>> Ted: COMING UP NEXT ON ARIZONA HORIZON, U.S. SUPREME COURT STRIKES DOWN AFFIRM ACTION IN COLLEGE AND UNIVERSITY ADMISSION PROGRAMS.

WE'LL HAVE ANALYSIS OF THE LANDMARK DECISION.

TONIGHT, A COURT CASE INVOLVING THE MEDIA'S ABILITY TO LOOK AT SECRET RECORDS IN INVESTIGATING ABUSE AT STATE AGENCIES.

AND NEW INFORMATION SUGGEST HOW STARS AND GALAXIES FORMED AFTER THE BIG BANG.

THAT'S NEXT ON ARIZONA HORIZON.

GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO ARIZONA HORIZON.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THE U.S. SUPREME COURT TODAY IN A LANDMARK DECISION STRUCK DOWN AFFIRMATIVE ACTION IN COLLEGE AND UNIVERSITY ADMISSION PROGRAMS.

THE DECISION OVERTURNS LONGSTANDING PRECEDENT BENEFITING BLACK AND LA LATINO STUDENTS.

CHIEF JUSTICE JOHN ROBERTS SAID IT VIOLATED THAL PROTECTION CLAUSE BECAUSE IT FAILED TO JUSTIFY THE USE OF RACE.

LIBERAL JUSTICES IN DISSENT SAID THE DECISION WILL MAKE IT ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE FOR COLLEGES TO CONSIDER RACE IN ACCEPTING STUDENTS.

REACTION TO THE HIGH COURTS FROM PRESIDENT BIDEN?

>> I KNOW TODAY'S COURT DECISION IS A SEVERE DISAPPOINTMENT TO SO MANY PEOPLE INCLUDING ME, BUT WE CANNOT LET THIS BE A PERMANENT SETBACK.

WE NEED TO REMEMBER THAT DIVERSITY IS OUR STRENGTH AND FIND A WAY FORWARD AND WE NEED TO REMEMBER THAT THE APPROPRIATIONPROMISEAMERICA IS BIG ENOUGH FOR EVERYONE TO SUCCEED.

>> Ted: THEY COMMENDED THE SUPREME COURT AUS DECISION SAYING THIS IS A HISTORIC VICTORY FOR ASIANS AND ALL AMERICANS AFTER FIGHTING AGAINST 35 YEARS AND TODAY WE SEE THE JUSTICES OF THE U.S. SUPREME COURT PROVIDE EQUAL PROTECTION WITH THE LAW TO ALL COMMUNITIES.

>>> TODAY'S DECISION BY THE SUPREME COURT HINGED ON ISSUES OF DIVERSITY AND EQUAL PROTECTION AND FOR MORE ON THE RAMIFICATIONS WE WELCOME STEPHEN MONTOYA FROM MONTOYO LUCERNA AND PATSOR AND LET'S GET INTO IT.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Ted: WHAT DID THE SUPREME COURT RULE TODAY?

>> A VERY RADICAL CONCLUSION.

THE COURT REACHED TODAY IS THAT AFFIRMATIVE ACTION VIOLATES THE EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE.

I SAY THAT'S VERY RADICAL BECAUSE THE EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE HAS BEEN WITH US SINCE 1968 AND ENACTED IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE CIVIL WAR AND SOON AFTER THE RATIFICATION OF THE 13th AMENDMENT IN 1865 AND IT WAS ENACTED IN THE MIDST OF THE EPANS OPERATIONEMANCIPATION OF THE ENSLAVED AMERICAN PEOPLE WHO HAD BEEN ENSLAVED FOR 250 YEARS.

IMMEDIATELY IN THE AFTERMATH OF THE 14th AMENDMENT, THE CONGRESS ENACTED A BUNCH OF LAWS TO PROTECT THE RECENTLY EMANCIPATED SLAVES THAT WERE RACE SPECIFIC.

AND SO, THE CONCEPT OF REPAIR REPAIRATORY RESTORATIVE JUSTICE WAS IN THE CLAUSE SINCE THE VERY BEGINNING AND THIS COURT THAT PURPORTS TO BELIEVE IN THE ORIGINAL INTENT GOVERNING THE INTERPRETATION OF THE CONSTITUTION COMPLETELY THREW OUT THE INTENT IN TODAY'S OPINION.

THAT'S WHY IT WAS A RADICAL DECISION AND IT OVERRULED 69 YEARS OF JUDICIAL PRECEDENCE IN FAVOR OF AFFIRMATIVE ACTION.

>> Ted: CHIEFCAN IT BE ARGUED OR WAS IT ARGUED THAT IT WASN'T NECESSARILY RACE, IT WAS SPECIFIC AND SOLELY RACE AS A DETERMINANT ON ADMISSIONS?

>> I DON'T THINK IT WAS ORGANIZED ANDARGUEDAND I DON'T THINK IT WAS ARGUE CRIT,ACCURATE BECAUSE THERE WERE OTHER FACTORS THAT THE OTHER COMMITTEES LOOKED AT, GRADES, EXTRAEXTRACURRICULAR ACTIVITIES IN MAKING ADMISSION'S DECISIONS.

>> Ted: HOW DO YOU DIFFERENTIATE THIS BASED ON RACE AND WHAT COULD BE DESCRIBED AS A DEFACTO AFFIRMATIVE ACTION BASED ON INCOME, BASED ON ALUMNI, SIGNS OF, YOU KNOW, PREVIOUS STUDENTS?

I MEAN, THERE'S ADVANTAGE AND BIASED EVERYWHERE, IS THERE NOT?

>> THERE IS.

SO-CALLED LEGACY ADMISSIONS.

FOR EXAMPLE, ONE OF OUR PRESIDENTS WENT TO YALE COLLEGE.

HIS FATHER WENT TO YALE COLLEGE AND HIS GRANDFATHER WENT TO YALE COLLEGE.

AND THERE ARE PREFERENCES FOR LEGACY STUDENTS, BUT THEY DON'T INVOLVE RACE, BUT ARE THEY FAIR?

AND, ALSO, IF YOU DONATE LIKE FOR EXAMPLE, THE FORMER PRESIDENT'S SON-IN-LAW'S FATHER DONATED A MILLION DOLLARS TO HARVARD.

AND HIS SON WAS ADMITTED.

SO THERE'S AFFIRMATIVE ACTION.

>> Ted: THERE'S A DEFACTO EFIRMTIVE ACTION.

CHIEF JUSTICE JOHN ROBERTS, RACIAL STEREOTYPING.

>> HE'S RIGHT, BUT THIS IS NOT RATIO STEREO TYPING.

NO ONE THINKS ALL AFRICAN-AMERICANS THINK THE SAME WAY.

EXHIBIT NUMBER ONE, CLARENCE THOMAS, AND iTHINK I THINK HE WAS A BENEFICIARY OF AFFIRMATIVE ACTION AND YET, HE'S A RADICAL CONSERVATIVE.

SO AFFIRM AFFIRMATIVE ACTION HAS BENEFITED CONSERVATIVES AND LIBERALS ALIKE.

>> Ted: THE TWO JUSTICES, THOMAS AND JACKSON, BOTH SIDES AND THEY KIND OF WENT AFTER EACH OTHER HERE A LITTLE BIT.

>> UNFORTUNATELY, IT GETS HIGHLY PERSONAL AND ESPECIALLY -- I HAVE A LOT OF RESPECT FOR JUSTICE THOMAS, BUT TO SAY THAT HE WOULD HAVE BEEN ELEVATED TO THE SUPREME COURT IN THE ABSENCE OF HIS COLOR, I JUST DON'T THINK THAT'S A CREDIBLE PROPOSITION.

I AM VERY FAMILIAR WITH HIS CAREER AND IT WAS A RELATIVELY DISTINGUISHED ONE.

BUT IT WASN'T ONE THAT WOULD TAKE HIM TO THE SUPREME COURT AND I THINK IF YOU COMPARE HIM TO SOME OTHER JUSTICES LIKE THE CHIEF JUSTICE, YOU WOULD REACH THE SAME CONCLUSION.

>> Ted: DIVERSITY NOT NECESSARILY A COMPELLING INTEREST AS FAR AS EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE IS CONCERNED?

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH AFFIRMATIVE ACTION, IT HAS SEVERAL JUSTIFICATIONS AND ONE IS DIVERSITY.

HEY, IS IT BETTER IF YOU'RE GOING TO HARVARD TO HAVE SOMEONE FROM ITALY IN YOUR CLASS OR SOMEONE FROM ARABIA?

BUT ANOTHER JUSTIFICATION IS REPAIRATORY JUSTICE.

"HARVARD AND THE LEGACY OF SLAVERY REGULATION.

HAR HARDHARVARD HAS A DEBT BASED ON ITS HISTORY THAT THE SUPREME COURT COMPLETELY IGNORED IN THE DECISION AND I DON'T THINK -- I THINK THAT'S CONTEMPORARY TO FAIRNESS AND iTHINK I THINK IF YOU HURT SOMEONE OR A GROUP, YOU SHOULD HAVE TO REPAY THEM.

>> Ted: BUT IS THAT WHAT CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS TALKS ABOUT WHEN HE SAYS THERE'S NOTHING MEASURABLE HERE TO JUSTIFY USING RACE?

YOU HAVE SOMETHING MEASURABLE THERE AND HE DOESN'T SEE IT THE SAME WAY.

>> I'LL RESPOND TO THAT.

I THINK THAT IS A VALID POINT.

I THINK AFFIRMATIVE ACTION READS TOO BROADLY.

AND I THINK THERE CAN BE SOME PROBLEMS WITH IT AT THE EDGES, BUT TO SAY THAT AFFIRMATIVE ACTION ACROSS THE BOARD VIOLATES THE EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE IS WRONG.

FOR EXAMPLE, THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH CAROLINA IS ALSO ONLINE, WAS LITERALLY BUILT BY SLAVES.

THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH CAROLINA OWES THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN COMMUNITY SOMETHING BASED UPON THAT HISTORY OF OPPRESSION AND IT CAN PAY THOSE PEOPLE BACK BY MEANS OF AFFIRMATIVE ACTION POINT.

>> Ted: IMPACT ON ARIZONA WOULD SEEM TO BE LIMITED BECAUSE OF 2010, PROP 107 AND YOU REMEMBER THAT BEING PASSED BY 60% OF THE VOTE AND NOT AN IMPACT ON STATE UNIVERSITIES?

>> I DON'T THINK IT IS.

HERE IS THE THING, THERE'S AN OUT IN THIS AND I'M A PRACTICING LAWYER, SO WHEN I READ ONE OF THESE OPINIONS, I LOOK FOR THINGS I USE.

HERE IS WHAT THE CHIEF JUSTICE SAYS.

ALL OF THE PARTIES AGREE THAT NOTHING IN THIS OPINION SHOULD BE CONSTRUED AS PROHIBITING UNIVERSITIES FROM CONSIDERING AN APPLICANT'S DISCUSSION OF HOW RACE AFFECTED HIS OR HER LIFE BE IT THROUGH DISCRIMINATION, INSPIRATION OR OTHERWISE.

THAT IS NOW GOING TO BE THE DOOR BY WHICH TO ADMIT THESE MINORITIES.

I'M ALL FOR THAT.

THIS OPINION ISN'T ALL BAD.

IT DOES LEAVE OPEN A DOOR TO CONSIDERING RACE AMONG OTHER THINGS, WHICH IS NOT ALL THAT DIFFERENT FROM THE OLD REGIME.

>> Ted: BEFORE WE LET YOU GO FOR COLLEGE AND THE UNIVERSITY ADDADMISSIONS.

DOES THIS BLEED OVER INTO INCLUSIONS THERE AND IS THIS OVER TO ACADEMIA ONLY?

>> IT WILL BLEED OVER, BUT IT'S SO DILUTED THAT IT WILL TURN INTO A MURKY MESS BECAUSE THE PORTION OF THE OPINION THAT I JUST READ, THAT DEPENDS UPON INTENT AND THAT'S A MURKY THING TO HAVE TO PROVE AND THAT COULD BE DETERMINED ON A CASE-BY-CASE BASIS.

SO I DON'T THINK AFFIRMATIVE ACTION WILL END.

I THINK IT WILL JUST BE TRANSFORMED.

>> Ted: INTERESTING.

STEPHEN MONTOYA, GREAT ANALYSIS AND THANK YOU.

>> YOU BET, SIR.

>> Ted: THE QUESTION OF PRIVACY WITH GOVERNMENT RECORDS OF PUBLIC CONCERN.

>> AN VIV REPORT ON ECONOMIC SECURITY'S HANDLING OF COMPLAINT WITH ABUSE AND COMPLAINT OF VULNERABLE CULTS HAS TUSHED INTO A COURT CASE ABOUT THE MEDIA'S ABILITY TO LOOK AT PRIVATE RECORDS.

JOINING US NOW IS THE JOURNALIST, AMY SILVERMAN AND WITH US IS GREGG LESLIE AT THE SANDRA DAY O'CONNOR COLLEGE OF LAW.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

AMY, WE'LL START WITH YOU, THIS INVOLVES ACCESS TO FILES REGARDING, AGAIN, DES, WHAT, NOT DOING INVESTIGATIONS AS THEY SHOULD ON VULNERABLE ADULTS, BUT THESE ARE SECRET FILES, WHAT GIVES?

>> WE DON'T KNOW IF THEY'RE DOING APPROPRIATE INVESTIGATIONS OR NOT.

SO WITH ADULT PROTECTIVE SERVICES, SOMEBODY FILES AN INVESTIGATION AND A CASE IS OPEN AND YOU TYPICALLY DON'T HEAR MUCH AFTER THAT.

AND THIS BECAME A BIG ISSUE AFTER THE HACIENDA CASE, WHERE THE WOMAN WAS SEXUALLY ASSAULTED AND GAVE BIRTH TO A FULL-TERM BABY BOY WITH SIGNIFICANT DISABILITIES.

AT THE TIME, THE STATISTIC STUCK OUT AND LESS THAN 1% OF ALL CASES INVOLVING PEOPLE WITH DEVELOPMENTAL DISABILITIES, APS CASES WERE SUBSTANTIATED.

I WANTED TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED IN THE REST OF THE CASES.

>> Ted: YOU WANTED TO KNOW AND YOU LOOKED UP FOR RECORDS AND FILE, WHAT HAPPENED?

>> THERE AREN'T RECORDS.

YOU CAN'T GO TO THE LAPTOP AND PULL THOSE UP.

THAT'S WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO IF PUBLIC RECORDS REQUEST FOR.

>> Ted: WHEN YOU DID THAT?

>> THEY SAID, "NOPE."

[ Laughter ] >> I'M CAREFUL WHEN I MAKE A PUBLIC RECORD'S REQUEST, THAT I UNDERSTAND THE PRIVACY LAWS AND I DON'T WANT TO VIOLATE THOSE OR ASK YOU TO AND DO WHATEVER REDACTIONS AND SECOND, IF THERE'S A BETTER WAY TO GET AT THIS STORY AND INFORMATION, OR EVEN JUST TO WORD THE REQUEST, LET ME KNOW AND WE CAN SIT DOWN AND TALK ABOUT IT AND COME UP WITH WORKS FOR BOTH SIDES AND IT'S NOT AN ONEROUS A LOT OF WORK.

IT DOESN'T VIOLATE POLICIES OR LAWS OR WHATEVER.

>> Ted: GREG, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS PRIVACY, SECURITY AND THE PUBLIC'S RIGHT TO KNOW THE PUBLIC'S BUSINESS.

>> RIGHT.

EVERYBODY SEEMS TO AGREE THESE RECORDS SHOULD BE PUBLIC IN SOME CIRCUMSTANCES.

I MEAN, THAT PRIVACY INTEREST IS OVERWHELMING AND EVERYBODY AGREES THAT YOU NEED SOME PROTECTION IN THERE, BUT IN THIS CASE, THEY SAID IT SHOULD BE OPENED TO BONAFIDE RESEARCHERS AND PEOPLE HOLDING THE AGENCY ACCOUNTABLE.

>> Ted: THERE IS A RESEARCH CLAUSE, CORRECT.

>> RIGHT, ONE OF THE FEW EXCEPTIONS THAT SOMEBODY ENGAGED IN BONAFIDE RESEARCH.

>> Ted: IS THERE A QUESTION REGARDING JOURNALISTS BEING RESEARCHERS?

>> YOU DON'T SEE THAT TERM, BONAFIDE RESEARCHERS AND THEY WOULD SAY JOURNALISTS.

IF THEY PUT THAT TERM IN THE STATE LAW AND NOT DEFINE IT, I WOULD SAY A JOURNALIST IS DOING EXACTLY THAT.

THEY'RE DOING BONAFIDE RESEARCH INTO HOW THE AGENCY IS PERFORMING THE FUNCTION.

AND THE APPELLATE COURT AGREED WITH THAT.

THE JOURNALIST CAN BE DOING BONAFIDE RESEARCH.

>> I WASN'T SURE WHAT I WAS DOING FOR THE LAST 32 YEARS.

>> Ted: AS LONG PERSONALLY, IDENTIFIABLE INFORMATION AND A LOT OF REDACTION AND WHAT DID YOU FIND?

>> WHAT DID I FIND WITH THOSE RECORDS?

>> Ted: YES.

>> NOTHING BECAUSE THEY HAVEN'T GIVEN US ANYTHING.

>> Ted: THIS WAS FROM A 2020 PROJECT AND NO.

>> THEY SAID, THIS ISN'T WHAT BONAFIDE RESEARCH SHOULD BE.

IT SHOULD BE SOMETHING THAT BENEFITS THE AGENCY.

IT'S SOMETHING THAT AN ACADEMIC DOES TO HELP THE AGENCY AND THEY REFUSE TO DISCLOSE ANYTHING.

THEN WE HAD TO GO TO COURT AND APPELLATE COURT AND THAT'S WHAT WE JUST WON.

SO NOW IT'S GOT TO GO TO THE STATE SUPREME COURT OR BACK DOWN TO THE TRIAL COURT.

>> Ted: WHEN YOU GET THE RECORDS, THEY WILL LIKELY, BUT WHEN YOU GET THESE RECORDS, THEY WILL LIKELY BE HEAVILY REDACTED, WOULD YOU THEY NOT?

WILL YOU BE ABLE TO USE THEM.

>> THEY WILL BE DETAILS THAT I CAN'TWILL BE USEABLE AND I NEVER WOULD EXPECT THAT.

AND I DID A PROJECT LAST YEAR WITH RECORDS THAT GREG HELPED ME GET FOR K J.J. Z THAT WAS FOCUSED ON INCIDENT REPORTS IN DEVELOPMENTAL DISABILITIES AND WE DID, I THOUGHT, BONAFIDE RESEARCH.

WE DID A SERIES OF STORIES.

>> Ted: THE JOB CAN BE DONE AND I NOTICED WHAT DES, THEY CAN SHOW IF THIS IS OVERLY BURDENSOME TO THEM AND THEY CAN BALK AT THAT.

>> THAT'S GOING TO BE A FIGHT IN ARIZONA, IN THESE CASES, BUT THERE'S AN ODD EXEMPTION FROM BEFORE THE PUBLIC RECORD LAW AND THERE WAS A COMMON LAW RIGHT TO DENY THE REQUEST IN THE BEST INTERESTS OF THE STATE AND NOBODY KNOWS WHAT THAT PHRASE MEANS SO IT CAN BE BROADLY INTERPRETED AND IF WE HAVE TO DO A LOT OF WORK THAT'S GOING TO CONSUME OUR STAFF TIME, THEN THAT'S JUST NOT IN THE BEST INTERESTS OF HOW THE AGENCIES SHOULD WORK.

BUT WE KEEP GOING LIKE AMY SAID, YOU GO BACK AND SAY, WE'LL DO IT ANYWAY YOU WANT AND THINK OF WAYS TO DO THIS.

>> I'LL TAKE A NARROWER TIME FRAME.

>> THIS IS ALL COMPUTERIZED AND NARROW TIME YOUR QUERY EASILY.

>> Ted: THERE'S AN ASPECT INVOLVING -- THIS IS A DIFFERENT CASE, BUT INVOLVING ACCESS, INFORMATION REGARDING ACCESS AND OBSCURING THE MATERIAL AND MAKING ACCESS OR WHATEVER STATE AGENCY IT IS, GOING THROUGH AN ENCRYPTION PROCESS AND THAT'S NOT THE LAW.

>> RIGHT.

SO DATABASES ARE WHERE ALL OF THE THE INFORMATIONWHEREOF A STATEAGENCY IS KEPT.

THERE'S A CUSTOMER I.D.

AND IF YOU HAVE A CLAIM THAT'S MADE, IT'S CONNECTED BY THAT I.D.

THEY'RE SAYING THAT I.D.

HAS TO BE OBSCURED BECAUSE THAT IS PERSONALLY IDENTIFIABLE HEALTH INFORMATION.

THAT'S QUESTIONABLE ENOUGH, BUT THEN WHEN YOU SAY YES THIS DATABASE SHOULD BE RELEASED AND SINCE WE'RE OBSCURING THAT AND YOU CAN'T CONNECT ANY RECORDS, IT WOULD BE WORTHLESS AND WE WON'T TURN IT OVER.

SO YEAH, WE SAID THERE'S A SIMPLE WAY TO OBSCURE THAT TO MAKE IT USEABLE THROUGH HASHING FUNCTIONS OR ENCRYPTION AND THEY SAID, YES, THAT'S CREATING A NEW RECORD WHICH IS NOT REQUIRED UNDER THE LAW.

SO THE COURT CAME OUT WITH A PRETTY GOOD OPINION SAYING, THAT'S NOT CREATING A NEW RECORD BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT ADDING ANYTHING NEW BUT IT'S LIKE REDACTING IN A COMPLICATING WAY.

>> Ted: WHERE DO WE STABBED STAND ON YOUR INVESTIGATION?

>> WE'RE WAITING FOR RECORDS.

>> Ted: GIVES US A TIME TABLE ON IT.

AN IMAGINED OR -- >> DEPENDS IF THE STATE TAKES THIS TO THE ARIZONA SUPREME COURT AND HOW LONG -- IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO TELL.

IT COULD BE ONE YEAR OR FIVE YEARS.

>> Ted: THERE WOULD BE A REDACTION PROCESS.

IT'S A FASCINATING IDEA REGARDING, AGAIN, PRIVACY AND SECURITY WITH THE PRIVATE'S RIGHT TO KNOW AND HAVE YOU BOTH HERE FOP.

>> THANKS, TED.

>> THANKS, TED.

>> Ted: IMAGES FROM THE JAMES WEBB TELESCOPE ARE HELPING ASTRONOMERS IN ARIZONA TO LEARN ABOUT HOW THE FIRST STARS AND GALAXIES FORMED AFTER THE BIG BANG AND FOR MORE, WEWORK DR. MARCIA RIEKE AT THE UNIVERSITY OF ARIZONA.

GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN AND THANKS FOR JOINING US.

>> WELL, THANKS FOR HAVING ME AGAIN.

I LIKE TO TALK ABOUT THIS STUFF.

>> Ted: WHAT DO WE TALK ABOUT WITH THIS PROGRAM LOOKING WAY BACK AND I MEAN WAY BACK AT THE BABY GALAXIES?

>> JADES IS THE JWST ADVANCED EXTRA GALACTIC SURVEY AND WE HAD AN ALLOCATION OF NEARLY 900 HOURS OF OBSERVING TIME ON THE TELESCOPE FOR MY TEAM AND HALF OF THAT TIME IS GOING TO THIS PROJECT.

SO WE'VE BEEN TRYING TO FIND THE MOST DISTANT GALAXYING AND THE FIRST ONE IS TO FORM AFTER THE BIG BANG.

>> Ted: HOW FAR BACK DID YOU GO?

>> RIGHT NOW, WE'VE MADE IT TO A TIME OF 330 MILLION YEARS AFTER THE BIG BANG AND THE UNIVERSE IS 13 BILLION YEARS OLD.

SO WE'RE ALMOST ALL THE WAY, NOT QUITE.

>> Ted: AGAIN, LOTS OF GALAXIES AND HOW MANY DID YOU FIND OUT THERE?

>> IN THE FIRST DATA RELEASE, WE HAVE A CATALOG OF 45,000 IN AN AREA 1/4040th THE AREA OF THE FULL MOON.

>> Ted: WAS THIS IS A SURPRISE TO FIND THAT MANY OF THESE INFANT GALAXIES OUT THERE?

>> SOME OF THE ONES IN OUR IMAGE ARE SORT OF MIDDLE AGED AND NOT -- THE MOST DISTANT ONES WE DIDN'T FIND 45,000.

BUT YES, WE'RE FINDING MORE THAN PEOPLE HAD ORIGINALLY PREDICTED WE WOULD.

>> Ted: WE HAVE SOME IMAGES HERE THAT MEAN ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO ME, BUT YOU'RE THE EXPERT AND YOU BROUGHT THE IMAGES AND LET'S LOOK AT THE FIRST ONE HERE AND IT HAS A BUNCH OF NUMBERS AND THIS IS -- I GUESS THAT'S THE LITTLE THING OF THE MOON ON THE LEFT AND THIS IS WHAT THAT LITTLE SPOT IS SHOWING, CORRECT?

>> THE TILTED RECTANGLE, IT TAKES 40 OF THOSE TO COVER THE FULL MOON AND THEN I MAGAZINE MAGNITUDE ONEMAGNIFIEDONE LITTLE SECTION.

THIS IS A MEASURE OF HOW FAR AWAY THE OBJECTS ARE AND IN LITTLE SNIP, YOU CAN SEE ONE NEAR THE TOP YELLOW ARROW THAT SAYS 7.56.

SO THAT'S NOT QUITE THE FURTHEST ONE WE FOUND, BUT IT JUST HAPPENED TO BE THE ONE IN THIS LITTLE SNIP.

>> Ted: AGAIN, FOR SUCH A SMALL SAMPLE, AND THESE ARE GALAXIES AND NOT TALKING ABOUT STARS HERE.

THESE ARE GALAXIES.

>> EACH ONE HAS AS MANY AS THE MILKY WAY.

>> Ted: THE NEXT CHART HAS WAVE LENGTHS AT THE BOTTOM AND WHAT EXACTLY ARE WE LOOKING AT?

>> THIS IS A SAMPLE, DATA SAMPLE FROM ONE GALAXY AND THE WAVE LENGTHS CORRESPOND TO THE DIFFERENT COLORED FILTERS THAT WE USE.

THEY'RE INFRARED AND RED, GREEN, BLUE AND THE DIFFERENT WAVE LENGTHS.

AND THE TOP ROW OF THE GRAY SCALES SHOW WHAT WE SAW AND THIS IS THE SECOND MOST DISTANT GALAXY WE FOUND AND YOU CAN JUST SEE A LITTLE SMUDGE IN THE MIDDLE OF THOSE.

WE MADE A MODEL OF THE SHAPE AND , WHICH IS THE MIDDLE ROW AND WE SUBTRACTED TO MAKE SURE WE DID IT RIDE AND THE BOTTOM IS THE RESIDUAL SHOWING IT'S DONE RIGHT.

>> Ted: YOU GO GRADUAL AND FASCINATING.

THERE'S ONE MORE IMAGE, DISCERNABLE SHAPES OF DISTANT GALAXIES.

EXPLAIN THIS ONE AND THIS IS AT THE CORE OF WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE.

>> IT IS.

AND THE PREVIOUS PICTURE, THE OBJECT WAS JUST A TINY LITTLE SMUDGE.

THESE ARE NOT QUITE AS FAR BACK IN TIME, BUT THIS IS ALMOST AND THIS IS SHOWING THAT INSTEAD OF JUST BEING A TINY SMUDGE WITHOUT STRUCTURE, WE'RE ACTUALLY SEEING SOME OF THESE BLOBS COME TOGETHER AND PRESUMABLY BY THE MODERN TIMES, WE WILL HAVE MERGED AND FORMED A BIGGER GALAXY AND SO WE'RE STARTING TO TRACE OFF THAT PROCESS.

>> Ted: THIS IS ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING AND WHAT ARE YOU AS A RESEARCHER AND WHAT DO WE AS A PUBLIC, WHAT DO WE TAKE FROM ALL OF THIS?

>> WELL, ONE THING WE TAKE FROM THIS IS THAT OUR BASIC THEORY OF WORK SEEMS OK, BUT THERE ARE A BUNCHCH DETAILS WE NEED TO TUNE UP AND THE WE STILL HAVE HOPES OF COMING TO GRIPS OF HOW DID OUR OWN MILKY WAY FORM?

AND WE'RE GETTING A LOT MORE OF THE PIECES OF THE PUZZLE PUT TOGETHER HERE.

WE'LL HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF OUR PLACE IN THE UNIVERSE IS WHERE WE'LL END UP HERE.

>> Ted: GREAT RESEARCH AND CONGRATULATIONS ON THIS JAMES WEBB TELESCOPE.

MARCIA RIEKE, CONGRATULATIONS.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Ted: THAT IS IT FOR NOW AND AND THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

YOU HAVE A GREAT EVENING!