- Just ahead on Black Issues Forum Black students are reaching new heights as they begin to see themselves in the world of aviation.

Some of the historical challenges that they face in the industry, and what opportunities are available today.

Stay with us.

- [Narrator] Black Issues Forum is a production of PBS North Carolina with support from the Z. Smith Reynolds Foundation.

Quality public television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you who invite you to join them in supporting PBS NC.

[upbeat music] ♪ - Long before Dr. King's I Have a Dream speech, Army Lieutenant William Powell shared his own dream for America in the early 1930s, one where Black people shed the shackles of racism and spread their wings to fly.

Today we see more and more Black students enter the skies of aviation earning their wings and the right to fly.

And one school right here in North Carolina has their hands on the pulse of the industry.

Elizabeth City State University has played an active role in the fight and have no plans on stopping.

Take a look at this feature created by our producers here at PBS highlighting the school's aviation program and its outstanding students.

- The program is focused on preparing students for careers in aviation.

That could include being professional pilot, that could be air traffic controller, aviation managers, and even avionics technician.

- There's so many different like opportunities in aviation.

That's one thing I love.

Like you could do cargo, you could do corporate, you could do commercial, you could be a bush pilot.

Like how cool is that?

You could go anywhere in the-.

Like.

- [Kuldeep] Our professional pilot program has grown considerably in the last few years because the demand for pilot has increased as a lot of pilots are coming up with the age and they will be retiring very soon.

So what we are trying to do is we are partnering with industry, aviation industry to make sure that we can supply a diverse aviation workforce.

We are focusing more on the minorities and women to get into aviation workforce.

- Black females are rare in aviation, rare in STEM, just a rarity.

So if you actually see a Black female pilot, you saw a unicorn.

[laughs] It's the coolest thing ever.

- [Orestes] We call it the, what is it?

The forever smile.

Once you get into the airplane and you're flying the aircraft, there's a permanent grin that's plastered on your face.

That's, it's just an exhilarating happy feeling.

- Flying, you see a sparkle in my eye when I talk about it.

Flying is just limitless.

It's boundless.

It's a new liberty that you can't get here on the ground.

Everyone asks me if I'm scared when I go up and it's just a sense of calmingness like just looking down at the ground.

I just can't explain it.

[laughs] - 2065 [indistinct] 16, good for take off.

615, Delta [indistinct].

The right base runway, 28 right.

Remember two zero whiskey kilo.

Roger cross runway two eight right.

Taxi main grant via Delta India.

- We're gonna enter the landing pattern here and enter on the downwind for this airport.

So we're just basically doing a slight descent here down to a thousand feet.

I chose to come back here because I graduated here.

It's just a way to give back to not just the students here, but to my community as well.

- Oh my gosh.

When I graduate, [laughs] I just can't wait.

My mom's my biggest supporter through all of it.

If I need any inspiration, I call her.

So I just can't wait to see the look on her face when I can just take us all up, get my job, get my career set up.

I just can't wait.

Just pure bliss.

- Pure bliss indeed.

It brings a smile to my face just to see the inspiration in those students.

To talk more about the program and the career in aviation, we invite to the show Dr. Kuldeep Rawat Thorpe, endowed professor and Dean at ECSU, flight attendant and aspiring pilot, Jasmine Williams, and high school student and pilot in training, Trinity Dooner.

Welcome to the show.

Jasmine, I want to come to you first.

You're currently a flight attendant but you've got your sights set on that pilot seat.

Share with us your journey and what initially piqued your interest.

- I have actually always wanted to be a pilot since I was about four or five.

I remember going to the airport to pick up a family member and we met a flight attendant in the restroom.

She happened to be a person of color and with her talking to my mom at the time and she was able to allow me to come on board, sit in the flight deck, and talk to the pilots.

And ever since then, it was just kind of like love at first sight.

I associate being in the air as kind of being free.

It is very blissful.

So that's, now that I'm in the aviation world within the next year or two, I plan to take on a pilot role and start our pilot training through a program that we have at the airline I work for.

- Beautiful.

Trinity at 17, soon to be 18, you've accomplished more than many twice your age.

And when I first heard your story, I felt a rush of emotions and knew that we had to share it here.

So tell us how you knew that this was the path for you.

- I just grew up traveling and just loving to fly and being on planes and loving being at the airport.

And I was just on a flight once and I was like thinking like, I need to figure out what I wanna do with my life and my career.

So I was like, why not flying?

And then ever since then I started taking classes and learning how to fly.

- [Kenia] Wow.

Well, we're hopefully at a time in our culture where organizations understand the importance of diversity.

This drive also extends into the airline industry.

Many of these companies understand and know that DEI is essential to their workforce development.

A diverse group of managers and employees can give business different perspectives on various areas and create more inclusive culture.

Dr. Rawat, bringing you into the conversation.

How does the program at ECSU support this DEI movement, taking it beyond the trend and actually making moves that matter?

- So here at Elizabeth City State University, as you may know that it has distinction of offering the only four year aviation science degree program in the state of North Carolina.

So it is upon us to make sure we take every step possible to attract more and more minorities into the aviation workforce.

So currently, we are offering a aviation science program with different tracks.

We are trying to cover as much of aviation workforce as possible.

So we are offering pilot training.

We are also offering aviation management training.

We are offering drone training, avionics, and also air traffic control.

On top of that, we are also doing outreach into high schools, middle schools, through our FA Aviation Workforce Development Initiative, where we bring 80 students to campus every summer, where we expose them to aviation careers, and we always ensure that at least 70% of the participants are African Americans in those programs, so that they can get exposed to what educational opportunity they have and also the career opportunities.

At the end of the program, we'll also be giving them scholarships so that financial doesn't become, the finance doesn't become the barrier of entry, because there is cost associated with flight training, and we are trying to keep that cost as minimum as possible.

At this point, our pilot training cost is less than half of what a student would pay if they go out to any other university, a larger campus, or a private school.

So we are trying to keep that, we're trying to bring more and more K-12 students into the pipeline and expose more and more minorities to the aviation careers.

- Yeah, have you seen an uptick in numbers in students that are expressing interest in the career?

- Yes, a lot of increase in the enrollment, in the interest the students have expressed.

In fact, in the last three years alone, we have experienced over 27% growth in the program.

We are currently at 180 students.

Just four years back, we were only 68, so we have experienced tremendous growth, and of those 180 students, we are proud to say that 60% of them are African Americans.

So we are increasing that population as well.

Plus, we're also focusing more on women.

We have a Women in Aviation international chapter here.

Again, that's another avenue for students to get involved with a professional organization and learn more about the opportunities.

So yes, we have seen a lot of increase in the interest because there is a shortage of pilots, and everybody knows about that, and this is the right time actually to get into aviation.

We will need 18,000 pilots every year for next 10 years.

- Yeah.

- That's a great opportunity.

We have 180,000 jobs available in this field.

- That's a wonderful, wonderful opportunity.

In 1969, black aviator, Warren H. Wheeler, a native of Durham North Carolina, established Wheeler Flying Service, Wheeler Airlines, the first African American owned and operated air service in the United States.

He successfully led Wheeler Airlines for over two decades until its closure in 1991.

It was a time when it was extremely rare to see people of color in aviation, and any effort to penetrate the industry was consistently made more difficult over time.

Dr. Rawat, coming back to you, as you prepare for the future aviators of the world, I'm sure there's an understanding of the importance of black students seeing themselves.

Jasmine alluded to that.

That's what sparked her love.

Talk to us about that, and how important it is.

- That is very, very important because that helps them build self-efficacy.

You know, that helps them build their confidence that they can also do it.

So one thing we do here at ECSU is our training staff, the flight training staff.

We make sure that we have a great representation of black flight instructors in our program, of women in our program.

Presently, around 70% of our flight training staff is comprised, comprises of either African American male or women flight instructors.

That's very important because students need to see who's training them, and when they see that there are black pilots, they get inspired, and then we also make sure that those pilots are able to mentor them.

We're also forging partnership with industry.

There's a lot of outreach from the airlines with HBCUs, historically black colleges and universities, in terms of aviation.

They're very select HBCUs that offers aviation science program.

We're talking only six to seven universities that have these programs.

So airlines are also reaching out to these universities.

We signed agreement with United Airlines, and we signed, we are also working with JetBlue, and very soon, we'll be working with Delta Airlines.

And the whole idea behind these partnerships is to reach out to these students and tell them that there are careers available for them to get into airlines.

- That's wonderful.

- And also, airlines is able to provide them mentorship.

- Yeah, that's great.

Partnership is key.

As we saw earlier in the video, though, women make up only 5.6% of commercial aviation industry.

Black women, less than 1%.

Jasmine, we know that you are currently in a program.

What are some of the trends that you're seeing as you've begun your career?

Has it been difficult as a young black woman in this space?

- I would say that that trend is very on point.

For example, the airline that I'm with, we have 17,000 pilots, and only four of them are African American women that are captains.

So it is very, it is a very on point trend.

In terms of my experience, the pilots that I have reached out to or have asked for mentorship, especially through our AVIATE program, I've tried to reach out to mostly women and/or women of color.

But because that number is so small, we don't have women of color to kind of lean on.

And if we do, their time is very tight just because they're trying to cover so many bases and be a part of so much.

But the women that I have reached out to that are not necessarily women of color have also been very motivating and just reassuring that this is a field that we do need diversity in.

It is not swept under the rug that this is a man-led industry, especially once you cross over to being a pilot.

So women are lifting each other up, which is extremely motivating and helpful.

But to everyone's point, we would love to see more black pilots just in the commercial airlines.

It gives people who want to do that a sense of belonging.

- Yeah, yeah.

Reason why we're having this show, right?

Having this conversation and bringing awareness to it.

Trinity, I can't imagine, once again, being 17, flying a plane, I was barely driving at that age.

I understand that you recently got behind the wheel of a plane.

I don't even know if that's the right description of how to say that.

Describe for us what it took mentally to prepare for that and what it felt like to fly for the very first time.

- Well, I actually hadn't flown a plane by myself yet, but I've had an instructor next to me.

And just like watching him and like learning the ropes and it's very nice.

It's comforting, I find it and it's not as scary as I thought it would be, but it's very relaxing to me.

- [Kenia] Yeah, no fears at all?

- No, not at all.

- That's awesome.

That's awesome.

Dr. Rawat, how is ECSU'S aviation program preparing students as a whole?

I can imagine Black students, who go through this education is not only ready to work but also ready to change the narrative and do some justice work there.

- Yeah, so as I said, we have women in aviation international chapters so we are doing a lot of activities through club, you know trying to promote more and more aviation for minorities.

We are also doing outreach through our summer programs and through our year round programs.

Again, trying to bring more and more minorities into the program.

And while they're here, we are trying to make sure that whenever there's an opportunity for students to talk about their experiences we are bringing those minority students in front of camera and have them express what their experiences have been in aviation.

We are also trying to connect them with the federal agencies and with the industry making sure that they are trying, they're getting their exposure early on while they're on campus.

Start talking to the professionals who are already in the field and try to get their perspective on what they need to do to make sure that they're well prepared to enter those careers.

And then we also have, especially in the flight area we have what we call as flight team.

We send our students to compete with other flight teams across the country.

So that's another exposure that they get.

They go and meet other students of color when they go and compete in these competitions.

So we try to give them exposure through federal agencies through industry, through competitions and through other programs that we offer on campus year round summer, so on, so forth.

- Nice, Jasmine, many make the assumption that women expressing desires to enter into aviation want to become a flight attendant.

Not many see beyond that.

Why do you want to push past that expectation?

- For a number of different reasons.

Mainly for what we're talking about today is to extend the narrative.

And a recent conversation I've had with a pilot mentor is that she has noticed that a lot of people of color don't go into aviation because growing up it's not something that's discussed in our communities.

It's not something that is offered as a career choice.

Not necessarily one that is offered and as well promoted.

So I definitely wanna change that narrative.

I wanna show people that literally the sky is the limit.

Being in the sky is one of the best feelings, it's become my home.

So I would love to share that joy and that love and bring more women of color and put them in the captain seat because there aren't very many of us.

And change the narrative and make it a more diverse role just in general.

- Yeah, I love that sky is the limit.

Trinity, similar question to you.

You're young and some may not believe that you know what you want already, right?

Especially in such a unique space.

What do you say to the naysayers?

- Some people just know what they wanna do young and really do good with that and some people find out later in life.

So it's kind of just up to you, I guess.

- COVID certainly impacted many industries and it's no secret that the travel industry felt some of the biggest impact during the pandemic.

There was a drastic decline in commercial airline flights but reports show that we saw a rise in 2022 and is rapidly rapidly approaching pre-covid status, meaning the industry needs more people.

Jasmine, there are airline programs out there that help those have a way or path right after graduation from college to take this career path.

Tell us about the program that you're in and what someone who's interested should know and prepare for.

- So I will be starting a program through my airline called Aviate.

And it's where we partner with different private pilot schools.

I actually think Elizabeth City is in part of that program.

It is a lot, it is a lot of information to take in.

I would suggest that if you are interested in it you have to kind of tune out the background noise.

Especially as a woman of color.

I've heard time and time again that you know, women of color don't make it as a pilot or you do better as a flight attendant.

You know, it's cuter to be a flight attendant and that's just not what I want.

So if you're gonna go through Aviate, you have to be very headstrong, very self progressive is a word I like to use.

You don't have someone you know right over your shoulder telling you, you know, you have to study, you have to memorize these subjects.

So definitely just keep your focus.

Keep your goal at your insight 'cause you'll have a lot of naysayers, but it's up to you to kind of break those barriers down and believe in yourself.

Because if you don't believe in yourself, no one else will.

- No one will.

Dr. Rawat, careers are not just limited to piloting.

We've been talking about that a lot, but there's more as the video suggested, there are other options.

So tell us a little bit about those options and then I'd love to know are advanced degrees needed in this field?

- Yeah, so yeah, you're right.

You know, as I mentioned earlier, you know we offer a lot of options when students come to get their aviation degree.

Pilot being one and most popular, but there are options to be air traffic controller you know, around 10 million new towers will be added by 2030.

Think about it, 10 million new air traffic control towers.

So that means there is a huge demand for air traffic controllers.

Also aviation managers who will be managing these airports who will be managing these airlines or other aviation businesses?

We need aviation managers.

And then, the emerging areas in aviation, which is un-crewed, the unmanned aviation that we keep hearing about, drones, the advanced air mobility.

All these will, again, need new professions or the professionals who already aviation need to be retrained for these careers.

At this time, the drone use is doubling every year.

There are over 300,000 drones that are flying currently.

So there's tremendous potential to enter these areas.

So again, yes, pilot is huge but all these areas are now catching up very soon and we need professionals in all these areas and not to forget the maintenance who's gonna maintain these airplanes?

We need aircraft mechanics.

So there is a lot of opportunities if somebody wants to be in aviation and they can definitely choose what career path they want to go for.

- And every, every Role is important, 'cause without the smaller roles, the bigger roles, none of it's possible.

Trinity, you are a pilot in training at Wings of Carolina.

Walk us through that program and what's next for you?

- It's a really great program.

They're very one-on-one and very helpful with classes and book stops.

Next for me, is probably to take a couple more classes to get my instrumental rating and hopefully get my private pilot's license in a couple of months and, yeah.

- Yeah, we'll see Trinity just jet setting off to all the amazing spaces and places in this country, I'm sure.

Dr. Rawat, I wanna come back to you with technology advancement.

You talked about drones.

We talk about artificial intelligence.

Does that take away from the jobs or how do we integrate technology and still have opportunity for us in this space?

- Yeah, I definitely don't agree that all these technologies are going to affect jobs.

No, they are just making it more efficient.

For example, training technology.

You could sit in a simulator and train to become a pilot.

Okay, but if you don't have that high expensive simulator you could use a virtual reality headset and try to get a similar type of experience.

So that's where the technology is being used.

Artificial intelligence.

Artificial intelligence is again being used to make you a better pilot with all the technology it has all the data, it's helping you basically analyze that data and give you information in real time that you could use to be a better pilot or a better aviation professional.

So it is an extension of what is already being done.

So I don't really believe that that can take jobs away.

Even drones, okay.

Now people may say that when drones are going to take jobs away.

No, we need people to operate those drones.

It takes, even though it's unmanned or uncrewed, it takes crew to actually operate the drones.

We need a person who's flying the drone.

We need the person who's controlling the sensors on the drone.

And then once the drone gathers the data we need professionals who can analyze the data.

There's a whole field of drone analytics now.

And then of course machine learning and AI can also play a role into that.

We just need to re-skill, upscale, retool ourselves to be in line with the new technology.

- Yeah, I'd love to know bringing it local, obviously you're here at Elizabeth City State University.

But what does the outlook for aviation look like in North Carolina?

Are there opportunities across the state to really see us integrated into this movement?

- North Carolina is aviation focused state.

There's a lot of things going on in aviation here.

We have a huge global transport right in Kingston, North Carolina.

We have over, close to 400 airports.

We have major aviation companies here.

We have Honda Jet, we have Sonic Boom, we have other small and large businesses related to aviation.

We have one of the largest air station post guard station right in Elizabeth City.

So yes, there is huge demand for aviation workforce in the state of North Carolina.

And aviation, North Carolina is also leading the charge for advanced air mobility, the air taxis.

Also leading the charge for drones.

In fact, North Carolina will see their first low altitude traffic management to be set up in this here state.

So that will be again, just like an air traffic controller but it will be for the air taxis.

So that's happening in North Carolina.

When it comes to use of drones, we have large solar phones.

We have wind turbines, we have miles and miles of coastlines.

Who's going to monitor those?

How are those going to be inspected.

Again, drones will be key to that.

We are also talking offshore wind turbines.

Who's going to inspect those wind turbines?

Again, you're going to have drones used in that.

So yes, North Carolina is really heavy on aviation site.

So if you're in North Carolina and northeast, even in northeastern North Carolina you have a lot of opportunities to be in that area, as long as you are trained and you have the required certification.

Certification is the key.

As you mentioned, advanced degrees, that's the beauty about aviation.

If you are certified, if you have right certification you can enter the workforce.

And if you have a bachelor's degree that's an add-on for you to move up in the career.

But this is one of those areas where you can enter with just a bachelor's degree or a certification.

- Wonderful.

Well, Dr. Rawat, you've brought so much information to our audience.

Jasmine and Trinity, I'm just so proud and I know both of your mothers and I'm so proud to see you guys doing what you love and being in the air and taking the reins in this industry that you are much needed in.

So thank you all for being here.

We also want to thank you for watching and invite you to engage with us on Twitter or Instagram using the #BlackIssuesForum.

You can also find our full episodes on pbsnc.org/blackissuesforum.

I'm Kenya Thompson.

See you next week.

[upbeat music] ♪ - [Narrator] "Black Issues Forum" is a production of PBS North Carolina.

With support from the Z. Smith Reynolds Foundation.

Quality public television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you who invite you to join them in supporting PBSNC.