>> GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO CHICAGO TONIGHT: BLACK VOICES.

I'M BRANDIS FRIEDMAN , AND THANKS FOR SHARING PART OF YOUR WEEKEND WITH US.

ON THE SHOW TONIGHT, A PRODUCT THAT MILLIONS OF BLACK WOMEN USE TO STRAIGHTEN THEIR HAIR OVER THE YEARS HAS NOW BEEN LINKED TO UTERINE CANCER.

WE TALK ABOUT HAIR RELAXERS , THE RISKS OF THESE PRODUCTS, AND HOW MUCH SO OF OUR IDENTITY IS TANGLED UP IN OUR HAIR.

ART INTERSECTS WITH PUBLIC FAITH IN THE WORK OF NEW MacARTHUR FELLOW FROM CHICAGO.

WE WELCOME ARTIST AND ARCHITECT AMANDA WILLIAMS.

>> IT'S A LOT OF UNTAPPED TALENT.

BUT YOU DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT UNTIL YOU ACTUALLY GO THERE.

>> AND WE TAKE YOU INSIDE A NEW CALL CENTER HELPING TRANSFORM THE CHATHAM NEIGHBORHOOD.

ALL THAT IS COMING UP, BUT OUR FIRST STORY TONIGHT, WHAT NEW RESEARCH AND A LAWSUIT SAY ABOUT HAIR RELAXERS AND CANCER.

THAT'S RIGHT AFTER THIS.

>> CHICAGO TONIGHT: BLACK VOICES IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY FIFTH THIRD BANK , AND BY THE SUPPORT OF THESE DONORS.

>> OVER THE YEARS, MILLIONS OF BLACK WOMEN HAVE BECOME FAMILIAR WITH USING A PRODUCT THAT JUST RECENTLY HAS BEEN LINKED TO POSSIBLE UTERINE CANCER.

A STUDY FROM THE NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF HEALTH SHOWS WOMEN WHO USE CHEMICAL HAIR RELAXERS OR STRAIGHTENERS MAY HAVE A HIGHER RISK OF A DISEASE, AND MOUTH, A MISSOURI WOMAN IS SUING FIVE BEAUTY COMPANIES, INCLUDING L'OREAL, CLAIMING THE RELAXERS CAUSED HER UTERINE CANCER AT THE AGE OF 28.

THAT DIAGNOSIS EVENTUALLY LED TO A HYSTERECTOMY.

JOINING US TO TALK ABOUT THE STUDY AND THE SOCIAL PRESSER TO STRAIGHTEN BLACK HAIR, OUR PATRICE YOUR SICK, A WRITER AND BEAUTY INFLUENCER.

DR. JUNE McCOY, , DR. McCOY ALSO HOLDS A LAW DEGREE, AND DR. , AN ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR AT U CHICAGO MEDICINE.

THANK TOOK ALL THREE OF YOU FOR JOINING US.

PATRICE YURSIK, LET'S START WITH YOU.

PLEASE EXPLAIN FOR US HOW THESE RELAXERS WORK AND HOW COMMONLY THEY ARE USED BY BLACK WOMEN AND GIRLS.

>> THESE RELAXERS ARE COMMONLY USED.

THEY'RE, IT'S A CHEMICAL MIXTURE THAT IS APPLIED TO THE SCALP , APPLIED TO THE ROOTS OF THE HAIR , AND LEFT ON FOR A DURATION OF TIME, AND THAT ALTERS THE , THE APPEARANCE OF THE HAIR.

IT, IT LOOSENS THE CURLS, AND IT MAKES THE HAIR LIE FLAT , AND IT, IT CHANGES THE TEXTURE.

>> HOW COMMONLY, HOW FREQUENTLY WOULD YOU SAY THESE ARE USED.

>> I BELIEVE, I MEAN, I STARTED USING THEM WHEN I WAS SIX YEARS OLD.

I STOP WHEN I WAS AGE 23.

I DID , APPROXIMATELY, I WOULD SAY, EVERY MONTH, EVERY SIX WEEKS, TO MAINTAIN, BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT YOUR, YOUR ROOTS TO START GROWING UP, SO, SO IT'S A PRETTY REGULARLY DONE PRACTICE IF YOU ARE IN THE HABIT OF USING A RELAXER.

>> YEAH, A FAMILIAR EXPERIENCE FOR A LOT OF BLACK WOMEN.

DR. LEE , EXPLAIN FOR US THE LINK BETWEEN UTERINE CANCER AND HAIR RELAXERS THAT THE NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF HEALTH FOUND.

>> YEAH, SO THIS STUDY JUST CAME OUT RECENTLY, WHERE THEY HAVE TAKEN A VERY LARGE COHORT OF WOMEN, THERE WERE OVER 33,000 WOMEN WHO WERE TAKING PART IN A BIGGER STUDY THAT'S LOOKING AT ONGOING RISK FACTORS FOR BREAST CANCER AND OTHER CONDITIONS, AND THEY SEPARATED US OUT AND LOOKED, SPECIFICALLY, ABOUT THE WOMEN WHO HAD DEVELOPED UTERINE CANCER OVER TIME, AND THEY SAW A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE WOMEN WHO HAD NEVER USED A HAIR STRAIGHTENING PRODUCT VERSUS THOSE WHO HAD HAD MORE FREQUENT USE OF A STRAIGHTENING PRODUCT.

THEIR RISK OF UTERINE CANCER SEEMED TO HAVE CHANGED FROM ABOUT 1.6 TO ALMOST 4%.

SO THE RISK GREW QUITE A BIT, THOUGH THE CANCER AS A WHOLE IS NOT AS COMMON AS BREAST CANCER.

BUT BECAUSE UTERINE CANCER IS INCREASING IN OUR COUNTRY , THIS IS A REALLY IMPORTANT LINK TO BE THINKING ABOUT.

>> SO IN A STATEMENT, THE PERSONAL CARE PRODUCTS COUNCIL SAID, QUOTE, THE STUDY DOES NOT ACCOUNT FOR A NUMBER OF OTHER DIFFERENT THINGS THAT MAY BE ASSOCIATED WITH INCREASED INCIDENCE AS THE UTERINE CANCER CASES TEND TO BECOME ATTENDED TO THE OLDER, WITH AN EARLIER AGE AT THE FIRST MENSTRUAL PERIOD, A HIGHER BMI, AND LOWER COLLECTIVITY, AND NO STRONGER ASSOCIATION OF STRAIGHTENER YOUTH AMONG WOMEN WITH LOW PHYSICAL ACTIVITY.

THESE OTHER OBSERVED ASSOCIATIONS WERE LARGELY IGNORED IN THE STUDY.

THE STATEMENT ALSO POINTS OUT THAT ASSOCIATION ISN'T NECESSARILY CAUSATION.

DR. McCOY, WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ON THE NIH STUDY , AND WHETHER THE WOMEN BRINGING THE LAWSUIT HAVE A CASE?

>> I BELIEVE THE WOMEN BRINGING THE LAWSUIT HAVE A CASE, AND THAT THIS CASE WILL ULTIMATELY END UP AS A CLASS-ACTION LAWSUIT.

AND I SAY THAT BECAUSE IT MIRRORS SOME OF THE THINGS WE'VE SEEN WITH THE TALCUM POWDER CASES , WHERE YOUNG GIRLS, EVEN AS BABIES, STARTED USING TALCUM POWDER.

THERE IS NO CAUSE AND EFFECT.

I WANT TO STRESS THAT.

BUT YOU DON'T NEED A CAUSE-AND-EFFECT TO ACTUALLY BRING A LAWSUIT FORWARD.

YOU NEED TO SHOW THAT THE MANUFACTURER, THE PRODUCER OF THE PRODUCT INCLUDED PRODUCTS THAT THEY KNEW, OR SHOULD HAVE KNOWN, WERE POTENTIALLY CARCINOGENIC , AND THEN YOU HAVE TO SHOW THAT THE ASSOCIATION IS STRONG ENOUGH, IN THIS CASE, THE WOMEN BRINGING THIS, THIS LAWSUIT FORWARD WAS AGE 28 WHEN SHE HAD A TOTAL HYSTERECTOMY BECAUSE OF CANCER .

AND THIS WOMAN STARTED USING THE HAIR PRODUCTS FOR A LONG TIME.

SO IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE CAUSE-AND-EFFECT , THE ASSOCIATION IS GREAT, AND YOU HAVE TO PROVE THAT PRODUCTS WITHIN , INGREDIENTS WITHIN A CERTAIN PRODUCT THAT THE MANUFACTURER IS USING THIS POTENTIALLY CARCINOGENIC.

SO I THINK THESE PEOPLE HAVE A LAWSUIT GOING FORWARD.

>> PATRICE, BLACK WOMEN, MANY WOMEN OF COLOR FILE SOCIAL PRESSURE TO MEET A CERTAIN BEAUTY STANDARD.

WHAT IS THAT LIKE , AND HOW DO THE HAIR RELAXERS FACTOR INTO THAT?

>> YEAH, I WAS DEFINITELY RAISING A FAMILY THAT ENCOURAGED THAT KIND OF EUROCENTRIC, I GUESS, BEAUTY STANDARD , AND, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, GOING BACK AS FAR AS MY OWN MOTHER.

SHE WAS TOLD SHE, YOU KNOW, THAT HER HAIR WAS NOT DONE , SHE SHOULD STAY IN THE BACK AND NOT BE PART OF, OF WHATEVER WAS GOING ON THAT EVENING.

THAT BELIEF IS THEN PASSED DOWN INTO THE HOLE, THE WHOLE FAMILY, EDIT, IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S PART OF OUR LARGER SOCIETY AS WELL , AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE TO KIND OF EXAMINE AND QUESTION , WHY DO WE BELIEVE THESE THINGS?

WHY DO WE CARRY THIS FORWARD?

ALSO , THE USE OF THE WORD, LIKE, "PROFESSIONALISM" IN TERMS OF HOW WE WEAR OUR HAIR, HOW WE PRESENT OURSELVES, IS SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE TO EXAMINE, BECAUSE THE WAY I, I PRESENT MYSELF, THE WAY MY HAIR LOOKS, HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY PERFORMANCE ON THE JOB.

>> DR. LEE, RECENT RESEARCH IS ABOUT UTERINE CANCER, BUT IS IT POSSIBLE THERE IS MORE RESEARCH TO COME ABOUT THE WIDE RANGE OF FEMALE HEALTH ISSUES , AND FERTILITY INCLUDED?

>> YOU KNOW, IT'S VERY HARD TO TELL, BECAUSE I THINK THIS KIND OF OPENS THE WINDOW TO IT, AND I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT BECAUSE IT RAISES THE QUESTION WITHIN A GROUP OF WOMEN, YOU KNOW, BLACK WOMEN IN GENERAL, ALSO HAVE A HIGHER RISK OF DYING FROM UTERINE CANCER.

SO OUR INVESTIGATION INTO, LIKE, WHAT COULD BE A HYPOTHESIS AROUND THE , AND AROUND OTHER CANCERS, OR AROUND OTHER HEALTH CONDITIONS, MAY BE VERY IMPORTANT.

OBVIOUSLY, THIS STUDY DOESN'T SHOW CAUSATION, BUT IT DOES REALLY START TO OPEN OUR EYES TOWARDS, YOU KNOW, LIKE, US AS CONSUMERS.

IT STARTS TO OPEN OUR EYES AS SCIENTISTS IN TERMS OF WHAT WE'RE THINKING ABOUT, AND I THINK IT REALLY WIDENS THE RANGE OF WHAT WE NEED TO BE THINKING ABOUT WHEN WE'RE THINKING ABOUT CANCER.

>> DR. McCOY, IS IT POSSIBLE THAT THE COMPANIES WERE AWARE OF THE POTENTIAL CARCINOGENIC OPERATIVE IN THEIR PRODUCTS?

>> INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, ANOTHER STUDY DONE BY THE NIH ACTUALLY SHOWED A PROBLEM WITH BREAST CANCER BECAUSE OF HERE STRAIGHTENERS.

SO THERE'S BEEN A, STUDIES DONE BEFORE IN WOMEN , SHOWING THAT HORMONAL , INGREDIENTS THAT ACTUALLY INCREASE OR MAKE HORMONAL CHANGES , ACTUALLY CAN HAVE A HIGH ASSOCIATION WITH FEMALE CANCERS.

SO, YES , I BELIEVE THEY WERE AWARE.

NUMBER ONE, ONE OF THE INGREDIENTS IS FORMALDEHYDE , AND THAN SOME OTHERS.

WE HAVE LONG KNOWN THAT WHEN THE HAIR IS HEATED UP, AND AS PATRICE MENTIONED, WHEN IT'S HEATED UP , FORMALDEHYDE BECOMES ACTUALLY TOXIC .

AND FORMALDEHYDE IS A KNOWN CARCINOGEN.

SO THEY KNEW THAT , AND SOMETHING I WANT TO POINT OUT.

THESE PRODUCTS ARE REGULARLY .

THE FEDERAL TRADE COMMISSION, THE FDA , FDA , AND EPA.

BUT IN TERMS OF THE FDA, THE PRODUCTS THAT ARE SOLD, THE HAIR STRAIGHTENER PRODUCTS THAT ARE SOLD, THE ONES THAT I USED IN THE BEAUTY SALON, ARE ACTUALLY MARKETED TO PROFESSIONALS , COMPANIES, AND THEY DO NOT HAVE TO LIST THE INGREDIENTS ON THE LABEL.

SO THE TRUTH , THE TRANSPARENCY IS LOST WHEN PRODUCTS ARE SOLD THAT WAY.

AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT PERCENTAGE OF INGREDIENTS IS PRESENT IN MOST PRODUCTS.

SO I WOULD BELIEVE THAT COMPANIES -- >> NO, IT'S OKAY.

IT'S GOOD INFORMATION.

YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT ABOUT, WE GOT A COUPLE SECONDS LEFT, DR. McCOY.

ADVICE TO WOMEN WHO STILL USE RELAXERS OR HAVE USED THEM?

>> MY ADVICE TO WOMEN IS STOP, TAKE A PAUSE.

WAIT AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

THE RISK TO YOU IS TOO GREAT .

THE STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS FOR PERSONAL INJURY CASES IS TWO YEARS.

BUT IT DOESN'T START UNTIL YOU'RE AWARE OF IT, IN MANY REGARDS.

I WOULD SAY, STOP.

I'M SURE DR. LEE WOULD RECOMMEND EXERCISE , WATCH YOUR WEIGHT , KEEP YOUR WEIGHT DOWN TO DECREASE YOUR UTERINE CANCER RISK, AND TAKE A PAUSE.

PAUSE ON THE BUTTON OF USING HERE STRAIGHTENERS GOING FORWARD.

>> AND WE'VE GOT WITH A COUPLE SECONDS LEFT.

PATRICE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN ANSWER THIS, IN THE VERY BRIEF AMOUNT OF TIME THAT WE'VE GOT, A LOT OF BLACK WOMEN'S IDENTITY IS TIED UP IN OUR HAIR., WOULD YOU SAY?

>> YES, ABSOLUTELY, AND I THINK IT'S TIME FOR US TO QUESTION, IS IT WORTH USING SOMETHING THAT COULD BE POTENTIALLY KOSTIC TO OUR HEALTH TO MAINTAIN THIS APPEARANCE WHEN THERE ARE ALTERNATIVE WAYS TO STYLE OUR HAIR ?

IF YOU STILL WANT THAT STRAIGHT LOOK, YOU CAN ACHIEVE IT WITHOUT USING A HARSH CHEMICAL THAT CAN AFFECT YOU IN TERMS OF GETTING A CANCER.

>> THAT'S WHERE WILL HAVE TO LEAVE IT.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>> IN 2018, TARGET CAUSED AN OUTCRY WHEN IT ANNOUNCED PLANS TO SET OR TWO OF ITS SOUTHSIDE CHICAGO LOCATIONS.

ONE OF THEM, THE CHATHAM LOCATION.

A RETAIL HUB IN THE HEART OF THE COMMUNITY FOR DECADES, AND EMPLOYED OVER 150 PEOPLE.

THE 100,000 SQUARE-FOOT BUILDING GOT A NEW LEASE ON LIFE LAST YEAR WHEN RIVERWOOD BASED DISCOVER FINANCIAL SERVICES BEGAN TRANSFORMING IT INTO A CALL CENTER THAT WOULD EMPLOY 1000 PEOPLE , MOSTLY FROM THE SURROUNDING AREA, BY 2024.

TODAY , WITH ABOUT 500 EMPLOYEES IN PLACE, DISCOVER LEADERSHIP SAYS THEIR COMMUNITY FOCUS APPROACH IS PAYING OFF.

FOR NEWS, OUR ERIKA GUNDERSON HAS THAT STORY.

>> THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE.

I DO APPRECIATE IT.

>> THE TIME WE'RE FULLY RAMPED UP, THEY'LL BE ABOUT 10 MILLIONS A CALLS A YEAR THAT'S FOLLOWED TO THE CENTER.

>> IN THE 11 YEARS SHE HAS WORKED FOR FINANCIAL SERVICES, SHE'S MANAGED CALL CENTERS ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

>> FOR ME, WELL BEFORE BEING A DISCOVER EMPLOYEE, I WAS A GIRL FROM THE SOUTH SIDE FIRST.

>> IS A REGIONAL OPERATIONS DIRECTOR OF THE DISCOMFORT.

BUT IT'S ALSO SOMETHING OF A DEPARTURE , SINCE THE DENSE URBAN CHATHAM HAS LITTLE IN COMMON WITH DISCOVER'S OTHER CALL CENTERS, ALL OF WHICH ARE IN SUBURBAN AREAS WHERE THE WORKFORCES ARE MAJORITY WHITE.

>> THERE IS THIS ECOSYSTEM OF FAMILY AND CONNECTEDNESS LIKE WE HAVE AT ANY LOCATION.

WE'RE PROUD THAT ALMOST 90% OF OUR EMPLOYEES LIVE WITHIN FIVE MILES OF THE SENDER.

WE'VE BEEN OPERATING FOR A LITTLE OVER A YEAR.

WE HAVE WELL OVER 150 EMPLOYEES THAT HAVE BEEN PROMOTED , AND SOME OF THEM HAVE BEEN PROMOTED MULTIPLE TIMES SINCE STARTING HERE.

>> CEO ROGER HAWKS CHILD SAYS WHEN DISCOVER BEGAN MAKING PLANS IN 2019 TO OPEN THEIR FIRST NEW CALL CENTER IN OVER 20 YEARS, THE COMPANY HAS TOOK A FRESH LOOK AT THEIR APPROACH.

>> CALL CENTERS ARE RADICALLY IMPORTANT FOR US.

WE'RE THE ONLY MAJOR BANK WITH 100% U.S.-BASED CUSTOMER SERVICE.

WE PICKED IT CHATHAM BECAUSE WE WANTED TO DO WHAT WE COULD TO BRING OPPORTUNITY TO COMMUNITY THAT HAVE BEEN UNDER INVESTED, AND I STRONGLY BELIEVE THAT SOMETHING THAT LARGE COMPANIES CAN DO , AND ONLY LARGE COMPANIES CAN DO, WHICH IS BRING JOBS AT A SCALE INTO THE COMMUNITY.

CLOSE TO 90% OF OUR EMPLOYEES HERE IN THE CENTER ARE BLACK, AND SO AS PART OF OUR FOCUS AROUND DIVERSITY AND EQUITY INCLUSION, AND CHANGING THE RACIAL MAKEUP OF DISCOVER , THIS CENTER IS, IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT TO THAT.

THE ATTRITION RATE IS LESS THAN HALF OF WHAT WE SEE IN OUR OTHER CENTERS.

THERE'S A FASTER SPEED TO PROFICIENCY.

THIS IS OUR BEST PERFORMING CALL CENTER, AND I COULDN'T BE MORE EXCITED ABOUT THAT.

>> GREATER CHATHAM INITIATIVE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR SAYS DISCOVER SUCCESS STORIES BY FAR SHOWS IT MAKES GOOD .

>> WE HAVE GOOD HOUSING STAFF , THAT'S AFFORDABLE.

WE HAVE GOOD SCHOOLS.

WE HAVE GOOD TRANSPORTATION.

WE HAVE ABLE AND WILLING WORKFORCES.

WHAT ELSE DO YOU WANT?

>> EMPLOYEES OF THE CHATHAM CENTER THEY WORKING CLOSE TO HOME IN JOBS WITH GROWTH OPPORTUNITIES IS PLAYING DIVIDENDS FOR THEM.

>> I'M REALLY, REALLY FORTUNATE THAT THIS WAS AVAILABLE FOR ME.

BEING KIND OF LIKE A DREAM COME TRUE , BECAUSE I CAN BE A MOM, A REALLY REALLY GREAT MOM, AND I CAN COME TO WORK AND BE IN CORPORATE AMERICA.

>> BEFORE, I WASN'T ABLE TO BE IN FAMILY LIFE AT ALL, REALLY.

I WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR DRIVING MY DAUGHTER OFF TO DAY CARE.

NOW I'M ABLE TO , WITH THE HOURS I HAVE NOW, I CAN PICK HER UP.

>> EVERYTHING I NEED TO KNOW ABOUT WORKING IN A CALL CENTER, THEY TRAINED ME TO DO IT.

I'M NOW DOING MY JOB AS A TECHNICAL APPRENTICE TRAINING THEM TO DO IT.

>> IN ADDITION TO DRAWING FROM THE COMMUNITY FIRST WORKFORCE, DISCOVER SCALED THE SERVICES TO ALLOW THEM TO CONTRACT WITH SMALL LOCAL BUSINESSES.

>> WE JUST WANT THE OPPORTUNITY.

WE DON'T WANT ANYONE TO GIVE US ANYTHING PRO BONO.

WE JUST WANT YOU TO POINT US IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, AND WE'LL SHOW YOU THAT WE'RE CAPABLE OF DOING WORK ON THIS MAGNITUDE AND EVEN BIGGER.

>> THE CHATHAM CENTER ALSO FEATURES A COMMUNITY CENTER, WHICH LOCAL NONPROFITS CAN USE AT NO COST FOR MEETINGS AND EVENTS.

THE ROTATING SELECTION OF ART FILLING THE SPACE COMES FROM I PAINT MY MIND, WHICH CURATES ART FROM LOCAL ARTISTS AND BUSINESSES.

>> THEY'RE GETTING THIS INCREDIBLE ART IN THEIR SPACE, SO THEY GET VALUE AND THAT INCREDIBLE SERVICE FROM US, BUT ALSO KNOWING THAT THAT HELPS I PAINT MY MIND DELIVER MUCH-NEEDED AND OFTEN UNDERFUNDED ART PROGRAMS TO LOCAL SCHOOLS IS, IS WAY MORE THAN A CHARITY FOR US.

>> DISCOVER LEADERSHIP SAYS THIS MODEL OF COMMUNITY INVESTMENT OF BUSINESS DECISIONS HAS CREATED A FULL NEW BLUEPRINT FOR FUTURE ENDEAVORS.

>> IT'S REALLY TRANSFORMED US AS A COMPANY .

I LIKE TO SAY WE ACTUALLY GET MORE OUT OF THIS THAN THE PEOPLE IN CHATHAM.

>> THAT'S WHAT ALLOWS US TO TRANSLATE THAT INTO GOOD BUSINESS, FOR US TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY THRIVE, AND THROUGH THAT, THEY TAKE REALLY GOOD CARE OF OUR CUSTOMERS IN RETURN.

>> THE BUSINESS RESULTS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES.

AGAIN, AS I SAID, THIS IS OUR TOP PERFORMING CALL CENTER, AND SO WE ARE COMMITTED TO CHATHAM FOR THE LONG-TERM.

>> AND ONE YEAR IN, THE EMPLOYEES WE SPOKE WITH SAY THEY'RE ALL IN ON DISCOVER, TOO.

>> OFTEN, BIGGER COMPANIES ARE SCARED TO COME INTO COMMUNITIES LIKE THIS, RIGHT?

THEY'RE SCARED THAT THEY WON'T GET THE RIGHT TALENT, OR JUST , THEY WON'T BE SUCCESSFUL, AND I THINK DISCOVER SAID, WELL, WE'RE GOING TO TAKE THAT CHANCE.

>> IS A LOT OF UNTAPPED TALENT , BUT YOU DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT UNTIL YOU ACTUALLY GO THERE.

>> I CAN'T WAIT TO SEE, LIKE, A YEAR FROM NOW , HOW IT'S CHANGED THE COMMUNITY AND THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE.

>> FOR CHICAGO TONIGHT: BLACK VOICES , THIS IS ERIKA GUNDERSON.

>> AND IF YOU'RE WONDERING ABOUT THE FATE OF THE OTHER SHUTTERED TARGET IN MORGAN PARK , IT BECAME A BLUE CROSS BLUE SHIELD OF ILLINOIS WELLNESS CENTER THAT OPENED IN 2020.

NEXT, A MacARTHUR GENIUS GRANT RECIPIENT FROM CHICAGO IN A CONVERSATION RECORDED EARLIER.

>> THE MacARTHUR FOUNDATION RECENTLY ANNOUNCED ITS ANNUAL LIST OF FELLOWS, HONORING CREATIVE INDIVIDUALS WITH A NO STRINGS ATTACHED GRANT.

IT'S OFTEN CALLED THE GENIUS GRANT.

THREE CHICAGO IS MADE THE LIST, INCLUDING SOCIOLOGIST JONATHAN MILLER AND COMPOSER READ.

THEY'RE BOTH OUT OF TOWN, AND WE'LL CATCH UP WITH THEM LATER, BUT FOR NOW, WE'RE PLEASED TO WELCOME ARTIST, ARCHITECT, AND NOW MacARTHUR FELLOW AMANDA WILLIAMS.

WELCOME TO CHICAGO TONIGHT.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> SO CONGRATS, OBVIOUSLY.

WHEN AND HOW DID YOU RECEIVE THAT IS?

>> I GOT THE NEWS A LITTLE OVER A MONTH AGO.

I ACTUALLY WAS AT MY ALMA MATER, CORNELL UNIVERSITY.

I HAD JUST GIVEN A LECTURE.

I WAS DRAGGING MY YOUNGEST DAUGHTER AROUND CAMPUS, AND I WAS LITERALLY STANDING AT MY DORMITORY EXPLAINED TO HER THAT WHEN I WALKED IN THOSE DOORS, MY LIFE CHANGED.

AND THEN THE PHONE RANG, AND IT WAS THE FOUNDATION CALLING.

DO YOU HAVE SOMEWHERE YOU CAN TAKE A MOMENT TO YOURSELF?

YOU KNOW, SO WHEN YOU GET THAT KIND OF CALL, YOU PANIC, YOU KNOW?

AND SO WHEN SHE SAID, WE'RE CALLING FROM THE MacARTHUR FOUNDATION , YOU KNOW, NO, NO, YOU'RE NOT, YOU'RE NOT, THE TEARS STARTED.

AND THEN IT WAS JUST A BLUR.

LIKE, WHATEVER THEY WERE SAYING , YOU'RE JUST NOT LISTENING ANYMORE.

>> YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO REPEAT ALL OF THIS LATER ON WHEN I CAN ACTUALLY PAY ATTENTION TO AND, OF COURSE, YOU DON'T KNOW THE PHONE CALL WAS COMING.

>> NO, NO.

>> HOW WOULD YOU DESCRIBE YOUR WORK, YOUR ART?

>> I THINK MY WORK USES COLOR AS ITS KIND OF FRAMEWORK TO BOTH DRAW VIEWERS AND PARTICIPANTS IN, BUT ALSO TO TALK ABOUT VERY DIFFICULT SUBJECTS IN A VERY ACCESSIBLE WAY.

SO, OF COURSE, IN CHICAGO, RACE AND COLOR ARE INTERTWINED.

SO THERE'S A WAY IN WHICH I'M ABLE TO USE COLOR TO GET PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND SOMETHING AS COMPLEX AS REDLINING, BECAUSE RED IS AN UNDERSTANDABLE COLOR.

OR OLDER SHAME, OR PINKO MOISTURIZER.

SO I'VE DEVELOPED THIS KIND OF PROCESS OF USING COLOR TO DESCRIBE COMPLEX KIND OF SPECIAL SITUATIONS.

MY TRAININGS IN ARCHITECTURE, SO IT, IT REALLY HELPS BRIDGE THIS GAP BETWEEN WHAT PEOPLE MIGHT THINK OF AS ART IN A TWO-DIMENSIONAL SENSE , PAINTINGS, DRAWINGS, AND SO FORTH, BUT THEN THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT OF THE CAMPUS AS WELL.

>> AND WE'RE LOOKING AT SOME OF YOUR ART RIGHT NOW.

WE WERE DOING A STORY LAST WEEK AT THE MUSEUM OF ART AT THE UNIVERSITY OF CHICAGO.

WE SHOT THE VIDEO OF A PROJECT OF YOURS THAT GOT A LOT OF ATTENTION.

THIS IS COLORS OF THEORY.

TELL US ABOUT THAT.

AND YOU JUST NAME SOME OF THOSE COLORS.

>> YES, SO COLOR.

IS A, IS KIND OF A WESTERN CONVENTION.

IT'S SOMETHING YOU LEARN IN ART SCHOOL AND ARCHITECTURE SCHOOL, AND I WAS JOKING WITH A FRIEND THAT I WAS AN EXPERT IN COLOR THEORY.

AND SO WHAT MIGHT THAT MEAN IT LOOK LIKE?

AND SO I REALLY THOUGHT ABOUT COLORS THAT IMPACTED MY LIFE WHEN I WAS COMING OF AGE ON THE SOUTH SIDE, AND, AND WHAT WERE THE, THAT PALLET BE FOR PEOPLE THAT WERE LIKE ME?

AND SO I DEVELOPED THIS PALLET EIGHT, AND THEN I DECIDED I'M GOING TO TEST IT OUT ON THE LARGEST CANVAS POSSIBLE, THESE ABANDONED HOUSES.

AND THAT IT REALLY DID BECOME A PROJECT THAT, THAT HELP HIGHLIGHT SOME OF THE INJUSTICES THAT CREATED THAT ENVIRONMENT.

BUT REALLY, THE COLORS WERE THE, THE INSPIRATION FOR ME AS AN ARTIST, AS A PAINTER, AS AN ARCHITECT.

SO IT WAS JUST THIS KIND OF PERFECT, YOU KNOW, STORM OF WAYS TO BRING TOGETHER ALL OF THOSE .

>> AND, OF COURSE, THE COLORS ARE NAMED FOR SOME VERY MEMORABLE COLORS IN THE BLACK COMMUNITY.

ULTRA SHEEN BLUE MOISTURIZER.

>> HAROLD'S CHICKEN SHACK.

>> HAROLD'S CHICKEN SHACK, OF COURSE.

A CHICAGO FAVORITE.

>> SO IT WAS IMPORTANT TO HAVE COVERS THAT WOULD BE BOTH SORT OF LIKE MNEMONIC DEVICES AND BRING PEOPLE JOY OR HAPPINESS, BUT ALSO TO AN IDEA OF VALUE.

SO HOW CAN THESE GET TO THIS CONDITION, AND WHAT DOES IT MEAN ?

AND SO COLOR CAN DO THAT IN A WAY THAT MESSAGING CAN'T, THAT RALLYING CAN'T, BUT IT CAN LEAD TO THOSE TYPES OF CHANGES, SO IT WAS REALLY IMPORTANT TO ME TO, TO FRAME IT, ACTUALLY, VERY MUCH ABOUT MY OWN EXPERIENCE, AND NOT TRY TO BE UNIVERSAL, OR EXPLAIN EVERYONE'S EXPERIENCE.

THE WESTSIDE WOULD HAVE A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PALETTE, EVEN, OF COURSE.

>> DO YOU FEEL YOUR WORK IS MOSTLY ABOUT CHICAGO, OR COULD SOME OF THESE EXPLORATIONS PERTAIN TO ANY BIG CITY?

>> I THINK ON PURPOSE, THAT WORK WAS VERY MUCH ABOUT CHICAGO.

IT WAS VERY MUCH ABOUT ME HAVING AN INTERNAL DIALOGUE ABOUT WANTING TO BECOME AN ARCHITECT TO CHANGE THE LANDSCAPE, AND THEN FEELING FRUSTRATED ABOUT THAT.

SO I WANTED TO DO THINGS THAT WERE HIGHLY SPECIFIC.

BUT I THINK I'VE BEEN ABLE TO BRIDGE THE IDEA OF COLOR BEYOND THAT.

I HAVE ANOTHER PRODUCT THAT CAME DURING THE PANDEMIC , AND IT REALLY QUESTIONED, OR CHALLENGED, WHOSE BLACK LIVES ARE MATTERING, YOU KNOW?

THERE WAS THIS PANIC TO, TO MAKE EVERYTHING OKAY , SO IT WAS A MAINSTREAM SORT OF ACCEPTANCE OF BLACK LIVES MATTER IN WHICH IT, YOU KNOW, BEEN RELYING, MAYBE, YEARS BEFORE.

LIKE, WHICH BLACK LIVES?

THE ONES BACK IN THE PARKING SPACES AT MARIANO'S, OR THE ONES THAT -- BLACK PEOPLE ARE VERY DIVERSE IN AND OF THEMSELVES, AND SO WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO TRY TO MAKE A MONOLITHIC SORT OF BLANKET ACCEPTANCE?

>> AND WE ALSO HAVE SOME VIDEO OF A COLLABORATION THAT YOU DID WITH ARTIST SEAN NIEKRO AND VALERIE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO.

TELL US WHAT THE FELLOWSHIP MEAN FOR YOU.

>> I THINK IT JUST SAYS KEEP GOING.

I THINK IT SAYS CONTINUE TO TAKE RISKS AND TO DREAM BIG .

SHAWNEE AND I DID THAT PROJECT , AND THAT WAS , ORIGINALLY IT CAME BACK TO CHICAGO.

I REALLY WANTED TO THINK ABOUT THE SPACES OF JOINT AND SPACES OF PROTECTION FOR BLACK WOMEN.

AND SO I THINK THINKING ALWAYS BE ON, THINKING A LITTLE BIT FURTHER THAN ONE MIGHT ASSUME , EITHER ART CAN INSPIRE, OR A TOPIC THAT MIGHT NOT SEEM LIKE IT COULD BE UNIVERSAL, BUT ACTUALLY SHOULD BE, OR IS .

THIS WEEKEND, I'M PLANNING 100,000 TULIPS IN VACANT LOTS ON THE SOUTH SIDE AT 53rd AND PRAIRIE.

AND SO IT'S JUST RIGHT ON TIME.

AN EXCITING KIND OF EXTENSION FOR SOMEBODY THAT MIGHT'VE JUST WON A GENIUS GRANT .

WHAT DOES IT LOOK LIKE TO RE-CREATE THE FOOTPRINT OF THE HOUSES THAT WOULD'VE EXISTED THERE HAD IT NOT BEEN FOR REDLINING?

SO PLANTING THESE RED TULIPS TO REDEFINE REDLINING.

OF THE WORK IS COLLABORATIVE AND PARTICIPATORY.

THE WAY THAT PEOPLE CAN SEE THAT ART CAN BE A CATALYST FOR CHANGE.

>> YOU TRAINED AS AN ARCHITECT , AND, YOU KNOW, HAVE MADE THE TRANSITION, OBVIOUSLY, TO ARTFUL TIME.

HOW DOES YOUR BACK ON IT ARCHITECTURE INFORM YOUR ART?

>> I THINK I GOT INTO ARCHITECTURE BECAUSE I THOUGHT THAT WAS A VEHICLE FOR TRANSFORMING SPACE , FOR BRINGING AUTONOMY TO SPACE.

A LOT OF WHAT I THOUGHT WAS INEQUITY , AT SEVEN YEARS OLD, I DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING WHICH FOR THAT, BUT I KNEW WHEN I CROSSED IT WAS VERY DIFFERENT, WHEN I CROSSED MEDICINE, IT WAS VERY DIFFERENT.

AND SO I THINK THE IDEA THAT YOU CAN LITERALLY CHANGE SPACE, OR BE A SPACE SHAPER IN THE ULTIMATE DEFINITION OF ARCHITECTURE, AND ART ALLOWS THAT IN A WAY THAT EXTREMELY VERSATILE.

YOU KNOW, BUILDINGS, OUT OF NECESSITY, STAND UP.

THEY NEED TO OPERATE IN A CERTAIN WAY, SO I APPRECIATE AND RESPECT MY TRAINING AND MY PEERS THAT ARCHITECTS, A, BUT I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT TO REALLY CREATE THE SPACES THAT WE ASPIRE TO, YOU HAVE TO HAVE PARTICIPATION AND COMMUNITY BUY-IN.

OFTEN TIMES, THAT COMES FROM BEHAVIOR AND SPATIAL PRACTICES, AND NOT FROM THE BUILDING ITSELF.

>> THAT'S WHERE WE'LL HAVE TO LEAVE IT.

AMANDA WILLIAMS, CONGRATS AGAIN.

THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

IT'S BEEN A BIT OF A BLUR.

GOOD LUCK TO YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME.

>> AND WE'RE BACK TO WRAP THINGS UP RIGHT AFTER THIS.

AND THAT'S OUR SHOW FOR THIS WEEKEND.

IF YOU'RE WATCHING US ON SATURDAY NIGHT, KNOW THAT YOU CAN ALSO CATCH LIKE VOICES AND LATINO VOICES ON SUNDAYS GETTING AT 10:00.

AND JOIN ME AND PARIS SCHUTZ NEXT WEEK AT 7:00 ON CHICAGO TONIGHT.

NOW FROM ALL OF US HERE AT CHICAGO TONIGHT: BLACK VOICES, I'M BRANDIS FRIEDMAN.

THANKS FOR SHARING OUT OF YOUR WEEKEND WITH US.

STAY HEALTHY AND SAFE, AND HAVE A GOOD NIGHT.