[ ♪♪ ] >> WELCOME BACK.

UPPER PENINSULA REPUBLICAN MEMBER BEAU LAFAVE IS HERE, CRITICAL OF HIS OWN PARTY.

OUR LEAD STORY, TUDOR DIXON RUNNING FOR A RUNNING MATE.

ON THE PANEL, DAVE BOUCHER, CRAIG MAUGER AND JIM KIERTZNER.

SIT WITH US AS WE GET THE INSIDE OUT OFF THE RECORD.

>> Announcer: PRODUCTION OF "OFF THE RECORD" IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY... MARTIN RAYMEYER, A FULL SERVICE STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS AGENCY PARTNERING WITH CLIENTS THROUGH PUBLIC RELATIONS, DIGITAL MARKETING AND PUBLIC POLICY ENGAGEMENT.

LEARN MORE.

NOW THIS EDITION OF "OFF THE RECORD" WITH TIM SKUBICK.

>> THANKS VERY MUCH.

WELCOME TO "OFF THE RECORD" AS WE TAPE ON THIS FRIDAY MORNING AT 8 O'CLOCK.

LET ME RUN SOME NAMES BY YOU AND TELL ME IF THEY WILL BE ON THE TICKET WITH TUDOR DIXON.

MIKE BISHOP, YEA OR NAY?

>> DOESN'T SOUND LIKE IT.

>> I WAS TOLD HE WAS UNDER CONSIDERATION BUT PROBABLY NOT.

>> I THINK THE ANSWER IS NO.

VINI JOHNSON, WHO HAS A NICE JUMP SHOT.

>> SURE.

>> AGAIN, I DON'T THINK SO.

>> NO.

>> HE ACTUALLY PUT OUT A STATEMENT THIS WEEK, SOME OF US DID STORIES, YOURS TRULY INCLUDED, NAMING HIM ON A LIST.

HE PUT OUT A STATEMENT SAYING I'VE HAD NO CONVERSATIONS WITH ANYONE, I'M NOT IN CONTENTION, I'M NOT INTERESTED.

>> Mr. BURTON, ANOTHER BASKETBALL PLAYER.

YEA OR NAY?

>> I BELIEVE HE'S ALSO BOWED OUT.

>> I THINK HE IS NO LONGER UNDER CONSIDERATION.

>> HE MERGED PRETTY STRONG AT THE BEGINNING.

>> THAT FADED LIKE THE MIDNIGHT SUN.

AND MS. MANIC FROM OAKLAND COUNTY?

>> THAT WOULD BE QUITE A SPLASH, BUT THAT ALSO SEEMS LIKE -- IS IT ACROSS THERE?

>> I THINK SHE HAS HER HANDS FULL AS CO-CHAIR OF THE PARTY.

>> SHE WOULD APPEAL TO THE TRUMPSTERS, BUT I DON'T THINK SHE UNIFIES THE PARTY AT ALL.

>> WE HAVE THE QUESTION IS: WHO IS IT?

>> I THINK THAT THERE ARE A NUMBER OF FORMER STATE LAWMAKERS, MAYBE ONE CURRENT STATE LAWMAKER, WHO ARE UNDER CONSIDERATION AS OF LAST NIGHT.

>> ONE CURRENT STATE LAWMAKER?

>> JULIE ALEXANDER FROM THE JACKSON AREA.

UNDER CONSIDERATION AS OF LAST NIGHT.

SHANE HERNANDEZ, A FORMER STATE LAWMAKER.

>> FORMER CHAIR OF THE HOUSE OF APPROPRIATIONS.

>> EXACTLY.

FORMER CANDIDATE FOR CONGRESS.

THE CLERK IN LACOMBE COUNTY, ANOTHER FORMER STATE LAWMAKER.

THESE ARE THREE PEOPLE I BELIEVE WERE UNDER CONSIDERATION AS OF LAST NIGHT.

>> DO WE WANT TO SAY SHE WANTS LEGISLATIVE EXPERIENCE?

>> THAT'S A BIG CHOICE.

THAT'S WHAT ANY CANDIDATE WOULD WANT.

THERE'S ALSO TALK OF CROSSOVER APPEAL.

REPRESENTATIVE ALEXANDER CAME OUT THIS YEAR WITH A BILL TO END SALES TAX ON DIAPERS FOR ADULTS AND KIDS.

THAT'S SOMETHING THE DEMOCRATS HAVE BEEN WORKING FOR.

SHE ALSO WORKED ON SOME LEGISLATION THAT WOULD CURTAIL EMERGENCY POWERS, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT SPEAKS TO REPUBLICANS AND SPEAKS TO TUDOR DIXON AND OTHER REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES.

SO AGAIN, WE TALKED ABOUT THIS UNITY NOT ONLY WITHIN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY BUT SOMEBODY THAT A FORMER DEMOCRAT OR A MODERATE OR AN INDEPENDENT MIGHT BE OKAY WITH.

>> WAIT A MINUTE.

WHO GETS THROUGH THE CONVENTION NEXT WEEK IN THIS TOWN?

>> THAT'S THE QUESTION.

IF YOU GIVE ME A NICE MODERATE REPUBLICAN, ARE THEY TOASTING THE CONVENTION.

>> I THINK SO.

>> IT WOULD BE A MAJOR RISK TO NOMINATE SOMEONE WHO'S A MODERATE.

THAT'S WHY SOMEONE LIKE JULIE ALEXANDER, I BELIEVE, IS FLOATING TOWARDS THE TOP.

SHE WAS ONE OF THE LAWMAKERS AGGRESSIVELY PUSHING TO INVESTIGATE AND POSSIBLY OVERTURN THE 2020 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION AT THE SAME TIME, SHE IS A FEMALE, WHO IN A YEAR WHEN FEMALE VOTERS IN SUBURBAN AREAS COULD DECIDE THIS HECKS, YOU COULD SEE A BENEFIT OF HAVING TWO FEMALES ON THE REPUBLICAN TICKET.

>> YOU HAD THE SPECTER, THOUGH, OF TWO OF THE FORMER REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES RUNNING FOR GOVERNOR SAYING, MAYBE I'LL GO TO THE CONVENTION.

THAT POSES A PROBLEM.

DOES IT NOT?

>> IT'S A HUGE PROBLEM POTENTIALLY.

>> THIS IS RYAN KELLY.

>> PASTOR RALPH.

YOU DON'T WANT TO STUMBLE RIGHT OUT OF THE BLOCK WITH THIS PICK AND HAVE THE DELEGATES INTERVENE, CAUSE CHAOS AT THIS CONVENTION AND SAY, HEY, YOUR PICK IS NOT ALL RIGHT WITH US.

WE'RE GOING MAKE YOU RUN WITH THIS PERSON.

THIS SEEMS LIKE AN ABSURD IDEA ON ITS FACE BUT WE'VE SEEN THIS ALMOST HAPPEN BEFORE AT PREVIOUS REPUBLICAN CONVENTIONS.

>> RICK SCHNEIDER.

>> YES.

>> RYAN KELLY.

>> NOW THERE IS A CROP OF DELEGATES WHO I DON'T THINK ANYONE IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY REALLY KNOWS WHO HAS A MAJORITY OF THESE DELEGATES, WHO THEY ARE, WHO IS GOING TO HAVE THE POWER AT THIS CONVENTION.

IT'S NOT THE SAME CROP OF DELEGATES THAT CHOSE BRIAN CALI OVER GARY.

>> PLUS YOU HAVE THE SPECTER OF AN AUDIENCE IN THAT CONVENTION THAT IS NOT GOING TO TAKE ANYBODY'S ORDERS FROM ANYBODY STANDING UP ON THE PODIUM.

RIGHT?

>> NOT IN THIS DAY AND AGE.

WE SAW THAT IN APRIL.

SO WE'RE GOING TO GET -- HOW IS IT GOING TO BE ANNOUNCE SND DON'T WE HAVE TO LEARN BY FIVE O'CLOCK TODAY?

>> APPARENTLY SO.

SO I EXPECT YOU GUYS TO STAY HERE.

[ Chuckling ] >> TIME AND A HALF.

>> WAIT A MINUTE.

I CONTACTED A COUPLE OF PEOPLE IN THE CAMPAIGN LAST NIGHT SAYING I'M COMING UP TO DO SKUBICK'S SHOW.

I'LL BE DONE ABOUT 9, 9:30 IN THE MORNING.

I'M DRIVING UP FROM DETROIT.

SHOULD I STICK AROUND IN LANSING?

ARE YOU GOING TO DO AN EVENT?

ARE YOU GOING TO DO A NEWS CONFERENCE?

THE ANSWER WAS NO.

WHERE DOES THIS GO?

>> AT THE END OF THE DAY, DOES IT MATTER?

>> YOU KNOW, VOTERS -- IF THEY'RE ENGAGED NOW, MAYBE THEY KNOW WHO THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR CANDIDATES R. >> THEY DON'T KNOW WHO THE CANDIDATE IS!

>> THAT'S COMPLETELY FAIR.

IT'S FAIR TO QUESTION IF PEOPLE THOUGH WHO THE CURRENT SITTING GOVERNOR S SOMEBODY MIGHT RECOGNIZE NAMES ON A TICKET.

I WOULD SAY IT'S VERY RARE WHEN A LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR PICK IS ACTUALLY SWAYING VOTERS.

IN THEORY, THEY MIGHT BE IF IT'S A RYAN CALI.

MAYBE THERE'S SOMEBODY THAT REMEMBERS THAT NAME FROM THE FBI OR FROM THE CAMPAIGN WHERE THEY DECIDE THAT'S NOT SOMEONE THEY WANT.

>> HIS HOUSE WAS RAIDED.

>> IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO MOVE THE NEEDLE IN THEORY ALL THAT MUCH ESPECIALLY ROUGHLY 100 DAYS OUT FROM THE ELECTION.

>> THE PROBLEM HERE IS THAT SHE NEEDS TO BROADEN HER MESSAGE TO OTHER PEOPLE.

RIGHT NOW SHE'S DOING ALL THE CONSERVATIVE MEDIA OUTLETS.

SHE'S GOT THOSE PEOPLE.

DOESN'T SHE?

>> NOT ALL THE CONSERVATIVE OUTLETS.

[ Chuckling ] >> WELL -- >> SOUTHERN ACTION NEWS THIS WEEK, ABC.

MAINSTREAM MEDIA.

>> PLEASE TAKE A BOW.

YOU GOT AN INTERVIEW WITH HER.

>> AND I WAS DOING THE STORY ON THE GOVERNOR'S PROPOSED SALES TAX TWO-WEEK MORATORIUM FOR BACK-TO-SCHOOL.

>> WHICH BY THE WAY WAS A REPUBLICAN IDEA YEARS AGO.

>> OKAY.

>> BOB GOSSAGE FROM OAKLAND COUNTY PUSHED THAT PUPPY FOR WEEKS AND YEARS AND NEVER GOT ANYWHERE.

>> YES.

I GOT AHOLD OF THE HOUSE REPUBLICANS, GIDEON.

I SAID, DO YOU HAVE ANYBODY TO WANTS TO SPEAK TO THIS?

HE GAVE ME A STATEMENT AND I REACHED OUT TO THE DIXON CAMPAIGN, MUCH TO MY SURPRISE, WITHIN NINETY MINUTES TO TWO HOURS, SHE'S AVAILABLE FOR A ZOOM.

SO I SET HER UP AND I TALKED WITH HER.

OF COURSE, SHE TOOK HER SHOTS.

BUT I WAS SURPRISED THAT SHE DID IT.

>> BUT DOING A FEW MEDIA INTERVIEWS IS SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT GOVERNOR WITMER IS DOING.

SHE WAS DOING CAMPAIGN EVENTS ACROSS THE STATE, AT THE UP STATE FAIR.

SHE HAS BEEN AROUND OPENLY CAMPAIGNING, PUTTING OUT POLICY IDEAS THAT SHE'S DOING AND NOT TO MENTION, THE DEMOCRATIC GOVERNORS' ASSOCIATION HAS BEEN RUNNING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF ADS AGAINST TUDOR D DIXON SO TO START THIS RACE, TUDOR DIXON IS ON HER BACK FOOT RIGHT NOW.

IT'S VERY CLEAR.

>> THE RACE IS NOT OVER.

WHO KNOWS WHAT HAPPENS BETWEEN HERE AND NOVEMBER.

BUT AS WE SIT HERE ON THIS AUGUST MORNING, THE TUDOR CAMPAIGN LOOKS LIKE IT'S WHAT?

>> I DON'T KNOW IF STRUGGLING IS THE RIGHT WORD.

I WOULD CERTAINLY SAY FIGHTING AN UPHILL BATTLE.

TO BE CLEAR, EVERYBODY WAS GOING TO BE FIGHTING AN UPHILL BATTLE AGAINST INCUMBENT GOVERNOR WITH A NATIONAL -- WITH AN ABSOLUTE TON OF MONEY, RIGHT.

SO TO YOUR POINT, THERE'S STILL A LOT OF TIME.

THERE'S TIME TO LET EVERYBODY KNOW A MESSAGE.

NOT ONLY WITH THE TOP OF THE TICKET, BUT WITH THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL CANDIDATE, WITH THE SECRETARY OF STATE CANDIDATE, WHO HAVE HAD MONTHS TO PIVOT TO A MODERATE AUDIENCE AND HAVE NOT BY ANY STRETCH OF THE IMAGINATION, IT'S A STRUGGLE TO SEE HOW SUDDENLY, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN BRING IN A TON OF MODERATE VOTERS OR BRING IN A TON OF CASH THAT HASN'T HAPPENED YET.

>> THAT IS THE REPUBLICAN THEORY OF THIS ELECTION RIGHT NOW.

THAT THIS ELECTION IS A REFERENDUM ON GRETCHEN WITMER AND JOE BIDEN AND AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT'S NOT GOING TO TAKE THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT THE DEMOCRATS HAVE TO WIN IF YOU'RE A REPUBLICAN.

THAT IS THEIR ARGUMENT AT THIS DATE.

THE PUSHBACK ON THAT IS THAT THE DEMOCRATS ARE DEFINING THEIR CANDIDATES RIGHT NOW.

AND THERE'S NO OPPOSITION TO THAT ON THE AIRWAVES, IN MAILBOXES, ON SOCIAL MEDIA AT THE MOMENT.

>> ISN'T THAT ALL THE TRADITIONAL AND ESTABLISHMENT WAY OF THINKING?

AND WHAT PLANET ARE WE ON NOW?

WHAT COUNTRY?

>> WHAT STATE ARE WE IN?

YOU KNOW, WE'RE DEBATING WHO WOULD BE A GOOD RUNNING MATE.

CAN YOU IMAGINE THE DISCUSSIONS BEHIND CLOSED DOORS?

WHO DO WE GET THROUGH THE CAMPAIGN?

WHO DO WE GET THROUGH THE CON VEINS?

WHO UNIFIES VOTERS?

WHAT'S THE PRIORITY LIST?

HOW DO THEY PICK?

CAN YOU IMAGINE ALL THE DIFFERENT VOICES IN THAT ROOM?

>> YEAH.

THE CLOCK IS TICKING.

OKAY.

THE CLOCK IS TICKING FOR HER TO GET IN THIS GAME TO SHOW THAT SHE'S GOT SOME CHOPS AND WE'LL SEE WHAT THEY COME UP WITH.

>> OKAY.

THE ABORTION ISSUE, AS WE TAPE HERE, A LITTLE BIT BEFORE NINE O'CLOCK -- I'LL BUY BREAKFAST AFTERWARDS -- WHAT'S APPEARING THERE.

>> THERE'S BEEN A HUGE CASE IN OAKLAND COUNTY CIRCUIT COURT.

WE EXPECT A RULING FROM THE BENCH FROM A JUDGE AROUND 10:30 TO ESSENTIALLY DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT THIRTEEN PROSECUTORS IN MICHIGAN'S LARGEST COUNTIES CAN ENFORCE THE CRIMINAL ABORTION BAN.

IF I WERE TO BET, I WOULD SAY HE'S PROBABLY GOING TO ISSUE A PRELIMINARY INJUNCTION, WHICH WOULD PREVENT THESE THIRTEEN PROSECUTORS IN COUNTIES THAT HAVE ABORTION CLINICS FROM BRINGING CHARGES UNDER THIS CRIMINALIZATION.

>> THIS AUTOMATICALLY GOES TO A HIGHER COURT.

>> I TALKED TO THE ATTORNEY PROSECUTOR -- HE'S GOING TO APPEAL THIS DECISION IF AN INJUNCTION IS ISSUED.

IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO NOTE, THOUGH, TOO, THIS INJUNCTION APPLIES TO THIRTEEN PROSECUTORS.

THERE ARE SEVENTY OTHER PROSECUTORS IN MICHIGAN WHERE THIS ORDER WOULD NOT APPLY TO.

NOW, OF COURSE, THESE THIRTEEN PROSECUTORS ARE IN COUNTIES WITH ABORTION CLINICS, ROUGHLY 88% OF ABORTIONS IN 2021 HAPPEN IN ABORTION CLINICS, BUT THAT'S MORE THAN 3,000 LAST YEAR THAT DID NOT.

OF COURSE, THEY COULD BE HAPPENING IN THOSE COUNTIES BUT THEY COULD BE HAPPENING ELSEWHERE.

I ASKED THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH IF THEY'RE ISSUING GUIDANCE TO HOSPITALS, HEALTH PROVIDERS, PRIVATE PHYSICIANS IN THESE COUNTIES AND THEY SENT ME A STATEMENT SAYING MICHIGAN ABORTION IS LEGAL IN MICHIGAN.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING IN THOSE COUNTIES.

>> AT THE SAME TIME, THE STATE BOARD OF MEETING ON THE PETITION LANGUAGE TO PUT THIS ABORTION ISSUE ON THE FALL BALLOT AND THE CHALLENGERS ARE SAYING BASICALLY THIS THING IS FLAWED.

NOT IN WORDS.

>> YES.

>> WHO PROOFREAD THIS THING?

>> HOW THAT GOT BY ANYBODY -- >> I THINK WE'RE GOINGBACK TO JAMES CRAIG AGAIN WITH -- >> THIS IS NOT -- >> IT'S NOT.

>> THIS IS A MISTAKE.

WHO WORDED THAT THING AND HOW DID THAT -- WHO PROOFREAD THAT?

>> I CAN'T ANSWER THAT.

I WILL SAY, YOU KNOW, WE ALL COVER POLITICS HERE AND IT JUST ALL POINTS TO HOW FLUID THIS ISSUE OF ABORTION IS GOING TO BE OVER THE NEXT THREE MONTHS.

AND ANYONE WHO LOOKS YOU IN THE EYE AND TELLS YOU THIS IS HOW THIS IS GOING TO BREAK DOWN ON ELECTION DAY ON NOVEMBER 8th, THEY DO NOT KNOW THIS CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT COULD BE CHALLENGED.

DOES THE SUPREME COURT WEIGH IN ON ALL THIS LITIGATION?

MAYBE THE SUPREME COURT STEPS IN AND SAYS, THIS 1931 LAW IS NOT CONSTITUTIONAL.

HOW DO VOTERS REACT TO THAT?

THIS COULD CHANGE AS WE'RE SITTING HERE THIS MORNING ON AN HOUR BY HOUR BASIS, A DAY-BY-DAY BASIS RUNNING UP TO NOVEMBER 8th AND IT REALLY IS ONE OF MANY "X" FACTORS LOOMING OVER THIS ELECTION.

>> WE'VE TALKED A LOT ABOUT HOW DEMOCRATS -- THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT GOVERNOR WITMER HAS MADE THE CENTER OF HER CAMPAIGN.

>> THIS IS THE TOP OF HER CAMPAIGN AND REPUBLICANS HAVE TENDED TO NOT WANT TO RUN ON THIS ISSUE.

YOU SEE NATIONAL POLLING AND MICHIGAN POLLING NOT JUST RECENTLY, FOR DECADES, THAT SHOW THE MAJORITY OF VOTERS SUPPORT AT LEAST SOME ACCESS TO ABORTION AND POST ROE, YOU'VE SEEN THAT'S ONLY INCREASED.

SO THIS IS OBVIOUSLY AN ISSUE THAT'S GOING TO BE FLUID AND TOP OF MIND FOR MANY VOTERS REGARDLESS OF WHAT HAPPENS AT THE COURT OR WHETHER OR NOT THIS MAKES IT ONTO A BALLOT.

IF WE'RE LOOKING AT POLITICS, IT'S GOING TO BE KEY TO ALL OF THESE RACES MOVING FORWARD.

>> THE REPUBLICANS WANT TO TALK ABOUT INFLATION.

THEY WANT TO TALK ABOUT INFLATION.

AND THEY WANT TO TALK ABOUT INFLATION.

>> OF COURSE THEY DO.

THAT'S WHERE THEY WOULD HAVE THE UPPER HAND.

BUT TO THESE POINTS AGAIN, I THINK THIS ABORTION DEBATE AND IT BEING FAVORED IS ALSO PROPELLED BY WHAT HAPPENED IN KANSAS WITH THE POPULAR VOTE DOWN THERE.

THAT'S A RED STATE.

I WORKED THERE FOR THREE YEARS IN THE EARLY EIGHTIES BEFORE I CAME HERE.

THAT EVEN SURPRISED ME.

WHEN YOU HAVE CONSERVATIVE PEOPLE GOING INTO A PRIVATE BALLOT VOTING BOOTH, AND THEY VOTE PRIVATELY, THIS IS WHAT YOU COULD GET.

>> AND INDEPENDENT VOTERS ARE THE KEY TO THIS WHOLE ISSUE RIGHT HERE AND IF THE POLLING DATA IS CORRECT, THE GOVERNOR IS CAN GO WELL WITH INDEPENDENT VOTERS AND MS. DIXON'S ARGUMENT IS NOT GOING TO BE DIRECTED AT THE SOCCER MOMS WHO ARE WHO HE CHOICE IN OAKLAND COUNTY.

>> IT'S INTERESTING YOU SAY, REPUBLICANS WANT TO BE TALKING ABOUT THE ECONOMY.

THEY WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE ECONOMY AND THEY WANT TO TALK ABOUT HOW GOVERNOR WITMER HANDLED THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC BUT THEY HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO CONTROL THE MESSAGE.

INSTEAD OF TALKING ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED IN 2020 WITH THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC, THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED IN 2020 WITH THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION.

>> IT'S A MESSAGING CHALLENGE.

>> OF COURSE, AS CRAIG WROTE ABOUT TODAY, IT'S TOUGH TO GET YOUR MESSAGE OUT WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE ANY MONEY AND SO YOUR POINT, YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT INFLATION, YOU DON'T HAVE ANY MONEY, PRESS CONFERENCES IS TYPICALLY HOW YOU DO THAT OR FREE MEDIA AND THAT'S JUST NOT HAPPENING.

>> YEARS AGO, CANDIDATES FOR GOVERNOR WOULD GET ON AN AIRPLANE AFTER THE ANNOUNCEMENT AND FLY AROUND TO ALL THE MAJOR MARKETS AND GO POP IN, GET OFF THE PLANE, DO A PRESS CONFERENCE, GET BACK ON THE PLANE AND GO AROUND.

APPARENTLY THOSE DAYS ARE LONG GONE.

BUT A FOND MEMORY.

SPEAKING OF FOND MEMORIES, LET'S CALL IN OUR GUEST.

>> NEWS SEGUE.

>> I WORKED ON THAT ALL NIGHT.

Mr. REPRESENTATIVE, HOW ARE YOU DOING UP THERE IN THE UP, STIR?

>> I'M DOING JUST WELL, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> ARE YOU GOING TO HIRE A FOOD TASTER ALL OF YOUR CRITICAL COMMENTS ABOUT REPUBLICAN RUNNING FOR SECRETARY OF STATE AND CALLING THE FUND RAISING A DISASTER?

ARE YOU IN TROUBLE?

>> NO, I AM STILL POLLING AT 86% IN MICHIGAN'S UPPER PENINSULA FOR SECRETARY OF STATE, ALTHOUGH I'M NOT RUNNING FOR IT.

>> WHY ARE YOU SO CRITICAL OF YOUR PARTY, SIR?

>> WELL, UNFORTUNATELY, WE'VE GOT -- I'M NOT CRITICAL OF MY PARTY.

I'M CRITICAL OF CANDIDATES THAT HAVEN'T LEFT THE BASEMENT SINCE APRIL.

UNFORTUNATELY THAT WOULD BE OUR ATTORNEY-GENERAL CANDIDATE AND SECRETARY OF STATE CANDIDATE, BUT I THINK OUR GOVERNOR CANDIDATE IS GOING TO WIN IN NOVEMBER BECAUSE SHE IS SO MUCH MORE MAINSTREAM THAN THE CURRENT GOVERNOR, IT'S UNBELIEVABLE.

YOU GUYS MENTIONED BEFORE THAT TUDOR DIXON'S POSITION ON ABORTION IS UNPOPULAR.

ABOUT 25% OF MICHIGANDERS AGREE WITH US.

THE 8% OF MICHIGANDERS AGREE WITH FWRECH GRETCHEN WITMER POOPS HAVE WE SHOULD HAVE TAXPAYER-FUNDED ABORTION.

NOBODY WANTS TO TALK ABOUT WHAT GRETCHEN WITMER WANTS, WHICH IS NINE-MONTH ABORTION COMPLETELY LEGALIZED IN THE ENTIRE STATE AND WE PAY FOR IT.

THAT'S WHAT HER LAWSUIT WOULD ACCOMPLISH.

>> Mr. MAUGER?

>> YOU WERE AT THE APRIL ENDORSEMENT CONVENTION OBVIOUSLY AS A CANDIDATE.

AS WE SIT HERE TODAY, AHEAD OF THIS AUGUST CONVENTION, WHERE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR CANDIDATE WILL BE PICKED, WHAT DO YOU THINK THE CHANCES ARE THAT THE DELEGATES WOULD BE ABLE TO OVERRULE WHOEVER TUDOR DIXON SELECTS HERE?

>> I THINK THAT AT ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE O'CLOCK THIS AFTERNOON, WE'RE GOING HEAR NOMINEE TUDOR DIXON IS GOING TO UNIFY THE PARTY AND GET READY TO BEAT GRETCHEN WITMER AND HER UNKNOWN LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR CANDIDATE AND I THINK THAT SHE WILL WIN ON HER FIRST BALLOT.

>> WHO DOES THAT NEED TO BE AND HOW DOES HE OR SHE UNIFY THE PARTY?

>> I DON'T WANT TO GET AHEAD OF THE CAMPAIGN, BUT WHOEVER THEY CHOOSE TODAY, IT PROBABLY SHOULD BE SOMEBODY THAT CAN RELIABLY EXPLAIN THE MESSAGE OF REPUBLICANS.

YES, WE ARE PRO-LIFE.

YES, WE BELIEVE THAT INFLATION IS THE BIGGEST ISSUE IN MICHIGAN AND AN ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

WE BELIEVE IN INDIVIDUAL LIBERTIES.

YES, GRETCHEN WITMER LOCKED DOWN OUR COUNTRY, OUR STATE, HARDER THAN ANYBODY ELSE.

YES, SHE TOOK COVID POSITIVE YOUNG PEOPLE AND PUT THEM IN THE NURSING HOMES NEXT TO OUR MOST VULNERABLE PEOPLE AND YES, SHE NEEDS TO BE REPLACED IN NOVEMBER.

>> WHY SHOULD MICHIGAN FAMILIES AND MICHIGAN REPUBLICANS DONATE TO AN AG CANDIDATE WHO'S THE SUBJECT OF A CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION AND TO A SECRETARY OF STATE CANDIDATE WHO YOU'VE CALLED QANON?

>> I THINK THAT ALL CANDIDATES FOR OFFICE THAT ARE RUNNING AS REPUBLICANS, DEMOCRATS STAY HOME, IT'S FINE.

BUT REPUBLICANS NEED TO GET OUT AND THEY NEED TO COMMUNICATE MESSAGES THAT ACTUALLY MATTER TO VOTERS.

WHAT VOTERS WANT TO KNOW IS THAT WE'RE GOING TO WORK ON THINGS THAT ARE IMPORTANT TO THEM SUCH AS KITCHEN TABLE ISSUES LIKE INFLATION AND FRANKLY WITH THE HOUSING CRISIS.

I THINK THAT OUR GOVERNOR CANDIDATE IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH THAT.

>> THESE OTHER TWO CANDIDATES, THOUGH, CONTINUE TO TALK ABOUT THE PAST, DO THEY NOT, AND DO YOU FIND THAT OBJECTIONABLE?

>> ARE THEY TALKING ABOUT THE PAST?

I HAVEN'T SEEN THEM SINCE APRIL.

>> LET ME ASK YOU THIS: YOU WERE AT THE CONVENTION IN APRIL.

I DID A STORY WITH CINDY BARRY WHO WAS A CHESTERFIELD TOWNSHIP CLERK, ALSO A CANDIDATE FOR SECRETARY OF STATE.

WERE YOU CALLED A RHINO AT THAT CONVENTION IN APRIL?

>> I WAS CALLED LOTS-OF-THINGS.

>> WERE YOU CALLED A RHINO?

>> YEAH.

WHICH I QUITE FIND TO BE QUITE INTERESTING.

I MEAN, I WAS THE LAWMAKER THAT INTRODUCED ARTICLES OF IMPEACHMENT AGAINST GRETCHEN WITMER COVERING UP AND USING A NO-BID CONTRACT TO AWARD HER POLITICAL ALLIES.

I WAS THE FIRST ONE TO CRITICIZE THE LOCKDOWNS ON DAY ONE OF FIFTEEN DAYS TO SLOW THE SPREAD THAT HAS NOW LASTED TWO AND A HALF YEARS.

>> WILL YOU VOTE FOR THE SECRETARY OF STATE CANDIDATE ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE?

>> YES, I WILL.

ABSOLUTELY.

>> WHY ARE YOU CRITICAL OF HER?

>> BECAUSE SHE'S GOING TO LOSE.

>> WHY IS SHE GOING TO LOSE, IN YOUR OPINION?

>> SHE HASN'T LEFT HER BASEMENT SINCE APRIL.

>> SHE'S BEEN OUT DOING STUFF.

SHE'S BEEN DOING THE -- HER CAMPAIGN SAYS SHE'S BEEN DOING INTERVIEWS AND GETTING OUT AMONG PEOPLE.

>> I DON'T KNOW.

DAY FIVE OF THE UP STATE FAIR, TUDOR DIXON WILL BE HERE ON SATURDAY, ATTORNEY-GENERAL CANDIDATE.

SOS HASN'T MADE IT TO THE UPPER PENINSULA YET FOR THE UP STATE FAIR.

WE'LL HAVE 120,000 PEOPLE NOT THERE.

THEY'RE DOING INTERVIEWS WITH GLEN BECK, WHICH IS GREAT.

LOVE GLEN BECK.

BUT WE'LL BE REACHING OUT TO INDEPENDENT, MODERATE, FORMER UNION DEMOCRATS AND REALIZE THE TEM DEMOCRAT IS NO LONGER FOR UNION JOBS.

THEY WANT TO SHUT DOWN LINE FIVE.

THEY WANT TO DESTROY OUR ENERGY.

WE'RE HAVING -- GOING TO HAVE BROWN-OUTS IN THE NEXT TWO YEARS BECAUSE OUR INFRASTRUCTURE IS A DISASTER.

THEY WANT TO PUT UP WINDMILS AND SOLAR PANELS AND GET RID OF PIPELINE FIVE.

THAT DOESN'T PLAY WELL WITH OUR UNION FRIENDS.

THEY'RE READY TO VOTE FOR REPUBLICANS.

DO YOU HAVE TALK TO THEM.

>> WHEN YOU HAVE THE TRUMP PEOPLE, THE WING IN THE REPUBLICAN PARTY CALLING THE ESTABLISHMENT REPUBLICANS RHINOS, AREN'T YOU CONCERNS THOSE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO STAY HOME?

IS THAT DOESN'T ENERGIZE THEM TO COME OUT AND VOTE FOR ANYBODY.

AND THEY'RE NOT GOING TO CONTRIBUTE.

THE BIG DONATIONS WILL NOT ROLL IN.

CRAIG DID A STORY ALREADY ON THE HUGE DISPARITY IN THE FUNDING SO FAR IN THIS CYCLE.

SO WHAT ARE YOUR CONCERNS THAT REPUBLICANS STAY HOME AND DON'T CONTRIBUTE?

>> WELL, AS MUCH AS WE COULD BE DOING BETTER WITH UNIFYING OUR BASE, THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT FWGRETCHEN WITMER IS ONE O THE LEAST POPULAR INCUMBENT GOVERNORS IN HISTORY.

SHE HAD THE WORST LOCKDOWNS.

WHILE SHE WAS TELLING ME YOU COULDN'T VISIT YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS IN A NURSING HOME, SHE WAS GETTING ON A PRIVATE JET FLYING OFF TO GO SEE HER DAD.

NOW, LATER SHE SAID IT WAS A HEALTH EMERGENCY AND SHE WAS SEEN BUYING CLOTHES FOUR DAYS LATER IN DOWNTOWN LANSING.

GOVERNOR WITMER IS DO AS I SAY, NOT AS I DO, LOCKDOWN GOVERNOR OF THE COUNTRY.

SHE WILL LOSE IN NOVEMBER.

THERE WILL BE COATTAILS.

LET'S SEE WHAT HAPPENS WITH AG AND SOS.

>> YOU PREDICTED THAT SHE WOULD LOSE -- CHRISTINA CARMICHAEL WAS GOING TO LOSE EARLIER.

YOU SAY YOU'RE GOING TO VOTE FOR HER.

YOU'VE ALLEGED SHE'S A QANON SUPPORTER.

YOU'RE SAYING YOU WOULD RATHER HAVE SOMEONE IN BELIEVES IN YOUR MIND, IN QANON, THAT HAVE JOCELYN BENSON CONTINUE FOR FOUR YEARS AS SECRETARY OF STATE.

THAT'S A LEGITIMATE QUESTION FOR YOU TO ANSWER.

>> SURE.

TO BE FAIR DOES JOCELYN BENSON BELIEVE THAT DONALD TRUMP WAS LEGITIMATELY ELECTED IN 2016?

LET'S GO BACK.

THE PARTY OF ELECTION DENYING HAS ALWAYS BEEN A GAME WITH THE DEMOCRATS AT PLAY.

I DON'T THINK THAT A REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT HAS EVER BEEN LEGITIMATELY ELECTED, ACCORDING TO GRETCHEN WITMER, AND JOCELYN BENSON, SINCE PROBABLY RONALD REAGAN THE SECOND TIME.

THEY HAD DONALD TRUMP, TRUMP-RUSSIA COLLUSION FOR A DECADE AT THIS POINT.

DECADES.

>> HAVE YOU HEARD THE CHATTER IN THE PARTY THAT THERE IS SOME PEOPLE IN THE PARTY WHO THINK KEEPING CONTROL OF THE LEGISLATURE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN GRETCHEN WITMER?

ARE YOU IN THAT CAMP?

>> AS A CREATURE OF THE LEGISLATURE, I THINK THAT IT IS INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT TO VOTE IN YOUR LOCAL STATE REP AND STATE SENATE ELECTION.

I THINK THAT THOSE INDIVIDUALS NEED TO WORK VERY HARD.

BUT WE NEED A GOVERNOR AND WE NEED A GOVERNOR WHO CAN GOVERN AND FIX THE ISSUES OF ALL MICHIGANDERS AND I THINK THAT TUDOR DIXON'S GOING TO DO A GREAT JOB.

>> DO YOU THINK IT'S MORE IMPORTANT TO KEEP CONTROL OF THE LEGISLATURE OR TO WIN THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE?

>> WOULD I RATHER HAVE MY FOOT CUT OFF OR MY ARM CUT OFF?

[ Chuckling ] I WOULD PREFER TO HAVE BOTH.

BUT I'M GOING TO BE ACTIVELY CAMPAIGNING HEAVILY FOR TUDOR DIXON.

>> DO I HAVE TO ASK YOU A THIRD TIME WHAT'S MORE IMPORTANT?

PLEASE, REPRESENTATIVE.

>> I GUESS I WOULD TAKE MY ARM CUT OFF?

I THINK THE GOVERNOR -- WE'RE GOING TO KEEP THE HOUSE AND SENATE.

>> WHY IS THAT SUCH A TOUGH QUESTION FOR YOU?

>> I MEAN, IT IS LIKE ASKING ME DO I WANT TO GET SHOT IN THE HEAD OR THE HEART?

IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO ANSWER.

WE HAVEN'T LOST THE HOUSE AND SENATE IN OVER A DECADE.

I DON'T THINK WE'RE ABOUT TO.

>> WHAT MESSAGE HAVE YOU HEARD FROM THE ATTORNEY-GENERAL OF CANADA AND THE SECRETARY OF STATE CANDIDATE THAT COULD APPEAL TO MODERATE FORMER DEMOCRATS, THE FORMER UNION MEMBERS YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT?

>> I HAVEN'T.

THERE'S BEEN NO PIVOTING TO THE GENERAL HERE.

IT IS JUST BEEN MORE TALK TO MY BASE, OUR BASE, WHICH IS GREAT.

YOU NEED TO TALK TO THE INDEPENDENT MODERATE VOTERS AND THEY HAVEN'T DONE THAT.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S BECAUSE THEY'RE INCAPABLE OR HAVE A TERRIBLE CAMPAIGN TEAM OR WHAT IT IS, BUT THERE'S BEEN NO MOVING TO TALK ABOUT INDEPENDENT ISSUES.

WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT COMPROMISING ON OUR PRINCIPLES.

I'M NOT SAYING START SUPPORTING ABORTION ALL OF A SUDDEN.

THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

BUT, YOU KNOW, CONVENTION DELEGATES HAVE DIFFERENT ISSUES THEY'RE MOSTLY FOCUSED ON AND THAT'S WHAT I TALKED ABOUT FOR ALL OF THE CONVENTION AND THEN THE MINUTE THAT'S OVER, YOU START TALKING ABOUT ISSUES THAT INDEPENDENT AND MODERATES ARE WORRIED ABOUT.

THAT'S JUST DIFFERENT THAN ANYTHING THAT OUR AG ENDORSED CANDIDATES LIKELY NOMINEES HAVE BEEN SAYING SINCE APRIL.

>> DO YOU THINK THAT TUDOR DIXON WILL WIN BUT THE AG CANDIDATE AND SECRETARY OF STATE CANDIDATE WILL LOSE?

>> PROBABLY.

>> SO WHAT'S THE LOGICAL EXTENSION IS, IF THERE IS NO PIVOTING, YOUR PARTY -- THESE CANDIDATES ARE IN DEEP TROUBLE?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I MEAN, THESE CANDIDATES, NOT INCLUDING TUDOR DIXON, I THINK THAT SHE ABSOLUTELY HAS A WINNING MESSAGE AND WILL DO A GREAT JOB, I THINK THE GOVERNOR NOMINEE.

>> GIVE ME ONE ISSUE SHE'S PIVOTED ON.

IS SHE OUT THERE SHOOTING JUMP SHOTS AND PIVOTING ALL OVER THE PLACE?

>> JUMP SHOTS?

IT WAS INTERESTING BECAUSE WE WERE TALKING ABOUT SPORTS FIGURES FOR LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR.

I THINK THAT WE'RE GOING TO SEE THAT STARTING AFTER WE GET THE LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR OUT OF THE WAY.

OUR CONVENTION ISN'T OVER.

BY STATE LAW, THE CANDIDATES THAT WERE ENDORSED ARE NOT OUR NOMINEES UNTIL NEXT WEEKEND.

>> IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU KNOW WHO THE LG PICK IS.

DO YOU THINK THAT PERSON CAN BEAT RYAN KELLY?

IT'S NOT A HEAD TO HEAD MATCH-UP.

IF IT WERE RYAN KELLY VERSUS THIS PERSON, WHO WINS AT THE CONVENTION?

>> FOR THE RECORD, I DO NOT KNOW THE NAME OF THE LIEUTENANT GOVERN NOR CHOICE.

>> ARE QUICKLY.

>> BUT I KNOW THAT QUALITY OF THE CAMPAIGN, SO I'M SURE THAT THAT PERSON WILL WIN.

>> WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO AFTER THIS?

ARE YOU GOING TO GET A REAL JOB?

>> NO, I'VE NEVER GOT A REAL JOB BEFORE.

BESIDES THE TIME I WAS AT JIMMY JOHNS.

WE'LL SEE.

[ Chuckling ] >> REPRESENTATIVE, THANKS.

HAVE FUN UP IN THE UP.

>> HE'S VERY CANDID.

>> THANKS TO THE THREE OF YOU.

SEE YOU NEXT WEEK!

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