Support for Arkansas Week provided by the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette.

The Arkansas Times and KUAR FM 89.

Hello again, everyone, and thanks very much for joining us.

In our state alone, new COVID cases in the hundreds and as another viral threat presents itself, is a scourge once considered conquered, making a comeback.

We'll get to that in a moment.

First fall semester 22.

In the post-secondary sphere, a primary question remains how to afford a university or a tech school education in the public schools.

Meantime, the dominant issue may not be teacher pay quite so much as teacher availability.

Joining us to talk about both components of the Arkansas educational system, Dr. Ivey Schaeffer, the State Education Department's deputy commissioner for Elementary and Secondary, and Dr. Maria markham, director of the Division of Higher Education.

Thank you both for being with us.

Dr. Schaeffer, if I can begin with you.

You had an exchange yesterday with members of the General Assembly in committee on the matter of teacher availability or teacher shortages.

I'm not sure what it accomplish other than a demand for additional data which you and others in the department say you're in the you're in the process of acquiring.

At the moment, though.

How how severe is the shortage?

How critical is the shortage?

Thanks for having me and for that question.

So while we don't have real time vacancy data because every school district is its own local employing agency, we do know that in Arkansas, for the past few years, we've been dealing with fewer people in preparation programs.

We know that vacancies are taking longer to fill and we have fewer applicants all over the state to fill those vacancies.

And probably most concerning is the number of districts that have significant numbers of teachers teaching on waivers.

So an example would be we note that 38 of our districts have more than 10% of their teachers teaching on a waiver.

We've got four of those districts where 40 and 50% of teachers are teaching under a waiver.

So we have teachers with less experience, and we also have had higher rates of turnover after two years of the pandemic.

So all of those factors combined are what we have to consider when we're looking at shortages of educators.

And it is creating a problem in several areas of our state.

What is is it particularly pronounced in one or another area?

We see the greatest numbers of teachers teaching under a waiver in the east and southeast part of our state.

However, there are pockets of shortages throughout South Arkansas and even in some of the smaller districts in northwest Arkansas.

What in the near term can be done now?

You have proposed the department had proposed a loosening, if you don't or a departure anyway from the existing certification stand, temporary certification standards to allow some otherwise non certified personnel to assume teaching positions.

That was the department pull that back in in face of some pretty stiff legislative opposition.

So what's the next step?

What's the next move?

So we definitely want to pull as much data as possible.

We actually our state board has asked us to bring them some research on the impact that licensure exams are having on the availability of people in the workforce.

So we're doing that.

We'll be sharing that report with the Education Committee.

I do believe that it's very important that people have the information they need in order to make decisions and to feel good about decisions that are being made.

So we'll be doing that.

We are going to be continuing to work with districts that have a large number of teachers teaching under waivers.

And I'm hoping I get the opportunity also to talk about the work that we're doing with Higher Ed to create a teacher residency model that is launching this fall and going to really provide us with that long term solution to our teacher workforce stability.

Well, I'll give you a break for just a second.

We'll go to Dr. Mark and ask her to pick it up on those on that relationship, that partnership, if you will.

Yes.

We've been working really closely with Department of Elementary and Secondary Ed on developing some alternative pathways through this residency model that would hone in on those paraprofessionals, teachers, aides that have been successful in the classroom.

They have demonstrated competency for working with children, that maybe they're in situations they can't leave their employment to get a full time education, we're able to reach down into the existing pockets of employment and help those students pursue that bachelor's degree that would allow them to be a classroom teachers that we're taking those with that proven experience, the proven time on task and elevating those to the teacher positions.

So, yes, that's something that we've been working on very closely.

We're excited to get that started in the fall.

Well, I mean, do you expect it to have a significant impact anyway on on the difficulties that that the K 12 people are having?

You know, well, immediately it was it's going to take a couple of years because these students are going to, at the most, have associate degrees.

They're going to have a couple of years where they're going to be pursuing their their coursework before it can have that impact.

So this is more of a long term sustainability strategy rather than a quick solution to the teacher shortage issue.

Let me while I'm still Dr. Michael, let me veer off for just a moment.

We had and we're coming off a period now of retrenchment, at least in South Florida, a couple of campuses anyway, with Henderson State, notably in which higher ed is have or some institutions anyway are having to retrench as it will re retool themselves simply to survive.

What overall is the state of higher ed in Arkansas today?

We'll go ahead and take it from there.

Sure.

We don't have enrollment data for the fall.

Anecdotally, I've heard that we're going to have a bit of a rebound from our low enrollment semesters due to the COVID pandemic.

So it's going to be a bit of a bump.

However, enrollments have been trending down for several years as a result of declining classes of our high school graduates.

So we have been experiencing that enrollment decline and that is going to continue.

So there's there's a strong possibility that we will see additional needs for institutions to make decisions about program offerings if they have reduced enrollment.

That will also drop reductions in revenue for their campuses through tuition and fee income.

So we do expect to see that.

I expect to see institutions looking to make efficiency a priority, whether through collaborations with other institutions and partnerships at reduction of administrative overhead cost in order to maintain viable in these smaller communities.

Well, in other words, more campuses are going to have to consider offering fewer major courses of study.

Well, I think that's a fair assessment and it's something that we're looking at.

Our coordinating board has asked us to do a statewide review of program duplications where we can make recommendations maybe for reductions of academic programs, where we have for example, if we have ten programs throughout the state and they're only operating at about 50% capacity, how can we combine some of those programs, shift our resources so that we have full programs at fewer campuses and allow us to use our resources more efficiently and effectively?

Do you want to identify at this time that the campuses, that the institutions that are most likely to to have to cope with that?

Absolutely not.

Save.

I think that we're going to see some of the smaller communities that are going to need to reevaluate, because we do have outmigration from certain areas of the state into more of our population centers.

I think that as the enrollment cliff looms larger and closer, we're going to see some natural retrenchment from institutions based on those decisions.

And we're likely going to see some of our larger institutions, some that are in those areas of the state that are growing become larger.

They're going to start attracting students out of those rural areas into the more urban education center.

So those are going to be some things that the coordinating board will want to keep an eye on to ensure we don't have future catastrophic issues like we have had at Henderson State.

Are we are we hear, Dr. Markham, are we in a period here where we're having to pay the piper?

I can recall 20, 30 years ago where predecessors, some of your predecessors and certainly members of the board of Higher Ed were warning.

I'm not sure anyone in higher ed would would would say that there were ever fat years for higher education in Arkansas.

But but there were warnings even then that we're growing, we're expanding too fast, too many institutions offering too many degrees, particularly at the graduate level where they're ferociously expensive.

Is has the bill come due?

Is that what we're looking at?

I think so.

I think that we you know, one thing that we have been very focused on for the last 20, 30 years is access.

And we have fantastic access.

We have institutions geographically spread in every community throughout the state, whether it's a university or a two year college or a campus associated with one of those.

So we serve Arkansas very, very well.

The problem is it's very expensive access for students comes at a cost to the state.

So we have an incredible amount of facility infrastructure throughout the state that has to be supported.

It's expensive to maintain all those buildings in all of the communities, and then 70% of the cost of higher education is in personnel, faculty, staff and student support.

So it costs money to staff all of these locations.

So although we have really done a great job in providing access, it comes at a cost.

And now that we have fewer people who are requiring higher education or seeking higher education, that cost per Arkansan is going up.

So at some point, yes, we're going to have to recalibrate.

We're going to have to pull back unless we have a major change in our population distribution.

Well, a final question before we go back to your colleague.

It would appear that market forces, frankly, are driving these these pullbacks in anyway way on higher end rather than than policy choices.

Are we learning a lesson here?

Yes, I think we are.

Yeah.

And policy should also consider those market forces as well.

So I look for policy to be influenced by market in the coming legislative session, in the next few years, between the enrollment variations and what we think might be a recession coming.

It will shift some of our role patterns.

It will shift some of the revenues that are received and how those are distributed.

So the market forces will inform policy.

But I think policy has to keep up with what what is happening.

Well, I said well, I had I do have one more.

I hear this a lot, and I'm sure you do, too.

You hear from faculty and from from non-certified staff in higher ed that that there is a surfeit of administrators.

And that top administration's answer to every problem is to hire another administrator.

Which which are generally at the top of the salary scale.

Your thoughts on that?

Is that, in fact, an issue, a legitimate issue?

It is an issue in some situations.

I think that part of the need to add administrators has been a lot of state and federal administrative burden.

Every every regular session, we are asked asking our institutions to provide more and more administrative oversight, which is extremely partizan on our our smaller institutions that do not have people dedicated to that.

So, I mean, it really is a full time administrative position that has to be added every session or two just to keep up with that administrative burden.

So reducing that will be important.

But I think we also have to make sure that our institutions are reducing those administrators and those faculty members as their enrollments decline.

And they're not maintaining those high level administrators on their campuses once they do not have the student the student headcount to support it.

Back.

Back to Dr. Pfeifer.

Now, you K-12 is pre K-12 is actually to no small extent at the mercy of the General Assembly and the adequacy study, which is due early next year.

What are you that aside, are there specific things that you're going that the Department would ask of the General Assembly in January?

Are you going to have a new governor and to some extent a new General Assembly?

Well, I think to piggyback on some of what Dr. Markham was just talking about, it is important for us to use the data to to make good decisions and to and in K-12 also personnel is your biggest expense.

And so I think really making sure we're all taking a look at what our enrollment trends look like in K-12 and making the decisions about how do we make sure that core instruction is prioritized with the very the most prepared teachers who are the most skillful and having that impact on core instruction every day.

So I think that's going to definitely be at the heart of the adequacy conversations.

And we know that the General General Assembly has said that they want to take a take a look at teacher pay.

And I'm very encouraged that we're going to have productive conversations there.

We also do want to look at what are our barriers to getting people through preparation programs and into the workforce.

And so we know that licensure assessments have been a big barrier and they're not highly predictive of overall success in a classroom.

So that's another area where I think we'll be taking a look and possibly looking at legislation.

So and those would be two of the big things.

And I think that all of this goes back to the partnerships between K-12 and Higher Education and the Office of Skills Development with Post-Secondary opportunities and really thinking through what are the pathways that students need for success and how do we provide them with opportunities post-high school at an affordable cost?

And I think that's something that has been a benefit from transfer transformation and allowing all of us to have that closer working relationship.

And we're seeing a lot of success with those partnerships.

Just a few seconds remaining, Dr. Pfeifer.

And on the matter of the physical safety of of youngsters and I'm talking about obviously COVID and perhaps other micro, are these districts going to have the flexibility and the wherewithal to take care of students and to address student safety in the clinical sense?

And I think the the fact of how well we were or how successful we were with in-person learning the last two years is a testament to the fact that our districts are always focused on taking care of students, and not just from the terms of physical health needs, but also in terms of school safety.

The the task force, the recommendations coming from there are being looked at very closely.

I'm confident that we will work together to implement all of the recommendations.

And I have every confidence that schools are prioritizing student safety and well-being across the board.

Got to end it there because we are simply out of time.

Dr. Pfeifer, Dr. Mark, I thank you very much for being with us.

Come back soon.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And we'll be back in a moment.

We are back and we are in year three of the COVID era driven by an elusive virus that has erased any serious question of its power.

12,000 deaths or just about that.

That is simply not just the flu.

But now yet another virus is in the headlines and on the horizon.

A third, a microscopic threat that most of us assumed was vanquished decades ago.

Well, here to update the situation as the conventional flu season began.

State health director Dr. Jennifer DeLay.

Hey, doctor, it's a pleasure always to have you with us.

Let's begin with with with COVID.

It seems to be such a fluid situation.

We are still seeing peaks and valleys and there they are about equal in number.

Am I correct?

Just looking at the statistics, it goes.

It subsides for a while, then it roars back.

Yes, we do see surges from time to time and we're coming off of Surge, the Baked Phi, which is the sub variant of the Macron variant that we saw peak in January and February.

Fortunately, we're in a much better place than we were when the pandemic started.

We have good treatments.

We have a vaccine that's safe and effective.

And, you know, we know what to do when we know what to expect, what prevents that illness, what people need to do to isolate.

So we're in a very different place now with these surges than we were when the pandemic started.

But still vaccine except it's and vaccine utilization is not where not where you and the other health professionals want it to be.

I would love to see more Arkansans get fully vaccinated and then boosted by fully vaccinated.

I mean people who've had their primary doses and then for the recommendation, the length of time after those primary doses, they get boosted with another dose.

We anticipate that we will have booster doses available this fall for that protect against the Macron variant that we've been seeing lately.

So they are likely to be more protective and we're hoping that that would prevent a large surge in the winter time.

Are we resolved?

Are we resigned, perhaps, as is the word, to continuing variants?

I emerging from from COVID.

Well, I think that the virus that causes COVID 19 will continue to mutate and spread.

And we'll just have to be flexible.

We can pivot when we have a surge and do those things that we need to do to dampen the spread.

And then when those start is over, in between, we can go back to doing more of what we would normally do in our daily lives.

Well, a great many Arkansans are doing what they would ordinarily do or very close to it, and that that some experts say.

Well, a lot of experts say that prolongs the issue, actually.

You agree with that?

Well, I think that we probably could do more.

And I encourage people to stay well-informed and to make sure the information they're getting is accurate and reliable.

And so that is one of the issues that we're having, is where do people go to get their information?

Is it accurate?

Is it something that's really going to help them?

Would you maintain would you maintain social distancing at at a level that that was encouraged, certainly in the first months of the pandemic?

I would say that at this point in time, social distancing is not as important, that it was earlier.

I would encourage people who are at high risk for severe illness if they were to get infected, to continue precautions as they are comfortable.

But for us, if we watch the community levels or what we call the COVID community levels that are either green, yellow or red and follow those recommendations, I think that we will do well in our communities to minimize the spread and go about our normal daily activities, our businesses, schools and so forth.

We're just concluding that for most anyway, Arkansas youngsters, the first week of public schools and the private schools as well, plus the universities are meeting again in previous years, earlier times, they were regarded as hothouses for for the spread of COVID and any viral infection.

Is your concern as profound as it was in the first year or two of of COVID?

Well, at this point in time, most people have some immunity to the virus that causes COVID 19, either through vaccination or previous infection.

And we see that in our young people and pediatric age group under 18, probably 80% have had some exposure or vaccination.

So that will provide them at least some protection.

It may not keep them from getting infected.

So it's going to be up to the schools to monitor the situation and take steps as needed if it's spreading in their environment.

But right now, I think that students are important for them to be in school, whether it's college or K through 12.

And I think we can keep the schools open by following the CDC recommendations.

Couple of other invisible enemies.

And let's start with monkeypox, which has had a minimal appearance anyway in Arkansas thus far.

What can you how can you update us on that?

Well, you know, monkey pox is caused by a viral infection that similar to smallpox is in that same family.

It causes a very painful rash and it is spread mostly by skin to skin contact.

It can also be spread by contact with contaminated objects that have fluid from the rash on it.

So this rash rash is becomes a posture like a pimple, and then it forms a scab.

And until the new skin underneath it is formed and it's capped over, then it's still contagious.

So it's not as easily spread as flu or COVID 19 because it's not spread through the respiratory tract.

It's spread by contact with the rash or the fluids from the rash.

So I think that's an important consideration for the general public.

We know right now that most of the cases in the U.S. are caused by are occur among men who have sex with men with the skin to skin contact.

So people are at higher risk, are in a defined group right now.

And our hope is that they will be able to take steps to prevent the spread, and we can lessen that in the communities around our country and in Arkansas.

And finally, this.

Many of us thought we would never hear the word polio again or read it again, except in history books.

Now it seems to be on the comeback trail.

What do we need to know about that in Arkansas?

Well, polio is a illness, a viral illness that spread through ingesting or eating or drinking contaminated water or or food, mostly water.

And it can also be spread by contaminated hands.

So it's spread through what we call the fecal oral route, and it's highly preventable.

We have a very safe and effective vaccine that we use in the U.S. that prevents the damage that polio can cause, such as paralysis.

It works very well and it's very safe.

But we're going to need to make sure that all children get that vaccine and even people who have not had it such as young adults, they may wish to consider getting the vaccine, too.

Dr. Delahaye, as always, thanks for coming in and thanks for briefing us.

Come back soon.

Thank you.

And that does it for us for this week.

As always, thanks for joining us.

See you next week.

Support for Arkansas Week provided by the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette at the Arkansas Times and KUAR FM 89.