- This week on "Black Issues Forum," join us as we explore the North Carolina Museum of Art right here in the Capitol City of Raleigh, North Carolina.

- [Announcer] "Black Issues Forum" is a production of PBS North Carolina with support from the Z. Smith Reynolds Foundation.

Quality public television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you who invite you to join them in supporting PBS NC.

[upbeat epic music] ♪ - Welcome to "Black Issues Forum."

I'm your host, Kenia Thompson, and we've got a special treat for you today.

We are here at the North Carolina Museum of Art, enjoying and experiencing the Ruth E. Carter "Afrofuturism" exhibit, featuring the "Black Panther" costume designs.

In a few moments, we'll sit down with director of Performing Arts & Film, Moses Greene, and assistant curator, Maya Brooks, to talk about how they got all of this magic right here in Raleigh, North Carolina.

All right, so, Moses, talk to me a little bit about what does being the director of Performing Arts & Film mean here at the North Carolina Museum of Art?

- It means that I get a chance every day to activate the galleries in our 146-acre museum park with music, dance, theater, film, and now literary arts.

- So talk to us about some of the exhibits that are here currently, and how did you come to find these exhibits and think that they were a good fit here in this museum?

- So I always get credit for finding exhibits.

That's Maya's role, and that's the curator's role.

My job is literally to make sure that people can engage with them through the performing arts or through film.

- So you mentioned Maya.

So we'll bring in Maya to the conversation.

So talk to us about the life of a curator.

What does that look like?

And then how did you pair with this museum?

- Yeah, it's very interesting to think about how art like is involved in people's lives and throughout people's lives.

And so as a curator, you're always trying to bridge this connection between the museum as an institution and our public.

You also have collectors and donors.

There's all types of individuals involved in this process.

And so when I wanted to join the field, what I always thought about was, how I wanna impact people through art, how I want to start conversations around art and create a dialogue about who is missing from these stories, who's missing from the narrative, who's missing from our spaces?

And facilitate that from the institutional side, on my side as a curator, and the public side, being that I'm also a part of the public too.

So it's both, it's a lot of duality.

- Yeah, so when you think about, you know, the Ruth E. Carter exhibit, for example, we know that we're gonna flock out to it, but when we talk about new audiences and bringing new demographics in, what's that tactic?

What does that look like when we're trying to attract some folks to come in?

- Yeah, so the tactic that we take as curators is to be able to figure out our writing, who we're writing for, who we're writing to, and also how we promote our events.

So working with marketing, working with folks like Moses who are doing programming, who are reaching out to the public in different ways, so that we can help facilitate those conversations.

Another thing that we also practice is thinking about the kinds of shows we're putting on.

The content is really the basis, and the root of our jobs is, are we putting on shows that people are interested in?

Especially with something like Ruth Carter, a lot of people watch movies, right?

A lot of people, you know, wanna know the costumes, wanna know that process.

So being able to have an exhibition that breaks that down is like the basis of what we do.

- So, Moses, bringing you back in, when she talks about programming, what kinds of programs do you have here to bring that attraction to the museum?

- So first we start with film.

So for the Ruth E. Carter exhibit, we're showing about six films, everything from "Kirkland."

We showed "School Days," which was Miss Carter's first work, working with Spike Lee.

We're showing "Coming to America" too.

So we show films.

We also have a playlist that is specifically based on the films, and so I work with Maya and her team to make sure that the playlist, which if you go into the exhibit, the playlist is actually playing.

So that it's not just the visual art, but it's also, hoping, what we are hoping to do is that you understand the time period, especially since Afrofuturism, so you'll understand that "School Days" has a different feel, 1980s has a different field than "Malcolm X," which is the 1940s to 1960s, which is completely different than "Black Panther."

So adding those elements.

So it's film, it's music, and then sometimes it's dance.

So we had North Carolina Central University's dance department here, and they created a dance that we commissioned called "Piercing the Veil," and "Piercing the Veil" was about an Afrofuturistic look at, not only her films, but at of ourselves.

So it's all of that.

- Yeah, talk to me about the People's Collection.

Who's in charge of that?

That being you, all right.

[Maya laughs] So tell us a little bit about the People's Collection, and then what are some of the experiences that have been able to have been curated from that?

- Yeah, so we are just now calling it The People's Collection in like a fuller sense because the People's Collection has always been about the public, it's always been for everyone, but really promoting it as that is something new with our reinstallation.

So we completely reinstalled the museum over the past few years.

I was actually hired to help with that process initially.

And what we've done is we've arranged the galleries in a geographical sense and also a chronological sense.

So now that when you move through them, you're moving through different continents and different time periods.

We also have thematic exhibitions that are rotating in those shows.

So including some local shows like Black Mountain College.

We have a performing arts gallery for the first time.

We've also bridged some gaps that were existing in our collection.

So like for instance, we have Egypt next to Africa now.

Like that's a really big part of our process where we were like, "Well, why was that not always the case here?"

Right?

Why was that not always a thing?

And so that was like the really big push for us in the People's Collection.

The other part is inviting artists to do commissions.

So we have some rotating commissions.

We have our first artist in residence, JP Powell.

So we are really excited to showcase local artistry and put it in conversation with global artistry.

So thinking about who's making art now in the world, and also over time.

We have what's called an encyclopedic or a survey museum.

So, our collection extends across different centuries and different time periods.

And so, there's over 5,000 pieces in our collection that come from everywhere, from Ancient America to the ancient Mediterranean to contemporary.

So, being able to show this expanse of geography and time all in one space has been like the biggest part of what our collection represents.

- And that's beautiful because, to me, that means when we have kids come through, students in schools, they see themselves in the art.

- [Moses] Absolutely.

- Right?

So, Moses, talk about the importance of having students walk through.

I remember being a kid and not really seeing myself on the walls.

What is that experience for them like now, here today?

- Well, that's actually my favorite part of my job which is making sure...

I don't call it diversity, inclusion and equity, it's belonging.

- [Interviewer] Yeah.

- That every student, as many cultures and identities as possible, see themselves reflected in our programming.

And so, in spaces where it may not be as vibrant or as numerous as we want in the collection itself, we get a chance to augment that with performing arts and with dance.

Performing arts, music, the dance, the film, that actually is why I took the job, so then I could expand belonging to everyone.

- Yeah.

Maya, you've curated a lot, I'm sure.

Well, what would you say is your most favorite project that you've worked on?

- I definitely think my favorite project so far... Oh, that's a big question.

I've done a lot here so far.

I think it has to be the reinstallation, to be honest.

And I know that's kind of like, "Okay, like, yeah!

That was why you were hired."

But it's been such a joy to see people come in for the first time, and experience the galleries and feel represented.

It's beautiful to see first time visitors who come up to me specifically and be like, "Oh, I came just for you.

Like I came to meet you."

And to hear that from people who did not feel welcome here for a very long time.

I mean, this museum has a lot of history that hasn't always been the prettiest or the nicest or anything like that.

And so, you have to acknowledge that.

And that's what we've done.

That's what the steps we're taking in our work now.

And I think that has been the most fulfilling part of my job.

- Yeah.

Moses, any favorite stories that you can share during your time here?

- Favorite stories?

I think they're happening every day.

One would be last year, we had Arturo O'Farrill who is an Afro-Latin Jazz legend, and a friend from New York brought her son.

And for him to see his culture on that stage, you can't quantify the brightness and the light that was in his eyes.

And she sent us a picture that's been in our board reports.

It's the daily connections.

We have something called "Intimate Groove".

We were doing the joy of 80s.

And a woman who brought her aging husband, she said, like literally she says, "I prayed, God don't let it rain because we need the joy."

This is coming out of the pandemic.

This is coming through what America's going through.

And so, it's the everyday...

It really is for me the everyday moments of people learning to breathe in what we're going through in this country.

And then people also reconnecting to what joy feels like and creating new normals.

- Yeah.

So, what's to come?

What's the future here?

What does the next art exhibit look like?

What are the next attractions?

And who do you want to come?

- [Moses] I'll defer to you.

I know what that looks like musically, but I'll defer to you.

- Exhibitions wise, you know, especially working in contemporary art, we are expanding to really think about what that means in the present.

We define contemporary art as art existing within the past 25 years and ongoing.

And when I think of ongoing, you know, one of my main focuses is to think about digital art and new media, and how people are taking traditional forms and recreating them in these really imaginative ways.

So that's one of the things I'm really excited... Really, one of the things I'm really excited to showcase in the next few exhibitions.

But then we also, you know, still mix in some more of the traditional forms.

Like we have a Dutch art show coming up.

We have some different European shows coming up, so that people are still getting that good balance.

But I'm really looking forward to showcasing the future of art, and how marginalized voices, people of color, artists of color are really taking this field to a new level of imagination.

Excuse me!

- And for me, that looks like bringing new series, you know, the jazz at the NCMA series.

We're now in our second year.

Overall, our performing arts season, we have 17 Grammy Award winners.

It's the most that the season has ever had in 26 years.

And so, attracting top-notch talent, grade A, like Grammy Award winners from a wide array of genres.

So, from folk to country to jazz to gospel.

And when it's allowed...

Allowed is not the right word.

When possible, infusing music, dance, theater and film as part of the collection and part of the exhibitions.

- Beautiful!

Well, thank you very much.

- Thank you.

- Thank you.

- I've enjoyed our time here.

- Thank you.

- Thank you.

[soothing music] - Partnerships are integral part to keeping exhibits like this alive, as well as the museum.

Dr. Gray, founder of "Black and Belonging", brought 180 students here to experience the culture, the Afro-futurism and the Ruthie Carter designs.

[soothing music] Moses and I are joined now by Dr. Gray, and Jules, which is a student that's here with us today.

Moses, we have 180, 190 students here.

Tell us about this partnership with "Black and Belonging", and what are all these students doing here at the museum?

- So as part of our department, which is education outreach and audience engagement, we reached out to Dr. Gray, the founder of "Black and Belonging".

And together, he and I came up with which specific Spike Lee film would really resonate with students as a part of the exhibit.

And so, we are so grateful that the energy of the students this morning as they were going through the exhibit, there's nothing like I've ever seen in my short tenure here.

It's been a wonderful day!

- Yeah.

Tell us about the connection between the Ruthie Carter and the Spike Lee movie.

- Okay, so Ruthie Carter is a costume designer.

Again, her very first film was Spike Lee's "School Daze".

She does "Malcolm X", and she did "Crooklyn".

And so, we wanted to make sure that the students at the day went through the exhibition that they had a connection to see literally not just the big "Black Panther" or the big "Fortnite" costumes, but just how important it is to reflect the black lived experience in everyday ways.

And "Crooklyn" does that, you know.

- Dr. Gray, I wanna bring you in.

You are the founder of Black and Belonging.

Talk about what the organization does.

Why did you establish it?

And the importance of these kids being here today?

- So Black and Belonging is a youth focused organization based outta Durham, North Carolina.

And so what we are is a close knit group of young thinkers who are designing cultural experiences that make their ancestors smile.

So this partnership is an example of that because we have middle schools here represented by Carrington Middle School, Shepherd and Neal Magnet Middle School in Durham.

But we have alumni of these schools like Jewels who is a high school student who we've been working with since she was in middle school and now she's taking on leadership roles.

So today she's greeting students, just talking to them, giving them some game about next steps throughout their time here today.

And you know, we believe that youth should lead the way and teach us how young people deserve to be treated.

And so, we want them to create a more welcoming society and what better way to do that than to elevate them into positions where they can achieve for the sake of social progress and racial uplift and not just the 4.0's that Jewels and other students may have.

- So that's great, a 4.0.

- [Jewels] Thank you.

- So that you are a true leader.

So talk to us about coming up in the ranks of Black and Belonging and what that's been like for you and some of the joys that you get with being a leader in this group.

- We have, like, for one, we start off with a small project and then we, after the small project, we go up and move bigger to bigger projects.

It's really fun.

It's a new adventure every time we meet with each other.

It's just like, every time we meet it's something different.

It's something new.

- [Interviewer] Like what?

What are some of the programs that you guys have done besides this trip?

- We have spoken at NC State.

We did a youth led conversation with, what's her name?

- [Dr. Gray] With Durham public schools.

- With Durham public schools.

- [Dr. Gray] For Crown Week.

- Yeah, Crown Week.

We have made, I made a video called "Who Taught You the Hate the Texture of Your Hair?"

And we also, me and my friends we made a video about hair last year.

- Nice.

- They also recently submitted for a grant and pitched a grant.

So they're hoping to get that funded soon to develop fashion that has messages in it that wake adults up to issues that young people go through.

- And so you partner with the local middle schools and high schools or just the middle schools?

- So it's mainly middle school focused, but when students leave out of Middle School, we still work with them all the way through.

And so one of our oldest mentees, his name is Michael Ali, he recently got a full ride to Duke University, so he'll be starting there in the fall.

But he's spoken with them at NC State.

He's given talks at Duke.

They've given professional developments at their high school in front of their teachers, well supported by their principal, Dr. Logan.

And you know, he's also traveled out of town to San Diego to present at the American Educational Research Association.

So when it came to getting funding for college, you know, it was a no-brainer.

Duke gave him a full ride in the first week of December.

- So when we talk about accessibility for our students, you know, this experience for students like Jewels and the rest of the students that are here today, partnering with Moses and the museum.

Talk about the importance of the accessibility of having Maya create and bring content here that's worthy of them finding connection through.

- Well, you know, as a psychologist and you know, a researcher, one of the biggest things that I have come to understand is that students need to have opportunities to belong.

So this experience represents an interpersonal opportunity to belong which they're connecting with one another.

So as they're, you know, viewing themselves, they're also sparking up conversation, laughing and joking and having a good time and making connections with their peers at their schools but also at other schools.

You never know who may be the next scholar, the next leader, the next athlete, the next poet, and they're all in the same space meeting each other early across schools.

So that's interpersonal.

Instructional opportunities to belong.

Just learning about different, you know, exhibits and understanding the connection between me and my culture and/or community through what the museum deems as important wakes students up to understand their power, and also institutional opportunities to belong.

So one of the things that we were fortunate about today was Moses gave me the stage for about 10 minutes before the movie started.

And so what I did was reach out to one of the middle schoolers and I said, hey, remember that poem that you shared in front of your whole school?

Now I need you to share it in front of three schools today.

You got two minutes.

She got up on the stage, and she completely rocked the house.

And so, you know, having an opportunity to, you know, share what they have and the assets that they bring to the space is something that is also important.

And so this experience touches on all three.

- That's beautiful.

Moses, when you and Maya work together to curate these spaces, these exhibits, how front of mind are students for you?

- [Moses] Always.

- Yeah.

- Always because museums are known as society's taste makers, the way to cultivate an understanding and that sense of belonging that Maya and I are after is making sure that we involve young people.

Former middle school teacher, so when I met the students and said who's in sixth or seventh grade?

Like this is a part of my heartbeat that this next generation knows that they belong.

Not that they think.

Nothing about respectability politics, that they know that there is something that reflects them.

And so when we attract a Ruthie Carter exhibit, how much more empowering, not just to visit the museum but to visit a museum and to see popular culture, Black Panther, to see a history in the making.

She just became the first Black woman to win two Academy awards and then to see reflections of themselves, not just in Black Panther which is an Afro futurist world, but from Roots.

And I love the project that you just mentioned because what we learned was there were certain cultural aspects of even the clothing that came from Africa on the plantations here in America.

And so from Roots through the Civil Rights movement all the way up to Afro-futurism, they're getting a chance to learn the historical value of their lived story.

So they are always literally the heartbeat that guides me.

- And I just wanna build on that by saying that there's so many different ways that youth are having experiences outside of these spaces where, you know it's important for their culture to be reflected here.

Case in point, I told Jules that we were putting together this experience and she said, oh, I have to be there because this is my mom's favorite movie.

So she watches it quite frequently from what I have heard.

And so her mother's jealous that, you know she can't be here today.

- So Jules, I'd love to get your experience, you know in seeing Ruth Carter's exhibit you watched Black Panther, I take it.

- [Jules] Yes.

I don't know about you, but I loved Black Panther.

I watched Black Panther two, but then to see, to be in front of the costumes, right?

To be there and almost feel like I'm living the movie.

Tell us, or describe that feeling for you when you experienced it.

- I felt really happy because like, I don't know like I wish I could touch it, but I can't like I was really happy especially when I saw Zuri custom in the front.

Cause he was like really important in the movie.

And then I saw like the Black Panther thing, me and my parents we just started taking pictures cause we were so excited.

It's just like very warm and comforting to see it in person.

- Yeah., no same, same.

Dr. Gray, when you hear that, what are some of the emotions that you experience in understanding that it's actually, I know you already know it's connecting with the kids but to see them experiencing it and enjoying it, what does that do for you?

- I'm just looking at the story unfold through Jules's eyes.

So, you know, the reason why this really hits me is because in the fall we had an event called Blackout, for Black Panther two, where about 200 folks packed the AMC in Durham wearing their black and belonging hoodies.

And if you didn't have one when you showed up, a middle schooler greeted, you asked you what was your name and they checked your name off and they called your hoodie size out.

And another middle schooler ran it up and gave it to you before the movie, there was a lot of conversations.

Everyone from school board members were there to teachers, to principals, to community organizations and of course the youth.

So it was very intergenerational in that conversation.

So to have a part two where they're excited to come back and see the costumes live in person, you know and have pictures and them Instagramming their friends who aren't here, showing them what's going on.

There's this reach that they have, you know with other young people and they can live through vicariously, through Jules's experiences as well.

So just to see the continuity and alignment I think touches me the most.

- Yeah, so what's the future for Black and Belonging?

What do you have planned?

- So there are a couple things that we wanna do in the future.

You know, one, we wanna make young people the owners of their own ip, they create so much inside of schools they have so much inside of them in terms of creativity.

They need to be creating their own clothes that design things that reflect them here locally in the community.

Cause I believe it will go viral instantly.

Anything that I've incorporated into the designs of clothing and bags that I've made, it sells out immediately.

We can't keep inventory in.

So that's the first.

The second piece is that we want to put young people on the road and travel.

So Jules has made a visual mixtape which which is a part of this online, on demand e-course for young people sharing belonging from their own experiences.

It kind of invited them into this idea of media first because that's a friendly area for them to jump into but it really tricks them into practicing being a better speaker and having your message and refining that.

So after that, what do you do?

You get that show on the road.

And so we need to get them out more going to different schools, presenting and hosting things for other young people so that it's young person to young person talking more than it is adults young person, you know, because they need to hear them their own selves and they need to be able to build their resumes along the way.

The third thing that I think we're trying to do though is we're really trying to get more groups in front of these young people as well.

So, you know, where I may have a lot of focus as a psychologists and a lot of experience there I don't formally have media training or media kits.

So, you know, just interacting with folks who do this every day, can give them that next level to polish.

And so we want those community connections.

- Oh, that's beautiful.

Well, we look forward to seeing Jules, what you do in the future as well as your peers.

And we thank you for the work that you're doing with our students and we continue to encourage you and I'm sure Moses will continue to support.

Thank you all.

We hope you enjoyed the special feature here at the North Carolina Museum of Art.

And we encourage you to continue engaging with us on Instagram using the hashtag black issues forum or watch us on PBSnc.org/blackissuesforum or anytime on the PBS video app.

Until next time, I'm Kenia Thompson [upbeat music] ♪ - [Narrator] Black Issues Forum is a production of PBS North Carolina.

With support from the Z. Smith Reynolds Foundation.

Quality public Television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you who invite you to join them in supporting PBS NC.