>> Braude: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON," LONGTIME NPR HOST DIANE REHM JOINS ME ON HER NEW DOCUMENTARY, "WHEN MY TIME COMES," ABOUT THE PUSH FOR MEDICAL AID IN DYING, ALONG WITH ANOTHER ADVOCATE FEATURED IN THE FILM, A LOCAL DOCTOR WITH STAGE FOUR CANCER.

THEN LATER, GBH SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE REPORTERS JENIFER McKIM AND PHILLIP MARTIN ON THEIR LATEST REPORT ABOUT THE BOYS VICTIMIZED BY SEX TRAFFICKING WHOSE CASES TOO OFTEN GO OVERLOOKED.

>> Braude: RIGHT NOW, THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA AND NINE STATES-- TEN, BY SUMMER-- ALLOW DOCTORS TO PRESCRIBE LETHAL PRESCRIPTION MEDICATION TO TERMINALLY ILL PATIENTS SO THAT THEY CAN DIE PEACEFULLY.

BUT HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS, VOTERS NARROWLY DEFEATED A BALLOT QUESTION THAT WOULD HAVE ALLOWED THE SAME THING IN 2012, 51% TO 49%.

AND SINCE 1995, 10 BILLS ON THE ISSUE HAVE GONE BEFORE STATE LAWMAKERS.

THE LATEST IS KNOWN AS THE "END OF LIFE OPTIONS ACT," WHICH HAS BACKING FROM THE ADVOCACY ORGANIZATION "COMPASSION AND CHOICES," INCLUDING DR. ROGER KLIGLER, A RETIRED PHYSICIAN FROM FALMOUTH WITH INCURABLE STAGE FOUR PROSTATE CANCER, WHO SUED MASSACHUSETTS FOR THE RIGHT TO SEEK MEDICAL AID IN DYING, WHICH A JUDGE ULTIMATELY DENIED, WHILE GRANTING DOCTORS THE FREEDOM TO DISCUSS THE PRACTICE WITH PATIENTS.

>> I WONDER ABOUT THE HIPPOCRATIC OATH TO "DO NO HARM."

HOW DOES THAT WORK INTO YOUR THINKING?

>> DO NO HARM -- WHAT IS HARM AND WHO GETS TO DEFINE "HARM"?

>> Braude: DR. KLIGLER IS FEATURED IN A NEW PBS DOCUMENTARY THAT SEEKS TO ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS, HOSTED BY LONGTIME N.P.R.

HOST DIANE REHM, WHO'S BEEN AN ADVOCATE FOR MEDICAL AID IN DYING SINCE HER HUSBAND WAS DENIED THE OPTION IN MARYLAND BEFORE HE DIED IN 2014.

THE FILM IS CALLED "WHEN MY TIME COMES," AFTER A BOOK REHM PUBLISHED LAST YEAR BY THE SAME NAME.

AND IN IT SHE SAYS THAT, FOR HER, THE ISSUE IS ALL ABOUT INDIVIDUAL AUTONOMY, AS SHE TOLD A LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE IN MARYLAND.

>> MY PHILOSOPHY IN THIS MATTER IS TO RESPECT THAT SINGULARLY PERSONAL MOMENT FOR EACH OF US.

IF YOU BELIEVE THAT ONLY GOD SHOULD BE THE DECIDER, I SUPPORT YOU 100%.

IF YOU WISH TO HAVE EVERY SINGLE OPTION THAT MEDICAL SCIENCE CAN PROVIDE, I SUPPORT YOU 100%.

AND IF YOU BELIEVE, AS I DO, THAT YOU WANT THE RIGHT TO END YOUR SUFFERING AT A TIME YOU CHOOSE, I SUPPORT YOU 100%.

>> Braude: DIANE REHM AND DR. ROGER KLIGLER JOIN ME NOW.

>> Braude: WELCOME TO BOTH OF YOU.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU FORK FOR HAVING US.

>> Braude: IF I CAN START WITH YOU, DIANE, YOU AND JOHN REHM WERE MARRIED FOR ALMOST A HALF CENTURY, WHAT SPECIFICALLY IN HIS LONG BATTLE WITH PARKINSON'S CAUSED YOU TO BECOME AN ADVOCATE FOR MEDICAL AID AND DYING?

>> I THINK HIS DECISION TO STOP EATING, DRINKING, TAKING ANY MEDICATION, WHICH ULTIMATELY ENDED HIS LIFE AFTER 10 LONG DAYS OF SUFFERING, REALLY PROPELLED ME FORWARD.

I BELIEVE THAT HE ASKED FOR, AND WAS DENIED, BECAUSE HE WAS IN THIS STATE OF MARYLAND, MEDICAL AID IN DYING FROM HIS DOCTOR, WHO COULD NOT PROVIDE IT LEGALLY.

AND SO JOHN TOOK MATTERS INTO HIS OWN HANDS.

HE WAS SO COURAGEOUS.

HE WAS SO DETERMINED TO DO EXACTLY THAT.

PAIN IS NOT THE NUMBER ONE ISSUE THAT PEOPLE ASK FOR MEDICAL AID IN DYING, AS DR. KLIGLER WILL, I THINK, SUPPORT ME IN THIS.

IT IS ACTUALLY NUMBER SIX.

BUT JOHN HAD LOST WHAT HE FELT WAS ALL DIGNITY IN LIFE, AND HAD NOWHERE TO GO BUT DOWN.

>> Braude: DOCTOR, WHAT CAME FIRST, YOUR DIAGNOSIS OR YOUR ADVOCACY?

>> OH, MY ADVOCACY.

I HAD WATCHED MY MOTHER DIE OF PANCREATIC CANCER -- WELL, I'M SORRY, NEITHER OF THEM CAME FIRST.

I WAS AN ADVOCATE FOR MYSELF WHEN I TURNED 40.

MY MOTHER DIED OF PANCREATIC CANCER, AND I SAID THAT THERE WAS NO WAY THAT I WANTED TO DIE THAT WAY.

AND THEN -- >> Braude: YOU KNOW -- I'M SORRY.

CONTINUE, PLEASE.

>> I THEN WENT ON TO DEVELOP CANCER, AND SUBSEQUENTLY LEARNED ABOUT MEDICAL AID IN DYING.

>> Braude: IN THIS FILM, IT COMES THROUGH VERY CLEARLY THAT DIANE'S DOCTORS ARE VERY TOLERANT OF THOSE WERE OPPOSING POINTS OF VIEW.

ARE YOU AS TOLERANT, PARTICULARLY YOUR FELLOW DOCTORS WHO ARE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THIS ISSUE, DOCTOR?

>> Doctor: I'M TOLERANT OF THEM, HOWEVER, I THINK THEY HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO TAKE CARE OF WHAT THE PATIENT NEEDS.

I FEEL THAT THE PATIENTS' NEEDS ARE ULTIMATELY WHAT WE SHOULD BE TAKING CARE OF.

AND IF THEY'RE NOT ABLE TO TAKE CARE OF THE PATIENT'S NEED FOR MEDICAL AID AND DYING IN STATES WHEN MEDICAL NEED AND DYING IS ALLOWED, THEN THEY HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO HELP THAT PERSON GET WHAT THE PERSON WANTS.

>> Braude: WHAT DO -- >> THE QUESTION -- >> Braude: GO AHEAD, DIANE.

I'M SORRY.

>> THAT WAS ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I ASKED DR. KLIGLER WHEN I INTERVIEWED HIM, THAT NOTION OF A DOCTOR'S VOW TO DO NO HARM.

AND DR. KLIGLER'S RESPONSE WAS: "WHO IS TO DETERMINE WHAT HARM IS?"

IS IT THE PATIENT OR IS IT IN THE HANDS OF THE DOCTOR?

AND I STRONGLY BELIEVE THAT SO MUCH HARM IS BEING DONE TO PATIENTS IN THE NAME OF SIMPLY KEEPING THEM ALIVE BEYOND THAT POINT WHERE THEY WOULD LIKE TO GIVE UP.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, DOCTOR, BACK TO YOU TO FOLLOW UP ON SOMETHING DIANE JUST SAID, I HAVE TO SAY I NEVER QUITE UNDERSTOOD THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN A DOCTOR HAVING THE POWER TO THE EXTEND A LIFE BY EXTRAORDINARY -- PARDON ME, TO WITHDRAW EXTRAORDINARY MEASURES WHICH WOULD OTHERWISE EXTEND A LIFE AND BEING ALLOWED TO PROVIDE MEDICAL AID IN DYING.

WHY IS THE FORMER PERMISSIBLE AND THE LATTER NOT?

>> Doctor: UM, I THINK PART OF IT IS, UM -- I MEAN WE'RE ABLE, ACTUALLY, TO DO MORE THAN THAT.

WE'RE ABLE TO GIVE SOMETHING CALL PALLIATIVE SEDATION.

WE GIVE SOMEONE MORPHINE, SOMETIMES MORPHINE TO UNCONSCIOUSNESS, AND THE PERSON WILL DIE SOONER THAN THEY OTHERWISE WOULD HAVE, AND THAT IS PERMISSIBLE.

IT HAS GONE THROUGH THE COURTS.

IT IS POSSIBLE MEDICAL CARE.

I THINK IT IS REALLY A FIG LEAF, YOU KNOW, OF THE DIFFERENTIATION.

I THINK WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO HELP PEOPLE TO HAVE COMFORT, AND COMFORT HAS TO BE DEFINED BY THE PERSON WHO IS SUFFERING.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, DIANE, ONE OF THE MOST AFFECTIVE THINGS I THOUGHT YOU DID IN THIS FILM WAS WHEN YOU'RE TESTIFYING BEFORE THE MARYLAND LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE, YOU GAVE VOICE TO ALL LEGISLATORS WHO APPEAR TO HAVE GOOD FAITH CONCERNS ABOUT THIS.

I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT A COUPLE OF THE ISSUES THEY RAISED, WHICH WE HEARD LOT HERE ALMOST 10 YEARS AGO IN MASSACHUSETTS.

THE SLIPPERY SLOPE TO EUTHANASIA, PARTICULARLY TO THOSE WITH SEVERE DISABILITIES, WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THOSE WHO HAVE THOSE FEARS?

>> I THINK THE SLIPPERY SLOPE ARGUMENT HAS BEEN USED AGAIN AND AGAIN.

AND YET IN THE 20 OR MORE YEARS THAT THE OREGON LAW ON WHICH MOST LAWS IN THIS COUNTRY ARE BASED, THERE HAS NOT BEEN A SINGLE CASE WHERE FORCE HAS BEEN USED, WHERE SOMEONE HAS BEEN PRESSURED INTO MAKING A DECISION TO DIE, WHERE EUTHANASIA HAS BEEN CARRIED OUT.

EUTHANASIA IS WHAT IS USED IN PARTS OF EUROPE.

AND IF PEOPLE WANT THAT, THAT'S WHERE THEY CAN GO.

WHAT IS SO IMPORTANT HERE IS THAT THE PATIENT MUST REQUEST FROM HIS OR HER DOCTOR THAT MEDICAL AID IN DYING BE ALLOWED, AND THAT DOCTOR MUST HAVE A SECOND DOCTOR TO CORROBORATE THAT THE PATIENT IS WITHIN SIX MONTHS OF DEATH.

YOU MENTIONED THE DISABLED COMMUNITY.

IT'S SO INTERESTING BECAUSE HERE IN WASHINGTON, THE PERSON WHO INTRODUCED THE BILL TO THE D.C. CITY COUNCIL TOLD ME THAT HALF OF THE DISABLED COMMUNITY WAS FEARFUL, JUST AS YOU MENTIONED.

AND THE OTHER HALF OF THAT COMMUNITY SAID, WHY AREN'T WE INCLUDED?

WE HAVE THE RIGHT TO MAKE A CHOICE AS WELL.

SO I THINK THAT SLIPPERY SLOPE ARGUMENT HAS YET TO BE CORROBORATED.

>> Braude: DIANE -- >> Doctor: I'D LIKE TO SAY A COUPLE OF THINGS.

>> Braude: OF COURSE, DOCTOR.

>> Doctor: IF I COULD.

THE FIRST THING IS A QUARTER OF ONE PERCENT OF PEOPLE, WHICH IS ALMOST THE NUMBER WHO USE MEDICAL AID IN DYING, OF TERMINALLY ILL PEOPLE END THEIR OWN LIVES.

THAT DISAPPEARS IN STATES WHERE MEDICAL AID IN DYING IS PERMISSIBLE.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU LOOK AT IT, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO DO WHAT PEOPLE FEEL THAT THEY NEED TO DO, AND NO LAW IS GOING TO PROHIBIT THEM.

BUT THEY CAN'T DO IT WITH THEIR FAMILY AND FRIENDS AROUND THEM.

THE SECOND IS THAT DISABILITY RIGHTS, IN OREGON, MONITORS THE DISABLED COMMUNITY, AND THEY HAVE BEEN DOING IT FOR ALMOST A QUARTER OF A CENTURY IN OREGON, AND THEY HAVE NO CASES WHERE PEOPLE WITHING DISABILITIES ARE TARGETED.

>> ONE OF -- >> Braude: IF I MAY, DIANE, FRANKLY THE MOST PERSUASIVE ARGUMENT AGAINST WAS NOT FROM A LEGISLATOR, BUT THE D.C. A.M.A.

CHURCH, AND IT RINGS PARTICULARLY TRUE WHAT I'M ABOUT TO PLAY BECAUSE IN THE TIME OF COVID, WE HOPEFULLY HAVE BECOME SENSITIZED TO THE HEALTH INEQUITIES THAT PEOPLE OF COLOR, POOR PEOPLE, HAVE HAD TO LIVE WITH FOREVER.

HERE IS PASTOR LAMAR.

>> I UNDERSTAND THE LAW.

I SUPPORT WHAT THE LAW MAKES AVAILABLE.

BUT I DO NOT TRUST THE GOVERNMENT AND ESTABLISHMENT TO BE FAIR.

IF I HAD A MAGIC WAND THAT WOULD ENSURE THAT NO PERSON AT ALL, NO MATTER WHO THEY ARE, WOULD BE DISCRIMINATED AGAINST, AND THAT THEY WOULD BE TREATED FAIRLY AND HONORABLY, IF THIS WAS THAT PERSON'S DECISION, THEN I WOULD SUPPORT IT.

>> Braude: DIANE, I DON'T HAVE MUCH TIME, BUT WHAT DO YOU SAY TO PASTOR LAMAR?

HE IS RIGHT ABOUT ALL OF THE INEQUITIES IN THE SYSTEM, AND THE THIRD AND FOURTH-CLASS TREATMENT THAT PEOPLE OF COLOR GET IN THE HEALTH CARE SYSTEM?

>> WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT EXPERIMENTS LIKE THAT CONDUCTED, THE TUSKEGEE EXPERIMENT -- >> Braude: OF COURSE.

>> -- AND THE ISSUE OF SYPHILUS, HE HAS GOOD REASON TO BE DISTRUSTFUL.

BUT IF THERE HAD BEEN ONE CASE WHERE THIS KIND OF DISCRIMINATION HAD OCCURRED, SINCE THE LAW IS IN 10 STATES AND D.C. HAVE PUT INTO PLACE, THEN I WOULD AGREE WITH HIM.

BUT HE, HIMSELF, SAID WHEN YOU CAN ENSURE THAT NO DISCRIMINATION OR FORCE TAKES PLACE, I WILL SUPPORT THIS.

>> Doctor: THE OTHER PART OF THAT IS THAT EACH INDIVIDUAL HAS TO DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES, AND SO IF SOMEONE FEELS THAT THERE IS DISCRIMINATION AND THEY WANT TO CONTINUE WITH FULL CARE, THEY CAN CONTINUE WITH FULL CARE.

>> Braude: DIANE, I ONLY HAVE 30 SECONDS LEFT.

MASSACHUSETTS IS, AS I MENTIONED -- THEIR BILL IS PENDING IN THE ERA OF COVID, WHERE PEOPLE ARE MUCH CLOSER TO DEATH, TALKING ABOUT IT MUCH MORE THAN THEY HAVE IN THE PAST, THE LINE YOU USED IN THE FILM, "EACH OF US IS ONE DEATH AWAY FROM HAVING THIS POSITION," ARE YOU MORE OPTIMISTIC THAT THERE WILL BE A DIFFERENT OUTCOME IN MASSACHUSETTS THIS TIME AROUND?

>> I TESTIFIED IN MASSACHUSETTS TWO YEARS AGO.

I AM MORE OPTIMISTIC NOW BECAUSE THERE ARE MORE SUPPORTERS FOR THE BILL THIS TIME THAN HAS BEEN IN THE PAST.

I DO NOT BELIEVE A LAWMAKER SHOULD DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT A SUFFERING SUFFERING, END OF LIFE PERSON CAN DIE OR NOT.

>> Braude: DR. KLIGLER AND DIANE REHM, THANK YOU FOR YOUR WORK AND ADVOCACY, AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME TONIGHT.

I REALLY APPRECIATE IT.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Doctor: THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> Braude: YOU CAN WATCH "WHEN MY TIME COMES" ONLINE NOW AT THE ADDRESS ON YOUR SCREEN.

>>> NEXT UP, FAR TOO MANY CASES OF SEX TRAFFICKING GO UNREPORTED, UNPROSECUTED, AND REMAIN UNKNOWN, BUT CASES OF MALE VICTIMS ARE ESPECIALLY LIKELY TO GO UNSEEN.

A NEW REPORT FROM GBH'S CENTER FOR INVESTIGATIVE REPORTING, CALLED "UNSEEN: THE BOY VICTIMS OF THE SEX TRADE," DIVES DEEP INTO SOME OF THE LIKELY THOUSANDS OF CASES IN MASSACHUSETTS ALONE, INCLUDING THAT OF CHRIS BATES, WHO WAS JUST 16 WHEN HE WAS LURED INTO SELLING SEX A DECADE AGO.

>> I ALWAYS THOUGHT WHEN I WAS IN THE LIFE, LIKE, I'M LIKE -- I DON'T THINK PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR BOYS.

IT'S HAPPENING IN, LIKE, PEOPLE'S HOMES.

IT'S HAPPENING EVERYWHERE.

AND PEOPLE NEED TO OPEN THEIR MINDS TO THIS ISSUE AND REALIZE ITS ALL AROUND US, REALLY.

>> Braude: I'M JOINED BY THE TWO SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE REPORTERS BEHIND THIS STORY, JENNIFER McKIM AND PHILLIP MARTIN.

>> Braude: CONGRATULATIONS TO BOTH YOU OF, YOUR REPORTS ARE TERRIFIC.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING ME.

>> THANK YOU, JIM.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Braude: JENNIFER, LET ME START WITH YOU.

WHEN YOU HEAR OF SEX TRAFFICKING, I AM NOT A TYPICAL -- IT'S TRUE, YOU THINK OF GIRLS, YOUNG WOMEN.

HOW SIGNIFICANT IS THE ISSUE WITH BOYS, YOUNG MEN?

>> SO YOU'RE RIGHT.

PHILLIP MARTIN AND I HAVE BOTH WORKED FOR YEARS COVERING ISSUES RELATED TO SEX TRAFFICKING IN THE UNITED STATES, INCLUDING DOMESTIC SEX TRAFFICKING VICTIMS, AND YOU USUALLY THINK OF GIRLS, WHICH IS A HUGE PROBLEM.

BUT WHAT WE'VE REALIZED THERE IS ALSO AN EVEN MORE UNDERGROUND, HARDER TO FIND PROBLEM OF TRAFFICKED AND EXPLOITED BOYS, AND SOME STUDIES SAY IS AS MUCH AS A THID OF THIRD OF THE ENTIRE TOTAL.

>> Braude: PHILLIP, WHY DO WE KNOW SO LET ABOUT THIS?

>> FOR A LOT OF REASONS.

THE REASON THAT THE LAW ENFORCEMENT FOCUSES -- YOU HEAR A LOT ABOUT SEX TRAFFICKING, BUT WHAT YOU LARGELY HEAR IS FOCUSED ON FEMALES FOR GOOD REASON.

THEY, OF COURSE, REPRESENT THE MAJORITY OF THOSE WHO ARE TRAFFICKED.

BUT THERE ARE ALSO BOYS AND MEN WHO ARE TRAFFICKED.

AND THERE ARE SEVERAL REASONS WHY WE DON'T HEAR ABOUT THIS.

ONE IS POLICE AND SOCIAL SERVICE AGENCIES DON'T TAKE IT AS SERIOUSLY.

THE SECOND REASON IS BECAUSE OF TOXIC MASCULINITY.

MANY MEN AND BOYS WILL NOT ADMIT TO BEING TRAFFICKED.

IT IS NOT SOMETHING THAT THEY WILL ADMIT TO.

IT IS ONE OF THOSE TABOO TOPICS, IF YOU WILL.

>> Braude: WHEN YOU SAY PEOPLE IN LAW ENFORCEMENT DON'T TAKE IT AS SERIOUSLY, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

IF IT IS A BROWN KID OR A BLACK KID, IT IS MORE LIKELY THAT HE IS SEEN AS A CRIMINAL RATHER THAN AS A VICTIM?

IS THAT WHERE YOU'RE GOING WITH THAT, PHILLIP?

>> THAT'S PRECISELY THE CASE.

I SHOULD MENTION THAT JENNIFER TOOK THE LEAD ON PART ONE OF THIS SERIES, AND I'M TAKING THE LEAD AT PART TWO, AND WE, IN FACT, LOOK AT RACE IN PART TWO.

ONE OF THE PEOPLE WE INTERVIEWED SAID YOU COULD SEE A CAR FULL OF BLACK OR BROWN YOUTH, AND YOU THINK THERE IS A CAR FULL OF BOYS.

BUT YOU MIGHT NOT THINK AMONG THEM IS A VICTIM.

IF YOU SEE A CAR FULL OF BOYS AND A YOUNG WOMAN, A POLICE OFFICER MIGHT HAVE SOME INCLINATION, BASED ON ANY NUMBER OF FACTORS, THERE IS A PROBLEM HERE.

BUT WITH THE BOYS, WITH YOUNG MEN, IT IS SEEN AS JUST A CAR FULL OF BOYS.

AND IF THEY'RE BLACK AND BROWN, QUITE OFTEN THEY ARE SEEN IN A CRIMINAL -- THROUGH A CRIMINAL PRISM.

WHICH IS THE PRISM THAT YOUNG BLACK AND BROWN BOYS ARE OFTEN SEEN, BASED ON ANY NUMBER OF THINGS, JIM.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, JEN, ONE OF THE TWO YOUNG MEN WHO YOU PROFILE, JOSE ORFARO, WHAT I HEARD HIM SAY REALLY BREAKS YOUR HEART, BUT IT EXPLAINS THE SMALL AMOUNT OF REPORTING.

HERE HE IS.

>> I DIDN'T SEE MYSELF AS A VICTIM.

I SAW MYSELF AS SOMEONE WHO PARTICIPATED IN THIS BUSINESS WITH HIM.

AND I FELT LIKE I WAS JUST AS WRONG AS HE WAS.

>> Braude: I WAS JUST AS WRONG AS HE WAS.

THAT IS JUST -- HOW DO MOST OF THESE YOUNG MEN, BOYS IN SOME CASES -- HOW DID THEY GET INTO THIS?

>> JOSE IS AN AMAZING PERSON.

HE TALKS ABOUT HOW HE FELT GUILTY, THAT HE WAS JUST AS GUILTY AS THIS PERSON WHO TRAFFICKED HIM.

HE WAS 16 YEARS OLD.

AND THE PERSON WHO WAS SELLING HIM WAS IN HIS 30s.

HE WAS A YOUNG, HOMELESS KID, WHO WAS KICKED OUT OF HIS HOME BECAUSE HE WAS GAY.

THERE IS A LOT OF ISSUES RELATED TO RACE AND HOMOPHOBIA.

TRANS KIDS ARE OFTEN VICTIMIZED.

SO PEOPLE LIKE JOSE, AND WE SPOKE TO ANOTHER YOUNG MAN, CHRIS BATES, WHO WAS 16, ALSO, GOT LURED IN AND GROOMED BY THE INTERNET, AND STARTED TO SLOWLY GET MORE AND MORE INVOLVED IN EXPLOITATION.

>> Braude: WHAT IS SURVIVAL SEX, JEN?

>> SO THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS -- I THINK THAT IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT MAKES THIS VERY CONFUSING, WHEN YOU OFTEN THINK ABOUT TRAFFICKING, YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT SOME PERSON OVERSEAS BEING HELD BY CHAINS, BUT A LOT OF THESE ISSUES ARE RELATED TO WHAT THEY CALL SURVIVAL SEX, WHICH IS WHAT HAPPENED TO JOSE AND CHRIS, WHICH THEY WERE YOUNG MEN, OUT ON THEIR OWN.

BASICALLY THE ONLY WAY THEY FELT THEY COULD SURVIVE WAS TO BE SELLING SEX FOR THINGS OF VALUE.

AND UNDER THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, SEX TRAFFICKING IS CONSIDERED SEX TRAFFICKING IF YOU'RE UNDER THE AGE OF 18 AND TRADING SEX FOR SOMETHING OF VALUE LIKE A HOME OR FOOD.

>> Braude: PHILLIP, I KNOW YOU MENTIONED JENNIFER DID MOST OF PART ONE, AND YOU'LL BE DOING PART TWO, WHICH AIRS ON MONDAY, CAN YOU TELL US A LITTLE ABOUT JASON VALASQUES?

>> SURE.

HE IS FEATURED IN PART ONE, AND AN UPCOMING SERIES -- >> Braude: MY APOLOGIES.

>> THAT'S NO PROBLEM.

BUT I WILL LET HER TALK ABOUT VALASQUEZ.

AND THERE IS ANOTHER PERSON WE INTERVIEW IN THIS SERIES, AND HIS NAME IS FILMORE.

HE IS A MAN WITH A Ph.D., WHO WAS ONCE TRAFFICKED IN CHICAGO.

WHO ENDURED A LIFETIME, AND I MEAN LITERALLY A LIFETIME OF SEXUAL ABUSE PREDICATED LARGELY ON RACE.

HE WAS ESSENTIALLY TRAFFICKED IN CHICAGO.

ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT TIES ALL OF THIS IN, JIM, TO YOUR OTHER QUESTION OF HOW PEOPLE GET INTO THIS, THE INTRICATE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN POVERTY AND TRAFFICKING, AND WITH A NUMBER OF THESE INDIVIDUALS, ALMOST EVERY ONE YOU'LL MEET IN THIS SERIOUS WHO HAS BEEN TRAFFICKED AND IS A SURVIVOR, THEY STARTED OFF HOMELESS, AND THEY WERE HOMELESS BECAUSE EITHER THEY WERE -- EITHER THEY LOST THEIR HOMES THROUGH BEING RACIALLY OSTRACIZED OR THEY WERE GAY OR ANY NUMBER OF FACTORS WHERE THEY WERE ESSENTIALLY THROWN OUT, CAST ASIDE.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, JENNIFER, I WILL FOLLOW THE ADVICE OF PHILLIP AND ASK YOU ABOUT JASON VALASQUEZ.

I DON'T HAVE MUCH TIME, BUT TELL ME A LITTLE ABOUT HIS STORY.

>> BRIEFLY, JASON VALASQUEZ WAS LAID OFF LAST YEAR, A CONSTRUCTION WORKER.

HE ALSO HAD SUFFERED SEXUAL ASSAULT AS A YOUNGER PERSON.

HE STARTED SOMETHING CALLED PREDATORS, POACHERS IN MASSACHUSETTS, WHICH HE PRETENDS TO BE A YOUNG CHILD AND BASICALLY GOES AND SORTS OF HUMILIATES PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO -- PREDATORS WHO ARE TRYING TO GO AFTER YOUNG PEOPLE.

AND THEN HE PROVIDES THAT INFORMATION TO POLICE.

AND IN ONE CASE THAT WE LOOKED AT, HE ACTUALLY ENDED UP LEADING TO CHARGES TO THE FORMER POLICE CHIEF OF STOWE, MASSACHUSETTS, A SMALL TOWN IN MASSACHUSETTS.

>> Braude: YOU KNOW, SPEAKING OF LEADING THE CHARGES, ONE OF THE MOST DEPRESSING PARTS OF THIS STORY, IS PHILLIP, WHEN I READ MOST OF THE TRAFFICKING AND EXPLOITATION CASES ARE DISMISSED.

WHY?

WHY?

>> FOR ANY NUMBER OF REASONS, JIM.

SOMETIMES THE WITNESSES DON'T COME FORWARD.

SOMETIMES THE -- IT'S HARD TO PROVE A TRAFFICKING CASE FOR THE REASONS THAT JENNIFER MENTIONED, WHEN IT SEEMS LIKE THERE IS SOME RECIPROCAL TRANSACTIONAL CONDITION, BUT THOSE TRANSACTIONAL CONDITIONS SHOULD NOT APPLY IF SOMEONE IS UNDER THE AGE OF 18.

UNDER THE AGE OF 18, IT IS TECHNICALLY TRAFFICKING.

BUT WHAT YOU MAINLY FIND ARE A LOT OF YOUNG PEOPLE WON'T COME FORWARD, ESPECIALLY YOUNG MEN.

THEY DO NOT WANT TO BE IDENTIFIED.

THEY'RE ALREADY TRAUMATIZED.

AND GETTING YOUNG MEN TO SPEAK ABOUT WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO THEM IS VERY PROBLEMATIC FOR THEM.

THEY FEEL THEY'RE OSTRACIZED NOT JUST AS VICTIMS AND SURVIVORS, AND WON'T BE SEEN AS VICTIMS AND SURVIVORS, BUT WOULD HAVE A HARD TIME, IF YOU WILL, THE TOXIC MASCULINITY PERMEATING MANY COMMUNITIES, COMMUNITIES ACROSS THE BOARD.

>> Braude: JENNIFER, MAURA HEALEY IS APPARENTLY EARNESTLY TRYING TO CHANGE THIS DYNAMIC, NO?

>> EXACTLY.

SHE HAS BEEN WORKING ON -- OR HER OFFICE HAS BEEN WORKING ON ISSUES OF SEX TRAFFICKING FOR THE LAST DECADE.

THEY FILED 62 CASES OVER THIS TIME PERIOD, AND YET ONLY ONE OF THEM HAS HAD A MALE VICTIM.

THAT IS A CONCERN SHE SEES AND IS SOMETHING SHE WANTS TO DO MORE.

FIRST OF ALL, WE'RE NOT SEEING ENOUGH OF THE YOUNG WOMEN, EITHER, BUT BOYS ARE EVEN FARTHER UNDERGROUND.

>> Braude: LET ME JUST TELL YOU, AS I SAID AT THE BEGINNING AND I'LL SAY AGAIN, THIS IS AN EYE-OPENING SERIES TH EVERYBODY HAS AN OBLIGATION TO CHECK OUT.

WONDERFUL REPORTING, AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME, BOTH OF YOU.

I REALLY APPRECIATE IT.

>> THANK THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR INTEREST.

>> Braude: THE SECOND INSTALLMENT WILL BE OUT ON MONDAY.

>> AND DAVID TOLD US HE ENJOYED THE CREATIVITY AND WHOEVER CLEVERLY PAINTED OVER THIS MANHOLE, AND I DID, TOO, DAVID.

IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING YOU WOULD LIKE TO SHARE WITH US, USE THE ADDRESSES ON YOUR SCREEN.

THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT.

PLEASE COME BACK TOMORROW, BOSTON CITY COUNCILOR LYDIA EDWARDS JOINS ME ON THE REPORT THAT THEY HID ALLEGATIONS THAT A LONG TIME COP AND POLICE UNION PRESIDENT WAS A CHILD PREDATOR.

AND J.C. MONAHAN TALKS ABOUT HER STRUGGLES WITH DEPRESSION IN BOSTON MAGAZINE.

THAT AND MORE TOMORROW AT 7:00.

THANKS FOR WATCHING AND PLEASE STAY SAFE.

Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org