Major funding for election 2022 Arkansas PBS debates is provided by AARP Arkansas, with additional funding provided by the Arkansas State Chamber of Commerce.

From the campus of University of Central Arkansas.

From the studios of Arkansas.

PBS.

His election, 2022 Arkansas PBS, Secretary of State debate.

In 54321 upon Jim and Justin and hello again everyone, and welcome to debate week here on Arkansas PBS.

At this hour, the candidates for Secretary of State and they are, in alphabetical order, the Democratic nominee, Annabeth Gorman and the Republican candidate and incumbent John Thurston.

Questions for the debate will come tonight from Brandon.

Evans from 4029 News, Fort Smith and Fayetteville and Christina Munoz of Arkansas, PBS and Natural state update.

I'm Steve Barnes.

Rules for the debate have been agreed upon by both candidates and in review.

Each will have one minute to respond to a question.

The candidates will have 30 seconds for rebuttal or for expansion on an answer if they choose.

At the conclusion of questioning, each candidate will have one minute for a closing statement.

The order of candidate appearance was determined prior to the debate by a toss of a coin, which was overseen by the candidates or.

Their representatives.

Our first question will come from Brandon Evans and it goes to Miss Gorman, Kennedy Gorman.

A lot was made about whether the 2020 election was free and fair.

Do you believe it was?

And if elected Secretary of State, what would you do to ensure that elections remain free and fair in Arkansas?

Thank you, Brandon.

Thank you, PBS.

Thank you, Christina.

Thank you, Steve.

I'm very happy to be here today.

And the short answer is yes.

I believe that the 2020 election was a free, fair and sound election.

And I believe that President Joe Biden won the presidential election.

And as sad as that day was, it taught Americans that we have to treat democracy as a fragile institution, that we have to work hard to ensure that.

That exist in the form that we want it to exist in.

So as Secretary of State, I'm going to work hard to ensure that all our Kansans are participating in the the process.

We have the lowest voter participation and turnout in the country and that's a way to ensure election integrity.

Integrity is to change that statistic.

Thank you, Mr Thurston.

One minute.

Well, that is the $1,000,000 question everyone's been asking for the past, what, two years?

And I believe it's the same question that was asked when Hillary lost several years ago.

So that concern and that fear has been among voters.

Since the beginning of this, probably the first election back when we just penciled in the name.

The short answer is I positively, 100% can tell you with certainty that I don't know.

Because.

Each state, according to the US Constitution, shall run their own elections and certify those elections.

So for me to say that a particular state did it perfectly, I can't say that I can say here in Arkansas during record turnout.

A pandemic, no doubt.

We had probably the safest and most secure elections in the country.

In fact, Arkansas ranks, according to the National Heritage Foundation, ranks #4 in the nation in the area of election integrity.

And so I look forward to talking more about that because there's there's a lot we can say pertaining to especially.

The last presidential election look Miss Gorman 30 seconds.

Well I'm concerned to hear that we can't all agree about the 2020 election still and and on stage with the individual who overseas elections in Arkansas.

Yes Arkansas has got integrity and we've had no voter fraud complaints and again we were went red and so no one came after Arkansas in the 2020 election but that could have been different we saw the President United States go after members of his own party because they certified.

Election they did their job and he came after them.

So we have to ensure that Secretary of States in particular, once they're elected, act in the most nonpartisan way.

Mr Thurston, 30 seconds.

So the reason that I can't say for certainty, I can tell you what the certification said is because I'm not there.

So it's it's definitely assuming too much for me to say that every state ran their election perfectly because every state is.

You would be shocked at how different each state is when it comes to their election laws and what they carry out.

One state has ID, voter ID, one state doesn't.

One states vote by mail, all vote by mail, another state is limited to.

Absentee so, but I definitely am very confident with what went on here in Arkansas.

Miss Munoz has the next question.

First, for Mr Thurston.

Thank you for Mr Thurston.

So there's no doubt that election integrity is incredibly important.

So when it comes to a potential voter in Arkansas, are there too many hoops to jump through?

Are the safeguards and protections just the right amount, or should there be even more?

So I tell people that you have to take ownership of your vote.

Some states have an automatic voter registration.

Here in Arkansas, you have to register vote to vote 30 days prior to the election that you want to vote in.

That's what I mean by taking ownership of your vote.

You do need to register.

There is a lot of debate on some of the election laws passed here in Arkansas this past General Assembly.

There were several.

Some call it voter suppression, as if voter ID is somehow suppressing votes.

But we do want it to be convenient.

We do want it to be easy for people to vote, obviously, but also hard to cheat.

And accuracy is more important than convenience, in my opinion, because elections, it is the bedrock of our Republic.

Miss Gorman.

Again, when you look at this, the statistics of us having the lowest voter participation and turnout, I would argue that we have made it extremely hard to access your fundamental right as an American to participate in the American election process, process, American democracy.

There are things that we can do today that overnight would change that.

Things that have been tried and true and several other states.

Online voter registration most Americans conduct their business.

Through a tool in their pocket, their phone, we are making it extremely difficult in this day and age for Arkansans to access what truly makes America and American democracy different from any other country in the world.

And on day one, I'm going to be addressing this again.

If you're going to be judging the performance of this job, the first thing you should judge it by is how many people are participating in our elections.

Mr Thurston, you have 30 seconds, Sir.

So during the the primary that we just had and.

Well, even the general election before that we had record turnout and record participation.

So I think we are seeing it trend up.

Obviously we should do a better job educating our young people, because I believe that's where we we should be telling them first, when they're young, the importance of voting.

Because once an individual's into their 60s and 70s, they're pretty well set.

They they're just not going to vote.

But I do think we need to do a better job in educating our young people, and I hope we have time to talk more about that.

Miss Gorman, 30 seconds.

I believe this office should be the chief Civic engagement officer for the state of Arkansas.

I absolutely agree that we should be talking to not just young populations, but all populations.

We can look at data and look at who's not voting and can develop strategic strategies.

To address those populations and meet their needs, not expect them to come to us.

Thank you, Miss Gorman.

And a question for Miss Gorman.

You have indicated that you want to assist.

Commute underserved communities, and particularly and women.

Is there something unique to the office of Secretary of State?

How can you do that with the office of Secretary of State?

On the campaign trail, I talk about being an opportunity advocate.

I've seen how opportunity transforms lives.

I've seen how it transformed the lives of women when you give them access to an opportunity that already exists.

I look at this job as the position in statewide office that really has the most opportunity to help all our Kansans, not just women.

Opportunity is a rising tide that lifts us all up.

So when I say that I want to work for women, I want to work for all of our communities.

I want them participating in the election process because your voice is your vote.

And that is important.

Mr Thurston.

So we we all wish we could do more, I mean in every at every level.

But when it comes kind of to back up in a little previous question about participation, voter registration and those sorts of things.

As a constitutional officer.

There's very little room for advocacy because your job description description is.

Set by the Constitution, it is set by state law.

You don't get to define your job.

And when you're if you're going to do a outreach or a voter drive or try to get more people to participate, which group do you pick?

And that's why it's a very fine line for the Chief Election Officer to go to any particular group and encourage.

Them to vote, do I go to Northwest and we'll focus on that area.

Do I go to the delta?

And so even though it it, it does sound good and I wish we could do more, it also takes resources to make sure you're doing it across the board.

And your outreaching every Arkansan, encouraging them to register and to vote.

So Miss Gorman, 30 seconds.

I'm a successful CEO of a nonprofit.

I know how to do a lot with a little.

And I believe that you absolutely should expect your constitutional officers to be advocates.

And I've done a lot of work with our existing constitutional officers and other state agencies on creating programs and opportunities for all our Kansans.

Back to Mr Thurston for another 30 seconds, Sir.

I think you do advocate for.

People's rights.

But again, I mean back to the voter registration part because I've, I've heard this over the years, you know, increased voter turn out increased voter registration.

John, what what does the Secretary, Secretary of State do?

What we do put an ad in a magazine that goes to every senior in high school that has an application on to register to vote.

So at the very least, when they're a senior, they do have that opportunity.

But you do have to be careful.

What demographic, which part of who do you encourage to vote?

It's kind of crosses the line time, Sir.

Our next question, Mr. Evans.

For Secretary Thurston, when it comes to real ID laws, the Secretary of State's office will oversee the implementation of the new real ID laws when they are put into place in Arkansas in May of next year.

How would your office make that transition for voters specifically go as smoothly as possible?

So secret county clerks are the ones who really carry out elections.

The county clerks.

The election Commissioners, poll workers, and even though the title chief election Officer is on the Secretary of State, a lot of folks think, well, you have a big stick.

You must really.

Have you know you must run elections when really it's done at the county level.

And the reason that's good is because not only am I for states rights and I'm against federalizing elections, anytime there's some federal law that comes out to tell states how they are to run their elections, I oppose because which ones do you pick?

What if it's a federal law for voter ID?

What if it's one to go vote by mail?

So I think they should stay out.

Likewise, you have to be cautious.

We we we try not to go into counties.

And and with that same approach and tell them how to do it and so that would that's definitely something I think will probably have to be handled legislatively to make sure that that process is in place one minute for Miss Gorman.

I understand how elections work in Arkansas.

We have 75 counties and you work with 75 county clerks and their staff.

I've been going all over our state, meeting with counties, meeting with our different communities, and I'm hearing things from our county officers that are talking about their employees receive death threats for showing up to administer elections.

So I don't think that it just falls on that county clerk to really ensure the safety and integrity of election law and laws that come up are passed for our legislature, I think.

That you are, as the chief Election Officer, responsible for acting as an effective administrator.

And so you understand what that county needs, what resources they need to be successful in implementing what the legislature passes.

That's what an effective administrator does, doesn't just pass it off to our county clerks.

It's a coordinated effort.

Mr Thurston, 30 seconds, Sir.

So resources, I mean, just an example, when you talk about resources during the pandemic, which was the first time we'd ever had one during an election, and during the month of August, prior to the presidential election, my office delivered PP PPE to all 75 counties.

And of course, we have outreach teams and we're in constant communication with the counties.

So supporting them, I haven't had any county clerk that to say otherwise.

And so 30 seconds sure goes by fast.

Storm and you have another 30 seconds.

Again, I this is a coordinated effort.

We have 75 counties and they're very different.

So they're going to have different needs.

And so it's not a one-size-fits-all approach.

It is an adaptive approach and you can do this in a way and you can be a resource partner to our counties.

Christina Munoz for the next question goes first to Mr Gorman or Miss Gorman, yes.

Before these debates got underway this week, we gave an opportunity for viewers to participate by submitting questions via social media.

So this next question comes from a viewer in Pulaski County.

How will you bring people who do not agree with you to the conversation?

This is important because you will be representing not your party and your supporters, but all of Arkansas.

Miss Gordon, I've had a lot of practice at this.

I'm an advocate for women and sometimes when I walk in the room that people don't want to talk just about women.

Right.

So I have to find an opportunity of some project or an idea that we can work on together and that's how you bring people together.

And in the job that I have, I will say there are so many things that we can agree on, we can work on.

It's just working to find that.

So my organization, we've been extremely successful because we work with cross section of stakeholders, we look for unlikely allies and we partner with them.

You know what I care about passionately, I can put that aside.

If there is something that we can collaborate on and really create, good for all Arkansas, we go to Mr Thurston now for one minute, Sir.

I mean that is important because.

We are Americans at the end of the day and.

And we get so caught up in sometimes the, the, the really, the small, the smallest of things.

But I do want to encourage listeners today that here in Arkansas don't don't don't think that Arkansas politics or what goes on in the capital is what you see on Fox and CNN because we are much more cordial and we get along a whole lot better up there in that building than what people realize we do disagree on on some things.

But I do want to encourage people with that because and to think that one individual has all the authority and power to change the.

World or change.

The founding fathers designed this government so that there is not one person that can change.

There are separation of powers.

You do have to work together.

And so we would not be where we are at this point in history if there was not compromise and working together.

So I do want to encourage folks we we are not quite as divided as maybe cable news depicts.

Back to Miss Gorman now for 30 seconds.

I agree with John.

Does not how everyday Arkansans behave.

That's not.

We're a small state.

We are 1 degree of separation from knowing your cousin.

Absolutely.

I've run into multiple of John's cousins on the campaign trail, literally.

And again, to get things in our state, we've got a lot of people working on good things, and we're collaborating every day.

It's not going to be an issue, not in this job.

That should be the most nonpartisan of all the constitutional offices.

And Mr Thurston, I agree.

Question now for Miss Thurston, I think yes.

Mr Thurston, you're, you're both of you have some extensive experience according to your resumes and your job performance with Cyber, cyberspace and particularly cybersecurity.

What can you tell Arkansans about the state of the the documents, the records that are entrusted to the Secretary of State, and how can they be improved?

Are we liable to hacking right now?

I don't think anyone can say that it is impossible to be hacked.

I mean no one can say that for certainty.

I am very confident and I will talk, talk, say this, that when I was first elected, all the conversation was around cyber security, cyber attack, Russian interference.

And so for the first time in state history, we had the FBI and the Department of Homeland on site at the Capitol on election night and they will be there again this election night to help keep and they'll be in communication with their counterparts.

Across the nation in the event there is a cyber attack and we also for the first time we have a cyber security specialist on staff.

And so we we we put in some safeguards and and of course we're constantly sending our people to to be more educated and I'm actually on the cyber security.

Council or board committee I should say committee with the national associations of Secretary of State.

So there's a lot of collaboration and and work that goes in on making sure something really really bad doesn't happen.

Miss Gorman, you have one running Steve as you mentioned I was appointed to serve on the on by ASA Hutchinson.

Governor ASA Hutchinson to serve as a commissioner for the Computer Science and Cybersecurity Task Force.

I advocate for computer science education across our state.

I've learned a lot about computer science and cybersecurity.

And what I would say is that we have to always be vigilant because technology is ever changing.

So records today might be safe, but that doesn't mean that there's not going to be new technology or new efforts from bad actors tomorrow.

So we have to be vigilant.

So I'm excited to hear about that.

We've got a full time position and I would intend to improve upon that position and and care and continue to see it forward.

Mr Thurston, back to you for 30 seconds.

Sure.

It it is very important.

It's a changing world and there's a lot of bad.

Actors out there and.

The cyber world, you know, we're no longer, you know, being attacked, if you will, by someone with a gun crossing our border.

They are literally, you know, trying to get into our systems here and what better system.

Then to hack something that has to do with elections.

And so, yes, we have to constantly.

Be mindful of that.

Lord Miss Gorman, 30 seconds for the comment.

Alright.

At this point we want to let the audience know.

Everyone know that the candidates can participate in a press conference here directly following the debate.

Now to watch at home, scan the QR code on your screen with your mobile device.

You will see that QR code periodically throughout the balance of our debate.

And with that, our next question comes from.

Mr. Evans and it goes first to Miss Gorman.

Candidate Gorman.

So I want to talk about business now because the Secretary of State's office does have the business and Commercial Services Division and the Business Office.

So how as Secretary of State would you help businesses and business owners in Arkansas?

Thank you, Brian, for this question.

I'm very passionate about the business economy, specifically the small business economy.

I'm currently the chairman of the North Little Rock Chamber of Commerce.

In my day job, I've worked very closely with female entrepreneurs across our state.

I'm helping understand how their business can become a true vehicle of economic mobility.

And what I've learned is that the Secretary of State plays a very vital role as the incubator to business in Arkansas.

The 1st place that you have to go is a Secretary of State's website to register your business, and if you are not in good standing with the Secretary of State, a bank will not give you a loan.

And unfortunately, currently if you call the bank and say I'm looking to get a loan, they're gonna look you up on the Secretary of State's website.

And if you're not good stating, they'll just tell, you know, they won't tell you why.

So I absolutely intend to really focus a lot of attention on this seldomly talked about but very important aspect of the Secretary of State's job.

Mr Thurston, one minute.

It is a very important function of the office.

When I took office.

3 1/2 years ago, one of the needs that I saw was NW, 40% of the growth in Arkansas in in the realm of commerce and business goes on in Northwest Arkansas.

That's 40%.

And so we created the first ever Secretary of State satellite office, if you will, that handles business, commercial service issues that they may have to deal with.

Also during my first term, we had 50,000.

New businesses slash entities, corporations, nonprofits and so forth, startup and our office takes 4 around 400 calls a day.

So it's a very, very busy office and I have just a couple of minutes.

And also during the pandemic, the the PPP loans that were available to small businesses, they had to call our office and get their status of you know that they were active and articles of incorporation and so forth.

And we served around 20,000 of those during that time.

And so I've got a call, very important function.

Yeah.

And we go to Miss Gorman.

I think this is an area where we've got to improve.

I looked yesterday on the business service tab, the first thing you click when you says new businesses.

Basically, due to a staffing shortage, you're going to experience customer service delays.

Nothing about that or our website currently makes this an easy place to do business in Arkansas.

We've got to improve it another 30 seconds for Mr Thurston.

Well, 30 seconds it's.

50,000 new entities in the last 3 1/2 years.

And um.

We're growing.

And we have very little complaints personally and and most lawyers and those who start businesses, many across the state have my cell number and they know they can call me and so we we definitely respond to any needs immediately so.

And Miss Moon, he always has the next question.

It goes first to Mr Thurston.

So we've talked a lot about the office and the duties as well as increasing voter turnout, voter registrations.

But what criteria would you use as Secretary of State to evaluate your performance in that office?

When I take I was Commissioner of State lands for eight years and ran for this office and how I look at a constitutional office, as you first look at your statutory responsibility, I mentioned you don't get to set the job description and the main thing that you do is you make sure you're fulfilling that statutory responsibility.

Period.

You don't get to go off into other lanes of of government and dabble with.

And so I think to way to the way to measure that is to make sure that you're doing that fulfilling your obligation statutorily and you do it with great customer service as well.

Because we're in the people business.

I mean the tentacles of the Secretary of State touched so many lives, whether it's elections, BCS, the capital grounds, the security, all the monuments.

The restoration projects of that building that's going on constantly and so.

I think that's how you measure you.

You have to, you have to look at, look at the laws and and make sure and and make sure that the public are are taken care of.

Miss Gorman, one mother.

Then figures.

I think it's a simple way to evaluate job performance.

Again, I'm a I'm a CEO of an organization and I get evaluated every year, not just every four years.

Every year I get evaluated.

And we look at very specific metrics.

The there are some big metrics with this job, voter participation, voter turn out the number of businesses.

Why is 50 the threshold, 50,000?

Why isn't it 100,000?

Let's put those numbers on a board.

Let's see us go from the bottom of a national list.

And voter engagement to the top.

If you go around the state, people cannot tell you the name of the Secretary of State.

I want people to know who the Secretary of State is, hold them accountable for their job.

And I want this office to really fulfill its constitutional mandated responsibilities.

I think all our Kansans want, where their taxpayer dollars go, to know that someone is working not just to check a box, but to exceed expectations.

Mr Thurston, 36.

It is a public office and.

Anyone in the state can obviously find us and reach out, and we also have 135 legislators that keep a close eye on my job performance as well.

And so.

It's it's it's been an honor and it's gone really well.

Nothing's broken.

It it's it's that's the reason we're having a really hard time today finding something that hasn't been fulfilled or accomplished or statutorily where the ball's been dropped because it it has been a great first term.

Alright, and back to Miss Gorman.

I think that I've clearly pointed out, and I'm in, I'm inviting Arkansas voters to look though.

You can see where we're not delivering on this office.

Worst voter participation in the country.

A website that isn't working in red letters.

We're having customer service issues.

I've walked.

I've gone around the site.

I've met with professional service firms, lawyers.

I've met with entrepreneurs, support organizations.

They are extremely frustrated with the lack of support they're getting from the Secretary of State's office.

Question now for Miss Gorman executive power in Arkansas State government is legendarily diffuse.

In the interest of efficiency economy, would you support?

A proposal that would consolidate some of the independent offices, say Secretary of State, Auditor, Treasurer, Land Commissioner.

That's a great question and one that I haven't spent a lot of time on thinking about.

I I believe in checks and balances in our government and I believe, you know John just talked about this is a really big job.

The Secretary of State, it to me in my opinion is one of the biggest jobs.

I mean it is elections, it's business support services, it's the state capital grounds itself, it's the capital police force.

If you're telling me that you think that we need to consolidate more offices, then I'm going to tell our Kansans.

You're gonna get what you pay for.

You're not going to get a lot.

I think that we want professional.

Constitutional officers that can do a really good job.

So give them a give them.

The opportunity to do a good job.

Mr Thurston.

That's right.

When I became land Commissioner, there was talk of making it an unelected position and consolidating and so forth.

The good part about having an elected official is you, well, we're we're coming up on a term that's ending, and the public will have the opportunity to cancel my contract or extend it for another term.

When there is an office that's up led by an appointment or something, or it's buried under bureaucracy.

It is very, very hard for the public to have a say on who runs that particular agency or office and so.

Perhaps there's some consolidation out there that may be needed.

I can't think of it off the top of my head, but certainly the Secretary of State needs to stand alone as a constitutional office.

Miss Gorman, 30 seconds.

I'll just say that I'm all about efficiency and trying to save taxpayer dollars, but we can work smarter and not harder and get a good job done.

Mr Thurston, 30 to you.

I'm good.

Thank you.

Next question then is from Mr. Evans, and it goes first to Mr Thurston.

So I want to kind of springboard off Steve's question, talking about the different divisions of the Secretary of State's office.

We talked about business, but as she mentioned, capital, facilities, capital, police, there's also communications and education.

Which of these divisions that falls under the Secretary of State's purview, do you feel like has the most room for improvement?

Boy.

That is a great question.

In the world that we're in today.

Um.

Security is so important.

The security of that building, that building is.

A museum.

It's an Event Center.

There are events there almost every single day.

Sometimes multiple events.

School children come, there are legislators.

It's it's an office building.

There's business that goes on there and so.

We can always do a better job in the securing of that building.

Now we have increased our officers by 10.

There's way more surveillance.

Our officers have been trained like never before because of the protest that we had a couple of years ago.

And so we had to really look in in different ways to to beef up that particular area, but because the the world is changing.

There will always be room to improve that that area as the security of that building.

Miss Gorman, one minute.

State Capital is the front door to Arkansas.

So I'm excited about the opportunity to really get to manage that facility.

But when you ask the question about which area needs improvement, well, the answer is all of them.

There's a need for constant improvement.

John said that.

But we have to look at really where we're failing currently.

And again, I think that we've got to address voter participation, business support services has got to be addressed in Arkansas.

I tell people this all the time, and I really believe this.

The next Sam Walton lives in Arkansas.

She might live right here in Conway, but she cannot navigate our current website.

And that's not gonna happen on my watch.

Mr Thurston?

30 seconds, Sir.

That's true.

I mean, because of the changing world and technology changes at a rapid pace, I suppose every division will always, there's always room to improve.

Tomorrow there will be something more that we need to be doing.

But because.

Elections in my, in my opinion, elections.

The Capitol police.

BCS, there's, there's really no way to say which one is more important and so, but just based on the question, the way it was framed, my mind goes to the security of lives when they're there at that capital.

And so Miss Gorman, 30 seconds, I really appreciate John pointing that out because unfortunately we've now seen historically what happens when.

That house, the House of Government can be attacked.

So I'm gonna agree with him on, on that.

And that's something that, again, if you didn't recognize and appreciate the Capitol police force, that's an important agency within the Secretary of State and I'm excited to serve it.

Miss Munoz has the next question.

So, Miss Gorman, you have already addressed this question, but because it is a viewer question, we want to be sure to get it in and get both of you to respond to it.

This question comes from a viewer in Garland County.

Should Arkansas have online voter registration?

We are one of four.

States that does not allow online voter registration.

Miss Gorman, to you first, I think that's, I think that we are one of 11 states that doesn't have online voter registration.

And John might actually be able to better answer that than me.

But yes, we're, we're in the minority of sites that doesn't have it.

I'm absolutely in favor of that.

Of course, a legislator has to carry that piece of legislation.

What's great is that, you know, it was introduced a couple sessions ago.

It was introduced by a young Girl Scout working with her.

Her representative, senator from Fort Smith, AR, she did the she did the hard work and she did the research.

She worked with the Secretary of State's office, but she got letters of support from.

Comparable states, other southern states about this is working for us and this is low hanging fruit.

This is low hanging fruit to overnight change voter participation.

And again, we live in a society where we do everything on our phone.

Why aren't we providing this access to our Kansans right now?

I am not in opposition to online voter registration, not my good friend in Alabama, Secretary.

They they have successfully pulled it off there and and have they have seen an increase in in voter registration.

It is.

It is completely a legislative issue completely because there's other laws that have to be changed before you could implement that one, meaning you have to have a wet signature and registering to vote and so there's there's other things that need to go on before that takes place.

But if done correctly, yes, I think it would be.

Convenient and a good thing, but again.

The General Assembly definitely holds that power to make those decisions.

40 follow up, Miss Gorman, you have 30 seconds and I would, I would try to work with the General Assembly on that.

I think it's important.

I think you know, the Secretary of State does have to speak out and up for innovation, automation, access.

This creates transparency, it's a cost saving mechanism.

It is a physical cost for paper registration.

This is gonna save our Kansans taxpayer dollars.

It's going to help our Kansans participate in the most American thing voting in elections.

Mr Thurston, another 30 seconds if you wish.

I think I'm good.

Question for Mr Thurston, then.

What separates you from your opponent?

Obviously you are Republican.

Miss Gorman is a Democrat.

But what is?

Are the differences largely ideological, or are they?

Do they involve the mechanics of the Secretary of State's office?

What separates the two of you?

Honestly, I don't know.

I I've just gotten to know her just in recent months and haven't had really had a chance.

And this is really our first.

Well, no, we I guess there was a primary debate that went on.

I guess you would have to go maybe start off at the party platforms that might tell you a little bit of our differences if you looked at those two platforms because we both, I think agree with our platforms and also I guess the experience in running a constitutional office, not to discredit anyone's experience in life or or resume, but I have successfully run a constitutional office and maybe there's a reason no one has heard of the Secretary of State in Arkansas.

Because.

I've done a good job.

There's a reason that I haven't been in the headlines, at least not very many times and so.

But because I can't articulate and know for certainly the main differences, I would say the platform and also the experience and actually running a constitutional office.

Same question to miss.

I'm the CEO of a nonprofit, a statewide nonprofit.

I've been working across the state for 14 years.

I'm a recognized nonprofit leader.

I'm a business advocate.

I'm the wife of a Marine combat veteran.

It's true John, I haven't spent a lot of time together, but I think that probably we have some similar values when it comes to how we believe that people should be treated and and how we treat each other.

And we campaign.

I've noticed that we have a similarity.

Our differences are just, it is life experiences, it is approach to the job.

You know, I believe in really amplifying the voices of others.

I believe that if you have the opportunity.

And if you are given an opportunity to be constitutional officer, then it is your charge to speak for the Arkansans that aren't able to speak for themselves.

Mr Thurston, 30 seconds.

Well, it has been an absolute honor, and I'm sure we're getting close to the time.

I want to make sure I at least take these 30 seconds to tell our Kansans this.

That I've been an Arkansan my whole life.

And the one thing that I when I was elected that I did not ever want to do to you, Arkansas, is bring reproach to you.

And so.

And those sounds corny, but I love Arkansas.

I love you.

And at the end of the day, we are running for this office, I think to serve our Kansans.

Miss Gorman, another 30 seconds.

See my family in Arkansas, because I believe it is the land of opportunity.

I believe that all our Kansans have a voice.

And the best way to exercise that voice is to participate in the American democracy right here in our great state.

And I'm asking for your support this November.

Mr Robbins has the next question goes first to Miss Gorman.

So I would like to talk about something in the news recently involving this election cycle when it comes to the recreational marijuana initiative.

There was a back and forth between the Secretary of State's office where they declared the recreational marijuana amendments ballot title insufficient.

It was eventually overturned by the state Supreme Court.

How do you feel that situation was handled and how, if elected, would you handle similar situations like that?

Again, the role of Secretary of State should be a nonpartisan, you know, arbiter of of how we get things on the ballot.

And again, there's a lot of role of the legislative body involved and they put a lot of laws in place.

We kind of have to manage that process, you know, this is.

Issue 4 is is a hotbed issue.

But I, I, I trust, I trust our Kansans.

I trust them to make the decision for our state.

And so I would be very careful as Secretary of State that although I'm, I'm running on a party platform and I'm, I'm a proud Democrat.

You know once elected I become the Secretary of State for all of our Kansas.

And so if if a group of legislators have have done the work, the hard work to get that issue on the ballot, then I'm going to do my job and I'm not going to let my personal feelings on an issue one or the other.

Shade or influence the role that I have, which is to ensure that.

We can get things on the ballot.

Mr Thurston, one minute, Sir.

So the signatures were, you know, verified and approved and certified by my office.

The they had the proper amount of signatures also, when so when the the ballot title went to the state Board, which everyone knows, the Supreme Court deemed that unconstitutional, that the state board would approve a ballot title and personally don't totally get that, but.

And I chair that board.

It was unanimous that that ballot title was deceiving.

Unanimous.

Democrat, representative, Republican, represent the whole entire board.

I did not vote on that particular in on that.

I was chairing and I was going to an event.

There was a tie, but did not.

Personally.

I'm voting against it.

I have some libertarian leaning.

I'm all for decriminalizing.

Marijuana, however, if you read that bill, are not bill, but that amendment.

It has not just some barriers of entry.

It is a complete barrier of entry.

It is the opposite of the free market.

When you look at that particular amendment and we go back to Miss Gorman again.

And you know, John, I both have our personal feelings and we're going to vote how we're going to vote.

I'm going to vote in favor again because I believe that recreational marijuana is a step in the right direction and and it's coming.

The train has left the station right.

It is coming.

Is it perfect?

It's written.

No, the great thing is that we have.

A way to admit to change the process, to change the language.

It's hard, but we could do it.

So again, I'm going to put faith and trust in our Kansans, but I'm going to stop short of putting my personal feelings on the process.

That's not the role of Secretary of State.

That is not the role of this constitutional office.

Well, Mr excuse me, Mr Thurston, you have another 30.

That is true, and I obviously have not done that in this whole entire process.

But I do want to, I just want to point this out because this amendment, and I'm sure she'll get campaign contributions after I say this, but this amendment.

Is not as clear as people think.

It is not free market, it does create barriers of entry and it does create a drug cartel.

Period.

Whether the social issue of marijuana, whatever you think of that, that is separate.

It could be.

Bubble guppies or pineapples that we're talking about, gotta gotta call time.

Let's.

Thank you, thank you.

And so I can remind our audience once again that the candidates are going to be participating in a press conference or certainly can directly following the debate.

And you can watch at home live scan the QR code on your screen with your mobile device and we'll throw that up again.

You'll see that QR code periodically through the remainder of our debate.

We have another question, Miss Munoz, and it goes first.

You, Mr Thurston.

Yeah, so, Mr Thurston, you've already touched on this a little bit with regard to federal regulation on states with regards to elections.

So how have federal regulations like the national Voter Registration Act and the Help America Vote Act impacted our Arkansas?

And what do you believe the role of the federal government is with regard to state elections?

So the federal government does set dates and so forth.

You need timelines.

Obviously when you're dealing with overseas ballots, you're dealing with our veterans.

There needs to be some federal guidelines.

But there's also been legislation, HR1 and HR4, which was leftist.

I call it California, California nizuc, California way of elections.

Is it was.

It is basically what it was doing away with voter ID's, going to vote by mail drop boxes, which I'm 100% against, which when you talk about the last presidential election, whether it was stolen or not.

Every election official across this nation will agree that vote by mail.

And the drop boxes opens the door to election fraud.

Whether it happened or not, obviously evidence I guess has not been presented at least hasn't been presented to the right courts.

But that's where I draw the line when it comes to federal overreach.

Miss Gorman.

Yeah, I think when the federal government gets involved it's is it trying to solve a problem or is it creating a bigger, a bigger problem?

Right.

I believe in in in our state and our ability to to manage it, oversee our own elections and we talked about our 75 county clerks and the.

The good people in the communities across our state that are doing a good job.

But again, I think that when it comes to the national Voting Rights Act and things, it's, it's historically because we've had voter disenfranchisement, right?

I mean, we have to create access to the most fundamental thing, being an American that's participating in our democracy.

You know, I'm married to a combat veteran, you know, and.

We take voting very seriously.

It is a an emotional act for us.

My husband served in Iraq with Ukrainian forces.

He literally served with men and women that understand how fragile democracy is.

And we have got to ensure that there are safeguards to accessing this fundamental right that makes our country great back to Mr Thurston for 30 seconds.

Her bringing up veterans is it.

It is so important.

If you do nothing else but vote in honor of our veterans, I mean, that's why you should vote.

That's why you should participate.

Because veterans and their families.

Pay a great price and some of the ultimate price so that we can live in this country and vote.

And so it obviously it's too late to register to vote for this election, but just for just out of honoring our veterans, encourage you to participate in this process.

Thank you, Sir.

A question now for.

You know, or Miss Gorman would go back to you.

I'm sorry.

I just would really quickly say that I I agree with John, you know I've been telling people and like you know it's.

You know, people like to wave American flags to show patriotism.

Most patriotic thing you can do is exercise your right to vote, and it's because someone fought for that right.

Now a question from Miss Gorner, starting with Miss Gorman, you have seemed to suggest to in the debate that the office should be more of a bully pulpit and that the occupant of the secretary of Secretary of State could be more of an advocate is not, though the office is sent, and Mr Thurston has seemed to suggest that it is essentially a housekeeping, a bookkeeping office, if you will.

Well, I hope.

I didn't intend to think that I should be a bully, but I absolutely think it should be an opportunity advocate.

I absolutely think that.

I think that you want to feel a great deal of confidence in your constitutional officer that has this very important responsibility.

So yes, I want to stress that, but I think that there's a way to do it that first and foremost, you know on November the 9th, I I hope that the individual in this office and I hope that it's me, I hope that they behave in a way that is not reflected of a partisan.

I I absolutely.

Believe that American democracy is more important than the letter by your name.

Mr Thurston.

Well, I think the question was kind of directed toward her.

So I'm not sure how to actually answer it, you know, but there are times to speak out.

I mean, there are times to use the bully pulpit.

One example was during COVID.

A lot of these states changed their election laws in the name of safety.

Well, here in Arkansas, there was a lawsuit that was filed that basically radically changed our elections.

It had everything in that doing away with voter ID.

Drop boxes.

All those things in the name of safety in the name of COVID.

And I released a statement that saying that I felt like our absentee process, our systems was adequate enough to accommodate anyone during this time of this pandemic.

And the the judge threw that lawsuit out of court based upon that.

So there are times you do speak up, you just don't sit there behind the desk and make sure the grass is mowed and the light bulbs are changed.

There are times to speak out, but you do have to be mindful of when that timing is.

Miss Gorman, 30 seconds.

As an advocate, I won't be bullied.

I think that that's the true concern with Secretary of State offices.

For years I've flown under the radar, but have always served critical functions in state government.

But the concern now is that there are bully pulpits out there attempting to influence this office.

And So what I'm saying is, let's really educate and empower what the office does and talk about what the office does and how the individual holding that office should be held accountable and how they should do their their job every single day.

The first.

I can't think of anything to add.

All right, we have reached that point in the debate where we have afforded each of our candidates 30 seconds for a closing statement.

And that's one minute each.

And our first closing statement is from Miss Gorman.

And I want to thank TBR, thank PBS, Arkansas, PBS, thank our our moderators.

Today I want to thank Secretary John Thurston for his time.

American democracy is fragile.

We have to engage with it.

We have to, as our Kansans come from the middle.

Work.

With all of our communities to strengthen our democracy.

Come November 8th, I'm I'm asking for your for your vote, your support.

Because I can.

I believe I can do this job.

I can do it well, and I'll do it well for you.

For all our Kansans.

My name is Anna Beth Gorman.

Thank you for your time.

Thank you, Miss Gorman.

Mr Thurston.

Thank you, PBS moderators for taking your time and thank you for watching and being more informed about the candidates in in in this next election.

I've been in legislative battles.

I've been in battles with the other side of the aisle.

I've been in battles with my own party.

I've been in legal battles.

All sorts of battles.

During my time as Secretary of State, but the one.

Individual or the one group or entity that I have not battled as you are Kansans.

Everything I've done from day one has been with you in mind.

Have I done it all perfectly?

Probably not.

But my heart has always been to serve you at the highest level of integrity.

That any individual can possibly serve as at and I'm asking for your vote to allow me one more term as Secretary of State.

Thank you so much to both of our candidates our thanks.

We wish we could stretch the clock but we are unable to do so.

We would like to remind our audience that you can watch this debate again and all the PBS debates on demand at the Arkansas PBS YouTube channel or on the PBS video app.

And of course on our website, the candidates have, as we mentioned earlier, the option to participate at a press conference that directly follows this broadcast.

Those press conferences will air on YouTube as part of our live stream, scan the QR code on your screen and start watching on YouTube.

Now again, our thanks to the candidates for participating and for our questioners tonight and to everyone here at the Rentals Performance Hall at UCLA and of course.

Thank you for watching Election Day, November 8th.

Major funding for election 2022 Arkansas PBS debates is provided by AARP Arkansas, with additional funding provided by the Arkansas State Chamber of Commerce.