Laura: JOHN RYAN, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING ME TODAY  TO TALK ABOUT ENERGY TRANSITION AND THE SUNZIA  LINE.

ELECTRICAL TRANSMISSION IS  SOMETHING THAT AFFECTS ALL US AND YET I FEEL LIKE WE DON'T  TALK ABOUT IT VERY MUCH.

AND A LOT OF US DON'T REALLY  UNDERSTAND IT.

SO, CAN WE START OFF, CAN YOU  KIND OF LAY OUT THE PURPOSE AND THE NEED FOR THIS PROPOSED  TRANSMISSION LINE?

Ryan: I WOULD BE HAPPY TO,  LAURA.

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

THE SUNZIA PROJECT, WE HAVE  BEEN WORKING ON FOR A LONG TIME.

TRANSMISSION LINES TAKE A LONG TIME.

SUNZIA IS ONE OF THOSE LINES THAT IS A RENEWABLE  TRANSMISSION LINE.

SO WE ARE BUILDING TO GET TO  THE WIND ENERGY IN CENTRAL NEW MEXICO.

GETTING TO THAT POINT TO WHERE THAT WIND ENERGY CAN GET ON  THE TRANSMISSION LINE AND WE WOULD TRANSFER IT INTO ARIZONA  AND ONCE WE GET INTO ARIZONA, THE POWER COULD BE SOLD TO THE  ARIZONA UTILITIES OR CALIFORNIA UTILITIES,   WHATEVER THE CASE MAY BE.

IT IS REALLY EXCITING.

IT HAS BEEN A LONG HAUL.

WE HAVE A NEW IDEA ABOUT ALTERNATIVE ROUTES AND I WOULD  LOVE TO GET INTO SOME OF THAT DETAIL BUT, REALLY, IT IS A  TRANSFORMATIONAL PROJECT FOR NEW MEXICO.

IT WILL BRING A GREAT DEAL OF ECONOMIC BENEFIT TO THE STATE,  TO A LOT OF THE RURAL COMMUNITIES THAT WE DEAL WITH,  TO A LOT OF THE LANDOWNERS AND WE ARE TRYING TO DO IT IN  ENVIRONMENTALLY SENSITIVE WAY.

Laura: IN TERMS OF THE  ELECTRICITY THAT NEW MEXICANS WILL USE, DOES THIS MEAN THERE  WILL BE MORE RENEWABLE ENERGY IN THE MIX FOR NEW MEXICANS OR  DOES IT GO TO OTHER MARKETS?

Ryan: IT COULD BE BOTH.

WE ARE DOING TWO LINES, LIKE I SAID.

ONE OF THE FIRST LINES WILL BE A DC LINE WHEREBY WE ARE  TRANSPORTING A LOT OF WIND ENERGY INTO ARIZONA AND  THEREFORE INTO THE WESTERN MARKETS.

THE SECOND LINE WILL BE AN AC LINE THAT WILL INCLUDE  SUBSTATIONS IN LUNA COUNTY, ONE IN TORRANCE COUNTY AND  THAT ALLOWS FOR INTERCONNECTIONS INTO THE NEW  MEXICO GRID.

ALL IN ALL, THE EXPANSION OF  TRANSMISSION IS REALLY VALUABLE, NOT ONLY WHETHER WE  ARE TRANSPORTING OUT OF STATE OR WITHIN STATE, ELECTRICITY  IS BECOMING MORE OF AN AREA WHERE WE NEED TO GET PATHED  INTO COMMUNITIES, SO A DIFFERENT PATH WOULD ALLOW FOR  IMPROVED RELIABILITY FOR THE REGION AS A WHOLE AND SO A LOT  OF THAT IS WHAT WE ARE AFTER, WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO, WHAT  WE THINK IS VALUABLE ABOUT SUNZIA.

Laura: WE KNOW THE CLIMATE IS CHANGING.

WE KNOW THAT IS BECAUSE OF OUR EXPENDITURES OF FOSSIL FUELS  AND RENEWABLE ENERGY IS A REALLY IMPORTANT PART OF THE  CONVERSATION LOCALLY AND GLOBALLY.

HOW DO YOU BALANCE, THOUGH, THAT THESE SORTS OF INDUSTRIAL  PROJECTS DO HAVE ALL SORTS OF LOCAL ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS?

LIKE HOW DO WE BALANCE THOSE TWO THINGS THAT WE NEED TO BE  THINKING ABOUT?

Ryan: WE HAVE TO DO IT.

WE HAVE TO BALANCE THOSE.

WE WORK REALLY HARD AT DOING  THAT.

WE KNOW THAT THERE IS A LOT OF  FOCUS ON LOW CARBON GENERATION AND SO WE ARE TRYING TO  FACILITATE THAT.

WE ARE TRYING TO ADDRESS THE  CLIMATE CRISIS.

WE UNDERSTAND IT.

WE RECOGNIZE THE IMPORTANCE OF RENEWABLE ENERGY AND CLEAN  ENERGY.

BUT, YOU'RE RIGHT, WE HAVE GOT  TO CONVINCE LOCAL COMMUNITIES, LOCAL ELECTED OFFICIALS,  STAKEHOLDERS, ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS THAT NOT ONLY ARE THESE  PROJECTS IMPORTANT, BUT WE HAVE TO DO THEM IN AN  ENVIRONMENTALLY SENSITIVE WAY.

AND THERE IS LOTS OF THINGS  THAT WE ARE DOING THAT I HOPE TURNS INTO A MODEL FOR HOW  OTHER PROJECTS SHOULD PROCEED.

REACHING OUT TO STAKEHOLDERS,  LIKE I MENTIONED, IS REALLY IMPORTANT.

WE FOR THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS HAVE VISITED WITH  NATIONAL ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS, LOCAL ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS,  SOME OF THE LANDOWNERS DON'T LIKE TRANSMISSION LINES IN  THEIR AREA.

AND WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WAYS  TO IMPROVE THE ENVIRONMENT WHEN WE ARE DONE.

THERE IS THINGS THAT WE CAN DO TO PRESERVE THE TOURISM, THE  BEAUTY OF NEW MEXICO, THE BOSQUE WHERE WE CROSS THE  RIVER, THOSE ARE ALL REALLY SENSITIVE AREAS THAT WE ARE  FOCUSED ON AND ARE DOING A LOT OF THINGS TO MAKE IT A MUCH  MORE ENVIRONMENTALLY SENSITIVE PROJECT THAT CARES ABOUT HOW  WE CROSS THE RIVER, WHERE WE CROSS THE RIVER.

CAN WE PUT IN TECHNOLOGY ON THE TRANSMISSION LINES THAT  WILL HELP THE SAND HILL CRANES OR OTHER MIGRATORY BIRDS AVOID  THE LINE.

CAN WE CORRIDIZE OUR  TRANSMISSION LINES?

CAN WE FOLLOW OTHER  TRANSMISSION LINES SO THAT WE ARE NOT GOING IN PRISTINE  AREAS THAT ARE UNTOUCHED.

CAN WE CO-LOCATE LINES ON  OTHER PEOPLES' LINES.

ALL THOSE THINGS ARE WHAT WE  TRY TO DO.

WE ALSO ARE TALKING TO LOCAL  GROUPS ABOUT IMPORTANT THINGS RELATIVE TO THE BOSQUE.

YES, WE ARE GOING TO IMPACT THE BOSQUE.

WE ARE GOING TO BE CROSSING THE MIDDLE RIO GRANDE VALLEY.

IT IS INEVITABLE THAT WE DO THAT.

THAT IS THE ONLY WAY TO GET TO THE WIND BUT WE CAN LOOK AT  PURCHASING CONSERVATION PROPERTY, WATER RIGHTS.

WE CAN LOOK AT DEVELOPING THE BOSQUE AND CREATING  OPPORTUNITIES FOR SOME OF THE LOCAL ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS,  NONPROFIT GROUPS TO IMPROVE  THE BOSQUE.

Laura: JOHN RYAN, THANK YOU  FOR JOINING ME.

I APPRECIATE IT.

Ryan: THANK YOU SO MUCH.

Laura: SANDRA NOLL, THANK  YOU FOR JOINING ME TODAY.

WELCOME TO NEW MEXICO  IN FOCUS.

Noll: THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR  THE OPPORTUNITY.

Laura: YOU LIVE IN SOCORRO  COUNTY AND YOU HAVE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THAT.

WHAT ARE YOU WORRIED ABOUT?

Noll: THIS HAS BEEN IN  PROCESS FOR QUITE SOME TIME AND IT IS NOT JUST TWO LINES.

THESE ARE TWO PARALLEL HIGH VOLTAGE LINE SETS AND SO WE  ARE CONCERNED ABOUT A NUMBER OF THINGS.

THIS IS THE SECOND TIME IT IS BEING CONSIDERED AS AN  ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT BY THE BUREAU OF LAND MANAGEMENT AND  SO THERE IS SOME CROSSINGS THAT ARE BEING CONSIDERED.

ONE OF THEM WILL IMPACT SEVILLA NATIONAL WILDLIFE  REFUGE.

THAT IS A GREAT CONCERN.

THE SECOND CONCERN IS THAT THE MIDDLE RIO GRANDE VALLEY IS  PART OF THE CENTRAL FLYWAY FROM ALASKA AND CANADA DOWN TO  SOUTH AMERICA AND WE HAVE MORE THAN 400 BIRD SPECIES THAT USE  THAT FLYWAY.

SO, TWO SETS OF HIGH VOLTAGE  MULTIPLE LINE CROSSINGS OF THAT RIVER, OF OUR RIO GRANDE,  WILL BE OF GREAT IMPACT.

THE THIRD MAJOR THING THAT WE  ARE CONCERNED ABOUT IS REALLY THE IMPACT ECONOMICALLY ON  ECOTOURISM PARTICULARLY ON COUNTIES LIKE SOCORRO THAT  COUNT A LOT ON THAT.

Laura: YOU MENTIONED  MIGRATORY BIRDS.

WHAT KIND OF SPECIES ARE WE  TALKING ABOUT AND WHY IS THE RIO GRANDE IMPORTANT TO THESE  PARTICULAR SPECIES?

Noll: THERE IS MORE THAN  400 SPECIES THAT MIGRATE ALONG OR UTILIZE THIS RIVER CORRIDOR  FOR HABITAT.

AND JUST HISTORICALLY IT HAS BEEN A PART OF THE EAST/WEST,  MID CONTINENT FLYWAY FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS.

THE BIRD PEOPLE OFTEN THINK ABOUT IN THIS AREA IS THE SAND  HILL CRANE.

IT WINTERS AT BOSQUE DEL  APACHE AND IT IS ICONIC TO THIS PART OF NEW MEXICO.

WE ALL TELL OUR SEASONS BY WHEN THIS BIRD COMES AND GOES  BUT THE LARGE BIRDS LIKE THE SAND HILL CRANE AND WATERFOWL  ARE NOT SO MANEUVERABLE.

A LOT OF THEM ROOST ON THE  RIVER.

THESE BIRDS DON'T ROOST IN  TREES.

AND SO WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT  THEIR COMING AND GOING TO ROOST IN THE RIVER.

THE SONG BIRDS MOSTLY MIGRATE AT NIGHT.

SO, AGAIN, WIRES THAT HAVEN'T BEEN THERE AND THEY HAVE BEEN  DOING THIS FOR GENERATIONS AND GENERATIONS OF BIRDS, THEY  WILL BE IMPACTED AS WELL.

Laura: CAN YOU TALK A  LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE CHALLENGE THAT RURAL NEW MEXICANS FACE  WHEN THERE ARE PROJECTS LIKE THIS IN TERMS OF HAVING YOUR  VOICE HEARD, BEING A PART OF THE PROCESS, MAKING IT THROUGH  THE PROCESS?

Noll: WE OFTEN TALK ABOUT  IT AS A MATTER OF SOCIAL OR ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE.

A LOT OF TIMES, BIG PROJECTS LIKE THIS ACTUALLY SAY THEY  ARE LOOKING FOR THE PATH OF LEAST RESISTANCE AND THAT  HAPPENS TO BE OFTEN RURAL AREAS AND INDIVIDUAL FARMERS  AND RANCHERS THAT DON'T HAVE THE BIG VOICE OR CLOUT OF  OTHER AREAS.

SO, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT  PEOPLE ARE REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT.

I THINK STUDIES HAVE SHOWN THAT PROPERTY VALUES DROP  ABOUT 15 TO 20% WHEN THEY ARE IMPACTED BY THIS KIND OF  CONSTRUCTION.

SOME PEOPLE HAVE HEALTH  CONCERNS.

THAT IS STILL AN ISSUE WITH  SOME OF THESE HIGH VOLTAGE LINES.

AND THEN THE POTENTIAL TO DECREASE TOURISM IS A BIG PART  OF THAT AND THE BURGEONING FILM INDUSTRY IS JUST  BEGINNING TO USE AREAS LIKE OURS MORE AND MORE.

SO, I THINK THOSE ARE SOME OF THE THINGS.

WE ARE NOT SAYING DON'T GENERATE.

WE ARE NOT SAYING DON'T TRANSMIT.

JUST DO IT AS SMART AS POSSIBLE.

CONSIDERING PEOPLE AND  WILDLIFE.

Laura: SANDRA NOLL, THANK  YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING ME.

Noll: APPRECIATE THE  OPPORTUNITY TO BRING THIS TO YOUR VIEWERS.