- Welcome to Beyond the Classroom on PBS 39.

I'm your host, Joe Paccitti, and it's a pleasure to sit down with you this evening.

During this program, our goal is to equip parents, guardians and caregivers with the information and resources they need to make informed decisions about their children's educational experiences, both in and outside of the classroom.

Every week, we'll engage experts in the field.

At the end of each show, you'll walk away with resources and strategies generated from our conversations with guests.

Last week, we spoke with our guests about the best ways of helping students transition back into school this year.

One big takeaway from the conversation was the need to address our basic needs for belonging and health, both physically and mentally.

In education, we usually hear this phrase, "To Maslow before you Bloom."

In other words, we have to create a safe, nurturing, and fully-resourced environment for learning before any academic work can occur.

This week, we'll be exploring ways that caregivers can connect in meaningful ways with their schools, teachers, and curricula to foster academic growth and achievement at home.

Researchers are still examining the role of caregivers as teachers, so to speak, given the recent virtual learning we've all been a part of.

There are some findings that show the effectiveness of easy-to-implement strategies we can all use at home to help our children academically, and our guests this evening are going to discuss some of those with us.

Let's get started.

Thank you again for joining us this evening.

I want to introduce you to our esteemed guests tonight.

Right over here, we have Jess Kilmetz - Dr. Jess Kilmetz, my apologies - the director of curriculum and instruction in special services at the Phoenixville Area School District.

- Hi, Joe.

- Hi, Jess, good to see you.

Over here, we have Jen Brinson.

Jen Brinson is an assistant principal at the Owen J. Roberts Middle School.

- Yeah, good to see you, Joe.

- Good to see you, too.

And over on the big screen, we have Sam Varano.

Sam Varano is the principal of Souderton Area High School.

And, without kind of exposing any of our related experiences, we have about 100 years of combined experience in education here tonight.

So, it's a pleasure to be with all three of you.

Thank you for joining us.

Jess, if you don't mind, I'd like to start with you.

So, when we talk about relationships and building those, we often think about a parent or a caregiver building a relationship with a teacher, or a student building a relationship with a teacher.

From a district perspective, what kinds of ways can parents interact with the district to make sure that they're forging appropriate relationships that are meaningful for their learners at home?

- That's a really great question.

You know, speaking from my perspective in the realm of curriculum and instruction, at the district level, it can sometimes be hard for parents to relate to what's going on in, say, a central office.

But, you know, the bottom line is, first of all, ask your kids what's going on, what they're being taught, what the curriculum is like in their classes, and have those conversations with the people at the district level.

You know, I think more than ever, parents are really interested and involved now that they kind of got that glimpse in that window into what curriculum truly looks like when it's being delivered during our time of virtual instruction.

Now, they're really interested and just want to get a feel for what do all the curricula look like in our classes, K-12.

And so, I think more than ever, parents are asking those questions, certainly we're getting those questions a lot in the district.

We're getting those questions at board meetings, too, of course, you know, and I think it's really important that we have those conversations.

At my district, one of the ways that we meaningfully engage parents is by surveying them with regard to specific curricula.

It's actually a part of our curriculum writing process, and that is something we newly implemented.

But it's a great window into, you know, getting parents' feedback, from our perspective, about how they feel about the curricula.

And they have the opportunity, of course... That feedback has the opportunity to go both ways.

- That's excellent.

Especially to have that two-way street of communication.

Fantastic.

So, Jen, middle school, critically important, for some of us, a remarkably awkward time.

Actually, most of us, let's be honest, a very awkward time for all of us.

When it comes to building relationships especially...

I mean, you are a remarkable teacher, I had the pleasure of working with you for many years.

I saw the strong relationships that you built on a daily basis with our parents, with our students.

Moving into administration, especially at the middle level, what kinds of things are you seeing in terms of the way that parents build relationships?

And again, same question, to Jess' point.

How do you do it, and what would you encourage them to do?

- So, I would agree with Jess that the conversation with the student has to be primary.

You know, I grew up in a time when dinnertime conversations were the thing.

And today, families are just stretched in so many different directions that that dinnertime conversation might be a car conversation on the way to practice or on the way home from a game, or something along those lines.

The way that we engage parents is through a very open and transparent communication process.

They are welcome to call and email us at any time, but we certainly encourage them to call and email their teachers first if there's a concern.

But I also am a big fan of after-school activities, having events for kids, attending games, and so forth.

I can be found at almost every home football game, and we engage our kids and our families in that way.

So, just creating the fun for kids in school.

And it's not all about the content, but connection first.

- Yeah, absolutely.

And I think middle school in particular, that's a really critical time grade, grade 6-8 for us to really build those relationships with them, too.

Sam, same question to you, when it comes to the high school perspective.

And also, you know, as a parent, too, I know that you wanted to talk a little bit about that.

So, could you give us some perspective on relationships in that capacity?

- Sure, Joe.

Just that it's a...

I think it's a really challenging, delicate balance for high school students, parents, and schools to connect, in that, as a parent, you certainly want to hope that your child has earned some freedom and autonomy to control his or her own experience with you, staying just involved enough that you can celebrate as many small and large victories that your student has as a parent, as possible, as well as being close enough to know when there might be a concern, for example, in academics.

And I think a way to do that is from, again, the parent perspective.

Most schools put their daily announcements on their websites.

You, as a parent, can just very quickly, in just a matter of 30 seconds each day, look to see what's being announced in school, seeing if any of it may pertain to your kid, and then bringing it up when they're at home, asking, "Did you hear the announcement about X-club or golf tryouts," or whatever.

And also certainly, as a parent, almost every school now has an online parent access system to grading, where you can check in on your child.

The challenging thing is you don't want to be overbearing.

And, from my perspective, as both the parent and the principal, let your child know you're watching every second.

You can let your kid know, certainly that you're looking, but it's better done by asking your kid questions.

"How's everything going?

"Have you been submitting your homework?

"Are you doing well in X, Y and Z class?"

Maybe once or twice a week, again, just a really fine balance between staying involved, knowing when to celebrate especially, and then, also being able to understand when there are concerns, so you can address them with your kid.

It's a challenge to be a high school parent.

- Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely.

And so, one of the things you touched on there, Sam, and I'm interested to get feedback on this, too, is the online grade book.

You had mentioned an online portal where parents can access those.

Some people treat that as a substitute for a conversation with their students' teacher.

And in many cases, that's not enough.

So, where do I draw that line, and when should I have a conversation?

Should I be concerned if I start to see their grades slip, or should I do it proactively before the grade book opens?

What advice do you have?

- I think balance is key, and it's all about knowing what tools are available to you.

So, you know, is your school using some sort of learning management system, like Canvas or Google classroom?

You know, that's a tool that you can look at, kind of, see what the assignments posted are.

Maybe there's a test or something similar that you can take a peek at.

What does the online grade book say?

What does the teacher say?

Sometimes you are wanting to reach out to a teacher, which you should feel encouraged to do.

And sometimes you want to talk to your child directly.

So, I think having that balance of tools at your disposal is really important.

- I think also understanding that there's context behind every grade, and an online grade book is very cold because all you see is a number or a letter, and you don't know the context or the rubric, or the substantial commentary that a teacher might provide for a student in feedback.

We've actually encouraged our teachers this year to hold the grade for, you know, a full period.

You know, give the kids the rubric, let them figure out what your commentary is and where they can correct, and then give them the grade, because the feedback is the most important thing, and not necessarily the grade.

- Excellent point.

- Yeah.

Sam, are you seeing similar patterns?

Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off, there's a bit of a delay.

Go ahead and respond.

- Well, just again, I'm taking it from the perspective of a parent that, again, back to that balance.

We don't, as parents...

If you've got a high-achieving student, celebrate their victories, ask them how things are going.

That high-achievement student who, you know, when told to answer five problems with an optional, to do two more, they'll do six more.

We don't need to worry about them.

In fact, what we need to worry about is squeezing them too tightly and putting too much pressure on them, which happens.

Who we really need to be concerned about are the middle student, which are many, and the lower-range student, as far as academic motivation.

And even there, if we're constantly questioning and constantly calling the teacher, we're not...

I don't believe parents get more out of kids, they frustrate the heck out of kids, and then, they have a strained, very precious relationship between parent and kid over school.

So, as a parent, when you become concerned, I would first ask your child, I wouldn't ask on the first missed homework assignment, especially once a kid gets to high school.

And, depending upon what your kid says, I would then communicate with the teacher.

My question would be, "How can I help as a parent?"

- Yeah.

Well, that was my next point, too.

I have two young children, one of whom is in second grade, and one of whom is in kindergarten.

And one of the struggles that my wife, who's an educator, and I have, is we taught high school.

And so, connecting with that coursework meaningfully was always very challenging and continues to be a challenge.

If I don't know something about it, how exactly can I start to know more about it?

I know you mentioned curriculum, Jess.

But what are some more in-depth ways that I can kind of connect with that and assist my child at home?

- That's a really great question.

And of course, the teacher is probably the first and best resource, especially for younger-grade students where they see primarily one teacher all day long.

That's the best person to connect with, for sure.

But again, the tools at your disposal are varied, and usually include actual curriculum documents posted on a school district's website.

So, you can peek through and see exactly what's being taught, usually when it's being taught, sometimes how it's being assessed, and maybe even what resources are being used.

So, I think that's a really great step to take that a lot of parents don't think to reach out for.

But those curriculum documents can reveal a lot about what's happening in the classroom.

And, if you're concerned about evaluation and grades, you know, that's another great place to look for how your student and your child is being evaluated.

- And utilizing that learning management system, the Google Classroom, the Canvas, and what have you to affiliate your parental email with the teacher's Google Classroom.

So, we use Guardian, connected with Google Classroom, and it allows our parents to go in and see exactly what is being assigned and what is being taught in the classroom.

And so many resource videos exist today that teachers don't have to necessarily direct instruct.

They can post a resource video that will help the parent in the evening, say, "OK, this is how you do "that factorial equation."

And, you know, where some of us wouldn't have a clue.

- Yeah, myself included.

You said factorial, and it rang a bell, but a very distant one.

And it's not resonating with me right now.

Yeah.

So, I guess one of the biggest challenges, and I talked about this last week with our guest is going back.

Right?

And we don't want to talk about something that has been talked about ad nauseum, but how have we, each of you respectively, kind of adjusted the way that you build relationships with your constituents, so to speak, with your stakeholders in the district?

So, Sam, are there additional strategies or some other special things that you've done, or some silver lining, so to speak, that you found out of this virtual learning environment?

- So, Joe, this is one area where I don't have much experience because, quite frankly, my school was in school in-person all last year.

So, we just had such a small number of students in virtual learning where our teachers who were involved with it did a great job.

It's just not something that I had to give much thought to or adjust to, other than just, again, assuring parents in every way, shape, or form that we're going to offer a safe environment for their kids when they come back in September.

But it was it was no great transition for our kids in my school.

- Oh, that's good to hear.

That's good to hear.

Yeah.

Jen, how about yours?

- So, I spent last year at Southern Lehigh High School as one of the assistant principals there.

And our principal, Mrs. Garrillo, would engage parents in the evening with parent advisory meetings where they could provide feedback, and so forth.

And prior to the pandemic, we did those in-person, and we might get ten parents, maybe a dozen that would that would come to the high school in the evening.

When we went online and took those meetings to Zoom, we had sometimes 40-50 parents that would Zoom in and talk.

And it gave us a lot of great feedback about what the community was looking for.

Now, at a middle school, it's a very different game to engage parents.

So, we try to do that through very positive emails, very positive postcards.

I have stationery made every year to send home and send those notes of positivity when a kid does a really great thing and hopefully that will engage our community and open up some dialog and conversation, as well.

But we want to point out the positives.

- Yeah, that's great.

- One of the great things that my superintendent had been doing for years, but similarly was not as well-attended except when we were in this virtual setting, were these superintendent chats that he had with families and brought in a variety of administrators to participate.

We saw hundreds of families attending those from our very small district during Covid, and now, post-Covid, as well.

And so, we continued those sessions virtually.

And it's a great opportunity to connect with parents in particular.

So, parents will attend, sometimes they watch through YouTube, sometimes they register to get a Zoom link, and they come and can ask questions.

And a variety of administrators speak to inform the parents about what's going on.

Oftentimes there's questions about reopening, and health and safety.

Sometimes there's questions about grading and curriculum.

Sometimes there's questions about upcoming events.

I mean, it runs the gamut.

And so, it's a really nice way to connect with families.

And oftentimes, those Zoom meetings lead to one-on-one conversations after the fact, which again, I think is just a nice way to connect, and a really powerful way to not only disseminate information but get feedback from the community.

- Yeah, that's great.

And so, you actually made me think of, all of us are administrators here, and that transition from... And, you know, it's reaching a little bit from teacher to administrator.

Right?

That transition was difficult, I think, for all of us in some way, shape or form, a total adjustment of the way that we have our frame of mind, how we comport ourselves daily.

And I'm often thinking from a parent's perspective of how to interact with an administrator.

Right?

Regardless of where they fall on that spectrum, so to speak, of the administrative ladder.

Whether it's central office, or if it's a building administration, I always struggle with how to interact with them because I don't interact with them the same way as a teacher.

And there might be a general sense that you only talk to an administrator when there's a problem.

- Right We often find that parents will come to us with problems, and we're constantly looking for the solution.

And the one thing that you sometimes cannot provide is a solution on the spot.

And sometimes, you have to dig a little deeper.

You have to go to a teacher and say, "Tell me about this experience, what happened here?"

Or maybe you need to go to some students and say, "Tell me about what happened here."

And I think that is frustrating for parents, that we are not always at the ready with an answer, that it might take some time to get to that answer.

But having that feedback is critical, and being able to come back to a parent and say, "This is what we've found, "this is what we've discovered, and we can either move forward "in this direction, or maybe we need to rethink."

And being open to that conversation is important.

- Yeah, and I did just want to couch that question with one thing, all of you were excellent administrators, and that's why I have you here today, because you built relationships very effectively.

So for people watching, that's why they're here.

So, Jess, how about you?

- You know, I think building on what you said, Jen, that's an opportunity.

Right?

So, even when parents are coming to you with a problem for you to solve, that's an opportunity to continue to build that relationship in a positive manner.

You know, maybe you can address the problem right there.

Maybe you can't.

But either way, you have that opportunity to really connect with the family, learn more about that family, and learn how to better serve them.

So, I think when you approach it from that perspective, even problems are just a great way to connect with family.

- Absolutely.

- Yeah.

- So, you asked, I believe, how a parent would approach an administrator.

And all that I would ask is, and what I try to convey in phone conversations or personal conversations, is that we're just human beings trying to do the right thing by your kid.

And sometimes, that's multifaceted.

Doing the right thing by a kid may mean doing the right thing by a teacher that can allow the teacher to take risks with that kid, which is also the key to education.

We want our teachers and coaches to be able to teach and coach our kids through mistakes.

If they're not making mistakes, they're not growing.

But if the teachers and administrators, and coaches are put on the defensive, and it's assumed that we're not trying to do the right thing, we're afraid to take those risks and make mistakes, thus limiting kids' growth.

So, I guess I went off on a tangent there.

All I'd add is that we're trying to do the right thing, and I try to be open going into a conversation.

I think it's inhuman for me to think that I would not go into a conversation with a parent about an issue that I've been forewarned about, and not have thought about what my answer or resolution is.

I'm going to come in thinking, "Yes, I can do this," or, "No, I can't."

I work really hard at trying to be open to change what I'm thinking.

And all that I want to ask is that if parents can just relax, they just treat us... And almost every parent I've ever dealt with has done this, we're just human beings trying to do the right things.

- Yeah.

And I think, you know, what that drills down to, Sam, and it's a beautiful, very punctuated point, is we just want what's best for our kids.

And I think that an important takeaway is that we're all in the same team.

We wouldn't be doing what we're doing or dedicate our whole lives to it if it weren't for the sake of everybody's children.

That's why we do, you know, we love what we do.

And there's a reason for that.

So, to that point, kind of switching gears a little bit, moving towards the educational components at home.

So, there's that saying that a parent or a caregiver is a child's first teacher.

In what ways would you consider them their first teacher?

- Parents are the expert on their child, for sure.

And we need to defer to that expertize in our schools, from a teacher perspective, from a principal perspective, from a district office perspective, that's always true.

And so, we know that a parent comes to us with a great deal of knowledge about their child, and it's getting that information that's our job.

Obviously, we don't need to pry and know everything about their home lives, but we do need to know what the parent thinks it's important for us to know in order to best teach the children sitting in front of us.

So, I think that's something that's really important for all of us in school districts to remember.

- And I think, you know, at the middle school level, we get our kids for two grade levels, seventh and eighth grade, and then they're gone.

They're at the high school.

So, we have to learn about our kids very quickly.

And so, having those conversations with parents where you ask them, "Tell me something about your student, "tell me what I need to know about Johnny and how he learns, "and how he grows, how does he respond to a back step, "a mistake, and how can I best help him or her "learn moving forward?"

And it's a very quick process in education, we don't have them very long.

Parents certainly have them for a lot longer time and know so much more about them.

And Jess, you're right, they are the experts.

And we have a lot to learn, and they can teach us much.

- Yeah.

- Trying to do with and for my own children, who are 18 and 20, senior in high school, junior in college, just for the perspective, trying to, with and for them what I just said, for parents to realize about administrators, what we're trying to do with kids.

Man, it's so much harder as a parent to do it than as a principal, trying to advise a parent what to do.

I'm so much better at giving advice and, maybe in my own mind, criticizing, "Man, parent, "why can't you just put your foot down on that issue?"

Because, as a parent, I'm just not that good at that, because it's really hard when you love your kids so much, it's really hard to let them fail and not step in so much, and to draw clear boundaries.

I'm not saying I don't do it or that I'm a failure as a parent.

I don't think I am.

But as an administrator, I really try to empathize that it's just so hard, parenting, and I try not to judge.

I think all of this...

If I can show the parents what I truly think, it goes into building those relationships.

And just one last thing.

So, I guess to parents just know I'm trying to say, "Do as I say or advise, not necessarily as I do," because what I'm asking you to do is really hard.

And also, in my administrative career, what we have done is, we always try to communicate almost all positive to parents.

One thing that we've done very successfully, we haven't been able to do it during Covid, we'll bring it back next year, is over the summer, the administrators, the teachers, and our link crew orientation leaders, our junior and seniors in high school, take to the streets, and we go out and randomly visit about 20% of our incoming ninth graders just to knock on their door, hand them a note of important events, and to say, "We can't wait to see you at our high school."

And that's our first step.

And that's really how we feel.

- Yeah.

That's excellent.

Thank you, Sam.

- And honestly, that opportunity for leadership for students, too, is another takeaway for parents, as well.

If they, you know, I think very often and again, we are our own worst critics in many ways of our own children.

But when we take a look at them, you know, encouraging them to take those risks and understanding that we know best practice is to make mistakes and learn from them, because that's how true learning happens.

And we need to apply that no matter how hard that might be for us as parents, for sure.

So, to kind of wrap up our segment, I always like to ask, and I say "always", this is the second show, but as of right now, I always love to ask this question.

So, we're called Beyond the Classroom.

If you could give a very succinct piece of advice for parents watching tonight to employ a strategy to build a relationship with a teacher, with an administrator, with a district office person, what exactly would that be?

Beyond the classroom for them?

- Again, coming from that district perspective where I don't always hear from parents as often as maybe they want to reach out, reach out.

We're there definitely to listen, respond to the surveys, give us a call, do show up to events that we're hosting that might give you an opportunity to ask questions or get informed about the current happenings.

We want to hear from parents as often as possible.

I know that's really hard to fit into a parent's busy schedule, especially nowadays.

But the opportunities that you have that you can take advantage of, please do.

We definitely want to hear from you.

- That's great.

- And kids will learn a lot from the parents, modeling that behavior.

They watch everything.

And they see what their parents do, and they mimic their parents in so many ways.

You know that saying "apples don't fall far from the trees" is so true.

So, model your own best practices and, you know, approach administrators.

We are, in fact, human.

And we love great conversations, and we love to talk about kids and what they can do, and what attributes they bring to the world.

And the kids will watch that, and they'll see that, you know, "Hey, those administrators aren't so bad after all."

- That's always a good takeaway for them to have, for sure.

Yeah.

Sam?

- For parents to reach out to teachers or administrators, school personnel, my advice is simple.

Email the person for whom you have a question, or want to make a comment, saying, "Can you please call me at X number?"

Without saying anything else, and then...or can you meet with him or her?

Once you're in that person-to-person conversation, whether in person on the phone, then ask you your question, not in email.

Don't give that opportunity for the school personnel to read it the wrong way, or perhaps be on the defensive.

If you're going...

I would, with a question, email, saying, "Can you please give me a call?"

- Yeah, I think that's excellent advice, too.

And I think we give it to our students, as well, teaching tone, and it's remarkably difficult, whether it's a text message or particularly an email to read into to tone effectively there.

Yeah.

So, I want to thank all three of you.

That brings us to the end of our time tonight.

So, I just appreciate each of you so much.

In many ways, you've all been mentors to me, so it's a real pleasure to sit down with each of you and talk with you tonight.

So, Dr. Varano, thank you so much, from Souderton High School, Jen Brinson from Owen J. Roberts Middle School, and Dr. Kilmetz from Phoenixville Area School District.

Thank you so much again.

- Thanks so much, Joe.

- We appreciate it.

- Thank you.

So, as the saying, or the proverb, rather, goes, "It takes a village to raise a child."

And we hope that you'll consider our program a part of your village.

Do you have questions or comments for us?

We want to hear from you.

Go to... Or join the conversation on social media.

Goodnight.