- Just ahead on "Black Issues Forum," three childhood friends, one shared dream, and a family's legacy that has changed Raleigh forever.

We discover how Raleigh Raised is building more than structures.

They're building community.

Coming up next, stay with us.

[upbeat music] - [Announcer] Quality public television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you who invite you to join them in supporting PBS NC.

[upbeat music] ♪ - Welcome to "Black Issues Forum."

I'm your host, Kenia Thompson.

Today we're bringing together business, community, and legacy.

We meet two of three childhood friends who grew up in Raleigh and are now co-founders of Raleigh Raised, a real estate development company that's redefining what it means to build for community.

And we'll hear how their latest project carries a name that speaks volumes, The Holt at Oberlin, honoring a family who fought for educational equity during one of our nation's greatest periods of social change.

So let's get right to it and start introductions because if you haven't noticed, we have a very full set today.

To my right, we've got co-founders of Raleigh Raised Development and brothers for life, LeVelle Moton, and Terrell Midgett.

And to my left, I have the honor of introducing Joseph Holt Jr, a true trailblazer in civil rights.

And just in case you haven't made the connection yet, he is also the father of our executive producer, Deborah Holt Noel.

Welcome, everyone.

- Thank you.

- Thanks for having us.

- Yes, this is great.

I love having this full set.

I think we probably should do this more often, LeVelle and Terrell, I would be remiss if we didn't mention CJ Mann, who is the third person in the group.

But let's talk about growing up together in Raleigh, what that was like, what you saw, and why you created Raleigh Raised.

LeVelle, I'll start with you.

- Well, I've known this guy to my right since we were nine, 10 years old.

We met at the Raleigh Boys Club like so many kids in southeast Raleigh during that time.

And it was a safe haven for us.

And we just instantly bonded and had a unique friendship.

- [Kenia] Yeah.

- And that friendship has lasted, you know, for 35, 40 years.

And so what happens within that friendship is that you develop a sense of trust.

He's probably the most solid individual outside of my family members that I can lean on.

- [Kenia] Yeah.

- Right, and I'm proud to say that.

So couple of years ago we saw this gentrification thing taking place, and we had always done some business together from my basketball camps, and you know, little minute things such as that.

And so we just had a sit down along with CJ and said, man, lets start a development company because we felt like if anyone should benefit from our community, it should be us, right?

Because we are the ones that's well invested, our friends, his father, family, loved ones.

Those are the people that carried this community when no one thought about it, right?

So we needed to preserve this legacy, and who else knew the challenges and difficulties of this community better than us?

So we knew exactly what we needed.

And so from that idea, Raleigh Raised was born.

- [Kenia] Was born.

- Yeah.

- Terrell, when you, you looked at everyone's skill sets, did it work?

Like when y'all thought, okay, I'll do this, I'll do this.

What do you do?

What does LeVelle do?

What does CJ do?

- Yeah, so I grew up in a family owned business.

And so we started in '87 doing lawn care.

- [Kenia] Yeah.

- And we kind of migrated to full service facility services.

And that's kind of how we got in the mesh with CJ and his father, because they're a full service land acquisition and real estate firm as well.

- [Kenia] Yeah.

- And so they do a lot of purchasing of land for DOT.

And a lot of times we were in rooms that we were bidding on jobs together and as two different entities, and a lot of times we didn't have the capacity.

So we wanted to be able to bring together a entity that could be competitive in those fields.

And so, again, we sat down, you know, me and LeVelle talks constantly, and CJ's a little younger than us, but he has been in the fold because he once attended LeVelle's camp.

And so we kind of meshed together and has been a strong bond ever since.

- Ever since, when was Raleigh Raised established?

- 2020.

- 2020.

- Okay, all right, so pandemic.

- Yeah, pandemic.

- [Kenia] Okay, and we.

- Had a lot of thinking time.

- Had a lot of thinking time, you're right.

Now, Mr.

Holt, you are from the Raleigh area.

You grew up in the Raleigh area.

Tell us a little bit about what Raleigh used to look like growing up for you.

- Well, Raleigh was quite different when I was young, as opposed to how it is now.

One of the first things I think about is the fact that Raleigh was smaller then, much smaller.

Now sometimes when I'm talking with a person from Raleigh, and I'll ask 'em where they're from, and they're giving me the part of Raleigh they're from, and I don't know what they're talking about.

- [Kenia] Right.

- But I know old Raleigh, so Raleigh was a lot, lot smaller then.

But of course it was also a segregated town.

- [Kenia] Yes.

- When I grew up.

Segregation was a way of life, yes.

- And LeVelle mentioned gentrification, right?

How have you seen the change due to gentrification in Raleigh?

- Well, the classic example of gentrification.

- That's a little.

- Is the community I grew up in, I grew up in Oberlin.

- [Kenia] Yes.

- And when I grew up, Oberlin consisted on its main artery, Oberlin Road, of just homes and residences from the 300 block all the way to the 400 block, which was essentially the section that defined the black community.

- [Kenia] Yes.

- Of that part of the road.

Homes, houses, yards with flower gardens and all that kind of thing.

I knew just about everybody on the street.

And now there are hardly any homes or houses from the 300 block to the 1400 block.

It's one big commercialization.

And quite honestly, it's dispiriting to me to drive through Oberlin now.

Because I go through there, and in my mind I'm picturing how it was, and it's nothing like now, yeah.

- Nothing like that, yeah.

And I also grew up in Raleigh for the most part, and, you know, recalling what it looked like in that space.

And for those that don't know, this is kind of a downtown Raleigh area, not too far from North Carolina State University.

And there's been so much rapid growth that's happening that I don't think included us in it.

When you, you know, my parents all the time say, I wanna move 'cause they live in that area.

And I'm like, well, where are you moving to?

'Cause they wanna stay in Raleigh, but there's nothing affordable anymore.

- That's right.

- So when y'all thought to, and we'll go to why we're here today to the groundbreaking for The Holt at Oberlin, but when y'all saw what was happening in Raleigh, what did you know you needed to do with Raleigh Raised to ensure that people like my parents can stay in Raleigh?

- Well, the first thing, you know, for me was, you know, I was from that part of town.

I was actually from Lane Street.

And you know, unfortunately when I grew up, it was a beautiful neighborhood until crack decimated our communities.

And then once crack cocaine, the inception of crack cocaine just kind of tore the community apart in my humble opinion.

And so now you had a bunch of drugs and violence, it seemed like people began selling the drug to take care of their family, or they were using it to deal with the fact that they couldn't.

And so me being a kid and what the city perceived as a rock bottom part of town, well, when you rock bottom, you get a full view down there and so I knew what the community needed.

I knew the challenges because I was just speaking from a kid's heart.

I knew what I needed as a child.

I knew I needed the funding.

I knew the most basic fundamental component of American life is just a roof over your head that you can afford.

Like forget everything else, right?

So we talk about this American dream and so on and so forth and so once I got with Levelle and CJ, I said, the first thing we gotta do, we're not gonna compromise our value system, right?

My grandmother was a huge pillar in this neighborhood, so for us, this really wasn't about money, it was just about Moore's values and helping those who didn't have the platform or the voice that we could provide.

You know, there was so many people who invested in me and us when we were young and helped us get into this situation.

And so we can't forget about them because the one thing that we were always taught is never to forget where you come from.

So number one first and number one priority was just community engagement.

Seeing exactly what they need, bringing them to the table, allowing them to voice their opinions, concerns, ideologies, et cetera, et cetera and then just making sure we try to execute their vision.

So it look like it's a rally raise execution, but it's really the community's execution.

Now, we not Jesus or a Grand Poobah, but we don't walk on water like so we just three men trying to do the best that we can.

But unfortunately, when you're three Black men trying to do the best that you can, sometimes those expectations can be exceeded.

People put more on you and try to give you more power than you actually have.

And we understand that because God gives us strongest battles to his toughest soldiers.

So and that's a bear witness of that gentleman to your left over there.

- Yes, indeed.

- You know, we just tried to execute the game plan and the vision of the community and I just knew it would work out from there.

- I love that and I love how you went back to the community that made you essentially, right?

That made sure that you didn't go down the wrong path cuz that could have easily happened.

- Absolutely.

- And to come back and reinvest into community.

And I saw that at the groundbreaking.

So we recently attended the groundbreaking for the Hope at Oberlin.

Terrell, tell us a little bit about this community and what it will look like.

- So this unit, this development, will consist of a total of nine town homes and one single family home on a lot.

It's going to be a great development.

I mean, we've been planning this for last four or five years.

- [Interviewer] Wow.

- And we have been intentional and wanted to make sure that the whole story be told and the legacy will forever we carried on.

- And part of that Hope story, well first, what was the connection?

How did we find out about the Hope story?

- Wow.

You know, I'm the historian out the bus.

- Okay.

- So I just- - Okay.

- I just love history.

I just love, you know, going back in time and, you know, doing my homework and educational research on people and how we actually, you know, got into this position and then we had a mutual friend.

When I was young, the first basketball camp I ever attended was St.

Augustus, right, and it was literally three blocks up the street.

- [Interviewer] Yeah.

- And I met a gentleman by the name of Rick High who was from the Oberlin community.

So when we got into the strategic phase and strategic planning of this particular parcel of land, Rick was the mutual friend between ourselves and Mr.

Holden.

He said, there's only one person to name this thing after, and that's Joe Hope.

- Yes.

- And so I proceeded to go do my research and what I found, like it literally almost brought me the tears.

It would be, you know, a lot of times we look at our eldest and we think, oh, that was so long ago, but it's not.

Like like, this is not.

- No.

- Too far removed, and I remember looking and Googling a picture of him and it brought tears to my eyes, literally, because it was my son's age at that time.

I think he was 12 or 13.

And I just knew if my son was going through this, the abduction, the kidnapping, the threats, the bombing, like, we're not equipped to go through that.

Like, if it was me and my family, to be all honest with you, like this story would've ended a long time ago and completely different.

'cause I don't have the poise or, you know, possess the cache that Mr.

Holt had.

And so I just remember saying, wow, that's a 12, 13-year-old kid having to bear all of this.

Right, during the time where we wasn't that removed from Brown versus Board of Education, there was no Fair Housing Act, no Civil Rights Act, like it was still, the heels of Jim Crow, like all of those things, right?

And so for a young man and his family to not only go through that, but stand proudly with his chest out on the other side of it.

And then what I really realized was that every kid that ever, every Black kid, that ever touched a Wake County Public School System property, whatever school you went through, like we owe him everything because this is the pioneer, this is the trailblazer.

And so that's so big.

And that story needs to be told, that story needs to be in the history books of those who are in Wake County public schools, right.

It's the same story as a Jackie Robinson, right, Or it's the same story that needs to be told that our kids really need to understand that because how do you know where you're going if you don't know your past?

- Exactly.

So let's put a little context, Mr.

Holt, like he said, I mean, you were a young child and your parents made the decision to admit you, or try to, into an all white school during a time where that was not heard of.

This was 1956 to 1959.

Eventually the courts and local officials did deny your admission.

But what was it like during that time to carry that task as a young boy?

- Well, I wanna begin by expressing my thanks to coach, for the very kind comments you made and appreciate the research that you did and how you learned this on your own.

So I appreciate that very much.

What I remember is how we were terrorized, the threats, the abduction threats.

I remember how my father was fired from his job.

All these are very negative, but these are very real.

These are facts.

I remember how my mother's paycheck was garnishing for almost the entire amount, one month of pay.

I think she got paid less than a dollar at one time.

So when I think back to that time, I think about how we were terrorized and how we had to resource our spirit and our determination to make sure that we persevered and would not break under the pressure.

So this was a very stressful time for my parents and me for about three and a half years.

But we were determined we were gonna persevere and not let the Black community down.

But we did go through quite a bit.

The entire legal system, the segregationist legal system was arrayed against us and we had to fight against that.

And we fought that alone for about three and a half years.

We were the only family in the fight in Raleigh.

And we did begin very early on.

Coach mentioned Brown versus Board in 1954.

We first challenged segregation in 1956 because, well, none of the local boards or none of the Southern states were complying with the spirit and intent of Brown versus Board.

Yeah.

- Probably more of an emotional, spiritual question, but what impact has that time of life had on you over the years?

- Well, one of the things that worried me, and I don't want to get into too much detail, but I've been relieved now of it because I've learned more, but there was this matter of administrative remedies not being exhausted.

Okay, that's kind of a legal principle.

But the system was designed to perpetuate segregation.

When I say the system, there was a North Carolina Pupil Assignment Act of 1955 that was enacted right after Brown versus Board, and it was designed to perpetuate segregation.

And the requirements for transferring from one school to another, okay, were implemented primarily to make it frustrating for black families to transfer their child to a white school.

Okay?

Which had better facilities.

Which was better structured.

Which offered better programs or more advanced programs.

It was almost impossible to comply with the requirements.

Now, but we had complied and then we were denied.

There was a provision that a family denied transfer could appeal.

You could ask for an appeal hearing.

But you appealed to the same board that had denied you.

- Denied you, yeah.

- Where is that gonna go?

- Right.

- A part of that also would be me as a student being interrogated by the board.

I was uncomfortable with that.

- It's intimidating.

- And our lawyers informed us, we will represent you at that hearing.

And they did.

The lawyers weren't asked anything, okay?

The board still denied my admission to Needham Broughton High School.

Okay?

And then when it went to court, the ruling was that we had not exhausted all administrative remedies under the law because I had not personally appeared for interrogation before that board.

And that bothered me, okay?

Then, I'm gonna mention this, I know I'm getting pretty long-winded here.

But one of my high school classmates, her name now is Betty Stevens Walker.

She steered me to some literature that was produced and written by the US Civil Rights Commission that explained this whole matter of pupil assignment laws and how they were designed to keep you from integrating the schools to perpetuate segregation.

And when that occurred to me, and I realized that this had happened across the state, it happened throughout the South, that relieved me of feeling that there was something our family didn't do.

Okay?

I know now it had nothing to do with my not going before that board personally.

- Mm!

So you were carrying?

- I was carrying that for many years.

- Oh, wow.

- Okay.

And now I know differently.

- Now you know differently.

- In Durham there were 160 families that applied about two years after our case in Raleigh.

Do you believe 160 were denied?

- Wow.

- I'm sorry.

- No, no, you're fine.

How long did it take for you to realize that?

- Oh, okay, we go back to 19... Let's make it even, let's go back to 1960.

It's only been within the last five or six years that I realized that.

- Wow, so you carried this for so long.

- I carried this all that time, okay?

I'm greatly relieved now.

And my classmate who graduated from Harvard, you know, she's a Harvard lawyer.

She explained to me that situation and she thought I knew.

We were talking on the phone and she sent me the literature or either emailed me the literature and I read up on it.

And I said, wow, she's right.

It wasn't.

- The fact that we didn't go before that board, we would've been denied anyway.

- It was set up to.

- And that did happen in Raleigh.

- Yes.

- Four years later, someone else was denied.

- Wow.

Yeah, so I'm... Took a lot of time.

- No, I think it was well worth the time.

- Yeah.

So now to see Raleigh raised, it's a beautiful logo.

Beautiful design.

How does that make you feel to see The Holt at [indistinct]?

- Oh gosh.

You know, it's surreal.

I've been kinda like walking on cloud nine.

I've been very elated ever since this.

I was surprised and just elated and delighted about this.

But along with the elation, I temper that with humility and gratitude to Raleigh Raised Development and also to Richard High.

I was explaining to Coach and Terrell earlier that I have often been asked, "What could happen to make you feel better about all this?"

And I often said, "Well, I would like for someone who's other than Joe Holt Jr.

to tell this story and tell what really happened because I can be always accused of being self-centered."

Okay?

But, I never knew when this might happen.

And then I found out from Rick High that he's recommended to Raleigh Raised Development.

- Yeah.

That our family be honored.

And that's the way this happened.

- That's the way.

You know, yeah.

That's beautiful.

And it's a beautiful story.

And I think this is why it's so important to continue sharing the stories because they get lost over time, - Definitely.

and we don't realize where we're standing, when we're standing where we are.

- [Lavelle] Absolutely.

- So how long is it gonna take for The Holt to come to fruition and for us to be able to?

- So this time next year, someone will be moving in.

- Oh wow, that's fast.

Yeah, so we've already started.

We broke ground and the very next day, we were moving asphalt.

So we are definitely moving forward.

- That's wonderful.

And I wanna make sure to also mention other projects that you have been working on.

Not too long ago we had the groundbreaking for Cottages of Idlewild, and this is Affordable Homes.

Tell us about that, LeVelle.

- Oh man, that was personal for me.

That wasn't even business.

'cause that's exactly where my grandmother grew up.

So that's my housing projects and you know, across the street, it's a park that bears my name and a statue.

So, it was kind of like the Trinity for my family and for me personally, so.

It was a land trust model in which we partnered with Raleigh Area Land Trust.

And that's gonna be what, Terrell, 18, 19 units?

- [Terrell] 18 units.

18 units.

14 for sale and four rentals.

- Yeah.

- Okay.

And, you know, it just provides a different affordable housing perspective because, see, when I lived on Lane Street, and one of the problems in the black community is, in particular southeast Raleigh, is that no one owns anything, right?

So, you know, you can have all the opinions, all the passion, all the energy about who's building what on that parcel of land, but if you don't own it, then you don't really have any say so, right?

And so, once again, doing my history and my research, you know, I realized how we actually got in those situations and it was because of redlining.

And then, I'm not going to go into, you know- - We'll have another conversation about that.

- Right, that's a whole nother black issues form right there within itself, but we all ended up in these communities and we were all renting, right?

And so at the end of the day, when you're renting, you claim these neighborhoods and you're passionate about these neighborhoods.

But when you're renting, someone can always knock on that door and say, I need you out in about 30 or 45 days, and that was the reality of it, so.

You know, now this has given black people an opportunity to not only have affordable housing, but gain equity within their homes, right?

And so I thought that was huge, you know, because that's the first step into kind of changing our neighborhoods.

It's ownership, right, in any and everything that we do.

- Is there any plans around education?

So, we're giving them ownership, but how do we educate them to utilize it?

- So, the process for, to apply for the homes is home ownership and financial literacy.

- Okay.

- The community land trust model is nothing new.

It's been around since the '60s.

I think what we've done is something different because we have established the first land trust model in Wake County.

And so, we partner with like, like LeVelle said, Raleigh Area Land Trust.

And what we have that's different from most of 'em is that we have a repair fund.

And so, essentially how we able to keep it affordable for the next 99 years is that you're payin' for the structure.

You're not payin' for the land.

And so, if we market it for 185 or $215,000, 99 years that would be the same price of that property should someone moves out.

The thing is is that when the equity in it, there's a percentage that will be shared with the land trust and the home buyer.

So, that's how to keep the long term affordability, but what we saw when we was negotiatin', you know, how this land trust was gonna be.

- [Kenia] Yes.

- Is it wouldn't be fair for the homeowner to have to pay for the depreciation of a hot water heater burstin' or a roof.

- Anything they may.

- Anything happenin'.

So, we as a development team came together and put a repair fund in.

So, we pumped in 150,000 into that, that if anything should happen, you know, during the state, they can pull off that.

- I hate to rush you, but the time has come to an end.

I think there's so much we could talk about, but thank you so much.

- Thank you.

- For the work that you're doin' in Raleigh, Terrell Majave, LeVelle Moton, and Mr.

Holt.

Thank you.

- Thank you.

- For the legacy that you have carried forward.

- Thank you.

- Thank you so much.

And I thank you for watching.

If you want more content like this, we invite you to engage with us on Instagram using the hashtag Black Issues Forum.

You can also find our full episodes on pbsnc.org/blackissuesforum and on the PBS video app.

I'm Kenia Thompson.

I'll see you next time.

[upbeat music] ♪ - [Announcer] Quality public television is made possible through the financial contributions of viewers like you, who invite you to join them in supporting PBS NC.