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TED: GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO AZ VOTES, "CANDIDATES IN CONVERSATION," A SPECIAL EDITION OF "ARIZONA HORIZON."

I'M TED SIMONS.

TONIGHT WE CONTINUE OUR "CANDIDATES IN CONVERSATION" WITH A DISCUSSION BETWEEN CANDIDATES RUNNING IN THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY FOR ARIZONA STATE TREASURER.

THE STATE TREASURER IS CONSIDERED ARIZONA'S CHIEF BANKING AND INVESTMENT OFFICER, PROVIDING AMONG OTHER THINGS, FINANCIAL OVERSIGHT AS CHAIR OF THE STATE BOARD OF INVESTMENT.

TONIGHT'S "CANDIDATES IN CONVERSATION" IS NOT A FORMAL DEBATE, IT'S AN OPEN EXCHANGE OF IDEAS, AN OPPORTUNITY FOR GIVE AND TAKE BETWEEN CANDIDATES FOR ONE OF THE STATE'S MOST IMPORTANT OFFICES.

AS SUCH, THE OCCASIONAL INTERRUPTION ARE ALLOWED PROVIDED ALL SIDES GET A FAIR SHAKE, WE'LL DO OUR BEST TO SEE IT HAPPENS.

JOINING US IN ALPHABETICAL ORDER, KATHERINE HALEY, SMALL BUSINESS OWNER AND PRESIDENT OF STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION AND ELIJAH NORTON, SMALL BUSINESSMAN AND FORMER TREASURER OF THE ARIZONA REPUBLICAN PARTY.

KATHERINE, START WITH YOU, WHAT QUALIFIES YOU FOR THE POSITION?

>> THANK YOU ARE IF THE QUESTION, TED, AND THANK YOU ALL FOR JOINING US.

I KNOW YOU ALL CARE DEEPLY ABOUT OUR STATE AND FUTURE, AND I'M GRATEFUL TO BE HERE.

I'M A SMALL BUSINESS OWNER.

WE MAINTAIN BALANCE SHEETS.

WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE WE BALANCE OUR CHECKBOOK EVERY DAY.

WE ARE READY TO PAY BILLS.

IN ADDITION TO THAT, I HAVE GOVERNMENT EXPERIENCE, BOTH ON CAPITOL HILL OVERSEEING BUDGETS, BUT ALSO ADVANCING POLICY, THE NAVIGATION OF IMPLEMENTING POLICY.

I'VE ALSO SPENT QUITE A FEW YEARS HELPING ORGANIZATIONS INVEST IN THEIR LOCAL COMMUNITIES, SO UNDERSTANDING STRONG GOVERNANCE STRUCTURE, EXCELLENT LEADERSHIP AND TALENT, BUT ULTIMATELY, I BELIEVE AS A LIFELONG CONSERVATIVE, AS SOMEONE WHO HAS SPENT HER LIFE IN PUBLIC SERVICE, I BELIEVE I HAVE THE QUALIFICATIONS, THE EXPERIENCE TO SERVE OUR STATE AS THE NEXT TREASURER, SO THANK YOU.

TED: ALL RIGHT, ELIJAH, YOUR QUALIFICATIONS ARE IN STATE POSITION?

>> WELL, I THINK MY QUALIFICATIONS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES.

I OWN A GLOBAL INSURANCE ORGANIZATION.

I AM VERY, VERY LUCKY.

I STARTED IT AT 21 YEARS OLD AND GREW IT INTO A GLOBAL COMPANY THAT GENERATES OVER $400 MILLION IN REVENUE.

IT'S AN INSURANCE ORGANIZATION, AND THAT UNIQUELY QUALIFIES ME BECAUSE I HAVE TO INVEST IN GUIDE LINES AND THEY ARE MORE CONSERVATIVE THAN THE GUIDELINES WE HAVE IN SOME OF OUR MAIN FUNDS.

SO IT'S VERY CLEAR THAT YOU NEED INVESTMENT AND BANKING EXPERIENCE IN ORDER TO DO THIS JOB WELL, AND THAT'S THE KEY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MY OPPONENT.

I THINK MY OPPONENT IS A LOVELY PERSON, VIT PRIVILEGE OF TRAVELING THE STATE WITH HER AND SEEING HER AT A LOT OF DIFFERENT EVENTS BUT THIS IS ABOUT EXPERIENCE, AND THE TRUTH IS, I WENT INTO ANY JOB INTERVIEW AND WE WERE ASKED TO GET A JOB AT FINANCIAL OR BANKING FIRM, I THINK IT'S CLEAR SHE DOESN'T HAVE THE FINANCE OR INVESTMENT EXPERIENCE -- >> I WOULD LIKE TO INTERRUPT A LITTLE BIT.

I APPRECIATE YOU SAYING I'M NICE, BUT I'M QUALIFIED AND COMPETENT AND HAVE THE INTEGRITITY DO THIS JOB.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE TREASURER'S JOB IS A CHIEF INVESTMENT AND BANKING OFFICER, YOU OVERSEE MORE THAN $32 BILLION IN ASSETS UNDER MANAGEMENT AND MANAGE $64 BILLION CASH FLOW.

MY EXPERIENCE IS OVERSEEING TEAMS, OVERSEEING RESOURCES AS CAPACITY AT THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION, WE OVERSEE SCHOOL BUDGETS, WHEN THEY'RE OUT OF COMPLIANCE, WE PUT THEM IN CORRECTIVE ACTION PLANS.

I DO HAVE OVERSIGHT, AND I DO HAVE INVESTMENT EXPERIENCE.

IT'S DIFFERENT THAN MY OPPONENT'S EXPERIENCE, BUT IT IS VERY RELEVANT TO THE RESPONSIBILITIES OF THE TREASURER.

TED: PLEASE, LET HIM RESPOND.

>> I'D LIKE TO RESPOND TO THAT.

I THINK WORKING IN WASHINGTON, D.C.

FOR JOHN BOEHNER AND PAUL RYAN, WHO ARE ESSENTIALLY SWAMP CREATURES.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO INTERRUPT THAT.

>> THIS IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE THE PEOPLE OF ARIZONA NEED TO KNOW THIS, IS NOT QUALIFICATION TO MANAGE $32 BILLION.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT $32 BILLION.

AND THE SMALL BUSINESS THAT SHE HAS, WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT DOES.

I OWN INSURANCE ORGANIZATION, CLEAR WHAT WE DO.

LOOK, SHE'S NOT QUALIFIED, FRANKLY, AND I MEAN THIS WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, TO BE THE BOOKKEEPER OF A PIZZA PARLER MORE OR LESS MANAGE $32 BILLION.

>> YES, I WORKED FOR MEMBERS OF CONGRESS BUT WORKED FOR MEMBERS OF CONGRESS WELL BEFORE YOU GOT INVOLVED YOURSELF, AND YOU SERVE YOUR CONSTITUENTS, THAT IS THE ROLE AND RESPONSIBILITY.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT IS ABOUT STEWARDSHIP, IT'S ABOUT SERVICE, OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES.

THE ROLE OF THE TREASURER IS SERVE AS CHIEF BANKING INVESTMENT OFFICER BUT YOU ARE IN SERVICE TO LOCAL COMMUNITIES.

IT IS NOT TELLING WHAT THEY DO OR DON'T DO, BUT IT'S IN SERVICE TO, SAYING YES, COME JOIN US AND INVEST WITH THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT POOLS BUT EQUIP WITH YOU THE SKILL US THAT NEED TO MAKE STRONG DECISIONS AT THE LOCAL LEVEL?

I'D LIKE TO MAKE A REBUTTAL TO THAT.

>> GO AHEAD.

>> HOW ARE YOU GOING TO DO THAT IF YOU DON'T KNOW ABOUT INVESTING MONEY?

YOU'VE BEEN ASKED THIS ON THE TRAIL MULTIPLE TIMES SXUSHGSDZ I HAVE NO BANKING OR INVESTMENT EXPERIENCE.

THAT'S ON VIDEO MULTIPLE TIMES.

HOW ARE YOU GOING TO BE A STEWARD OF $32 BILLION OF OUR STATE'S MONEY WHEN, MA'AM, YOU HAVE NO EXPERIENCE?

THAT'S A HUGE, HUGE PROGRAM, AND WE NEED TO ELECT SOMEONE WHO CAN MANAGE MONEY AND KNOWS WHAT THEY'RE DOING.

A GLORIFIED HR MANAGER TO MANAGE UNELECTED BUREAUCRATS, WE'RE ELECTING THE CHIEF BANKING AND INVESTMENT OFFICER OF OUR STATE.

TED: RESPOND, PLEASE.

>> INTERESTING COMMENTIS AND APPRECIATE THE INDIRECT DIGS.

AS OUR TREASURER, IT'S ONE OF THE TOP FIVE ROLES IN OUR STATE, AND IT'S DEFINED IN OUR CONSTITUTION.

YES, IT IS THE CHIEF BANKING AND INVESTMENT OFFICER.

YES, IT OVERSEES CONTRACTS.

YES, IT IS AN ADVOCATE FOR EDUCATION FREEDOM.

YES, IT'S IN SERVICE TO OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES.

YES, IT IS OVERSIGHT OF THE PUBLIC LAND ENDOWMENT TRUST FUND.

AT THE END OF THE DAYS, YOU ARE MAKING INVESTMENTS SO THAT OUR STATE CAN PAY ITS BILLS.

WE CANNOT MAKE RISKY BETS, CANNOT MAKE BAD BETS CAN, NOT SELL OUR PORTFOLIO TO THE HIGHEST BIDDER WITH THE GOAL OF PERHAPS WE'LL GET HIGHER YIELD.

>> I WANT TO ASK YOU A QUESTION, YOU MENTIONED A POLICY EARLIER AND REFERRED TO A POLICY AND PROMOTING POLICY, IS THAT SOMETHING, IS THAT A DUTY?

IS THAT A RESPONSIBILITY OF THE STATE TREASUREER?

>> AT THE END OF THE DAY, YOU ARE FOLLOWING STATE STATUTE AND WHAT IS DEFINED ALSO IN THE CONSTITUTION.

HOW WE INVEST OUR STATE DOLLARS.

MY OPPONENT SAID WE SHOULD INVEST LIKE TEXAS OR FLORIDA.

THEY ARE VERY DIFFERENT STATES.

WE IN ARIZONA, I'M INTERVIEWING TO BE THE TREASURER OF THE STATE OF ARIZONA.

IT IS A POLICY JOB.

IT IS AN INVESTMENT JOB.

IT IS A STEWARDSHIP JOB.

IT IS ALSO AN EDUCATION OPPORTUNITY TO HELP EDUCATE OUR COMMUNITIES ABOUT FINANCIAL LITERACY AS WELL AS THE ROLES THAT THE TREASURER'S OFFICE CAN PLAY IN SUPPORT TO THE LOCAL COMMUNITIES, COUNTIES AND OTHER TAXING AUTHORITY.

TED: IS IT AN ADVOCACY JOB?

>> IT'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS, BUT THE PRIMARY JOB OF THE STATE TREASURER IS TO MANAGE AND PROTECT OUR STATE'S $32 BILLION IN ASSETS UNDER MANAGEMENT.

IF YOU ELECT SOMEONE WITH NO FINANCE BACKGROUND OR EXPERIENCE TO MANAGE $32 BILLION, IF SOMETHING -- THE ECONOMY IS NOT ALWAYS LIKE THIS, THERE IS UPS AND DOWNS IN THE MARKET, AND YOU NEED TO ELECT SOMEONE THAT CAN RESPOND TO THOSE TO MAKE SURE WE DON'T LOSE PRINCIPLE.

TED: IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF AN ADVOCACY JOB.

>> OF COURSE.

NUMBER ONE, I'M GOING TO PROMOTE FINANCIAL LITERACY, I LOOK FORWARD TO DOING.

I LOVE DOING WHATEVER I CAN TO HELP PEOPLE BECOME BETTER AT MANAGING MONEY PERSONALLY.

BUT THE BULLY PULPIT IS ANOTHER KEY THING.

WE HAVE HAD A TERRIBLE DEMOCRAT GOVERNOR FOR THREE YEARS.

THERE'S $300 MILLION MISSING THAT WE CAN'T FIND.

WE NEED SOMEONE WITH THE GALL TO STAND UP TO LEFT DEMOCRATS.

HOPEFULLY KATIE HOBBS IS OUT OF HERE IN JANUARY 2027, WE NEED SOMEBODY TO STAND UP TO THE RADICAL LEFT AND BAD FINANCIAL POLICY BE AND AN ADVOCATE FOR GOOD FINANCIAL POLICY IN THE STATE.

AND NO ONE IS GOING TO TRUST SOMEONE -- >> I WOULD LIKE TO SAY, MY OPPONENT SAID STAND UP TO THE POLICY.

TREASURER YEE WAS TRYING TO ADVANCE A BILL, HOUSE BILL 2344 WOULD AND KEEP THE FINANCES INHOUSE, TO MAKE SURE THAT THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT INVESTMENT POOL ARE MANAGED INHOUSE.

IT'S CURRENTLY THE POLICY, IT'S NOT IN STATUTE, AND ONLY ON THE CONDITION BY WHICH THEY ARE UNABLE TO DO THE JOB.

THEN YOU CAN GO AND SEEK OUTSIDE COUNSEL OR HAVE PRIVATE INDUSTRY BANKERS AND PRIVATE EQUITY AND MANAGE THAT PORTFOLIO.

SOMETHING THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO ME IS I BELIEVE IN THE FREE ENTERPRISE.

I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT WE NEED TO BRING IDEOLOGY INTO THE WAY WE INVEST OUR STATE DOLLARS.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT WOKE, DEI, ESG, ET CETERA ARE NOT PART OF THAT PORTFOLIO, THE ONLY WAY WE CAN DO THAT IS MAKING SURE WE KEEP THE INVESTMENTS INHOUSE AND NOT SHOP IT OUT TO THE HIGHEST BIDDER.

TED: INTERESTING YOU BROUGHT UP THAT, THE IDEA OF WOKE AND DEI AND THE INVESTMENTS WITH FIRMS, WITH ENTITIES THAT MIGHT NOT AGREE WITH THE POLITICAL IDEOLOGY THAT YOU ESPOUSE.

IF IT'S GOOD FOR THE STATE, WILL YOU STILL SAY NO TO THE INVESTMENTS?

>> I'M GOING TO BE THE -- IF I'M ELECTED, I'M THE CHIEF BANKING AND INVESTMENT OFFICER.

I'M GOING TO INVEST IN COMPANIES FOCUSED ON MAKING MONEY AND PROVIDING A SERVICE.

NOT INVESTING IN COMPANIES THAT ENGAGE IN IDEOLOGY.

I WANT TO SAY SOMETHING A LITTLE ALARMING.

MY OPPONENT SITS ON THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION, THERE IS A VOTE THAT CAME UP IN OCTOBER TO BAN DEI FROM PUBLIC INSTRUCTION, AND I THINK THAT MY OPPONENT WAS NOT THERE, AND THE VOTE IS NOW BEEN DELAYED FOR FOUR OR FIVE -- I DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER OF MONTHS, AND WE STILL HAVE DEI INSTRUCTION IN THE CLASSROOM.

>> I APPRECIATE HIM BRINGING UP THAT.

I WAS UNABLE TO ATTEND THE BOARD MEETING IN OCTOBER AND THE VOTE WAS TABLED.

>> YOU COULD HAVE BROUGHT IT UP.

>> WE VOTED ON IT ELIJAH.

>> WHEN DID YOU DO THAT?

THE SUPERINTENDENT OF PUBLIC INSTRUCTION TOLD ME THAT'S NOT TRUE.

>> HE'S GOING TO NEED TO GO BACK.

IT HAPPENED THE FIRST WEEK OF DECEMBER.

>> I CAN TELL YOU --.

TED: HOLD ON.

>> IT'S REALLY INTERESTING, THEY PUT TOGETHER A GROUP, AS IS ANY POLICY, WHEN WE ARE TRYING TO ROOT OUT, THERE IS A GOVERNANCE COMMITTEE THAT'S COME TOGETHER OF EDUCATORS AND OTHERS TO ROOT OUT THE LANGUAGE SO WE CAN BE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE FEDERAL ORDER THAT WAS PUT IN PLACE.

>> I NEED TO SAY SOMETHING VERY IMPORTANT.

YOU VOTED TO ESTABLISH A COMMITTEE.

>> I WOULD JUST SAY -- >> I WOULD HAVE VOTED A BAN -- IF I'M THE TREASURER, I WANT TO MAKE SURE -- >> I WILL SAY WHEN IT COMES TO POLICY, IF YOU'RE A RULE-MAKING ORGANIZATION, THAT IS THE ROLE OF THE STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION, THE POLICIES WE PUT FORWARD, WE MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS, YOU HAVE A WORKING GROUP.

IT'S THE WAY IT HAS TO GO, A WORKING GROUP AND YOU COME TO A CONCLUSION AND ROOT OUT, IN PARTICULAR, THE LANGUAGE.

>> YOU DO WHAT DONALD TRUMP DOES, AND YOU CHOP DEI FROM PUBLIC SCHOOLS, AND YOU VOTED TO DO THAT.

TED: PLEASE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DEI, AND THIS IS A CONVERSATION WITH TWO PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BE THE STATE TREASURER.

>> THANK YOU, TED.

TED: WHAT DOES DEI HAVE TO DO WITH AN ADMINISTRATIVE JOB LIKE BEING THE STATE TREASURER?

>> THERE'S A LOT OF COMPANIES THAT HAVE DEI AND ESG POLICIES.

THEY INVEST PART OF THEIR PROFITS IN THE DEI AND ESG POLICIES.

I WANT TO DIVEST FROM THE POLICIES.

SHE DID A GOOD JOB OF DIVESTING FROM UNILEVER.

TED: WOULD YOU DIVEST IN THE COMPANIES IF IT WAS GOOD FOR THE STATE PORTFOLIO?

>> THERE'S BEEN QUESTION ABOUT ESG MANDATES.

AT THE END OF THE DAYS, MANY EQUITIES, OR MANY PUBLICLY TRADED COMPANIES HAVE BACKED AWAY, AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT WASN'T BEST FOR THE BOTTOM LINE.

IT WAS NOT BEST FOR INVESTORS.

AS SOMEONE WHO BELIEVES IN THE FREE ENTERPRISE, WE NEEDED TO IDENTIFY THOSE INVESTMENTS WHETHER THEY'RE BONDS, TREASURIES, EQUITIES, ABOUT 40% OF PORTFOLIO IS EQUITIES.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE ARE INVESTING ALIGNED WITH ARIZONA VALUES.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT'S ABOUT ARIZONA VALUES TO GET A RETURN PROTECTING THE PRINCIPLE, MAKING SURE WE HAVE LIQUIDITY BECAUSE WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO PAY OUR BILLS, AND THEN IT'S ABOUT YIELD.

TED: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT INVESTMENTS, AND I WANT TO TALK ABOUT INVESTING IN CRYPTO.

GOVERNOR VETOED A COUPLE OF BILLS INVOLVING CRYPTO, BASICALLY SAYING THERE IS TOO MUCH VOLATILITY IN THE CRYPTO MARKET FOR THE STATE TO BE INVESTING OR INVOLVED IN THAT KIND OF A THING?

DOES SHE HAVE A POINT?

>> I THINK THAT I DO NOT -- I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF INVESTING A LARGE AMOUNT OF OUR STATE'S MONEY IN CRYPTO.

IT'S TOO VOLATILE, THE OPTION SHOULD BE AVAILABLE AS THE CRYPTO INVESTMENT BECOMES MORE STABILIZED AND ENGRAINED IN OUR FINANCIAL SYSTEM.

TED: WHAT DO YOU THINK?

.

>> I HAVE A LITTLE CONCERN, PARTICULARLY RIGHT NOW.

IT'S, QUOTE, NEW.

CONGRESS IS IN THE MIDST OF DEBATING A PIECE OF LEGISLATION, THE CLARITY ACT TO SEE IF WE CAN CREATE GREATER CLARITY ON CRYPTO INVESTMENTS.

THEY WERE -- THEY'RE ALMOST DOUBLE WHERE THEY WERE TODAY, IN SEPTEMBER, AND THAT GIVES ME GREAT CONCERN BECAUSE PART OF THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE TREASURER IS SAFETY, LIQUIDITY, THEN YIELD.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE HAVE TO PROTECT THE PRINCIPAL.

UNDER TREASURER YEE, SHE'S DOUBLED STATE ASSETS UNDER MANAGEMENT TO MORE THAN $32 BILLION.

WE'VE DOUBLED THE PERMANENT LAND ENDOWMENT TRUST FUND WHICH HELPS FUND EDUCATION.

IF WE MAKE BIG BETS AND RISKY DECISIONS, THAT'S GOING TO MAKE SURE WE CAN'T PAY OUR EDUCATORS.

IT'S GOING TO MEAN WE CAN'T PAY OUR PUBLIC SAFETY OFFICERS AND FIRST RESPONDERS AND CAN'T MEET OUR LOCAL COMMUNITY NEEDS.

TED: PLEASE.

>> LOOK, I WANT TO SAY SOMETHING BECAUSE THERE IS TWO THINGS ON THIS.

NUMBER ONE, SHE CONSTANTLY BRINGS UP THAT DOUBLING ASSETS UNDER MANAGEMENT IS A GOOD THING.

THERE'S THE RULE OF 7 AND 2 IN INVESTMENTS.

IF SHE HAD THE EXPERIENCE SHE WOULD UNDERSTAND.

THAT IF YOU PUT MONEY INTO A NORMAL INVESTMENT ACCOUNT IT'S GOING TO DOUBLE EVERY SEVEN YEARS, SEVEN AND TWO.

AND WE HAVE IN THE 7.85 YEARS THAT OUR CURRENT TREASURER IS IN OFFICE, WE GAINED 450,000 PEOPLE.

WE SOLD $1.9 BILLION OF LAND INTO THE PERMANENT LAND ENDOWMENT TRUST FUND SO PRINCIPAL WENT UP IN THE TIME SHE'S BEEN IN OFFICE AND HAD THE WAY FAIR DECISION WHICH ALLOWS CITIES AND TOWNS TO IMPOSE SALES TAX ON TRANSACTIONS.

IF YOU TAKE OUR PORTFOLIO TO SOMEONE UNDERSTAND THATS INVESTMENTS, THEY'RE GOING TO SAY WE SHOULD HAVE 3 TO $5 BILLION MORE THAN WE DO.

IF YOU QUANTIFY THAT OVER 25 YEARS, THAT'S $25 BILLION.

I'M NOT SAYING WE SHOULD TAKE RISKY BETS.

THE DEMOCRAT WANTS TO CHANGE INVESTMENT STRATEGY TO SOMETHING THAT'S RISKY.

I WANT TO GO INTO THE OFFICE EVERY DAY, DO MY JOB AND APPLY MY EXPERIENCE TO GETTING BETTER RETURN TO THE TAXPAYERS.

TED: CAUTIOUS VERSUS AGGRESSIVE.

TAKE RISKY OUT OF THIS.

>> I WANT TO BE CAUTIOUS.

TED: CAUTIOUS OR -- >> I WANT TO BE CAUTIOUS, MAKING BIG BETS, AGAIN, IS GOING TO PUT US AT RISK.

ELIJAH HEARD ME TALK ABOUT THIS, BUT ORANGE COUNTY IN 1994 WENT ALL-IN TO CHASE THE INCREASED RETURN, IT WENT BANKRUPT.

IT TOOK 22 YEARS AND A BILLION DOLLARS.

>> DO YOU KNOW WHY IT WENT BANKRUPT?

>> IT WENT ALL-IN ON REPURCHASE LOANS.

>> DERIVATIVES, ACTUALLY.

THAT IS PROHIBITED UNDER OUR INVESTMENT PLAN.

>> IT IS AN EXAMPLE, IF WE GO ALL-IN UNDER OUR CURRENT STATUTE, WE ARE PROHIBITED TO BE DOING IT EXCLUSIVELY IN ONE SPECIFIC INVESTMENT.

>> I'VE ADVOCATED FOR SMART INVESTING AND TAKING MY EXPERIENCE TO INCREASE PRINCIPAL.

THE BIGGEST BET ARIZONA CAN MAKE IS ELECTING SOMEBODY THAT IS TOTALLY UNQUALIFIED TO MANAGE $32 BILLION.

I CAN'T THINK OF ANY BIGGER RISK.

TED: WHAT DO YOU THINK OF PROP 123 AND THE EXTENSION OF PROP 123, WHAT DO YOU THINK SHOULD BE THE PERCENTAGE OF DISTRIBUTION?

WE'RE SEEING 6.8%, 8.9%, IS IT WISE TO TAKE THE MONEY OUT OF TRUST?

>> I WANT TO PROTECT THE PRINCIPAL, THAT'S THE NUMBER ONE THING.

PROPOSAL PUT FORWARD BY KATIE HOBBS AND THE DEMOCRATS ARE RIDICULOUS.

IF YOU LOOK AT DEPLETIST RETURNS, THE ANNUALIZED RETURN IS 8, 9%.

IF YOU GO BACK TO 2022, WE HAD A NEGATIVE RETURN, IT LOST 7%.

SO HERE'S WHAT WE NEED TO DO.

WE NEED TO HAVE A TREASURER WHO CAN LEAD ON THE ISSUE AND DO A PROJECTION THAT SAYS IF WE SELL X AMOUNT OF LAND AND PAY Y AMOUNT YIELD AND HAVE A MARKET VOLATILITY SITUATION THAT WE CAN'T PREDICT IN THE FUTURE.

ANOTHER 2008 OR WHATEVER.

WE ARE PROTECTING THE PRINCIPAL.

THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO DO.

TED: THE IDEA, THE CONCEPT OF PROP 123, YOU ARE OKAY WITH THAT?

>> YES.

TED: YOU OKAY WITH THAT?

>> PROP 123, AND MY OPPONENT DOES NOT KNOW PROP 123, HE CRITICIZES ME.

WHEN HE GOT INTO THE RACE IN APRIL OF 2025, HE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT IT WAS.

>> THAT'S NOT TRUE.

THAT'S A LAUGHABLE STATEMENT.

>> THE PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITY OF THE FUND IS TO FUND PUBLIC EDUCATION AND THAT'S REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT.

IT WAS SET AT THE FOUNDING OF OUR STATE IN 1910, PRIOR TO OUR FOUNDING OF OUR STATE, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT GAVE US 10 MILLION ACRES OF LAND, WE'VE ONLY SOLD A MILLION ACRES OF LAND.

I AGREE WITH MY OPPONENT THAT THE STATE LAND TRUST HAS NOT GONE, I WOULD SAY, A VERY GOOD JOB OF STEWARDING RESOURCES.

THERE ARE OTHER STATES LIKE ARIZONA THAT HAVE DONE A BETTER JOB OF SELLING LAND.

IT REQUIRES LEADERSHIP, IT REQUIRES A NEW GOVERNOR.

WHEN IT COMES TO ACTUAL PERCENTAGE, YOU HAVE TO PROTECT THE PRINCIPAL.

WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE PUBLIC LAND ENDOWMENT TRUST FUND, IT'S TO INVEST INTO TODAY AND LOOK INTO IN PERPETUITY.

WITHOUT PROP 123, WE ARE BACK DOWN TO 2.4%.

TED: THE STATE TREASURER WHO THOUGHT THIS WAS A ROTTEN IDEA, AND TOTALLY AGAINST PROP 123 THAT SAID THIS IS NOT A GOOD STEWARDSHIP OF PUBLIC FUNDS, DID HE HAVE A GOOD POINT?

>> ELIJAH HAD A GOOD POINT, THERE'S UPS AND DOWNS, IT'S NOT ALWAYS HAD A HIGH RETURN, IT'S DOING INCREDIBLY WELL RIGHT NOW, I BELIEVE OVER 9.8%, BUT WE HAVE TO PLAN FOR THE FUTURE.

IN SOME WAYS I'M GRATEFUL THAT THE TAXPAYERS HAD OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE ON PROP 123 IN 2016.

IT GIVES AN OPPORTUNITY TO RE-EVALUATE, IS THAT THE BEST PERCENTAGE TO SUPPORT OUR PUBLIC EDUCATION?

BECAUSE IF NOT, OUR LEGISLATURE HAS HAD TO BACK FILL THE DOLLARS.

$300 MILLION.

TED: IS THAT MONEY THERE TO MANAGE, OR IS THAT MONEY THERE TO DISTRIBUTE?

WHAT SHOULD BE THE EMPHASIS THERE?

>> A COMBINATION OF BOTH.

TED: GIVE ME AN EMPHASIS.

>> THE EMPHASIS IS PROTECTING THE PRINCIPAL.

MY NUMBER ONE THING IS PRINCIPAL PRESERVATION.

I WANT TO BE SURE WE HAVE THE PRINCIPAL IN THE TRUST FUND, AND THAT'S WHY IT'S IMPORTANT TO DO A PERFORMA AND ELECT SOMEBODY THAT HAS EXPERIENCE TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM.

WE HAVEN'T SOLVED THIS PROBLEM IN EIGHT YEARS.

NOT LIKE WE DIDN'T KNOW THIS WAS GOING TO COME UP FOR RENEWAL.

WE KNEW THIS WAS GOING TO HAPPEN, AND I WANT TO LEAD ON THIS ISSUE, WORK WITH THE LEGISLATURE IN 2027 AND FIX THIS PROBLEM ONCE AND FOR ALL.

>> AGAIN, I DO APPRECIATE GIVING THE VOTERS AN OPPORTUNITY TO VOTE ON THIS.

IT'S BEEN TEN YEARS, I APPRECIATE THAT.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE FUND WAS ESTABLISHED TO DISTRIBUTE FUNDS TO 13 DIFFERENT ENTITIES.

90% GOES TO PUBLIC EDUCATION.

WE NEED TO BE A GOOD STEWARD ON BEHALF OF ARIZONA TAXPAYERS TO INVEST IN EDUCATION TODAY AND PLAN FOR THE FUTURE.

HENCE WHY IT'S AN ENDOWMENT, INVESTING IN TODAY AND TOMORROW.

TED: PLEASE, I WANT TO GET -- I WANT HIM TO HAVE A CHANCE TO SPEAK.

>> ONE THING I APPRECIATE ABOUT MY OPPONENT CONTINUALLY SAYING STEWARD, WE NEED TO BE A STEWARD OF TAXPAYER DOLLARS.

I 100% AGREE WITH THAT.

YOU NEED TO BE AN INVESTMENT OFFICER.

YOU ARE ELECTED BY THE TAXPAYERS ON WHERE INVESTMENTS GO.

AND I GO BACK AND DIGRESS, HOW CAN YOU BE A GOOD STEWARD WHEN YOU HAVE NO EXPERIENCE MANAGEMENTING INVESTMENTING OR FINANCE?

>> PLEASE, I HAVE MY OWN PERSONAL FINANCES AND MY OWN PERSONAL INVESTMENTS.

>> $32 BILLION IS A LOT DIFFERENT THAN -- >> SIMILAR TO MY OPPONENT HE HAS NOT INVESTED $32 BILLION.

>> I INVESTED OVER 100 BILLION, THAT'S A LOT OF MONEY.

IT'S SERVING AS A CHIEF BANKING AND INVESTMENT OFFICER.

IT'S CHAIRING THE STATE INVESTMENT BOARD.

ENSURING WE HAVE AN INCREDIBLE TEAM OF INVESTORS SERVING THE BEST INTEREST OF ARIZONA.

MY LIFE IN PUBLIC SERVICE, AS A SMALL BUSINESS OWNER, I BELIEVE HAS EQUIPPED ME.

IT'S BECAUSE OF MY EXPERIENCE, MY TEMPERAMENT, THE WISDOM THEY BRING TO THE ROLE THEY HAVE THE ENDORSEMENT OF KIMBERLY YEE AND THREE OTHER FORMER TREASURERS AS WELL AS OTHER TREASURERS.

TED: THE CURRENT TREASURER DID NOT ENDORSE YOU.

ARE YOU CONCERNED ABOUT THAT?

>> NO.

ENDORSEMENTS UNFORTUNATELY ARE MADE OFF OF PERSONAL RELATIONSHIPS, AND I HAVE OVER 20 ENDORSEMENTS.

I'VE BEEN ENDORSED BY THE FREE ENTERPRISE CLUB, BY TURNING POINT, BY AZRA, THE PRESIDENT OF THE STATE SENATE, LEADERSHIP IN THE STATEHOUSE AND COUNTY SENATORS.

THE REASON I DON'T TOUT MY ENDORSEMENTS IS I'M RUNNING ON MY OWN RESUME, AND MY OPPONENT HAS RELIED ON ENDORSEMENTS TO COVER UP THE LACK THEREOF.

TED: HOLY SMOKES, WE GOT TO STOP RIGHT THERE.

WE HAVE ALLOTTED ONE-MINUTE CLOSING STATEMENTS.

WE START WITH KATHERINE HALEY.

>> ARIZONA IS MY HEART, AND IT IS IMPORTANT TO YOU BECAUSE THAT'S WHY YOU ARE JOINING US TODAY.

YES, THIS IS A JOB INTERVIEW, AND I COMMIT TO BE AN ADVOCATE ON BEHALF OF ARIZONANS, TO BE A WISE STEWARD, TO ENSURE LIMITED AND EFFICIENT GOVERNMENT.

TO NOT DO AUDITS ONCE IN A LIFETIME BUT EVERY SINGLE DAY BRING EFFICIENCY TO THE OFFICE SO THAT WE ARE ADVANCING AND PROTECTING YOUR DOLLARS.

WHY?

BECAUSE WE ARE A WISE STEWARD AND ADVANCING GOVERNMENT, OUR TAXES STAY LOW, AND WE ARE ABLE TO GIVE YOU THE FREEDOM TO INVEST YOUR DOLLARS AS YOU SO CHOOSE.

ROLE OF THE TREASURER IS TO ENSURE NOT ONLY INVEST ON BEHALF OF OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES, BUT ALSO TO MAKE SURE THAT WE MAKE GOOD ON OUR BILLS.

HELPING TO PAY -- MAKING GOOD ON OUR LOCAL COMMUNITIES, OUR SCHOOLS ARE FUNDED, OUR TEACHERS ARE SUPPORTED, OUR PUBLIC SAFETY IS WITH US.

THANK YOU SO MUCH, AND I HOPE I EARNED YOUR VOTE.

TED: THANK YOU VERY MUCH, AND NOW THE CLOSING STATEMENT FROM ELIJAH NORTON.

>> THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT.

I THINK THIS JOB IS ABOUT EXPERIENCE AND QUALIFICATIONS.

NOT ONLY DO I OWN A MULTIMILLION DOLLAR GLOBAL INSURANCE COMPANY AND HAVE LARGE INVESTMENT EXPERIENCE, I SERVED AS ARIZONA REPUBLICAN PARTY TREASURER AND MANAGED OVER $20 MILLION OF FUNDS AND WE HAD A GOOD ELECTION YEAR BECAUSE WE RESTORED HONESTY AND TRANSPARENCY AND TRUST.

I THINK WE NEED TO DO A D.O.G.E.

OF STATE EDUCATION SYSTEM.

THERE'S A LOT OF WASTE, FRAUD AND ABUSE.

CITIES COUNTIES AND TOWNS ARE INVESTING WITH THE STATE OF ARIZONA TREASURER IF THEY SO CHOOSE TO MAXIMIZE THE RETURNS IN A SAFE WAY.

AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, THIS JOB IS ABOUT EXPERIENCE, I REITERATE THAT AGAIN.

IF YOU WERE TO FLY INTO AN AIRPLANE INTO A $32 BILLION AIRPLANE, WOULD YOU WANT SOMEONE FLYING YOU THAT HAS NEVER SET FOOT IN A COCKPIT OR SOMEONE THAT UNDERSTANDS INVESTMENTS AT A HIGH LEVEL.

THANK YOU SO MUCH AND I HOPE I EARNED YOUR VOTE.

TED: THANK YOU, CANDIDATES, YOU CAN TAKE A SEAT.

WE'RE NOT QUITE DONE YET.

OUR NEXT "CANDIDATES IN CONVERSATION" IS TUESDAY AS WE FOCUS ON THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY FOR ARIZONA'S 4th CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT AT 5:00 P.M.

AND AGAIN AT 10:00 P.M.

RIGHT HERE ON "ARIZONA HORIZON."

A REMINDER ALL EPISODES OF "CANDIDATES IN CONVERSATION" ARE LIVESTREAMED ON YouTube AT AZPBS NOW AND VIEWED AT AZPBS.ORG.

THAT'S IT FOR YOU IN.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

YOU HAVE A GREAT EVENING.