TO WEIGH IN, BUT THERE ARE FEW CERTAINTIES IN LIFE, AND THE ACLU FILING A LAWSUIT ON THE ABORTION LAW IS ONE OF THEM.

[LAUGHTER] NOW, OPPOSING SIDES CAN MAKE THEIR ARGUMENTS AND THE COURT WILL BRING CLARITY.

>> CERTAINLY THE ACLU HAS FILED A LAWSUITS OVER THE YEARS OVER ANTIABORTION LAWS THAT INDIANA HAS PASSED BECAUSE THEY'VE ALWAYS BEEN IN FEDERAL COURT.

BECAUSE AS LONG AS ROE V. WADE AT THE TIME WAS STANDING PRECEDENT, THEY WERE WITH MOST CERTAINTY GOING TO BE KNOCKED DOWN AND LAWMAKERS GENERALLY KNEW THAT.

THIS ONE SEEMS MORE LIKE A ROLL OF THE DICE, DOESN'T IT?

>> A LITTLE BIT.

I WANT TO LEAVE IT UP TO THE LAWYERS AND THE COURTS, OBVIOUSLY.

BUT THERE WERE 50 YEARS WHERE MY COLLEAGUES ON THE RIGHT WERE ADVOCATING TO GET RID OF THIS.

WE'LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS ON SEPTEMBER 15TH, BUT I THINK IT IS A ROLL OF THE DICE.

>> THERE'S BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF LITIGATION IN THE PAST IN STATE COURTS.

VERY, VERY LITTLE THAT WE CAN FIND THAT HAS TO DO WITH ABORTION LAW.

I THINK THE AP FOUND THAT A CASE OUT OF 2004, THE STATE APPELLATE COURT RULED THERE WAS A RIGHT TO PRIVACY IN THE CONSTITUTION IN INDIANA AND ABORTION RIGHTS WERE A PART OF THAT RIGHT.

IT WENT UP TO THE STATE SUPREME COURT WHO UPHELD THE LAW, BUT SAID THIS IS A ROE V. WADE ISSUE, WE DON'T HAVE TO DECIDE THIS ON THE STATE CONSTITUTION ISSUE, SO WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HIGHEST COURT IN THE STATE THINKS ABOUT ABORTION WHEN IT COMES TO THE STATE CONSTITUTION.

REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT IT TAKES EFFECT ON SEPTEMBER 15TH, IT WILL BE APPEALED UP PRESUMABLY.

BUT IT SEEMS LIKE WE'LL GET SOME CLARITY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

>> EVENTUALLY.

THE BIG QUESTION IN THE BEGINNING IS WHETHER THEY'LL DO AN INJUNCTION WHILE WE DEBATE THAT.

THE PRIVACY PART OF THE LAWSUIT, SPEAKING TO A FEW LAWYERS, SEEMS LIKE IS THE WEAKEST PART.

ONE PART POINTS OUT AN EXCEPTION FOR THE LIFE OF THE MOTHER AND FATAL FETAL ANOMALIES, AND THE OTHER HAS TO DO WITH TREATING ABORTION PROVIDERS DIFFERENTLY THAN HOSPITALS.

THERE ARE EQUAL PRIVILEGES ARGUMENTS THERE AND WE'LL SEE ALL THREE OF THEM.

>> OBVIOUSLY, IN THE PAST WHEN GROUPS LIKE THE ACLU WOULD FILE A LAWSUIT CHALLENGING AN ABORTION LAW AND THEY GOT HALTED OR NOT, THE STAKES WERE ARE THERE GOING TO BE MORE RESTRICTIONS, A FEW MORE BARRIERS.

THE STAKES HERE ARE MUCH BIGGER TO THE POINT OF WHERE CAN YOU EVEN GET THE ABORTIONS THAT ARE STILL LEGAL, WHICH IS A VANISHINGLY SMALL NUMBER OF PLACES UNDER THE LAW.

AND POTENTIALLY HOW RESTRICTED IS ABORTION ACCESS PERIOD?

NOT EVEN LOCATION, BUT EVEN WHAT KINDS YOU CAN GET.

THE STAKES ARE MUCH HIGHER THIS TIME.

BUT WILL THAT CHANGE ULTIMATELY HOW THE ARGUMENT PLAYS OUT IN COURT, DO YOU THINK?

>> YOU WOULD WANT TO ASSUME THAT IT HAS NO BEARING ON THE DECISIONS OF THE FOLKS IN THE JUDICIAL BRANCH.

BUT THEY'RE HUMAN BEINGS, LAST TIME I CHECKED.

THEY KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON.

THEY TALK TO PEOPLE.

THEY READ NEWSPAPERS.

>> THEY LIVE IN THE WORLD.

>> THEY LIVE IN THE WORLD.

IT'S UNREALISTIC, I THINK, TO ASSUME THAT THEIR THINKING IS NOT SHAPED IN SOME FASHION BY SORT OF THE, I'M NOT SAYING POLITICAL IMPACT IN TERMS OF PARTISAN GAME, BUT JUST THE POLITICS IN TERMS OF SOCIETAL IMPACT AND REPERCUSSIONS.

>> THAT'S PART OF THE ARGUMENT HERE.

>> THAT'S PART OF THE ISSUE BEHIND SEEKING INJUNCTION IF YOU CAN PROVE IRREPARABLE HARM, YOU HAVE A BIT OF A LEG TO STAND ON.

>> IT'S ARGUABLY NEVER BEEN MORE CLEAR EVEN IN AN ABORTION CASE AS IT IS IN THIS ONE.

>> THIS IS SOMEWHAT OF A RARITY IN INDIANA AS YOU POINTED OUT IN INDIANA COURTS.

NOT UNPRECEDENTED, BUT A RARITY.

WE'RE SEEING THIS UNFOLD IN STATES ACROSS THE COUNTRY WHERE THE ISSUES MAY BE SUBTLY DIFFERENT, AS YOU WOULD EXPECT, BECAUSE YOU'RE DEALING WITH STATE CONSTITUTIONS AND STATE STATUTE.

BUT COURTS ARE WEIGHING IN AND WE HAVE SEEN A LOT OF COURTS IN CONSERVATIVE STATES PUT THE BRAKES ON THESE KINDS OF MEASURES AND SAY LET'S TAKE A BREAK BECAUSE THE STAKES ARE HIGH.

AND IF THESE CLINICS DO CLOSE, CERTAINLY IT'S HARD TO GET THEM BACK UP AND RUNNING AGAIN.

SO, I DON'T THINK IT'S AT ALL BEYOND THE REALM OF POSSIBILITY THAT THE COURT WOULD SAY LET'S ALL TAKE A DEEP BREATH HERE.

THERE'S A LOT AT STAKE AND LET'S MAKE SURE.

BECAUSE OF THE INCONSISTENCY IN THE STATUTE OR THE CONTRADICTION, I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY THE MOST COMPELLING PART.

>> THAT PART IS EASILY FIXED.

>> IT'S EASILY FIXED, BUT ALSO A REASON TO TEMPORARILY HALT THE LAW POTENTIALLY.

WE'LL FIND OUT PRESUMABLY IN A FEW WEEKS' TIME.

A POLL FROM DEMOCRATIC U-S SENATE CANDIDATE TOM MCDERMOTT'S CAMPAIGN, RELEASED TO THE INDYSTAR THIS WEEK, SUGGESTS INDIANA'S U.S. SENATE RACE COULD BE A LOT CLOSER THAN MANY EXPECTED.

>> THE INDYSTAR STORY SAYS THE POLL, CONDUCTED FOR MCDERMOTT BY POLLING FIRM CHANGE RESEARCH, SHOWS 45 PERCENT OF THOSE SURVEYED SAY THEY WILL VOTE FOR INCUMBENT REPUBLICAN SENATOR TODD YOUNG, WHILE 42 PERCENT SAY THEY WILL VOTE FOR MCDERMOTT, WITH A MARGIN OF ERROR OF AROUND TWO-AND-A-HALF PERCENT.

ANOTHER 13 PERCENT ARE UNDECIDED.

MORE THAN TWO THOUSAND PEOPLE WERE SURVEYED.

AND LIBERTARIAN CANDIDATE JAMES SCENIAK WASN'T INCLUDED IN THE POLL.

THE YOUNG CAMPAIGN REPORTEDLY TOOK ISSUE WITH THE METHODOLOGY, PRIMARILY CENTERED ON THE FACT THE POLL WAS CONDUCTED ONLINE.

>> GREG STOWERS, SHOULD WE TAKE SERIOUSLY A POLL COMING OUT OF ONE OF THE CANDIDATES' CAMPAIGNS?

>> SHORT ANSWER IS YOU GOT TO TAKE IT SERIOUSLY.

I THINK FROM A CAMPAIGN PERSPECTIVE, POLLS ARE THERE FROM A STRATEGY STANDPOINT, RIGHT?

YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE YOU'RE ADHERING TO WHAT THE NUMBERS SAY.

BUT FROM A STANDPOINT OF THE REPRESENT -— REPUTABLENESS OF THE POLL.

YOU HAD THE INDY STAR BACKING IT UP AND TWO COLLEGE PROFESSORS BACKING IT UP.

CHANGE RESEARCH IS A REPUTABLE POLL OUT THERE.

I THINK IT'S GOING TO INCITE THE BASE A LITTLE BIT.

I THINK THAT'S PART OF THE GOAL.

>> I THINK THOSE OF US WHO COVER THESE THINGS ALWAYS TAKE POLLS COMING OUT OF ANY CAMPAIGN WITH A GRAIN OF SALT.

BUT EVEN WITH THAT, ARE YOU SURPRISED THAT ANY POLL THAT SEEMS LEGITIMATE, AS THIS ONE DOES SEEM TO AS MUCH AS IT CAN, ARE YOU AT ALL SURPRISED THAT IT'S EVEN THIS CLOSE?

>> IT'S NOT THIS CLOSE.

IT DOESN'T SEEM LEGITIMATE TO ME AT ALL.

THERE'S A COUPLE BIG PROBLEMS WITH THIS.

FIRST OF ALL, IT'S ALL ONLINE PART OF IT GENERATED THROUGH FACEBOOK ADVERTISING.

WE'RE NOT TO A POINT YET WHERE ALL ONLINE SURVEYS ARE RELIABLE.

YOU DON'T HAVE PEOPLE ON THE PHONE SCREENING RESPONDENTS.

AND THIS FIRM DOES NOT HAVE A GOOD TRACK RECORD IN INDIANA.

IN THE GOVERNOR'S RACE IN 2020 THEY WERE OFF BY 18 POINTS.

THEY WERE ALSO OFF SIGNIFICANTLY IN CONGRESS SPARTZ'S DISTRICT.

WE'VE SEEN PROBLEMS WITH THE METHODOLOGIES THAT THEY'VE REPORTED IN INDIANA.

PERHAPS IF THEY ADDED IT'S AN UNSCIENTIFIC, BUT FUN POLL, THE WAY THAT OTHERS DO, THAT WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE TO ACCEPT.

[LAUGHTER] BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S ANYWHERE CLOSE TO THAT.

I THINK THAT SENATOR YOUNG HAS A MUCH LARGER LEAD AND WITH $7 MILLION GOING UP ON TELEVISION THIS WEEK, HE IS GOING TO HAVE AN EVEN BIGGER LEAD.

WE'RE TALKING DOUBLE DIGITS.

>> THAT, I THINK HAS BEEN THE CONVENTIONAL WISDOM ABOUT THIS RACE.

REGARDLESS OF WHO TOM McDERMOTT IS, I THINK EVERYBODY ASSUMED THATTED TO -— TODD YOUNG WITH ALL HIS MONEY AND THE ADVANTAGE THAT REPUBLICANS AND INCUMBENTS IN INDIANA HAVE.

DOES A POLL LIKE THIS OUT THERE EXCITE PEOPLE WHO MAY NOT HAVE BEEN PAYING ATTENTION TO THE RACE SAY WE SHOULD TAKE TOM McDERMOTT SERIOUSLY?

>> YEAH, IT DOES, I THINK.

IT PROBABLY EXCITES TWO CAMPS, BOTH CAMPS, FOR DIFFERENT REASONS.

YES.

TODD YOUNG'S CAMPAIGN CAN SORT OF DISMISS IT FOR THE REASONS POINTED OUT HERE.

BUT STILL, IN THE BACK OF THEIR MINDS, IT'S STILL SORT OF UNNERVING TO SAY GEE, IT COULD BE THIS CLOSE?

SO, THEN THERE'S THAT SORT OF DESIRE TO REDOUBLE THEIR EFFORTS AND REALLY FOCUS MORE ON GETTING OUT VOTERS AND THE GRASSROOTS ASPECTS OF THIS.

I'M SURE THEY ALREADY HAVE THE AIR CAMPAIGN WITH THE $7 MILLION TAKEN CARE OF.

BUT THIS IS ABOUT THE LITTLE THINGS, GETTING PEOPLE TO THE POLLS.

>> AND FOR REPUBLICAN VOTERS THEMSELVES.

THE WORST THING THAT CAN HAPPEN TO AN INCUMBENT'S CAMPAIGN IS EVERYONE ASSUMEING THEY'RE GOING TO WIN AND NO ONE SHOWS UP.

>> IT GIVES SOME BUOYANCY TO THE McDERMOTT CAMPAIGN THAT IT COULD BE CLOSE.

IT COULD BE A BOOST FOR BOTH.

A WORD OF CAUTION, YOU LOOK AROUND THE COUNTRY.

YOU CAN'T MAKE APPLES TO APPLES COMPARISONS.

EVERY RACE IS DIFFERENT.

THE 19TH NEW YORK SPECIAL ELECTION THIS WEEK, WHERE THE REPUBLICAN BY ALL POLLS WAS SUPPOSED TO WIN AND DIDN'T.

WE SAW OTHER INCIDENTS.

>> ALASKA.

>> ALASKA.

THAT WASN'T A TRADITIONAL RACE, BUT IN KANSAS WE SAW THE VOTE ON ABORTION.

AND I'M WONDERING, AND CERTAINLY THE McDERMOTT CAMPAIGN WOULD HOPE THIS IS THE CASE, I AM WONDERING IF IN FACT AS SOME DEMOCRATS HAVE SUGGESTED ROE-VEMBER, IF IT IS MOTIVATING PEOPLE TO ENGAGE WHO MAY NOT HAVE ENGAGED IN THE PAST OR NEW VOTERS COMING FROM THE SIDELINES, SO TO SPEAK.

>> I WANT TO POINT OUT ONE THING.

THEY DIDN'T INCLUDE THE LIBERTARIAN CANDIDATE.

IF IT WAS A TODD YOUNG CAMPAIGN POLL, YOU MAY NOT WANT TO.

THE CONVENTIONAL WISDOM IS THE LIBERTARIAN CANDIDATE IS GOING TO PULL VOTES FROM THE REPUBLICAN.

THERE HAS BEEN MORE OF A MOVEMENT HERE IN INDIANA WITH PEOPLE UNHAPPY WITH THE MAINSTREAM REPUBLICAN PARTY AND THE LIBERTARIAN PARTY TRYING TO GAIN MORE TRACTION.

BUT WHY WOULD YOU NOT WANT TO PUT THAT PERSON IN THIS POLL?

>> YEAH, IF YOU WOULD HAVE INCLUDED THE LIBERTARIAN CANDIDATE, IT PROBABLY WOULD HAVE MADE THE NUMBERS LOOK EVEN BETTER FOR McDERMOTT.

YOU'RE PUTTING THE MONEY INTO THE POLL, YOU MIGHT AS WELL INCLUDE THE CANDIDATE.

>> IT'S NOT LIKE THEY'RE CHARGING PER WORD.

AT LEAST I HOPE NOT.

[LAUGHTER] TIME NOW FOR VIEWER FEEDBACK.

EACH WEEK WE POSE AN UNSCIENTIFIC, ONLINE POLL QUESTION.

THIS WEEK'S QUESTION: WHO WILL WIN INDIANA'S U.S. SENATE RACE?

A. TODD YOUNG B. TOM MCDERMOTT C. JAMES SCENIAK >> LAST WEEK'S QUESTION.

DO YOU SUPPORT PRES.

BIDEN'S PLAN TO FORGIVE UP TO $10,000 IN STUDENT DEBT FOR THOSE EARNING LESS THAN $125,000?

69% SAY YES.

31% SAY NO.

IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO TAKE PART IN THE POLL GO TO WFYI.ORG/IWIR AND LOOK FOR THE POLL.

AN ALLIANCE DEMANDS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT REJECT INDIANA'S ELECTRIC VEHICLE CHARGING PLAN DUE TO EQUITY CONCERNS.

INDIANA PUBLIC BROADCASTING'S REBECCA THIELE REPORTS IT ALSO ASKED U.S. SECRETARY OF TRANSPORTATION PETE BUTTIGIEG TO TOUR PLACES WHERE IT SAYS THE CHARGERS SHOULD BE PLACED - AND SEE WHAT OPPORTUNITIES IT COULD OPEN UP FOR THOSE COMMUNITIES.

>> THE INDIANA ALLIANCE FOR EQUITY, DIVERSITY AND INCLUSION FOR ELECTRIC VEHICLE INFRASTRUCTURE AND ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITIES SAYS, UNDER THE STATE'S PLAN, FEW CHARGERS WOULD BE PLACED IN RACIALLY OR ETHNICALLY DIVERSE COMMUNITIES.

BUT IT'S IMPORTANT THEY GET A SEAT AT THE TABLE.

LIONEL RUSH IS PRESIDENT OF THE INTERDENOMINATIONAL MINISTERIAL ALLIANCE IN INDIANAPOLIS.

LIONEL RUSH: THE HIGHWAYS TORE THROUGH THE HISTORICALLY BLACK NEIGHBORHOODS DESTROYING HOMES AND BUSINESSES UPROOTING FAMILIES AND COMMUNITY, POISONING THE AIR THAT WE BREATHE.

>> AMONG OTHER THINGS, THE ALLIANCE WANTS THE STATE TO COMMIT TO PLACING CHARGERS IN RACIALLY AND ETHNICALLY DIVERSE COMMUNITIES AND AT BLACK-OWNED BUSINESSES.

IT ALSO WANTS INDOT TO CREATE AN EQUITY ADVISORY BOARD AND COMMIT TO HIRIG AND TRAINING A DIVERSE WORKFORCE FOR THE E-V PROJECTS.

SO FAR, THE GROUP SAYS INDOT HASN'T RESPONDED TO ANY OF ITS REQUESTS.

>> NIKI KELLY, SHOULD THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT STEP IN TO ADDRESS THESE CONCERNS, IF THE STATE ISN'T RESPONSIVE?

>> YEAH.

I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S THEIR PLACE.

IT'S TECHNICALLY THEIR MONEY.

THEY PROBABLY COULD.

I THOUGHT IT WAS INTERESTING THERE WERE SORT OF TWO LEVELS OF CONCERN IN THIS.

THE ONE IS WHERE THEY'RE LITERALLY BEING PLACED.

THEY'RE BASICALLY SORT OF MORE AFFLUENT PLACES.

>> WHERE ELECTRIC VEHICLES ARE NOW, BUT THE POINT IS THIS IS NOT FOR THE NEXT FIVE YEARS, IT'S FOR THE NEXT FIFTY YEARS.

>> YES, YOU HAVE TO THINK BEYOND WHERE WE ARE AT RIGHT NOW.

THE SECOND ISSUE IS THE WHOLE ADVISORY SITUATION AND WHO THEY GOT COMMENTS FROM ON THE BOARD.

THERE REALLY WAS VERY LITTLE ATTEMPT TO GET THE MINORITY COMMUNITIES INVOLVED.

SO, I THINK BETWEEN THE TWO OF THEM, WE'LL SEE IF THE SECRETARY STEPS IN.

>> OUR REPORTER REBECCA FIELD DID A STORY ABOUT THIS, ABOUT THESE EXACT CONCERNS TWO MONTHS AGO WHEN THEY WERE FIRST RAISED BY THIS ALLIANCE.

WHEN I TALKED TO HER LAST WEEK I ASKED IF YOU EXPECT ANYTHING TO CHANGE WITH THIS NEW PRESS CONFERENCE.

SHE SAID NO BECAUSE THE CONCERNS ARE THE SAME BECAUSE AFTER THE PLAN WAS INITIALLY ROLLED OUT, NOTHING WAS CHANGED.

SO, WHY DO YOU THINK THE STATE ISN'T BEING RESPONSIVE HERE?

>> I DON'T KNOW.

I THINK THE MARKET EVENTUALLY WILL GET THERE BECAUSE THESE VEHICLES WILL BECOME MORE AND MORE POPULAR.

WE SAW WHAT CALIFORNIA IS DOING.

AND LIKE IT OR NOT, AS CALIFORNIA GOES, SO GOES A LOT OF THE MANUFACTURING, AUTOMOTIVE MANUFACTURING INDUSTRY FOR OBVIOUS REGIONS.

THAT'S A HUGE CHUNK OF THE MARKET.

SO, THIS MAY BE UPON US EVEN FASTER THAN WE HAD THOUGHT IN TERMS OF A PERVASIVE SORT OF MARKET, IF NOT SATURATION, AT LEAST A GOOD PERCENTAGE OF VEHICLES NEEDING THESE KIND OF CHARGING STATIONS.

AND THAT WILL FORCE IT TO BE IN LOTS OF AREAS, NOT JUST WHERE THERE SEEMS TO BE THE DEMAND RIGHT NOW.

BECAUSE AGAIN, IT'S FLUID.

THIS IS A MOVING TARGET, OBVIOUSLY.

WHY IS THE STATE NOT BEING MORE RESPONSIVE?

I DON'T KNOW.

I THINK THEY'RE PROBABLY THINKING, YOU KNOW, WHERE IS THE DEMAND NOW.

AND IT COMES DOWN TO SIMPLY TO THAT.

ANY KIND OF ASSESSMENT, WHERE SHOULD WE PUT FIREHOUSES.

YOU LOOK AT DATA.

WHERE ARE THE FIRES?

OR CRIME?

YOU PUT THE FACILITIES IN THOSE LOCATIONS.

I THINK THAT'S PART OF IT.

ALSO, YOU HAVE A PHILOSOPHY, MAYBE MORE SO PRONOUNCED AT THE STATE LEVEL THAN THE FEDERAL LEVEL, WHERE IT'S NOT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF WHERE THE MARKET AND DEMAND SHOULD DRIVE THE PLACEMENT OF THESE TYPES OF THINGS.

IT'S NOT SOCIAL ENGINEERING.

IT'S NOT USING GOVERNMENT DOLLARS TO ENGINEER AN OUTCOME, ALTHOUGH THAT'S WHAT GOVERNMENT DOES ALL THE TIME.

>> THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BEING PRACTICAL AND ASPIRATIONAL.

>> RIGHT, RIGHT.

AND THAT'S A DEBATE THAT GOES ON.

SHOULD WE HAVE A FLAT TAX OR SHOULD WE USE IT TO ENCOURAGE HOMEOWNERSHIP?

OR CHARITY FOR VALUABLE NONPROFITS OR FOR COLLEGE EDUCATIONS?

YOU KNOW, THIS IS A DEBATE THAT IS PROBABLY A HUNDRED PLUS YEARS OLD.

>> IN TERMS OF WHERE THE MARKET WILL EVENTUALLY GO, AND TALKING ABOUT THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE NEXT FEW YEARS, THIS IS ABOUT THE NEXT SEVERAL DECADES, THE INFLATION REDUCTION ACT, THE LATEST FEDERAL SPENDING BILL THAT PASSED RECENTLY INCLUDES A NEW FEDERAL TAX CREDIT FOR ELECTRIC VEHICLES THAT FOR THE FIRST TIME INSTEAD OF SAYING OKAY WE'LL GIVE YOU SOME MONEY WHEN YOU FILE YOUR TAXES NEXT YEAR AFTER YOU'VE BOUGHT ONE OF THESE VEHICLES, INSTEAD NOW YOU APPLY THAT CREDIT AT THE PURCHASE.

YOU CAN BRING THE COST OF ONE OF THESE DOWN UP TO $7,000 BECAUSE OF THIS NEW PROGRAM.

THESE THINGS ARE ALREADY GETTING CHEAPER, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS MAKING THEM A LITTLE MORE COST EFFECTIVE.

WE NEED TO BE THINKING, YOU KNOW, A LITTLE MORE ASPIRATIONALLY, BUT A LITTLE MORE PRACTICALLY, TOO, ABOUT WHERE THIS IS GOING TO BE FOR THE LONG-TERM, DON'T WE?

>> WELL, I THINK SO.

I THINK THERE'S A BALANCE THAT HAS TO BE STRUCK HERE.

YOU KNOW, THE STATE SAYS THAT THEY'VE FOLLOWED THE LAW IN PREPARING THE PLAN AND MEETING THE OVERALL GOALS OF HAVING STATIONS, YOU KNOW, ALONG THE HIGHWAYS SO YOU'RE KIND OF REDUCING THE ANXIETY FOR RANGE THAT PEOPLE WOULD BE ABLE TO TRAVEL DISTANCES.

AND THAT'S THE PRIMARY KIND OF FOCUS THERE.

AND THEN ALSO THEY'LL SAY THERE IS COVERAGE, THEIR COUNTER TO THIS IS THAT THERE IS GREAT COVERAGE WHERE NEARLY EVERYONE IS WITHIN 35 MILES OF A CHARGING STATION.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE ALL VOICES HERE AND WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS TRANSITION IS RIGHT.

AND THAT EVERYONE IS GOING TO HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY.

AND IF WE WANT MORE PEOPLE TO BE, YOU KNOW, DRIVING ELECTRIC VEHICLES, THEN WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE PUTTING THE PIECES OUT THERE FOR THEM TO SEE THAT AND WANT TO DO THAT.

SO, YOU KNOW, ALL THESE THINGS ARE A PROCESS.

AND I'M HOPEFUL THAT AT THE END OF THE DAY IT WILL BE GOOD FOR EVERYONE.

AND FRANKLY, ALSO INDIANA IS JUST SEEING A LOT OF INVESTMENT FROM THE EV WORLD, RIGHT?

WE HAVE STELANTIS AND POTENTIALLY THIS BATTERY CENTER IN CARLISLE.

LET'S EMBRACE IT FOR EVERYBODY.

>> EVEN IF THE PLAN WERE EXACTLY THE SAME, IF FOLKS FROM THESE COMMUNITIES HAD HAD A SEAT AT THE TABLE, WOULD THAT HAVE MADE THE SITUATION BETTER?

>> HOPEFULLY, YES.

BUT I DON'T SEE THE STATE BEING AS INTENTIONAL AS THEY COULD BE.

WHEN WE THINK ABOUT ELECTRONIC VEHICLES, I THINK IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO THINK ABOUT ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE, AS WE THINK ABOUT EQUITY, AS WE THINK ABOUT THE NEXT 50 YEARS AHEAD.

AND, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHY THE STATE ISN'T MOVING AS QUICKLY AS IT COULD BE, BUT WE'LL SEE.

>> DON'T ASSUME EVERYBODY IN THE STATE IS UNIFIED IN SUPPORT OF ELECTRIC VEHICLES, BECAUSE AS WE SAW BEFORE, THE STATE USED TO GIVE AN EVEN BIGGER INCENTIVE, BUT THEN THERE WAS A PUSH IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY A SESSION OR TWO BACK, THEY'RE NOT PAYING GAS TAXES, SO WE'RE GOING TO PUT A SURCHARGE ON ELECTRIC VEHICLES.

>> THERE'S NO EVIDENCE THAT INDIANA TAXPAYER DOLLARS ARE BEING INVESTED USING WHAT'S KNOWN AS ENVIRONMENTAL, SOCIAL AND GOVERNANCE, OR ESG CONSIDERATIONS.

BUT ATTORNEY GENERAL TODD ROKITA SAYS HE WANTS TO ASSURE HOOSIERS THAT'S TRUE.

>> ESG INVESTING IS A GROWING PRACTICE IN WHICH INVESTORS CONSIDER THE ENVIRONMENTAL AND SOCIAL IMPACTS OF THEIR INVESTMENTS.

SEVERAL CONSERVATIVE-LED STATES HAVE TAKEN STEPS TO BAN IT WHEN IT COMES TO INVESTING PUBLIC DOLLARS.

ATTORNEY GENERAL TODD ROKITA SAYS THE INDIANA PUBLIC RETIREMENT SYSTEM, INPRS, IS ALREADY BANNED FROM INCORPORATING ESG INVESTING STRATEGIES UNDER STATE LAW.

ATTORNEY GENERAL TODD ROKITA: WE ALL DESERVE ASSURANCE THAT STATE RETIREMENT FUNDS ARE BEING INVESTED SOLELY FOR FINANCIAL INTERESTS.

>> ROKITA SAYS THERE'S NO EVIDENCE INPRS IS USING ESG PRACTICES.

BUT HE SAYS THE STATE DOES USE OUTSIDE INVESTMENT FIRMS TO MANAGE ITS FUNDS.

AND THE REPUBLICAN A.G. SAYS HE'S INVESTIGATING WHETHER THOSE FIRMS EMPLOY THAT INVESTMENT STRATEGY.

THERE'S EVIDENCE THAT STATES BANNING FIRMS THAT USE ESG INVESTING HAVE COST TAXPAYER DOLLARS BY LIMITING COMPETITION AND INCREASING BORROWING COSTS.

>> JON SCHWANTES, WHAT PROBLEM, EXACTLY, IS TODD ROKITA PURPORTING TO ADDRESS?

>> MAYBE HE'S ADDRESSING THE FACTION OF THE PARTY THAT EATS THIS KIND OF STUFF UP AND MAYBE HASN'T HAD ENOUGH HEAD LINES THIS WEEK ON TOPICS THAT DON'T REALLY HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH HIS OFFICE.

I MEAN THIS IS A PATTERN WE'VE SEEN TODD ROKITA IN WHATEVER IS FASHIONABLE AROUND THE COUNTRY.

CRITICAL RACE THEORY OR PARENTS DEPRIVED OF AN OPPORTUNITY TO WEIGH IN ON THEIR STUDENTS' INTERESTS IN THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

EVERY WEEK WE COULD COME UP WITH THE TODD ROKITA TOPIC OF THE WEEK.

AS A PRACTICAL MATTER IT SEEMS DESIGNED TO DO WHAT WE'RE DOING, TALK ABOUT IT AND GET PEOPLE WORKED UP.

>> HOW HE DID THIS EVENT, IT SEEMS LIKE THAT IS WHAT HE WANTS TO DO GOING FORWARD.

IS THAT A PROBLEM?

>> I JUST WANT TO NOTE.

THIS IS A QUESTION THAT A STATE LAWMAKER ASKED FOR AN ADVISORY OPINION ON.

HE DIDN'T AT LEAST PULL IT OUT OF TOTAL THIN AIR.

NORMALLY WE ALL GO TO A PRESS CONFERENCE, YOU'RE IN THE SAME ROOM, YOU SHOUT YOUR QUESTION,.

>> RESPOND TO SOMETHING HE SAID.

>> CORRECT.

THIS IS DIFFERENT.

THIS WAS LIVE STREAMED ON FACEBOOK AND THEY TOLD REPORTERS YOU HAD TO EMAIL IN YOUR WRITTEN QUESTIONS BEFORE, CAN WHEN WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT WAS GOING TO BE DISCUSSED, OR WHILE IT WAS GOING ON.

AND THEY LOOK AT THE QUESTIONS AND CHOOSE WHICH ONES TO ASK HIM.

IT'S NOT A GOOD SITUATION.

THINK BACK WHEN THE GOVERNOR WAS DOING COVID STUFF.

AT LEAST WHEN YOU RAISED YOUR HAND ON THE ZOOM, THEY DIDN'T KNOW WHAT QUESTION WAS COMING.

THAT LET'S THEM PICK AND CHOOSE SO SOME OF THE HARDER ONES HE DOESN'T HAVE TO ANSWER THEM.

IT'S JUST A LACK OF ACCOUNTABILITY.

>> AND WE WORKED OUT A WAY THAT WE COULD COME UP WITH FOLLOW-UP QUESTIONS.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO GET CALLED ON TODAY, WE ALL NEED THIS QUESTION ANSWERED.

NONE OF THAT WAS POSSIBLE.

OVERALL, THOUGH, IS THIS KIND OF WHAT WE SHOULD EXPECT FROM TODD ROKITA'S OFFICE.

>> THE CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUSING OF WOKE SINCE IT STARTED.

STAY WOKE WAS COOL.

BUT THESE TACTICS DON'T HELP HOOSIERS AT ALL.

>> WE'LL SEE HOW OFTEN WE TALK ABOUT IT SEEMS LIKE THE SAME KIND OF ISSUE ALL OVER AGAIN.

I'M SURE HE'LL BE THRILLED.

THAT'S INDIANA WEEK IN REVIEW FOR THIS WEEK.

OUR PANEL IS DEMOCRAT GREG STOWERS, REPUBLICAN JENNIFER HALLOWELL, JON SCHWANTES OF INDIANA LAWMAKERS, AND NIKI KELLY OF THE INDIANA CAPITAL CHRONICLE.

IF YOU'D LIKE A PODCAST OF THIS PROGRAM YOU CAN FIND IT AT WFYI.ORG/IWIR OR STARTING MONDAY YOU CAN STREAM IT OR GET IT ON DEMAND FROM XFINITY AND ON THE WFYI APP.

I'M BRANDON SMITH OF INDIANA PUBLIC BROADCASTING.

JOIN US NEXT TIME BECAUSE A LOT CAN HAPPEN IN AN INDIANA WEEK.

♪ >> THE OPINIONS EXPRESSED ARE SOLELY THOSE OF THE PANELISTS.

INSIDE INDIANA BUSINESS IS A WFYI PRODUCTION IN ASSOCIATION WITH INDIANA'S PUBLIC BROADCASTING STATIONS.