GEOFF BENNETT: Good evening.

I'm Geoff Bennett.

AMNA NAWAZ: And I'm Amna Nawaz.

On the "News Hour" tonight: Kamala Harris defends her policy shift in her first interview as the Democratic nominee.

And reproductive rights once again become a focal point in the neck-and-neck presidential race.

GEOFF BENNETT: The first child to contract polio in Gaza in 25 years highlights the dire circumstances faced by the desperate and displaced population.

AMNA NAWAZ: And three years after the United States withdrawal from Afghanistan, women there describe the brutal repression by the Taliban regime.

SARA, Founder, Secret Girls Schools: It is like being in a jail, but the prison is your home.

(BREAK) GEOFF BENNETT: Welcome to the "News Hour."

We start tonight with the race for the White House and Vice President Kamala Harris in her first sit-down interview since capturing the Democratic nomination for president.

AMNA NAWAZ: Over the course of 27 minutes, alongside her running mate, Tim Walz, Harris fended off challenges to her policy positions.

And she tread a thin line between being a change candidate and carrying on the legacy she's forged with President Biden.

To be sure, she did make some news, like saying she would bring a Republican into her Cabinet, something that's not been done since the Obama administration.

KAMALA HARRIS, Vice President of the United States (D) and U.S. Presidential Candidate: I have spent my career inviting diversity of opinion.

I think it's important to have people at the table when some of the most important decisions are being made that have different views, different experiences.

And I think it would be to the benefit of the American public to have a member of my Cabinet who's a Republican.

GEOFF BENNETT: Also In that interview, Harris was pressed on why her economic proposals had not already been put into place given her position within the Biden administration.

DANA BASH, CNN Host: You have been vice president for 3.5 years.

DANA BASH: The steps that you're talking about now, why haven't you done them already?

KAMALA HARRIS: Well, first of all, we had to recover as an economy.

And we have done that.

I'm very proud of the work that we have done that has brought inflation down to less than 3 percent.I will say that that's good work.

There's more to do, but that's good work.

AMNA NAWAZ: Meanwhile, Harris' rival, former President Donald Trump, was campaigning in Johnstown, Pennsylvania today.

He'd already used his social media platform to describe the Harris interview as -- quote -- "boring."

And, today, he said that the interview was hardly a test.

DONALD TRUMP, Former President of the United States (R) and Current U.S. Presidential Candidate: Kamala, who's a total lightweight, did you see her on television last night?

This is going to be the president.

(BOOING) DONALD TRUMP: This is going to be the president of our country?

I don't think so, sitting propped up in a desk.

And that's the first interview she's done in like -- nobody's ever seen anything like it.

And if you're too weak to do a one-on-one interview with a person that was so soft... GEOFF BENNETT: Tonight, Mr. Trump speaks to the right-wing Moms for Liberty group in Washington, D.C., and, on Monday Vice President Harris will appear alongside President Biden for a Labor Day event in Pittsburgh.

It'll be their first campaign event together since her nomination.

AMNA NAWAZ: Also today, a Russian-guided bomb attack on Ukraine's second largest city killed at least five people and injured dozens more.

Authorities in Kharkiv say the bombs hit five locations across the city, including a playground where at least one child died.

Others were killed in a nearby apartment building that caught fire as a result of that attack.

Meantime, in Washington, Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin met with his Ukrainian counterpart today and condemned Moscow's recent wave of strikes on civilian infrastructure.

LLOYD AUSTIN, U.S. Secretary of Defense: Let me be clear.

It is never, never acceptable to target civilians.

And Ukraine's resilience will help it prevail over Putin's aggression and atrocities.

AMNA NAWAZ: Separately, Ukraine's president has fired the country's air force commander after an F-16 warplane supplied by Ukraine's Western allies crashed earlier this week.

U.S. experts have joined the investigation into why the jet went down during a Russian missile and drone barrage on Monday.

Shifting to the Middle East, the Israeli military says it killed a top commander and two of his associates during a third day of operations in the occupied West Bank.

Video today caught smoke rising over the city of Jenin as Israeli police vehicles patrolled on the ground.

Israel says the raids have killed at least 19 people since Tuesday, most of them militants.

Residents of Tulkarm returned today after Israel withdrew from the area, finding their homes reduced to rubble.

HUSSEIN SHEHADA, West Bank Resident (through translator): Here, where you are filming was the house of an old woman.

Since the first moment of the raid, they destroyed the house, and then they entered the house behind us.

There were walls and a road here.

They destroyed them too.

AMNA NAWAZ: Meantime, in Gaza, an aid group says an Israeli airstrike killed several people when it struck a convoy that was carrying medical supplies to a hospital.

They say the dead were employees of a local transportation company and the strike came without warning.

Israel claims gunmen had seized the convoy and were the target of the attack.

Investigations are ongoing.

Maryland's Supreme Court has ordered a redo of the hearing that freed Adnan Syed over concerns about the rights of the victim's family.

It's the latest twist in a legal drama that was the focus of the "Serial" podcast, which propelled the case to national attention.

Syed was convicted more than two decades ago for killing his high school ex-girlfriend.

He was freed in 2022, only to have his conviction reinstated a year later.

One of the dissenting judges in today's ruling did not mince words, writing that the case is -- quote -- "a procedural zombie.

It has been reanimated despite its expiration."

Syed will remain free as a lower court considers whether to throw out his conviction.

On Wall Street today, stocks ended the week with solid gains.

The Dow Jones industrial average added more than 200 points to close at a new record high.

The Nasdaq added nearly 200 points, or more than 1 percent.

The S&P 500 closed out its fourth straight winning month.

And we have results from the second full day of competition at the Paralympic Games in Paris.

In the shot put, Tunisia's Raoua Tlili won her fifth gold in five appearances.

France's Alexandre Leaute secured a second gold medal for the host nation, winning the men cycling 3,000 meters by two seconds.

Team USA won its first gold medal of the tournament thanks to Gia Pergolini's performance in the 100-meter backstroke.

And Brazil takes home the first gold in para athletics, which includes running, jumping and racing events.

Julio Cesar Agripino won the men's 5,000-meter event for runners with near-total visual impairment.

And we have a passing of note from the world of sports.

NHL player Johnny Gaudreau and his brother were killed last night by a suspected drunken driver as they were riding bicycles in their home state of New Jersey.

Known as Johnny Hockey, Gaudreau played 11 seasons in the NHL, most recently with the Columbus Blue Jackets.

He was known for his speed on the ice, for his positivity and his love of the game.

LeBron James and former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie are among those who've paid tribute.

Gaudreau was in New Jersey to be a groomsman at his sister's wedding this weekend.

Johnny Gaudreau was 31 years old.

His brother, Matthew, was 29.

Still to come on the "News Hour": how the United States' complex system of insurance and mental health care makes finding help so difficult; David Brooks and Kimberly Atkins Stohr weigh in on the week's campaign headlines; and we hear from young Afghan musicians who were forced to flee their country after the Taliban takeover.

GEOFF BENNETT: The World Health Organization is leading an effort to start vaccinating children in Gaza this Sunday against polio.

Israel and Hamas have agreed to have three-day pauses in the fighting in different zones so health workers can distribute the vaccine.

It comes amid the massive destruction of Gaza's health care infrastructure and after health officials detected the first polio case there in 25 years.

In a refugee camp in the Central Gaza Strip, a once vibrant baby boy now sits paralyzed in his car seat; 10-month-old Abdul Rahman is Gaza's first confirmed case of polio in a quarter-century.

The anguish clear in his mother's voice.

NIVINE ABU AL-JIDYAN, Mother (through translator): He's my only baby boy.

It's his right to walk, run, and move like before.

It's his right to get the proper treatment, travel, get out, and get his chance in life.

GEOFF BENNETT: Nearly a year of displacement and destruction prevented her child from receiving a polio vaccine.

NIVINE ABU AL-JIDYAN (through translator): We were displaced from the north to the south from one place to another.

Abdul Rahman did not get his vaccinations.

GEOFF BENNETT: Now, as fighting drags on in the death toll in Gaza, it clips his 40,000, authorities are scrambling to prevent the full-blown outbreak that the United Nations and health officials have been warning about for months.

SAM ROSE, United Nations Relief and Works Agency: We're calling for calm.

We're calling for humanitarian pauses that will allow the vaccination programs to pass and be implemented successfully.

GEOFF BENNETT: Israel and Hamas have agreed to a series of humanitarian pauses in the fighting, as the U.N. attempts to vaccinate more than 600,000 Palestinian children under the age of 10.

Over one million doses of the polio vaccine have now been shipped into Gaza, and more than 2,000 health workers will conduct the operation.

The WHO says at least 95 percent coverage during each of the two vaccination rounds, conducted four weeks apart, is necessary to prevent the spread of the disease.

RIK PEEPERKORN, World Health Organization: This is a massive operation.

The security, of course, is paramount.

And we urge all parties to ensure that protection, as well as -- of them and of course, of the families, as well as of the health facilities and children.

GEOFF BENNETT: But for Palestinian families, after nearly a year of sustained bombardment, the vaccine, while welcomed, offers little comfort.

TAGHREED BAKR, Grandmother (through translator): We're asking for a humanitarian truce.

Just have mercy on us, on the children, so that we can give them the polio vaccine.

The schools have been bombed.

The camps have been bombed.

The streets are bombed.

There is bombing everywhere.

There is bombing everywhere in Gaza.

GEOFF BENNETT: For perspective now on the total collapse of health infrastructure in Gaza and the growing polio crisis, we turn to Dr. Tammy Abughnaim, who recently returned from South Gaza's Nasser Hospital, where she volunteered with the International Rescue Committee as an E.R.

physician.

Thank you for being with us.

DR. TAMMY ABUGHNAIM, Volunteer, International Rescue Committee: Thank you for having me.

GEOFF BENNETT: So, as we just heard, Gaza is seeing its first confirmed case of polio in 25 years.

How big a threat does this pose?

DR. TAMMY ABUGHNAIM: I think it poses a tremendous threat to the population of Gaza, but also a threat to public health in general in the region.

As you have mentioned, the health care system has been under direct Israeli targeting and bombardment for the last 11 months, and the destruction of infrastructure means that epidemics will become a common thing.

This will become one of many epidemics that we anticipate over the course of the next few months and years for Gaza.

The decimation of the health care system by Israeli forces means that it will be difficult to tackle.

And, as your report mentioned earlier, humanitarian pauses and truces and the gymnastics of coordinating a vaccination program are made extremely difficult by the fact that there is still ongoing bombardment of civilian areas.

GEOFF BENNETT: Well, a question about that, because this WHO plan to inoculate more than 600,000 children against polio, based on what you know of the region and its disintegrated health care system, is this even feasible?

DR. TAMMY ABUGHNAIM: It's the best that the World Health Organization is going to be able to do under the circumstances.

In the absence of a cease-fire, this vaccination program is really kind of the only patched-up solution that we have at this point.

In an ideal world, we would be able to get a cease-fire and get all of these children vaccinated.

It's important to remember too that just because Israel has outlined certain areas and certain times that it is not going to be bombarding these vaccination centers does not mean that it's going to make the task of actual vaccine administration easier.

There are lots of logistics that go into vaccination programs, transportation to these centers.

The roads in Gaza have been destroyed by Israeli forces.

You can't easily get a taxi or a bus and go to a vaccination center.

And then the areas around the vaccination center will still be subject to aerial bombardment by Israeli forces.

So all of the logistics of a humanitarian pause and an operation like this are extremely complicated, made more difficult by the fact that it's hard to plan around what Israel will actually do during these times.

GEOFF BENNETT: You have been to Gaza twice in the last few months.

You have served at both Al-Aqsa Hospital in Central Gaza and the Nasser Hospital in the south.

How would you describe the health and humanitarian conditions?

DR. TAMMY ABUGHNAIM: I mean, I would describe it in the way that every humanitarian aid worker who has returned describes it.

It's catastrophic and it's unacceptably catastrophic.

There seems to be this floating idea that, oh, goodness, the health care system is decimated, it's incapacitated, it's crippled.

But it's still somewhat functional.

But it is not nearly at the capacity that it should be.

And it is not the spontaneous natural disaster that's happened in Gaza.

It's the result of deliberate targeting and strikes.

And so the things that we're seeing at Al-Aqsa Hospital and Nasser Hospital are shortages of supplies because Israel restricts the amount of entry, both of supplies and personnel, that can come in.

So on any given day, when I was in the emergency department, we didn't have a sufficient number of tourniquets.

We were reusing supplies that technically should not be reused, like ventilator supplies, intubation stylets.

We were using giant rubber bands as tourniquets.

Specialized surgical equipment not being available is also a problem because a lot of these patients require surgical intervention, and they're simply not able to get it.

And these are all the direct result of Israeli-imposed restrictions.

GEOFF BENNETT: What do you carry as a health professional having worked in Gaza?

DR. TAMMY ABUGHNAIM: I mean, having worked in Gaza and come back from my second mission, the things that stay with you are really the stories of the people.

Besides the horrific trauma that you witness every single day to innocent civilians, you also see the stories of those civilians, the stories of the mothers, the stories of the health care workers.

Any time I sit down in the emergency department on a shift, I make it a point to speak to my Palestinian colleagues about what their experiences have been.

Many of my Palestinian colleagues have been kidnapped by Israeli forces during the siege of Nasser Hospital, during the siege of Shifa Hospital.

And they tell me horrifying accounts of torture that they suffered because they were health care workers.

Human Rights Watch recently released a report on this, the targeting and the torture of health care workers throughout the Gaza Strip.

And their stories are in line with everything that's described in that report.

So, really, the scars that you carry coming out of Gaza doing humanitarian aid work is the scars of the stories that people will tell you of the suffering that Israel has inflicted on them.

GEOFF BENNETT: Dr. Tammy Abughnaim, thank you for making time for us in between your shifts there back home in Illinois.

Thanks for being with us.

DR. TAMMY ABUGHNAIM: Appreciate it.

Thank you.

AMNA NAWAZ: More than one in five adults in the U.S. live with a mental illness, but only about half receive treatment.

Many struggle to find a therapist that will accept their insurance.

An NPR-ProPublica report aimed to figure out the reasons why.

Stephanie Sy has that story.

STEPHANIE SY: The investigation found that many therapists who initially join insurance networks end up leaving because of difficulties getting reimbursed by insurers.

That leaves a lot of patients paying out of pocket or being unable to access care.

For more, I'm joined by Annie Waldman, who covers health care at ProPublica.

Annie, thanks so much for joining the "News Hour."

So, for this report, you and your colleagues interviewed, I understand, hundreds of psychologists, psychiatrist, therapists.

And you did find that it's insurers who often ultimately decide the length of care and ultimately who gets covered treatment.

Is that right?

ANNIE WALDMAN, ProPublica: Yes, that's right.

In the most simple terms, we really wanted to understand, why is it that, even when you have insurance, it can be so hard to access mental health treatment?

And what people don't realize is that insurance companies play a big role in this and have a big say in how much treatment you get, how often you get treatment, how frequently you get treatment, and what kind of treatment you get.

And providers also told us that they experience a lot of red tape dealing with insurers, delayed and low payments, audits and reviews.

Therapists really told us that they tried to stay in network.

They are committed to their patients, are committed to delivering mental health care.

But these practices from insurance companies are squeezing them out.

STEPHANIE SY: So there's red tape, there's bureaucracy in having to file these claims.

And there's also what you describe as below-market-rate reimbursement from insurers, therapists that describe having their rates not shift in years.

And, obviously, we all know inflation has been a factor, but that reimbursement rate has stayed the same.

ANNIE WALDMAN: Yes, that's right.

In a lot of our interviews, therapists told us about how their rates have been largely stagnant and notoriously low.

Therapists on average earn about $98 for a 45-minute session of therapy from commercial insurers.

But if they went out of network, they could get doubled that.

So a lot of providers say that it's just not sustainable for them to stay in network and get these rates that are really low in which all their expenses of their office, their own health insurance, they can't keep up with them.

STEPHANIE SY: So there are also many claims that get denied on the basis of what the industry calls medical necessity.

You spoke to a therapist who experienced that.

Here's what Anna DiNoto, who provides therapy for children with autism, had to say.

ANNA DINOTO, Psychologist: They started to say that the amount of time we spent with the patient wasn't supported by the documentation.

And so it's things like that where they say, well, you're not demonstrating medical necessity, but then they won't give you what the rubric is for medical necessity.

STEPHANIE SY: Annie, in disputes over what is medically necessary, I understand that there are not clear guidelines in mental health care, the way there may be in physical health care.

Is that the crux of the problem?

ANNIE WALDMAN: Yes, the term medical necessity is frequently used by insurers to deny claims.

Many people assume that, if your mental health provider believes that you need a certain type or length of treatment, that they are the expert and they should have the final say.

But our reporting found that's not entirely true, that insurance companies generally face few limitations on how they define what kind of care is medically necessary.

And they sometimes even create their own internal standards, instead of relying on the ones developed by nonprofits or professional medical societies.

And these standards can be used to challenge diagnoses or treatment plans, which can lead to denials of care.

STEPHANIE SY: You also report instances when the therapists were told by insurers to spend less time with patients who the therapist, as you call them, the experts, felt needed long-term care.

Again, here's what Anna DiNoto said.

ANNA DINOTO: It's really concerning and unethical in many ways, in my opinion, because it's like saying to a surgeon, we're going to give you four hours to be able to do open-heart surgery, and, sorry, not sorry, like, if you can't finish.

We don't know what to tell you.

STEPHANIE SY: Anna DiNoto was not alone.

You interviewed dozens of therapists, some of whom felt that insurers were reducing care for patients who were even on the edge of self-harm, even suicide.

So what impact did the therapist describe these insurance policies could have on their patients?

ANNIE WALDMAN: Yes, what's so striking from what Anna DiNoto experienced is that, under the Mental Health Parity and Addiction Equity Act, which is also known as MHPAEA, it's a federal law that requires insurance companies to provide the same access to mental health and physical health care.

But we heard numerous stories from patients and providers about how mental health care was discriminated against and often scaled back in ways that medical care may not be.

You know, for example, if you have cancer and your doctor says that you need chemotherapy, an insurance company likely wouldn't say, well, you can only have that chemotherapy if you first try a less aggressive, less intensive, less costly medication first and show that it doesn't work.

But with mental health care, we heard stories of scaling back care for acute disorders often, someone in the midst of a mental health crisis who needed intensive treatment, and then the insurer will only improve coverage for a less intensive treatment first.

Such limitation means patients can risk bodily harm or even death through overdose or suicide.

STEPHANIE SY: What do insurance companies tell you by way of explaining these reimbursement and care issues?

ANNIE WALDMAN: Yes, we reached out to several insurance companies for our reporting, and they told us that they are committed to ensuring access to mental health providers.

They also emphasize that their plans are in compliance with state and federal laws.

Insurers also said that they have practices in place to make sure reimbursement rates reflect the market value to support and retain providers, which they're continually trying to recruit.

But that doesn't match up with what we heard from therapists or the previous analyses that policy experts have done and mental health advocates have done.

STEPHANIE SY: Annie Waldman with ProPublica, thank you so much for joining the "News Hour" and sharing your reporting with us.

ANNIE WALDMAN: Thank you for having me.

AMNA NAWAZ: Today marks three years since the chaotic withdrawal of U.S. and NATO allies from Afghanistan.

It also marks three years of intensifying repression of women under the Taliban regime, what the U.N. has described as a -- quote - - "striking erasure of women from public life."

Producer Zeba Warsi spoke to Afghan women inside the country about their lives today.

Once the hub of U.S. troops in Afghanistan, Bagram Air Base is now the Taliban stage, a show of force with abandoned U.S. and NATO equipment.

In 2021, a different scene here, as desperate Afghans clung to airplane wings during a chaotic U.S. withdrawal.

This month, the Taliban draped the streets with their flags, marking three years in power.

Missing from these scenes, Afghans women, who say they're being erased from public life in a wave of Taliban restrictions.

SARA, Founder, Secret Girls Schools: It is like being in a jail, but the prison is your home.

AMNA NAWAZ: We're calling this woman Sara to protect her identity.

Women in Afghanistan, including girls as young as 10, are now banned from attending schools and colleges.

A new law passed last week states women are forbidden from looking at men they're not related to and banned from being heard in public.

Sara spoke to us from an undisclosed location in Afghanistan.

SARA: You're not allowed to go to restaurants or university, nowhere but just your home, because they say the best place for women and young girls is their home.

AMNA NAWAZ: But Sara, a teacher, refuses to relent.

She founded an organization that runs secret schools like this one.

SARA: We were teaching them English, instead of Islamic studies.

We take actions very conservatively.

Our classes' numbers are significantly low.

The number of students are low because we have to let those students to join the classes that are very trustable.

WOMAN: Hello.

Good morning, guys.

AMNA NAWAZ: The risk, she says, is always there because the Taliban are always watching.

SARA: Their officials and their agents came into our classes and they found the English books.

They saw us teaching English, instead of Islamic studies.

And they arrested our man colleague.

We advise our volunteers to be very careful.

But they have that inspiration and that motivation to do something for girls.

AMNA NAWAZ: And she decries the Taliban's warped view of her faith.

SARA: I am a Muslim.

You can see the paintings behind me.

That's a verse and a verse of Koran.

And I believe in Islam.

I haven't read in the Koran any banning on women's education.

What the Taliban are not Islam.

They're not Muslim.

And they're just extremists.

They're radicalists.

AMNA NAWAZ: Sara is not alone in her defiance.

Online, video surfaced of Afghan women defying Taliban law and singing in public.

The lyrics to this song, "You made me a prisoner in my home."

The United Nations says two-thirds of Afghan women suffer from mental health issues and note an increase in suicide attempt rates among women.

A stolen future has left this woman we're calling Roya with dimmed hopes.

ROYA, Teacher, Secret School For Girls: One of my fears is that all of my education become nothing.

I cannot use my knowledge.

I cannot continue my educations.

I cannot work in the society.

AMNA NAWAZ: Once an economic student, she's now a teacher for an online school.

Banned from public life, she was forced to take up sewing lessons, a permitted activity by the Taliban.

But she's not abandoning her dreams.

ROYA: One of my biggest dreams is that I become an independent girl and I be head of my own company.

And, inshallah, I never give up for my trying.

I try my best to achieve my dreams.

AMNA NAWAZ: Sara says secret schools like this are one way to fan the flames of a generation of young girls' dreams.

SARA: That's why we have to take the risk.

It could be a punishment.

It could be a -- maybe a death threat.

It could be arresting, anything.

But we have to take the risk.

AMNA NAWAZ: Joining me now is Afghan education activist Pashtana Durrani.

She's the founder of LEARN Afghanistan.

That's a grassroots group working to expand education access there.

She's currently a visiting fellow at Wellesley College's Centers for Women.

Pashtana, welcome back.

It's good to see you.

PASHTANA DURRANI, Executive Director, LEARN Afghanistan: Thank you for having me.

AMNA NAWAZ: So, you, of course, had to flee Afghanistan after the Taliban reclaimed power, but you're still regularly in contact with many women and girls there.

You heard what these women had to say about their lives today.

What else do you hear from women and girls on the ground?

PASHTANA DURRANI: I think the one thing I really want to highlight is the fact that women and young girls still want to go to school.

They still want to work,.

They still want to breathe the fresh air and go to parks and enjoy going to salons and stuff.

But the only thing that you hear from them is how supplicating it is, how it's an open-air prison, and how they are not allowed to do anything but breathe.

AMNA NAWAZ: You are -- somehow, you found a way to remarkably continue to run your schools in secret in Afghanistan, not on the scale you could when you lived there, when the Taliban weren't in power.

But what are you able to do there today?

How is that running?

PASHTANA DURRANI: So, right now, we have five schools in five different provinces of Afghanistan, in Kandahar, Helmand, Bamyan, Daykundi, and Herat.

We're hoping to expand to other provinces.

And we're in the midst of it.

We have around 661 students since last we spoke.

But the sad reality is that, last week, we had to close down our Kandahar school, and we had to switch to online because of the current surveillance and because of the intelligence reports and how they are being surveilled.

So we find ways to work, and we continue to do so.

But it is not an easy job.

Running a school in Afghanistan right now is the toughest thing to do.

AMNA NAWAZ: The longer they're in power, it feels like the more restrictive the Taliban get with women and girls in particular.

So what does that mean for the future of your schools?

PASHTANA DURRANI: I think two things.

The first is that Afghan women, given that we are very resourceful, we have to be more innovative in ways we approach everything in Afghanistan, education, health care, human rights, women rights, mental health spaces.

Afghanistan is right now the highest -- the country that has the highest suicide rates for women.

So it's all of that all together.

But then at the same time, when we look at it to other countries, do we really need to fight for education, instead of just being able to go to school or teach in a school or just go to work, just like other Muslim countries are allowing their own women to do that?

So it's two things.

But then, at the same time, I'm also thinking the Taliban are not clever enough.

They're coming up with the weird ways to impose their power.

I mean, tell me one single woman who has been (INAUDIBLE) in the past 20 years or in the past three years.

Tell me about women who have been loud about any of the things.

So I also find it very funny when they come up with these dictates.

I'm like, they really need to be innovative with these things, but they're not.

So it's restricting.

It's going to get more restricting, but they're running out of things to ban anymore.

AMNA NAWAZ: Well, what about when it comes to international pressure or U.S. pressure?

Does anyone that you talk to there on the ground or do you yourself think that that kind of public pressure that we haven't really seen, especially from the U.S., could get the Taliban to reverse course in any way?

PASHTANA DURRANI: I think right now the U.S. has found, like, one chief watchman for Afghanistan.

As long as it doesn't do anything outside of Afghanistan, whatever they do that uses anything, it's OK for them.

And I think that has been the attitude towards Afghanistan so far for the past three years.

And that's going to continue, because the U.N. literally brought them into Qatar and talked to them without even recognizing and bringing in Afghan women.

That has happened in the past three years and even before that in Qatar.

They have offices all over.

They are being recognized in all these countries.

So I think the U.S. is complacent in many ways.

Like, they don't want to even -- like, they are turning a blind eye.

Every time an ambassador is accepted in other countries, the U.S. doesn't say anything or do anything.

I don't think their engagement will bring any changes either.

AMNA NAWAZ: You know, when the Taliban came back to power and they threatened you, we should point out, which is why you were forced to leave -- and I know you were reluctant at the time.

We have spoken before and since.

But when you look at what has happened under the Taliban rule in the last three years, do you ever think about what it would have meant if you had stayed, what would have happened?

PASHTANA DURRANI: I -- this morning, there was a -- one of my friends posted this field, and it said that imagine another time where we didn't leave home, and it was all beautiful sceneries of Afghanistan and the actual national flag of Afghanistan.

And I thought to myself, I was like, imagine if we all had stayed, right, but the Taliban were not in power.

Afghanistan might have been a different place.

But then, at the same time, if we all have stayed, would we have made out?

Would we have been doing all the things that we do right now?

Would I be running schools, or would I be literally begging for documentation in the neighboring countries?

Would I even be alive?

Like, all of those things.

So, it's hard to imagine, but it definitely takes a toll on you.

AMNA NAWAZ: That is Pashtana Durrani, founder of LEARN Afghanistan, currently at Wellesley College's Centers for Women.

Pashtana, good to speak with you.

Thank you.

PASHTANA DURRANI: Thank you.

GEOFF BENNETT: Vice President Harris sits down for her first interview since launching her presidential campaign, as former President Donald Trump tries to change the narrative on abortion access.

On that and more, we turn tonight to Brooks and Atkins Stohr.

That is New York Times columnist David Brooks and Boston Globe columnist Kimberly Atkins Stohr.

Jonathan Capehart is away this evening.

It's great to see you both.

KIMBERLY ATKINS STOHR, The Boston Globe: Good to see you.

GEOFF BENNETT: So it would appear that Donald Trump is having trouble staking out a consistent stance and message on abortion access and reproductive rights.

David, just yesterday, in an interview with NBC News, he slammed Florida's six-week abortion ban as being too restrictive.

He says it's too short.

He said, "I want more weeks."

That was a direct quote.

Today, he tells FOX News that he's going to vote to uphold that same ban when it comes up for a ballot -- when it comes up for voters, a ballot measure, come November.

It would seem that he's struggling to find an answer for this environment that he's created.

DAVID BROOKS: Yes, well, Donald Trump has two principles here.

One is the Republican Party's pro-life, and, two, it's not a good way to get elected president.

And so he seems to be toggling between the two.

And if I were him, I would just stick to the pro-life position.

You know, he appointed the judges that did Dobbs.

He's effectively a pro-life person.

His party's a pro-life party.

He should just simply stick with the pro-life.

But he can't help it.

When he wants to position himself more favorably, he shifts.

But this was the first time when he shifted, saying six weeks was too short, or really trying to push the Republican Party in a pro-choice direction, this was the first time I really saw social conservatives furious and just putting tremendous pressure on him not to do this.

And so usually they just get in line, but this time they really were mad.

GEOFF BENNETT: What about that, Kimberly?

KIMBERLY ATKINS STOHR: Yes, I think that is absolutely true.

Look, we have seen in the elections since Dobbs was overturned by the Supreme -- or Dobbs was handed down by the Supreme Court overturning Roe that every time an abortion access question is on the ballot, the abortion access wins.

And we have in -- not just in Florida, but in some 40 other states some measure on November's ballot that's going to be about abortion access.

And if you have Donald Trump suddenly saying, oh, I think that this is a problem, it's going to do a lot of damage to the conservatives that are pushing those measures.

So you're seeing him thinking about his own hide and then clearly talking to somebody and trying to pull that back.

But it also goes against what he's always said was, leave it to the states, right?

Well, then he was telling states it was too short, telling them what to do.

So he's really struggling to find where his lane is here.

GEOFF BENNETT: He's also talking about access to IVF, because, in that same NBC News interview, he's saying that, if he's reelected, his administration would not only protect access to IVF, but would also have either the government or insurance companies cover the cost.

Take a listen.

DONALD TRUMP, Former President of the United States (R) and Current U.S. Presidential Candidate: Under the Trump administration, we are going to be paying for that treatment.

So we are paying for that treatment.

QUESTION: All Americans who want it?

DONALD TRUMP: All Americans that get it, all Americans that need it.

GEOFF BENNETT: Now, neither he nor his campaign have offered any specifics about how this would work or how you would pay for it.

IVF is not cheap.

Per patient, per cycle, it's roughly $20,000.

What's he trying to accomplish here?

DAVID BROOKS: Get elected.

And so it's just -- I mean, he tweeted out a couple or whatever, TRUTH Social'ed something saying women will have complete reproductive freedom under my administration.

And so on this IVF issue, that's obviously an issue where Americans are more supportive than -- abortion is obviously complicated.

But he's a salesman and he's just trying to sell himself and he will say whatever will help you buy.

And so he's lost in salesman mode.

GEOFF BENNETT: Is this the gift to the Harris campaign?

KIMBERLY ATKINS STOHR: It is.

I mean, when he posted that reproductive health care, reproductive freedom under my administration, when did he do that?

He did that on Thursday after Kamala Harris gave her accepted speech and made that a central theme in her campaign, protecting reproductive choice for women.

So what he is doing is -- well, he's lying, first of all, because he worked throughout his tenure to -- vowing to repeal Obamacare, tried to do that, never put forth a replacement plan for what would replace Obamacare.

And now suddenly he's talking about mandates.

He's not going to do a mandate.

He is trying with all of his might to say anything.

He's throwing spaghetti at the wall or ketchup at the wall in an effort just to try not to have this be the torpedo of his campaign.

GEOFF BENNETT: Well, let's talk about that CNN interview last night with Kamala Harris and her running mate, Tim Walz.

It's evident that the vice president is trying to establish herself as the change candidate, even as she's the sitting vice president, trying to make this election a referendum on Donald Trump.

She said last night that the country is ready to turn the page.

KAMALA HARRIS, Vice President of the United States (D) and U.S. Presidential Candidate: I think that people are ready for a new way forward in a way that generations of Americans have been fueled by hope and by optimism.

I think, sadly, in the last decade, we have had in the former president someone who has really been pushing an agenda and an environment that is about diminishing the character and the strength of who we are as Americans, really dividing our nation.

And I think people are ready to turn the page on that.

GEOFF BENNETT: So what about that, David?

Can she have it both ways, be a change candidate while also serving as vice president?

DAVID BROOKS: Yes, first, I thought she did a very credible job.

I mean, the most important thing was, can people look at that person and say, could be president?

And I think she passed that test.

She seemed self-assured.

She was in control.

I think she's right to drop all her 2019 positions, basically.

She should just do that ruthlessly.

I mean, I'm personally I'm glad to see her moving toward the center with the Republican -- it's sort of gimmicky to put a Republican in my Cabinet, but Obama did it, George W. Bush did it.

And so it's a gesture toward the center.

As for the change, I do think there's peril here.

It's a tradition.

A lot of vice presidents run for -- sitting vice presidents run for president.

That happens a lot in American history.

Most of them lose and they lose because they're not willing to break with the current administration.

And if you want to be a change agent, it's good to say, I want to -- we got -- have to have a new path forward.

There has to be some substance to it.

And if you're just embracing the Biden agenda up and down the line on economic policy and everything, it's not a change.

And so I think eventually she has to show some substantive change and not just rhetoric change.

KIMBERLY ATKINS STOHR: Yes, I think it's a little different here.

Yes, vice presidents have not done well when they have won -- run for president, but that's often after eight years of the other president running.

This is after four.

This is with a lot of people who I have spoken to who were relieved because they voted for Joe Biden thinking that he was a transitional president and were freaked out by the idea of him not.

And so now they are encouraged by not just Kamala Harris, but the energy that her candidacy has created with -- Democrats are saying they haven't felt this since Obama, right, this really big change.

So it is a change.

She does have positions.

She is staking out positions that are different from the presidents, and even in centering reproductive rights in the way that she has and really taking on the issue of immigration as much as she can so far in five weeks that has allowed her.

So I think that there is a change.

And we have also been reintroduced to Donald Trump after four years of being able to forget about him a little bit.

So that does -- I think that makes this needle she's threading between change and incumbency tough, but she seems to be hitting it right on that mark.

GEOFF BENNETT: And, David, you mentioned her move toward the center.

She was asked last night to explain her shifting policy stances on matters like the Green New Deal, Medicare for all, her position against fracking.

Those were at the time big progressive measures.

Here's how she explained herself.

DANA BASH, CNN Host: In 2019, you said -- quote -- "There is no question I'm in favor of banning fracking."

Do you still want to ban fracking?

KAMALA HARRIS: No.

And I made that clear on the debate stage in 2020.

DANA BASH: Wouldn't me do change that position at the time?

KAMALA HARRIS: Well, let's be clear.

My values have not changed.

What I have seen is that we can we can grow and we can increase a thriving clean energy economy without banning fracking.

GEOFF BENNETT: That line, "My values have not changed," even though her stance is on policy has changed.

DAVID BROOKS: It was opportunistic in 2019.

It's opportunistic now.

The Democratic Party moved pretty far left on a whole bunch of issues in ways that I thought were politically suicidal, decriminalizing the border, obviously the defunding the police, the ban on fracking.

But it wasn't just her.

It was all sorts of people on that Democratic debate stage as well.

There were 20 people running that year.

And Jim Clyburn decided, no, we can't be there, and Nancy Pelosi too.

And they said, Joe Biden.

And so when it became a political option for her to go back toward the center, talk about being a prosecutor, she went that way.

And so she's not the only opportunist to be a politician, but it was opportunist.

GEOFF BENNETT: In the time that remains, I want to put a marker on something that happened this week, the U.S. Army issuing a stark rebuke of the Trump campaign over this incident at Arlington National Cemetery.

The army said in a statement, a rare statement, that the campaign was made aware of federal laws prohibiting political activity at the cemetery.

And they confirmed the reporting that a campaign staff -- Trump campaign staffer abruptly pushed aside an employee of the cemetery.

This was a female employee who, according to The Times, didn't want to press charges because she was afraid of retaliation from Trump supporters.

Kimberly, your thoughts on all this?

KIMBERLY ATKINS STOHR: You know, there was a time that being disrespectful in any way at Arlington National Cemetery, one of the most sacred places in our nation, would have put an end to a political career.

But we have seen Donald Trump time and time again disparage members of the military, Gold Star families.

And so this seems par for the course.

I really would love to return to a time where people would look at this in a bipartisan way, in a nonpartisan way, say this is absolutely outrageous.

He is not an official at the moment.

He is a civilian.

He had no business being there.

And he certainly didn't have any business trying to shoot a video, a campaign video, that would have knocked Kamala Harris for not being there.

I mean, it's really one of the lowest political moments that I have seen in my 20-plus years in covering politics.

GEOFF BENNETT: David?

DAVID BROOKS: Yes, lowest political Trump moment I have seen in the last 48 hours, I think.

One of the things that strikes me, obviously, it's to transgress Arlington as a serious thing.

But one of the things that strikes me is, will it have a political effect?

And the answer is no.

And that's partly because people are used to Trump.

They like Trump.

But partly it's just because of the change in our politics.

And so when George H.W.

Bush was running for president in 1988, he went into his convention 17 points down.

And, obviously, he went on to win.

So that's when you could have these big public swings in public opinions, that daily eventually mattered.

That's no longer the case.

GEOFF BENNETT: David Brooks, Kimberly Atkins Stohr, it's great to see you both.

Have a good Labor Day weekend.

DAVID BROOKS: You too.

KIMBERLY ATKINS STOHR: You too.

AMNA NAWAZ: Since its founding in 2010, the Afghanistan National Institute of Music has provided a unique education and music training to Afghan children.

Back in 2013, the group made a triumphant visit to the U.S.

This month, three years after the Taliban retook control of Afghanistan, they returned, amid a completely changed world.

Senior arts correspondent Jeffrey Brown reports for our arts and culture series, Canvas.

A recent evening at Washington, D.C.'s Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts, young musicians from Afghanistan age 14 to 22 joined by members of the D.C.

Youth Orchestra playing a mix of Western and traditional Afghan music, joyful sounds, a hugely appreciative audience, but never far off, says the founder of the Afghanistan National Institute of Music, Ahmad Sarmast, a sense of grief and pain.

AHMAD SARMAST, Founder, Afghanistan National Institute of Music: We come here to let the world know that Afghanistan is today a silent nation.

JEFFREY BROWN: A silent nation?

AHMAD SARMAST: Yes, because Afghanistan is the only country today in the world where its people are denied all their music rights and cultural rights.

JEFFREY BROWN: From its founding in 2010 until the Taliban regained power and reimposed its ban on music and a crackdown on the rights of women and girls, the institute, known as ANIM, offered Afghan children a free secular coeducational curriculum and musical training, the only such school in the country.

AHMAD SARMAST: Afghanistan National Institute of Music back was quite often called the happiest place in Afghanistan.

JEFFREY BROWN: Students studied violin, cello and other Western classical instruments, also rubab, sitar and more from the Afghan musical tradition.

AHMAD SARMAST: There was two objectives, to encourage Afghan people to pick up their own instruments and to learn their own musical culture.

There was to show them that the Afghan instrument is capable to be used in any context.

We also wanted the world to know that Afghanistan is committed to musical and cultural diversity.

JEFFREY BROWN: Drawn from Afghanistan's ethnically diverse population, ANIM's student body included girls like now 20-year-old violinist Sevinch Majidi from Mazar-e-Sharif, whose childhood experience was common for girls, with parents desperate to find a path to a better life.

SEVINCH MAJIDI, Student, Afghanistan National Institute of Music: And my mother just think that I don't want to be -- grow up my girls like other girls, that they are thinking, oh, when I grow up, I have to marry, I have to cook, I have to make a baby, like that things.

Because of that, she sent me to the orphanage to grow up in another way.

JEFFREY BROWN: And now 20-year-old percussionist Shogofa Safi from Jalalabad.

SHOGOFA SAFI, Student, Afghanistan National Institute of Music: You know, we're from different cities, but we come together and we play together.

So that's why we say that music has power to bring people together.

JEFFREY BROWN: Among the boys, 16-year-old Samir Akbari from Kandahar, who fell in love with the viola.

It was a new instrument, but also a very new experience.

SAMIR AKBARI, Student, Afghanistan National Institute of Music: Everyone was in the same class, boys and girls.

They were eating together, playing together, making music together.

JEFFREY BROWN: Soon ensembles were formed, first the Afghan Youth Orchestra, which Sarmast took on tour to the U.S. in 2013.

AHMAD SARMAST: We wanted to show to the world that how far Afghanistan moved after the Taliban regime has been ousted in Afghanistan.

JEFFREY BROWN: Then, crucially, the Zohra Women's Orchestra.

SEVINCH MAJIDI: I think the main idea of that to show the Afghan men that girls also can go without men, without taking help from them.

They can do everything.

JEFFREY BROWN: They can do anything without the men?

SEVINCH MAJIDI: Yes.

JEFFREY BROWN: And they can make music together.

SEVINCH MAJIDI: Yes, of course.

They can do everything.

But on August 15, 2021, everything changed.

SAMIR AKBARI: I went to my school.

There's a lot of people running, and they said that Taliban is now in Afghanistan - - in Kabul.

They're in Kabul.

Go to your home.

JEFFREY BROWN: Within hours, the invading Taliban targeted the school, burning books and destroying instruments.

A week later, the ransacked buildings were turned into a Haqqani Taliban barracks.

SEVINCH MAJIDI: We went to the safe house.

And we were there for like one month.

I couldn't see outside.

And it was too hard for me.

I had a hard depression and -- yes.

JEFFREY BROWN: After several months in hiding, Sarmast negotiated the evacuation of students and staff, most leaving family behind, first to Qatar, then to Portugal, where ANIM has been based since, first in Lisbon, now in Braga.

There, Portuguese conductor Tiago Moreira da Silva began working with them.

He knew nothing of Afghanistan or its music, he says, but was completely transformed at the very first meeting.

TIAGO MOREIRA DA SILVA, Conductor, Afghanistan National Institute of Music: I start to cry, like, because it was so special to be around them.

JEFFREY BROWN: You started to cry?

TIAGO MOREIRA DA SILVA: Yes, yes.

It was really -- I don't know, it was too much, because you see that people were, like, suffering a lot different country, in a very difficult situation.

But they found through music something that could make them happy.

JEFFREY BROWN: Happy, yes, but also, says Shogofa Safi, a deep sadness.

SHOGOFA SAFI: I didn't want to leave Afghanistan, but my father said that: "You're a musician.

You're a girl.

Like, there's no future in Afghanistan for you."

But I accept that and I left Afghanistan, first of all, to saving my own life and on the other hand save music of Afghanistan.

JEFFREY BROWN: With the world's attention turned elsewhere, that focus on preservation is an even more urgent goal of the musicians.

AHMAD SARMAST: All the performances that we are doing and all the speeches and the interviews and publicity and media publicity that goes around, it helps to bring back Afghanistan to the radar of the international community.

JEFFREY BROWN: It was a message they brought this time to Carnegie Hall in New York and to the Kennedy Center, where they were joined on stage by internationally renowned American soprano and longtime supporter Renee Fleming.

RENEE FLEMING, Singer: I know you're having a wonderful time because I was in the audience listening too.

You sound fantastic.

JEFFREY BROWN: And they performed for an audience that included many from the exiled and emigre Afghan community.

SHOGOFA SAFI: I feel really, really good when I see my Afghan people that support us and they clap for us.

I think, I mean, an Afghan Youth Orchestra is a -- it's a symbol of hope.

JEFFREY BROWN: Ahmad Sarmast is now working to bring several hundred family members to Portugal, including younger siblings he hopes will take up instruments and keep the music alive.

For the "PBS News Hour," I'm Jeffrey Brown at the Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts in Washington, D.C. AMNA NAWAZ: Well, be sure to tune into "Washington Week With The Atlantic" tonight.

GEOFF BENNETT: And on "PBS News Weekend": Paralympic wheelchair racer Tatyana McFadden on her goal to become the most decorated track athlete in history.

And that is the "News Hour" for tonight and for this week.

I'm Geoff Bennett.

AMNA NAWAZ: And I'm Amna Nawaz.

On behalf of the entire "News Hour" team, thank you for joining us and have a great weekend.