♪♪ >> BRAUDE: TONIGHT, A SPECIAL "GREATER BOSTON," THE FINAL IN OUR SERIES OF THE ONLY TELEVISED PRIMARY DEBATES IN MASSACHUSETTS.

WE'RE CLOSING OUT WITH THE RACE FOR SECRETARY OF THE COMMONWEALTH-- BEST KNOWN FOR OVERSEEING ELECTIONS ACROSS THE STATE-- BUT HAVING A NUMBER OF OTHER IMPORTANT RESPONSIBILITIES AS WELL, INCLUDING MAINTAINING PUBLIC RECORDS AND CORPORATE REGISTRATIONS AND PRESERVING HISTORICAL SITES.

I'M JOINED BY THE TWO DEMOCRATS VYING FOR THE JOB, AHEAD OF THE PRIMARY ELECTION ON SEPTEMBER 6: SEVEN-TERM INCUMBENT, WILLIAM GALVIN, WHO'S SERVED AS SECRETARY SINCE 1995; AND PRESIDENT OF THE BOSTON N.A.A.C.P., TANISHA SULLIVAN.

>> BRAUDE: AS ALWAYS, THE RULES?

THERE ARE NONE.

BUT TIME IS SHORT, SO BREVITY IS APPRECIATED, ACTUALLY, REQUIRED.

FEEL FREE TO TALK TO EACH OTHER, JUST NOT OVER EACH OTHER.

THANKS FOR BEING HERE.

I'VE BEEN ASSURED THAT NEITHER CANDIDATE WILL TAKE THE FIFTH TONIGHT.

THANK YOU BOTH FOR BEING HERE.

TANISHA SULLIVAN, YOU WANT VOTERS TO FIRE BILL AND HIRE YOU, WHY?

>> BECAUSE THIS MOMENT IN OUR DEMOCRACY REQUIRES A MORE PROACTIVE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE.

WHAT WE KNOW IS THAT OUR STATE IS SUFFERING FROM DEEP VOTER PARTICIPATION GAPS, EVEN IN 2020.

76 OVERALL VOTER PARTICIPATION, BUT 90% IN CITIES LIKE DOVER, AND 52% IN CITIES LIKE SPRINGFIELD.

WE HAVE CONSISTENTLY HAVE HAD DEEP VOTER PARTICIPATION GAPS THAT CUT ACROSS BOTH RACIAL AND ECONOMIC LINES.

IN ORDER FOR US TO HAVE A STRONG DEMOCRACY, WE NEED TO ENSURE ALL PEOPLE ARE PARTICIPATING.

THERE IS A ROLE FOR THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE TO PLAY, NOT JUST FROM AN ADMINISTRATIVE STANDPOINT, BUT FROM A COMMUNITY STANDPOINT TO MOTIVATE PEOPLE TO GET OUT THERE AND VOTE.

>> Braude: WHY DO YOU DESERVE AN EIGHTH TERM?

>> WE'RE ONE OF THE BEST ELECTION SYSTEMS IN THE COUNTRY.

I INTRODUCED AUTOMATIC VOTER REGISTRATION.

WE MADE IT MUCH EASIER TO VOTE.

I MADE PERMANENT THE VOTE BY MAIL.

WE'VE EXTENDED EARLY VOTING.

WE'VE GIVEN PEOPLE AMPLE OPPORTUNITIES TO VOTE, AND WE'VE ENCOURAGED THEM.

WE HAVE SPENT MONEY ON COMMUNITY-BASED STUFF.

WE HAVE REACHED OUT TO COMMUNITIES WHERE WE CAN.

THERE ARE DISPARITIES, BUT THEY'RE NOT CAUSED BY THE PROCESS.

THEY'RE CAUSED BY THE INTERESTS OF PEOPLE IN CERTAIN RACES.

WE SEE THAT IN MUNICIPAL ELECTIONS ALL OF THE TIME.

WHERE SOME COMMUNITIES, THERE IS THIS HEAVY INTEREST IN A PARTICULAR RACE, AND OTHER PLACES THERE IS NOT.

I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT TO REACH OUT TO GET PEOPLE TO VOTE, BUT WE'VE DONE THAT.

THE MOST IMPORTANT THING WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT IS THE FUTURE.

WE HAVE A VERY CHALLENGING ELECTION COMING UNIN 2024.

WE KNOW REPUBLICANS HAVE, IN STATE AFTER STATE, MADE IT HARDER TO VOTE.

IT WILL AFFECT OUR NATIONAL POLICY FOR US HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS -- >> JIM, I DO WANT TO RESPOND.

>> Braude: WE'LL GET TO YOU.

>> IT IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT WE HAVE SOMEBODY WHO KNOWS ABOUT ELECTIONS AND TO RUN ELECTIONS -- >> Braude: YOU SAID IN THE FIRST DEBATE THAT SHE WAS SPOUTING A LOT OF MISINFORMATION.

IS SHE QUALIFIED TO BE SECRETARY OF STATE?

>> QUALIFIED, SURELY.

SHE EDUCATED, AN ACCOMPLISHED WOMAN.

BUT IT IS WHO HAS THE TECHNICAL EXPERIENCE.

>> Braude: I GOT IT.

>> MASSACHUSETTS RANKS 28th IN VOTER REGISTRATION, NOT DUE TO THE ACTIONS OF SECRETARY GALVIN.

THE VOTING RIGHTS COMMUNITY WAS FIGHTING WITH BILL GALVIN TO ACTUALLY IMPLEMENT AUTOMATIC VOTER REGISTRATION.

AND WHEN THE LEGISLATURE TOOK ACTION IN 2018, BILL GALVIN FAILED TO IMPLEMENT VOTER REGISTRATION, AS IT WAS INTENDED.

LEADING TO THE LEGISLATURE THIS YEAR HAVING TO TAKE IT UP AGAIN -- >> CAN I RESPOND?

>> Braude: ONE SECOND.

>> TODAY WHAT WE KNOW IS VOTE BY MAIL HAS NOT BEEN IMPLEMENTED CORRECTLY.

IN FACT, VOTERS IN CAMBRIDGE AND CONCORDE TODAY HAVE RECEIVED THE WRONG BALLOT.

TODAY VOTE BY MAIL HAS NOT BEEN IMPLEMENTED CORRECTLY.

WE'RE STILL MISSING THE ELECTRONIC PORTAL THAT THE LAW REQUIRES.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, WHAT WE NEED IS NOT ONLY SOMEONE WHO WILL IMPLEMENT WITH FIDELITY THE LAWS THAT ARE BEING PASSED BY OUR LEGISLATURE, BUT SOMEONE WHO IS ALSO GOING TO BE DEEPLY COMMITTED TO ENSURE THAT WE'RE DOING THE WORK NECESSARY TO BUILD TRUST, RESTORE RELATIONSHIPS IN COMMUNITIES, THAT WILL THEN INSPIRE, MOTIVATE, AND ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO VOTE.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, THIS OFFICE, THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE IN THE LAST 25 YEARS UNDER BILL GALVIN HAS FOUND ITSELF ON THE OTHER SIDE OF VOTING RIGHTS LITIGATION BROUGHT BY VOTING RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS AND CIVIL RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS.

>> Braude: YOU CAN RESPOND, BUT I'M SURE YOU HAVE SEEN SENATOR RALPH SENT YOU A LETTER SAYING EXACTLY WHAT TANISHA SULLIVAN SAID.

YOU HAD 30 DAYS, AND NOT ONLY HAVE YOU NOT DONE IT, YOU PUT OUT INFORMATION THAT THE ONLY WAYS YOU CAN REQUEST THOSE VOTES IS BY SNAIL MAIL, E-MAIL, AND A THIRD THING, BUT NOT THE ONLINE PORTAL.

>> THE LEGISLATURE SAT ON THAT LEDGESLEGISLATION FOR MONTHS.

IT WAS ONLY WHEN I SAID SOMETHING THAT THEY PASSED IT.

FOR THEM TO SAY WE HAVE TO DO IT IN 0 30 DAYS, WE CLEARLY TOLD THEM IF THEY DELAYED IT, WE WOULD BE UNABLE TO DO THE TECHNOLOGY.

>> Braude: YOU KNEW IT WAS COMING?

>> WE DID NOT.

WE THOUGHT A LOT OF THINGS WERE COMING FROM THE LEGISLATURE AND THEY DIDN'T COME.

IT HAS BEEN A STRUGGLING TRAUG STRUGGLE FOR ME FOR THE PAST TWO YEARS, WE HAVE NOT HAD VOTE BY MAIL.

IT EXPIRED IN DECEMBER, THAT WAS THE END OF IT.

SO THERE WAS NO CERTAINTY.

WHAT WE DID DO, AND WE WERE READY TO DO, AND WE TOLD THEM WE WERE PREPARING TO DO, WAS TO SEND THE MAIL TO EVERY SINGLE VOTER IN MASSACHUSETTS, WHICH WE DID.

AND WE ENCOURAGED PEOPLE TO DO IT ONLINE OR ANOTHER WAY.

THE RESPONSE HAS BEEN VERY STRONG.

THE EFFECTIVENESS OF THE VOTE BY MAIL -- CLEARLY NO ONE HAS MORE ENTHUSIASTIC ABOUT VOTE BY MAIL, AND I'VE TRIED TO GET IT DONE, BUT THE LEGISLATURE DECIDED TO HOLD IT UP -- >> Braude: I WANTED TO QUOTE SOME LEGISLATION.

IN 2020 THERE WAS A RECORD TURNOUT IN TERMS OF TOTAL NUMBER OF VOTES, IN TERMS OF PERCENTAGE TURNOUT AS WELL.

SOME WOULD SAY THAT IS A CAUSE FOR CELEBRATION.

YOU SAY IT IS REASON FOR CHANGE.

WHY?

>> IT IS REASON FOR CONCERN.

I NEED TO CORRECT SOMETHING THAT WAS STATED.

LET'S BE CLEAR THAT IN 2020, THE PORTAL THAT IS REQUIRED UNDER THE LAW TODAY WAS UP AND RUNNING.

THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE TOOK IT DOWN.

THERE WAS NO NEED TO RAMP UP.

THEY SIMPLY NEEDED TO PUT BACK UP THE PORTAL -- >> Braude: WE'LL GET TO THAT.

I WANT TO STAY ON THE 2020 NUMBERS.

RECORD NUMBERS ARE NOT ENOUGH?

>> AS I SHARED WITH YOU EARLIER, 76% OVERALL TURNOUT WAS HIGH ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

PEOPLE TURNED OUT BECAUSE WE WANTED TO GET DONALD TRUMP OUT OF OFFICE.

BUT IT IS NOT ENOUGH, WHEN WE LOOK AT THE DATA AND FIND THAT CONSISTENTLY, EVEN IN 2020, JIM, WE HAVE COMMUNITIES LIKE SPRINGFIELD, LIKE NEW BEDFORD, LIKE LAWRENCE, WHO HAD VOTER PARTICIPATION RATES HOVERING IN THE 50s.

THAT IS NOT SUCCESS.

WHY?

BECAUSE I KNOW WHO THE PEOPLE ARE LIVING IN THOSE COMMUNITIES.

IF WE'RE HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS ARE GOING TO BE A LEADER WHEN IT COMES TO PROTECTING AND ADVANCING OUR DEMOCRACY, WE CANNOT ACCEPT VOTER PARTICIPATION RATES YEAR AFTER YEAR THAT TELL US WE HAVE AN ECONOMIC AND RACIAL JUSTICE ISSUES.

>> Braude: I WANT TO ADD ONE HOLE THAT TANISHA SULLIVAN DIDN'T MENTION, ACCORDING TO THE KAISER FOUNDATION, LOWEST PERCENTAGE BLACK TURNOUT IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.

IF YOU CLAIM CREDIT ACROSS THE BOARD, YOU HAVE TO CLAIM SOME RESPONSIBILITY FOR THAT, DON'T YOU?

>> I CLAIM RESPONSIBILITY FOR MAKING SURE WE DID AS MUCH AS WE POSSIBLY COULD.

THE ACTUAL NUMBERS OF SELF-IDENTIFIED BLACKS WAS HIGHER.

HOW DO YOU GET PEOPLE OUT TO VOTE?

WE MADE IT AS EASY AS WE COULD.

OBVIOUSLY, I WANT IT TO BE AS HIGH AS I CAN EVERYWHERE.

I'M SECRETARY OF STATE FOR ALL OF MASSACHUSETTS.

NO ONE DURING MY CAREER IS MORE COMMITTED TO GETTING MINORITY COMMUNITIES INVOLVED FROM THE VERY BEGINNING.

>> Braude: SECRETARY GALVIN, YOU PUT UP AN ED IN WHICH PART OF IT YOU QUOTE A STORY FROM THE NEW YORK SOMETIMES SAYING MASSACHUSETTS IS A MODEL FOR HOW TO COUNT VOTES.

AND THAT WAS PART OF THE "NEW YORK TIMES" EDITORIAL.

"BUT CASTING BALLOTS WASN'T ALWAYS AS SEAMLESS.

ELECTION BALLOTS PROVIDED A MIX OF HARSH POLICY AND HARSH DEADLINES WHICH POSSIBLY DISENFRANCHISED VARIOUS VOTERS."

THAT WAS NOT IN YOUR AD, WAS IT NOT?

>> YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE 2020 STATE PRIMARY.

IT WAS IN THE HEIGHT OF THE COVID.

WE COULD NOT LEAVE AN EXTRA PERIOD OF TIME FOR THE ABSENTEES OR THE MAIL-INS TO BE RECEIVED.

THEY HAD TO BE RECEIVED THAT A DAY.

I WAS SUED, AS I OFTEN AM BY CANDIDATES AND OTHER PEOPLE, AND THE COURT FOUND IN MY FAVOR BECAUSE WE EXPLAINED TO THE COURT IN ORDER TO GET THE BALLOTS OUT TO MILITARY AND EVERYBODY ELSE, WE COULDN'T ALLOW AN EXTRA 10 DAYS -- >> Braude: THEN WHY DID YOU PUT IN THE AD WE'RE A MODEL?

BIKERS>> BECAUSE WE WERE A MODEL.

I GOT CONSULTED BY OTHER STATES AND HELPED THEM.

LOOK WHAT HAPPENED IN PENNSYLVANIA.

IT TOOK THEM WEEKS.

LOOK WHAT HAPPENS IN NEW YORK, IT TAKES THEM A LONG TIME.

WE PUT TOGETHER A SYSTEM FOR VOTE BY MAIL WHERE EVERY PERSON WAS BAR CODED, AND WE COUNTED THEM ELECTION NOT WITH TRANSPARENCY AND WITHOUT CHALLENGE.

>> Braude: HE DIDN'T VOTE IT DOWN.

THE HOUSE REFUSED TO APPROVE IT AFTER THE SENATE DID.

ISN'T THAT WHERE YOUR PROBLEM IS, NOT WITH THE SECRETARY'S OFFICE?

>> NO.

BECAUSE THIS IS A LEADERSHIP MOMENT.

MAINE ADOPTED SAME-DAY VOTER REGISREGISTRATION IS 1973.

HE'S BEEN IN THE OFFICE FOR A QUARTER OF A CENTURY.

IF SAME-DAY REGISTRATION WAS A PRIORITY FOR THE SECRETARY, IT WOULD BE DONE BECAUSE HE WOULD HAVE LEANED IN FROM A LEADERSHIP STANDPOINT TO GET IT DONE OR HE WOULD HAVE FOUND ANOTHER PATHWAY TO YES.

>> Braude: WHAT DOES ANOTHER PATHWAY TO YES MEAN?

>> I BELIEVE AT THIS POINT -- I BELIEVE AS SECRETARY, I WILL BE ABLE TO WORK WITH THE LEGISLATURE TO GET IT DONE.

ANOTHER PATHWAY THAT WE COULD BE TAKING IS A BALLOT QUESTION.

THAT IS ANOTHER ROUTE FOR THE PEOPLE'S VOICE TO BE HEARD ON THIS ISSUE.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, FOR US HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS TO BE A HALF CENTURY BEHIND OTHER STATES IS SIMPLY UNACCEPTABLE.

>> Braude: DO YOU WANT TO RESPOND TO THAT?

QUICKLY.

>> BUT WHAT I WANT TO LIFT UP HERE IS IN 2016, WHEN THE CHELSEA COLLABORATIVE SUED SECRETARY GALVIN FOR THE 20-DAY VOTER REGISTRATION, THERE WAS A WINDOW FOR SECRETARY GALVIN, IF HE WAS A FIRM BELIEVER, TO ADVANCE SAME-DAY.

BECAUSE IN THE CHELSEA COLLABORATIVE DECISION, THE LOWER COURT SIDED WITH THE CHELSEA COLLABORATIVE -- >> Braude: THE 20 DAYS BEFORE.

>> THE 20 DAYS.

BUT INSTEAD OF TAKING THAT WINDOW, GALVIN APPEALED.

>> Braude: THAT IS TRUE -- >> I DEFENDED IT BECAUSE WE NEEDED TO GET THE BALLOTS CLEARED.

I'M GLAD YOU BROUGHT UP THAT CASE.

BECAUSE IN THAT CASE, WHICH THE SUPREME COURT FOUND IN MY FAVOR, IT SAID OF MY RECURRING EFFORTS TO PASS ELECTION DAY REGISTRATION IT SAID IT RIGHT THERE, THAT I WAS TRYING THAT EN, FOURTHEN, FOUR YEARS AGO, AND I WAS TRYING BEFORE.

IT IS A PROPOSAL FOR OVER A DECADE, WHICH I HAVE RESPONDED TO.

WHAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT ABOUT ELECTION DAY REGISTRATION IS THIS: YOU WOULD O NOT HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DO THAT PRIOR TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE PLAN I DEVELOPED.

I HAD TO CREATE, THE FIRST TIME, A NETWORK STATE-WIDE TO DO CREATE THE CENTRAL VOTER REGISTRATION -- >> Braude: YOU WANT TO RESPOND?

>> HERE WE'RE MISSING THE POINT ONCE AGAIN.

I'M TALKING ABOUT THE NEED FOR MASSACHUSETTS A TO HAVE A SECRETARY OF STATE WHO IS NOT ONLY GOING TO BE PRO-ACTIVE, BUT WHO IS LOOKING FOR EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO INCREASE BALLOT ACCESS.

WE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY IN 2016 WITH THAT LOWER COURT DECISION.

WHAT FOLKS NEED TO UNDERSTAND IS WHEN YOU'RE IN LITIGATION, YOU HAVE A CHOICE TO APPEAL.

BILL GALVIN CHOSE TO APPEAL THE LOWER COURT DECISION THAT WOULD HAVE DONE AWAY WITH OUR VOTER REGISTRATION DEADLINE, WHICH HAVE CLEARED THE PATHWAY FOR SAME DAY VOTER LEGISLATION.

>> Braude: THAT WAS THE LAW OF MASSACHUSETTS AT THE TIME.

>> THAT WAS THE LAW, THE 20-DAY VOTER REGISTRATION DEADLINE.

BUT THE LOWER COURT, THE LOWER COURT, AGREED THAT THE 20-DAY REGISTRATION WAS UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

THE FACT THAT BILL GALVIN CHALLENGED THAT DECISION HAS LED -- >> Braude: I WANT TO MOVE FROM 2020 TO 2022.

PRIMARY DAY IS THE DAY AFTER LABOR DAY, AFTER A LOT OF KIDS ARE GOING TO SCHOOL FOR THE FIRST DAY.

WHY WAS THAT DAY CHOSEN?

>> IT WAS CHOSEN BY THE LEGISLATURE.

WE COULD NOT GO ANY LATER THAN THAT DATE BECAUSE WE'D GET UP AGAINST THE FEDERAL DEADLINE FOR HAVING BALLOTS AVAILABLE FOR MILITARY PEOPLE 45 DAYS BEFORE AN ELECTION.

IF WE WENT EARLIER, WE WOULD BE IN AUGUST.

I FELT, AND I STILL DO, AUGUST IS A BAD TIME.

OUR EXPERIENCE IN ELECTIONS IN MASSACHUSETTS IS SUMMER ELECTIONS DO NOT GET BIG TURN OUTS.

WHEN WE HAD THE SPECIAL ELECTION IN 2013, WE HAD A SUMMER OF FINAL ELECTION IN JUNE AND IT WAS A VERY POOR TURNOUT.

IN MASSACHUSETTS AND NEW ENGLAND, I THINK PEOPLE TEND TO GO AWAY DURING THE SUMMER MONTHS.

>> Braude: WHY NOT SEPTEMBER 13th -- >> BECAUSE WE CAN'T -- >> Braude: IT SAYS SEVEN WEEKS EARLIER -- >> WHICH WE CANNOT DO.

>> Braude: THEN THE LAW SHOULD BE AMENDED, SHOULDN'T IT?

>> YES, AND WE'VE TRIED.

I SUPPORTED, AND SENATOR ROUSHE, WHO YOU MENTIONED EARLIER, SHE HAS PROPOSED A SPRING PRIMARY -- >> Braude: YOU SUPPORT IT OR YOU JUST DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT?

>> WELL, I SUPPORT IT.

>> Braude: HAVE YOU DONE ANYTHING ABOUT IT?

>> I'VE LAID OUT A PLAN.

THE PLAN IS YOU HAVE TO MOVE EVERYTHING ELSE, ALSO, ASSUMING YOU WANT TO DO THAT.

THAT MEANS YOU HAVE FILING DATES MUCH EARLIER IN THE YEAR, FORCING PEOPLE TO MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT RUNNING EARLIER IN THE YEAR -- >> Braude: DO YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH SEPTEMBER 6th -- >> ABSOLUTELY.

THERE IS A PROBLEM WITH THE DAY AFTER LABOR DAY AS THE PRIMARY DAY.

WE SPOKE OUT AGAINST IT IN 2018 AS WELL.

THE ISSUE IS VOTER PARTICIPATION IN MASSACHUSETTS AGAIN IS LOW, AND CONSISTENTLY THIS ISSUE IMPACTS OUR GATEWAY CITIES.

IF WE WANT TO INCREASE VOTER PARTICIPATION, WE HAVE TO ENSURE THAT ALL OF THE STRUCTURES AROUND OUR VOTING SYSTEM ARE SUPPORTING HIGHER VOTER TURNOUT.

WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS ENSURE THAT WE ARE REVIEWING THE CALENDAR AT LARGE.

THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, WE COULD NOT ONLY HAVE SPRING PRIMARIES, BUT WE COULD ALSO BE LOOKING AT MOVING AND ALIGNING OUR STATE ELECTIONS WITH FEDERAL ELECTIONS, AND OUR MUNICIPAL ELECTIONS WITH STATE ELECTIONS.

>> Braude: DID YOU EVER SUGGEST IT ON A BALLOT QUESTION, AS YOU REQUESTED THE SECRETARY SHOULD DO?

A CITIZEN COULD DO THAT AS WELL?

>> THEY CAN.

HERE IS THE THING, JIM, I BELIEVE AS SECRETARY OF STATE -- I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT FOR A SECRETARY OF STATE TO EMPOWER PEOPLE TO ACTUALLY BE MORE ENGAGED IN OUR DEMOCRACY.

IT IS ONE OF THE KEY ISSUES THAT I FIND WITH THE CURRENT SECRETARY OF STATE.

BUT I DO NEED TO LIFT UP AND RESPOND TO SOMETHING THAT WAS SAID EARLIER.

>> Braude: WHAT'S THAT?

>> IT IS NOT -- IF WE WANT TO INCREASE VOTER PARTICIPATION, WE CANNOT CONTINUE TO DO THIS WORK THE SAME WAY THAT WE'VE ALWAYS BEEN DOING IT.

>> Braude: WHAT SHOULD BE DONE DIFFERENTLY?

>> WE SHOULD BE ENSURING THAT WE ARE NOT ONLY WORKING TO BREAK DOWN THE ADMINISTRATIVE BARRIERS TO THE BALLOT BOX BY IMPLEMENTING AUTOMATIC VOTER REGISTRATION, IMPLEMENTING EARLY VOTING AND VOTE BY MAIL, BUT WE HAVE TO -- THIS IS A KEY PIECE -- WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH, WE'VE GOT TO ADDRESS THE VERY REAL ISSUES IN OUR COMMUNITY, THE LACK OF TRUST AND THE LACK OF FAITH IN OUR GOVERNMENT AND IN OUR DEMOCRACY.

>> Braude: SECRETARY -- >> IT DOESN'T MATTER IF FOLKS ARE REGISTERED TO VOTE IF THEY DON'T BELIEVE IN THE SYSTEM.

AND THERE IS A ROLE FOR THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE TO PLAY.

AND AS SECRETARY OF STATE, I WILL ENSURE THAT THIS OFFICE HAS A CONSISTENT PRESENCE IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

>> Braude: CONSISTENT PRESENCE IN THE COMMUNITY.

I ASSUME THE IMPLICATION IS YOU DON'T?

>> I THINK THAT IS WHAT SHE IS TRYING TO SAY.

MY OPPONENT OBVIOUSLY WANTS TO PAINT THAT PICTURE.

WE ARE VERY CONSISTENT.

ONE OF THE THINGS WE DID LAST IN 2020 WAS THE CENSUS, IN ORDER TO GET THE TREMENDOUS RESULT WE HAVE, OF A SEVEN MILLION POPULATION THAT EQUATELY REFLECTED MANY OF THE GATEWAY COMMUNITIES, SUCH AS LAWRENCE AND CHELSEA.

WE HAD TO WORK WITH COMMUNITY GROUPS, AND WE DID.

WE WERE ON THE GROUND.

WE SPENT A LOT OF MONEY.

WE GAVE THEM FINANCIAL SUPPORT AND WE HAD A GREAT RESULT.

>> I'D LIKE TO RESPOND.

>> WE HAVE GIVEN MONEY IN THE PAST TO COMMUNITY GROUPS TO ENCOURAGE VOTER REGISTRATION.

LESS VOTER REGISTRATION IS ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO VOTE.

MUNICIPAL ELECTIONS, OFTENTIMES THEY WON'T VOTE.

WE LOOK AT THEM AND SAY, WHY AREN'T THEY VOTING.

WE CAN'T MAKE IT ANY EASIER ADMINISTRATIVELY.

>> Braude: A QUICK RESPONSE?

>> FIRST OF ALL, OUR CENSUS DID PRODUCE AN UNDERCOUNT.

AND THAT MEANS THAT IN COMMUNITIES ACROSS MASSACHUSETTS WE DON'T HAVE THE FUNDING WE NEED FOR EDUCATION, WE DON'T HAVE THE FUNDING WE NEED TO SUPPORT OUR MUNICIPALITIES.

WE NEED TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE AN ACCURATE COUNT AND WE'RE WORKING TOWARDS AN ACCURATE ACCOUNT EVERY TIME.

AND, AGAIN, THE ISSUE HERE IS TRUST.

LET'S NOT BE DISMISSIVE ABOUT THIS.

THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, IF PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITIES DON'T HAVE FAITH IN OUR GOVERNMENT, THEY ARE NOT GOING TO PARTICIPATE.

IF PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITIES DON'T TRUST OUR GOVERNMENT -- >> Braude: WHO ARE THOSE PEOPLE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

>> -- IT DOES NOT MATTER IF YOU KNOCK ON THE DOOR FOR A CENSUS COUNT.

THEY WON'T OPEN THE DOOR.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BLACK FOLKS AND INDIGENOUS FOLKS -- >> Braude: SHOULD YOUR GENDER AND RACE MATTER TO VOTERS?

>> LET ME JUST FINISH THIS PIECE.

WE'RE NOT JUST TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE OF COLOR.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WORKING FOLKS -- >> Braude: I WANT TO STAY WITH PEOPLE OF COLOR.

SHOULD YOUR GENDER AND RACE MATTER TO THE VOTERS?

IS IT RELEVANT?

>> I'M A PRACTICING ATTORNEY, AND WE LIFT UP MY CIVIL RIGHTS, AND THAT'S VOLUNTEER WORK.

I HAVE 20 YEARS OF LEGAL PRACTICE, AND THAT ABSOLUTELY IS RELEVANT, AND IN ADDITION TO THAT, YES, I BRING MY LIVED EXPERIENCE TO THIS ROLE AS A BLACK WOMAN, YES.

A BLACK WOMAN WHO IS ACTIVELY ENGAGED IN OUR COMMUNITIES AND HAS A DEEP UNDERSTANDING AND A GROUNDING IN WHAT THE ISSUES ARE PREVENTING PEOPLE FROM ACTUALLY VOTING AND COMPLETING THE CENSUS.

>> Braude: COMMONWEALTH MAGAZINE DID A PIECE OF THE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS, YOU HAVE THE LOWEST PERCENTAGE STAFF OF PEOPLE OF COLOR, AND YOU DON'T COLLECT DATA -- >> WE DO COLLECT DATA.

YOU'RE REFERENCING 2017.

IT IS 16% OF BLACK, AND THERE ARE OTHER GROUPS, HISPANIC GROUPS AND OTHERS.

>> Braude: STILL ONE OF THE LOWEST OF THE COUNTRY -- >> IT IS THE LOWEST.

>> EXCUSE ME, IF I MAY.

I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICES.

I DO KNOW MY CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICE.

I KNOW WHEN I HAVE TO AB SORD ABSORB OTHER AGENCIES, THE REGISTRY OF DEEDS, MY CONTROL OVER THOSE AGENCIES IS VERY LIMITED AS FAR AS THE POPULATIONS.

WE'VE WORKED HARD, FIRST OF ALL, TO HAVE A HIGHER DIVERSITY IN OUR WORK STAFF.

AND A MAJORITY OF MY DIRECTORS ARE WOMEN, INCLUDING A BLACK WOMAN.

>> Braude: BY THE WAY, I'M TOLD BY MY PRODUCERS THAT YOU'VE GOTTEN MORE TIME PRIMARILY BECAUSE OF ME, SO THE FINAL FEW MINUTES YOU'LL GET ADDITIONAL TIME.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Braude: EVEN THOUGH NOT TECHNICALLY IN YOUR JURISDICTION, SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE, MASSACHUSETTS, AS EVERYBODY KNOWS, IS THE ONLY ONE WHERE JUDICIARY IS EXEMPT FROM PUBLIC RECORD LAWS.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO CHANGE THAT?

>> I'VE DONE MORE THAN ANYBODY BEFORE ME AND ANYBODY WHO HAS ATTEMPTED TO INFLUENCE WE.

WE CHANGED THE LAW, THAT HAS CHANGED THE TIMELINES IN TERMS OF RESPONSE, ESTABLISHED A RECORD KEEPING OFFICERS, AND WE FOR THE FIRST TIME ESTABLISHED WE COULD GET COURT FEES, A REQUESTER COULD GET ATTORNEYS FEES AND COURT COSTS IF THEY HAVE TO SUE.

AS A RESULT OF THAT, WE'VE HAD A SEA CHANGE.

WE JUST WON A BIG CASE UP IN WORCESTER.

>> Braude: BUT THE THREE ENTITIES ARE CLAIMING EXEMPTIONS.

>> IN THE CASE OF THE EXECUTIVE, NO ONE HAS BEEN MORE OUTSPOKEN ABOUT THE FACT THAT THE EXECUTIVE, PARTICULARLY THE GOVERNOR, SHOULD NOT BE EXEMPT.

IT IS ON A PHONY CASE FROM THE WELDON ADMINISTRATION.

EARLIER THIS YEAR I PROPOSED HAVING A CHANGE THAT WOULD ONLY TAKE EFFECT WHEN THE CURRENT GOVERNOR LEAVES.

AND EVERY GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE SPOKE IN FAVOR OF IT, AND I ADDRESSED IT, AND I SAID THIS IS A SOLUTION.

AND I TRIED TO GET THAT THROUGH, BUT THERE IS A RECALCITRANT.

THESE AGENCIES, THE SEPARATE ENTITIES OF GOVERNMENT, THEY HAVE MADE THEIR DECISION THEY DON'T WANT TO BE PUBLIC.

I HAVE PROPOSED INITIATIVE PETITIONS TO TRY TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT.

>> Braude: WHAT DID YOU PROPOSE?

>> I PROPOSED ALL OF THE THINGS I JUST SUGGESTED CHANGING.

>> Braude: TO TAKE AWAY THE EXEMPTION -- >> TO TAKE AWAY SOME OF THE EXEMPTION, PARTICULARLY THE LAMBERT EXEMPTION.

>> Braude: WHEN YOU WERE ON MY TELEVISION SHOW HERE, RIGHT AFTER YOU DECLARED YOUR CANDIDACY, AND I ASKED YOU A SECOND TIME IF YOU WOULD LEAD THE CHARGE ON THAT ISSUE, AND YOUR WORDS VERBATIM WERE "I'LL LEAD THE CONVERSATION."

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> Braude: WHAT IS TO CONVERSE ABOUT?

EITHER MUN SOMEONE IS FOR TRANSPARENCY OR NOT.

>> I WANT TO ADVANCE POLICY THAT IS NOT JUST ABOUT MY VIEW, BUT ABOUT THE VIEW OF THE COLLECTIVE.

WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE TRANSPARENCY, LET'S GO BACK TO THE SECRETARY OF THE STATE'S OFFICE.

COMMONWEALTH MAGAZINE HAS ACTUALLY TWICE ASKED ABOUT THE DIVERSITY OF THIS OFFICE.

IT IS THE LEAST OF CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS.

TO HAVE THE CHIEF DEMOCRACY OFFICE HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS HERE BEEN THE LEAST DIVERSE, THE LEAST REPRESENTATIVE OF THE PEOPLE IS A DEEP CONCERN.

AND THE FACT THAT THE DATA IS NOT AVAILABLE, IS NOT TRANSPARENT, NO ONE KNOWS -- >> Braude: LET'S ASK -- ARE YOU WILLING TO MAKE THAT AVAILABLE TOMORROW?

>> SURE.

>> Braude: HOW DO YOU RESPOND TO HER CHARGES?

>> IT IS A MISSTATEMENT.

WE HAVE TRIED TO BE AS DIVERSE AS POSSIBLE.

I'VE HAD EMPLOYEES OF COLOR FROM THE VERY BEGINNING.

WE ABSORB OTHER RESPONSIBILITIES OF EMPLOYEES THAT WERE THERE THAT I DID NOT HIRE THAT WERE UNIONIZED AND WERE PROTECTED.

SO MY INFLUENCE WAS VERY LIMITED.

I HAVE WORKED HARD.

MY COMMITMENT TO DIVERSITY AND REPRESENTATION WAS FROM THE BEGINNING OF MY YEAR.

THE VERY FIRST THING I DID WHEN I GOT ELECTED WAS TO PURSUE REPRESENTATION FOR THE MINORITY COMMUNITIES.

MY ALLIES WERE PEOPLE IN THE MINORITY COMMUNITIES.

WE FOUGHT THAT BATTLE AND LOST IT, BUT ULTIMATELY WE WON IT BECAUSE OF THE LEGISLATION I PASSED THAT ALLOWED TO DISTRICT REPRESENTATION FOR MINORITY COMMUNITIES FOR THE FIRST TIME.

THERE IS NO QUESTION OF MY COMMITMENT TO DWIEFERS DIVERSITY -- >> THERE IS -- >> THERE IS.

>> Braude: YOU CAN FINISH YOUR THOUGHT.

>> I HAVE WORKED VERY HARD FOR THAT.

ONE OF THE GREATEST CHALLENGES I HAVE IRRESPECTIVE OF RACE IS CHANGING BUREAUCRACIES.

IT IS VERY HARD TO GET BUREAUCRACIES TO DO WHAT YOU NEED THEM TO DO.

>> Braude: SO WHY SHOULDN'T THERE BE A NEW VOICE?

>> I WANT TO SPEAK TO THE FACT THAT THE MOST IMPORTANT ISSUE IS WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN IN 2024.

ALL OF THE OTHER THINGS WE CARE ABOUT ARE AFFECTED BY THE OUTCOME OF THAT ELECTION.

WE KNOW THAT.

IF WE'RE GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT, WE HAVE TO HAVE SOMEBODY THERE WHO UNDERSTANDS IN GREAT DETAIL THE OPERATIONS OF ELECTIONS, AND I DO.

I HAVE CALLED OUT TRUMP BEFORE SUCCESSFULLY, AND THE DENIERS, THOSE WHO SOUGHT TO CONTROL ELECTIONS AND LIMIT PARTICIPATION.

I WANT TO DO THAT IN 2024.

I WANT TO BE THERE FOR THAT RACE BECAUSE I THINK THE FUTURE OF OUR COUNTRY IS HERE.

>> Braude: IT SAYS YOU CAN'T HOLD FEDERAL OFFICE IF YOU ENGAGED IN INSURRECTION.

A LOCAL GROUP REACHED OUT THAT SAID THERE IS NO CONSTITUTIONAL REQUIREMENT THAT THE COURT ADJUDICATE THAT ISSUE, AND THAT YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO DECLARE DONALD TRUMP INELIGIBLE FOR THE ELECTION IN 2024 -- WOULD YOU DO THAT?

>> IF HE WAS CRIMINALLY HELD.

I SURELY WOULD DO IT, CERTAINLY FOR THE PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY, WHICH IS THE ONE AREA I WOULD HAVE JURISDICTION.

>> Braude: IS HE RIGHT OR WRONG ABOUT HIS POWER?

>> ACTUALLY, HE IS WRONG.

THE FIRST QUESTION WILL COME TO THE STATE.

THE QUESTION WILL BE FOR THE SECRETARY: WILL YOU ALLOW DONALD TRUMP TO BE ON THE BALLOT?

MY ANSWER IS NO.

THAT WILL VERY LIKELY BE CHALLENGED IN COURT.

IT WILL BE CHALLENGED.

IT WILL LIKELY GO TO THE SUPREME COURT.

BUT I BELIEVE IT IS IMPORTANT FOR US TO DO WHAT IS RIGHT IN THE INTEREST OF OUR DEMOCRACY AND LET IT GO TO COURT.

>> Braude: 10 SECONDS LEFT.

>> AT THE END OF THE DAY, WHAT WE NEED IN THIS MOMENT IS A SECRETARY OF STATE WHO IS NOT GOING TO SIT BACK AND WAIT FOR OTHERS TO TAKE ACTION.

BUT IS GOING TO, IN HER OWN VOLITION, TAKE THE ACTION NECESSARY TO INCREASE VOTER PARTICIPATION, WE'RE TACKLING ECONOMIC INEQUALITY, AND WE'RE ENSURING WE HAVE A TRANSPARENT GOVERNMENT.

>> Braude: WE'RE OUT OF HAND.

I WANT TO THANK YOU BOTH FOR YOUR PARTICIPATION TONIGHT.

I REALLY APPRECIATE IT.

THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT AND FOR OUR PRIMARY DEBATE SERIES.

YOU CAN FIND ALL OF OUR DEBATE SERIES ON youtube.com/gbh-news YOUTUBE.COM/GBH-NEWS.

WE CONTINUE IN THE NEXT WEEK, AND I WOULD WATCH IT OR LISTEN IN.

PRIMARY ELECTION DAY IS SEPTEMBER 6th, AND YOU CAN VOTE IN PERSON THE DAY OF, AND IF YOU WANT TO VOTE BY MAIL, YOU TECHNICALLY HAVE UNTIL 5:00 P.M.

BUT I WOULD SUGGEST GETTING IT DONE ASAP.

THERE IS MORE INFORMATION sec.state.ma.us/ele.

NO MATTER HOW YOU DO IT, BE SURE TO VOTE.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR WATCHING.

GLOONLT.

♪♪ GOOD