>> FROM OUR STATE HOUSE STUDIO IN MONTGOMERY, I'M TODD STACY.

WELCOME TO "CAPITOL JOURNAL'"S WEEK IN REVIEW.

AND WHAT A WEEK IT WAS IN THE ALABAMA LEGISLATURE.

WE'LL GET TO THAT IN A BIT, BUT FIRST SOME BREAKING NEWS.

FORMER STATE REPRESENTATIVE WILL DISMUKES HAS BEEN ON CHARGES OF FIRST-DEGREE PROPERTY THEFT BY A MONTGOMERY JURY.

DISMUKES WAS ACCUSED OF STEALING MORE THAN $2,500 AND FLOORING EQUIPMENT FROM HIS FORMER EMPLOYER.

DISMUKES SERVED ONE TERM IN THE ALABAMA HOUSE REPRESENTING PRATTVILLE AND MILLBROOK IN DISTRICT 88, AND BRIEFLY RAN FOR CONGRESS BEFORE DROPPING OUT.

MONTGOMERY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DARYL BAILEY SAID HE WILL BE PURSUING SIGNIFICANT PRISON TIME FOR DISMUKES.

SENTENCING WILL TAKE PLACE MAY 4.

BACK TO THE CURRENT LEGISLATURE, THE HOUSE AND SENATE MET FOR THE 8TH , 9TH AND 10TH LEGISLATIVE DAYS, BRINGING US TO THE ONE THIRD MARK OF THE 30 DAY SESSION.

THE PACKAGE OF ECONOMIC INCENTIVE BILLS KNOWN AS THE GAME PLAN SAW ITS FIRST VOTES ON THURSDAY - AND THEY WERE UNANIMOUS IN THE HOUSE AND SENATE.

ALABAMA'S CURRENT INCENTIVES LAWS - THE ALABAMA JOBS ACT AND THE GROWING ALABAMA ACT - ARE EXPIRING THIS YEAR.

THAT'S BY DESIGN BECAUSE THE LAWS AUTHORS INTENDED TO FORCE FUTURE LEGISLATURES TO UPDATE THE STATUTES TO KEEP UP WITH ECONOMIC TRENDS.

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT GOVERNOR KAY IVEY, LT GOVERNOR WILL AINSWORTH AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS ARE TRYING TO DO.

THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES PASSED ALL FOUR GAME PLAN BILLS, WHILE THE SENATE PASSED TWO OF THEM.

ALL THE VOTES WERE UNANIMOUS.

THE BILLS WILL NOW SWITCH CHAMBERS AND BE IN COMMITTEE NEXT WEEK WITH POSSIBLE FINAL PASSAGE NEXT THURSDAY.

SENATE PRESIDENT PRO TEM GREG REED SAID THE LEGISLATURE'S QUICK AND UNANIMOUS ACTION ON THE GAME PLAN BILLS SHOWS WHAT A HIGH PRIORITY THEY ARE.

>> THE INCENTIVE BILLS, WHICH WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT FOR MONTHS, THE SENATE TODAY PUT TWO OF THOSE OUT -- THE TRANSPARENCY BILL AND THE SEED BILL.

AND WE'RE WORKING ON THE FOUR-BILL PACKAGE FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT INCENTIVES SO I'M EXCITED ABOUT THAT.

I THINK THAT THE IMPORTANT THING WITH THE INCENTIVE SEAS THAT THE INCENTIVES HAVE WORK EXTREMELY WELL.

YOU LOOK AT THE STATISTICS OF BILLIONS AND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF INVESTMENT IN THE STATE OF ALABAMA., TENSE OF THOUSANDS OF JOBS THAT ARE OURS TO ENJOY AND THE PEOPLE OF ALABAMA SO HAVE A GOOD INCOME AND GOOD JOB AS A RESULT OF THESE INCENTIVES BEING SUCCESSFUL.

IF YOU MEDICARE THOSE JOBS THAT ARE INCENTIVE FOCUSED RATHER THAN THOSE THAT AREN'T, THERE'S A SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE IN HOURLY WAGE RELATED TO THOSE.

SO THE STATISTICS ON THE SUCCESS OF THE INCENTIVES HAVE PROVEN THEMSELVES TO BE VERY STRONG.

AND AS A RESULT, I THINK WE NEED TO KEEP DOING A GOOD THINGS.

>>THE SENATE ALSO PASSED LEGISLATION AIMED AT UPDATING ALABAMA'S ADOPTION LAWS TO STREAMLINE THE PROCESS WHILE ENSURING PROTECTIONS FOR CHILDREN AND FAMILIES.

HOUSE BILL 101 FROM STATE REPRESENTATIVE GINNY SHAVER WAS AMENDED IN THE SENATE TO ALLOW PROSPECTIVE FOSTER PARENTS TO APPLY FOR AN EXEMPTION TO VACCINATION REQUIREMENTS AT THE DEPARTMENT OF HUMAN RESOURCES.

THE BILL THEN PASSED THE SENATE, WENT BACK TO THE HOUSE AND RECEIVED FINAL PASSAGE.

>> THE BIGGEST PROCESS IS PARENTS RIGHTS.

WE WANT TO PROTECT PARENTS RIGHTS.

WE WANT TO TAKE TIME -- THIS SHAVES OFF A LITTLE TIME IN THAT RESPECT.

BECAUSE WE HAVE OVER 5700 CHILDREN IN FOSTER CARE IN ALABAMA AND ON AVERAGE THEY SPEND TWO YEARS OR LONGER AND TO THAT'S A LONG TIME IN THE LIFE AND DEVELOPMENT OF A CHILD.

SO SHAVING OFF THE TIME THERE AND ALSO SPEEDING UP THE COURT PROCESSES ALLOWING THE COURTS TO COMMUNICATE WITH EACH OTHER AND PROTECTING THE CONFIDENTIALITY OF THE DOCUMENTS INVOLVED AND JUST CLARIFYING WHICH COURT IS IN THE PROCESS, AND JUST ALL THROUGH THAT PROCESS.

>> THERE WERE OTHER HIGH PROFILE BILLS CONSIDERED IN THE HOUSE THIS WEEK.

PLUS LAWMAKERS GOT TO HEAR FROM INTEREST GROUPS GATHERED AT THE STATE HOUSE FOR DEMONSTRATIONS.

CAPITOL JOURNAL'S RANDY SCOTT REPORTS ON A BUSY WEEK OF ACTION IN THE HALLS OF THE LEGISLATURE.

>> IN THE ALL REGULAR SESSION ACTION TOOK PLACE IN THE STATEHOUSE.

THIS RALLY GIVES VOTERS A CHANCE TO HAVE THEIR VOICES HEARD, THIS TIME ON THE SUBJECT OF REMOVING SALES TAX ON EMBRYOS GROCERIES.

>> WE'RE HERE TODAY TO ASK OUR LAWMAKERS TO END THE GROCERY TAX QUICKLY AND RESPONSIBLY.

THIS IS THE YEAR TO FINALLY UNTAX GROCERIES ONCE AND FOR ALL.

>> SPEAKERS AT THIS EVENT SAY ALABAMA IS ONE OF THREE STATES THAT CONTINUES TO TAX GROCERIES.

AND THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE.

>> 4 PERCENT OF YOUR GROCERY SPENDING GOES TOWARD THE STATE GROCERY TAX.

THE ANGE ALABAMA FAMILY OF FOUR SPENDS APPROXIMATELY $600 A YEAR IN GROCERY TAX.

THE STATE'S 4 PERCENT GROCERY TAX IS ENOUGH TO PAY FOR AN ADDITIONAL TWO WEEKS WORTH OF FEED EVERY SINGLE YEAR AND YOU ALL THE KNOW THAT BOB HELPFUL TO ALABAMA.

FAMILIES.

>> WE TALKED ABOUT THIS OVER AND OVER AND OVER.

IT IS TIME!

YOU ALL COME HERE EVERY YEAR AND STAND RIGHT HERE AND YOU SEND YOUR MESSAGE THAT WE NEED TO TAKE OUR SALES TAX OFF GROCERIES.

YOU SEND US HERE AND ELECT US TO BE YOUR MOUTHPIECE.

YOU HAVE SPOKEN.

IT'S TIME FOR US TO SPEAK UP.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> KEITH WILLIAMS SAID THIS IS A GOOD CHANCE FOR VOTERS TO SPEAK DIRECTLY TO LAWMAKERS.

>> THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT DEMOCRACY IS ALL ABOUT -- PEOPLE COMING TO WHERE THE PLAYERS ARE, THE PEOPLE THAT MAKE THE DECISIONS THAT WE HAVE ABLE TO HAVE ONE-ON-ONE CONVERSATIONS WITH THEM AND TELLING OUR STORY OF THE ISSUES THAT IMPACT US THE MOST.

>> INSIDE THE HOUSE CHAMBER, PROPOSALS SUCH AS SENATE BILL ONE WERE BEING DEBATED BY HOUSE MEMBERS.

CALLED THE DEPUTY BRAD JOHNSON ACT, THIS BILL ADDRESSES THE GOOD TIME RULES FOR ALABAMA INMATES.

>> CORRECTIONS IS NOT SOLELY ABOUT INCARCERATION.

BUT THERE ARE TWO OTHER COMPONENTS THAT WE MUST HAVE AS A VITAL PIECE OF WHAT WE'RE WORKING ON.

YOU MUST HAVE THE ABILITY TO EDUCATE AND YOU MUST HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO REHABILITATION.

SO I SUBMIT TO YOU WE ARE FAILING THE SYSTEM IF WE DO NOT HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE THESE INMATES IN OUR FACILITY IN A TIME PERIOD WHICH WE CAN HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO EDUCATE AND REHABILITATE.

>> WHEN THIS MAN VIOLATED HIS PAROLE OR HOWEVER HE GOT OUT, BUT HE WENT BACK INTO PRISON, I UNDERSTAND HE MIGHT HAVE GONE TO TWO DIFFERENT FATAL FACILITIES SORE SOMETHING.

BUT THAT WAS AN ERROR ON THE PEOPLE THERE THAT HE GOT OUT.

BUT YOU'RE GOING TO COME BACK AND YOU'RE GOING TO MODIFY THE GOOD TIME AND PUNISH EVERYBODY BECAUSE OF THE ERROR WHICH IT HAPPENS TO HAVE BEEN THE STATE'S ERROR IN LETTING THAT GUY OUT IN THE 1ST PLACE.

>> SENATE BILL ONE WAS APPROVED.

>> I'M JUST AN ADVOCATE FOR REHABILITATION AND EDUCATION, SOMEBODY WHO THE JUDGE DETERMINED SHOULD BE THERE FOR 10 YEARS AND THEY'RE ONLY THERE FOR THREE YEARS, WE CAN'T HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO EDUCATE AND REHABILITATE.

SO WHILE THERE IS ENOUGH BLAME TO GO AROUND AND WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE OFFENDER THAT MURDERED DEPUTY JOHNSON I WANT TO TAKE THIS AS A POSITIVE THAT WE'RE OFFERING AN OPPORTUNITY TO APPROVE SO WE DON'T FAIL THE INMATES INSIDE THE SIMILAR.

WE'RE OFFERING THEM A BETTER OUTCOME AFTER THE INCARCERATION IS OVER.

>> FOR "CAPITOL JOURNAL" I'M RANDY SCOTT.

>> THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT ACTION IN COMMITTEE THIS WEEK, SETTING BILLS UP FOR FURTHER CONSIDERATION.

A BILL DEALING WITH "“DIVISIVE CONCEPTS"” WAS BEFORE THE HOUSE STATE GOVERNMENT COMMITTEE.

HOUSE BILL 7 FROM STATE REPRESENTATIVE ED OLIVER WOULD PROHIBIT CERTAIN PUBLIC ENTITIES, INCLUDING STATE AGENCIES, K-12 SCHOOLS AND COLLEGES, FROM PROMOTING OR ENDORSING CERTAIN DIVISIVE CONCEPTS RELATING TO RACE, SEX, OR RELIGION.

THIS BILL WOULD ALSO PROHIBIT CERTAIN PUBLIC ENTITIES FROM CONDITIONING ENROLLMENT OR ATTENDANCE IN CERTAIN CLASSES ON THE BASIS OF RACE.

THE COMMITTEE ADVANCED THE BILL AFTER A PUBLIC HEARING THAT INCLUDED SOME PASSIONATE ARGUMENTS ON BOTH SIDES.

>> IT DOESN'T PREVENT ANY HISTORY, WHICH IS HOW IT IS ALWAYS FRAMED THAT WE CAN'T TEACH HISTORY BECAUSE OF THIS BILL.

WE'RE ALL PROPONENTS OF HISTORY -- GOOD, BAD AND UGLY.

IT'S WHO WE ARE AND WHAT MAKES US WHO WE ARE.

THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO ABOUT THAT.

WE ARE AT A POINT THOUGH IN THE WORLD WHERE WE WOULD LIKE TO FIND WAYS TO COALESCE AROUND THE THINGS THAT MAKE US STRONG AND MOVE FORWARD.

AND I'M ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE -- I DON'T WASN'T KIDS IN SCHOOL.

I THINK ABOUT WHEN I WAS A CHILD.

IT'S HARD ENOUGH TO LEARN HOW TO READ AND WRITE AND DO MATH, WHICH I STILL DON'T DO VERY WELL OBVIOUSLY, BUT WITHOUT HAVING THESE DIVERSIONS THAT ARE GOING ON AROUND YOU.

AND RACISM IS A SERIOUS ISSUE.

IT'S NOT SOMETHING WE SHOULD TEACH KIDS.

WE'VE DON'T WANT TO TEACH THEM HOW TO BE RACISTS.

I THINK THAT'S WRONG.

>> MY FOCUS WERE ENSLAVED.

THAT'S A FACT.

SLAVERY BY ITS VERY NATURE WAS EVIL AND SINISTER.

IT WAS DIVISIVE.

SO THAT WOULD BE A DIVISIVE CONCEPT.

BUT THERE'S NOT A SINGLE PERSON WHO VOTES IN FAVOR OF THIS TODAY WHO IS GOING TO SAY TAKE DOWN THE CONFEDERATE FLAG.

THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE A SINGLE PERSON WHO VOTES IN FAVOR OF THIS TODAY THAT IS GOING TO SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT, THERE ARE THINGS SOME OF MY ANCESTORS DID THAT WERE WRONG AND, YOU KNOW WHAT, IT WASN'T ME BUT I KNOW THAT IT WAS WRONG AND I DO FEEL THAT IT IS PART OF MY RESPONSIBILITY TO DO WHAT IS RIGHT, RIGHT HERE, RIGHT NOW, GOING FORWARD.

>> THE SENATE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE TOOK UP AND UNANIMOUSLY PASSED LEGISLATION AIMED TO LIMIT THE STATE FROM SUSPENDING THE DRIVERS LICENSE OF THOSE CHARGED WITH NON-MOVING TRAFFIC VIOLATIONS, SUCH AS FAILURE TO APPEAR OR UNPAID PARKING TICKETS.

THE BILL'S SPONSOR, STATE SENATOR WILL BARFOOT, SAYS EXCESSIVE DRIVERS LICENSE SUSPENSIONS ARE KEEPING AVAILABLE WORKERS ON THE SIDELINE DURING A WORKFORCE SHORTAGE.

>> NOW THERE ARE THOSE WHO SAY, WELL, THIS IS AN EFFORT TO MAKE SURE THAT COURT COSTS OR FINES ARE NOT PAID.

NOT THE CASE.

ALL COURT COSTS AND FINES ORDERED BY THE COURT WILL BE PAID.

HAVE TO BE PAID AND THIS BILL DOES NOTHING WITH THAT.

THERE'S STILL THE ABILITY FOR THE COURTS, SHOULD YOU MISS A COURT APPEARANCE DATE AFTER AN ADJUDICATION TO ISSUE A WARRANT FOR YOUR ARREST AND BRING YOU IN.

STILL THERE.

CURRENT LAW REMAINS LAW.

THERE'S STILL AN ABILITY FOR THE COURTS SHOULD YOU MISS MORE THAN A PAYMENT AT ANY POINT IN TIME.

IF YOU PAID RELIGIOUSLY LIKE YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO AND THEN YOU MISS A PAYMENT, GUESS WHAT, THE COURTS STILL HAVE THE ABILITY UNDERCURRENT LAW AND THIS BILL TO BRING YOU IN FOR A CONTEMPT HEARING.

ASK YOU WHY YOU HAVEN'T PAID AND HOLD YOU IN CONTEMPT IF THEY FIND THAT YOUR CONDUCT IS CON SEARCH USE.

>> WE WILL BE RIGHT BACK WITH TONIGHT'S GUESTS.

>> JOINING ME IS DANNY GARRETT FROM TRUSSVILLE CHAIRMAN OF THE HOUSE BUDGET COMMITTEE.

MR. CHAIRMAN, THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> YOU IS A LOT OF ISSUES TOUCHING YOUR REALM THERE IN THE ATF BUT I WANT TO START WITH INCENTIVES.

YOU CARRIED TWO OF THE 97 BILLS THAT PASSED THROUGH THE HOUSE TODAY.

>> RIGHT.

>> AND THEY'RE ON THEIR WAY TO THE SENATE.

YOU KNOW, NOT MANY CHANGES BUT A FEW.

BUT JUST TALK ABOUT IN GENERAL THESE INCENTIVES BILLS AND THE IMPORTANCE OF THEM AND YOUR WORK IN HELPING CRAFT THEM.

>> SURE.

WELL, THE JOBS ACT WAS PASSED IN 2015.

SINCE THAT TIME, THAT'S BEEN THE CATALYST OR THE DRIVER FOR MOST ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT FROG OF PROJECTS IN THE STATE AND IT'S BROUGHT $22 BILLION OF INVESTMENT TO THE STATE AND 40,000 JOBS.

AND THREE AND A HALF BILLION OF THAT INVESTMENT HAS BEEN TARGETED IN RURAL COUNTIES WITH LESS THAN 50,000 AND HAS CREATED ABOUT 6,000 JOBS.

THE GROWING ALABAMA ACT, WHICH WAS PART OF THE JOBS ACT, ALSO PROVIDED FUNDS FOR SITE DEVELOPMENT ALL ACROSS THE STAY.

AND WE'RE TO THE POINT NOW WHERE THOSE CREDITS, BOTH SUNSET IN JULY.

SO THE PROGRAM HAS TO BE RENEWED.

LAST YEAR OF THE LEGISLATURE PASSED THE JOINT TASK FORCE, THE TAX COMMISSION ON TAX INCENTIVES, UNDER THE DIRECTION OF THE LT.

GOVERNOR.

AND THEY UNANIMOUSLY REPRESENTED THE RENEWAL OF BOTH OF THESE PROGRAMS.

SO THE BILL THAT WE PASSED BASICALLY TAKES THAT POLICEMAN.

AND AFTER AHEAD YEARS OF WHAT WE HAD PREVIOUSLY, UPDATES IT AND MODERNIZES IT AND TREATMENT LINES IT AND LOOKS AT WHAT OTHER STATES ARE DOING AND SEES WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO MAKER IT MORE COMPETITIVE.

WHAT IT DOES, IT INCREASES THE CAP FROM 350 MILLION FOR THE JOBS ACT TO $475 MILLION OVER A FIVE-YEAR PERIOD SO WE WALK INTO THAT.

AS A PERCENTAGE OF THE BUDGET TODAY VITAL SIGNS WHAT IT SHOW THAT WAS A PERCENTAGE OF THE BUDGET IN 2015, IT'S ACTUALLY LESS WHICH INDICATES PARTIALLY THE EFFECTIVENESS OF THE INITIAL BILL BECAUSE IT'S CREATED JOBS AND HAS BEEN A BOOST TO OUR ECONOMY.

THERE ARE OTHER TECHNICAL CHANGES.

IT PROVIDED AN INCREASE IN THE ALABAMA CAP FROM $20 MILLION.

IT ALSO ADDED SOME THINGS THAT ARE GOING TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR US TO DEVELOP SIDES AND ASSESS SITES PREDEVELOPMENT.

WE'RE RUNNING LOW ON INVENTORY OF SITES IN THE STATE.

IT ALSO HAS A COMPONENT THAT ADDRESSED TOURISM.

THE PREVIOUSLY BILL HAD ONE PARAGRAPH THAT JUST LISTED A LOT OF THINGS THAT WE COULD DO FOR TOURISM AND DIDN'T GIVE SPECIFICS.

>> THAT WAS OF THE ONE SIGNIFICANT CHANGE THAT I SAW.

>> WHAT WE DID, WE ADDED ABOUT SEVEN PAGES WHICH BASICALLY SAID PARAMETERS, FURTHER DEFINITIONS, SET CRITERIA FOR TOURISM CREDIT BASED UPON INVESTMENT.

IT LIMITS THAT TO PROJECT, AND IT LIMITS THE HIT TO THE ETF TO $1 MILLION PER YEAR PER COMPANY.

THE INITIAL CAP PROPOSED WAS $20 MILLION FOR TOURISM CREDIT AND WE CUT THAT IN THE HOUSE TO $10 MILLION AND NOW MOVES TO THE SENATE.

WE WILL VET THAT PORTION A LITTLE FURTHER.

BUT IT'S JUST A CONTINUATION AND A MODERNIZATION OF WHAT HAS ALREADY WORKED AROUND.

AND OTHER STATES ARE PUTTING A LOT OF DOLLARS INTO SIDE DEVELOPMENT, A LOT OF THEM USE ARPA FUNDING OR OTHER SOURCES TO SURE THAT UP.

WE HAVEN'T DONE THAT.

WE HAVE SEE THE MECHANISM FOR US TO CONTRIBUTE TO SITE DEVELOPMENT SITUATIONS WHICH WE'RE RUNNING LOW ON SITES AND THAT'S CRITICAL, PARTICULARLY FOR MEGA SITES.

>> THEY OUGHT TO HAVE BROADBAND SOON.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

OUR BROADBAND EFFORTS CONTINUE TO ME MOVE.

WE HAVE A GREAT PLAN OF.

>> THAT IS A COMPONENT OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

BROAD BAND IS A HUGE COMPONENT.

AND ALSO THE EDUCATION SYSTEM IN SOME OF THESE AREAS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO TARGET NEEDS HELP SO WE PUT A LOT OF RESOURCES IN THE EDUCATION BUDGET SHORING UP THOSE AREAS SO IT'S A COLLABORATIVE EFFORT WITH A LOT OF DIFFERENT GROUPS.

AND THIS WAS SIGNIFICANT TO KEEPING THE STATE MOVING FORWARD.

>> THAT'S AT GREAT POINT ABOUT EDUCATION.

SO I REMEMBER -- I GUESS IT WAS AT THE BCA CONFERENCE WHEN YOU WERE ON A PANEL TALKING ABOUT THIS AND IT WAS THE SPEAKER OR YOU THAT MADE THE COMMENT THAT IMPROVING OUR EDUCATION SYSTEM MAY BE THE BEST ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT TOOL WE COULD HAVE STATED-WIDE.

>> YES.

>> LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT THIS GROCERY TAX ISSUE.

THIS HAS BEEN -- THIS HAS SUDDENLY BECOME THE TOP ISSUE EVERYBODY IS TALKING ABOUT, PROBABLY BECAUSE IT'S UNEXPECTED; RIGHT?

IF YOU WOULD HAVE ASKED ME FIVE MONTHS AGO NOBODY WOULD SAY THIS IS GOING TO BE A FRONT BURNER ISSUE.

BUT IT IS NOW.

AND YOU HAVE FILED YOUR OWN GROCERY SALES TAX CUT BILL.

WALK ME THROUGH WHAT YOUR PLAN DOES.

>> FIRST, LET ME ASK, BECAUSE I HAVE A MASTER'S IN TAX ACCOUNTING, SO HAVE TO GO DOWN INTO THE WEEDS.

>> THAT'S FINE.

WE HAVE A TIME.

>> WHEN YOU LOOKS AT THE GROCERY TAX AND THE SALES TAX IN GENERAL, IT'S 4 PERCENT ON ALL PRODUCTS.

AND OUR BASE IS NARROWER THAN OTHER STATES.

OUR STATE RATE OF 4 PERCENT IS THE SECOND LOWEST OF ALL OF THE STATES THAT HAVE SALES TAX RATES.

THERE ARE ABOUT FIVE OR SIX STATES THAT DON'T HAVE A SALES TAX.

FOR THE REST THAT DO WE HAVE THE SECOND LOWEST RATE.

ALL OF THAT CONVERSATION OF COMES INTO THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND.

THE SALES RATE GETS NORTH OF 11 PERCENT BECAUSE OF WHAT THE LOCALS ADD TO IT.

>> THAT'S THE LION'S SHARE OF WHAT WE ACTUALLY PAY.

>> THAT'S THE LION'S SHARE AND MOST OF THE THAT GOES TO THE LOCALS.

SO THE GROCERY STACKS -- AND WHEN YOU PUT ALL OF OUR TAX STRUCTURE TOGETHER WE HAVE THE LOWEST TAX COLLECTIONS PER CATCH AT THAT IN THE COUNTRY.

WE'RE NUMBER 50.

WE'RE AT THE LOWEST MOUNTAIN OF TAX COLLECTIONS.

OUR STRUCTURE IS DIFFERENT FROM OTHER STATES.

SO WE'RE TAKING THAT BOTTOM -- YOU KNOW, WE'RE NUMBER 50.

AND WE'RE LOWERING THAT.

THAT'S FINE.

WEAVER ALL IN FAVOR OF MAKING TAX IMPROVEMENTS AND FAX RESTRUCTURING AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

BUT YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHEN WE DO THAT WE'RE LOWERING OUR REVENUE WHICH NOW WE WILL EXPECT TO COMPETE WITH THE OTHER STATES ON OTHER THINGS, EDUCATION AND SERVICES AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

SO IT'S SOMETHING WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT.

AND MOST OF THE SALES TAX MONEY IS AT THE LOCAL LEVEL.

NOW, GROCERY TAX IS SPECIFIC AND I KNOW YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE TO PAY NOR GROCERIES.

AND I GET THAT CONCEPT.

IT'S JUST THAT BECAUSE WE IN ALABAMA DO TAX THAT BUT DON'T TAX A LOT OF OTHER THINGS STATES TAX.

WHAT HAVE WE DONE?

I FILED THE BILL AND SENATOR ORR ALES BILL WHICH LOOKS AT THE NARROWEST DEFINITION OF GROCERIES, OF THE WIC, WOMEN AND CHILDREN DEFINITION.

HEALTHY PRODUCTS.

IT HAS ONLY ABOUT A 200 TO TWO A $50 MILLION OF EDUCATION TRUST FUND SO IT HAS THE LEAST IMPACT OF THE TRUST IF YOU SAID BUT IT DOES HAVE -- WE PROVIDE RELIEF BUT FOR CERTAIN PRODUCTS.

SOME OF THE OTHER BILLS THAT WE HAVE SEEN ARE GOING TO BE CLOSER TO $500 MILLION IMPACT OR $700 MILLION IMPACT.

WE NEED TO GET THEM ALL ON THE TABLE AND SEE ALL OF OTHER TAX INCENTIVES AND MEASURES OR ANY OTHER MEASURES THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT THAT WOULD AFFECT THE ETF NEGATIVELY AND PRIORITY PHASE.

SO I THINK GROCERY TAX -- I GUESSED SOUNDBYTE.

I GET THE DRUMBEAT.

BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE ACTUAL DEGREES IT'S NOT GOING TO SAVE INDIVIDUALS THAT MUCH MONEY.

BUT IT COLLECTIVELY IS A BIG NUMBER AND IT'S COMING OUT OF THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND WHICH IS GOING TO IMPACT WHAT WE DO WITH THE EDUCATION BUDGET.

>> WHICH IS WHY IT'S NEVER PASSED FOR THE LAST 20 YEARS BECAUSE KNOWN NOBODY WAS WILLING TO TAKE THAT HIT.

THERE ARE THOSE THAT HAVE THAT REPLACEMENT AND SEEM TO REPLACE THAT REVENUE WITH OTHER MEANS.

MOST NOTABLY ENDING THE FEDERAL INCOME TAX DEDUCTION THAT A LOT OF FOLKS ENJOY.

DOES YOUR BILL HAVE ANY KIND OF WAY TO REPLACE THAT REVENUE IN THE ETF OR IS IT JUST -- >> OUR BILL AGAIN WOULD TAKE THE 4 PERCENT TAX OFF OF GROCERIES OVER A -- I THINK IT'S A FIVE OR SEARCH YEAR TIME FRAME.

I CAN'T REMEMBER NOW, WHICH TIME PERIOD, BUT YOU WALK INTO THAT AND STEP INTO THAT AND IT WOULD HAVE GUARDRAILS AND SAY IF THE BUDGETS DON'T GROW A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE WE WOULD WAS THAT REDUCTION UNTIL YOU GET BACK ON TRACK.

WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING LIKE THAT TIED TO THE FEDERAL INCOME FAX.

THERE'S BEEN A BILL OUT THERE TO DO THAT.

AND THE MATH ON THAT WORKS.

AND WE'RE THE ONLY STATE THAT LAWS THE FEDERAL INCOME TAX DEDUCTION.

THAT IS INTERESTING BECAUSE WHEN YOU LOOK AT OUR INCOME TAX RATES, IT'S 5 PERCENT FOR INDIVIDUALS.

THAT'S 65 PERCENT OF OUR EDUCATION BUDGET.

SO INCOME TAX IS VERY IMPORTANT.

IT'S ALSO VERY VOLATILE.

BUT WE DON'T GET 5 PERCENT ON PEOPLE'S TAXABLE INCOME BECAUSE WE ALLOW YOU TO REDUCE THAT BY YOUR STATE -- BY YOUR FEDERAL INCOME TAX TO GET TO YOUR STATED TAXABLE INCOME.

SO TAKING AWAY THAT DEDUCTION IS GOING TO TAKE AWAY -- IS GOING TO CHANGE THE TAX BASE, WHICH EVEN THOUGH YOU GET THAT RATE REDUCTION, YOU MIGHT FUEL INCREASE YOUR TAX.

IT'S A MATH THING.

BUT I HAVE SHOWN WHERE OTHER STATES HAVE CUT THEIR INCOME TAX RATES BUT THEY TAX IT ON YOUR FEDERAL TAXABLE INCOME.

BUT IN ALABAMA, IF YOU TO WORK THAT -- A LOWER OR HIGHER TAX RATE AND TOOK AWAY THE FEDERAL INCOMES TAX DEDUCTION WE HAVE A LOWER BASE TO APPLY THE 5 PERCENT TO AND THAT'S A LOWER RESULTING TAX COMPARED TO THE OTHER.

SO IT GETS KIND OF NERDY AND WEEDY.

>> I WILL ADMIT I'M OUT OF MY DEPTH NOW.

>> THE POINT IS WE FILED A BILL THAT I THINK IS THE NARROWIST RECOGNITION, THE LOWEST TAX ON GROCERIES PRODUCTS AND WE EXPECT TO SEE BILLS FILED AND WE WILL HAVE DISCUSSIONS AND DETERMINE WHAT TO DO.

I WILL SAY APART FROM THAT WE HAVE ALSO PASSED AND FILED OTHER BILLS THAT WOULD REDUCE TAXES.

WE HAVE BEEN IN THIS FOR THE PAST THREE, 45 YEARS.

WE HAVE PASSED TAX CUTS EVERY YEAR.

THEY'RE TARGETED.

THEY'RE SUSTAINABLE BECAUSE THEY DON'T HIT, DID THEY DON'T OUT PACE THE GROWTH OF THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND BUT THEY'RE MEANINGFUL AND IMPACT FULL TO PEOPLE.

CERTAINLY THIS IS THAT WE WILL LOOK AT AND DISCUSS.

>> WELL, YOU JUST KIND OF HIT THE NAIL IN THE HEAD IN TERMS OF WHY THIS IS -- IT'S NOT AN EASY ISSUE.

I MEAN YOU'RE RIGHT, IT SOUNDS EASY TO SAY LET'S JUST CUT THAT GROCERY TAX BUT THERE ARE SO MANY TENTACLES THROUGHOUT STATE GOVERNMENT SO AS MUCH MOMENTUM AS THERE IS THERE'S A LONG WAY TO GO AND THAT IS IMPORTANT FOR THE VIEWERS.

>> AND I WOULD SAY ANY OF THE VIEWERS OPPOSING THE TAX CUT ARE THE LOCAL ORGANIZATIONS AND THE LOCAL ADVOCATES BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO REDUCE THEIR TAXES.

THAT'S LOCAL REVENUE.

>> THERE WILL START TO BE A DRUM BEAT AT THE LOCAL LEVEL.

>> I THINK THERE'S RESISTANCE.

WE VERY TO STEP BACK AND DO WHAT WE THINK IS BEST FOR THE STATEMENT WHATEVER WE DO WE WANTED OF DON'T WASN'T TO PUT THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND IN JEOPARDY, AND WE WANTED TO BE SEASON, AND I BELIEVE THAT'S IMPORTANT.

>> LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT A DISH ISSUE.

THIS WEEK, THE SPONSORS FILED THIS PRICE ACT.

THIS IS THE OSTENSIBLE SCHOOL CHOICE ON STEROIDS BILL THAT WOULD ALLOW PARENTS, SPEAKING OF THE TRUSTED FUND, ALLOW PARTICIPANTS TO PUT A PORTION OF THEIR INCOME TAX THEY PAY TO THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND INTO AN EDUCATION SAVINGS ACCOUNT AND THEY WOULD THEN BE ABLE TO USE FOR PRIVATE SCHOOL TUITION OR FINDING A DIFFERENT SCHOOL.

THERE'S A LOT OF DETAILS INVOLVED IN THIS.

BUT OBVIOUSLY THIS IMPACTS AND IT WOULD COME TO YOUR COMMITTEE.

WHAT HATS BEEN THE CONVERSATION AND THE CAUCUS.

DOES THIS BILL HAVE A CHANCE?

>> WELL, I THINK THAT THE SCHOOL CHOICE ISSUE IS GAINING MOMENTUM AROUND THE COUNTRY.

STEP 1 IS UNDERSTAND WHAT IT IS AND IT ISN'T.

THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO FIND OUT WHAT IT ISN'T.

THEY'RE NOT FOR IT.

SOME MEME BELIEVE YOU PASS SCHOOL CHOICE AND IF I LIVE IN THIS COMMUNITY THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO GO TO THE SCHOOL IN THE NEXT COMMUNITY.

NONE OF THESE BILLS DO THAT.

THAT'S THE 1ST THING.

THE SECOND THING IS THAT IT IS A HUGE DRAIN -- ABOUT A $600 MILLION DRAIN ON THE EDUCATION BUDGET IF YOU TOOK JUST THE CHILDREN AT HOMESCHOOL OR PRIVATE SCHOOL TODAY AND THERE'S $6,900 AND LEFT THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND AND WENT TO THE PRIVATE SCHOOLS, THAT WOULD SHOW A BIG GAP IN THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND.

AND TO THAT MONEY WE WOULD LOSE IN TERMS OF WHAT WE'RE PROVIDING IN EDUCATION NOW FOR THE PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE -- IT'S GAINING MOMENTUM AT SOME TIME.

BUT WHAT ARE WE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH?

WE'RE NOT AGAINST THE CONCEPT OF THE CHOICE, AND WE WANT TO SEE THEE OPTIONS AND ALABAMA HAS A LOT OF CHOICE OPTIONS WHICH I THINK WE WILL BUILD UPON IN THIS SESSION.

IF YOU LOOK AT OUR PUBLICATIONS YOU SEE THAT WE OFFER A LOT OF THINGS OTHER STATES DON'T DO.

BUT THESE ESA ACCOUNTS ARE ACCOUNTS THAT THE -- THE EDUCATION SAVINGS ACCOUNTS, ARE WHERE YOU CAN TAKE THE MONEY AND GO TO PRIVATE TUITION.

THOSE ARE, YOU KNOW -- THOSE HAVE AGAIN DETAILS TO THEM.

ONE KEY THING THAT IS HAPPENING IN ALL STATES THAT HAVE PASSED THESE ARE ACCOUNTABILITY.

THERE'S TESTING OR SOMETHING DONE TO MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE THAT LEAVE THE SYSTEM ARE, YOU KNOW, GETTING THE PROPER EDUCATION AND WHATNOT.

THIS BILL AS I UNDERSTAND IT -- I HAVEN'T SEEN IT.

IT WAS FILED YESTERDAY.

IT DOESN'T HAVE ANY OF THOSE ACCOUNTABILITY SESSIONS.

I HAVE HEARD FROM PEOPLE IN FAVOR OF SCHOOL CHOICE, SOME ARE IN FAVOR OF THIS AND SOME ARE NOT.

SOME HOME SCHOOLS WANT IT AND SOME DON'T.

SOME ADVOCATES SAY THEY WANT THIS AND OTHERS SAY THERE'S A PROBLEM.

WE WILL HAVE TO VET IT.

THE SENATE WILL BRING IT UP NEXT WEEK IN A PUBLIC HEARING.

I THINK WE NEED TO HEAR THAT DISCUSSION.

BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, I THINK IT'S A TOPIC THAT WE NEED TO DISCUSS AND CONSIDER.

WE ALSO WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE PROVIDING CHOICE IN AREAS WHERE THEY DON'T HAVE A CHOICE.

AND THE OTHER THINGS IS, RIGHT NOW THERE'S NO PROFIT INCENTIVE OR FINANCIAL MOTIVE FOR ANYONE TO HOME SCHOOL.

IF YOU HOME SCHOOLS THAT'S PSYCHIATRIST MOST PEOPLE DO THAT AND HAVE A QUALITY OUTCOME.

THERE'S NO INCENTIVE FOR YOU TO GO TO PRIVATE SCHOOL BECAUSE YOU'RE PROBABLY DEEP INTO YOUR POCKET TO DO THAT.

BUT IF YOU NOW SET IT UP WHERE, OKAY, WE HAVE A MODEL THAT WOULD ALLOW SOMEONE TO OPEN A PUBLIC SCHOOL OR PRIVATE SCHOOL OR CHARTER SCHOOL OR WHATEVER AND NOT HAVE THE ACCOUNTABILITY, THEN YOU RUN THE RISK OF HAVING SOME ABUSE OF THAT DEAL.

SO I THINK BEAT HAVE THE PROPER GUARD RAILS.

IT'S JUST ANOTHER ISSUE THAT NEEDS TO BE VETTED AND UNDERSTOOD.

>> ALL OF THESE DETAILS, YOU KNOW?

WHILE I HAVE YOU I WANTED TO ASK ABOUT BIRMINGHAM SOUTHERN COLLEGE.

I WAS TALKING WITH REPRESENTATIVE GAVAN ABOUT THIS.

IT'S IN HER DISTRICT SO SHE IS VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT THEIR REQUEST FOR THE STATE TO ESSENTIALLY BAIL THEM OUT.

THEY'RE IN FINANCIAL DIFFICULTY OF DIFFICULTY.

IT'S GONE FROM A DIRECT ASK TO NOW THERE'S TALKING OF A LOAN SITUATION.

DO YOU SEE THAT AS FEASIBLE THIS SESSION?

AND WOULD IT COME FROM THE EDUCATION TRUST FUND.

>> I'M A FORMER CFO SO I'M USED TO SAYING GUYS I UNDERSTAND AND EMPATHIZE AND I CAN UNDERSTAND IT BUT NOW.

BUT THE FUNDAMENTAL PROBLEM THAT WE HAVE IS THIS IS A PUBLIC INSTITUTION USING PRIVATE FUNDS AND THERE'S A LOT OF ISSUES CONNECTED TO THAT.

SO THE ISSUE THAT IS QUOTED SEVERAL TIMES IT'S DIFFERENT TO SEE A PATH FORWARD TO MAKE THAT TRANSACTION HAPPEN.

THEN WE RECEIVED A BUDGET FROM THE EXECUTIVE BRANCHES THAT HAD A LOT OF NONPUBLISH HE INVESTMENTS.

I MEAN THE SUPPLEMENTAL BUDGET.

SO SENATOR ORR AND I DISCUSSED AND SAID, WELL, LET'S LOOK AT THIS BECAUSE AT LEAST THIS IS EDUCATION RELATED.

IT'S A WORTHY CAUSE, DEFINITELY A WORTHY CAUSE.

AND IT WOULD BE A GREAT OR TERRIBLE THING TO LOSE BIRMINGHAM SOUTHERN SO WE'RE LOOKING AT WHAT WE CAN DO.

WE MET WITH THE LEGAL FOLKS AND AT THE CONSTITUTIONAL LIMITATIONS THAT WE HAVE.

WE'RE TRYING TO COME UP WITH A LOAN STRUCTURE THAT WOULD BE A BRIDGE LOAN THAT WOULD HAVE THEY DID AND WE'RE WORKING ON WHAT THAT MIGHT BE.

ULTIMATELY THAT WANT TO HAVE TO BE PASSED IN A BILL BY THE LEGISLATURE.

SO WE'RE TRYING TO COME UP WITH A STRUCTURE TO PROVIDE BRIDGE FUNDING.

BUT THAT'S GOING TO SHOW THE DECISION OF THE LEGISLATURE.

>> THAT'S AN IMPORTANT DISTINCTION.

BECAUSE IT WOULDN'T JUST BE IN PART OF A BUDGET.

IT WOULD BE A SPECULATE BILL WITH A SPECULATE VOTE?

>> THAT WAS AN OPTION OF MAKING A APPROPRIATION BUT I CAN ALREADY TELL YOU THAT THE POSSIBILITY OF THAT HAPPENING, I HAVE A LINE AT MY DOOR OF PEOPLE WHO WOULD LIKE THAT SAME OPPORTUNITY.

EVERYONE HAS A STORY.

>> AND IT PUTS YOUR BUDGET IN -- >> IT COMES OUT OF THE BUDGET.

THE EDUCATION BUDGET.

SO WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL.

WE'RE TRYING TO HELP WHERE WE CAN AND SOMETHING THAT WOULD SHOW MEANINGFUL FOR THEM AND NOT JEOPARDY EYES THE BUDGET BUT THAT'S GOT TO BE THE DECISION THAT THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE WILL MAKER.

>> WE'RE OUT OF ADVERTISEMENT BUT I REALLY PREFER YOUR COMING ON AND SHARING ABOUT THIS LITANY OF ISSUES THAT YOU TOUCH AS CHAIRMAN.

THANK YOU FOR COMING.

>> THANK YOU.

THANK YOU THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU DO.

>> WE WILL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> JOINING US ME NEXT IS RHONDA MANN, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF VOICES FOR ALABAMA'S CHILDREN.

THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> I HAVE NOTED YOU TO DEFER, BEFORE WE GET INTO THE DETAILS, REMIND OUR AUDIENCE ABOUT VOICES AND YOUR ORGANIZATION'S ROLE IN THE STATE.

>> VOICES IS A CHILD ADVOCACY ORGANIZATION.

WE DEAL WITH ALL ISSUES, BIRTH TO 18 YEARS OF AGE.

AND OUR MISSION IS TO SPEAK FOR CHILDREN THROUGH PUBLIC AWARENESS, EDUCATION, ADVOCACY, AND DATA AND RESEARCH.

>> SO YOU HAVE YOUR KIDS COUNT DATA BOOK.

THIS IS AN ANNUAL REPORT THAT COMES OUT EVERY YEAR.

WE KIND OF LOOK FORWARD TO IT BECAUSE IT'S SORT OF A MEASURING STICK, YEAR BY YEAR FOR LOTS OF DIFFERENT METRICS.

BUT I KNOW Y'ALL HAVE TAKEN A DIFFERENT APPROACH THIS YEAR TO HOW YOU HAVE REPORTED IT.

>> RIGHT.

YOU KNOW SOMETIMES THE STORY CAN'T CONTINUES TO BE THE SAME.

WE KEEP TALKING ABOUT AN AGING POPULATION.

THIS YEAR EVENTED TO DIG DEEP AND LOOK AT THE COUNTIES THAT HAVE AN INCREASE IN THE PERCENT OF CHILD TO THE TOTAL POPULATION.

AND SURPRISINGLY ENOUGH THERE WERE ONLY TWO COUNTY THAT DIDN'T HAVE A DECREASE.

>> YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT AN INCREASE IN THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE UNDER 18 VERSUS THE REST OF THE POPULATION?

>> RIGHT.

AS A PERCENTAGE OF THE TOTAL POPULATION.

>> SO IT'S IMPORTANT FOR A LOT OF DIFFERENT REASONS, PLANNING PURPOSES OBVIOUSLY.

DO YOU NEED MORE SCHOOLS.

DO YOU NEED MORE NURSING HOMES, THAT SORT OF THINGS.

BUT FOR US, WE LOOKS AT IT AS A POTENTIAL WORKFORCE.

AND JUST WANTING OUR CHILD POPULATION TO KEEP UP.

BECAUSE THEY WILL HAVE A MUCH MORE DIFFICULT JOB TAKING CARE OF OLDER CITIZENS.

>> WHERE WERE THOSE COUNTIES.

>> SO MARSHALL COUNTY HAD JUST A SLIGHT INCREASE.

IT WAS NOT EVEN 1 PERCENT BUT STILL AN INCREASE.

AND THEN LIMESTONE -- I'M SORRY, FRANKLY COUNTY STAYED THE SAME.

AND SO -- >> EVERYWHERE ELSE DECREASED.

>> 65 COUNTIES SHOWED A DECREASE.

>> IS THAT TYPICAL OR IS THIS -- >> WELT WE HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT FOR YEARS.

THIS IS THE 1ST YEAR WE HAVE ACTUALLY LOOKED AT IT CLOSER AND SAID, OKAY.

LET'S REALLY LOOK AT WHAT IS HAPPENING NOT AS A TOTAL BUT INDIVIDUALLY AS A COUNTY, LET'S SEE HOW MANY COUNTY ARE ACTUALLY MOVING THE NEEDLE OR NOT.

AS IT TURNED OUT IT WAS THE OR NOT.

AND SO IT WAS A SURPRISE FOR US TO SEE THAT THAT IS THE DIRECTION THAT WE WERE HEADING.

>> YOU'RE RIGHT.

IT HAS IMPLICATIONS FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THIS BUILDING AND THE STATE HOUSE AND GOVERNMENT.

>> RIGHT.

>> WALK ME THROUGH THE OVER FINDINGS FROM THE DATA BOOK.

BECAUSE IT'S ALL ABOUT CHILD WELL BEING.

>> IT IS ABOUT CHILD WELL BEING.

WE DO DATA, OBVIOUSLY POPULATION TRENDS.

AS I SAID, VERY IMPORTANT FOR US TO TRACK.

SO WE KNEE WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT, HOW TO PLAN FOR THE FUTURE.

BUT OTHER THAN THAT, HEALTH, EDUCATION, SAFETY AND ECONOMIC SECURITY.

SO IN HEALTH, WE ALSO LOOKED AT RESOURCES.

WE HAVE 22 COUNTIES THAT HAVE NO LOCAL PEDIATRICIAN.

NOW, THAT DOESN'T MEAN KIDS DON'T GET CARE NECESSARILY WHERE THEY LIVE.

IT JUST MEANS THERE'S NOT A PEDIATRICIAN.

SOMETIMES THEY'RE ABLE TO GO TO A FAMILY PRACTICE AND GET THE SERVICES THAT THEY NEED THERE.

IF NOT, THEY MIGHT HAVE TO DRIVE TO ANOTHER COUNTY.

THAT MIGHT BE OKAY IN SOME SITUATIONS.

BUT FOR THOSE THAT DON'T HAVE TRANSPORTATION AND IF YOU'RE IN A REALLY RURAL AREA, PUBLIC TRESPASS MAY BE LIMITED.

>> I'M JUST THINKING ABOUT LIKE SUBURBAN AREAS IF YOU TOLD SOME PARENTS THERE'S NO PEDIATRICIAN IN TOWN THEY WOULDN'T LIVE THERE.

>> RIGHT.

>> SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PARENTS BUT THAT ALSO MEANS EMPLOYERS.

WILL THEY COME TO YOUR AREA IF THE RESOURCES ARE LIMITED.

SO IT'S PORCH FOR US TO KEEP UP WITH THAT.

I THINK IT WAS IN -- SINCE ABOUT 2000 OR MAYBE 2010 WE HAVE HAD 14 HOSPITALS THAT CLOSED IN RURAL AREAS.

SO YOU MAY NOT HAVE OBSTETRICAL CARE IN AREAS AS WELL.

SO HAVING BABIES DO YOU WANT TO LIVE THERE WHEN YOU CAN'T ACCESS RESOURCES 459 THAT YOU MIGHT KNEE.

WE HAVE 14 COUNTIES WITH NO DENTIST.

I WAS SURPRISED TO FIND OUT THEY'RE ABLE TO DO DENTAL CARE.

IS JUST LIKE TELEMEDICINE, THEY CAN DO TELEDENTAL.

THEY USE DENTAL HIGH GENERALIST SUPERVISED BY A DENTIST THROUGH BROADBAND.

SO THINK FOR US IN A THE ESTATE WITH SO LIMITED RESOURCES AND SOME YOURS BROADBAND IS GOING TO BE THAT CREATIVE WAY TO EXPAND RESOURCES OUT TO OTHER PEOPLE.

>> YOU'RE LOOKING AT CAREER AND COLLEGE READINESS; RIGHT?

ARE OUR SCHOOLS AND PARENTS AND PARENTS PREACHING STUDENTS EITHER FOR A CAREER OR FOR COLLEGE.

THAT'S SORTS OF THE BAROMETER.

>> THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT OF EDUCATION IS THAT THEY COME OUT READY TO GO TO WORK OR TO CONTINUE THEIR EDUCATION.

AND IF WE MISS THE MARK THERE, THEY HAVE WASTED A WHOLE LOT OF TIME.

AND WE HAVE WESTED A WHOLE LOT OF TIME INVEST OF VESTING IN THE STUDENTS.

WE WANT THEM TO BE SUCCESSFUL.

AND SO WE WORK ON THE FRONT END EARLY LEARNT LEARNING, EARLY ACCESS, EARLY INTERVENTION SERVICES FOR CHILDREN AFTER THAT MAY NEED SPECIAL HELP OR OVERCOMING EMOTIONAL ISSUES, 1ST CLASS PRE-K WHICH IS SO POPULAR IN OUR STATE BUT WE'RE NOT QUITE AT 50 PERCENT WITH FOUR-YEAR-OLDS HAVING ACCESS AND IN SOME AREAS IT'S A LOT LESS.

SO IT JUST DEPENDS ON WHERE YOU LIVE.

BUT THE QUALITY.

PROGRAM IS THE SAME NO MATTER WHERE YOU LIVE.

SO WE HAVE THAT TO BE THANKFUL FOR.

OTHER MILESTONES THAT WE REALLY FOCUS ON ARE 4TH GRADE AND 8TH GRADE ENGLISH LANGUAGE ARTS AND MATH.

AND 8TH GRADE WE HAVE THREE COUNTY THAT HAVE 0 PERCENT PROFICIENCY IN 8TH GRADE MATH.

>> GOODNESS GRACIOUS.

>> SO IT SHOULD BE A CONCERN FOR US AS PARENTS OR GRANDPARENTS, FOR, WILL, EMPLOYERS -- I WAS SPEAKING TO A GROUP ONE TIME AND I WANTED IF YOU DON'T NEED YOUR FUTURE EMPLOYEES PROVIDES TO READ OR DO SIMPLE MATH YOU'RE OKAY.

>> NAME AN EMPLOYER THAT -- >> I DID ASK THEM TO RAISE THEIR HAND 1ST.

I SAID HOW MANY OF YOU DON'T NEED YOUR EMPLOYEES TO READ OR DO SIMPLE MATH?

NOBODY'S HAND WENT UP.

AND I SAID WE HAVE A PROBLEM HERE.

AS I HAVE SAID THE ULTIMATE THING IS THAT THEY GRADUATE AND THE BEST INDICATOR OF THAT IS COLLEGE CAREER READINESS UNDER WHICH IS MADE UP OF SEVEN DIFFERENT INDICATORS.

WE HAVE MAP OUT HOW WELL, OUR STATES AND OUR COUNTIES ARE DOING AND WHAT WE FOUND WAS IT PROVED IN 28 COUNTIES.

AND IT STAYED THE SAME IN 16.

AND IN '23 WE SAW A DECLINE.

>> THERE'S GOOD IF IT WOULD IMPROVE.

I'M LOOKING AT YOUR MAP HERE.

WE WILL PUT SOME OF THIS UP AND WE'RE GOING TO LINK TO THE WEBSITE WHERE THE PEOPLE CAN FIND THE REPORT.

BUT WHAT IT'S SHOWING ME IS SOMETHING THAT IS COMMON SENSE AND WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IS THERE WERE POCKETS -- THERE ARE MACES IN THE STATE WHERE THE EDUCATION PROFICIENCY AND EVERYTHING IS GREAT.

THEN THERE'S OTHER POCKETS WHERE IT IS SERIOUSLY DEFICIENT.

AND IT'S JUST THE TALE OF TWO CITIES.

AND THAT'S -- YOU KNOW MAYBE NO STATEWIDE POLICY REALLY GETS IT ALL.

BUT I LIKE HOW YOU HAVE A MAP ABOUT IT SO IT KIND OF PAINTS THAT PICTURE.

>> A VISUAL GRAPHIC TELLS A WHOLE LOT ABOUT WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO EXPLAIN TO SOMEONE.

BUT LET ME JUST POINT OUT.

TYPICALLY THE BLACK BELT WOULD BE AN AREA -- BECAUSE IT'S SO RURAL.

IT HAS SUCH HIGH POVERTY.

EVEN MACON IMPROVED.

AND TYPICALLY THEY MIGHT NOT AND SO SUMTER AND HEAL AND CHOCTAW AND CLARK SOME OF THOSE COUNTIES RANKED NEAR THE BOTTOM ARE ACTUALLY MOVING THE NEED AND HE WILL SHOWING IMPROVEMENT AND THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS WARRANTED TO DO THIS IS YEAR WITH THE BOOK, NOT JUST WHAT IS THE BEST RATE OUT THERE BUT WHICH COUNTIES ARE MOVING THE NEEDLE.

SHELL BEAT COUNTY HAS BEEN NUMBER 1 FOR ALL OF THE YEARS THAT I HAVE BEEN AT VOICES.

BUT ARE THEY ACTUALLY MOVING THE NEEDLE?

ARE THINGS IMPROVING OR ARE THEY JUST NUMBER 1 BECAUSE THEY'RE THE MOST AFFLUENT COUNTY IN OUR STATE AND THEY HAVE THE MOST RESOURCES AND THEY DON'T HAVE AS FAR TO GO TO IMPROVE?

>> I WANT TO ASK ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH.

AND I KNOW THAT IS SORT OF INTERTWINED THROUGH ALL OF THE DIFFERENT CATEGORIES WHETHER IT'S EDUCATION, WHETHER IT'S WELL BEING AND ALL OF THIS.

>> I'M CURIOUS WHETHER, IN YOUR DATA, IN YOUR RESEARCH YOU FOUND EFFECTS OF COVID.

AND IT'S IMPACT ON CHILDREN.

I MEAN WE HAVE READ STORIES ABOUT HOW THAT HAS HAPPENED BUT I'M WONDERING HOW IT MAY HAVE POPPED UP IN THE DATA.

>> YEAH, SO WE DIDN'T TRACK AS CLOSELY ON MENTAL HEALTH YOU KNOW TO FOLLOW THAT EXACTLY.

BUT WE ARE WORKING WITH DEPARTMENT OF MENTAL HEALTH TO TELL A BETTER STORY ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON WITH KIDS.

>> IT'S PRETTY SUBJECTIVE.

>> IT CAN BE.

BUT THE ANNIE CASEY FOUNDATION WHICH FUNDS THE KIDS COUNT PROJECT THROUGHOUT THE U.S. ALSO DOES A NATIONAL BOOK AND THEIR FOCUS THIS YEAR WAS ON MENTAL HEALTH AND THE INCREASE IN MENTAL HEALTH CASES ESPECIALLY CHILDREN SHOWING ANXIETY AND DEPRESSION.

PARENTS MAY NOT THINK THAT'S MENTAL HEALTH BUT IT ACTUALLY IS A PART OF IT.

THERE'S A LOT ABOUT MENTAL HEALTH.

IT'S NOT THE CRAZY CUCKOO PERSON THAT YOU LOCK UP IN THE HOSPITAL WHEN THEY'RE IN THEIR 20S OR 30S OR OLDER.

MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES CAN SHOW UP AS YOUNG AS TWO-YEARS-OLD.

AND SO EARLY ASSESSMENTS.

IS A 2-YEAR-OLD -- ARE THEY ACTING OUT?

IS THIS TYPICAL 2-YEAR-OLD BEHAVIOR, TERRIBLE TWOS WE WANT TO CALL IT OR IS IT SOMETHING MORE?

AND WITH YOUNG PEOPLE YOU KNOW IT COULD BE THEM ACTING OUT BUT IT COULD ALSO BE THEM WITHDRAWING AND PULLING INTO THEMSELVES.

IS IT JUST TYPICAL TEEN BEHAVIOR OR IS IT SOMETHING MORE?

AND WE DON'T NEED TO IGNORE THAT.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON WITH OUR KIDS AND ADDRESS IT AS WICKS QUICKLY AS WE CAN.

YOU KNOW, THEN THE OTHER PART OF THAT IS ACCESS TO RESOURCES.

WE DID SHOW AN IMPROVEMENT.

IN WHAT WE REPORTED THIS YEAR, THE RATIO TO POPULATION WENT DOWN FROM 923 TO ONE TO 846 TO ONE.

>> WHAT IS THAT TELLING US.

>> THAT SAYS FOR EVERY 846 PEOPLE IN OUR STATE THERE IS ONE MENTAL HEALTH PROFESSIONAL TO SERVICES THEM.

>> OKAY.

>> WE SHOULD BE SOMEWHERE BETWEEN TWO AND 300 TO ONE.

>> SO WE STILL HAVE A LONG BAY TO GO.

>> WE HAVE A LONG WAY TO GO.

>> THAT'S GOOD.

WELL, SPEAKING OF THAT I WANT TO DO ASK YOU ABOUT OTHER UP TICKS.

THERE WAS A CHANGE IN MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INCOME.

>> 1 OF THE THINGS THAT WE LOOK CLOSELY AT NOT JUST THE AVERAGE FOR OF THE STATE WHICH IS JUST UNDER 54,000 BUT WHAT IS THE HIGHEST AND WHAT'S THE LOWEST AND WHAT HAPPENS WITH THAT MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INSURANCE COMPANY WHEN YOU TAKE OFF THE LOWEST COUNTY OR THE HIGHEST COUNTIES?

WE HAVE THREE COUNTIES THAT THE MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INCOME IS OVER $70,000.

THE HIGHEST IN OUR STATE IS SHELBY COUNTY AT JUST OVER $88,000.

THE LOWEST IN OUR STATE IS WILCOX COUNTY AT JUST UNDER $32,000.

>> THAT'S A PRETTY BIG GAP.

>> THAT'S A HUGE GAP.

>> IT STANDS TO REASON.

WE KNOW OF ALL OF THE REASONS WHY.

BUT DIDN'T YOU SAY THERE WERE SOME UPTICKS IN HOUSEHOLD INCOME AND MIGHT THAT BE CONNECTED TO SOME OF THE FEDERAL STIMULUS THAT WE HAVE SEEN OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS?

>> SO THERE WAS A DECREASE IN CHILD POVERTY THAT WE WERE JUST BRIEFLY TALKING ABOUT BEFORE WE GOT STARTED HERE.

BUT WHAT WE SAW, BY LOOKING AT COUNTIES THAT ARE MOVING THE NEEDLE, SO WHICH COUNTY IMPROVED THE MOST BASED ON THE RATE -- NOT THE HIGHEST RATE OR LOWEST RATED BUT WHICH ONES MOVED THE MOST.

>> SO MAY CON, LOWNDES, SUMTER, CRENSHAW AND WILCOX SHOWED THE GREATEST IMPROVEMENT.

IN DECREASING CHILD POVERTY.

THIS IS FROM 2016-2020.

WE OFTEN US A FIVE-YEAR ANGE SO THAT THE DATA DOESN'T JUST KEEP GOING UP AND DOWN WHICH A LOT OF TIMES IT L AND IT SMOOTHES OUT SOME OF THOSE FLUCTUATIONS.

SO THE LARGEST CHANGE WAS A 61 PERCENT DECREASE IN CHILD POPULATION IN MACON COUNTY.

MAY CON COUNTY HAD ALREADY SUFFERED WITH THE DOG TRACK CLOSING YEARS AGO.

THAT HAD AN IMPACT ON IT.

WHAT PEOPLE NEED TO UNDERSTAND TOO, IS WHAT IS GOING ON IN OUR ENVIRONMENT, WHEN LARGE COMPANIES CLOSE DOWN, YOU MAY NOT THINK THAT'S GOING TO IMPACT A CHILD BUT IT CERTAINLY IMPACTS THE CRESS WITHIN THE HOUSEHOLD.

AND THAT CAN INDIRECTLY IMPACT A CHILD OR EVEN DIRECTLY AT TIMES.

BUT YOU KNOW, WE WERE PLEASED TO SEE THESE NUMBERS AND RECEIVE THE DECREASES IN THESE COUNTIES THAT TYPICALLY ARE VERY RURAL, HAVE HIGH POVERTY RATES, BUT THEN OUR QUESTION, WE'RE CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC WHEN THE FEDERAL DOLLARS RUN OUT, WHAT WILL HAPPEN, WILL THESE COUNTIES GO BACK, MR.

THEY LOSE THE GAINS THAT THEY MADE FROM FUNDING THAT WAS AVAILABLE DURING COVID TO ADDRESS AND HELP OUT FAMILIES.

AND SO ALSO WHAT DOES THAT TELL US ABOUT SAFETY NETS AND FINANCIAL SUPPORT TO FAMILIES?

IS THAT A SOLUTION FOR ADDRESSING SOME OF THE ISSUES IN OUR STATED?

>> WELL, WE'RE ABOUT OUT OF TIME BUT I WANT TO GIVE YOU A CHANCE TO TELL EVERYBODY WHERE THEY CAN FIND THIS BOOK ONLINE.

IT'S ONLINE ON YOUR WEBSITE; RIGHT?

>> IT'S ON OUR WEBSITE, AL ALAVOICES..ORG.

>> AND WE WILL CERTAINLY SHARE THAT ON THE BROADCAST AS WELL.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU.

I APPRECIATE IT.

>> JOINING ME NEXT IS DR. DAVID HUGHES, PROFESSOR OF POLITICAL SCIENCE AT AUBURN UNIVERSITY, MONTGOMERY.

DAVID, THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME IT'S FUN TO BE ABLE TO HAVE A POLITICAL SCIENTIST ON THE SHOW HAD TO TALK SOME POLITICS BECAUSE IT'S ALWAYS INTERESTING POLITICS NOT JUST HERE IN BAM OF ALABAMA BUT AROUND THE COUNTRY.

I WANTED TO START WITH YOU, AT AUM, HOSTED THE SOUTHERN STUDIES CONFERENCE THIS PAST WEEKENDS.

ACTUALLY PARTICIPATED IN THE JOURNALISM PART.

BUT TELL ME WHAT ALL HAPPENED AND WHAT KIND OF ISSUES WERE DISCUSSED AS PART OF YOUR PANELS AND THINGS.

>> WELL, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

YEAH, WE WERE REALLY EXCITED TO BRING THIS BACK IN 2023.

IT'S BEEN ABOUT THREE YEARS SINCE WE WERE ABLE TO HOLD IT AS AN IN-PERSON CONFERENCE ON THE CAMPUS OF AUBURN IN MONTGOMERY DUE TO THE PANDEMIC.

WE HAVE BEEN GOING NOW A LITTLE OVER A DECADE AND WE BRING IN SCHOLARS FROM.

DISCIPLINES, PEOPLE WHO STUDY THE AMERICAN SOUTH FROM THE PERMITTED OF HISTORIANS AND ENGLISH PROFESSORS AND ALSO PEOPLE THAT ENGAGE IN THE FINE ARTS.

WE HAD A GREAT GATHERING.

OUR BIGGEST IN HISTORY.

WE HAD OVER A HUNDRED ATTENDEES WITH GREAT PANELS ON RECENT ACTIVITY IN THE SOUTH AND HOW THE SOUTH IS EVOLVING CULTURALLY, POLITICALLY AND SO FORTH.

AND WE ARE THANKFUL TO HAVE YOU PARTICIPATE PATE AS WELL.

>> SO MY PORTION WAS, YOU KNOW, I GUESS ALABAMA MEDIA IS ME, AARON DAVIS FROM WSFA, YOU HAD A COUPLE OF OTHERS AND IT WAS REALLY INTERESTING TO HEAR DIFFERENT SORT OF MEDIA TYPES, YOU KNOW, I'M TV AND ONLINE, YOU KNOW, TV, PRINT AND ALL OF THAT KIND OF STUFF SO IT WAS INTERESTING TO HEAR DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES.

WHAT WAS INTERESTING FOR ME WAS TO HEAR THE QUESTIONS FROM THE STUDENTS AND THE ATTENDEES WHICH WAS KIND OF ENRICHING.

>> YOU HAD THIS PROFESSOR FROM OKLAHOMA STATE, SETH MCKEY, WHO GOT INTO THE DEMOGRAPHIC CHANGES YOU KNOW, THAT ARE GOING ON IN THE SOUTH INCLUDING ALABAMA.

TALK ABOUT THAT, HOW WE'RE CHANGING POLITICALLY.

>> PROFESSOR MCKEY IS A POLITICAL SCIENTIST THAT OKLAHOMA STATE UNIVERSITY, AND WE WERE REALLY FORTUNATE TO HAVE HIM COME IN AND GIVE A KEYNOTE ADDRESS IN SOME OF HIS PUBLIC OPINION RESEARCH ABOUT SOUTHERN ATTITUDES AMONG THE ELECTORATE.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HE FOUND THROUGH HIS YEARS OF RESEARCH AND PUBLIC OPINION POLLING IS THAT, YOU KNOW, WE OFTENTIMES THINK OF THE SOUTHERN ELECTRIC EVOLVING OVER THE LATTER HALF OF THE 20TH CENTURY WHITE VOTERS THAT TENDED TO VOTED DEMOCRATIC AND EVENTUALLY SORTING THEMSELVES IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

WE SEE THAT EVIDENCE SUCH AS THE REPUBLICAN MATTER FLIPPING THE LEGISLATURE IN 2010 BUT ONE OF THE INTERESTING THINGS PROFESSOR MCKEY FIND FOUND THROUGH WRETCH IS POLITICAL ATTITUDES FROM SOUTHERNERS, ESPECIALLY WHITES IN ALABAMA AND MISSISSIPPI HAVE BECOME EVEN MORE RACIALLY POLARIZED WITHIN THE LAST DECADE SUCH THAT, YOU KNOW, WE SEE IT AT REALLY THE HIGHEST WE HAVE EVER OBSERVED IN U.S. HISTORY SINCE WE HAVE BEEN ABLE TO COLLECT DATA ON THAT.

AND WHILE THAT DOESN'T PORTEND WELL FOR OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IN STATES LIKE GEORGIA OR NORTH CAROLINA WHERE YOU HAD SUCH SIGNIFICANT IN MIGRATION THAT DEMOCRATS HAVE BECOME COMPETITIVE, WE SEE ANYTIME PLACES LIKE VIRGINIA, BUT IN ALABAMA BECAUSE OUR POPULATION IS SO STAGNANT WHAT IS MEANT IS THAT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY HAS BEEN ABLE TO BUILD LARGE SUPER MAJORITIES IN BOTH LEGISLATIVE CHAMBERS.

AND AS LONG AS THESE PATTERNS PERSIST THERE'S REALLY VIRTUALLY NO EVIDENCE THAT THAT'S GOING TO CHANGE ANYTIME SOON.

>> WHAT DOES THAT MEAN FOR THE FUTURE OF ELECTORAL POLITICS ESPECIALLY ON THE NATIONAL LEVEL.

I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT.

IT'S REALLY HARD TO SEE HOW DEMOCRATS COULD REALLY BE COMPETITIVE IN ALABAMA, I MEAN CONSIDERING THE LAST ELECTION.

IT WASN'T EVEN CLOSE.

THEY DIDN'T EVEN FILL CANDIDATES IN A LOT OF THESE RAISE.

BUT THOSE DEMOGRAPHICS MIGHT BE GOOD FOR ALABAMA REPUBLICANS NATIONALLY THAT MIGHT CAUSE THEM TO START LOSING SURFACE.

WHO WOULD HAVE THOUGHT GEORGIA WOULD BE UP FOR GRABS LIKE IT IS.

>> NATIONALLY THE REPUBLICANS ARE IN A BIT OF A BIND.

WE HAVE BEEN DOCUMENTING FOR YEARS THAT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY HAS A DEMOGRAPHIC PROBLEM AS NONWHITES BECOME A LARGER AND LARGER SHARE OF THE AMERICAN ELECTORATE MOST DEMOGRAPHERS THINK WHITE AMERICANS WILL CEASE TO BE AN ELECTORATE MAJORITY SOMETIME BY THE MID 2040S AND SO ONE OF THE STRATEGIES THAT REPUBLICANS CAN USE TO OVERCOME THIS IS TO TRY TO INCREASE THEIR THRESHOLDS AMONG WHITE VOTERS WHICH THEY HAVE BEEN PRETTY SUCCESSFUL REALLY SINCE THE REAGAN ERA, OR WE CAN SEE THEM TRY TO CHANGE THEIR ELECTORAL STRATEGY AND APPEAL TO MORE NONWHITES NATIONALLY.

AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION HAD SOME SUCCESS WITH.

THEY WERE ABLE TO BRING SUPPORT INTO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY, ESPECIALLY FROM HIS PANICS AND BLACK VOTERS TYPICALLY MALES WHO DON'T HAVE A COLLEGE EDUCATION.

SO WE SEE SOME REALIGNMENT ALONG THE EDGES BUT DEMOGRAPHICALLY THE NATIONAL REPUBLICAN PARTY STILL HAS SOME ISSUES AND WE HAVE SEEN THAT, IF YOU LOOK BACK OVER THE LAST 30 OR SO YEARS IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS THE ONLY REPUBLICANS TO HAVE WON A POPULAR VOTE SINCE THE 1990S WAS GEORGE W. BUSH IN 2004.

THAT'S A PRETTY REMARKABLE STATE ABOUT THE MATTER'S INABILITY TO COMPETE AT A NATIONAL LEVEL.

AND ONE OF THE FEW THINGS THAT REALLY ALLOWED THEM HAD TO CAPTURE NATIONAL INSTITUTIONS HAVE BEEN SOME OF THE QUIRKS OF THE AMERICAN CONSTITUTION, WHETHER IT'S THE ELECTORAL COLLEGE OR EQUAL REPRESENTATION IN THE SENATE.

>> YEAH, I REMEMBER AFTER THE 2012 ELECTION OBAMA BEAT MITT ROMNEY AND THERE WAS IN FRO SPECS AND SORT OF POSTMORTEM REPORT, YOU KNOW, OKAY, THE REPUBLICAN PARTY NEEDS TO REACH OUT TO THE MINORITIES AND IT DO I NEED KIND OF GOT THROWN INTO THE TRASH KIND WITH 2016 AS THIS HE SAID THEY WOULD JUST EXPAND THE BASE WHICH WORKED.

>> WHAT YOU HAVE FOR THE PARTY WHAT MAY NOT BE GOOD FOR THE PARTY AS A WHOLE IS NOT NECESSARILY GOOD FOR THE INDIVIDUAL CANDIDATES BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO GO BACK TO THEIR DISTRICTS AND FACE A HOSTILE PRIMARY ELECTION.

IF I'M AN INDIVIDUAL CANDIDATE RUNNING FOR REELECTION WHAT INDIVIDUAL INCENTIVE DO I HAVE TO DO GOOD NATIONALLY FOR THE PARTY IF IT MEANS I END UP LOSING MY PRIMARILY ELECTION.

WE HAVE SEEN A NUMBER OF MAIN STREAM REPUBLICANS, PEOPLE LIKE KISSINGER OR CHENEY, WHO ARE FAIRLY MODERATE, SOMEWHERE NEAR THE BELL CURVE OF THE PARTY, BUT AS THE PARTY HAS MOVED TO THE RIGHT IT'S PROVE UNTENABLE IN A PRIMARY ELECTION.

>> SPEAKING OF PRIMARIES WE'RE GETTING INTO PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARIES.

CANTS ARE STARTING TO ANNOUNCE.

YOU HAVE FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP WHO IS THE -- OSTENSIBLY THE FRONTRUNNER IN THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY, FACING INDICTMENTS AND THAT THROWS IN ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT THINGS.

DO YOU SEE SOMEONE LIKE DESANTIS OR A TIM SCOTT OR NIKKI HALEY TRULY BEING COMPETITIVE WITH TRUMP AND TRULY -- IS IT POSSIBLE FOR THEM TO GET THE NOMINATION OR DOES TRUMP HAVE IT LOCKED UP.

>> I SEE NO EVIDENCE WHY TRUMP WON'T WIN THE NOMINATION FOR THE 2024 NOMINATION.

THE PROBLEM WITH THE OTHER CANDIDATES IS THEY'RE ALSO TRYING TO APPEAL TO HIS BASE.

AND YOU CAN SEE THE AWKWARDNESS ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL AS HALEY OR PENCE OR DESANTIS HESITATE TO CRITICIZE THE FORMER PRESIDENT.

IT'S PLAIN WHAT THEIR DILEMMA IS.

THEY NEED HIS VOTERS.

WE HAVE HAD PLENTY OF PUBLIC POLLING TO COME OUT SINCE TRUMP'S INDICTMENT IN NEW YORK, AND THERE COULD WELL BE OTHER INDICTMENTS FOLLOWING IN PLACES LIKE GEORGIA OR IN THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA WHERE HE'S UNDER FEDERAL INVESTIGATION BUT I HAVEN'T SEEN ANY EVIDENCE RIGHT NOW THAT THAT'S MOVING THE NEEDLE AMONG THE REPUBLICAN ELECTORATE.

AND THIS TIES IN NICELY WITH OUR PREVIOUS CONVERSATION, WHAT IS NICE FOR OF THE PARTY ISN'T NECESSARILY GOOD FOR INDIVIDUAL CANDIDATES SO THE PARTY IS PROBABLY GOING SO HAVE TRUMP AGAIN IN 2024 AND WE WILL HAVE THE SAME TROUBLE HEAT HAD IN 2020 WITHOUT INCUMBENCY AND THE DISADVANTAGE OF CRIMINAL PROCESS.

>> THAT WOULD BE A HUGE ALBATROSS WHEN YOU GO TO A GENERAL ELECTION.

IT'S NOT JUST APPEALING TO YOUR BASE.

AT THE END OF THE DAY YOU HAVE TO WIN THE GENERAL.

AND IN THE PRIMARY HERE, I LIKE JENNA GOLDBERG'S ANALOGY OF BELLING THE CAT.

ALL OF THE MICE HAVE ABOUT INCENTIVE AS A GROUP TO PUT A BELL ON A CAT, RIGHT, SO THEY CAN HEAR IT GOING AROUND.

BUT NO ONE MOUSE -- NO ONE MOUSE WANTS TO BE THE ONE TO PUT THE BELL ON THE CAT BECAUSE YOU WILL PROBABLY BE EATEN.

THAT'S WHAT I SEE WITH THE CANDIDATES.

NO ONE WANTS TO BE THE ONE TO ATTACK TRUMP BUT IT'S IN ALL OF THEIR INTEREST FOR SOMEBODY TO DO IT.

THEY JUST DON'T WANT TO GET EATEN.

>> WE SAW THE VIRGINIA REPUBLICAN PARTY CAME UP WITH A NASHVILLE SOLUTION THIS THE LAST TIME THEY NEEDED A CANDIDATE TO RUN FOR GOVERNOR WHICH IS THAT THEY CANCELED THE PRIMARY, DIDN'T ALLOW THE VOTERS TO HAVE A SAY WHO THE NOMINEE WOULD BE AND THROUGH CONVENTION CHOSE A MORE MODERATED CANDIDATE THEY THOUGHT COULD WIN THE ELECTION AND IT WORKED.

GLENN I COULDN'T THINK WAS SUCCESSFUL.

>> YOU KNOW, AS WE GO FORWARD I'M WONDERING IF THAT APPROACH GETS MORE POPULAR IN DOING AWAY WITH PRIMARIES.

BECAUSE THEY HAVE SOMETIMES PROVEN -- ESPECIALLY HERE IN ALABAMA, PROVES TO BE SOMEWHAT UNPREDICTABLE.

>> WELL, YEAH.

WE USED TO DO THAT ONCE UPON A TIME, AND IT'S INTERESTING THAT THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY WOULD CHOOSE TO HOLD THEIR NATIONAL CONSEQUENCE CONVENTION IN CHICAGO.

WHEN THEY DID THAT IN 1968 IT WAS ONE OF THE LEADING MOTIVATORS TO SWITCH TO AN ELECTORAL PRIMARY RATHER THAN LET THE CONVENTION DECIDE WHEN THE VARIOUS FACTIONS FELL INTO SOME CONFLICT WITH ONE ANOTHER.

>> WELL, WE'RE OUT OF TIME AND I HATE IT BECAUSE THIS IS FUN TALKING POLITICS BUTTER WE WILL HAVE YOU BACKS ON, ESPECIALLY AS THE ELECTIONS MOVE FORWARD.

DAVID HUGHES FROM AUM, THANK YOU FOR COMING ON THE SHOW.

>> THANKS A BUNCH.

>> WE WILL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> THAT'S HOUR SHOW.

THAT EVER WATCHING.

WE WILL BE BACK NEXT WEEK, MONDAY AT 10:30 WITH MORE COVERAGE FROM THE ALABAMA LEGISLATURE HERE AN ALABAMA PUBLIC TELEVISION.

FOR OUR "CAPITOL JOURNAL" TEAM, I'M TODD STACEY.