Democratic congresswoman Haley Stevens is on deck on OTR.

As the Republican attacks o the Democratic ticket continue?

And she responds.

J.D.

Vance makes his third stop in Michigan since being nominated for VP on the GOP ticket Around the OTR table this week, Kyle Melinn, Beth LeBlanc and Rick Albin.

Sit in with us as we get the inside out.

Off the record.

Production of Off the Record is made possible, in part by Martin Waymire, a full service strategic communications agency, partnering with clients through public relations, digital marketing and public policy engagement.

Learn more at Martinwaymire.com And now this edition of Off the Record with Tim Skubick.

Thank you very much.

Welcome back to Studio C as the politics is gettin more interesting by the day, Mr. Albin you had a one on one with JD Vance.

I did.

First time that I had met him, I think in a more formal circumstance and talked to him for a few minutes and you know, he is a young new face in politics and he, he seems very dedicated to his beliefs.

And I think that he's kind of an interesting addition to that ticket.

Well, more importantly did you get a story out of it?

I think so.

And I think that we'll be the judge of that.

Yeah, right.

I think the story is and the thing I really wanted to know about is, look, we're in this environment where the political rhetoric and the vitriol has I mean, I've followed this for a long time as you have as all of you have.

But I mean, it's just to a point where it just it wears people out.

I wake up every morning and think, here we go again.

And I'm like, what?

You know, I ask him, you know, how do you how do you do this and not be ugly to the other side?

And I thought he had a pretty good answer.

But, you know, then again, you go back out on the on the stage and then you start attacking the other side.

I get it.

It's part of it.

It's not like I'm naive, but it it is a little exhausting sometimes.

Well, it was a nice get for you.

Look at it three times.

Within a couple of weeks, we'v seen Vance one more trip here.

He'll have to pay the nonresident income tax.

Yeah, I think he's just.

I think he's just trying to smooth things over for the Wolverines and the Spartans being from Ohio.

But I'm just kind of impressed that he spent time with the local reporters.

We don't really see that much.

And I know that the folks at home probably don't really realize that.

But the local media just in general does not have a lot of opportunities to speak one on one with national figures.

And in fact, the Kamala Harris and Walz campaign, we haven't had a chance to even ask them questions yet, let alone have a sit down one on one interview so you can make that what you will.

I mean, maybe they feel like J.D.

Vance is good enough on his feet and can relate.

Maybe they feel like they need the the free media.

You know, maybe they feel like they're at that stage of the campaign where they feel like the best strategy is to get in front of as many TVs as possible.

Whereas it's all for the most part it's choreographed and canned.

I hate to say it, but that's the way it is for many of these national campaigns.

So I'm just impressed he talked to you.

Well, in addition, when you want it when you want to talk to Mr. Biden, I've had reporters tell me they want the questions in advance.

They absolutely do.

Which is unheard of.

Do we get questions in advance, Beth?

No, we don't.

You know, I think often.

So you don't get to talk to the president.

Exactly.

You forego those types of interviews.

But, you know, I think also what they've done with this is they've created a talking point that didn't exist before.

Right.

So there there it's gone away from some of the issues, although they're still focused on on issues as well.

But it's created another kind of wedge between these two campaigns, one that is answering questions for local reporters, one that is not.

So I think it's it's up to the Harris-Walz campaign to remedy that They're the only ones who can.

Well, is that a problem?

Does the general public go home at night and sit around the table?

And so, you know, poor Rick Albin couldn' get an interview with X,Y or Z. I get that a lot.

Oh, poor Rick Albin.

you know, I think you're exactly right, because I think that that kind of access and Kyle, as you pointed out, it's not like people at home really get it.

And that was the point you were making too.

But here's what happens when you talk to a local reporter, a good deal of that interview.

In my case, all of that interview will be on television and it will be on television multiple times.

And it has to do with Michigan.

Yeah, that's right.

And if I go and cover an event I cover it toda and I forget about it, I'm done.

So, I mean, I think there's a longer lasting impact from an interview that you do with some of us event and I mean and equally surprising to me was and I don't remember when it was it was obviously prior to the convention, but Donald Trump made a really quick stop in Grand Rapids an I got like 3 minutes with him.

So I don't know if this is part of the campaign strategy, if they're going to put their principles out to talk to locals or not.

Well, the subtext to this story is if you're not talking to the media, what do you got to hide?

Well, that's the thing.

There's a secrecy thing here.

Also.

Look, there isn't very many independents out there, and most people have already pledge allegiance to the red or the blue.

But for those peopl who haven't made up their mind, what are they considering?

What are they thinking about?

And to be open to answering questions, to be available on the news, to at least get your face out there and to talk one on one with somebody like Rick, I think does connect with people.

I personally I do.

And maybe I'm a journalist and I'm biased, but it just feels like for for independent undecided voters, they want to hear as much from you as possible.

And if they feel like you're hiding or you're not making yourself available, that you're behind this glass shield, are you really accessible and like you said what do you have to hide?

Well, you go back first of all, if they do give you access, they give you two or three questions.

I remember when George Bush was running the junior.

Okay, came into East Lansing.

Johnny Truscott was doing PR for him.

Skubick you want to talk to him?

You get two questions.

It's two questions hardly worth showing up.

I said, Yeah, I'm in.

I'm in.

So I go in the room at the Kellogg Center, sit down with him.

I do my two questions and I'm ready to wrap it up.

And he says, Go ahead, ask me some more.

We did 20 minutes and at the end of it he said, I said, Why did you do that?

You broke the rules and all the guys in the back of the room go, Oh my God, he's going to do more than two questions.

So why did you do that?

He says, Because you were asking me stuff that nobody is asked.

You didn't ask about the horse race.

And he said, Why don't you al come down to Texas and see me?

And I said, No, talk to John Engler, you don't want me in your ranch.

And but that said, so I went home and told my wife, This guy's going to win.

He was loose.

He reacted and that kind of stuff we just don't see, right?

The packaged politicia is not something that we like.

American Seating is a big outfit in Grand Rapids.

And when he was Vice president, Joe Biden came to American Seating and spoke.

We got an interview with him afterwards.

And it's almost the same kind of thing I did my exact time.

I cut it off and stop.

Play by the rules.

And then he stood there and talked with me and one And Sam, one of his advisors that was handling for another 20 minutes.

And that's a rare thing that you see that you have that that kind of time or that kind of access and, and it rarely exists.

It just says something about the candidates, if they're willing to do that, don't you think?

Yeah.

And I think, you know, it's true that there are few independents, but in Michigan, the independents are the ones who who swing elections.

And so if you can do anything t get yourself in, in more print or in front of the camera more often in speaking directl to those independents, I mean, why wouldn't you take that opportunity?

There's a certain amount of risk because you don't know what we're going to ask.

Yeah, but nobody's ever lost an electio because they gave an interview.

Right?

Well, and I don't think.

And most of these politicians, when you've gotten to the level as a J.D.

Vance or Walz or a Kamala Harris, you should kno how to answer a question by now.

Anyway.

It's not like you're a babe in the woods.

It's not like you're a first time county commission candidate and you are handcuffed by a question.

I mean, you should be able to know how to spin out of a question by no if you don't want to answer it.

I think it's more about access being available and making it feel like you have some kind of connection with people.

All right.

Well, Jim Blanchard, former governor, was on the program last wee and he suggested on the program that Donald Trum had three personality disorders.

Well, of course, the job of a journalist is go to the other side.

So I went to the Trump campaign in Michigan and said, give me somebody to respond to this.

Okay?

So they gave me none other than Tudor Dixon.

Here's her response to what Mr. Blanchard said.

Did you believ him when he said the president, former president has personality disorders?

No, I think that's to my point.

That is the lowest possible attack you can go t if you can't talk about policy.

And so I don't think that he is able to talk about what's going on with Kamala Harris, his campaign.

To be fair here, I do need to ask you, do you believe Mr. Trump is a narcissist?

No, I don't think so.

I think, too he made his point himself.

Actually, Governor Blanchard made that point by saying this is someone who has to go out there and be loved.

There's no one in Donald Trump's position that it takes more attacks and no one who takes them as gracefully as he does.

And so if you are a true narcissist, you could never do what Donald Trump does every day.

You couldn't handle the attacks that he goes through.

Is he a sociopath?

Absolutely not.

He is someone who loves his country.

Like I said, these are the weakest possible attacks to go after him for he is someone who puts himself on the line every single day for other people.

A sociopath doesn't d that, doesn't put himself aside.

And is he a pathological liar?

He is not a pathological liar.

He's done more things for this country than any other presiden has done in the past 20 years.

So what do you think, Mr. Melinn?

That was.

Fantastic.

What great video.

But I think it jus kind of proved my point, though.

I mean, politicians like Tudor Dixon who admittedly, is now got a television show.

So she does media for a living.

Can can basically talk them talk their way out of a pointed question like that.

Is he a narcissist?

You know, doe he have personality disorders?

I mean, those are some pretty pointed questions.

And just to be able to deflect and to give the other side of an issue I think is important.

Well, go ahead.

Rick.

And that interview may b why they don't do local press, right?

Well, you know, they're only tough questions.

Only tough answers.

Also was part of that interview she also disclosed that she has not ruled out running for governor.

You were just absolutely shocked by that.

Right.

Right.

I don't know who's running for governor.

She's running for governor, Rick.

Well, she she may well, but I mean, I don't know tha she gets the nomination again.

Oh, no, nobody's going to hand it to her.

Rinke is going to get in again and Perry Johnson is going in again.

What do you think?

I think she didn't do great last time, but I don't know how she'd do against somebody who isn't.

Even though she lost by ten points.

Do we not concede that she actually in a couple of those debates, she took on the governor pretty well or did I misread that?

I thought she did very well in the debate that we held.

But it was almost 11 points, wasn't it.

Well, who's counting?

Well, I mean the numbers make a difference.

I mean, maybe five or six points of that was the abortion issu that was also on the ballot.

But I mean, that that was not a the kind of performance that says, hey, let's go do that again.

Yeah.

You know, I think the question is, can she get support?

I mean, that's that's the thing with all these candidates, you know, people running for governor, do you have support behind you, financial support?

Do you have ground troops?

You have people willin to go to the wall and say, yeah, I want you to run for governor and I've got all my friends.

And now you've got people in local communities.

Does she have that?

I don't know.

I mean, she had an admittedly, she had a pretty surface level campaign last time because everybody was kind of shallow because they all thought it was going to be James Craig at the end.

So, you know, it.

Could she do it again?

Yeah, I'm sure she would do it again, but she'd have to run a very different campaign.

Well, this is why she wants Mr. Trump in the White House.

Part of the reason.

You know, may be, yeah, to have his support from the very beginning and have his ground troops.

Yeah.

All right.

Let's go to our guest who is with us today from Oakland County.

I assume our congresswoman.

Nice to see you agai and welcome to Off the Record.

Let's let's cut to the chase.

There's a great debate going on about the EVs.

And you have some close contact with the auto industry.

Is it time for the Biden administration to roll back some of these restrictions and kind of back off?

Well, let's be clear.

The auto industry are GM, Ford, Stellantis.

They are pushing to compete on the global playing field, particularly in this grand competition that we are in with China.

And they want to make sure that we have the production capacity to produce electric vehicles.

And we know that it's not a a linear trajectory to full adoption here in th United States of of of America.

But we want to be best positioned when we're selling into global marketplaces.

So I stand by my vote for the inflation Reduction Act, the largest clean energy bill in history.

We had Jennifer Granholm, former governor, now Secretary of energy, Jennifer Granholm here just a handful of days ago, meeting with some of our building trade unions and boasting that we have no 42 new clean energy facilities in just the state of Michigan alone as a result of some of the legislative action that the Biden-Harris administration has taken.

So you don't think Miss Harris needs to revise that and dial back the EV standards?

Everything's good the way it is?

Well, I certainly think that we continue to take our cues from that hardworking people in the auto industry and the automakers themselves.

If I personally sat down with Mr. Jim Farley, who he and his team are working around the clock on this China competition consideration and the profitability of Ford and they have never spoken to me about standards being a challenge for them.

But I will say that we do know that we've got longstanding issues with states acting in different ways.

California comes to mind where they put in carbon emission standards that don't match the rest of the country, and that really hurts the auto industry.

What we know we need is certainty, which is why when we passed the renegotiation of NAFTA a handful of years ago, bipartisan action actually signed by President Trump, plus that buy American content, really great step that we were taking as this mobility revolution was underway.

We needed to give the auto industry certainty.

And it is actually about that.

And so I know sometimes people particularly use political talking points like the government is shoving electric vehicles down our throats.

We're just preparing for the futur and working alongside industry.

Rewind to two years ago, it was the auto industry and environmental groups that said they wanted the Inflation Reduction Act.

Beth.

I guess.

Do you feel lik there's certainty in the market right now?

I mean, we've heard from a lot of auto companies who feel they're, or that the adoption of EV vehicles is not going as quickly as they expected.

There are projects that have been scaled back in Michigan alone.

Do you feel like what's been done has given stability to the auto market?

Yes, absolutely Not very clear on the question that you're asking.

But I would just say that the investments are still going forward.

You see sales doubling.

We certainly don't see ourselves at a full tipping point in terms of rapid 100% adoption.

But we have seen the doubling of sales.

We got to get out of myopia.

Yeah, we've got to look globally.

You no have the Chinese Communist Party that does vertical integration of their supply chains.

They are flooding global markets with $10,000 EVs.

I would like to ask yo the question, do you want U.S. automakers to be able to sell into global markets or do you not want them to?

We are certainly not in the business of forcing anyone to do anything.

People are buying EVs because they want to buy EVs, period.

End of story.

We got out of the Great Recessio period that hit our auto rescue, in part because of a program called Cash for Clunkers that incentivized people to trade in their vehicles.

But we know in America we're the land of the fre and we're the home of the brave.

And so what we see with the auto industry, in particular with regard to new technologies, that frankly, we need to aggressively catch up on in terms of safety standards and in some of the challenges that we're facin with with adoption, we know that we need to have the competition, the cutting edge and we want to be the leaders.

We cannot fail to invest, which is what happened 10-15 years ago when we had a recovery Act.

We invested in battery technology.

We didn't carry through that technology.

It went over to China.

And now we're being dinged for trying to catch up.

We are dealing with large global companies that make and innovate here and sell globally.

That's what we need to be able to do.

To encourage United States competition.

Do you think it's time to look at more tariffs, a China, who, like you said, are giving us $10,000 electric vehicles?

Well, yes.

And that is something that President Biden did in May, is that he put into place tariffs on Chinese electric vehicles and minerals in particular.

And it was an aggressive action that was met with a lot of fanfare.

And I do think it was the right step.

Next term when I get back into Congress, we're going to be negotiating USMCA.

We're going to be reauthorizing it, which is the North American Trade Agreement.

And you better believ that Chinese electric vehicles are going to be a part of the conversation because they are seeking to get into Mexico, to produce in Mexico, and then use the the NAFT provisions to get into the U.S. We don't want to see that happen.

We've got to have a level playing field.

If you look at where we are, the almost the year 2025 quarter, 21st century mark, the next 25 years, it' this grand competition between the United States and Chin and how it's going to play out.

We've got free market, open capitalist democracy principles, rules based order that needs to be played by.

And so, yes, tariffs are a step in the right direction, but it's also coordinating and working with our allies, particularly the UK and Australia.

For instance, it' an agreement called AUKAS where we've got shared initiatives on technology development.

We can expand that to include minerals, we can bring Japan into that.

And then certainly with ou North American trading partners, we can also double down on th needs for some of those goods.

Minerals are the components that go with them, almost everything that is made.

Congresswoman, I want to circle back to Beth's question a little bit that you said you didn't quite understand.

I guess the question is and I appreciate.

Globally, I think she was ver clear on what she was asking me.

Well.

What I don't know exactly an I'm not going to speak for her.

What I'm asking is if you're investing in these car and if it's a global competition and if people in the United States aren't buying them, you said they've doubled in sales.

They're not buying, which I'm asking.

They don't They're growing and it's great.

We don't just have this one market share, you know, that we have many markets that we are selling in to.

GM sales in China are going down because of what they're doing in that marketplace.

So they're either going to be boxed out, making the cars of yesteryear or we're going to be making the cars of today, I think we need both.

I have done hundreds of visits with individual suppliers, manufacturers.

I'm an absolute expert in this field.

I'm honored to do this work alongside the economic drivers of our state.

I know where these guys are going.

But in terms of what you all are asking, we took legislation to meet the moment of where we needed to go.

I understand the proper questioning of forced hand forcing things down people's throats.

That's not what's happening here.

You can go to your dealer and still buy an ice.

I see this is being in iPhone 1.0, right?

We got, you know, first generation of these vehicles.

We'r working on the infrastructure, a clean economy, breathing clean air.

You know, I'm kicking off the dream cruise later today and then my own Woodward.

Two weeks ago, we had the clean cruise.

You had all the EV enthusiasts there.

These are good things.

I don't think we need to be afraid of the future or innovation.

Could we switch gears here?

Do you believe the commercial that says Elissa Slotkin gave money to Larry Nassar?

No.

Is it a lie?

Is it a lie?

That that is a that's a baldfaced lie and that's a manipulation of our legislative process.

And that is a deep insult to Elissa Slotkin and someone who's been very brave in terms of standing up to that corruption and that illegality, who's helped carry Michigan State through some of the horrors of the Nassar period.

And so I would I would fully reject that claim of that ad.

Did any convicts get any check from the federal government?

No, not that I'm aware of.

Congresswoman, what kind of reputation does U.S.

Senator J.D.

Vance have in Washington?

Well, he's been there a year so he doesn't really have a lot of legislative accomplishments or a big reputation.

You know, he seems to say one thing one da and another thing the next day.

So it's it's a little confusing to know who he really is.

I was really overwhelmed alongside so many people here in Southeast Michigan to see the return of Paul Whelen, someone who was taken captive by the Russian Federation at the end of 2018, falsely and wrongly in prison.

He's finally come home.

This was a long standing bipartisan effort through two presidentia administrations and trades.

J.D.

Vance his response today was to take shots.

And my response to him was some of us, like myself, who've been in Congress for five plus years, have actually been working on this.

And if he wanted to be involved or if he actually cared about Americans being wrongfully detained, he he could have been working on that rather than playing political games.

Representative, you heard a conversation about the need alleged need for Ms. Harris to speak to the news media.

Are we just just biased and self-serving?

Well, I can see wh you all want the interviews, and I certainly remain really enthusiastic about her campaign.

Does she need to talk?

Does she need to talk?

Does she need to talk to the local media?

Well, we we would certainly welcome that.

And I know that she's going to be spending a lot of time in Michigan.

And I know you all are great.

So, you know, let's let's do it.

I'm not I'm not an adviser, but I'm a supporter and I'm an endorser.

I'm a surrogate.

I'm happy to speak to her record, to all of you too.

Thank you for talking to us and thank you.

Appreciate it.

Have a good weekend at the cruise.

Also, our thanks to our great panel next week.

More off the record right here.

Production of Off the Record is made possible, in part, by Martin Waymire, a full service strategic communications agency, partnering with clients through public relations, digital marketing and public policy engagement.

Learn more at martinwaymire.com For more off the record, visit wkar.org Michigan Public television stations have contributed to the production costs of off the record.