These weeks are flying by.

And perhaps those seeking higher office are feeling that way.

And that's why many of them are starting campaigns for the 2026 election.

But when we focus on the here and now debates and lawsuits rage on over immigration and First Amendment rights.

And when it comes to free speech, there seems to be a very fine line in Colorado when it comes to protecting free speech and protecting our kids who are online.

Let's get started with this week's Colorado Inside Out.

Hi, everyone, I'm Kyle Dyer.

Let me get right to introducing you to this week's insider panel.

We start with Patty Calhoun, founder and editor of Westword.

Tyrone Glover, civil rights and criminal defense attorney here in Denver.

Ed Sealover, VP of Strategic Initiatives and at the Colorado Chamber of Commerce, and the editor of The Sum and Substance.

And Chris Roark, consultant with Roark Media.

It seems as though since the start of this month, and especially over the last week, the motivation factor has been high for those people wanting to run for office.

And there's a lot of different positions people are jockeying for.

But let's start with the governorship.

Senator Michael Bennet is running for governor, as is Attorney General Phil Weiser on the Democratic side.

And then also this week, Republican Greg Lopez announced that he is running for a third time for the governor's seat, making him at last check the 11th Republican who's running for in the gubernatorial race.

you know, Polis Patty is terminal.

It so it's wide open, the races wide open.

But I think we can safely say Greg Lopez will not be the next governor of Colorado.

The odds are on Michael Bennet side right now.

it was clear for the last two months that he was really going in that direction.

And it was interesting because the Weezer had announced the beginning of January, people were just beginning to mention the possibility that Bennet might run Salazar.

Ken Salazar, the former ambassador to Mexico, was also mentioned as potentially being interested.

I think he's clearly taken himself out of that.

He's got another plan.

But the Bennet issue that's so interesting is should he resign or should he not, while he runs?

I think it's fine that he stays both in the Senate and runs for governor as long as he does his Senate job, and I think he will.

That's the kind of thing Michael Bennet would do.

The issue is really does he?

If he wins, save it and appoint his replacement in the Senate?

Or does he let Polis do it, resigns earlier and lets Polis do it right after he's elected?

So that's the big issue.

But there's so many things going on right now, and it would be such a game of musical chairs if we had to have a new person appointed to the Senate.

Yeah.

You are watching the attorney general's race that's already taking shape.

Our attorney general offices is huge, and it does a lot of things from compliance to rule guidance, defense and prosecution.

And so right now we have Phil Wiser, sort of a varied background.

but now I think coming into the race, we have Michael Dougherty and Jenna Griswold, right?

Michael Dougherty is sort of typically what you would see as like a lot of attorney general, someone coming from a real strict prosecutorial background.

Right?

Sometimes you'll hear the AG referred to as like the top cop.

So we kind of have someone in Griswald coming from more of, I think, a wiser background.

I think just this week coming out, for Michael Clark, who, with this whole fiasco with Missy Woods wrongfully imprisoned for 12 years, I have to give a shout out to one of my colleagues in the bar, Adam Frank, for doing amazing work on this case and helping sort of bring this.

But Dougherty is really leaning into this in a way that you don't necessarily see prosecutors, in his position.

So he's a very interesting candidate.

It'll be interesting to see if we kind of go back to this more traditional role for the AG, or if we'll kind of continue on with what Weezer started.

And what are you watching?

I'm watching the governor's race here, and I think it's interesting to see the 11 Republicans that have jumped in already.

But I don't think we're talking about who could potentially be the most serious candidate.

And that is Senator Barb Kirk Meyer, who's been long rumored to be looking to see.

I mentioned Kirk by because for those who don't follow the legislature on a daily basis like I do, Kirk Meyer is actually one of the most respected figures at the Capitol on either side of the aisle.

She's been known as a powerhouse who can pass things such as, property tax breaks we saw in last session.

even down to the nitty gritty of, water rights she's gotten into.

And I think if she jumps into this race, she will actually change the dynamics of it.

This is going to be a very hard race for Republicans to win.

They haven't held the governor's office since Owens was termed out at the end of 2006, and the national, playing field is not going to be in their favor in 26, especially in a state that, frankly hates Donald Trump.

But Barbara Kirk Mile will bring enough gravity to this race where Democrats would have to at least hold some of their powder back and not blow everything out on the primary.

If she got in there, it'll be worth watching what she does in the coming months.

Well, also, in the governor's race, you mentioned Greg Lopez three times as a candidate.

Now running for office kind of has a shelf life.

And you wonder, has he exceeded that?

However, I did talk to somebody who has spoken to him since he has been in Congress.

And she talked about how he has just a different air about him, more sense on, policy and, and will voters, you know, look at that.

I'm not quite sure, but there is a shelf life when a candidates run for the same office over and over again.

I think voters tend to turn turn off a little bit as far as the free for all of everybody getting in right now, I'm just waiting for Ken Buck to say he's going to take on Michael Bennett again for a rematch.

I don't know if that'll happen, but with the GOP, I'm not real hopeful about 2026.

I think it's going to be another stomping.

I, I know I'm not going to be popular in the Republican Party for saying that, but, the fact that there is still so much infighting, and as long as that infighting continues, voters will not trust the Republican Party to lead.

So we'll see what happens.

Okay.

This week, a federal judge ruled that two men from Venezuela detained at the detention facility in Aurora must stay there until they can have a proper court hearing.

The, ACLU filed a lawsuit on their behalf in hopes of blocking the Trump administration's use of the Alien Enemies Act, which calls for deporting immigrants who are accused of having criminal records or who are gang members.

and the attorneys for these two men say they are not gang members.

I will start with Tyrone because you know a lot about this case.

I do.

In full disclosure, I am, one of the co-chairs of the ACLU who's a legal panel.

this really is an effort to circumvent our laws to advance this political agenda of effectuating these mass deportations.

But a threat to justice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.

Right.

And this should not stand.

And I think even the Supreme Court has said that if they're going to try to resurrect this ancient law, there needs to be some due process.

And we know just even locally, how notoriously unreliable these sort of gang affiliation mantles really are.

we don't even get it right here locally with gangs that have been around for decades, like the Bloods and the Crips since the 80s.

you know, they don't want to be detected by law enforcement.

So going off of things like tattoos that are oftentimes commonplace, Oftentimes they're just looking at who's been around who.

At any given point in time.

But the real fear here is that they just kind of push these things through so quickly, get these folks out of the country, and then throw their hands up and say, oh, even if we got it wrong, what are we going to do?

There's nothing we can do at this point.

So that's what I think we're trying to prevent.

Okay, Ed, let's talk about the Colorado Senate bill that is being considered that would prevent civil rights violations of people based on their immigration status.

Yeah.

This is basically the outgrowth of the law that was passed a couple of years ago that said, at that point, state agencies and state patrol had limited ways that they could interact with Ice.

There were restrictions on that.

This extends that policy to local governments and to local police agencies.

This is going to be a very controversial policy.

This is one that we're already seeing immense fight on in the Senate, hasn't gotten to the House yet.

and it's one that could actually have been a lot more controversial because one of the original drafts of the bill, they considered businesses to be political subdivisions, which basically would have told business owners, you two are not allowed to interact with the federal government on this, which, you know, blatantly unconstitutional provision that was taken out before it was introduced.

We're having tons of businesses that have called our office saying, what are my rights on this?

And you have to remind them that just like a private residence, a private business is sacrosanct.

If the ice comes and says, we want to find somebody and get them out of there, they have to have a warrant to come in there and take care of that.

So businesses have to remember they still have rights over there.

their property, even if they do want to find a way, which I know most do to cooperate with federal authorities.

Okay, Chris.

Well, this legislation is an example of we've had state leaders say that we are not a sanctuary state.

I think the legislation shows the attitude that that perhaps we are, all for due process.

I want to see due process.

Unfortunately, what's going to happen is a lot of these cases are going to be tied up in the courts, maybe for decades.

And so while I'm in favor of due process, I wish the people that really want to be here, in this, in this country would follow the process of having a legal status so we can know who is actually within our borders.

I looked at a federal report from 2020, which is somewhat outdated.

I'm sure it's changed quite a bit.

Should 94% of incarcerated non-citizens are here illegally, 94%.

So while I respect the fact that we do have to give these people due process, not everyone is a criminal just because they have a tattoo.

We've seen atrocities against children from non-citizens who are here illegally.

I think we have to take action again, though I do favor due process.

It may take some time.

Okay.

All right.

I would like to think that we're a sanctuary state for due process and for justice.

And in these cases where you have people like wearing funny, funny hats or strange t shirts, that's the sign they are not getting due process when they are thrown in in anticipation of deportation as gang members.

So good for Judge Sweeney for issuing this.

We're seeing similar kinds of cases popping up across the country.

We're still waiting to find out what's happening.

That Jeanette was Guerra about her case.

She's also in that Geo Group facility in Aurora.

So this is not going to end soon.

And in the meantime, what we're also hearing is that people are getting announcements they should self-deport.

And so you have students who are scared to go to school.

You have people who are scared to go get healthcare, even though hospitals are supposed to be off limits and health care clinics.

So it's going to get worse before it gets better.

And Jeanette is the woman who has been a long standing advocate for immigration.

She took sanctuary in churches back in 2017.

She was on the cover.

She was in time magazine as one of the 100 people of the year.

So she and she's been waiting now for a month after she she was popped in the parking lot of a target where she worked.

The headline for one of Ed's recent columns said An Industry on the Edge of Demise, referring to the child care industry.

The story talks about the closures of centers because of overregulation that centers face.

So not only is it harder to find a place that is fit for your child, it is also so very expensive.

The costs are through the roof.

Colorado is ranked as the most expensive place in the country for child care.

And let's start with you.

Make no mistake how hard it is to find a place and how expensive it is wrapped up with how regulated the industry is.

Are all one in the same issue?

yeah.

Just to put numbers on it, in the past year, we've lost more than a thousand child care slots in Colorado as 54 different centers have closed You're seeing, expanding regulations that, limit even more the number of children per adult, especially if you're going to take part in the state's universal pre-K program.

you see limits on things like teachers always having to be around students, meaning they can't take a bathroom break.

And if they do, you have to have somebody who's as trained up as them to go in and substitute for them for even those ten minutes there.

and that's causing, the cost of childcare provision to rise significantly.

We've seen a number of providers that say this is the most anti provider regulatory scheme I've ever seen, not just any specific rules, but in the way the state goes about enforcing them One of the folks I talked to, Chad Dunkley, runs, New Horizons Academy in five states, and he says, I've never seen anything like this in any of the other states.

And all of this is important because we need childcare to get mothers back into the workforce.

and the state really needs to think about how does it make itself a more accommodating place for an industry.

It says it wants to expand.

I think that the childcare industry should have regulations.

I think there should be a look at how many kids per adult, how many kids a single adult can handle at a time.

but really, what's at foot here is the universal, preschool program has become a competitor with private preschools and therefore has interrupted the free market, thus driving cost up.

When I was a mother with young children, I ended up swapping with another mother.

We both worked part time, 30 hours, which might be considered even full time now.

We swapped out.

Then my children went to preschool at four and then they went to kindergarten at five.

But we could afford to do that because the economy was significantly different 20 years ago.

Thank you very much.

so again, it's a shame we have an economy where parents, both parents, have to work full time, feel feel pressed to turn their child over at three months to a daycare because the mother has to go back to work.

or.

Farther.

Sorry.

You're right, you're right.

Well, you do want some regulation.

You've heard all the horrors of the McMartin preschool and all the other stories where you have people who go into this business a very few people who go into this business who might be preying on children.

So you do need some regulation, but that it has to be reasonable regulation.

And I would say the examples Ed used of finding someone to go to the bathroom to cover you while you go to the bathroom is a good one of we are getting to micromanaging on that.

The other issue is these are jobs that don't pay particularly well.

We have to remember that too.

So and they're not fun necessarily.

Even if you love kids, you might not love their parents who are bossing you around.

I have a sister who works in the childcare industry, and she says it's not a lot of fun sometimes once you get beyond the children themselves.

So it's an issue we have to work with because it does have such ramifications.

But I would say common sense regulations is the start.

All right in Tyrone?

As a father of three young kids, I can tell you that the parents have like a party when they're going into kindergarten because just trying to navigate child care and, you know, the wait lists.

And then if you actually get in somewhere, it's so it's like another mortgage payment, you know, for having multiple kids just to have them, you know, at a daycare.

It's just untenable.

I think that the universal pre-K is great and gave a relief to a lot of families, but in the sort of zero sum lawmaking politics game, we didn't really get to.

Okay, what was the effect going to be on the market to, some of these other like sort of the more the younger kids.

Right.

And yeah, we don't want to have one of those states with just notorious child care and daycare.

just tragedies frankly.

but sometimes, yes, it's easy for that pendulum to swing too far the other way.

But if we were all at the table, I think more collaboratively, it's easier to sort of figure out what regulations can stay, which ones can go, how can we make this actually work for parents and not just be sort of bickering from across the aisles?

Let's now talk about that fine line between protecting free speech and protecting our kids, the older kids who are online, on social media.

And for that, we can go back to the legislature.

There is a Senate bill that would require social media companies to bar users who seek to do criminal things online or to sell guns illegally, sell drugs, you know, sexually exploit kids.

The governor has serious concerns about that bill's impact on freedom, on innovation and privacy.

And that's not his only take on it.

Just on this bill, there's another bill that would require proof of age to get into online porn sites.

that has been pulled because there was the thought that the governor's going to veto it anyhow.

So, Chris, I want to start with you.

Sure.

I think it was disappointing that SB 201, the age limit on porn sites was pulled.

And here's why.

We we regulate how, how old you have to be to buy alcohol.

We regulate how old you have to be to drive.

We regulate how old you have to be to buy tobacco products, all in the name of safety.

So I'm all for safeguards that protect youth minors from things that are damaging.

And to say that porn isn't damaging, that's a ridiculous argument in my opinion.

but however, I am, you know, a supporter of free speech I think we have to have guardrails for children while maintaining an adults freedom of speech, freedom to access information as such, as far as selling illegal guns on the internet or on social media, I think you're ridiculous if you do that.

I mean, I'm sure the law enforcement agencies have access to social media.

That seems like a dumb idea.

it's so creepy when you read some of the stories about what teenagers are doing, who are replacing having any physical interactions or even social interactions with people with just watching porn.

I mean, that's creepy, but I still think he was wise to think they were wise to pull this since he was talking about a veto.

I do think he will be told this other bill and here's why.

It is still fraught with problems, which is you can the different providers right now do have rules.

You're not supposed to post illegal things.

And the problem is when you are looking for certain words or certain flags, you might cut out a lot of legal free speech that are for legal activities.

I know for a fact we've we tend to write about marijuana a lot.

We basically can't put most of those stories on Facebook just because they are going to assume it's illegal in another state.

So you actually have to watch out for will legal free speech things be tossed out if that passes?

And I think especially I'll take that one at a time as it relates to limiting the access on the porn sites, I think it was smart for them to pull it because there is a case that is, you know, in the Supreme Court where they are going to decide whether this type of law, specifically the one that this one was modeled from in Texas is even constitutional.

So to get this all the way through passes law, and then your law is now deemed to be unconstitutional and you're have a bunch of lawsuits.

You've got to go back to the drawing board.

I think it's smarter to see how this code is going to rule.

In the next session.

They can craft legislation because it seems like the political appetite is there to do this.

as it relates to, I think the concerns about the limit on free speech, with the other, I think law that's working its way through the session, I have some real concerns about the amount of, like, quasi law enforcement power that this hands over to the tech companies.

And I just think I agree with Patty.

It's really fraught with a number of landmines there.

The one that concerns me the most is the amount of sort of law enforcement type power that were given to the zuckerbergs and musks of the world.

I don't think it's a good idea.

All right.

Ed, you were in the state House every day.

How's it all playing out?

Well, you know, I want to play up what Tyrone said here, and that is, you're giving this power.

But business isn't asking for that.

Social media companies are worried about what they would have to do here.

When you're talking about, you know, the requirements in some of the bills, like Senate Bill 86, which is a bill that would require more social media protections, for, for users, going in and getting people, canceling accounts immediately.

they're worried about the blowback that could come from customers if they say Casl accounts someone who didn't, it turns out, do something criminal.

the idea that they have 72 hours to cooperate with police.

Look, there's a balance here that that that can be struck.

Police say we need that access to their accounts right away.

social media companies are saying, look, we want to work with you, but.

But 72 hours is a pretty quick ticking clock there, especially when we have to look into things and the idea of age verification, leaving them in charge of that with potential liability if they do that wrong, too.

I just think there needs to be a balance here.

And I think we need more conversations between the social media companies and the lawmakers to really craft what's going to work.

Okay.

All right.

Now let's go down the line and talk about some of the highs and the lows you all have witnessed this week.

Patty, I'll start with you.

Let's start on the low notes.

We can end on a good note.

Even if there's no tomorrow.

Get out and enjoy a national park while you can.

Entrances are free, and let's remember how the staffs have been cut.

What we're looking at on Earth Day.

Two more steps for EPA.

Different groups that protect our environment.

Think about what we we could lose out there.

So get out and enjoy it while you can.

full disclosure, as the, attorney for the Seaborn family, I think my low of the week is that the family is still calling for justice.

I think at the time that this airs, there will have been a rally, the day before.

they still are calling for justice.

They got some really disappointing news from D.A.

Brauchler last week that they are not going to be pursuing criminal charges against the officer.

Everyone's kind of holding their breath to see what the sheriff does with the internal investigation.

But you know, this has been going on since February.

There was a big, drawn out, nasty fight about trying to or not nasty or just a drawn out fight about getting the body, canons released.

And it's just been justice delayed and answers for the family.

So, you know, my heart goes out to them.

And that's my love.

The week.

Okay.

As a history buff, hearing a president question whether they will acknowledge a court decision from a federal court reminds me of Andrew Jackson once saying Justice Marshall has made his ruling.

Now, let him enforce it.

Jackson's failure to listen to Marshall led to the Trail of Tears and the deaths of tens of thousands of Cherokees.

I think before federal officials start deciding to blow off federal courts, they should think about what the results of their anarchistic behavior could be.

Chris.

Yeah, I watched the show last week, and I was glad to see some of the panelists point out, the issue with tariffs and, and the president declaring these tariffs that it really is the responsibility of Congress.

I had dinner with some Republican friends and they said, just hang on, don't worry about it.

It's all going to get fixed.

And that's great if you, you know, have time to leave your money in the market for a period of time for it to settle down.

Or perhaps you're not relying on an interest rate to buy a new home.

But people are not all, you know, homogenous in what stage of life or what stage they need their money.

the chaos we have seen, I think, could have been handled so much better.

It's sort of like taking up, chainsaw to something that required a scalpel, so.

Okay, Patty.

Something good.

I'm optimistic.

Guardedly so, about the new permitting plan and the city of Denver.

We clearly need to have that streamlined, have it make sense, have people be able to get projects deserving of being approved through so good luck to all of them.

Okay, Tara.

As a civil rights lawyer, I get asked like, you know, all the protests, the lawsuits, are they ever actually going to change anything?

Yes, because folks oftentimes get frustrated.

We got some good news this week, though, on the Kylan Lewis case where the independent monitor and looking at sort of what Aurora Swat has done to kind of revamp their, policies and procedures and training.

And we saw some real improvements there.

So I think, you know, it's not all about lawsuits and verdicts and settlements.

They're they're going to be actual institutional change where folks endeavor to do better.

And when the independent monitor looks at and says like, oh, actually, yeah, y'all are doing pretty good, I think that's a good sign.

And to keep up the fight.

Okay.

All right.

As the Colorado Chamber of Commerce in the Colorado Trial Lawyers Association worked in partnership to pass a bill this week, that in itself is enough of the statement where, you know, everyone on a committee was saying, wait, is the world ending here?

The bill is about shining a light in more transparency on the foreign funding of, third party litigation, which is a serious problem that that everyone needs to look into rather than just puff up my own organization.

Now, what I want to say is, look, if these two organizations, who are often at each other's throats, can work together for good policy, a whole lot of organizations now feuding can.

And I hope that people can take that as a sign and run with it.

Okay, I like that here.

Here.

I will always be a cheerleader for snow, even though it causes me issues to, snowpack statewide, I think is in the 60 percentile, 60%.

That's not good.

So every flake is water.

Let's bring it on.

All right.

Let's bring it.

Okay.

My highs are all of the fabulously unique people living on the autism spectrum.

And, we are now past the halfway mark of Autism Awareness Month.

April is all about increasing awareness and acceptance for those who live amongst us who live with autism.

This week, some crass assumptions were made about people who live in the spectrum.

They were inaccurate.

And yes, the spectrum does consist of individuals with varying degrees of differences and abilities.

But each life is exceptional and means so much in this world.

I don't want to talk about the negative and hurtful messages that came out this week, but I do want to just say, for all those people who live with autism and for their families, you are loved and you matter so very much.

And with Passover coming to an end this weekend and it being the holiest weekend for Christians with Easter being here, here's an opportunity to show some love and acceptance for one another.

I love my panel.

Thank you all for coming this week.

Thank you for watching as well or listening to our podcast.

I am Kyle Dyer.

I will see you next week here on PBS 12.

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