>>Well, I will tell you it's not a great experience by any means.

And we can look at it that way because that's exactly what it is, not being able to use water.

When I think about it, I think about a saying that I heard, every time there's a problem there comes a solution.

And what I truly believe, that what's happening, and I've said this many times, that what's happening right now in Benton Harbor, it could be in DC tomorrow, in Mississippi.

It could be in New Orleans.

It can be all over.

And my friends who call me from afar, I say to them, when's the last time you have actually, do you know when the pipes under your home were actually placed or you have checked.

So what we're doing in Benton Harbor, and this is where it's twofold, bad experience that we're turning into something that could be wonderful for the residents of Benton Harbor.

The mayor will speak about the pipes and how we're having them replaced throughout the entire city.

Then he would also, we would talk about what this is doing for our community.

We're building capacity.

We're giving people hope and we're changing the game of Benton Harbor, Michigan.

We're improving and we're providing solutions from water, pipes, to other things down the road.

So when you think about this whole entire challenge is what I call it, is that it gives us a sense of hope of what is yet to come.

Even as we go through this challenge for the city of Benton Harbor and its residents.

Thank you.

>>So for you, what is the daily routine, I guess, look like to make sure that you have water that you can drink, that you can brush your teeth with, that you can bathe with.

What are you doing to get through this?

>>So, you know, we hear the phrase about a village and about a movement.

That is what has happened.

Neighbors are helping neighbors.

The state has come in to help us.

Even the federal government has come in to help us.

People that you normally wouldn't talk to every day, it's like, can I help you?

Because it's true.

We can not drink our water.

So today, as I speak, we're getting used to it because we are survivors.

Benton Harbor is resilient.

And I hope that is the message that is taken from this conversation throughout the entire nation, about how resilient we are.

Because think about it, we cannot drink our water.

That's, and water is a necessity.

But it is bringing our community together.

It is showing the resilience of this wonderful community and what we're doing.

I'm not saying it's all bad, and I'm definitely not saying it as good right now.

But every single day, there are water distribution centers.

Every single day, there are churches and organizations going door to door delivering water.

Every single day, there are people uniting and coming together because of this challenge that we are facing.

So it's not all good, but I'm telling you, I thank God for the solutions that this situation, this challenge, is presenting themselves to the residents and the businesses and the stakeholders of Benton Harbor.

>>Yeah.

Yeah.

So Mayor Muhammad, you have been trying to, first of all, help the residents there get through this, but also I know trying to attract attention from state and federal authorities and figure out what the short-term and the long-term solutions are.

Let us know where you are.

This has been going on for a long time, we should say that upfront in Benton Harbor.

Let us know where you are though in the process of trying to solve this right now.

>>Well, I think that it's important to know that what legally is to be done in 15 years, Governor Whitmer and her administration has put the funding and resources in place where we can get it done in 18 months.

And that's unprecedented.

>>Yeah and that's the replacement of the lead service lines.

>>That's the replacement of the lead service lines.

We're about 9 close to 10% in that effort.

We have the bids out, our city engineer, city manager, and staff are engaging contractors, working with the state where we'll be able to replace up to 4,000 lead service lines.

And I've said this before, you know, quoting it Ecclesiastes 10:19, that money answersth all things.

So, you know, a $30 million deal is on the table and a city like Benton Harbor who just climbed out a receivership in 2017, where we went back to Public Act, the Home Rule Act, pardon me, where we now are governing ourselves.

And we need the help of the state.

We need the help of the federal government, which we have both now, and we're moving forward to remedy and fix the problem.

>>So I also want to give you a chance to talk about how we got to this place, and who's responsible?

How much of the work that was done to try to save, quote unquote, Benton Harbor from financial ruin should have been focused, I guess, on this kind of infrastructure.

I mean, we had the state running the city twice in the last decade.

Why was this problem not found and dealt with then I guess.

>>Well, under the Snyder Administration engaging in urban centers, there was a different approach, where Public Act 4, Public Act 4 3 6, where you had the emergency manager who was to come in and (unintelligible) one man solution.

And our first emergency manager, you probably have learned or know that he tried to sell the water money and tried to outsource it.

Then he laid off half the staff and fired the director.

And the second emergency manager, you know, tried to manage the problem, but, you know, it had mounted.

So by the time we inherited or received the government back, the water department or water plant had been neglected for 7 years.

So in terms of a lot of the efficiencies that came out in the report from the EPA, as well as from Eagle.

But with all that being said, you know, it's easy to play the blame game, and I'm not in a position as the mayor at this point to go about assigning blame, because there's enough blame to go around for everyone.

But again, at the end of the day, it's money.

It costs money to fix problems.

And three years ago, we didn't have the money.

>>So Regina Strong, this is the same old song in a different place in Michigan.

And I think we would be remiss if we didn't note that this seems to happen, certainly more frequently if not exclusively, in communities that are majority African-American.

Talk about from the state perspective, what we're doing wrong, what we're getting wrong about clean water.

>>Well first thing, you know, as the environmental justice public advocate for the state, a position that was created in 2019, that's exactly why my office exists now.

Because there was a realization that communities that had disparate impact of disinvestment and lack of opportunity also had lack of resources as the mayor, you know, referenced to address some of the challenges that we as an industrial state, as a state with lead pipes that have been in the ground for 80, 70, 60 years.

Communities across this part of the country, basically, have a very old infrastructure.

Communities have been in more of a position to address that than others.

And unfortunately, many of the communities in the lowest and most, I'd say, had the most disparate impact of all of that are communities of color.

Our black communities, our low income communities across Michigan and across the Midwest and across the country.

And so having both that focus on environmental justice communities and understanding how you both support the city as it moves forward and support the people.

Because one of the things that Princella said that is so vitally important is people don't want to be victimized.

They don't want, you know, for people to say, oh, poor Benton Harbor.

What they want to do is be able to live like everybody else, have the resources to do that, and have the support to make that happen.

And so we know that communities have a lack of resources.

It is incumbent upon us as, you know, state partners, federal partners, to support communities, you know, because they're already starting at a point where over time institutional decisions have put them at a disadvantage.

And so now how do we fix that?

And that's part of the work that's going on right now in Benton Harbor.

Because you're absolutely right, as a predominantly black community, you know, people see that and they think, oh, environmental justice communities are just black communities.

They're not just black communities, but oftentimes the disinvestment in majority, you know, black communities and black and brown communities, there's been less investment.

There's been less opportunity over time.

And so you're exactly right.

That's why we need to focus.

And that's why my office exists to help us do that from the state perspective.

>>Yeah, so we don't have a terrible amount of time left, but I do want to get you a chance to talk about, so we saw this happen in Flint.

Then we reacted and said, we're going to clean up the lead lines.

It's happening in Benton Harbor.

Now we're finding the money for that.

Do we have to keep doing it that way, where a crisis inspires the investment?

Or is there a plan to, I mean, I know we're talking about replacing lead lines over time, but can we go faster so that we don't have another crisis?

>>So I'm going to flip your question a little bit and say we need to go faster, right?

The challenge with that is resources and investment.

To the mayor's point, we have to be able to invest in communities.

We already know these aging infrastructure issues exist.

We already know certain communities are going to be at a disadvantage.

It is about finding the resources and money.

I think there is an opportunity right now with a lot of money coming down from the federal government to help communities and not just Benton Harbor.

There are other communities across the state who are in similar situations, or will be, because when we, as a state, created more stringent rules around identifying lead exceedances, the goal was to be able to address those faster and providing this window of resources and really getting communities to invest is so vitally important.

So we don't have to react to crisis because it will continue along this route until we've gotten rid of all the lead service lines, until we've invested in water systems.

I mean, there are thousands across the state of Michigan of water systems.

They're everywhere.

And all of them have aging infrastructure and some have been able to address them.

So we should not be in crisis mode.

We should be in a proactive mode.

And, you know, that's what the administration is really pushing for is the investment to be able to support communities in that work.

'Cause some of it has to happen at the local level whether the community has resources or not to do that.

And so we're looking for ways to make that happen.