>> BRAUDE: TONIGHT ON "GREATER BOSTON," U.S. ATTORNEY RACHAEL ROLLINS JOINS ME ON WHITE SUPREMACY IN OUR STREETS, AND IN GOVERNMENT.

PLUS, WHETHER SOMEONE UNDER 21 SHOULD EVER BE SENTENCED TO LIFE WITHOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF PAROLE AND MORE.

THEN, LATER, SPORTS BETTING IS ABOUT TO BECOME IN MASSACHUSETTS-- AND WHILE SOME ARE EXPECTING A BIG PAY-OFF FOR THE STATE-- OTHERS HAVE BIG CONCERNS ABOUT THE POSSIBLE RISKS INVOLVED.

RED SOX EXECUTIVE V.P.

DAVID FRIEDMAN AND MARLENE WARNER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE MASSACHUSETTS COUNCIL ON GAMING AND HEALTH, JOIN ME.

♪♪ >> BRAUDE: WHEN RACHAEL ROLLINS WAS SWORN IN AS U.S. ATTORNEY FOR MASSACHUSETTS, SHE LAID OUT HER PRIORITIES FOR THE OFFICE, INCLUDING EQUITY, SYSTEMIC CRIMINAL JUSTICE REFORM AND COMBATING HATE.

AND UNFORTUNATELY, SHE'S HAD A LOT TO WORK ON, IN ALL THOSE AREAS.

FROM THE INVESTIGATION SHE'S LAUNCHED INTO RACIST INCIDENTS WITHIN THE EVERETT CITY GOVERNMENT-- WHICH WE'VE TALKED ABOUT ON THIS SHOW-- TO THE MULTIPLE EXTREMIST GROUPS THAT HAVE BEEN HOLDING DEMONSTRATIONS IN THE REGION.

LIKE THE WHITE SUPREMACIST GROUP NSC-131, WHICH TARGETED A DRAG QUEEN STORY HOUR CHILDREN'S READING EVENT IN JAMAICA PLAIN A LITTLE OVER A WEEK AGO.

ANOTHER WHITE SUPREMACIST GROUP, THE PATRIOT FRONT MARCHING THROUGH BOSTON, ACCUSED OF ASSAULTING A COUNTER-PROTESTER LAST MONTH.

THE NSC-131 PROTEST AT THE SAINT PATRICK'S DAY PARADE IN MARCH AND THE NEO-NAZI PROTEST AT BRIGHAM AND WOMEN'S HOSPITAL IN FEBRUARY.

IN RESPONSE, ROLLINS HAS SAID SAYS SHE WANTS LAW ENFORCEMENT TO BE PROACTIVE RATHER THAN REACTIVE, AND APPEARS TO HAVE TAKEN A STEP IN THAT DIRECTION TODAY WITH THE LAUNCH OF AN "END HATE" HOTLINE.

U.S. ATTORNEY RACHAEL ROLLINS JOINS ME.

>> Braude: U.S. ATTORNEY, IT IS GOOD TO SEE YOU.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> OF COURSE.

>> Braude: I ASSUME THIS HOT LINE IS EXACTLY THE KIND OF THING YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT WHEN YOU USED THE WORD "PROACTIVE."

HOW DOES IT WORK?

>> WHAT HAPPENS, JIM, WE START SAYING OUT LOUD 1-83-END-H8, AND MAKING SURE THAT IS SOMETHING I'M SAYING A LOT WHEN I'M SPEAKING IN THE COMMUNITY OR WITH MEMBERS OF THE MEDIA, AND THEN PEOPLE HAVE TO CALL.

AND WE WILL BE NOTIFIED.

I PERSONALLY WILL GET A NOTIFICATION WHEN SOMEBODY LEAVES A VOICEMAIL MESSAGE, AND WE'RE GOING TO FIELD THAT INFORMATION OUT TO THE APPROPRIATE ENTITIES AS WE SEEK IT.

>> Braude: BY THE WAY, IT'S ON THE SCREEN NOW.

WE'LL PUT IT UP AT THE END OF THE SEGMENT AS WELL.

WHAT ELSE?

YOU'VE CREATED SOME SORT OF UNIT OR EXPANDED A UNIT, FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, THAT WILL ADDRESS THESE ISSUES AS SWELL.

WHAT IS THAT?

>> WE'VE HAD EXCEPTIONAL ATTORNEYS WORKING ON HATE CRIMES, AND HUMAN TRAFFICKING ISSUES, EXCESSIVE FORCE ALLEGATIONS AGAINST LAW ENFORCEMENT, BUT THEY'VE DONE THAT IN ADDITION TO THE WORK THEY'VE DONE FOR OTHER UNITS.

WHAT WE'VE DONE IS MAKE SURE THIS REALLY IMPORTANT WORK GETS A UNIT OF IT'S OWN.

NOBODY IS SPLITTING THEIR TIME BETWEEN NARCOTICS AND MONEY LAUNDERING AND PROSECUTING HATE CRIMES, OR OTHER UNITS WE HAVE.

SO WE HAVE A DEDICATED UNIT WITH EXCEPTIONAL AUSAs AND EXCEPTIONAL STAFF THAT WILL BE WORKING EXCLUSIVELY ON THESE TYPES OF CASES.

>> Braude: I WANT TO PLAY SOME SOUND FROM YOU TO YOU, THIS IS YOU SPEAKING AFTER THIS LAW ENFORCEMENT LISTENING SESSION, AFTER THE PATRIOT FRONT MARCH THAT I JUST MENTIONED.

HERE IT IS.

>> WE HAD A LOT OF POINTED QUESTIONS, AND WE SHOULD, AS TO IF THIS WERE A BLACK LIVES MATTER PROTEST, WOULD THE RESPONSES HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT THAN THIS WHITE SUPREMACIST GROUP?

>> Braude: YOU ASKED THAT QUESTION A MONTH AGO.

DO YOU HAVE AN ANSWER YET?

>> I BELIEVE THAT MAYOR WOO HAS INDICATED HERSELF THAT SHE DOES NOT BELIEVE THE RESPONSE WAS ADEQUATE FOR B.P.D -- AND, LISTEN, JIM, I'M OFTEN THE ONLY WOMAN IN THE ROOM WHEN I'M MEETING WITH LEADERS AND LAW ENFORCEMENT, AND OFTENTIMES, SADLY, THE ONLY PERSON OF COLOR IN THE ROOM.

AND I WILL ASK THESE HARD QUESTIONS.

LOOK, I THINK THAT WHAT WE NEED IS A MORE PROACTIVE RESPONSE, AND I THINK MAYOR WOO HAS INDICATED THAT THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN IN THE FUTURE MOVING FORWARD.

>> Braude: BUT YOU JUST -- YOUR RESPONSE TO THE U.S. ATTORNEY IS THAT MAYOR WOO CONCLUDED IT WASN'T ADEQUATE.

NOT BEING ADEQUATE IS NOT THE SAME AS SAYING IT WOULD HAVE BEEN HANDLED DIFFERENTLY IF THEY HAD BEEN BLACK DEMONSTRATORS RATHER THAN WHITE DEMONSTRATORS.

THAT IS THE QUESTION THAT YOU BROACHED.

WOULD IT HAVE BEEN HANDLED DIFFERENTLY?

>> I THINK LAW ENFORCEMENT, WHEN ASKED, SAID NO, IT WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN.

THEY WERE CONCERNED ABOUT LOOKING AS IF THEY WERE ESCORTING THIS THIS GROUP THROUGH THE CITY, AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE INCIDENT PARTICULARLY ON JULY 4th.

WE NEED LAW ENFORCEMENT THAT REFLECTS THE COMMUNITIES THAT IT PROTECTS AND SERVES.

AND WHAT WE ARE DOING, AND I'M A MEMBER OF LAW ENFORCEMENT, JIM, WE'RE MAKING SURE WE HAVE A BETTER RESPONSE THERE.

I'M NOT LOOKING BACKWARDS AND CASTING BLAME, BUT WHAT I AM DOING IS MAKING SURE MOVING FORWARD WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A DIFFERENT RESPONSE.

>> Braude: I WANT TO GO TO RACISM IN THE STREETS TO RACISM IN CITY HALL.

YOU ANNOUNCED YOU'RE DOING AN INVESTIGATION INTO POSSIBLE CIVIL RIGHTS VIOLATIONS IN EVERETT.

A CITY COUNCILOR USED THE "N" WORD, AND HE RESIGNED, AND A CITY STAFF PERSON IN A CONVERSATION WITH HIM TALKED ABOUT BRINGING ONE OF YOUR DARK FRIENDS TO AN EVENT.

WHAT IS THE STATUS OF THAT INVESTIGATION?

>> SO WE HAVE TWO INVESTIGATIONS, JIM, ACTUALLY, IN THE CITY SINCE I'VE BECOME THE U.S. ATTORNEY.

WE HAVE THE EVERETT INVESTIGATION WHERE WE WROTE A LETTER SAYING WE ARE INQUIRING, AND WE WANT INFORMATION.

I WANT TO BE CLEAR THAT THE MAYOR OF EVERETT AND THIS TEAM HAS RESPONDED IMMEDIATELY AND SAID THEY WILL ASSIST.

WE'RE NOT GETTING RESISTANCE FROM THE CITY OF EVERETT.

WE'RE IN THE PROCESS OF LOOKING THROUGH THAT INFORMATION.

I CAN TELL YOU WHY I SENT THAT LETTER IS BECAUSE OF THE INFORMATION YOU MENTIONED, AND THE FACT THAT, FOR EXAMPLE, EVERETT IS A MAJORITY/MINORITY CITY, BUT UNFORTUNATELY HAS, I THINK, APPROXIMATELY 2% OF ITS CITY EMPLOYEES MAKE UP PEOPLE OF COLOR, PARTICULARLY BLACK AND LATINX INDIVIDUALS.

THOSE NUMBERS DON'T AUTOMATICALLY STATE THERE IS DISCRIMINATION, BUT THEY DO RAISE A QUESTION AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THESE DECISIONS MADE BY THE CITY ARE HELPFUL TO ALL OF THE RESIDENTS OF EVERETT OR ARE POTENTIALLY DISCRIMINATORY.

WE HAVE MADE NO DETERMINATION.

AND THE OTHER INQUIRY, GENTLEWOMAN,JIM, IS INTO QUINCY.

>> Braude: WE'LL GET TO QUINCY IN A MINUTE.

YOU SAID THAT THE MAYOR IS COOPERATING, AND AS A LAY PERSON EARLY ON I WOULD SAY HE WAS DOING THE OPPOSITE.

HE WAS DEFENDING HIS COUSIN, THE CITY COUNCILOR, WHO WAS USING THE "N" WORD, UNTIL HE WASN'T DEFENDING HIM.

IT SEEMS TO ME IN A COMMENT HE MADE TO OUR COLLEAGUE, LIZ NEISLOSS AND A COUPLE OTHER REPORTERS, HE IS ESSENTIALLY ADMITTING IT DOESN'T STOP WITH THAT FORMER EMPLOYEE OF HIS AND THE COUNSELOR.

HERE IS MAYOR DEMARIA.

>> WE ARE INVESTIGATING ALL SOCIAL MEDIA PAGES.

I WANT PEOPLE TO UPPEDZ WE'REUNDERSTAND THAT WE'RE TAKING THIS VERY SERIOUS.

WE DON'T CONDONE THIS TYPE OF BEHAVIOR.

>> WHAT I CAN SAY IS WE'RE LOOKING INTO -- MY LETTER WAS SENT AFTER THE INDIVIDUAL STEPPED DOWN.

>> Braude: UH-HUH.

>> WITH OUTRAGE OR REACTION, QUITE FRANKLY, FROM THE PEOPLE OF EVERETT.

WHAT WE'RE DOING IS LOOKING AT WHO THE MAYOR HAS IN HIS DIRECT CONTROL, SPECIFICALLY WITH RESPECT TO HIRING DECISIONS, APPOINTMENTS THAT HE IS MAKING.

HIS COUSIN, WHO WAS ON THE CITY COUNCIL AS WELL, JIM, DID SAY, IN, I BELIEVE -- OVER SOCIAL MEDIA, THAT OTHER PEOPLE ALSO HAVE ESPOUSED THESE TYPES OF BELIEFS OR IDEOLOGIES AND USED THESE WORDS.

SO WE'RE LOOKING INTO ALL OF THAT, YES.

>> Braude: I WANT TO ASK YOU THE SAME QUESTION I ASKED YOU THE LAST MONTH OR THE MONTH BEFORE.

USING YOUR WORD "OUTRAGE," I'M OUTRAGED THAT EVERY POLITICIAN WHO CAN GET TO A MICROPHONE IS WILLING TO CALL OUT WHITE SUPREMACIST ON THE STREET.

UNLESS I MISSED IT, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE ATTORNEY GENERAL, WHEN WE ASKED HER ON THE RADIO, SAYING THAT THAT COUNCILOR SHOULD RESIGN IMMEDIATELY, AND YOU BEGINNING AN INVESTIGATION.

CAN YOU LIST FOR ME THE OTHER PUBLIC OFFICIALS WHO SAY THEY'RE APPALLED THAT COUNCILORS ARE USING THE "N" WORD, THAT A MAYOR UP FRONT IS CONDONING IT?

IS ANYBODY ELSE TALKING ABOUT THIS?

>> I HAVE NOT SEEN IT IS.

I WANT TO COMMEND OUR ATTORNEY GENERAL FOR DOING SO AND COMMEND THE MEDIA FOR WRITING ABOUT IT.

NOT JUST LOCAL MEDIA IN EVERETT, BUT ALSO "THE BOSTON GLOBE" AND OTHER PUBLICATIONS.

AND THAT, QUITE FRANKLY, JIM, IS HOW THAT CAME TO MY ATTENTION.

SO THE MEDIA'S WORK IS IMPORTANT IN LETTING ALL COMMUNITIES KNOW WHAT IT IS THAT IS HAPPENING THERE.

>> Braude: WON'T YOU LIKE TO HEAR A FEW MORE ELECTED OFFICIALS SOUNDING OFF ABOUT THIS THING?

>> I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR A FEW MORE PEOPLE, WHETHER ELECTED OR NOT, TAKING NOTICE OF THE FACT THAT, YOU KNOW, WHEN INDIVIDUALS THAT ARE LEADERS IN COMMUNITY HAVE THESE REALLY REPUGNANT BELIEFS, IT IS A PROBLEM.

>> Braude: OKAY.

SO YOU MENTIONED OTHER CIVIL RIGHTS INVESTIGATION YOU'RE DOING IN QUINCY, THIS IS AROUND WHETHER OR NOT THERE IS DISCRIMINATION AGAINST PEOPLE WITH ADDICTION BECAUSE OF THEIR OPPOSITION OF THE RECONSTRUCTION OF THE LONG ISLAND BRIDGE, WHICH -- SINCE YOU STARTED THAT INVESTIGATION, I HOPE I HAVE THE TIMING RIGHT, THE STATE'S HIGHEST COURT HAS BASICALLY SAID THAT THE OBJECTION OF THE QUINCY CONSERVATION COMMISSION, IF I GOT IT RIGHT, IS OVERDONE, OR IS SUBSERVIENT TO THE DETERMINATION BY THE STATE THAT IT CAN GO AHEAD.

DOES THAT MOOT OUT YOUR INVESTIGATION?

BECAUSE ESSENTIALLY -- AND I SPOKE TO MAYOR WOO ABOUT THIS ON THE RADIO, TOO, WHILE THERE IS STILL PERMITTING TO GO, THAT OBSTACLE, AT LEAST AS OF THE MOMENT, FROM QUINCY DOESN'T EXIST ANYMORE.

AM I RIGHT?

>> YOU'RE RIGHT, THAT OBSTACLE DOES NOT EXIST.

BUT THERE ARE MULTIPLE THINGS THE CITY OF QUINCY DID.

AT OUR HIGHEST COURT AND OUR COMMONWEALTH, S.J.C.

FOUND AGAINST THE CITY OF QUINCY, A SUPERIOR COURT JUDGE ALSO HAD A RULING ABOUT A WEEK LATER.

SO THERE HAVE BEEN SOME FINDINGS THAT HAVE NOT SUPPORTED WHAT QUINCY HAS DONE, BUT WE CONTINUE LOOKING TO SEE WHETHER THERE ARE DECISIONS OVERALL -- AND THEY DID MANY THINGS, NOT JUST WITH RESPECT TO PERMITTING AND ALLEGATIONS OF ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES -- THEIR TRAFFIC ARGUMENTS THAT THEY MADE WE'RE VERY INTERESTED IN, BECAUSE I REMIND YOU AGAIN IF ANY OF YOU HAVE BEEN TO MARINA BAY, I WONDER IF THERE WERE TRAFFIC CONCERNS WHEN THEY WERE BUILDING MARINA BAY FOR THE BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE, AND NOW, ESSENTIALLY, WHEN WE THINK ABOUT WHO MIGHT BE USING THE LONG ISLAND BRIDGE, IT IS NOT NECESSARILY THE SAME COHORT THAT WILL BE GOING TO MARINA BAY OR THEIR YACHTS ON THE WEEKENDS.

>> Braude: EXCELLENT COMPARISON.

THE STATE'S HIGHEST COURT BASICALLY DEPUTIZED THIS SUPREME COURT JUDGE TO LOOK INTO THE NEURO SCIENCE AROUND YOUNG PEOPLE UNDER 21 COMMITTING CERTAIN CRIMES.

BEFORE HE LOOKED INTO IT, IF YOU'RE UNDER 18 IT WAS UNCONSTITUTIONAL TO SENTENCE YOU TO LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE.

THIS JUDGE ALMAN IS RECOMMENDING, BASED ON SOME ACTUAL CASES AND I GUESS HIS RESEARCH INTO NEURO SCIENCE THAT THE S.J.C.

AFFIRMED HIS DETERMINATION THAT IT SHOULD BE UNCONSTITUTIONAL TO AUTOMATICALLY SENTENCE SOMEONE 21 OR YOUNGER TO LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE.

THAT WAS AN ISSUE THAT YOU WERE ARGUING WHEN YOU WERE THE D.A.

OF SUFFOLK COUNTY.

CAN YOU -- I MEAN -- OBVIOUSLY YOU SUPPORT THIS THING.

CAN YOU GIVE US A MINUTE ON WHY THIS MAKES SENSE FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HAVE COMMITTED THE MOST SERIOUS OF CRIMES, MURDER.

>> FOR SURE.

THERE ARE TWO THINGS, JIM, THAT I SIGNED MYSELF, MY HAND, OR ELECTRONICALLY, AS THE ELECTED D.A.

OF SUFFOLK COUNTY.

THE SEAN ELLIS PLEADING AND THIS PLEADING WITH RESPECT TO ROBINSON, MATUS, AND WATT.

ESSENTIALLY WHAT WE'RE DOING IS THE UNITED STATES SUPREME COURT HAS FOUND IN THE OPINION OF MILLER, NOT THAT JUVENILE OR INDIVIDUALS UNDER 18 BEING SENTENCED TO DEATH IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL, BUT THERE HAS TO BE A SEPARATE HEARING BEFORE MAKING THAT DETERMINATION.

OUR STATE SUPREME JUDICIAL COURT WENT A STEP FURTHER AND SAID, NO, NO, NO, ANYONE UNDER 18 CANNOT GET LIFE WITHOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF PAROLE.

THEY HAVE TO HAVE THE POSSIBILITY OF PAROLE.

WHEN I WROTE OUR PLEADING IN FAVOR OF MOVING THAT AGE FORWARD, AND FOUR OF MY COLLEAGUES TRIED TO JUMP INTO THAT CASE, AND I SAID, NO, WE CAN HANDLE IT, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I BASICALLY SAID, LOOK, 18 TO 20-YEAR-OLDS ARE FAR MORE SIMILAR TO 16 AND 17-YEAR-OLDS THAN THEY ARE TO 21 AND 22.

WHAT JUDGE ALMAN DID WAS AGREE WITH ME AND SAY WE BELIEVE THERE SHOULD BE A SEPARATE MILLER HEARING IN FIRST-DEGREE MURDER CASES WHERE A JUDGE HAS TO DETERMINE WHETHER THEY GET LIFE WITHOUT OR LIFE WITH THE POSSIBILITY OF PAROLE.

>> Braude: SO IT WOULD NOT BE AUTOMATIC?

>> NOT AUTOMATIC.

>> Braude: I ONLY HAVE A MINUTE OR SO LEFT, I'M EMBARRASSED TO SAY I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS QUESTION, BUT I'M SURE YOU DO -- THE LAW ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL, WHICH YOU DEAL WITH, DOESN'T HAVE THIS RECOGNITION OF 18 TO 21-YEAR-OLDS, DOES IT?

>> NO.

>> Braude: SO WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU'RE IN A SITUATION, YOU'RE ABOUT TO HAVE YOUR DESIRE REALIZED BY THE S.J.C.

IN TERMS OF STATE MATTERS, WHERE UNDER 21 THIS PROCEDURAL ADDITION, EXTRA ATTENTION GIVEN TO PEOPLE 21 AND UNDER WHO BEFORE LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE IS A SENTENCE THAT DOESN'T APPLY ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL, SO YOU COULD BE INVOLVED IN A CASE WHERE A 19-YEAR-OLD IS SENTENCED TO LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE AUTOMATICALLY, AND YOU HAVE TO ADVANCE THAT CAUSE BECAUSE YOU WORK FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE IN FEDERAL CASES.

IS THAT NOT TROUBLING FOR YOU?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, IT IS -- THERE ARE DIFFERENT OBLIGATIONS, AS THE U.S. ATTORNEY THAN THEY ARE AS THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY OF SUFFOLK COUNTY.

I WILLINGLY TOOK THIS JOB.

AGE CAN BE A MITIGATING FACTOR, AND ESSENTIALLY WE ALWAYS LOOK AT MITIGATING AND AGGREGATING FACTORS -- OR AGGRAVATING FACTORS, I'M SORRY, WHEN WE MAKE OUR DETERMINATIONS.

YOU'RE RIGHT, IT IS A DIFFERENT STANDARD ON THE FEDERAL SIDE, AND MOST OFTEN THE MURDERS ARE HANDLED BY THE 11 DISOARCHESDISTRICTATTORNEYS, AND THEY'RE DOING A GOOD JOB.

>> Braude: I KNOW YOU'RE SICK OF THIS QUESTION, BECAUSE I AND MANY OTHERS ASKED YOU THIS WHEN YOU WERE UP FOR THE JOB, AND NOW YOU HAVE THE JOB, BUT IN 15 SECONDS, THAT'S HARD, IS IT NOT FOR YOU?

>> IT IS HARD.

>> Braude: IT IS HARD, RIGHT?

>> IT IS HARD, BUT, YOU KNOW WHAT, JIM?

I'M PROUD OF THE WORK WE DID IN THE D.A.

's OFFICE.

A LOT OF PEOPLE WILL BE IMPACTED BY THE DECISION I MADE AND THE BRIEF THAT I WROTE, AND WE'RE GOING TO BRING IT UP TO THE SUPREMES TO MAKE A DECISION -- OUR SUPREMES -- TO MAKE A DECISION.

THE JUDGE DECIDED THE LUCIENNE CASE AND THE ELLIS CASE AND NOW THIS CASE AS WELL.

>> Braude: THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

I APPRECIATE.

>> BRAUDE: RACHAEL ROLLINS, THANKS.

AGAIN, THE HOTLINE IS: 1-83-END-H8 -- THAT'S H-8.

NOW FOR MORE INFO, VISIT JUSTICE.GOV/USAO-MA.

MORE THAN FOUR YEARS AFTER THE SUPREME COURT HANDED AUTHORITY OVER SPORTS BETTING TO THE STATES, MASSACHUSETTS LAWMAKERS HAVE REACHED A DEAL TO LEGALIZE IT IN THIS STATE, BOTH VIRTUAL, AND IN PERSON.

WHILE THE EXACT WHEN AND WHERE IS STILL TBD, IN-PERSON BETTING, AT LEAST, COULD VERY WELL BE HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS BY THE SUPER BOWL.

AND WHILE LEGALIZED BETTING HAS PLENTY OF SUPPORTERS WHO VIEW THIS CHANGE AS A LONG-TIME COMING, INCLUDING GOVERNOR CHARLIE BAKER, NOT EVERYONE IS EMBRACING THE FINAL VERSION OF THIS BILL.

I'M JOINED BY DAVID FRIEDMAN, EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT OF LEGAL AND GOVERNMENT AFFAIRS AND CHIEF COMPLIANCE OFFICER FOR THE BOSTON RED SOX; AND MARLENE WARNER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE MASSACHUSETTS COUNCIL ON GAMING AND HEALTH.

>> Braude: WELCOME TO YOU BOTH.

GOOD TO SEE YOU YOU BOTH.

>> THANK YOU.

>> GREAT TO SEE YOU, JIM.

>> Braude: DAVID, STARTING WITH YOU, 10 YEARS AGO, THE COMMISSIONER OF BASEBALL, BUD SELIG, TESTIFIED BEFORE SOME BODY IN IN NEW JERSEY -- 10 YEARS LATER, NOT JUST THE RED SOX, EVERY PRO SPORTS TEAM IN TOWN IS A SUPPORTER OF THIS LEGISLATION.

WHAT HAPPENED?

DRAFT KINGS?

WHAT HAPPENED?

>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION, JIM, AND IT REALLY IS QUITE A TURN AROUND.

ONCE NBA COMMISSIONER ADAM SILVER CAME PUBLICLY TO THE CONCLUSION THERE IS ALREADY A LOT OF ILLEGAL SPORTS BETTING HAPPENING IN TOWN TODAY, ALL OF THE LEAGUES AND TEAMS REFLECTED ON THAT AND THOUGHT: AT THE END OF THE DAY, GIVEN HOW MUCH ILLEGAL ACTIVITY IS HAPPENING, IT MAKES SENSE TO TRY TO HAVE A LEGAL MARKET THAT IS REGULATED THAT PROTECTS CONSUMERS AND THE INTEGRITY OF THE GAME.

>> Braude: BUT IT IS A GROWTH STRATEGY, TOO?

AND THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT, RIGHT?

>> THE LEAGUES AND THE TEAM THINK THERE IS SOME FAN ENGAGEMENT THAT COULD BE A BENEFIT TO HAVING SPORTS BETTING LEGALIZED.

WE THINK THERE IS A PLACE WHERE THERE IS SOME OPPORTUNITY.

AND NOW IN THE PAST FOUR YEARS WHERE DIFFERENT STATES HAVE LEGALIZED SPORTS BETTING, WE'RE GETTING TO SEE HOW THAT PLAYS OUT.

>> Braude: MARL MARLENE, YOU JUST RAISE CONCERNS ABOUT THE POSSIBLE RISKS ABOUT GAMBLING AND ADDICTION.

THERE ARE A LOT OF SAFEGUARDS BUILT INTO THIS LEGISLATION.

DID THEY SATISFACTORY ADDRESS YOUR CONCERNS?

>> THEY DID AN EXCELLENT JOB, NOT UNLIKE THE 2011 EXPANDED GAMING ACT.

WE ARE A LEADER AMONG THE UNITED STATES, AND CERTAINLY IN SOME JURISDICTIONS OUTSIDE OF THE UNITED STATES.

I WOULD SAY THEY DID A REALLY NICE JOB.

THERE ARE A FEW AREAS WHERE WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME ADDITIONAL IMPROVEMENTS, BUT THE MASS GAMING WILL PUT THIS INTO REGULATIONS, AND THEY DID A NICE JOB, AND THEY CAN BE TRUSTED.

>> Braude: NO CREDIT CARDS, WHICH IS HUGE.

YOU CAN ONLY SPEND THE MONEY YOU HAVE -- >> AND NO CREDIT EXTENSION.

>> Braude: THAT'S GREAT.

I DIDN'T KNOW THAT.

YOU HAVE TO BE AT LEAST 21.

THERE ARE REGULATIONS AROUND ADS.

9% OF THE REVENUE GOES INTO PUBLIC HEALTH FUND TO ADDRESS YOUR KIND OF CONCERNS.

YOU SAID THEY COULD HAVE DONE MORE.

LIKE WHAT?

>> ONE OF THE THINGS YOU JUST TALKED ABOUT WAS ADVERTISING.

ONE OF THE THINGS WE KNOW IS A LOT OF THE COMPANIES THAT WILL VIE FOR A LICENSE HAVE JUST RECEIVED A LICENSE IN LICENSE IN ONTARIO.

SO ANYONE WHO IS WATCHING IS NOT BEING BOMBARDED WITH GAMBLING ADVERTISEMENTS AND REALLY PAYING ATTENTION.

THERE IS SOME LANGUAGE IN TERMS OF THE FOLKS THAT ARE GOING TO BE RECEIVING THOSE ADS.

IT SAYS NO ADS GOING TO PEOPLE ON THE SELF-EXCLUSION LIST.

WE WOULD LIKE TO MAKE SURE IT IS FOR ANYONE AT HIGH RISK.

>> Braude: DAVID, MY UNDERSTANDING -- AND PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG -- IT STARTS WITH THE THREE CASINOS.

AND THEN MOVES ONLINE.

THERE IS A STUDY IN PLACE WHERE KIOSKS, EVEN AT PLACES LIKE FENWAY, COULD ULTIMATELY HAPPEN.

IS THAT AN EQUATE RETAILING OF WHAT THIS LEGISLATION DOES?

>> THAT'S RIGHT, BUT THE STUDY DOESN'T AUTOMATICALLY DO ANYTHING.

THE LEGISLATURE WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK AND ALLOW FOR IN-PERSON SITES, LIKE KIOSKS.

>> Braude: I WANT TO REPEAT WHAT YOU SAID BACK TO YOU, TO BE CLEAR, EVEN IF THIS STUDY OR COMMISSIONER DECIDES KIOSKS WERE APPROPRIATE, AND, LET'S SAY, OBVIOUSLY RELEVANT TO YOUR LIFE, APPROPRIATE TO FENWAY, THEY NEED TO PASS ADDITIONAL LEGISLATION TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

THE LEGISLATION THAT THE LEGISLATURE JUST PASSED, THAT THE GOVERNOR STILL NEEDS TO SIGN IS FOR IT TO BE LAW, HAS A LICENSING PROCESS.

THERE ARE SPECIFIC LICENSES THAT ARE ALLOWED.

BUT THERE IS NO LICENSE ALLOWED UNDER THIS LEGISLATION FOR KIOSKS ANYWHERE.

THEY'LL BE AT THE CASINOS, NOT A KIOSK BUT IN-PERSON BETTING.

SO THE LEGISLATURE WOULD HAVE TO ADD PLACES LIKE KIOSKS.

>> Braude: WOULD YOU LIKE KIOSKS AT FEN FENWAY?

>> WE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSIONS ABOUT IN-PERSON BETTING VENUES, AND WE THINK IT IS AN ATTRACTIVE IDEA, BUT WE'RE VERY HAPPY WITH THE LEGISLATION THAT WAS PASSED.

WE'LL SEE HOW IT GOES AND THEN WE'LL TALK TO THE PEOPLE AS IT BECOMES AN ISSUE.

>> Braude: OF THE 33 STATES THAT HAVE DONE SO -- ROUGHLY THAT NUMBER -- I WOULD ASSUME THE LARGEST PERCENTAGE OF GAMBLING WHERE IT IS PERMITTED WOULD BE ONLINE?

AM I RIGHT?

>> THAT IS ABSOLUTELY CORRECT.

>> Braude: STEVE CROSBY USED TO SIT ACROSS FROM ME AND GO OUT OF HIS WHY TO WAY TO TALK ABOUT ALL OF THE PRECAUTIONS THAT BUILT IN FOR ADDICTIONS, AND WHEN I WENT TO PLAINVIEW, THERE WAS A TABLE WITH LITERATURE AND A PHONE NUMBER ABOUT GAMING OR GAMBLING -- WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT.

HAS THE GAMING COMMISSION, THE STATE, THE LEGISLATURE, OUR GOVERNORS, HAVE THEY RESPONSIBLY DEALT WITH THE ISSUES YOU WORK ON?

OR HAS IT BEEN LIKE PULLING TEETH?

>> 100% THEY HAVE BEEN RESPONSIBLE AND RESPONSIVE.

SO OUR ORGANIZATION RUNS THAT CENTER YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT -- >> Braude: IT DOES?

I DIDN'T KNOW THAT.

I'M SORRY.

>> THAT'S OKAY.

ON PLAINVIEW MASS, AND THERE ARE ONCE ON SIGHT AT BOSTON HARBOR AND MGM SPRINGFIELD, AND STEVE CROSBY ACTUALLY SITS ON MY BOARD OF DIRECTORS.

AND SO WHAT I'LL TELL YOU IS, YES, THEY HAVE.

WE DON'T ALWAYS SEE EYE TO EYE, BUT THERE IS ALWAYS A DIALOGUE.

WHETHER THAT IS THE LEGISLATURE, WHETHER THAT IS THE GAMING COMMISSION OR THE GOVERNOR, THERE HAS BEEN A DIALOGUE, AND EVERYONE WANTS TO BE ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF PUBLIC HEALTH IN THIS DISCUSSION.

>> Braude: DAVID, I SHOULD HAVE BEEN CAND DIT CANDID WITH YOU AT THE BEGINNING, I DON'T LIKE STATE SPONSORED GAMBLING.

THERE WAS A STUDY YEARS AGO -- YOU MAY HAVE BEEN IN THE LEGISLATURE AT THIS POINT -- THAT WAS DONE BY TOM BIRMINGHAM'S COMMITTEE, WHO WENT ON TO BE THE SENATE PRESIDENT, SO THIG IS THE LOTTERY, LIKE ROBINHOOD IN REVERSE.

NOT ONLY DID WE SPEND MORE MONEY ON THE LOTTERY PER CAPITA THUNDER THAN ANY STATE BY FAR, BUT THE POOR PEOPLE SPENT MUCH MORE MONEY ON IT, AND MONEY ENDED UP BEING TRANSLATED TO RICHER AREAS.

YOU WORK FOR A TEAM THAT HAS A SOCIAL CONSCIENCE.

AND ANY PART OF THIS PROCESS WERE YOU WORRIED ABOUT THE IMPLICATIONS FOR LOW AND MODERATE INCOME PEOPLE OF EXPANDING GAMBLING YET GEN AGAIN IN MASSACHUSETTS?

>> JIM, IT IS A GREAT QUESTION, AND THANK YOU FOR THE COMPLIMENT.

WE TRY TO DO SOCIALLY CONSCIENTIOUS WORK.

THERE IS SO MUCH ILLEGAL SPORTS BETTING HAPPENING ALREADY, THAT THAT KIND OF WEALTH TRANSFER IS ALREADY GOING ON, EXCEPT IT IS ON ILLEGAL, OFFSHORE APPS THAT CAN'T BE REGULATED.

MANY YEARS AGO I HAD THE HONOR AND PRIVILEGE OF CLERKING AT THE U.S. SUPREME COURT.

CHIEF JUSTICE REHNQUIST RAN AN ILLEGAL SPORTS BETTING POOL OUT OF HIS OFFICE FOR THE NAACP BASKETBALL.

SO ONCE YOU FOCUS ON THE MASSIVE AMOUNT OF ILLEGAL BETTING, IT KIND OF MADE SENSE TO SUPPORT LEGALIZATION.

>> Braude: ONE MORE THING, DAVID -- EMBARRASSED ABOUT THIS, BUT I'M A HUGE BASEBALL FAN AND THERE IS SO MUCH TIME IN BETWEEN PITCHES, YOU COULD GO ARGUE A CASE BEFORE THE SUPREME COURT.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS THIS LEGISLATION, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, ALLOWS FOR IN-GAME BETTING.

AM I NOT RIGHT ABOUT THAT?

>> THAT'S RIGHT FOR PRO SPORTS.

>> Braude: SO IS BASEBALL TAILOR MADE BETTING BECAUSE OF THE UNENDING PAUSES BETWEEN PITCHES?

>> I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE CASUAL SPORTS BETTERS.

ONE THING ABOUT THE LEGISLATION IS IT LET'S THE LEADS GO TO THE GAMING COMMISSION, IF THERE ARE PROBLEMATIC TYPES OF BETS.

THE FIRST FOUL IN AN NBA GAME -- WHO WANTS TO BET ON THAT, BUT IT IS VERY EASY FOR A PLAYER TO WHISPER TO A FRIEND, HEY, I'M GOING TO COMMIT THAT FIRST FOUL.

IT DOESN'T CHANGE THE OUTCOME.

SO THE ANSWER IS, YES, IF A PARTICULAR PITCHER IS GOING TO STRIKE OUT SIX PEOPLE TONIGHT, THAT IS AN INTERESTING IN-GAME BET THAT KEEPS YOU ENGAGED IN THE GAME.

WE THINK THAT IS KIND OF NEAT.

>> Braude: THE POINT I THINK YOU WERE TRYING TO MAKE IS I THINK YOU WOULD OPPOSE IN-GAME BETS THAT PLAYERS COULD INTENTIONALLY ACT ON RATHER THAN -- THAT WOULD NOT AFFECT THE OUTCOME.

IS THAT NOT WHERE YOU WERE GOING?

>> RIGHT.

THAT IS A CONSIDERATION THAT THE LEAGUES AND THE LEGISLATURE THOUGHT A LOT ABOUT TO, AMONG OTHER THINGS, TO PROMOTE INTEGRITY.

BECAUSE THE LAST THING PEOPLE WOULD WANT IS THAT THEY'RE NOT PLAYED IN A COMPETITIVE SPIRIT.

>> Braude: DID YOU BOTH BUY MEGA MILLIONS TICKETS?

DAVID?

>> A FRIEND OF MINE DID.

>> Braude: THE IRONY OF THIS IS I'M AGAINST THIS GAMING, AND I BOUGHT 10 AND THE TWO OF YOU BOUGHT NONE.

>> BRAUDE: DAVID FRIEDMAN, MARLENE WARNER, THANKS.

THAT'S IT FOR TONIGHT.

WITH THE DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES FOR STATE AUDITOR ON MONDAY AND THE DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATES ON WEDNESDAY.

HOPE YOU'LL JOIN US FOR THOSE.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING, AND PLEASE DON'T FORGET UKRAINE.

♪♪ Captioned by Media Access Group at WGBH access.wgbh.org