>> "ALMANAC" IS A PRODUCTION OF TWIN CITIES PBS FOR THE STATIONS OF MINNESOTA PUBLIC TELEVISION ASSOCIATION.

>> CATHY: COMING UP, A BIG DEBATE WITH THE LEADING CANDIDATES FOR MAYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS.

BUT THAT'S NOT ALL WE HAVE IN STORE FOR YOU.

WE'LL EXAMINE THE MOHAMED NOOR RE-SENTENCING, THE ONGOING DROUGHT CRISIS IN GREATER MINNESOTA, AND THEN MARY LAHAMMER REPORTS ON BOGGED-DOWN PLANS TO PAY MINNESOTA'S FRONTLINE COVID WORKERS.

>> Mary: THE LEGISLATURE SET ASIDE ONEY FOR FRONT-LINE WORKERS AND NOW STILL CAN'T AGREE WHO SHOULD GET THE FUNDS.

WE'LL HAVE THE LATEST ON THE FEUD.

>> I JUST FEEL LIKE THIS IS BEING SLOW WALKED Y THE GOVERNOR.

>> WE AN'T SEGREGATE AND EXCLUDE FRONT-LINE WORKERS.

>> Mary: THAT'S COMING UP N "ALMANAC."

♪♪ >> "ALMANAC" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY MEMBERS OF THIS PUBLIC TELEVISION STATION.

SUPPORT IS ALSO PROVIDED BY· GREAT RIVER ENERGY: PROVIDING WHOLESALE POWER TO 28 MINNESOTA ELECTRIC COOPERATIVES.

DELTA DENTAL OF MINNESOTA FOUNDATION: IMPROVING ORAL HEALTH WHILE ADVANCING SOCIAL EQUITIES.

DELTADENTALMN.ORG/TPT.

THE SHAKOPEE MDEWAKANTON SIOUX COMMUNITY: A TRIBAL NATION FOCUSED ON COMMUNITY AND COLLABORATION - ESPECIALLY IN TIMES LIKE TODAY.

ENBRIDGE: CONNECTING MINNESOTANS WITH ENERGY FOR OVER 70 YEARS.

MORE AT ENBRIDGE.COM/LINETHREEUS.

AND EDUCATION MINNESOTA: THE VOICE FOR PROFESSIONAL EDUCATORS AND STUDENTS THROUGHOUT THE STATE.

MORE AT EDUCATIONMINNESOTA.ORG.

"ONE GREATER MINNESOTA" REPORTING ON "ALMANAC" IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY THE OTTO BREMER TRUST, WHOSE MISSION IS INVESTING IN PEOPLE, PLACES AND OPPORTUNITIES IN OUR REGION.

ADDITIONAL SUPPORT IS PROVIDED BY THE BLANDIN FOUNDATION, WORKING TO STRENGHTEN RURAL MINNESOTA.

>> CATHY: THANKS FOR JOINING US.

WE'LL START THE MAYORAL DEBATE IN ABOUT 15 MINUTES, BUT WE ALSO WANTED TO LOOK AT SOME OTHER BIG STORIES IN THE NEWS.

>> ERIC: FORMER MINNEAPOLIS POLICE OFFICER MOHAMED NOOR WAS RE-SENTENCED THURSDAY FOR THE 2017 SHOOTING DEATH OF JUSTINE DAMOND.

A NEW SENTENCE WAS NECESSARY BECAUSE THE MINNESOTA SUPREME COURT LAST MONTH TOSSED OUT HIS CONVICTION ON THIRD-DEGREE MURDER, ONE OF TWO CHARGES HE WAS CONVICTED OF.

HERE TO EXPLAIN THE LITTLE-USED AND OFTEN-MISUNDERSTOOD THIRD-DEGREE, OR DEPRAVED MIND, MURDER CHARGE IS MARK OSLER.

HE'S A PROFESSOR AT ST. THOMAS LAW SCHOOL AND HAS JOINED US IN THE PAST TO TALK ABOUT THE NOOR AND CHAUVIN TRIALS.

PROFESSOR, NOOR WAS FOUND TO HAVE ENDANGERED PUBLIC SAFETY BUT IT DIDN'T MEET THE CONDITIONS FOR A DEPRAVED MIND.

TELL US WHAT HAPPENED THERE.

>> YEAH, IT WAS A FASCINATING DECISION.

I'M HEARING FROM PEOPLE ACROSS THE COUNTRY WHO ARE WONDERING WHAT THIS ALL MEANS.

THE SUPREME COURT RULED THAT THIRD-DEGREE MURDER IS WRITTEN IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT COVERS AN INCIDENT THAT THREATENS MULTIPLE PEOPLE.

IN OTHER WORDS, IT CAN'T BE AIMED AT JUST ONE INDIVIDUAL.

AS WE SAW HERE.

AND BECAUSE OF THAT, THEY SAID THIS DOESN'T FIT.

AND WE'RE GOING TO REJECT THIRD-DEGREE MURDER.

AND THAT LEFT, AS THE REMAINING COUNT, SECOND-DEGREE MANSLAUGHTER, WHICH HAS A MUCH LOWER SENTENCING GUIDELINE IN STATUTORY MAXIMUM.

AND, SO, IT HAD TO BE SENT BACK AND WE DID GET A MUCH LOWER SENTENCE.

>> Cathy: WHAT IS THE DEPRAVED MIND -- WHEN IS IT USUALLY USED?

IS IT OFTEN USED, I GUESS I SHOULD SAY?

IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE IT IS.

>> NOT THAT FTEN.

AND T'S HARD TO -- FOR PEOPLE TO GET THEIR MINDS AROUND WHAT THAT MEANS, EXACTLY.

IT'S VERY DIFFERENT THAN INTENTIONAL MURDER, WHICH WE SEE IN SECOND-DEGREE, WHERE WE ARE FINDING THAT SOMEONE INTENDED FOR THIS OUTCOME.

DEPRAVED MIND IS JUST YOU'RE ACTING SO RECKLESS THAT IT'S A, YOU KNOW, REALLY SERIOUS THREAT TO OTHERS.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T USE IT MUCH BECAUSE WE WANT THE MURDER TO BE DEFINED CLEARLY.

INTENT, WE UNDERSTAND.

EVEN FELONY MURDER, LIKE WE SAW IN THE CHAUVIN CASE.

>> Cathy: IS IT USED WHEN PROSECUTORS WANT SOMETHING TO STICK?

>> YEAH, THAT'S PART OF IT.

AND IT'S ALSO SOMETHING THAT IS AN IN-BETWEEN CHARGE, AND THAT'S HOW WE SAW IT USED HERE, SOMETHING IN BETWEEN SECOND-DEGREE MURDER MURDER, WHICH WAS CHARGED.

>> Eric: MINNESOTA HAS SENTENCING GUIDELINES AND THERE'S A GRID.

HOW WILL THAT BE APPLIED TO HOW MUCH TIME HE HAS TO SERVE.

>> WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE GRID, THE GRID IN THIS KIND OF CASE PROVIDES A TARGET, WHICH IS 48 MONTHS, BUT ALSO GIVES THE JUDGE A RANGE WITHIN WHICH SHE CAN WORK WITHOUT BEING OVERTURNED.

AND HAS THAT DISCRETION.

HERE THAT RANGE WAS 41 TO 57 MONTHS.

AND SHE SENTENCED AT THE TOP END OF 57 MONTHS.

>> Cathy: DID THAT SURPRISE YOU AT ALL?

>> IT DIDN'T.

IN PART BECAUSE THE DISCOUNT WAS HUGE OFF THE 12 AND A HALF YEARS THAT HE HAD BEEN SERVING.

AND ALSO THE JUDGE CITED IN THE SENTENCING TO SOME OF THE THINGS THAT MADE IT ESPECIALLY DANGEROUS.

AND THIS WAS PRETTY EVOCATIVE BECAUSE SHE TALKED ABOUT NOT JUST SHOOTING ACROSS THE FACE OF NOOR'S PARTNER BUT THAT THERE WERE PEOPLE ON A PORCH ENJOYING A SATURDAY EVENING IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

THERE WAS A KID RIDING BY ON A BIKE.

SO THERE WAS A THREAT TO OTHER PEOPLE AS WELL.

>> Eric: IMPLICATIONS FOR THE CHAUVIN TRIAL, ARE THERE ANY?

>> NO.

PROBABLY NOT DIRECTLY.

BECAUSE THIRD-DEGREE MURDER WASN'T THE TOP CHARGE.

NOW, IF SOMETHING WAS TO HAPPEN TO THE SECOND-DEGREE MURDER, THE UNINTENTIONAL, THEN PERHAPS.

BUT THAT'S UNLIKELY.

>> Eric: WHY ARE YOU GETTING INQUIRIES FROM AROUND THE COUNTRY?

HOW DOES THIS SPREAD TO OTHER STATES OR JURISDICTIONS?

>> WELL, IT DOESN'T, REALLY.

AND THAT'S THE THING, THERE ARE THIRD-DEGREE MURDER STATUTE AND ESPECIALLY THIS INTERPRETATION, IT HAS TO BE ONE PERSON WHO IS THREATENED DIRECTLY.

I SHOULD NOTE, THREATENED DIRECTLY IS THE KEY, WHEN THE JUDGE WAS TALKING ABOUT THE PEOPLE ON THE PORCH, THAT'S NOT A DIRECT HREAT IN THE SAME WAY.

BUT IT'S UNUSUAL, AND ESPECIALLY WITH THAT DEFINITION, IT JUST HAS TO BE ONE SINGLE INDIVIDUAL.

>> Cathy: I WONDER, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THIS ISN'T USED THAT OFTEN, CLEARLY, THERE'S SOME AMBIGUITY ABOUT THIS, SHOULD LAWMAKERS CHANGE IT, JUST MAYBE SCRAP IT?

>> OR REDEFINE IT IN A WAY THAT HAS MORE MEANING.

YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE THING, WE LOOK AT THESE STATUTES, YOU KNOW, THE SECOND-DEGREE MANSLAUGHTER TALKS ABOUT UNREASONABLE RISK BEING TAKEN.

AND THIRD-DEGREE MURDER, AS YOU MENTIONED, IS TALKING ABOUT DEPRAVED MIND.

THOSE ARE THINGS THAT ARE VERY HARD TO DISTINGUISH IN REAL LIFE.

AND, SO, IT WOULD BE GREAT IF WE COULD REVAMP SOME OF THESE LAWS WITH AN EYE TOWARDS USING ORDINARY LANGUAGE THAT'S NOT ARCHAIC.

>> Eric: PROFESSOR, THANKS SO MUCH FOR COMING OVER AND EXPLAINING ALL THIS TO US.

THANKS.

>> ALWAYS MY PLEASURE.

>> Cathy: GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> Eric: THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU.

♪♪ >> CATHY: LAWMAKERS IN WASHINGTON ARE HAVING A HARD TIME AGREEING ON THINGS, AND THAT'S TRUE IN ST. PAUL TOO.

EARLIER THIS SUMMER THERE WAS HOPE THAT MINNESOTA LEGISLATORS WOULD MEET IN SPECIAL SESSION AND AGREE ON AID FOR DROUGHT-STRICKEN FARMERS IN OUR REGION.

THE WAIT IS ONGOING.

HERE TO TALK ABOUT WHAT IS BEING HELD UP, MINNESOTA AGRICULATURE COMMISSIONER THOM PETERSEN.

IT'S GOOD TO SEE YOU, COMMISSIONER.

BEFORE WE ASK ABOUT SPECIAL SESSION, THAT KIND OF THING, MY FARMER FRIENDS IN FAR WESTERN MINNESOTA WERE KIND OF PLEASANTLY SURPRISED WHEN THEY GOT INTO THE FIELDS AND THEY LOOKED AT THEIR YIELDS, IT WAS BETTER THAN THEY THOUGHT, GIVEN THE DROUGHT.

ARE YOU HEARING THAT, TOO?

>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

AND IT'S SO REFRESHING ITH THE DROUGHT IN THE SUMMER THAT WE HAD, TO SEE THE CROP REPORTS COMING IN ACROSS THE STATE ARE REALLY STRONG FOR CORN AND SOYBEANS, EVEN IN SOME OF THE DROUGHT AREAS.

AND, SO, THAT IS GOOD TO SEE THAT WE'VE HAD GOOD GENETICS AND SOME TIMELY RAINS THAT HELPED FINISH OFF THE CORN AND SOYBEAN CROP.

>> Eric: YOU'VE GOT A $10 MILLION DROUGHT RELIEF PACKAGE THAT YOU'RE PROMOTING.

WHAT'S INCLUDED?

>> SO WHAT IT IS, REALLY, WE LOOKED AT, AFTER WORKING ALL SUMMER WITH FARMERS AND TALKING WITH FARM GROUPS AND EVERYTHING THAT WE REALLY FELT LIKE THERE'S ASSISTANCE THERE FOR REALLY LIVESTOCK FARMERS AND SPECIALTY CROP GROWERS.

CROP FARMERS REALLY HAVE A GOOD SAFETY NET.

IT DOESN'T MAKE THEM WHOLE, BUT IT DOES HELP.

BUT OUR LIVESTOCK FARMERS AND OUR SPECIALTY CROP, LIKE PEOPLE THAT SELL AT FARMERS MARKETS, THEY DON'T HAVE THAT KIND OF SAFETY NET.

SO THEY LOST A LOT OF THEIR CROP.

YOU KNOW, WE REALLY DIDN'T HAVE RAIN FROM, FROM, LIKE, LATY UNTIL SEPTEMBER 1st, NOW IT WON'T STOP RAINING, OF COURSE.

SO A LOT OF THOSE CROPS THAT GROW IN THE SUMMER, THEY DIDN'T GROW.

THE HAY, THE PASTURE.

THAT'S WHAT REALLY IS HURTING.

WE'RE STILL REALLY SHORT ON HAY ACROSS THE STATE.

SO WE WOULD HAVE GRANTS TO HELP FARMERS, $5 MILLION TO HELP WITH TRANSPORTATION, HELP WITH FENCING, WATERING, THINGS LIKE THAT THAT WOULD HELP THEM PAY A BILL OR TWO AND GET THROUGH INTO NEXT YEAR.

>> athy: DO WE KNOW HOW MANY LIVESTOCK PRODUCERS WENT OUT OF BUSINESS AND SOLD THEIR HERDS BECAUSE OF THE DROUGHT?

>> WE WILL KNOW EVENTUALLY, WE DO CENSUS TAKING, WE TRACK NUMBERS.

WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE.

I MYSELF, PERSONALLY, VISITED SOME OF THOSE SALE BARNS WHEN THOSE FARMERS WERE GOING OUT.

THOSE WERE TOUGH CONVERSATIONS.

YOU THINK THE AVERAGE AGE OF A FARMER IS 58 YEARS OLD IN MINNESOTA, THEY'RE SELLING THEIR COW HERD, THEY'RE NOT GOING BACK INTO T. WE DO KNOW, THOUGH, THAT WE'VE LOST 20 DAIRY FARMS THE LAST THREE MONTHS.

AND THAT SOME OF THOSE WERE PUSHED IN.

SO ALMOST 60 DAIRY FARMS THAT WE KNOW THAT SOME OF THOSE ARE PUSHED IN TO RETIREMENT BY THE DROUGHT SITUATION, LACK OF FORAGE.

>> Eric: NOT TO GET REALLY DEEP IN THE WEEDS, HOW DO YOU MESH WHATEVER FEDERAL AID THERE IS, WITH WHATEVER STATE AID YOU'RE GOING TO PURSUE?

>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

LIKE I SAID, WE'VE BEEN TALKING A LOT WITH THE USDA, THERE'S A LOT OF DOLLARS.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE USDA DOLLARS DO, IT CAN SOMETIMES BE A LITTLE SLOWER AND DOESN'T COVER SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE GOING TO COVER OR OULD COVER.

IT'S LIKE WELL, WELLS INTERFERENCE, SOME TRANSPORTATION COSTS.

AND, AGAIN, FOR THOSE LIVESTOCK AND SPECIALTY CROP FARMERS, THE SAFETY NET AND THE ASSISTANCE ISN'T QUITE AS GOOD.

AND, SO, IT'S REALLY HELPFUL.

ALSO SOME OF OUR FARMERS THAT MAYBE AREN'T USED TO USING THE USDA, LIKE FOLKS THAT SELL AT FARMERS MARKETS, THEY'RE A LITTLE EASIER AND QUICKER TO DEAL WITH THE STATE.

SO HOPEFULLY WE CAN PAY A BILL OR TWO THAT WOULD HELP SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE GET THROUGH TO NEXT YEAR.

>> Cathy: COULD YOU EVER SEE HAVING -- I MEAN, THIS HAPPENS EVERY SO OFTEN, RIGHT?

AND THERE'S SPECIAL SESSIONS TO HELP FARMERS IN THE PAST BECAUSE OF DROUGHTS.

WHAT IF THERE'S LIKE AN EMERGENCY FUND THAT COULD BE ESTABLISHED?

>> YEAH.

AND I THINK THAT GOES BACK TO SEVERAL LEGISLATORS HAVE ALWAYS THOUGHT ABOUT THAT BECAUSE WE DO REACT A LOT OF TIMES.

YOU KNOW, WE HAVE DONE FLOODS, WOULD BE THE MOST RECENTLY, WHERE WE PAID TO HELP FARMERS FOR THAT.

AND I THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA.

AND ONE OF THE REASONS I THINK THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS THIS YEAR IS THE STATE DOES HAVE A SURPLUS, WE DO HAVE EXCESS DOLLARS, AND WE COULD BE HELPING SOME OF THESE FOLKS.

AND, SO, WE THINK IT IS A GOOD ASK AS AN ADMINISTRATION TO DO THIS RIGHT NOW.

>> Eric: I WOULD GUESS GRANTS ARE PREFERABLE TO EVEN LOW INTEREST LOANS, I SUPPOSE?

>> YEAH.

AND WE DO ALSO, WE ALSO DO HAVE LOW INTEREST LOANS, SOME OF THE STEPS THE ADMINISTRATION'S TAKEN, AS THE GOVERNOR'S WAIVED SOME TRUCKING REGULATIONS, WE'VE OPENED UP STATE EASEMENTS FOR GRAZING AND HAYING AND THEN WE'VE UNLOCKED SOME ZERO INTEREST LOAN NOT THAT FARMERS NEED A -- ANOTHER LOAN, BUT WE DO HAVE ZERO INTEREST LOAN, AND WE NEED ALL THE ABOVE PACKAGE TO HELP FARMERS GET THROUGH THIS.

>> Cathy: IS IT GOING TO BE PROBLEMATIC IF THIS SPILLS INTO THE REGULAR SESSION?

>> YOU KNOW, I THINK IT GETS COMPLICATED.

YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT THERE'S FARMERS, I WAS IN SAUK CENTER YESTERDAY, I MET WITH FARMERS WHO ARE SHORT OF FORAGE, THEY DON'T KNOW WHERE THEY'RE GOING TO GET THE HAY.

THE HAY IS EXTREMELY EXPENSIVE FOR I ALOT OF PEOPLE.

IT'S OUT THERE, BUT IT'S EXPENSIVE.

KEEP IN MIND, NORTH DAKOTA'S BAD.

IT'S GOING TO MAKE IT DIFFICULT FOR SOME OF THOSE FOLKS.

REALLY, NORTH OF St.

CLOUD TO THE BORDER.

>> Eric: WELL, YOU KNOW BETTER HAN I DO, IT WILL SLIDE TO THE MONTH OF MAY IF IT GETS INTO THE REGULAR SESSION.

>> EXACTLY, YUP.

>> Eric: COMMISSIONER, THANKS SO MUCH FOR COMING OVER.

APPRECIATE IT, THANKS.

>> Cathy: THANK YOU.

>> CATHY: IN JUST A FEW MINUTES WE'LL HEAR FROM FOUR CANDIDATES WHO WANT TO BE THE NEXT MAYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS.

ONE OF THEM ALREADY HOLDS THE JOB.

THAT WILL START IN ABOUT FIVE MINUTES, BUT, FIRST, MARY LAHAMMER HAS A STORY.

♪♪ >> ERIC: IF ALL HAD GONE AS PLANNED, FRONTLINE WORKERS IN MINNESOTA WOULD HAVE HERO PAY BONUSES IN HAND BY NOW.

THE LEGISLATURE AGREED ON THE AMOUNT, BUT TASKED A COMMITTEE TO COME UP WITH WHO GETS THE EXTRA COVID PAY.

MARY LAHAMMER REPORTS ON HOW COMMITTEE DIFFERENCES CONTINUE TO HOLD UP THE RELEASE OF THE MONEY.

>> Mary: A DOZEN TIMES THESE SELECT LAWMAKERS HAVE COME TOGETHER TO TRY TO SPEND THE $250 MILLION THE FULL LEGISLATURE ALREADY SET ASIDE FOR FRONT-LINE WORKERS.

>> IT'S BEEN A WHILE SINCE WE'VE MET.

IN FACT, WE'RE ABOUT SIX WEEKS PAST THE DEADLINE.

>> Mary: DESPITE ALREADY MISSING THEIR SEPTEMBER DEADLINE, THEY FOUND OUT EVEN WITH AN AGREEMENT, IT WOULD TAKE MONTHS TO GET THE MONEY OUT.

>> I JUST FEEL LIKE THIS IS BEING SLOW WALKED BY THE GOVERNOR TO POSTPONE THIS.

AND NOW ANOTHER THREE MONTHS, WE HEARD FROM LOUISIANA, THEY DID IT IN TWO WEEKS.

>> Mary: THE GOVERNOR OFFICIALLY LAUNCHED HIS RE-ELECTION THIS WEEK, LEANING ON HIS ADMINISTRATION'S RESPONSE TO THE PANDEMIC, AND HE'S STICKING WITH HIS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR.

AND DFL LAWMAKERS WHO WANT FRONT-LINE WORKER PAY DISTRIBUTED TO A BROADER GROUP.

>> I BELIEVE THE GOVERNOR IS PREPARED TO SUPPORT A PROPOSAL THAT RECOGNIZES THE ANY CONTRIBUTIONS DURING THIS VERY DIFFICULT TIME.

>> Mary: COMMITTEE CO-CHAIR HOUSLEY ALSO CHAIRS THE SENATE'S LONG-TERM CARE COMMITTEE AND WAS RECENTLY ELEVATED TO CO-DEPUTY MAJORITY LEADER.

HE WANTS THE FUND FOCUSED ON THE ON THE BRINK LONG-TERM CARE AND HEALTHCARE WORKERS, ALONG WITH FIRST RESPONDERS.

>> NEARLY 70% OF THE DEATHS FROM COVID CAME IN OUR LONG-TERM CARE FACILITIES.

70%.

I HAVE BEEN SCREAMING FROM THE MOUNTAIN TOPS FOR 20 MONTHS NOW THAT THOSE FOLKS IN OUR LONG-TERM CARE FACILITIES HAD THE GREATEST RISK, AND THOSE ARE THE FOLKS, LIKE I SAID, WALKED IN TO WORK EVERY SINGLE DAY, THEY WERE DROPPING LIKE FLIES IN THE ARMS OF THESE PEOPLE THAT WENT TO WORK AND THEY'RE STILL GOING TO WORK.

SO, YOU WIDEN THAT POOL AND YOU'VE JUST LESSENED THE DOLLARS THAT GO TO THOSE FOLKS THAT HAVE BEEN DEALING WITH DEATH AND COVID DAY IN AND DAY OUT, KNOWINGLY.

>> Mary: SENATOR MURPHY IS A NURSE WHO SAYS MANY MORE ESSENTIAL WORKERS FACED SERIOUS RISKS.

>> WE CAN'T SEGREGATE AND EXCLUDE FRONT-LINE WORKERS BECAUSE, WHETHER YOU WERE IN A HOSPITAL OR A MEAT PACKING PLANT OR A GROCERY STORE, YOU WERE ENCOUNTERING THE VIRUS AND WE KNOW THAT BY THE DATA AND WE KNOW PEOPLE GOT SICK, WE KNOW PEOPLE DIED.

SO TO SEGMENT AND SAY, SOME ARE WORTHY AND SOME ARE NOT ISN'T UPHELD BY OUR UNDERSTANDING OF INFECTION CONTROL, IT'S NOT HELD UP BY THE EXPERIENCE OF THE FRONT-LINE WORKERS.

>> Mary: REPUBLICANS SURPRISED DEMOCRATS BY TRYING TO OVE AN OFFER AHEAD TO THE ENTIRE LEGISLATURE TO CONSIDER, BUT DFLers WANT EDUCATION AND FOOD WORKERS INCLUDED.

>> WE ARE REBOUNDING QUICKER THAN ANY OTHER STATE BECAUSE THOSE FOLKS DECIDED THAT THEY WOULD TAKE THAT RISK ON, THEY WOULD CONTINUE TO SHOW UP DAY IN AND DAY OUT TO MAKE URE THEY CAN HELP TAKE CARE OF ALL MINNESOTANS.

AND WE SHOULD NOT FORGET THAT.

AND WE SHOULD HONOR THAT.

WE'VE SEEN SOME OF -- WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE RISK, SOME OF THE HIGHEST SPREAD RATES AND EXPOSURES AND DEATHS HAVE NOT COME IN OUR HOSPITALS, BUT THEY'VE COME FROM THE WORKERS AND SOME OF THOSE -- IN SOME OF THOSE INDUSTRIES THAT YOUR PROPOSAL WANTS TO EXCLUDE.

>> Mary: IN THE END, THE LEADER WITH THE GAVEL MADE IT CLEAR, WITHOUT LAWMAKERS OFFICIALLY IN SESSION, THE WORK HAS TO HAPPEN HERE IN COMMITTEE.

>> IF OUR WORKING ROUP CANNOT REACH AGREEMENT ON THIS PROPOSAL HERE AMONGST US, IT WON'T HAPPEN.

THAT'S JUST THE FACT F LIFE.

AND WITH THAT, WE ARE ADJOURNED.

♪♪ >> CATHY: FOR THE REST OF THE HOUR WE WILL HAVE A DEBATE WITH THE LEADING CANDIDATES FOR MAYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS.

"ALMANAC" IS A STATEWIDE PROGRAM AND WE DON'T OFTEN FEATURE DEBATES FOR CITY OFFICES.

BUT THIS YEAR IS DIFFERENT.

THE MINNEAPOLIS MAYOR'S RACE IS GETTING NATIONAL ATTENTION DUE TO THE PUBLIC SAFETY CHARTER AMENDMENT ON THE BALLOT.

THERE ARE 17 CANDIDATES ON THE MINNEAPOLIS MAYORAL BALLOT.

WE'VE INVITED WHO WE BELIEVE TO BE THE FOUR LEADING CANDIDATES TO JOIN US TONIGHT IN STUDIO.

THE FORMAT WILL BE TYPICAL FOR AN "ALMANAC" DEBATE.

NO TIMED RESPONSES.

NO OPENING STATEMENTS.

NO FORCED FORMALITY.

OUR GOAL, FRANKLY, IS CONVERSATION.

>> ERIC: HOWEVER, THE STAGING WILL LOOK A BIT DIFFERENT.

DEBATE, WE ARE SPREADING OUT ACROSS THE STUDIO TO ENSURE THE SAFETY OF OUR GUESTS DURING THIS TIME OF COVID.

THE CANDIDATES JOINING US TONIGHT, IN ALPHABETICAL ORDER, A.J.

AWED.

HE IS A MEDIATOR AND CO-EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR AT CEDAR-RIVERSIDE COMMUNITY COUNCIL.

JACOB FREY.

HE'S CURRENTLY THE MAYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS.

HE WAS A CITY COUNCIL MEMBER BEFORE THAT.

KATE KNUTH IS A FORMER STATE LAWMAKER.

SHE NOW RUNS A COMPANY CALLED DEMOCRACY AND CLIMATE.

SHEILA NEZHAD JOINS US AS WELL.

SHE'S A COMMUNITY ORGANIZER AND ACTIVIST WITH THE ORGANIZATION RECLAIM THE BLOCK.

WELCOME TO YOU ALL.

THANKS FOR COMING.

IF PAST IS PROLOGUE, I'M GUESSING THAT THE NEW OWNERS OF THE TIMBERWOLVES ARE GOING TO WANT A NEW BASKETBALL ARENA.

AND I WONDER, KATE KNUTH, HOW YOU FEEL IF -- HOW WOULD YOU SUPPORT A SUBSIDY, PUBLIC SUBSIDY, IF IT MEANS THAT'S THE ONLY WAY TO EPP COUP THE TIMBERWOLVES AND THE LYNX IN MINNEAPOLIS?

>> WELL, THANKS FOR THAT QUESTION, ERIC.

YOU KNOW, I THINK THE ISSUE THIS YEAR IN MINNEAPOLIS IS ABSOLUTELY PUBLIC SAFETY AND POLICING.

I'VE ACTUALLY NOT BEEN ASKED DIRECTLY ABOUT THE TIMBERWOLVES UNTIL THIS POINT.

>> Eric: WELL, WE'LL GET TO PUBLIC SAFETY SOON.

>> I APPRECIATE THAT.

BUT I WOULD SAY, I, AS MAYOR, WILL BE FOCUSING ON PUBLIC SAFETY, POLICING, COMING OUT OF THE PANDEMIC, AND TAKING ON THE CLIMATE CRISIS.

AND I DON'T SEE WORKING WITH --ING WITH FOR A NEW STADIUM AS A SIGNIFICANT PART OF THAT.

>> Eric: MAYOR FREY, WHAT DO YOU THINK?

>> WELL, UNLIKE CANDIDATE KATE KNUTH, I HAVE NOT SUPPORTED THE FORM OF CORPORATE SUBSIDIES LIKE SHE DID WHEN SHE VOTED IN FAVOR OF THE VIKINGS STADIUM.

EVERY SINGLE STADIUM DEAL IS DIFFERENT.

BUT, AS MAYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS, WE NEED TO CHART AN HONEST COURSE, WE NEED TO BE CONSISTENT, AND WHAT I WOULD SAY IS, I'LL EAD THE DEAL, WE'LL SEE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE, BUT ULTIMATELY, WE CAN'T HAVE PUBLIC SUBSIDY GOING TO SOME FORM OF PRIVATELY OWNED ENTITY.

>> Eric: SHEILA NEZHAD?

>> I THINK I AGREE WITH ATE ON THIS ONE.

IN THAT PUBLIC SAFETY IS THE TOP ISSUE IN THIS YEAR'S CAMPAIGN, IN WHAT'S FACING MINNEAPOLIS IN THE FOUR YEARS AHEAD, AND I DON'T THINK THAT A STADIUM IS REALLY HIGH ON THE LIST OF PRIORITIES AND WOULD LOVE TO SEE MORE PUBLICLY FUNDED SERVICES FOR THOSE WHO ARE CURRENTLY LIVING OUTSIDE IN MINNEAPOLIS, THOSE ARE SOME OF MY TOP PRIORITIES.

>> Eric: A.J.

AWED?

AGREE WITH ALL THE CANDIDATES ON THE STAGE TODAY THAT THE TOP PRIORITIES ARE PUBLIC SAFETY AND OTHER HOST OF THINGS.

BUT AS THE MAYOR SAID, WHEN IT COMES TO THIS ISSUE, A PUBLIC SUBSIDY SHOULD NOT BE THE WAY FORWARD.

AS AN ADR SPECIALIST, SOMEONE IN MEDIATION, I THINK THE COMMUNITY REALLY NEEDS TO HAVE A BIG STAKE IN THAT CONVERSATION, AND THAT'S THE LEADERSHIP THAT WILL BRING ON ISSUES LIKE THAT.

>> YOU KNOW, IF I COULD ADD SOMETHING.

>> Eric: SURE.

>> ABOUT WHAT I THINK A STADIUM REPRESENTS ABOUT MAYORAL LEADERSHIP AND SOMETHING I'VE ACTUALLY BEEN PRETTY FRUSTRATED BY WITH JACOB FREY.

YOU KNOW, THE STADIUM DEAL CAME TOGETHER WITH THE VIKINGS STADIUM BECAUSE THE GOVERNOR DUG IN, THE AYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS, R.T. RYBAK DUG IN, I REPRESENTED MY HOMETOWN OF NEW BRIGHTON, ND I WAS OFTEN LOOKING TO WHAT MINNEAPOLIS WANTED AND WHAT MINNEAPOLIS EADERSHIP WANTED IN THE WAY I VOTED.

I THOUGHT IT WAS IMPORTANT TO SUPPORT OUR STATE'S BIGGEST CITY.

BUT, YOU KNOW, MAYOR FREY SAYS I'M GOING TO LOOK AT THE DEAL, I'M GOING TO READ IT AND I'M GOING TO DECIDE.

IT'S A MAYOR'S JOB TO HELP US FIND A PATH, SEE A PATH, AND RALLY PEOPLE TO IT.

NOW, I DON'T THINK THAT SHOULD BE ON A STADIUM OVER THE NEXT FEW YEARS.

I THINK IT SHOULD BE ON A NEW, MORE EFFECTIVE PUBLIC SAFETY DEPARTMENT.

I THINK IT SHOULD BE ACTUALLY MEETING THE CLIMATE CRISIS WITH THE URGENCY WE HAVE.

AND WE HAVEN'T SEEN THAT FROM THE MAYOR.

HE'S LET THINGS SWELL AROUND IN A MOMENT OF CRISIS.

IN THIS ABSENCE OF LEADERSHIP, WE HAVE A LOT OF CONFLICT, DESPITE UNITY UNDERNEATH ALL OF THAT.

>> Cathy: I THINK THE MAYOR MIGHT WANT TO RESPOND.

>> I WANT TO RESPOND.

LET'S TALK ABOUT LEADERSHIP.

THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS HAVE BEEN UNPRECEDENTED, UNPREDICTABLE, AND WHATEVER OTHER SUPERLATIVE THAT YOU WANT TO ATTACH.

I, AS MAYOR, HAVE NEEDED TO MAKE DECISIONS AT TIMES VERY PAINFUL DECISIONS.

BUT WE'VE CONTINUED TO SHOW UP.

WE'VE CONTINUED TO ENGAGE COMMUNITIES THAT ARE TRADITIONALLY LEFT BEHIND.

NOW, IF THERE IS A SPECIFIC CRITIQUE, SPECIFIC CRITIQUE THAT YOU WANT TO LEVEL, GO FOR IT.

LET'S HAVE THE DISCUSSION.

AND THE ARGUMENT.

BUT TO THE EXTENT THAT WE'RE JUST GOING TO ENGAGE IN THESE BROAD OVERARCHING COMMENTARY AND JUST KIND OF THE POLITICAL RHETORIC AND THE HASHTAGS AND TALKING POINTS, HAT DOESN'T WORK.

WHAT OUR CITY IS LOOKING FOR RIGHT NOW IS A SERIOUSNESS OF GOVERNANCE.

THEY'RE LOOKING FOR A CLEAR VISION.

THEY'RE LOOKING FOR CONSISTENCY OF POSITION, NOT FLIPPING IT BACK AND FORTH.

THAT IS WHAT I'VE OFFERED, EVEN IN SOME OF THE TOUGHEST OF TIMES.

AND OTHERS CAN PLAY ARMCHAIR QUARTERBACK, BUT I'M GOING TO BE CONSISTENT THROUGHOUT.

>> Cathy: I'M KIND OF CURIOUS, PLEASE HELP ME OUT HERE.

THERE SEEMS TO BE AN ANYONE BUT FREY COALITION THAT HAS BUBBLED UP.

THERE ARE SEVEN MINNEAPOLIS DFL LAWMAKERS, CONGRESSWOMAN OMAR SAYING, PLEASE, VOTE FOR ANYBODY BUT JACOB FREY.

YOU DON'T SEEM TO BE TERRIBLY POPULAR.

WHY DO YOU THINK THAT IS?

>> WELL, IF YOU LOOK AT THE BROAD DIVERSITY AND THE BROAD COALITION THAT WE PUT TOGETHER, WE ARE SUBSTANTIALLY IN THE EAD.

AND IT'S NOT EVEN GOING TO BE CLOSE.

AND WHAT YOU GOT TO MOVE BEYOND IS JUST THE POLITICS.

AND THERE IS A MASSIVE DISJOINT BETWEEN THE POLITICS THAT YOU SEE, FOR INSTANCE, ON SOCIAL MEDIA AND COMING FROM MANY THAT, YES, HAVE PUSHED FOR DEFUNDING THE POLICE VERY PUBLICLY, AND THAT WHICH WE'RE ACTUALLY SEEING ON OUR CITY STREETS.

THERE'S A MASSIVE DISJOINT, AND, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF PEOPLE THAT HAVE BEEN TALKING FOR COMMUNITIES, ESPECIALLY LOWER-INCOME COMMUNITIES THROUGHOUT OUR CITY, I'VE BEEN LISTENING TO THEM, AND I THINK THAT'S THE PRIMARY DIFFERENCE.

>> IF I MAY JUMP IN.

>> Eric: SURE.

>> SO, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT LISTENING TO THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT'S HAPPENING ON THE GROUND AND WHAT'S HAPPENING ON SOCIAL MEDIA, THAT'S WHY MY CAMPAIGN HAS BEEN KNOCKING MORE DOORS THAN ANY OTHER CAMPAIGN.

WE'RE ON TRACK TO KNOCK 30,000 HOUSEHOLDS, AND HALF THE PEOPLE WE TALK TO DON'T KNOW THERE'S AN ELECTION THIS YEAR.

AND, SO, IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO DO THIS OUTREACH AND THAT'S WHY I'VE INVESTED IN THAT ON THE GROUND OUTREACH AND IT IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN WHAT'S GOING ON ON SOCIAL MEDIA.

BUT WHAT'S CONSISTENT IN ALL THE CONVERSATIONS I HAVE IS A DESIRE FOR SERIOUS CHANGE AND SOLUTIONS.

>> YEAH, YOU KNOW, I WOULD AGREE WITH SHEILA ON THAT.

AT THE DOORS, EOPLE ARE JUST REALLY STARTING TO TUNE IN.

THAT IS RAMPING UP.

AND WE HAD A POLL IN THE "STAR TRIBUNE" WITH A 35% APPROVAL RATING OF MAYOR FREY.

AND I THINK THAT REALLY REFLECTS WHAT I'M HEARING AT THE DOORS.

I KNOW YOU ASKED ABOUT SPECIFIC CRITIQUES.

I HAVE SEVERAL SPECIFIC CRITIQUES.

WE HAD THE MURDER OF GEORGE FLOYD, THE UNREST ALMOST A YEAR AND A HALF AGO.

WE AS A CITY HAVE NOT SEEN ACCOUNTABILITY FOR ANY OFFICER.

WE HAVE NOT SEEN AN AFTER-ACTION REVIEW OF WHAT HAPPENED DURING THAT TIME.

SO WE CAN ACTUALLY FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO BETTER.

BECAUSE, UNFORTUNATELY, IN MINNEAPOLIS, WE NEED TO BE PREPARED FOR POLICE KILLING SOMEONE IN OUR CITY AND WHAT HAPPENS AFTER.

>> LET'S TALK ABOUT EACH ONE OF THOSE WITH SPECIFICITY.

>> JACOB, IT'S MY TURN RIGHT NOW.

>> GO FOR IT.

>> POLICE OVERSIGHT S AND ACCOUNTABILITY IS ONE OF THE MOST FUNDAMENTAL ISSUES IN THIS CAMPAIGN.

AND OUR DEPARTMENT OF CIVIL RIGHTS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT DEPARTMENT FOR SOME OF THAT OVERSIGHT.

WE LOST OUR DEPARTMENT, OUR LONGTIME DEPARTMENT OF CIVIL RIGHTS DIRECTOR ABOUT A YEAR AGO.

WE HAD AN INTERIM DIRECTOR MOVE UP, FRANK REID, SERVED FOR SIX MONTHS, LEFT.

WE HAD AN INTERIM DIRECTOR MOVE UP FROM THE OFFICE OF POLICE CONDUCT REVIEW, LEFT SEPTEMBER 30th.

I HONTSLY DON'T -- HONESTLY DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE AN INTERIM DIRECTOR OF OUR OFFICE OF CIVIL RIGHTS OR OFFICE OF POLICE CONDUCT REVIEW.

THIS IS THE OFFICE IN OUR CITY GOVERNMENT THAT INVESTIGATES POLICE MISCONDUCT.

>> Cathy: JACOB.

>> SO LET'S TALK ABOUT EACH ONE OF THESE ISSUES WITH SPECIFICITY BECAUSE YOU NEED SPECIFICITY, NOT JUST RHETORIC.

MISS KNUTH KNOWS VERY WELL THAT THERE ARE STATE LAWS IN PLACE, AND THERE IS NOBODY IN THIS RACE THAT HAS MORE INCENTIVE THAN I TO DISH ON ALL OF THESE DISCIPLINARY DECISIONS, ALL OF THE INVESTIGATIONS, DISCIPLINARY ACTIONS AND TERMINATIONS THAN I DO.

BUT HERE'S THE HING.

IF I DO, WE WILL LITERALLY UNDERMINE OUR ABILITY TO HOLD THESE VERY SAME OFFICERS ACCOUNTABLE.

AND I AM NOT WILLING TO TRADE ACCOUNTABILITY FOR A FEW POLITICAL POINTS.

THAT'S NOT WHO I AM.

SO INSTEAD OF MISLEADING VOTERS, LET'S ACTUALLY TALK ABOUT CHANGING THE STATE LAW, AND BY THE WAY, THIS IS INCREDIBLY RICH COMING FROM MISKNUTH, WHO LITERALLY VOTED TO GUT CIVILIAN OVERSIGHT.

SHE VOTED WITH THE POLICE FEDERATION AND BOB CRIMINAL AND -- KROLL AND AGAINST MAYOR R.T. RYBAK AND THE CITY COUNCIL.

IT'S A CRITICAL POINT.

IT'S A CRITICAL POINT OF HER PLATFORM.

>> Eric: HE'LL HAVE MORE TIME TO TALK PUBLIC SAFETY AND GET YOU BACK.

>> CAN I JUMP IN?

BEFORE WE JUST LEAVE ON THAT PUBLIC SAFETY QUESTION, BECAUSE I'M HEARING A LOT FROM THE OTHER CANDIDATES, ESPECIALLY JACOB FREY IS TALKING ABOUT SPECIFICS.

I MEAN, I'M NOT GOING TO W THE SPECIFICS THAT KATE JUST ELABORATED ON.

BUT LET'S ALL BE HONEST, MINNEAPOLIS.

THE BURNING THE THIRD PRECINCT WAS NOT NECESSARY.

AND WE KNOW, AND I PERSONALLY BELIEVE, AS MUCH AS A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THE CITY, RIGHT, WE HAD HALF A BILLION, NEARLY HALF A BILLION IN DAMAGES IN BIPoC BUSINESSES, ALL RIGHT.

THIS IS A SPECIFIC AND FAILED LEADERSHIP.

MINNEAPOLIS, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PUBLIC SAFETY, THE APPROACH IS NOT, LIKE MY OTHER OPPONENTS, SHEILA AND KATE THAT ARE PROPOSING TO SAY YES FOR MINNEAPOLIS.

THAT'S NOT THE WAY TO BUILD TRUST.

COMMUNITIES OF COLOR HAVE TRIGGERED AN UPRISING, TRIGGERED A RACIAL RECKONING, FOR THEIR VOICES TO BE HEARD.

YET, WE HAVE AN MENDMENT THAT KEPT THEIR VOICES SILENT.

THAT IS THE REALITY, MINNEAPOLIS.

AND THE ONLY WAY THAT WE MOVE FORWARD IS REALLY TO BRING THOSE COMMUNITIES TOGETHER.

AND I'M THE ONLY CANDIDATE ON THIS TAGE THAT'S OFFERING THE MECHANISM TO DO THAT, WHICH IS THE CITY'S CITIZENS ASSEMBLY.

SO IF WE REALLY WANT TO TALK ABOUT BUILDING TRUST, IF WE REALLY WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT HARD WORK, AND LET'S NOT ALL JUST BLAME IT ON JACOB FREY.

THE CITY COUNCIL IS JUST AS -- AS MAYOR FREY IN HE REMEMBERS IT OF ETTING THE CITY DOWN.

>> Eric: LET'S GET SHEILA NEZHAD, THE ISSUE IS POLICE ACCOUNTABILITY.

>> YEAH, BSOLUTELY.

I THINK THAT RIGHT NOW IS THE MOMENT FOR MINNEAPOLIS TO EXPAND THE CONVERSATION FROM POLICING TO SAFETY, RIGHT?

WE'VE BEEN JUST TALKING ABOUT HOW CAN WE CHANGE POLICE, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO ABOUT POLICE.

BUT WE'RE IN A PUBLIC SAFETY CRISIS IN MINNEAPOLIS.

AND WE TALK ABOUT WHAT IT TAKES TO BUILD SAFETY.

YOU HAVE TO TALK ABOUT EVERYONE AS A HOME.

EVERYONE HAS ACCESS TO MENTAL HEALTHCARE.

KIDS HAVE A SAFE PLACE TO BE AFTER SCHOOL.

AND SCHOOLS AND SOCIAL SERVICES ARE THE THINGS WE'VE BEEN DEFUNDING FOR YEARS WHILE WE'VE BEEN POURING MORE MONEY INTO POLICING AND PRISONS AND JAILS.

SO I THINK RIGHT NOW IS THE TIME TO DEMILITARIZE POLICING, TO DECRIMINALIZE DRUGS AND SEX WORK AND HOMELESSNESS-RELATED CRIMES AND BUILD UP ALTERNATIVES, LIKE MENTAL HEALTH RESPONDER TEAMS IN ORDER TO BUILD SAFETY IN MINNEAPOLIS.

>> Eric: MAYOR, YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.

IT IS YOUR CALL.

AND I WONDER IF YOU'RE GOING TO WANT TO DEFEND YOUR RECORD IN YOUR TERM HERE.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT OUR RECORD, AND I HAVE WORKED CLOSELY EVERY SINGLE DAY WITH CHIEF ARRADONDO, WE HAVE OFFERED A LITANY OF CHANGES.

AND IT'S EVERYTHING FROM BRINGING BODY CAMERA COMPLIANCE FROM 55% WHEN I TOOK OFFICE TO 95% TODAY.

IT'S OVERHAULING OUR USE OF FORCE POLICY TO MAKE IT AS STRINGENT AS POSSIBLE UNDER STATE LAW.

IT'S GETTING RID OF SOME OF THESE LOWER-LEVEL PRETEXT STOPS, LIKE AN AIR FRESHENER HANGING FROM THE REARVIEW MIRROR OR LICENSE PLATE TABS AS THE PRIMARY REASON FOR STOPS.

IT'S INSTITUTING ABLE TRAINING, IT'S INSISTING THAT WE HAVE AN EARLY INTERVENTION SYSTEM SO THAT WE'RE ABLE TO CESS -- SUSS OUT SOME OF THESE DIFFICULT SCENARIOS BEFORE THEY BECOME MISCONDUCT.

ALL OF THESE THINGS REQUIRE SPECIFICS.

AND I ACTUALLY AGREE WITH SHEILA ON THE POINT HAT WE NEED MENTAL HEALTH RESPONDERS, THAT WE NEED SOCIAL WORKERS, THAT NOT EVERY SINGLE CALL REQUIRES RESPONSE FROM AN OFFICER WITH A GUN.

AND SIMULTANEOUSLY WE DO, IN FACT, NEED POLICE OFFICERS.

AND WE HAVE FEWER FFICERS PER CAPITA THAN JUST ABOUT ANY MAJOR CITY IN THE ENTIRE COUNTRY RIGHT NOW.

SHEILA'S BEEN REMARKABLY CONSISTENT ON THIS TOPIC, ALTHOUGH WE ADAMANTLY DISAGREE.

OTHERS HAVE FLIPPED THEIR POSITION BACK AND FORTH EXECUTIVE ON WHICH WAY THE POLITICAL -- DEPENDING ON WHICH WAY THE POLITICAL WINDS ARE BLOWING.

AS MAYOR -- HANG ON.

AS MAYOR, YOU DO NEED TO KEEP A CONSISTENT POSITION REGARDLESS OF WHICH WAY THE POLITICAL WINDS ARE BLOWING.

THAT IS CRITICAL COMPONENT OF LEADERSHIP, ESPECIALLY DURING DIFFICULT TIMES.

>> Cathy: KATE KNUTH.

>> I'VE BEEN HEARING THIS CRITIQUE ABOUT FLIP-FLOPPING AND NOT BEING CONSISTENT.

AND I ACTUALLY AM NOT REALLY SURE WHAT THE MAYOR'S TALKING ABOUT.

YOU KNOW, I -- >> I'M HAPPY TO DESCRIBE.

>> I HAVE BEEN CLEAR SINCE DAY ONE OF MY CAMPAIGN THAT I SUPPORT THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY AND A CHARTER AMENDMENT TO CREATE IT.

I HAVE EEN CLEAR THAT I SUPPORT AND WOULD CHAMPION POLICE AS PART OF THAT DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY.

I PRINTED AN OP ED IN THE "STAR TRIBUNE" BEFORE THE POLLS CAME OUT THAT SHOWED MINNEAPOLIS RESIDENTS DON'T WANT THE STATUS QUO IN POLICING AND THEY WANT POLICE ON OUR STREETS.

THE REASON WE'RE DOWN IN POLICE NUMBERS RIGHT NOW IS NOT BECAUSE OF FUNDING.

I'VE COMMITTED TO FUNDING THE EXACT SAME NUMBER OF OFFICERS YOU'VE FUNDED IN YOUR BUDGET THIS YEAR.

WE'RE DOWN ECAUSE OF MISMANAGEMENT.

AND I HAVE A COUPLE QUESTIONS ABOUT MISMANAGEMENT.

>> I'M HAPPY TO EXPLAIN.

YOU ASKED JUST A SECOND AGO WHY THE AREAS YOU FLIP-FLOPPED, LET ME TELL YOU EXACTLY WHERE YOU FLIP-FLOPPED.

>> AND I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THE CIVIL RIGHTS DEPARTMENT.

>> AS A STATE LEGISLATOR, SHE VOTED TO GET RID OF CIVILIAN OVERSIGHT.

NOW IT'S A CRITICAL COMPONENT OF HER VISION.

FIRST.

SECOND, BACK IN MARCH AND APRIL, SHE SAID ON A QUESTIONNAIRE THAT SHE SUPPORTED, QUOTE, DEFUNDING THE POLICE AND IN FAVOR OF A NEW APPROACH.

THIRD, SHE HAS CONSISTENTLY BEEN ADVOCATING, EVEN WHEN WE WERE BACK AT 630 OFFICERS, THAT WE NEEDED TO FURTHER REDUCE RESOURCES TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.

BY THE WAY, THE RESOURCES ALL GO FOR THE MOST PART, TOWARDS PERSONNEL COSTS.

NOW SHE WANTS TO ADD MORE OFFICERS.

I DON'T KNOW.

NO MATTER HOW YOU BREAK IT DOWN, THAT IS A CHANGE.

AND AS MAYOR, YOU NEED TO BE CONSISTENT IN YOUR APPROACH.

AND BACK WHEN I HAD 1,500 PEOPLE THAT WERE PROTESTING AT MY DOOR, I TOLD THEM THE TRUTH.

IT DIDN'T TICKLE.

IT WAS TOUGH.

BUT IT WAS THE TRUTH.

THAT IS THE CONSISTENCY THAT YOU NEED IN MAYORAL LEADERSHIP.

[ OVERLAPPING CONVERSATION ] >> Cathy: I WANT A RESPONSE FROM KATE AND THEN I WANT TO HEAR FROM A.J.

AWED.

>> YOU KNOW, IT'S SURPRISING, BECAUSE I THINK THE MAYOR IS MISREPRESENTING MY POSITION.

I HAVE VERY CLEAR AND CONSISTENT IN MY SUPPORT OF A DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY.

AND I'M ACTUALLY CONCERNED ABOUT WHERE THE MAYOR'S POSITION IS RIGHT NOW.

YOU'VE SAID YOU SUPPORT THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY BUT YOU DON'T SUPPORT HE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY CHARTER AMENDMENT.

YOU SAID YOU DON'T SUPPORT THE RENT CONTROL CHARTER AMENDMENT.

AND IT'S UNCLEAR TO ME, AS A RESIDENT OF THE CITY, WHERE YOU ACTUALLY STAND AND NOT HOW YOU'RE GOING TO DECIDE ONCE THE CITY HAS DECIDED.

IT'S THE MAYOR'S JOB TO LEAD US ON A PATH.

THAT IS NOT A -- THAT IS NOT CLEAR TO ME AS A MINNEAPOLIS RESIDENT.

>> Cathy: I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO HEAR FROM A.J.

AWED ON THE PUBLIC SAFETY ISSUE HERE.

A.J., 54 PEOPLE UNDER THE AGE OF 18 WERE SHOT THIS YEAR IN MINNEAPOLIS.

AND MURDERS ARE UP IN THE CITY.

WHAT WOULD YOU DO ABOUT THIS?

>> FIRST, WE NEED TO GET JACOB FREY OUT OF THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS SO WE CAN CTUALLY BRING CONFIDENCE BACK TO WHATEVER DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY OR MPD THAT WE HAVE IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS.

AND REALITY IS, BECAUSE OF CERTAIN MEMBERS, PERFORMATIVE PROGRESSIVES IS WHAT I CALL THEM, BUT CERTAIN MEMBERS OF THIS CITY, AND I WOULD SAY SPECIAL INTERESTS, HAVE REALLY TURNED UP THE FLAMES ON THIS CONVERSATION.

THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE A VERY NUANCED CONVERSATION TAILORED TO REALLY GIVING DIGNITY AND GIVING RESPECT AND EQUALITY TO COMMUNITIES -- FOR COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, BUT IN PARTICULAR, THE BLACK COMMUNITY IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS.

AND INSTEAD OF HAVING THE HONEST AND HARD CONVERSATION, WHAT WE'RE HAVING IS A FORCE-FEEDING OF POLICIES, WE'RE HAVING BICKERING ABOUT TRYING TO SEE REDEMPTION, AND WE'RE OBJECTS YOU ALSO HAVE NOT DOING THE -- OBVIOUSLY NOT DOING THE WORK OF THE PEOPLE.

REMEMBER, MINNEAPOLIS, THE NEXT MAYOR HAS TO ENLIST THAT TRUST.

NOW TO THE POINT THAT JACOB MADE ABOUT KATE, THE REASON WHY I DON'T PERSONALLY TRUST KATE IS BECAUSE SHE FLIP-FLOPPED AND ACTUALLY THE VOICE OF RACIAL EQUITY WILL BE TESTAMENT TO THAT.

THEY HAD A "B" RATING IN THE STATE LEGISLATURE AND IT DROPPED DOWN TO A D QOAGHT RATING IN RACIAL EQUITY.

NOW, COMMUNITIES OF COLOR, WHO ARE LOOKING FOR A MAYOR THAT'S ACTUALLY GOING TO STAND BY, MAKE SURE THAT THEIR VOICES ARE HEARD, DO NOT NEED THOSE TYPE OF INCONSISTENCIES.

AND, IN FACT, THEY NEED SOMEONE THAT HAS THE LIVED EXPERIENCE TO ACTUALLY BRING THEIR VOICES TO THE BUREAUCRACIES OF CITY HALL.

>> Eric: SHEILA NEZHAD.

>> I JUST HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF FLIP-FLOPPING A COUPLE TIMES.

AND I WANT TO BE CLEAR ABOUT THIS VOTE IN 2012.

AND, YOU KNOW, IN 2012, THIS CHANGE IN OVERSIGHT OF OUR POLICING WAS PRESENTED, MAKING A SHIFT OF TO BEING MORE EFFECTIVE, IT'S WHY I VOTED FOR IT.

I ABSOLUTELY BELIEVE AND WILL PUSH HARD FOR EFFECTIVE OVERSIGHT AND ACCOUNTABILITY OF POLICE.

IT WAS PASSED IN 2012, SIGNED BY GOVERNOR DAYTON.

AND I'VE LEARNED IN THE LAST NINE YEARS THAT THE SYSTEM WE HAVE NOW WITHOUT THAT IVILIAN OVERSIGHT IS NOT AS EFFECTIVE AS WE NEED AND, SO, ABSOLUTELY, I'VE LEARNED AND I'VE CHANGED BASED ON THE RESEARCH AND EXPERIENCE OF OUR STATE IN THE LAST NINE YEARS.

>> Eric: SHEILA NEZHAD, YOUR GROUP WAS VERY CRITICAL TO FORMING THE CHARTER AMENDMENT QUESTION ABOUT HAVING A PUBLIC SAFETY DEPARTMENT AND POLICE OFFICERS, IF NECESSARY.

I WONDER, THOUGH, THE RACIAL XOABT IN -- COMPONENT IN MINNEAPOLIS, IF I HAVE THE STATISTICS RIGHT, 85% OF THE GUN VICTIMS HAVE BEEN BLACK AND 85% OF THE PERPETRATORS HAVE BEEN BLACK.

AND I WONDER HOW THIS AMENDMENT, IF IT PASSED, WOULD CHANGE OR AFFECT THAT COMPONENT OF THE CRIME SITUATION IN MINNEAPOLIS?

>> YES.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THAT QUESTION.

SO, A BIG MOTIVATION FOR THIS NEW DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY IS TO BE ABLE TO INVEST MORE IN VIOLENCE PREVENTION AND WRAP-AROUND SERVICES.

USING THE RESOURCES THAT ARE CURRENTLY TIED UP IN MILITARIZATION.

DID YOU KNOW WE SPEND $3 MILLION A YEAR ON THE K-9 UNIT ALONE?

$800,000 ON THE OUNTED PATROL?

ALL OF THOSE CAN GO INTO SUPPORTING DIRECT SERVICES FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN GUN VIOLENCE WHO ARE AT RISK OF BEING INVOLVED IN GUN VIOLENCE.

WE HAVE PROGRAMS EXISTING IN THE CITY, BUT THEY'RE JUST FUNDED AT A REALLY SMALL AMOUNT, LIKE $100,000.

AND WE NEED A LOT MORE, RIGHT.

SO HE GROUP VIOLENCE INTERVENTION PROGRAM IS NOW IN NORTH MINNEAPOLIS AND IT NEEDS TO BE ABLE TO EXPAND ALL OVER THE CITY AND WE REALLY NEED YOUTH PROGRAMMING.

I WAS TALKING WITH NEIGHBORS AROUND GEORGE FLOYD SQUARE YESTERDAY AND THEY SAID, WE FEEL LIKE THE CITY HAS ABANDONED US.

AND A 15-YEAR-OLD WAS SHOT THERE EARLIER THAT WEEK.

AND THEY'RE HEARING GUNSHOTS IN THEIR ALLEY ALL THE TIME.

AND I ASKED THEM, WHEN YOU SEE FOLKS, WHO IS IT?

AND THEY SAID, IT'S ALWAYS KIDS.

IT'S ALWAYS YOUNG KIDS.

AND THAT'S WHY, AS MAYOR, I'M GOING TO FUND YOUTH PROGRAMMING AND YOUTH JOBS AT THE SCALE WE NEED IGHT OW.

>> Cathy: MAYOR FREY, BEFORE WE SWITCH FOCUS HERE, I'M CURIOUS, YOU KNOW, YOU WOULD AGREE THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE REFORM WITHIN THE MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT.

BUT YOU STILL HAVE THE POLICE UNION TO DEAL WITH.

SO HOW -- THEY'RE A POWERFUL UNION STILL.

AND IF YOU WANT TO MAKE CHANGE, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO SOMEHOW GO THROUGH THEM, RIGHT?

>> THERE ARE ANY BARRIERS TO CHANGE.

THERE ARE THINGS THAT WE CAN DO UNILATERALLY THROUGH THE CITY, AND I DON'T THINK THERE'S A MAYOR IN THE ENTIRE COUNTRY THAT IS CONTENT WITH THE PACE OF PROGRESS.

THERE ARE BARRIERS IN TERMS OF THE POLICE FEDERATION, AND, BELIEVE ME, I'VE HAD MORE THAN A FEW RUN-INS WITH THEM.

THERE ARE ALSO BARRIERS IN THE FORM OF STATE LAW.

AND YOU GOT MAYORS AND CHIEFS AROUND THE COUNTRY THAT ARE SCREAMING FROM THE ROOFTOPS ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR ISSUE OF ARBITRATION.

RIGHT NOW, WHEN THE CHIEF OR I FIRE OR DISCIPLINE AN OFFICER, AROUND 50% OF THE TIME THAT DECISION IS OVERTURNED BY MANDATORY ARBITRATION THAT IS REQUIRED BY STATE LAW.

AND THAT OFFICER GETS SENT RIGHT BACK TO THE DEPARTMENT TO CONTINUE VIOLATING TRUST.

BY THE WAY, THAT DOESN'T EVEN INCLUDE THE INSTANCES WHEN WE WOULD LIKE TO DISCIPLINE OR TERMINATE AN OFFICER, BUT WE TALK TO THE CITY ATTORNEYS, THEY SAY, WELL, YOU CAN, BUT ULTIMATELY YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE.

THIS HAS TO BE A CRITICAL COMPONENT OF THE CHANGE THAT WE NEED TO SEE.

IS IT THE ONLY ONE?

NO, IT IS NOT.

WE ALL NEED TO WORK FASTER.

WE NEED TO DO MORE.

AND WE NEED TO GET SERIOUS ABOUT THE WORK AHEAD.

AND THAT WORK CAN'T BE REDUCED TO EITHER A SLOGAN OR QUESTION 2 FOR THAT MATTER, BECAUSE QUESTION 2 HAS NOTHING IN IT ABOUT ACCOUNTABILITY OR REFORM.

SPECIFIC ISSUES THAT PEOPLESE- ARE EXPERIENCING EVERY SINGLE DAY WITHIN OUR DEPARTMENT.

SO, AGAIN, LET'S DO THE REAL WORK.

IT'S HARD BUT YOU CAN BE IN IT EVERY SINGLE DAY.

>> Cathy: I THINK OF A.J.

WANTS TO SAY SOMETHING.

WE'RE GOING TO MOVE ON.

>> MAYOR FREY IS COMPLETELY ACCURATE, I'VE BEEN JUST AS STRONG AS SAYING WE SHOULD NOT VOTE YES ON NUMBER 2.

>> Eric: NUMBER 2 IS THE ONE THAT WOULD CREATE A DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY.

ALL RIGHT.

>> AND FOR ME, A WHOLE HOST OF REASONS, I URGE VOTERS TO REALLY WATCH KARE-11 11'S TAKE WITH NEKIMA AND BLACK LEADERS ON IT, NEKIMA HIT IT SPOT ON.

LET'S GET BACK TO WHAT JACOB FREY SAID.

LEADERSHIP REQUIRES YOU TO LEAD.

AND THE NEXT MAYOR NEEDS TO LEAD THE CITY.

FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, THERE'S A MINNEAPOLIS FOR A BETTER POLICE CONTRACT.

THERE'S AN ORGANIZATION, EXPERTS IN THE COMMUNITY.

NOW, PERSONALLY, AS AN ADR EXPERT, ARBITRATION IS ONE OF THEM, RIGHT.

AND JACOB KNOWS JUST AS WELL AS I KNOW, THIS IS ALL CONTRACT BASED.

AND ONE OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS T ORGANIZATION HAS MADE IS TO HAVE A RESET CLAUSE WITHIN THE ACTUAL CONTRACT.

CITY COUNCIL WOULD ACTUALLY BE WILLING TO DO IT FROM ALL THE TALKS THAT WE HAVE A PROGRESSIVE CITY COUNCIL.

BUT WHAT WE NEED IS A LEADER THAT'S ACTUALLY GOING TO STAY COMMITTED TO IT.

BECAUSE THESE CHANGES THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IN RESETTING, RIGHT, THOSE BAD PRECEDENTS AND GETTING THEM OUT OF THE WAY AND MAKING SURE THAT WE HAVE A RUBRIC OR A METRIC, RIGHT, THAT ACTUALLY MAKES CONSISTENCY THROUGHOUT THE DISCIPLINARY PROCESS.

THAT'S AN EASY FIX.

IT JUST REQUIRES LEADERSHIP.

IT REQUIRES SOMEONE WHO'S CONSISTENT ON IT AND HO ACTUALLY HAS THE CREDIBILITY TO GO INTO DIFFERENT COMMUNITY COUNCIL MEMBERS' TERRITORIES AND SAY, THIS IS OMETHING THAT YOU WANT, NOW LET'S GET IT DONE.

AND LET'S BLOCK THAT CONTRACT IF IT DOES NOT HAVE THAT CLAUSE.

AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT I JUST DON'T SEE FROM OUR CURRENT MAYOR.

>> Eric: I TOTALLY ARBITRARILY PICKED FOUR ISSUES THAT EACH OF YOU KIND OF HAVE CHAMPIONED, AS I DID MY USUAL MINIMAL RESEARCH.

AND KATE KNUTH, LET ME START WITH YOU.

CLIMATE CHANGE.

GIVE US LIKE A MINUTE, 90 SECONDS ON WHAT THE CITY WOULD DO WITH CLIMATE CHANGE UNDER YOUR LEADERSHIP.

>> MINNEAPOLIS HAS DONE SOME GOOD WORK ON LIMATE CHANGE, BUT OUR MAYOR HAS NOT MADE IT A PRIORITY, AND WE HAVEN'T SCALED UP THE LEVEL OF ACTION WE NEED.

I PUT OUT A MINNEAPOLIS GREEN NEW DEAL THAT WILL INCREASE INNOVATION IN TERMS OF EMISSIONS REDUCTION, CENTERS FOR ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE AND BE PREPARED FOR THE CLIMATE CHANGE THAT IS ALREADY HERE.

I THINK THIS IS A PART THAT WE DON'T TALK ABOUT AS OFTEN.

LAST SUMMER, YOU WERE JUST TALKING WITH THE COMMISSIONER ABOUT THE DROUGHT, LAST SUMMER THERE WAS HEAT WAVES, THERE WAS DROUGHT, THERE WAS WILDFIRE SMOKE, WE HAD TO DECIDE AS PARENTS IF WE COULD LET OUR KIDS UT -- GO OUT IN PLAY.

IN 2018, I WAS WORKING FOR THE CITY AS CHIEF RESILIENCE OFFICER, I TOLD THE MAYOR, WE DON'T HAVE A RESILIENCE STRATEGY.

I TOLD HIM THAT'S A PROBLEM AND I AGREED.

WE HAVEN'T UPDATED OUR CLIMATE ACTION PLAN SINCE 2013 IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS.

AND St. PAUL HAS A CLIMATE RESILIENCE STRATEGY THAT CAME OUT IN 2019.

WE'RE BEHIND.

BECAUSE WE'RE BEHIND ON CLIMATE, WE'RE LESS AFE.

>> Eric: ALL RIGHT, MAYOR, AT YOUR INAUGURAL SPEECH, I HAPPENED TO BE THERE, AND YOU HAD THE CROWD CHANT, HOUSING IS A RIGHT.

GOING FORWARD HERE, WHAT'S ON THE AGENDA FOR YOU IN HOUSING?

>> EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE THAT SAFE PLACE TO GO HOME TO AT THE END OF THE NIGHT, TO REST THEIR HEAD ON THE PILLOW AND TO REJUVENATE FOR THE NEXT DAY.

AND WE HAVEN'T JUST BEEN TALKING, WE'VE BEEN ACTING, WHEN I TOOK OFFICE, WE INVESTED MORE THAN EVER BEFORE IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

ABOUT THREE TIMES THE PREVIOUS RECORD.

MORE PER CAPITA BASIS THAN ALMOST ANY CITY IN THE ENTIRE COUNTRY.

AND THE RESULTS ARE CLEAR.

WE SAW ABOUT SEVEN TIMES THE AMOUNT OF LOW-INCOME HOUSING, DEEPLY AFFORDABLE HOUSING THAN WE PREVIOUSLY SAW N AN ANNUAL BASIS.

STABLE HOMES, STABLE SCHOOLS, WHICH HAS NOW SUCCESSFULLY HOUSED ABOUT 3,100 KIDS IN OUR MINNEAPOLIS PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM.

BY THE WAY, 95% OF WHOM ARE OF COLOR.

ALL OF THE OTHER CANDIDATES THAT I'M AWARE OF HAVE ACTUALLY ADOPTED THIS POLICY AND HAVE SAID THAT THEY WANT TO EXPAND IT.

I AGREE.

BUT IT'S NOT JUST ADOPTING A POLICY IN THE RHETORIC, YOU ALSO NEED TO DO THE WORK TO GET THESE PROGRAMS SET UP.

WE HAVE.

WE DELIVERED AT RECORD NUMBERS.

BY THE WAY, WE NEED AND WILL DO MORE.

>> Eric: THANKS.

>> Cathy: SHEILA NEZHAD, YOU ARE PASSIONATE ABOUT THE PEOPLE'S BUDGET.

EXPLAIN THAT, PLEASE.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

SO, BUDGETING IS MY VERY FAVORITE THING TO DO.

I LIKE TO SAY THAT MY MOTTO IS FROM THE STREETS TO THE SPREADSHEETS.

AND LAST YEAR WE WORKED ON A COLLABORATIVE BUDGET CALLED THE PEOPLE'S BUDGET.

AND IT STARTED WITH ASKING EVERYDAY FOLKS, WHAT DO YOU NEED?

WHAT DO YOU NEED TO SURVIVE AND THRIVE IN MINNEAPOLIS RIGHT NOW?

AND WE TOOK HUNDREDS OF CONVERSATIONS AND WORKING WITH DIFFERENT SMALL BUSINESSES AND GROUPS ACROSS THE CITY TO DEVELOP A BUDGET WHICH WE PRESENTED AS WAY TO FUND SAFETY IN MINNEAPOLIS, THROUGH HOUSING, THROUGH HEALTH, THROUGH HARM REDUCTION SERVICES, AND TO SPECIFIC BUDGET ITEMS THAT THE CITY COUNCIL COULD ENACT.

NOW, WE DIDN'T GET A LOT OF THAT PASSED, UNFORTUNATELY, IN FACT, WE HAD TO FIGHT TOOTH AND NAIL TO JUST GET THESE TWO TEAMS, TWO PEOPLE FOR MENTAL HEALTH RESPONDER TEAMS.

IT'S A BIG PART OF WHY I'M RUNNING FOR MAYOR IS I SEE THE POSSIBILITIES IN HAT WE CAN FUND.

>> Eric: OKAY.

DIDN'T MEAN TO INTERRUPT.

LET'S MOVE ON.

Mr.

AWED, I WAS INTRIGUED AND INTERESTED IN THE FACT THAT OU ACTUALLY COME UP WITH A WAY TO PAY FOR SOMETHING IN MINNEAPOLIS.

THAT IS WITH THE HIGH-INCOME RENTERS TAX.

COULD YOU TELL US ABOUT THAT?

>> YEAH.

AND I SHOULD MAKE THE DISCLAIMER THAT WE DON'T CURRENTLY HAVE THAT AUTHORITY IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS.

STATE PREEMPTIONS PREVENTS US FROM DOING THAT.

BUT THIS IS THE TYPE OF LEADERSHIP THAT I DO WANT TO INFUSE IN THE CITY, IN THE CULTURAL POLITICS.

I THINK RIGHT NOW THE CURRENT MAYOR'S REALLY USING A LOT OF U.S. AID FUNDS FROM THE FEDS AND A LOT OF TATE FUNDING TO REALLY BUILD MOST OF THESE PROGRAMS.

THESE ARE SHORT TERM.

THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT'S SUSTAINABLE.

FOR ME, I'M URGING THE PEOPLE OF MINNEAPOLIS TO REALLY DO MORE.

AND THIS IS A WAY FOR US, WHEN WE HAVE LESS HOUSING, I SHOULD SAY, A SHORTAGE IN BASE OF TAXES FROM PROPERTY TAXES, AND THERE'S MORE IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS, MANY OF THESE PROPERTY DEVELOPMENTS, A LOT OF LUXURY APARTMENTS, WHO PEOPLE CAN'T AFFORD.

AND NOW I THINK RENTERS THAT ARE GOING TO BE IN THE CITY THAT ARE MOVING FROM THE COAST, THAT ARE OPTING IN TO LIVING IN THESE LUXURY APARTMENTS, WHICH ARE INCENTIVISING, I WOULD SAY, GENT TRIIFICATION, AND DISPLACEMENT THAT WE ACTUALLY ASK THEM TO PAY MORE.

AND THAT WAY I THINK WE'LL BE ABLE TO DO A LOT OF THE THINGS, NOT JUST BUILD AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I'M NOT A BIG FAN OF THAT.

I'M A FAN OF PUBLIC HOUSING BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY WAY TO KEEP THINGS ACTUALLY AFFORDABLE.

AND TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT, WE NEED MORE TAXES, NOT ONLY ON JUST THAT FRONT, RIGHT?

WE EED, JUST AS JACOB SAID, WE NEED A MAYOR THAT'S GOING TO REALLY PUSH THE STATE TO GIVE US MORE AUTHORITY, MORE CREATIVITY WHEN IT COMES TO POLICING IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS.

AND THAT'S WHAT WE REALLY NEED.

WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO ASK FOR IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS, AND THE STATE SHOULD REALLY BE MORE, I WOULD SAY, ACCOMMODATING TO THESE REQUESTS.

>> Cathy: SAY, A LITTLE BIT ABOUT POLITICAL QUESTION.

THIS WAS IN THE NEWS.

KATE KNUTH AND SHEILA NEZHAD, YOU BOTH PLEDGED TO RANK EACH OTHER AS THE SECOND CHOICE, YOU'RE ENCOURAGING YOUR SUPPORTERS TO DO THE SAME.

IS THAT THE PROPER WAY OF THE RANK CHOICE VOTING SYSTEM?

>> I THINK IT'S VERY CLEAR THAT MINNEAPOLIS RESIDENTS ARE READY FOR NEW MAYORAL LEADERSHIP.

ALMOST HALF OF THE LEGISLATIVE DELEGATION, CONGRESSWOMAN OMAR, I'VE GOT ENDORSEMENTS OF FIVE SITTING CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, THEY'RE SAYING, WE NEED STRONGER, MORE EFFECTIVE LEADERSHIP IN THE MAYOR'S OFFICE.

AND I THINK IT'S CLEAR THAT THE CITY'S READY TO MOVE FORWARD ON A DIFFERENT PATH.

AND WE HAVE RANK CHOICE VOTING.

AND, SO, WE GET TO HAVE -- WE GET TO HAVE COALITIONS, WE GET TO TALK WITH VOTERS AND SHARE THAT WE'RE FRUSTRATED WITH CURRENT LEADERSHIP.

I THINK SHEILA AND I HAVE A SHARED VISION OF A DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY, WE DISAGREE ON SOME PARTS OF THAT VISION, OF COURSE.

BUT WE ARE READY TO DIG IN AND OFFER THE LEADERSHIP THAT MINNEAPOLIS NEEDS RIGHT NOW.

>> Cathy: SHEILA NEZHAD?

>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

I ECHO WHAT KATE SAID.

I THINK WE HAVE A SHARED VALUE OF NEEDING NEW LEADERSHIP IN THE CITY.

AND I'LL ALSO SAY, A LOT OF SUPPORTERS I TALK TO ARE CONFUSED ABOUT RANK CHOICE VOTING.

AND IT IS GOOD TO RANK YOUR BALLOT AND KATE AND I ARE ALIGNED ON QUESTION 2.

WE'RE ACTUALLY ALIGNED ON ALL THE QUESTIONS NOW.

AND, SO, IT'S REALLY BEEN HELPFUL FOR OUR SUPPORTERS AS WELL TO BE ABLE TO HAVE SOME GUIDANCE ON, YOU KNOW, WHO THEY SHOULD RANK SECOND ON THEIR BALLOT.

>> Eric: MAYOR, HOW ARE YOU HANDLING ALL THIS INCOMING?

>> WELL, AS MAYOR, ESPECIALLY OVER THE LAST COUPLE YEARS, YOU DO, IN FACT, DEVELOP THICK SKIN.

AND YOU ALSO GET TO UNDERSTAND THAT THE POLITICO CONVERSATION IS ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THAN THE CONVERSATION THAT PEOPLE ARE HAVING ON THE GROUND.

AND I AM VERY CONFIDENT THAT AS WE MOVE FORWARD TO LECTION DAY, IT WON'T JUST BE A WIN FOR US, BUT IT WILL BE A SIGNIFICANT ONE.

BECAUSE WE'VE ACTUALLY BEEN TALKING TO PEOPLE.

WE'VE BEEN MEETING PEOPLE WHERE THEY'RE AT.

I AM A PROPONENT OF RANK CHOICE VOTING, AVE LONG BEEN ONE BECAUSE I THINK IT GIVES YOU THE ABILITY TO VOTE YOUR CONSCIENCE REGARDLESS OF THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THAT PARTICULAR INDIVIDUAL TO ULTIMATELY WIN THE RACE.

BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, I THINK PEOPLE ARE CLEARLY ASKING FOR CONSISTENCY, THEY'RE ASKING FOR A STEADY APPROACH, THEY'RE ASKING FOR POLITICIANS, ESPECIALLY MAYOR, TO BE HONEST REGARDLESS OF WHERE THE POLITICAL INDS HAVE BLOWN.

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WE'VE OFFERED.

AND WHAT WE'LL DO.

>> Cathy: A.J., ARE YOU ASKING YOUR SUPPORTERS TO PUT A SPECIFIC PERSON SECOND?

>> UNFORTUNATELY, I'M NOT.

AND THAT'S REALLY BECAUSE I COULD NOT IN GOOD CONSCIENCE DO IT.

AND I WOULD PUSH BACK, A LITTLE BIT OF WHAT KATE AND SHEILA SAID.

IF YOU NOTICE, I'M THE ONLY PERSON HERE WITHOUT MAJOR ENDORSEMENTS OR ANY ESTABLISHMENT BACKING.

AND THAT'S BECAUSE, REALLY, THE COMMUNITY IS BEHIND ME.

I'VE OUTRAISED BOTH SHEILA AND XAIT IN THE FIRST ROUND AND THAT'S BECAUSE THE BLACK COMMUNITY, IN PARTICULAR, IS BEHIND ME.

KATE.

AND WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, REALLY, WHERE POLITICS IS GOING AND WHY PEOPLE ARE ALIGNING, WHAT I'VE COME TO FIND UT IS THAT THE SPECIAL INTERESTS, ORGANIZATIONS THAT CLAIM TO BE PROGRESSIVES, RIGHT, REALLY TWIST THE ARMS OF CANDIDATES TO TAKE THE KNEE ON POLICY POSITIONS.

AND I WOULD PROBABLY ASSUME, HAD I PROBABLY SAID YES FOR MINNEAPOLIS, AND NO TO QUESTION 1 AS WELL, I WOULD PROBABLY BE THE THIRD PERSON ON THAT TICKET.

I DECIDED TO SAY, THE COMMUNITIES OF COLOR ACTUALLY DESERVE THEIR VOICES TO BE HEARD.

AND THAT'S WHY I DECIDED NOT TO SUPPORT ANY OF THOSE AMENDMENTS.

AND ALIGNMENTS IN THIS YEAR WHEN RANK CHOICE IS IMPORTANT, REMEMBER, MINNEAPOLIS, YOUR SAFETY BET SHOULD NOT BE YOUR FIRST BET.

YOUR PASSIONATE BET SHOULD BE YOUR FIRST BET.

>> Eric: A MINUTE FROM EACH OF YOU.

THEN WE'RE OUT OF TIME.

I'M WONDERING ABOUT PROPERTY TAXES.

DOWNTOWN PROPERTY VALUES LIKELY TO GO DOWN, THE POLICE OFFICER WORKERS COMP SETTLEMENTS DRAINING THE FUND.

HIGHER COST TO PUBLIC SAFETY.

LET'S GO DOWN THE LINE.

MAYOR, HIGHER PROPERTY TAXES COMING?

>> WELL, WE NEED TO REIGNITE THE ECONOMY OF OUR CITY.

OF COURSE WE NEED TO LISTEN TO EPIDEMIOLOGISTS, LISTEN TO ALL OF THE EXPERT DATA.

DO I REGRET BEING THE FIRST CITY IN THE COUNTRY TO HAVE A MASK MANDATE OR TO CLOSE DOWN BARS AND RESTAURANTS?

NO.

WE DID IT TO SAVE LIVES.

BUT NOW IS THE TIME TO START TO RE-OPEN BECAUSE PROPERTY TAXES ACCOUNT FOR ABOUT 50% OF OUR TOTAL REVENUES THAT WE BRING IN.

>> Eric: ARE YOU GOING TO PROPOSE RAISING PROPERTY TAXES SOME >> PROPERTY TAXES WE RAISED CONSISTENTLY SOMEWHERE IN THE 5% RANGE.

WE ALSO HAVE A CLEAR PLAN AS TO HOW WE ARE GOING TO PROGRESS IN THE NEXT SEVERAL YEARS AHEAD.

IS THERE A RAISE?

YES, HERES, BECAUSE -- THERE IS, BECAUSE OUR CITY REQUIRES IT, GIVEN INTEREST AND EVERYTHING ELSE.

BUT YOU DO NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT PROPERTY TAXES ARE KEPT UNDER CONTROL BECAUSE THEY ARE, IN FACT, A REGRESSIVE TAX THAT DISPROPORTIONATELY IMPACTS SENIORS AND PEOPLE OF LOWER INCOMES.

>> Eric: SHEILA, WHAT ABOUT A 5% RATE FOR THE PROPERTY TAX INCREASE OR WHAT HAVE YOU GOT?

>> YEAH, I THINK THE RATE THAT WE'VE BEEN AT IS APPROPRIATE AND I THINK WE NEED TO BE SPENDING IT BETTER, RIGHT?

WE DON'T NEED TO BE SPENDING $3 MILLION ON THE K-9 UNIT WHEN THERE ARE PEOPLE SLEEPING OUTSIDE IN MINNEAPOLIS.

FOR EXAMPLE.

I WOULD ALSO SUPPORT A LEVY FOR YOUTH PROGRAMMING.

THAT WAS ACTUALLY PRESENTED TO THE MAYOR BACK IN 2018.

>> Eric: PARK BOARD, DIDN'T IT?

>> YES, IT CAME FROM THE PARK BOARD.

AND IT WOULD HAVE PROVIDED S.T.E.A.M.

PROGRAMMING IN PARK BUILDINGS ACROSS THE CITY.

AND NOW, JUST NOW WE'RE GETTING SOME BUY-IN INTO IT.

>> Eric: KATE KNUTH?

>> YOU KNOW, THE CITY BUDGET IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS THE MAYOR WORKS ON.

AS A FORMER STATE REPRESENTATIVE, WHO SERVED ON THE INANCE COMMITTEE, ON THE TAXES COMMITTEE, I HAVE DEEP UNDERSTANDING OF PUBLIC BUDGETING AND THE PROCESSES BEHIND THEM.

AND WHEN I TALK TO VOTERS ABOUT OUR PROPERTY TAX LEVY, AND THE REALITIES OF OUR CITY BUDGET, I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE RISKS THAT YOU ACTUALLY MENTIONED WHEN IT COMES TO THE COSTS OF POLICE AND THE COST OF POLICE BRUTALITY CASES AND THE COST OF WORKERS COMP, WE ARE GETTING LESS POLICE SERVICE FOR SIGNIFICANTLY MORE MONEY AND THE MAYOR IS WHO MANAGES OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT AND HAS NOT BEEN HONEST AND DIRECT WITH US ABOUT THESE INCREASED COSTS AND HOW THEY'RE GOING TO AFFECT THE CITY'S BUDGET LONG TERM.

>> Eric: YOUR BEST BET ON PROPERTY TAXES?

>> I WOULD SAY THAT IT DEPENDS.

I THINK SHORT TERM, THERE'S PROBABLY REASON TO DO SO.

MORE TAXING AUTHORITY IN THE CITY OF MINNEAPOLIS, ESPECIALLY BEING CARRIED BY SOME OF THE LUXURY RENTERS.

I THINK THAT WE COULD PROBABLY BALANCE THAT OUT AND PUT A RESCINDING NUMBER BACK TO IT.

BUT THOSE ARE CONVERSATIONS THAT I THINK ULTIMATELY GO TO THE VOTERS ON.

WE HAVE TO BALANCE BUDGETS, AND WE HAVE TO DO THE WORK THE CITY REQUIRES.

I'M NOT GOING TO SIT HERE AND SAY TO YOU THAT THERE MIGHT NOT BE AN INCREASE, IF ULTIMATELY THAT IS REQUIRED AND IT'S DEEMED APPROPRIATE FOR US TO BE ACTUALLY BALANCING THE BUDGET AND TO DO THE WORK.

>> Cathy: ALL RIGHT.

I THINK WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE.

APPRECIATE YOUR TIME, ALL OF YOU.

THANKS FOR BEING WITH US.

IT WAS GOOD DEBATE.

THANKS.

>> Eric: APPRECIATE IT, THANKS.

>> CATHY: THANKS FOR WATCHING.

REMEMBER, THERE ARE 17 CANDIDATES RUNNING FOR MAYOR.

YOU CAN FIND OUT INFORMATION ABOUT ALL OF THEM BY SEEKING OUT ONLINE VOTER GUIDES.

THERE ARE A BUNCH OF THEM.

THEY'RE GOOD.

THANKS FOR WATCHING THIS SPECIAL EDITION OF "ALMANAC."

THANKS O THE CANDIDATES FOR BEING HERE.

NEXT WEEK WE'LL HAVE A MORE TRADITIONAL SHOW, INCLUDING A LOOK BACK AT THE GREAT HALLOWEEN BLIZZARD OF 1991, BECAUSE WHY NOT?

THE ONLY TIME IN 36 YEARS THAT "ALMANAC" CANCELLED ITS SHOW.

THANKS FOR WATCHING.

GOOD NIGHT.

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