>>> FOR ABORTION RIGHTS SUPPORTERS, THERE'S NO PLACE LIKE KANSAS.

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WELCOME TO "COLUMBUS ON THE RECORD."

THIS WEEK WE GOT OUR FIRST LOOK AT THE DIRECT ELECTORAL POLITICS OF ABORTION AFTER THE DODDS DECISION THAT OVERTURNED ROE V. WADE.

KANSAS VOTERS DECIDED A PROPOSAL TO REMOVE THE STATE'S CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTION OF ABORTION RIGHTS.

THE ANSWER WAS A RESOUNDING NO.

THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT LOST 59% TO 31%.

ABORTION RIGHTS EASILY PREVAILED IN A RED STATE THAT DONALD TRUMP WON BY DOUBLE-DIGITS.

THE MARGIN OF VICTORY SURPRISED NEARLY EVERYONE, AND IT HAS CAUSED ACTIVISTS ON BOTH SIDES TO WONDER WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF SUCH A VOTE WERE HELD IN OTHER STATES.

OTHER STATES LIKE OHIO.

JESSE BALMER, TELL OUR ACTIVISTS ON EITHER SIDE WHAT HAPPENED IN KANSAS, THE ONES HERE IN OHIO.

>> I THINK IF YOU SUPPORT ABORTION ACCESS IN OHIO, WHICH HAS BEEN GREATLY RESTRICTED SINCE THE DOBBS DECISION, OHIO CURRENTLY PREVENTS DOCTORS FROM PERFORMING ABORTION AFTER FETAL ACTIVITY THE DETECTED, SO ABOUT SIX WEEKS INTO PREGNANCY.

IF YOU SUPPORT MORE ACCESS TO ABORTION THAN THAT, THIS IS A CAUSE FOR SOME OPTIMISM.

OBVIOUSLY, KANSAS IS A MORE CONSERVATIVE, MORE RED STATE TRADITIONALLY.

THEY'VE PICKED REPUBLICANS 19 OF THE LAST 20 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS.

SO THERE IS SOME, YOU KNOW, REASON TO FEEL GOOD ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED IN KANSAS THAT COULD HAPPEN IN OHIO.

ONE OF THE CHALLENGES IS OHIO WON'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE ON A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT ON ABORTION ACCESS UNTIL 2023, AND WE'RE NOT SURE WHAT THAT LANGUAGE IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE YET.

>> BUT ANDREW, IT HAS TO HAVE WOKE EVERYBODY UP.

IT WAS ON THE BALLOT, CLEARLY YES OR NO ON ABORTION RIGHTS IN A RED STATE, AND THE ABORTION RIGHTS WON HANDILY.

THAT HAS TO HELP THE FOLKS WHO WANT TO GET THIS ON THE BALLOT, AND IT HAS TO WORRY FOLKS FOR THE MIDTERMS.

>> YEAH, I DO THINK ANOTHER ASPECT OF IT TOO IS IT A YES OR A NO, IT'S EASIER TO GET PEOPLE TO VOTE NO ON SOMETHING.

ON THE OTHER HAND, PEOPLE WANT TO EXPLAIN IT AWAY.

I THINK PEOPLE UNDERSTAND ABORTION.

THEY KNOW WHAT IT IS.

THEY UNDERSTAND IT.

IT'S NOT COMPLICATED REALLY.

IT'S SOMETHING PEOPLE HAVE STRONG OPINIONS ON.

THERE ARE NUANCES, LIKE JESSE SAID, IF IT IS ON THE BALLOT.

WHAT EXACTLY ARE YOU PROPOSING.

ON THE SUBJECT IN GENERAL, IT MAKES PUBLIC SENTIMENT REALLY HARD TO TRACK.

IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE, BUT CERTAINLY, AS WE KEEP SAYING, KANSAS IS FURTHER TO THE RIGHT THAN OHIO, AND THERE IS EVERY REASON TO BELIEVE SOMETHING LIKE THAT COULD HAPPEN HERE.

>> MIKE, WERE YOU SURPRISED BY THE MARGIN.

THE POLLS BEFORE THIS VOTE WAS BASICALLY 50-50, 47% TO 47%.

IN THE PAST YEARS, THIS WAS 60/40.

>> I WAS SURPRISED BY IT, VERY SURPRISED BY IT.

I DON'T THINK IT WOULD HAVE STAND HAD IT BEEN THE SAME RESULT.

I WOULD WOULD GUESS 52-48, THAT TYPE OF THING.

SO THIS WAS A REAL SHOCK TO ME.

>> HERB, DOES IT MAKE ABORTION A MORE SORT OF A BELLWETHER ISSUE FOR THE MIDTERMS?

OR IS THIS A ONE-OFF?

>> NO, IT'S NOT A ONE-OFF.

I THINK THE REPUBLICANS IN SOME STATES ARE MAKING ABORTION MORE OF AN ISSUE FOR THE DEMOCRATS BECAUSE I THINK IN OHIO NOW WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE HEARTBEAT BILL.

BUT I THINK WE'RE ALSO SAYING WELL, NO, NO, WE'RE GOING TO GO BEYOND THAT.

WE'RE GOING HAVE PERHAPS A CONCEPTION OR A PERSONHOOD BILL.

AND THAT'S EVEN MORE EXTREME.

AND SO I'M NOT SURE THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE PROPOSING THAT KIND OF MEASURE IN OHIO REALLY TOOK ANY LESSONS FROM KANSAS, AND I THINK THEY'LL ACTUALLY THEN FURTHER ENERGIZE THE PRO-CHOICE PEOPLE.

BUT THERE IS A CONSENSUS.

A LOT OF NUANCED VIEWS ABOUT ABORTION.

BUT LOOK, MOST AMERICANS DO NOT SUPPORT ANY TIME, ANYHOW ABORTION.

THEY DON'T BELIEVE IN THAT.

AND THEY CERTAINLY DON'T BELIEVE IN NO CONCEPTION, OR THE CONCEPTION VERSION OF ABORTION.

THEY DON'T BELIEVE IN THE PERSONHOOD.

THEY THINK THERE SHOULD BE A REASONABLE AND THERE SHOULD BE REASONABLE EXCEPTIONS.

AND I THINK WHAT'S HAPPENING IN OHIO RIGHT NOW IS THAT, YOU KNOW, THE ARDENT PRO-LIFE PEOPLE ARE DEFINING THE ISSUE IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT'S GOING TO SEEM VERY, VERY EXTREME WHEN IN FACT I THINK MORE PEOPLE ARE SAYING, YEAH, THERE SHOULD PROBABLY BE ABORTION RIGHTS, BUT WITH LIMITATIONS.

>> JESSE, THERE IS STRONG SUPPORT OF ABORTION RIGHTS.

OBVIOUSLY A WOMAN RUNNING AGAINST A MAN, WHO IS VERY MUCH OPPOSED TO ABORTION RIGHTS, EACH THOUGH HE HAS TAKEN A LOW PROFILE RIGHT NOW ON THE ISSUE.

DOES SHE TRY TO CAPITALIZE ON THIS?

DOES IT ENERGIZE HER CAMPAIGN ON THIS ISSUE?

DOES SHE JUST FOCUS ON THIS ISSUE NOW?

>> CERTAINLY SHE IS GOING TO TRY TO CAPITALIZE ON THIS.

IT'S A TOPIC THAT SHE'S TALKED ABOUT REPEATEDLY SINCE THE DOBBS DECISION CAME OUT.

MIKE DeWINE IN CONTRAST HAS TALKED VERY LITTLE ABOUT HIS POSITION ON ABORTION, WHICH HAS BEEN ONE OF, IF NOT HIS MOST CONSISTENT POLICY POSITION ACROSS SEVERAL DECADES OF POLITICS, HE HAS, YOU KNOW, REALLY SIGNED ABORTION BAN AFTER ABORTION RESTRICTION.

SO IF YOU ASK PEOPLE AT A HIGH RIGHT TO LIFE, HE IS ONE OF THEIR CHAMPIONS, BUT THAT IS NOT A POSITION THAT HE IS CURRENTLY FOCUSING ON.

IT'S THE GENERAL ELECTION AND HE'D RATHER TALK ABOUT INTEL.

THERE IS SOMETHING ELSE THAT'S POSSIBLE.

>> ANDREW, HOW DOES THIS PLAY OUT?

DO WE GET ON THE BALLOT IN '23 BECAUSE OF WHAT WE SAW IN KANSAS?

IS IT A BIG EFFECT IN THIS ELECTION, 2024'S ELECTION?

>> COLLEAGUES OF MINE HAVE DONE MORE REPORTING ON THIS.

MY SENSE IS I DON'T THINK THERE IS CONSENSUS WHAT THEY WANT TO DO.

I DON'T GET THE SENSE NECESSARILY THE CAMPAIGN IS VERY ORGANIZED.

I THINK THERE IS GOING TO BE A VERY DIFFICULT QUESTION FOR THEM IF THEY WANT TO DO IT IN 2023.

THERE ARE PROS AND CONS TO DO THAT.

THEY WOULD HAVE TO GET TOGETHER SOMETHING RATHER QUICKLY.

MAYBE THEY WANT TO CAPTURE ON THE ENERGY, FOR INSTANCE.

IF THEY DO HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL 2024, WHETHER IT'S TO GET RESOURCES OR GET AN IDEA OF WHAT THE CAMPAIGN LOOK LIKES OR WHAT THE ISSUE LOOKS LIKE, THEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION, MAYBE THAT CHANGES PEOPLE'S ISSUES THAT MAYBE WAITING A LITTLE LONGER, THE ISSUE FADES A LITTLE BIT.

SO IT'S KIND OF HARD TO PREDICT.

I GUESS WE'LL HAVE TO SEE HOW THINGS COALESCE.

>> I THINK THERE IS A WHOLE NEW WORLD.

THIS WAS PUT ON THE BALLOT.

THE EFFORT STARTED IN 2019 WHEN THE KANSAS SUPREME COURT RULED THAT THE KANSAS CONSTITUTION PROTECTED ABORTION.

REPUBLICANS WANTED TO GET IT ON THE BALLOT.

THE LEGISLATURE DID THAT.

THEY CHOSE AUGUST BECAUSE IT WOULD BE A LOW TURNOUT ELECTION.

THEY COULD GET IT PASSED.

WELL, IT WAS A HUGE TURNOUT ELECTION.

SO IT'S A WHOLE NEW GAME NOW.

>> IT IS A WHOLE NEW GAME.

I THINK YOU'RE PROBABLY GOING TO SEE SOMETHING SIMILAR TO THAT IN '23 ON THE BALLOT.

BUT IT'S DIFFERENT THAN KANSAS.

KANSAS WAS A YES-NO.

YOU PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT HERE, IT'S GOT TO SAY SOMETHING.

IF YOU JUST SAY LET'S HAVE ABORTION WIDE OPEN, IT'S NOT GOING TO PASS.

AND ONCE YOU PICK OUT A TIME FRAME OR SOMETHING, THEN YOU GET A LOT OF TALK.

AND WHATEVER THAT'S GOING TO BE, IT'S GOING TO BE 61-31, OR WHATEVER YOUR NUMBERS WERE.

>> THAT'S THE QUESTION FOR ABORTION RIGHTS SUPPORTERS IF THEY DO PUT IT ON THE BALLOT.

WHAT'S THE WEAK NUMBER?

>> THE CONTENT.

>> IS IT TEN WEEK, 12 WEEKS, VIABILITY ABORTION LEGAL.

>> SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 12 AND 15 WEEKS.

KIRKS THOSE FOLKS COME TO THAT AGREEMENT ON THE LEFT SIDE?

>> THEY WILL HAVE TO OUT OF NECESSITY, OTHERWISE THEY'RE DOOMED IN TERMS OF EITHER NOT GETTING ON THE BALLOT OR SUFFERING DEFEAT.

SO THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TELL THEIR SUPPORTERS WHO WANT, LET'S SAY A MORE OPEN ABORTION POLICY, HUH-UH, THAT'S NOT GOING TO FLY.

THAT WON'T PASS.

AND I THINK THEY'LL FIND POLLING DATA, AND THEY'LL FIND OTHER EXPERIENCES THAT SAY SOMEWHERE IN THE FIRST TRIMESTER, GIVE OR TAKE A WEEK OR WHATEVER.

AND THEN MAYBE HAVE A PROVISION IN THERE ALSO THAT SAYS IF THE MOTHER IS SUFFERING FROM SERIOUS HEALTH CONSEQUENCES WHILE PREGNANT BEYOND 15 WEEKS, THEN IN FACT THERE CAN BE AN EXCEPTION THERE.

BUT THEY WILL HAVE TO WORD IT VERY CAREFULLY.

THE OTHER THING THAT'S HAPPENED HERE NOW IN OHIO, I KNOW I WAS ON WITH MIKE SOME WEEKS AGO, HE SAID WE'LL ACTUALLY PROTECT THE HEALTH OF THE MOTHER, OKAY.

OR THE LIFE OF THE MOTHER.

LIFE AND HEALTH AREN'T THE SAME THING.

AND WE'RE ABSOLUTELY OPPOSED TO ANY EXEMPTION FOR RAPE AND INCEST.

AND, YOU KNOW, MOST PEOPLE HEAR THAT -- NOT EVERYBODY -- SAY THAT'S JUST ABSURD.

THEN WE HAD THE ISSUE OF THE YOUNG WOMAN FROM OHIO WHO WENT TO INDIANA.

AND THE ISSUE ISN'T WHETHER SHE COULD HAVE HAD THE ABORTION HERE IN OHIO.

THE ISSUE IS WHY WOULD YOU FORCE HER TO CARRY THE BABY TO TERM?

>> YEAH, THAT'S WHAT THE INDIANA LEGISLATURE IS STILL STRUGGLING WITH.

AND THAT'S A PRETTY RED STATE AS WELL.

>>> OUR NEXT TOPIC ON TUESDAY, OHIO HELD THE DELAYED SECOND HALF OF ITS PRIMARY ELECTION.

IT WAS FOR STATE LEGISLATIVE RACES.

VERY FEW PEOPLE CAST BALLOTS.

TURNOUT FAILED TO REACH 8%, A RECORD LOW.

EASILY A RECORD LOW.

632,000 PEOPLE CAST BALLOTS IN OHIO, WITH THE COST OF THE ELECTION ESTIMATED AT $25 MILLION, THAT CAME OUT TO $39 PER VOTE.

WHEN IT WAS OVER, THERE WERE FEW SURPRISES IN THIS REDISTRICTING CHAOS PRIMARY.

ANDREW TOBIAS, WHAT CAN WE, IF ANYTHING READ FROM THIS PRIMARY?

>> WELL, THE FIRST THING THAT I REALLY WANT TO EMPHASIZE IS YES, IT'S NOT LIKE THE OTHER PRIMARIES WE'VE HAD IN THE PAST, BUT IT WAS BY FAR THE LOWEST TURNOUT.

GOING BACK TO 1962, OHIO HAS ALWAYS HAD A MILLION PEOPLE SHOW UP TO VOTE FOR PRIMARY ELECTIONS IN EVEN YEARS.

THE NUMBER WAS SOMETHING LIKE AND THAT WAS 1960 WHEN THE POPULATION WAS FOUR MILLION PEOPLE LESS.

SO THAT BEING SAID, IT'S HARD TO REALLY TAKE ANYTHING TOO SERIOUSLY AWAY FROM IT JUST BECAUSE A LOW TURNOUT ELECTION JUST CREATES UNPREDICTABLE OUTCOMES.

AND I WILL SAY TOO THERE WERE THREE INCUMBENTS WHO WERE DEFEATED.

ONE, YOU HAD TWO DEMOCRATS DRAWN IN THE SAME DISTRICT.

AND THEN YOU HAD AN INCUMBENT WHO WAS JUST APPOINTED EARLIER THIS YEAR WHO WASN'T REALLY ESTABLISHED.

AND THEN YOU HAD SOMEBODY ELSE WHO RAN A VERY BITTER PRIMARY AND ALMOST LOST TWO YEARS AGO.

SO YOU DIDN'T REALLY HAVE ANY WELL ESTABLISHED PEOPLE, NOT SURPRISINGLY, YOU DID HAVE SOME INCUMBENTS LOSE.

IT WAS WASN'T ALL SAID AND TOLD THAT EXCITING OF AN ELECTION FROM MY POINT.

>> SOME FOLKS SURPRISED HOW HIGH THE TURNOUT WAS.

THEY THOUGHT IT WAS GOING TO BE EVEN LOWER.

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, MIKE, I'M ONE OF THOSE 607,000 PEOPLE WHO DID VOTE, AND I'M NOT SURE WHY.

I GOT THERE, AND THERE WAS A LITTLE STICKER IN FRONT OF ME AS I WAS SIGNING IN THAT SAYS IN THE RACE OF A VERSUS B, B DROPPED OUT.

SO IF YOU VOTE FOR HIM, IT DOESN'T COUNT.

SO THEN I GO IN, AND I THINK THAT COUNTING A VERSUS B, THERE WAS EITHER TWO OR AT THE MOST THREE CONTESTED RACES.

AND ONCE YOU TOOK A OUT, THAT LEFT TWO CONTESTED RACES OR ONE ON MY BALLOT.

SO, YOU KNOW, I COULD HAVE SAVED EVERYBODY $39, I GUESS BY NOT GOING.

>> IT WOULD HAVE COST MORE IF YOU DON'T VOTE.

>> THAT'S TRUE.

>> HERB, THIS IS AN UNUSUAL YEAR BECAUSE OF THE REDISTRICTING.

DOES IT -- DID IT HURT DEMOCRACY THAT WE HAD SO LITTLE PARTICIPATION BOTH AS FAR AS CANDIDATES AND VOTERS IN THIS PRIMARY?

>> MOST PEOPLE FORGOT ABOUT THE PRIMARY BEFORE THE PRIMARY, AND THEY'LL FORGET ABOUT THIS PRIMARY AFTER.

I THINK SOME OF THE SIGNIFICANT RESULTS, WHICH I'M NOT THAT FAMILIAR WITH, REALLY HAPPENED IN THE REPUBLICAN STATE CENTRAL COMMITTEE WHERE IN FACT THERE WAS SOME MAJOR GAINS IN LICKING, DELAWARE COUNTY AND ELSEWHERE BY THE NOT JUST THE CONSERVATIVE OR THE VERY CONSERVATIVE, BUT THE EXTREME WING OF THE PARTY.

AND I DON'T KNOW HOW THOSE NUMBERS ADD UP.

AND OF COURSE THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN AN EVEN LOWER TURNOUT.

I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY VOTES IT WOULD HAVE TAKEN TO HAVE WON.

AND OF COURSE WE TALKED ABOUT BETTY MONTGOMERY BEFORE GOING ON THE AIR.

>> SHE LOST HER SEAT.

>> AND SHE REALLY -- SHE REALLY DIDN'T CAMPAIGN.

IN FACT, SOME OF HER FRIENDS WERE URGING HER NOT TO RUN.

WHY DO YOU STILL WANT TO BE INVOLVED IN THIS MESS, BECAUSE IT REALLY IS KIND OF BITTER ON THE STATE CENTRAL COMMITTEE.

>> JESSE, THERE WAS SOME FOUR THAT MORE REPUBLICAN INCUMBENTS MIGHT LOSE IN THE PRIMARY, BUT THERE ARE ONLY JUST A COUPLE.

>> YEAH, I THINK ANDREA SUMMED IT UP WELL.

THERE WERE A FEW INSTANCES, PARTICULARLY LIKE THE LICKING COUNTY RACE THERE WAS A DECENT AMOUNT OF MONEY SPENT MY LARRY HOUSEHOLDER IN THIS RACE, THE LAST ROUND THAT HELPED THE PERSON WHO ULTIMATELY WON.

AND THEN THERE WAS THE REVENGE OF THE OTHER PRIMARY CANDIDATE THERE.

IT IS WORTH NOTING THERE ARE AT LEAST TWO DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES IN THE COLUMBUS AREA WHO MIGHT BE REPRESENTING SOMALI AMERICANS FOR THE FIRST TIME.

SO PERHAPS WHEN YOU HAVE LIKE A LOWER TURNOUT, A SLIGHTLY CONFUSING PRIMARY, YOU GET MORE REPRESENTATION FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE ORGANIZED.

>> YEAH.

ORGANIZATION WAS THE KEY.

A LOT OF PEOPLE THOUGHT THEY ALREADY VOTED IN THE PRIMARIES.

WHY DO THEY HAVE TO VOTE AGAIN.

VOTED IN MAY.

ANY WAY, J.D.

VANCE HAS SURFACED.

HE IS BACK CAMPAIGNING.

HE WAS AT THE STATE FAIR THIS WEEK, AND HE HAS A NEW TV AD OUT, HIS FIRST IN MONTHS.

A TIME WHERE HE BASICALLY YIELDED THE TV AD FIELD TO HIS OPPONENT, TIM RYAN.

SINCE WE HAVE PLAYED SEVERAL OF RYAN'S ADS ON THIS SHOW, HERE IS VANCE'S FIRST POST PRIMARY SPOT.

>> OUR FAMILY STORY IS AN OHIO STORY.

MY HUSBAND, J.D.

GREW UP IN MIDDLETOWN, AND THINGS WEREN'T EASY.

HIS MOM STRUGGLED WITH ADDICTION, AND HIS DAD WASN'T THERE.

BUT J.D.

WAS LUCKY.

HE WAS RAISED BY A LOVING GRANDMOTHER AND SERVED HIS COUNTRY AS A MARINE IN IRAQ.

HE IS AN INCREDIBLE FATHER, AND HE IS MY BEST FRIEND.

J.D.

SHARED HIS FAMILY AND HE WANTS FOR OHIO WHAT OHIO GAVE HIM, A FIGHTING CHANCE.

>> I'M J.D.

VANCE, AND I APPROVE THIS MESSAGE.

>> ONE NOTE.

THE AD WAS PAID FOR BY THE NATIONAL REPUBLICAN SENATORIAL COMMITTEE, NOT VANCE'S CAMPAIGN, WHICH HAS STRUGGLED TO RAISE MONEY.

THE AD ACCOMPLISHES TWO THINGS.

IT COUNTERS THE MESSAGE HE IS FROM SAN FRANCISCO, AND HIS WIFE I'M GUESSING IS TALKING TO SUBURBAN REPUBLICAN WOMEN.

>> IT'S A CLASSIC INTRO AD, THE BIOAD.

IT'S VERY, VERY POSITIVE, A VERY NICE AD.

THE ADS WILL CHANGE QUITE DRAMATICALLY WITHIN A COUPLE OF WEEKS.

AND THE ADS -- FIRST, YOU HAVE TO IDENTIFY YOURSELF AS SORT OF A GOOD GUY AND A GOOD PERSON.

BUT EVENTUALLY, IT WILL BE -- HE'LL TRY TO MAKE THIS A REFERENDUM ON DEMOCRATS AND JOE BIDEN, AND THEREFORE, TIM RYAN IS GUILTY OF EVERY SIN THAT ANY DEMOCRAT EVER COMMITTED AND WILL BE TALKING ABOUT HOW THE DRUGS IN OHIO COME FROM MEXICO BECAUSE THE DEMOCRATS ALLOW THE BORDER TO BE JUST A TOTAL MESS AND INFLATION AND ALL THAT.

SO VANCE WILL WANT TO MAKE THIS SORT OF REFERENDUM ON DEMOCRAT, ON THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

AND THEN TIE IN.

LYON WILL WANT TO MAKE THE ISSUE A CHOICE BETWEEN J.D.

VANCE AND TIM RYAN.

LYON GOT OFF TO A VERY GOOD START.

HE WAS DEFINING HIMSELF AND J.D.

VANCE.

>> THERE WAS A WIDE GAP BETWEEN THE END OF THE PRIMARY WHEN WE SAW A LOT OF J.D.

VANCE'S ADS, BOTH ATTACKING HIM AND SUPPORTING HIM.

AND HE TOOK CRITICISM FOR STAYING OFF THE AIR FOR A LONG TIME.

IT WAS GOOD.

IS THAT THE WAY HE STAYED OFF, LET THE OLD NEGATIVE STUFF THAT TIMKEN AND GIBBONS WERE THROWING AT HIM BACK IN THE DAY, BACK IN MAY, APRIL SETTLE?

>> THAT'S KIND OF A QUESTION THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAD, ESPECIALLY NATIONALLY REPUBLICANS ARE LOOKING AT A SENATE MAP WHERE THEY DON'T WANT A SEAT IN OHIO THAT ROB PORTMAN IS GIVING UP.

THEY'D RATHER FOCUS ON PICKING UP DEMOCRATIC SEATS IN OTHER STATES.

I THINK THEY ASSUMED THAT VANCE WAS FUNDRAISING, BUT WHEN HIS CAMPAIGN FINANCE REPORT CAME OUT IN LATE JUNE OR EARLY JULY, HE ONLY HAD A COUPLE OF MILLION TO TIM RYAN HAD AT THAT POINT SPENT SOMETHING LIKE $6 MILLION AND STILL HAD ANOTHER $4 MILLION LEFT.

THIS CAUSED A LOT OF CONCERN.

YOU KNOW, IF YOU TALK TO HIS -- VANCE'S ALLIES, THEY SAID ELECTIONS AREN'T WON IN THE SUMMER.

PEOPLE AREN'T REALLY PAYING ATTENTION.

WE'RE MORE EFFECTIVE SPENDING RESOURCES IN SEPTEMBER AND ONWARD.

IN ADDITION TO THE AD WE SAW THAT THE SENATE REPUBLICAN COMMITTEE PAID FOR, A NONPROFIT THAT'S ASSOCIATED CLOSELY WITH SENATE MINORITY LEADER MITCH McCONNELL ALSO INDICATED ABOUT $3 MILLION THAT THEY'RE GOING TO BE SPENDING ON ADS HERE.

AND THAT'S GOING TO BE HAPPENING THIS MONTH.

SO I THINK THAT'S MOVING UP THE SCHEDULE.

AND I THINK IT'S SHOWING THAT REPUBLICANS MIGHT HAVE SOME CONCERN.

>> ARE REPUBLICANS GLAD TO SEE J.D.

VANCE OUT THERE MORE VISIBLE NOW?

>> OH, I THINK SO.

I DON'T THINK ANY REPUBLICAN IS PROBABLY REALLY HAPPY WITH WHAT HE HAS DONE, WHICH IS BASICALLY NOTHING.

BUT IT WILL COME, AND HE IS GOING TO HAVE THE MONEY, AND IT WILL BE A VERY INTERESTING CONTESTED RACE.

I THINK HERB'S EXACTLY RIGHT.

THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

BUT ANY REPUBLICAN, ACCORDING TO THE POLLS AND SO FORTH, WHO DOESN'T ARGUE INFLATION AND THE COST OF EVERYTHING AND THE DRUGS, WHATEVER, IT'S NOT LIMITED TO VANCE AND HIS SENATE RACE.

IT'S GOING TO BE ALL OVER THE COUNTRY.

WHETHER THAT'S FAIR OR NOT, I GUESS YOU TAKE YOUR MONEY AND MAKE YOUR CHOICE.

BUT THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

>> JESSIE, A LOT OF EYES WILL BE ON THE NEXT CAMPAIGN.

NOT SURE IT WILL COME OUT BEFORE THE ELECTION, BUT HE IS GOING THE RAISE MORE MONEY THAN HE HAS.

IN THE PRIMARY HE DIDN'T RAISE THAT MUCH MONEY.

HE GOT IT FROM PETER THIEL.

>> IT'S NICE TO HAVE FRIENDS IN HIGH PLACES, I IMAGINE.

TIM RYAN IS ALSO IN A SPOT WHERE HE NEEDS TO CONVINCE NATIONAL DEMOCRATS THAT OHIO IS A PLACE WHERE THEY SHOULD BE SPENDING MONEY.

AND SO HE HAS DONE A LOT OF ADVERTISING, HAS DONE A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, DEFINING HIS OPPONENT IN AN EFFORT TO, YOU KNOW, CONVINCE PEOPLE THAT OHIO IS A PLACE WHERE DEMOCRATS CAN WIN, AND THAT THIS COULD BE A PICKUP.

THAT WAS TIME -- WE'LL FIND OUT IF THAT WAS WELL SPENT.

>> AND I THINK HE SUCCEEDED AT THAT.

I THINK VANCE REALLY MADE THE SO LONG.

REMEMBER, MONTHS AGO, EVERYBODY ASSUMED THE REPUBLICANS WOULD HOLD ON TO THIS SEAT.

DONALD FRUM CARRIED OHIO BY 8% AND REPUBLICANS CONTROL EVERYTHING IN THIS STATE.

SO I DON'T THINK THEY REALLY THOUGHT THERE WAS MUCH CONCERN HERE ABOUT HOLDING ON TO THE SEAT.

AND THEN IN FACT TIM RYAN WENT ON THE AIR AFTER THE PRIMARY AND WE NOW HAVE A NUMBER OF POLLS.

THE EARLY POLLS AND ALL THAT, BUT THEY SHOW THEM COMPETITIVE.

AND THAT DOES BECOME A PRIME OPPORTUNITY NOW FOR DEMOCRATS TO IN FACT PICK UP A SEAT, AND THEREFORE IN FACT THE MONEY WILL START FLOWING.

AND SO I THINK IN THAT SENSE, THE FIRST ROUND OF THE CAMPAIGN WAS WON BY RYAN.

>> SPEAK TO HERB'S POINT, I THINK VANCE IS AN EASIER ARGUMENT TO MAKE.

I THINK THAT SAYING DEMOCRATS ARE DOING BADLY IS PRETTY EASY WHEN INFLATION IS AT A 40-YEAR HIGH.

MAKING IT ABOUT SMB SOMEONE'S CHARACTER IS A NOR NUANCED ARGUMENT.

OHIO LEANS RIGHT THESE DAYS.

>> WE WOULD STILL SAY THAT SOMEHOW VANCE WOULD BE THE FAVORITE.

BUT RIGHT NOW I THINK VANCE ACTUALLY HAS A NUMBER OF THINGS THAT HE IS SAYING.

AND HE KEEPS ON MAKING UNFORCED ERRORS.

HE KEEPS ON GOING TO THE RIGHT ON ABORTION.

OKAY, MAYBE THAT'S THE WAY YOU'RE GOING WIN IN THE GENERAL ELECTION.

I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THAT.

YEAH, THE CARELESS COMMENTS HE HAS MADE ABOUT UKRAINE, I MEAN, THAT'S JUST AN UNFORGIVABLE MISTAKE.

>> HE IS STILL -- HE IS A ROOKIE.

HE HASN'T REALLY RUN FOR OFFICE BEFORE.

THIS IS MISTAKES YOUNG CANDIDATES MAKE.

OUR LAST TOPIC, WITHIN THE NEXT FEW WEEKS OR SO, OHIO SCHOOL KIDS RETURN TO THEIR CLASSROOMS.

IN SOME OF THOSE SCHOOLS, TEACHERS AND OTHER EMPLOYEES COULD BE CARRYING GUNS.

LAWMAKERS THIS SUMMER MADE IT EASIER FOR TEACHERS TO ARM THEMSELVES.

THEY ONLY NEED 24 HOURS OF TRAINING.

THIS WEEK GOVERNOR DeWINE DEFENDED THE LOWER ARMED TEACHER TRAINING THRESHOLD AND TOUTED HIS ADMINISTRATION'S AWARDING OF TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN GRANTS TO NEARLY 1200 SCHOOL DISTRICTS AROUND THE STATE TO PAY FOR SECURITY UPGRADES AND SAFETY TRAINING.

WE'RE TRYING TO LAYER THIS IN AND GIVE EVERY SCHOOL THE TOOLS THAT THEY NEED, ALL THE MONEY THAT SCHOOL IS GOING TO HAVE TO ENSURE THE SAFETY OF THE CHILD.

THEY'RE GOING TO DO THE BEST THEY CAN.

MY JOB IS TO GIVE THEM THE BEST I CAN TO HELP THEM DO THAT.

>> WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS SAFETY PLAN.

OF COURSE IT ALL CAME AFTER THE TERRIBLE SHOOTING IN TEXAS.

MONEY FOR SECURITY AND TRAINING, BUT ALSO ARM TEACHERS.

>> MIKE, I DON'T KNOW.

I -- THE SCHOOL BOARD HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO TURN IT DOWN.

THEY DON'T HAVE TO DO THIS, IF THEY DON'T WANT TO, WHICH I THINK IS THE ONE GOOD THING.

YOU KNOW, IS IT GOING TO SAVE ANYTHING?

THESE PEOPLE THAT DO THESE ACTS ARE SO CRAZY, AND I JUST SAW THE FBI CLOSED THEIR INVESTIGATION INTO THE DAYTON MASSACRE AND SAID NOBODY KNEW ABOUT IT, NOTHING ON SOCIAL MEDIA, NO INDICATION FROM ANYBODY THAT THIS WOULD HAPPEN.

AND SO MANY OF THEM ARE JUST LIKE THAT.

IF MY CHILDREN ARE IN SCHOOL, DO I WANT THE TEACHER THERE WHO IS ARMED?

I THINK I DO.

BUT OTHER PEOPLE WILL SAY NO, THEY DON'T WANT.

AND I THINK THAT'S A REASONABLE INTERPRETATION.

THIS IS NOT A PANACEA.

WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE INCLUDING ME THINK SHOULD HAPPEN IS A LOT OF THESE GUNS SHOULD BE BANNED.

BUT THE REPUBLICANS AREN'T GOING TO DO THAT.

THEY MAKE IT EASIER TO HAVE WEAPONS.

BUT IT'S JUST A TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE PROBLEM, AND THERE IS NO ANSWER TO IT.

BUT I DON'T THINK THIS HURTS.

>> FOR THE REPORTERS AT THE TABLE, DIDN'T SEEM LIKE MIKE DeWINE IS A HUGE FAN OF ARMING TEACHERS EITHER.

HE WANTED -- HE STRESSED THAT THE SCHOOL BOARDS MAKE THE RULE.

HE IS NOT GOING TO ALLOW FOR ANY LESS THAN 24 HOURS IN TRAINING, AND HE REALLY STRESSED THAT SCHOOLS SHOULD HIRE TRAINED POLICE OFFICERS TO BE SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICERS.

THAT'S HIS PREFERENCE.

BUT HE STILL SIGNED THE BILL.

>> YEAH.

I THINK HE WOULD RATHER TALK ABOUT ALL THE TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS THEY'RE GOING TO SPEND TRAINING TEACHERS AND UPGRADING SECURITY THAN HE WOULD RATHER TALK ABOUT THE CONTROVERSY WHETHER OR NOT TEACHERS SHOULD BE CARRYING GUNS IN SCHOOLS.

I KNOW THAT I THINK IT IS OPTIONAL.

AND SO I THINK YOU'RE MORE LIKELY TO SEE RURAL SCHOOL DISTRICTS DO THIS.

I THINK THAT MAKES MORE SENSE THERE.

BUT CERTAINLY, IN TERMS OF PEOPLE WHO ARE POTENTIALLY SWING VOTERS IN SUBURBAN AREA, I DON'T THINK THIS -- THIS WOULD NOT GO OVER THAT WELL.

POLITICALLY, THERE ISN'T ALL THAT TO GAIN WITH IT.

>> JESSIE?

>> THIS IS THE SECOND KIND OF CONTROVERSIAL GUN BILL THAT HE SIGNED, THE OTHER ONE BEING REMOVING PERMIT AND TRAINING REQUIREMENTS FOR CONCEALED/CARRY.

SOMETHING THAT HE MADE PROMISES DURING HIS FIRST CAMPAIGN TO DO.

SO IN SOME REGARDS, HE IS MAKING HIS PROMISES FOR THE PEOPLE WHO SAID, YOU KNOW, DO SOMETHING IN DATA, AND HE IS BREAKING SOME PROMISES.

IS THIS GOING TO BE A WINNING ISSUE FOR HIM IN NOVEMBER?

WE'LL FIND OUT.

>> HERB, THERE WAS AN ARTICLE IN THE FRONT PAGE OF "THE NEW YORK TIMES" LAST SUNDAY.

THEY PROFILED A KINDERGARTEN TEACHER IN OHIO NAMED MANDY.

THEY DIDN'T GIVE HER A LAST NAME.

THEY DIDN'T SAY WHAT DISTRICT SHE STEPHE TEACHES IN.

SHE IS A KINDERGARTEN TEACHER GOING THROUGH TRAINING.

SHE SAID SHE HAS TO TEACH HER KIDS TO HUG HER ON THE LEFT SIDE BECAUSE SHE HAS HER GUN ON THE RIGHT SIDE.

NOW SHE IS IN A RURAL SCHOOL DISTRICT AND SHE ARGUES SHE IS FAR AWAY FROM SHERIFFS FOR GETTING THERE.

WHAT'S THE RIGHT CALL THERE?

>> I THINK LET THE LOCAL DISTRICT DECIDE.

AND IF THEY THINK IT'S THE RIGHT CALL.

THE FIRST TIME THERE IS AN ACCIDENTAL SHOOTING, PEOPLE WILL SAY OH MY GOODNESS, WE SHOULDN'T HAVE DONE THAT.

WE WENT TOO FAR.

I'D BE CURIOUS TOE FIND OUT AS WE'RE GIVING TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS OUT WHERE DID THIS MONEY COME FROM?

AND IF YOU NOTICE THROUGHOUT THIS PAST YEAR, THROUGH THE STATE OF OHIO AND THE GOVERNOR HAVE BEEN ANNOUNCING LOTS OF GRANTS FOR THIS AND THAT.

AND THAT MONEY IS LARGELY COMING FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, WHICH WOUND UP PUTTING TOO MUCH MONEY OUT INTO THE ECONOMY TO FIGHT, YOU KNOW, THE RECESSION AND ALL THAT OR UNEMPLOYMENT.

AND NOW THE PEOPLE WHO REALLY COMPLAIN ABOUT THE FEDERAL DEBT ARE JUST MAKING WONDERFUL POLITICAL POINTS, SPENDING THIS MONEY THAT WE DON'T REALLY HAVE.

>>> ALL RIGHT.

LET'S GET TO OUR FINAL OFF THE RECORD PARTING SHOT.

MIKE MILLER, YOU'RE UP FIRST.

>> DAYS ARE GOING TO BE REALLY INTERESTING IN THE U.S. SENATE RACE.

I DISAGREE A WILL LITTLE BIT WITH WHAT HERB SAID.

I'M NOT POSITIVE RYAN IS GOING TO COME OUT AND ATTACK VANCE.

I THINK WHAT HE HAS DONE SO FAR IS TRY TO GET THE MIDDLE PEOPLE, NOT THE FAR RIGHT, NOT THE FAR LEFT.

AND I THINK WHAT HE HAS DONE SO FAR HAS BEEN VERY IMPRESSIVE.

AND I WOULD BE NOT SURPRISED AT ALL IF HE CONTINUES THROUGHOUT THE REMAINING 90 DAYS.

>> ALL RIGHT, HERB.

>> THREE PEOPLE WHO REALLY DESERVE MENTION FOR THEIR CRIBS TO AMERICAN POLITICS.

LIZ CHENEY, MAUREEN O'CONNOR, AND NANCY PELOSI HAS PROBABLY BEEN THE BEST SPEAKER OF THE U.S. HOUSE IN MODERN TIMES.

>> IT'S NOT VERY SERIOUS, BUT I WENT TO THE STATE FAIRGROUNDS TWICE THIS WEEK TO TALK TO POLITICAL CANDIDATES.

I'M DISAPPOINTED I DID NOT GET A CHANCE TO EAT A DEVILLED EGG WITH MERINGUE ON TOP.

I'M SURE IT WOULD BE AN EXPERIENCE.

BUT I DID GET TO SEE THE HOG RACES TODAY.

>> OH, BABY GO.

WHO WON?

NEVER MIND.

>> IN THE MOST IMPORTANT NEWS IN CINCINNATI, THE ZOO HAS WELCOMED A NEW HIPPO.

SO YOU CAN LEARN ALL ABOUT THAT.

>> NEW HIPPO.

NEWBORN?

>> YEAH.

CALF, FIONA'S SIBLING.

THERE.

>> YOU GO.

POSITIVE.

THE COLUMBUS TEACHERS UNION VOTED TO TAKE THE FIRST STEP TOWARDS A POSSIBLE STRIKE WITH THE START OF SCHOOL SET FOR AUGUST 24th.

THE SCHOOL BOARD TAKING A HARD LINE.

TEACHERS IN THE COLUMBUS CITY SCHOOLS WHO HAVE DEALT WITH AT-HOME LEARNING, AT-HOME LEARNING, DELAYED STARTS BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC, THEY ARE NOT HAPPY AND I THINK THIS THING WILL GET SETTLED BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH ALL THOSE PARENTS, BOTH SIDES.

THAT IS "COLUMBUS ON THE RECORD" FOR THIS WEEK.

CHECK US OUT ONLINE.

WE'RE ON FACEBOOK.

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AND YOU CAN WATCH EVERY EPISODE ON DEMAND AT OUR WEBSITE, WOSU.ORG.

AND ON THE PBS VIDEO APP FOR OUR CREW AND OUR PANEL, I'M MIKE THOMPSON.

HAVE A GOOD WEEK.

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