And now the 419 with Gretchen de Bakker might kill them.

And Kevin.

Mullin.

Welcome in to the 419.

I'm Kevin Mullin, alongside.

Gretchen Debacker and.

McCallum.

Hey.

Nailed it.

I mean, one so.

Far, so good.

Yeah.

Off to a great start.

Hey, I want to start off by a huge thank you.

Certainly to all of you for, for joining us on this adventure, but also, for our great sponsors and partners.

Which are wealth management has been with us from day one when this started as a podcast.

A little over two years ago.

Work.

Spring.

Has been a long time partner of ours.

We'll talk to them later this week as well.

As we get into our wellness Wednesdays, which is sponsored by work spring.

Toledo Refining Company.

An incredible organization that does great wor on the east side of the river, but also, is decided to cross across the Great Divide.

To come join us on this as well.

And, of course.

Tada!

Is another great, sponso and partner on the show as well.

Yup.

Traverses the whole area.

Right.

Connecting all these things.

I mean, the hyperbole is, without bound but certainly exciting for us.

And we made friends along the way with all these people, and, the region is certainly better by all their individual leadership.

In January.

Feels like the right tim to start something new.

It does.

I mean, it's like we'r we're like, out of that holiday.

We don't know what day it is.

Right.

So the this is like the first week that I really have to like.

You have to know what day it is.

Yeah.

Especially for me, because I've made a just a terrible parenting mistake.

In order to buy my children' love, I bought a bearded dragon.

Aren't there other things you could have bought?

A million things.

Like a. Doll.

Wait, I have.

Anyways, this is like a doll.

Can you buy a bearded dragon at a store?

Is that like a black market?

Like it feels like something you have to buy off the black market.

Like.

Like you bought something out of someone's trunk.

The old show.

I could talk about where I bought it.

Okay.

But the new show, based on.

Has.

Rules.

That's right.

I bought it at a store that was went to a Chipotle.

Is it an actual beard?

It I my daughter provides the beard.

And I looked into this, and.

No way.

And the amount of crickets this consumes.

Actually, what I should say is I' now the owner of a cricket farm.

In my house.

So do you go out and catch the crickets?

I will when spring comes.

Yeah.

Cricket you have to feed live crickets.

Does it?

Is it.

Is it picky?

To be determined.

Right now, it seems to be a pretty open.

To anything.

But it eats 60 cricket today.

No, it does not.

Yeah.

That's right.

What?

That is not a real number.

That's right.

Where do you get.

A lot of protein?

Where do you.

We're going to spend too much time at.

Where do you find 60 crickets?

There.

Really?

Did you ever think you'd be asked that question?

It was just a terrible, just a terrible idea.

And it's just a little bit of a window into what kind of parent am I?

It would be better if my daughter was in charge of research and development, I guess.

Development generally, but so?

So my daughter wanted a cat.

Sure.

Years ago.

And, How many crickets we.

Told?

Yeah.

I don't.

Yes.

Yeah, I know that.

We told her that if she eats vegetables every day for a month scam, she gets a cat.

Okay.

Well, joke's on me.

She's now a vegetarian, and so she's not a cat.

Yeah, and then we have a cat.

What's the cat's name?

Yeah.

I, Eliza is the official name.

It has changed.

No, we refer to her as b k and I can't on on the on th old show, I could have said what that that's okay.

But.

Yeah.

What's the dragons.

Of.

The Dragon has changed names many, many, many times.

It was Shonda at first.

Shonda?

Yep.

Then it was, Summer.

Summer.

Lilac.

Kill him.

Kill him is our last name.

My daughter's not a sociopath.

Or to be determined.

She's killing a lot of crickets every day.

I know it's, Mira, which, of course, is a nod to the, popular movie Dragon.

No.

I'm aware.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Demon.

That's the one.

Demon.

Yeah, you know it.

Does she name each of the crickets before she sends them to their death, or they just.

She does not handle the crickets at all.

Yeah, well, that's.

That sounds like she would be excited.

Did you, like, put it in a box with, like, the holes in it and, like, the opening it up kind of situation?

You got the whole thing?

It put it in a room, locked her up.

And I immediatel know that I had made a mistake.

And, you know, again, you are.

I didn't realize I would need this on any of them.

Meaning my kids and the crickets.

I I'd like them to think a lot of me as I'm shoving them into this dinosaur's mouth.

So more great content like this coming up.

Let's take a break When we come back, we will talk.

To the bearded dragon that is.

Dragon.

Shoulder.

It will be.

I bet we're going to talk somebody that eats fewer than 60 cricket today.

We'll see.

We'll be right back with Adam Levine from its Little Museum of Art.

It's the 419, powered by CTE and presented by Retro Wealth Management.

We'll be right back.

To me, community means connecting to others.

What will it really take to bring peace to Toledo's neighborhoods?

I love.

It here.

Yeah.

We're a community committed to education.

Discover new ideas, dive into.

Exciting subjects, and engage with the world around you.

It's all chapters in a book.

I would send them personally a t shirt.

Crim doesn't pay in the old West End.

Pass it on.

That's how we cleaned up the neighborhood.

Bring you back memorie that you don't think are there.

You know.

There, there.

Public media invites you to get out and play day.

The people of Toledo have really become family.

You know, they walk in and it was just like, hey, it's so good to see you.

Hello there, and welcome to public media town hall meeting.

The one where you come to watch, listen and learn.

I love PBS kids.

Welcome back to the 419 powered by GT, presented by Retro Wealth Management.

We are joined now by Adam Levine from Toledo Museum of Arts.

Welcome.

Thanks for being here.

Thanks for having me.

Gretchen, what is Adam's actual title?

Adam's actual title is the Edward Drum Drummond and Florenc Scott Levy, president and CEO.

Is that.

Is all of that on your business card?

It absolutely.

Is.

It is.

In fact, it is the name, the title for the director.

So I take it.

Yeah.

Who better to be named after the drumming up for Scott Libby than.

The founders of the museum?

So thank you so much for being here.

There's so much going on at the Toledo Museum of Art.

Right now, I wanted to start with if we could, the jewelry exhibit, because it's about to close.

Yes.

And I think it's around until January 18th.

So you tell us a little bit about that and what people can catch before it heads out.

I can I do just want to break some news as I, I would in the break, which is that, I grew up with bearded dragons.

You did not.

Yeah, because I raised you.

How did you know?

Yes.

I'm a I'm a Greek at that.

Got away.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, born and raised in New York City.

We were not allowed to have dogs.

Eating vegetables straight was not going to be an option for a dog or a cat.

So my brother and I each had bearded dragons, and your daughter is in for an incredible ride.

They've got great personality.

And wait till they start eating pinkies.

Little mice.

That's when you really get excited.

But should we talk about your eating.

Mice in New York is also a good thing.

Probably, yeah.

Absolutely.

And I won't tell you where we got the bearded dragons either.

Similar to Matt.

Right?

It's just, you know, they appeared.

Where did you get the crickets?

You get them from a pet store.

Okay, but but you will end up with crickets that escape, and it will be like you're in the metro parks in your hom all the time.

It'll be really.

Soothing.

Like a sound bath at night.

I'm actually, like.

I'm convinced that this was part of Dave's ANC's retention strategy.

For.

For Matt.

Kill him.

Yeah.

He is actually asked me to go hunt crickets in other countries.

Yeah, he's.

I said, Matt, I don't want you to think of your job having borders, or having a job.

Right?

That's a supportive boss.

Do they last?

How long do the bearded like dragons live for?

So a long time.

And, you know, I know I'm here to talk about the museum, but I could go on length about spike.

My brother's was named comet.

Yeah, but they lived for almost 12 years.

Oh, my goodness.

12.

Like you made a bad decision.

I wonder years.

Yeah.

Hey, Lizard years.

I don't know how they.

Can be as well.

Well, you're almost human.

Years.

Well I can tell you how it computes.

It's not going to be 12 years.

That's.

And we were not a runaway.

Yeah.

That's right.

They're going to go to the farm where my beloved chief by golden retriever went.

Exactly.

Exactly.

So.

So, thank you for having me.

Obviously, lots we could talk about.

But to answer the question, radiance from reverie, draw from the collection of Neil Land is up through January 18th, and it is, it's one of those shows that we decided to work on to expose our audience to something that we normally don't expose our audience to, which is jewelry is a fine art.

As we put the show together with this remarkable private collectio that Neil Land has amassed over the decades, we sort of stumble into the fact that, strangely, given how incredibl these objects are as artworks, this is the most comprehensive survey of jewelry that an American museum has ever done.

While you could walk into a classic court, at the Toledo Museum and expect to see Hellenistic jewelry or Roman jewelry.

It is a peculiar fact that there is only one curator in the United States that has a named endowed position, like sort of my directorship title in jewelry at the Museum of Fine Arts in Boston.

And she's one of the co-curators of this exhibition.

So most jewelry shows are shows of single houses.

Cartier.

Tiffany.

Right.

This is an exhibition of jewelry between 1850 and 1950 with lots of makers.

That is slightly biographica and that it's telling the story of Neal's life and how he collected these things through important locations in his life New York, Los Angeles and Paris.

But those were also the centers of jewelry making and jewelry wearing.

So it really became this rather comprehensive show, which I think is also a significant contribution to art history.

And that's really wha we try to do with these shows.

So dutiful.

It's a beautiful exhibition at the Glass Pavilion.

It is, and it's a particularly good gift shop.

Thank you for.

Excellent jewelry that that people can buy at the gift shop at the Glass Pavilion.

But it's a just it's a, it's a wonderful, exhibit.

So I would encourage people to think.

Where does this start?

Right.

Like the I mean, how do you get to I mean, you say, you know it's this, you know, incredible, kind of offering of a lot of different things.

But, like, where does the idea of, like, you know, what we should do is this and then, like, once that idea comes out, like the, like you got a guy that you're like, hey, I need all the jewelry and.

And let's go, let's go.

Dragons name.

Yeah, yeah.

Neil.

You know.

So, so thank you for commenting on the design, which I really do think is exquisite.

So, so, so, and I think the, the nature, if you've been to a lo of our exhibitions over the past few years, you'll notice everyone feels different.

And that's an intentional choice.

So to answer your question, you know, we are I say this a lot, you know, not for profit doesn't mean for loss.

And, you know, all of us who work for or have worked for government non-profits, you know, we don't want to necessarily, in that sector, work for a culture that feels corporate.

That's different than having best business practice.

So we developed an exhibition strategy, and our exhibition strateg reflects our overall strategy, which is to expos Toledo to the world through art.

And so it's integrate art into the lives of people.

We believe that art needs to reflect the world.

So we every five years on a rolling five year average, have exhibitions that cover every geography, every chronology and every medium.

So we are planning our exhibitions looking out five years.

So we're into 2031, right?

And we're actually starting to think about anchor properties in 2032 and 2033.

So that's how we think about the distribution of things we do.

But then I also say we made the concerted efforts early in the strategy to mov from an exhibition art from a, museum that takes exhibitions other people have organized.

So there are people you can call the American Federation for the Arts, the international Art and artists, organizations that tour high quality exhibitions.

We decided we wanted to generate our own intellectual property and travel those exhibitions ourselves.

When you think of, you know, there's a multiple rungs in organizational chart but when you think of your peers or where who, where is your checking in?

How do you spend a couple of hours just sort of exploring the space that you oversee?

I mean, are there people tha you see as colleagues, mentors, like what is your pulling on the day to day?

Which is a healthy way for someone in your position to do like where do you where do you look where do you see council.

Yeah.

So in my particular case, I spend a lot of time engaging with our senior leadership and leadership team within the organization.

I say maybe sort of looking down the org chart, and it, you know, almost six years into the role, it takes time.

But I feel so good about the team we have.

Really, I think it is as good a team as you will find anywhere in the country.

And that's an incredible privilege and also allows me to trust them and get out of the business.

So work on the business, not in the business, as they say.

But, I spent a lot of time engaging the board, and we think a lot about making sure that our board doesn't just reflect our community, but also reflects the types of expertise that we need to run a 21st century organization.

So our current chair is Mike Feinman.

Our vice chair is Susan Palmer.

You know, Mike was the former CEO of Owens Corning.

Susan has been the board president of almost every organization in this community has been involved with everything, has a fundraising background, couldn't be more different.

And the way they think and couldn't be more valuable and they're independent was.

Right.

So, so that's just, you know, one example, right?

We have an incredible board.

You can look them up online, but we think about complementarity.

And we actually vet candidates using this multi-dimensional matrix that includes expertise.

Exactly for that reason.

So when I have a question about AI, I can pick up the phone and call someone.

I have a question about marketing.

I can pick up the phone and call someone, and even if they don't know the answer, they can refer me to someone who will.

So leveraging their network has also been really important.

And then last but not least, obviously there are sort of lateral benchmarking that we do to other organizations.

But I'm sort of particularly interested in benchmarking in adjacent industries.

Not because I'm not really enamored by some of the things my peers are doing, but because, you know, sometimes you have to puncture your bubble.

Right?

You all speak the same languag in certain sectors, higher ed, sort of parks.

And you want to see what our organizations that are thinking about customer experience doing.

Right.

That's we're all in that business.

Right.

So I spend my time thinkin about, okay, what's happening, I'll read and I'll just follow u cold call people and say, hey, you know, really interested i this thing I read you're doing.

Can we talk about it?

Where do you go to, you know, close with this from my end of it.

Is there something when you roll out of bed?

What's the first thin you would look at in the phone?

If I, if I have that.

Yeah.

You see first.

Well, first, I look, I look at and see what the going rate is for the dragons.

Yeah.

The marke and the market price for a beer.

I know there isn't one.

Yeah, yeah.

We don't split.

So, I, you know, honestly, the first thing I look at is email.

Probably not the healthiest habit.

But just as we have sort of expanded our international footprint, the reality is, like tech between text, WhatsApp and email, there's inbound all hours.

So there is always stuff to clean up.

And I'm going by 5 a.m.

usually every day.

And a lot of your clients use WhatsApp.

That's right.

They do.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What a WhatsApp.

WhatsApp is great.

I have to say.

Right.

But telegram.

Right.

And, you're moving into a different territory.

But WhatsApp is WhatsApp is great.

So, yeah, but the first thing I read, I have a, pretty in like my, my diet every morning is The New York Times, this incredible, blog called International Intrigue, written by former, diplomats and intelligence officials about what's going on in the world from their perspective.

Quartz, which covers business hustle, which covers sort of what's happening in Silicon Valley.

And then when I say the times, it's dealbook in the morning, it's a bunch of their newsletters.

And I think that's mostl and then and then opinion pages in the blood.

Do you do the New York Times games?

I do not I know it's terrible.

It's been such an important part of their model and their pivot.

It's actually something I think about a lot for sort of the museum, because we're kind of publishers.

Like what we just publish experiences.

That' a fascinating way to articulate.

But the the way they've used games in ways that actually bolster brand rather than detract from it and have used it as a revenu stream for their digital play.

But I think it's super smart.

But no, I don't I mean, I, you know, I got into Wordle for like a second when it was like new.

Yeah.

But.

I can't.

So you can.

No, I can't, I can't.

I was, I was in on Wordle.

Yeah.

And I had a like, I think it was like a 200 game, like 200, a streak of winning every day.

Winning.

And then didn't play.

We're on vacation.

Yeah.

Didn't play one day.

And the streak went back to zero.

And I have not played because you got mad.

I was like, what do you mean it went to zero?

Well, that's the thing I just 200 and oh I didn't have a game that it's right.

I didn't load the app.

Oh, it's like Duolingo though if you try to learn.

Yeah.

It's a super interesting point.

They send you passive aggressive.

That's very generous right.

No no no it is it is because you hard.

Because I do I was like I bring up Duolingo as well because Duolingo.

This is the best morning in my life.

Yeah.

Listen Duolingo is in some ways actually closer to like the museum experience because you'r they've gamified the learning.

Yes.

Whereas Wordle is, you know, arguably a type of learning.

Right.

But it's sort of gamified intellectual exertion.

Right.

But there are lots of fortnights that too.

But Duolingo, you're learning a language.

So this is actually a really interesting point, that the streak is an important par of getting sticky behavior.

Yes.

Until you've invested a lot and you break the streak, and then there could be some like a psychological barrier to overcome.

I never thought about.

If they would.

Go out of you.

If they would have given me a like, I don't, I don't spend money on games like on my phone.

I won't do it.

But if they had told me for $2.99, I can maintain my streak I probably would have paid it.

I probably did pay it to keep going, or because I'd put so much into it.

Or give you an option to pause or say like, hey.

You missed it.

You haven't missed a day.

Is there a reason?

Right?

Yeah.

Get a mulligan.

Yeah.

So to answer your question, to bring this all together, there's a guy named Andrew Goldston who was the editor in chief of Artnet, but now does a lot of consulting for art and tech intersections, thinking about the future of interpretation.

So I brought him to our last board meeting to present to our board on where he views museum interpretation going in the next five years.

And he spoke about Duolingo a an interesting sort of example.

And whether you know, whether he's right or wrong.

And I clearly brought him because I think there's a lot of merit to the way that he thinks.

You know, those are the types of ways that, you know, I choose to benchmark.

A bit of an intersection from what my day job is.

You know, we are, sort of pushing a back against what I would describe as sort of park purists because screens are sort of considered like the Antichrist of what we do right outside is to be away from screens and such things.

But if we don't gamify that experience, right, or provide incremental cookies or the option.

That's right.

Right.

The difference between classic interpretation or dropping a augmented reality Bigfoot footprint is you pull a ki through your company's region.

From my standpoint I don't care why you're outside.

It isn't up to me to look down my nose at how you're there or how you aren't.

I just want to get you where you're at.

So I think with two with two caveats.

So one, I clearly agree except to say that like so that's the first thing is whenever someone tells you I think generally speaking it's binary.

They're wrong.

Right.

So the question is in screen or no screen, the question is how do you use the screen.

That's fine And then the secondary point is I can't speak for the Metroparks, but for the museum we will we will use screens.

We will use programs that are not connected to art at all.

As long as there is something that then connects peopl to the next rung of the ladder, it's about the conversion rate from that thing, moving people down a funnel to actually engaging when nature actually engaging with art.

So our screen base experiences are in the service of leading to an on screen based experience.

So if you like, if you need to use a screen at some point in your life to learn about Monet's Water Lilies, right?

No one should judge someone for that.

But we of course, want someon to have an unmediated experience of standing in front of Monet's water lilies thinking that it's remarkable, because that's the power of art in its fullest, and meeting peopl where they are through screens to pull them through, I think, is an effective way to think about screen use, think about screens as a destination in and of themselves I think is way less effective.

That there's a treehouse village and Swan built to create exactly that, right?

There were so many in the Oak Openings region, which is messaging that's been tried to be deliberate for over 100 plus years but if you have that experience, you'll be somewhat duped into caring about that space right now.

That's an incredible.

Village Let's let's take a quick break.

When we come back, you mentioned, I do want to talk about AI a little bit and how the museum because I don't I don't I think of the museum as a, you know, museum in an old sense.

And I don't think about the innovation and all that that goes into it.

I know, obviously, when I think about you and your leadership, I, I think more about that.

But, we'll talk about that.

I also want to dive in just a little bit like know a little bit more about Adam Levine.

Oh, not me at all.

Okay.

All right.

We know enough.

Yeah, Wolf.

Enough to be scary.

Okay, we'll be right back.

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Welcome back into the 419 powered by.

Presented by True Wealth Management.

We're talking with Adam Levine.

He is the Edward Drummond and Florence Scott Libby.

President and CEO and chief bottle washer of chief bearded dragon watcher.

Absolutely.

It's a little museum of art.

We talked, you mentioned I. And it just triggered for me because, you know, as I said before the break, when I think about a museum, it's hard for me not to think about how long it's been in place and to sort of almost think of it as like a pause button on history, and not think about i as a, as a space of innovation.

But I'm curious you know, how you want to fight me on that sentence?

But but also approach technolog and AI and embrace some of those kind of latest things that are coming out.

Sure.

Well, look, I think, a few things.

One is, we started by talking about not just an exhibition that we have up at the incredible store associated with that.

Museums didn't have stores till, like, 40 years ago, right?

Museums were not lik that was not part of the model.

Right?

Temporary exhibitions were not really part of th model until after World War two.

Now, bear in mind, right, that is our arts founded in 1901.

The Kunstmuseum in Basel was funded, founded in 1664.

Right.

So, I mean they've been around for a while.

So museums are always changing.

Right on.

They're always doing their best to keep up with the times.

I would say, generally speaking, though, we lag, which coming to your question is really very peculiar, because if you think about it, were monuments to creativity, were monuments to innovation, right.

Every artist is doing something innovative in a style with a medium, etc.. So we we don't take the risks of the people we celebrate as institutions, which is like a peculiar disconnect.

And there's some good reasons for that.

We're highly trusted.

Right?

So for that reason, we're more risk averse.

But I would also argue, what's the point of banking political capital if you're never going to cash it in to try and help the community, to help the institution?

So, you know, these are the I, you know, I think there are a few different ways to think about that.

The artistic side of the ledger, artists who are engaging with AI.

And you saw that recently in the exhibition Infinite Images The Art of algorithms.

And in our digital artist residency, which is sort of, modeled after our glass residency, but it's sort of a first of its kind, inviting a digital artist and to engage with the community, but also to create wor in response to our collection.

You can think about it in terms of sort of the visitor experience.

And I know we'll probably talk a little bit more about that.

Right.

And then you could talk about it in terms of sort of like the workflows of the museum, like anyone is talkin about across any organization.

So we've given a lot of thought to all of those things, and have developed what I think is, really, really good.

Second draft policy that will guide our use.

Our first draft was like very vanilla.

But it was important to get something in place, as sort of, at that point, ChatGPT took over the world.

And obviously we have some options.

But we, we think abou it across those three verticals.

And I would say the, probably the, the place we are making our biggest bet is going to be around the visitor experience.

And you're undertaking that as we speak.

And people may have seen this in the media, certainly if they've visited the museum, they see that in person.

But you and your board and your and your team are undertaking a reimagining of all of the galleries which hasn't really been done in 40 years and 40 years.

So nothing this holistic and 40 year.

So in additio to just improving the bathrooms and the lighting and accessibility and those kinds of things, you're really reorganizing the presentation of the entire museum.

We are so and this is where visitor experience and the bathrooms and seating, they all fit in.

Because if all we did was rearrange the art, we would have failed this community.

Rearranging the art is important and we'll come to why that is in a second.

But actually the mission, as I said in the first segment, is to integrate art into the lives of people.

So the art is part of that.

The people are also part of it.

And the act of integration requires an experience that makes art central to the way of Toledo in a northwest Ohioan lives.

And that's what we're hoping to achieve.

So I think the first thing to say, because, you know, I've said in a number of different settings, but you can never say it enough, right?

Repeat, repeat, repeat is one of the reasons we are doing this now, which is differen than whether it should be done.

And I'll come to that in a second.

And the reason we're doing this now is because our heating and cooling system is at the end of its useful life, right?

There is no collection if we can't keep temperature and humidity controls.

This is not.

Why we have Gretchen set here.

She is just at the tail end of her usefulness.

You're right, I will accept.

That's right.

Listen, I've gotten to kno Gretchen over the past 13 years.

I've been here 14 years.

Almost not true.

Okay, well.

Thank you.

You, on the other hand.

Yeah.

Questionable.

That's fair.

That's the kind of thing you've ever something that was so, So so so this this is not wh one becomes a museum director.

But the fact is, all the Hva air handlers need to be replaced at some point in the next couple of years, and it makes sense to synchronize those replacements as fully as possible.

It minimizes disruption and it minimizes expense.

So the building is structured.

The Beaux Arts building is structure in nine different zones across sort of the gallery floo and sort of the, education wing.

And each ai handler will be taken offline, and then a new air handler will be installed or parts will be rebuilt.

If we can extend the life of some of the air handlers which we are doing in two cases.

And we're going to do that in phases.

So what people are experiencing now is they're experiencing phased closures in conjunction with taking those air handlers off.

Which project?

Huge project.

I mean, that is I mean this is all public information.

You could look it up.

We took out $20 million of debt through the Port Authority.

Just because the cash goes out the door all at once will fund it through a capital campaign.

So before I got out of bed every day.

Right.

We have to pay back that debt to replace the heating and cooling system because that's table stakes.

So everyone also needs to remember in our community that there was no way every gallery in the museum wasn't going to close and then reopen by 2027.

So given that it makes sense when the galleries are closed anyway to look at things lik does Colonial American painting make sense next to Southeast Asian archeology?

And Kevin says, yes.

Yeah.

Okay.

So what are your thoughts on that?

Well, I've stopped listening.

I have not listened.

First, let's just say it made sense why we did it.

Because we had a growing collection.

We had a great curato of Asian art, Caroline Putney.

We had a growing collection in that area.

We wanted to give it a dedicated space.

And the old members lounge the space that is, sort of, you know, at the westernmost part of the building and the west northwestern mos part of the building made sense.

It was available totally rational, reasonable, ad hoc decision at the other end of the building, contemporary Art created a gallery and the old glass gallery adjacent across the court.

Totally reasonable, rational, marginal decision.

If you could design it from scratch, which, like more Godwin did in the 1930s, you wouldn't do that.

The original design of the museum was largely chronological.

To walk people through history, to get a sense of how styles develope so that that's how we landed on what we're doing.

The thing that's so interesting is, first of all, you say, well, it's just we're already shut down, so we might as well just do this little thing.

It's not a little thing.

It's a huge thing.

And it's a very, unique and inspiring thing.

If you go to museum around the world, one of my most favorite things to do is you g you go from gallery to gallery, you go from French impressionists to British masters to, you know, these, they're all segregated in that way based on the categories that have been set forever.

And so the focus on the organization will be that African art and, the Byzantine art and whatever French, it's not the geography that controls, but in fact the timeline.

Correct.

Okay.

So, Can you talk a little about what timeline means to you in the sense.

Sure.

So, so yeah.

So, so we are installing the museum chronologically, and we will be the most comprehensive such installation in the United States.

And really, the only installation that i similar in the world that covers 6000 years of human history and six continents is the Louvre in Abu Dhabi.

One of the things we will d differently than the Louvre Abu Dhabi is if you think about our building, there is a north south access and there is an east west access.

The west East-West access runs along Monroe.

The long access that will be your chronological access.

So you'll move through tim as you move from Classic Court at the east end through to what is currently called the Levitz Gallery, but, you know, will become our contemporary art gallery.

Then that north south access will be used.

You can think of it as geography, but I actually think it's better to think of it as connectivity.

So in the ancient world the world was connected but it wasn't connected directly.

It was connected by overland trade routes.

And then those trade routes got formalized in the medieval period.

And then Thomas ships, first in China then in Europe in the early modern period, connect to the world for the first time.

But it wasn't instantaneous.

There was a lot of latency.

Took two years, two and a half years to circumnavigate the globe.

Right?

And then telecoms, right.

And transportation technology accelerate the rate of connectivity so that by the time you're at in someone you're at the East Wang.

Right?

You'll see.

Yeah, you'll have your gallery of ancient Mediterranean next to your gallery of Southeast Asian archeology, because that's how far Alexander the Great made it.

He's going to regre made it to India and Pakistan.

When you get to the contemporary gallery, you'll have a Greek artist next to an Indian artist because they're following each other on Instagram.

That's right.

Right.

So so you'll get an embodied sense of how the world has been connected.

And we think that that's actually a very important thin for any audience to understand the nature of how we've bee connected as a function of time.

So time here means the past 6000 years, which, if you were to think about it from like an art historical perspective, there are prehistoric examples of art, which is to say, before the advent of writing.

But most museums cove art from the advent of writing.

Writing is correlated with administrative needs.

Administrative need is correlated with enough people in an area that you need sor of an administrative function, and which is to say cities.

And when people are more sedentary, there's more wealth usually, and more stratification of society.

And then surplus wealth tends to be put into adornment, manufacture or adornment or artistic manufacture.

So most museums begin their collections of 3500 BCE 4000 BCE.

Obviously some go much earlier.

There are examples of artwork from way before that, but not in any density.

So that's where most museums begin their collection this year.

We do.

This is a too sophisticated a question, particularly for me to even ask.

But in terms of your leadership, or vision of that, the Museum of Art, how do you manage it conceptually?

I mean, you've talked about heating and air conditioning in this conversation.

You've talked about reconfiguring or rethinking that space.

When you think about the management of the museum, how do you think of time, the audience today, the people who live in Sligo, the world as it is today, is Adam Levine, navigate time and space in the current leadership that you oversee.

Yeah.

I mean, look, that's a super interesting question.

You know, I think, You hear that.

Yeah.

So, so I think the.

The.

The thing that I think most about, I'll keep this as short as I can.

The thing that I think most about is how you live, the culture of a place.

And there are things that I think it's important everyone realize that the Toledo Museum of Art should do that other museum shouldn't do because of the nature of this place.

So our our strategic vision.

Right.

The vision of our strategy is to become the model museum in this country.

If our commitment to quality and our culture of belonging.

This idea of quality and community, those are like the bedrock strands of Toledo, the Toledo music, arts, DNA, they always have been.

The objectives and the programs and the projects that support that are given a 21st century flair.

Edward Drummond Libby was not thinking about artificial intelligence.

He was thinking a lot about automation.

Right.

But he was not thinkin about artificial intelligence.

So, you know, you you adapt to the times, but you have to be consistent with the DNA of a place.

So why do I bring that up?

So when the museum opened at its full extent in 1933, the Beaux Arts building opened its focus on 1933, only 40% of its galler square footage was being used.

The other 60% was intentionally overbuilt and left unfinished for future expansion within the walls.

If you tried to do that today, most boards would say, why are you spending that much money?

What are you doing over the.

It took 84 years till 2017 to finish the last of those galleries.

By my sort of imprecise, but I think ballpark math.

The museum saved about $120 million and real money and not having to.

And today's money not having to expand.

So I think a lot about what I can do that every future museum director for generations will thank me for.

So the timeline on which we're thinking is 40 to 50 years.

That's fascinating to.

Me.

It is.

Adam Levine, the Edward Drummond Florence Scott Libby president.

Bearded dragon enthusiast.

Your words of wisdom.

All right, it's time for the 419 quiz.

Which the actual name is Gretchen's crazy quiz.

She hates it.

I'm ready.

All right, here we go.

So I'm thrilled for rapid fire questions at you.

Yes.

What's your favorite quote about life?

Oh, boy.

The worst of vices.

Advice.

If you won the lottery, what's the first thing you'd buy?

I would give it all to the endowment of the Toledo Museum of Art.

You're good.

That's a lie.

I get most of it.

What's the most impressive thing?

You know how to do?

It's not the most impressive thing, but it's the thing that surprises people most.

I was a Golden Gloves boxer.

I did not know that.

So boxing.

If you had to change your name, what would you change it to?

Anything but Adam Levine.

I. I'm a fan of maroon.

Five, of course.

I mean, you know, I mean, obviously Ada Levine has made some decisions.

That's right.

But, you know, the I think the music is catchy.

Yes.

There are worse people with whom to share.

That's right.

Thank you.

When when I mentioned to my family that, you know, one of our first guest, the new year was Adam Levine, and they were like, how'd you pull that off?

I was like, well, he works at this little museum of art.

He just just emailed them.

You shut up.

Yeah.

I tried to crash his new year right?

Adam, thank you so much.

We're obviously going to have you back.

Would love to talk about.

Thank you so much.

Thank you for having me.

Thank you.

And thank you as well.

I guess on behalf of our I guess thank you for Rhonda, right?

I mean, delivered a beautiful, gift to us, for the set.

And so we certainly appreciate that.

So the least that we could do.

Yeah.

Appreciate.

All right Thank you.

We'll be right back.

With more of the 419 powered by presented by Retro Wealth Management.

And we'll have the man the myth, the legend, Tim Retro with u on the other side of the break.

We'll be right back.

Introducing the local Fred, a community news series uniting voices and storytellers from across the region in partnership with La Prensa, the Toledo Free Press, the Sojourner Truth, Toledo Public Schools, and veteran journalist Jerry Anderson.

The Local Thread brings you stories and conversations that connect our community here at weeknights at seven on FM 91, with early access on podcast platforms each morning.

The local thread only on GTV.

Welcome back into the 419 powered by.

Presented by We Wealth Management.

And I cannot say thank you enough.

We're joined now by Tim.

We tro fittingly from Retro Wealth Management.

How did you come up with the name?

I know I think it came from my father.

I think we were just spitballing.

Yeah, yeah yeah.

Let's just call it retro.

That's right.

I will say I, through my, like, entrepreneurship journey, I have come up with like, several different names for different companies over the years.

And it was it was retro also.

I also thought about people throw that around.

Yeah.

Yeah, it just didn't fit.

But I but I find the like with my like, latest company just said I'm I'm done get creative.

I'm gonna use my name.

Yeah.

And nobody's going to because everybody always wants to know like the story.

Sure.

Like, oh where'd you come up with that?

And I'm like, I don't know.

I just.

Came up.

A mom came up with that.

Yeah, exactly.

I, I. Got to be like, we've gone through the same process too.

But we ended up wit a wealth management at the end.

So who what what is which are a wealth manager for somebody who's not familiar with it?

We are an investment planning firm.

We do a lot of planning for retirement.

I'm a certified financial planner.

We like to meet with our clients and have discussions as far as what your hopes, your dreams.

And we think we are different.

We like to work with our clients and just having commitments.

People say what happens when they first come in?

I go, just come and talk to us.

You know?

We want to get to know you.

I mean, you've been, sponsor of the podcast from day one.

Now we've got this sort of new journey.

Congratulations.

Like this.

With with will.

Explain to me how these things fit.

Right.

Well, wealth management, kind of legacy planning and building and a daily talk show meeting people are in and around it.

I think it's just supporting people in the area.

And we talked originally when, when we were first talking about your podcast, and it's just giving back.

And if we can help and I'll tell you, just listening to Adam.

Yeah, it answered all my questions as far as did we.

Yes.

Yeah.

It's a good thing that we're, you know, we're helping you guys.

It just it I learned so much, and I know there's going to be more of it.

So I'm excited.

I will tell you how we met was when we were, hosting episodically, a radio show.

And in full candor, the your world is a complicated one, and it can be scary.

And information is best.

I mean, by definition, up and down.

Right.

But it was very easy to talk to you.

And the information is relatable.

And there was absolutely an immediate trust.

I was like, this is there's a human being on the other side of this, this telephone or on the other side of this data.

Right?

Yeah.

I'm a little old school.

I like to pick up the phone and call people.

Sure.

A lot of people say, well, just call the 800 now.

No, just call me.

You can send an email, but I always say call.

It's easier to talk to someone because so many people will read an email and interpret it 2 or 3 different ways.

It's easier to talk to somebody, and a lot of people don't want to email, but they're forced to do it or make appointments online.

And we're all old school.

We want to meet with you face to face.

And it seems to work.

I'm going to see Matt up a little bit here because, you know, we talk, about the Metroparks and what I hear, you know, Matt and his boss, Dave, talk about the metro parks.

They talk about, you know, part of how you can define quality customer service starts with the bathrooms.

And I and I have a teamed up for a story here that he he's got some experience with the customer service of retro and.

Yes.

It's my daughter was 13.

I would not be telling the story, but she's six, so I think I can, we were in a very relatable, experience.

We had to use the bathroom, and we happened to be in the same buildings.

We do management, and, we as I. This is probably the last option we got.

So we to some degree burst in to your office.

And I was anxiou and my daughter was clearly also I'm sure visibly.

And your team, did not care what I was saying as to who we are in relationship.

They just wanted to help.

And that people came ou to see if there was a commotion.

Something were needed.

Yes.

Yeah.

They're like should this person be a parent?

But there's no that the, the phone calls that have we had from a radio show, to the, the admin staff or your support team or the team in general was evident that they cared about us immediately.

And then we couldn' get out of there without cookies or some of the things.

So, yeah we seem to have cookies a lot.

Yes, cookies.

And another reaso to go buy the office chocolates.

Yeah.

That's right.

So again, like Kevin said, I appreciate the fact but you're not just on the other end of a line or the other end of falling market, right?

You are an avid runne or you're an avid participant.

Tell me what a week looks like for spending in our region.

For you.

Oh, land.

I love your parks, by the way.

And if you're talking abou restaurants, yeah.

Great show.

But I love the area, in Toledo and the surrounding area.

I utilize 4 or 5 of the parks on a regular basis.

I would just running side cut this weekend.

Yeah.

So, it.

Was up to your standards so everything would look fine.

Oh, it was perfect.

Yeah.

That's a great team out there.

I love it.

And I joined Dave's, mit because I'm training for the marathon in April.

All right, so first person.

No, this will be my fifth.

That's right.

Okay, so.

I did the Garmin back in September.

I believe it was, so we'll just start training again and take the last 30.

We'll we'll come get your cookies.

I mean, where do you set for a for a marathon?

I hear you setting time based goals.

Is it like, you know, finish, right.

What what is the.

How do you do that?

Usually I'm time based, or I, I, I set up, so much per mile.

What's my time on that mile?

But it's usually time based on where I want to be.

In the age group, too, so that's good.

I don't have to go.

Well, I'm trying to beat the guy that's winning.

That's not going to happen.

But I also, I enjoy running and biking, and swimming and it's just it's just a way for me to just forget about things, you know?

Of course, I'm always thinking when I'm running and things biking, but.

Me too, about heart failure.

Well, I try to.

I try not to focus on the side.

But I think a little bit about work, a little about, all kinds of things.

But it helps me relax.

Yeah.

So I try to get out at least 4 or 5 times a week, doing something.

And with this cold.

Yeah.

Yes.

I have a treadmill.

Yeah.

Yes, I have a bike that I call hooking it up to the the machine.

And I have my little avatar on TV, on, on the TV.

And then I bike with people.

See, I tried to do that.

I there was a, there was a stretch when I was like biking.

I wake up at five in the morning, bike 20 miles and continue my day.

And then it got cold.

And so I bought the trainer and hooked the, you know, my bike up to that.

And also Kevin, because he's a it just turned to 70 degrees and it was just an excuse to stop doing it.

That's also it wasn't the winter.

Yeah.

I had basically word all that.

Yeah.

Well it looks windy outside.

It's crazy.

How did you get into this line of work?

How did you end up here in in financial services, wealth management?

I think you kind of found me.

I started out with, in the insurance business, and I kind of morphed.

I was working for one company, and I realized that I couldn't take care of everything for my clients that way.

So I kind of morphed into more of the planning, to the CFP, certifie financial planning designation.

And I thought well, I'd rather be independent, because I want to work for my clients.

I want to represent them.

I'm a fiduciary.

I work for you.

So it just just kept going.

What, was there an moment that, their first client, first person on the first retirement that you were able to deliver?

Do you hav do you have something that is in sort of your journal?

Is this feels right and feels good?

Oh, I love helping people get retired.

I, I've even talked to client I got sometimes I feel like I'm more excited than them.

Right.

But it's rewarding.

Yeah I. Bet.

And when someone comes to us and is working with us and we lay things out, we do a plan for them.

And if they want to retire early and we look across the table and say, yes, yeah, we I agree.

I think you can and if not, we'll say, might not be the best time, maybe if we go here.

But again, we like to show things and work with our clients.

But it is super rewarding.

What do you what do you say to someone that doesn't.

It's not set up that doesn't have anything.

There.

They have this worry about their retirement.

What are they going to do?

Are they going to be able to live or are they ever going to be able to retire?

What's their name is Matt.

Let's say their name is Matt.

Tell the what's the what's like the thing this year we're at the beginning of the year.

What's the thing that they can do to, to to alleviate some of that worry and get started on the retirement path?

Coming a lot.

Right.

Well come in.

Yeah of course.

Come in and talk to us.

But usually people are no as bad as what they're thinking.

And once you lay it all out and go and people do worry, and once I lay things out and look at the picture and it's not that bad.

I think that's really great advice.

They are not I'm guilty of this too.

Like if you're something you're anxious about or fearful of, based o not knowing that it head on it.

It's easier jus to think about it for 17 years.

That's that's right.

Or 47 really 37 years.

And that's wha my mantra, in the office is we if there's something going on, we want to tackle it head on.

I don't want to put it off.

We want to take care of it right now.

And solve issue or solve problems, with clients.

So it's exactly.

Yeah.

He's.

Tim, we are with we are a wealth management.

All right, Tim, buckle up.

Oh, no.

It's time to.

Wait for the plan for this, buddy.

419 quiz.

You're going to keep jumping in.

It's time for Gretchen's crazy quiz.

Oh, we need a soccer.

Thanks, though.

Oh.

Is this like.

A symbol under here?

It's like a, like, you know, 90s shock jock, shock jock radio sho with, like, the horns over Paul.

I don't like it.

We can do that post, right?

Yeah, yeah.

All right.

All right, so I'm going to ask you, I realized that we screwed this up with Adam.

We did.

And by that, I. Mean he kind of blew it.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah.

All right, so I'm going to ask you for rapid fire questions.

Gretchen's going to ask you what's your favorite?

The one and nine.

Okay.

And then Matt is goin to ask you.

To wait.

For nine.

Yeah that's.

Four.

And then a couple more 141294129.

All righ here we go.

Question number one.

What movie d they need to make a sequel to?

Well, I can't say Top Gun because they did.

Oh boy.

They could make a third Top Gun as far as I'm concerned.

I know.

Yeah I'm in.

Okay.

Or.

Well they've already done three matrix matrix.

So for me right I'm not sure but yeah.

How did you do different I don't know.

Stay with Top Gun.

Okay.

Okay.

Matrices.

Yeah.

Yeah that actually might.

Be right for you.

Yeah.

Thank you.

I spent some time with Adam Levine today for smarter.

Yeah, I feel the opposite.

I was just watching it, I feel smarter, yeah.

What do you like most about your family?

Oh.

Yeah.

Me ask you for one that.

No, no, I, that we all get along.

Yeah.

And that's very important Especially during the holidays.

Do we have differences?

Probably.

But you know, I'm the youngest of four, so.

Yeah.

So we all get one.

What's your most treasured possession?

Well since I like to collect stuff.

You don't or you do, I do.

Oh, you do.

Okay.

My treasured possession.

Autographed Blu ray of Top Gun, too.

I do have a basebal with Pete Rose's autograph.

One.

Oh, okay.

When he was playing for the Phillies, actually, my grandfather was down in Florida and picked it up.

Cool That's nice.

Okay.

That's good.

All right.

People.

I had to do that.

What's the most unusual food combination that you love?

I like a peanut butter mayonnaise sandwich.

What?

What kind of bread?

Really?

It's usually whatever's available, but usually it was on white when I was younger.

Peanut butter and mayonnaise.

And so people will put, banana.

But just give me a paper, man.

So I, like, put chips in it.

There you go.

Now, I do agree with the chips on this too much, but okay for the one, the one of the four by nin quiz is what is your number one most favorite thing about the region?

I like the park system and I'm not just saying that, but I enjoy it.

You obviously used to go to.

Yeah, yeah.

And it's very relaxing and going and watch and I'm not sure what you call where the br you want to watch the birds like in.

Windows in my life.

It is just it's something over at Wildwood.

Yes.

That's near and dear to me.

My grandmother, was my daughter' namesake, was a polio survivor.

So we visit Wildwood frequently, and she couldn't really walk the trails.

But, so that's where she would go.

It is something.

I go there before my runs, and when we're done running, we go in there and set.

I've seen turkeys.

You see all different types of birds.

We saw big, big buck deer going through there.

So it's like it's impressive.

I love it.

All right.

Matt, all right.

This is.

And we won't countdown for words.

Yes.

Nine words, that describe the reason you need.

Someone to go.

Okay.

Got it.

Now I'm drawing a blank here.

Nine words.

I think people.

Shouldn't underestimate our area and try to engage more in what we really have.

Good.

That's got to be nine.

It's got to be entertaining.

Answer I think Gretchen counte underestimated two words I did.

But yeah, it's Yeah.

That's great.

Okay.

I think we did not underestimate Gretchen.

Estimate, but.

It was an appropriate.

Estimation.

Tim, thank you so much for the score, guys.

All right, we'll be right bac with more of the 419 powered by and presented by Retro Wealth Management.

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Welcome back to the 419 powered by CTE presented by We True Wealth Management.

Great show.

It was a great show.

Yeah.

It shows us.

Yeah that's right.

Yeah, yeah, that's totally unbiased.

That's right.

Now, Self review.

What did I just hear the other day?

I always say like here' a, here's an interesting fact.

And somebody responded with, why don't you let us decide to visit this?

Yeah.

Yeah, I think.

I'll tell you.

Yeah, I'll be it.

Right, right.

What's, watching you?

Okay.

That's a new day.

We're just going to slowly.

See a little lower.

You know how long the sho has progressed?

Yeah.

Perfect.

Jacket.

Hourglass.

Yeah, I like that.

I like.

Which is good.

I prefer to show.

What, what mat for you.

What was the kind of most interesting thing for you from today's show?

I don't know if it's the most interesting, but it is nice to banter.

And sort of talk abou the mission of the show, as true as that sounds.

Right?

So these are people who we've known for a long time that we care about.

And they deliver, what we are, prescribing to you, which is, you know, this is a it's nice to live in, small to medium middle sized town for this reason.

These are people whose bathrooms we use.

These are people who oversee an institution that I take my kids to right.

And there are brilliant people who live here.

They're doing brilliant things.

And usually the detractors of our region are us.

But there's great stuff going on here, Gretchen.

Sort of along the same lines I think that what Adam is doing and his team and the board their commitment to the museum and the community's interaction with it, is, is just remarkable.

And bearded dragon owner.

Bearded dragon.

Owner, I mean, yeah, I love it.

I it will it will stick with me that Adam referred to the museum as a monument for innovation.

I agree and that is not the way that I. That's right.

At my core, think about the museum.

But when you when you hear him explain it.

I think it's a real testament to his leadership.

You need a new system.

A lot of leaders would just say, all right well, let's get the 20 million and let's just do tha and we'll shut the things down.

They're doing so much more than that.

They're doing a complete reimagining of the entire way the museum is presented to the public.

But it's a reminde of the complication of that job.

Yeah, as a mini jobs.

All right.

So it isn't just what the next acquisition is.

Not just the next exhibit is there's actually a plan.

An old and retiring building that needs regular stuff to be maintaine that we just take for granted.

Yeah.

And we appreciate you joining us for this episode tomorrow.

It's Wellness Wednesday, presented by Work Spring, and we need it.

We hope you'll join us for that as well.

It's the 419 powered by GT in GT.

I can see.

GE.

Nailed it.

Nailed it.

So six letters.

Yeah 2026.

Here we go.

The 419 powered by GT presented by Retro Wealth Management.

Have a great day.

We'll see you back here tomorrow.

The 419 powered by GT is made possible in part by supporters like you.

Thank you.