♪.

TED: COMING UP NEXT ON "ARIZONA HORIZON," THE LATEST ON A PROPOSED NEW COPPER MINE ON LAND CONSIDERED SACRED BY ARIZONA INDIGENOUS COMMUNITIES.

>>> ALSO TONIGHT, DETAILS ON A NEW PIPELINE THAT WILL SEND MORE NATURAL GAS TO ARIZONA.

>>> AND WE'LL HEAR ABOUT A PHOENIX CAFE THAT COMBINES COFFEE AND THE CHANCE TO ADOPT A CAT.

THOSE STORIES AND MORE NEXT ON "ARIZONA HORIZON."

.

TED: GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO "ARIZONA HORIZON."

I'M TED SIMONS.

A FEDERAL APPEALS COURT LAST WEEK BLOCKED A PROPOSED LAND SWAP THAT WOULD ALLOW THE CONSTRUCTION OF A MASSIVE COPPER MINE AT OAK FLAT, A SITE CONSIDERED SACRED BY ARIZONA TRIBES.

THE TEMPORARY BLOCK CAME HOURS BEFORE THE LANDSLIDE WOULD HAVE BEEN COMPLETED.

THE INDIGENOUS AFFAIRS REPORTER FOR "THE ARIZONA REPUBLIC" HAS BEEN COVERING THIS STORY AND HOW.

GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME ON, TED.

TED: SO THE APPEALS COURT TEMPORARILY -- THEY TOOK THIS DOWN TO THE LAST MINUTE, DIDN'T THEY?

>> IT WAS LITERALLY HOURS BEFORE THEY WERE GOING TO INK THE DEAL IN D.C., JUST HOURS.

TED: SO WHAT EXACTLY -- AND WE SHOULD SAY HOURS BECAUSE THERE WAS, WHAT, A 60-DAY REVIEW PERIOD?

>> THE 60-DAY REVIEW PERIOD STARTED ON JUNE 20, AFTER THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT STATEMENT HAD BEEN REISSUED BY THE FOREST SERVICE.

THERE WERE TWO LAWSUITS PENDING THAT HAD BEEN WAITING FOR THAT ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT STATEMENT TO BE FILED, SO THEY REVIVED THEIR LAWSUITS.

THE FEDERAL COURT HEARS THAT WE'LL GIVE YOU THE FULL 60 DAYS TO GET YOUR LAWSUITS BACK IN, GET IT HEARD.

IT WAS HEARD ON AUGUST 6.

COALITION OF ENVIRONMENTALISTS AND TRIBES AND THE SAN CARLOS APACHE TRIBE, THE COURT RULED AGAINST THEM ON AUGUST 15.

THEY DID A WEEKEND APPEAL TO THE 9th CIRCUIT AND THE 9th CIRCUIT GAVE THEM A TEMPORARY HALT SO THEY COULD GO THROUGH WITH THEIR APPEAL.

TED: IT IS USUAL WHEN YOU HAVE A 60-DAY DEADLINE, EVERYTHING HAPPENS ON DAY 59.

>> OF COURSE.

TED: OKAY, THIS LAND SWAP, IT'S ALL-IMPORTANT TO THE COPPER MINE PROJECT.

TALK TO US ABOUT THAT.

>> RESOLUTION COPPER, DIVISION OF RIO TINTO AND BHP HAS BEEN WANTING TO BUILD A GIANT COPPER MINE THERE AT OAK FLAT FOR, I WOULD SAY 25 YEARS.

EVERYIER THEY WENT TO CONGRESS, CONGRESS TURNED THEM DOWN.

FINALLY, THEY WENT TO SENATOR McCAIN AND A COUPLE OF OTHER CONGRESSIONAL REPRESENTATIVES, AND THEY DID A VERY LATE, LATE LAST MINUTE RIDER TO PASS THE BILL.

THEY HAVE TO BE SIGNED, EVEN DONALD TRUMP CAN'T GET AROUND THEM.

OBAMA SIGNED IT AND THE TRIBE HAS BEEN CITING RESOLUTION EVER SINCE.

TED: WHERE IS OAK FLAT?

>> 60 MILES EAST OF PHOENIX.

IN THE PINAL MOUNTAINS, IN TONTO NATIONAL FOREST.

ABOUT A 2200 ACRE CAMPGROUND, RIPARIAN ZONE.

ROCK FORMATIONS.

TED: AND RIGHT NOW, THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT'S THERE.

HAS THERE BEEN PREPARATION OF THE LAND FOR THE COPPER MINE, ANYTHING GOING ON SO FAR?

>> WE KNOW THAT RESOLUTION HAS BEEN DEWATERING.

THERE'S A LOT OF GROUND WATER UNDERNEATH.

THE LAST PERSON TO REHAB THE MINE, WHICH AS YOU KNOW, OVERLOOKS WHERE OAK FLAT IS, SAID THERE'S A HUMONGOUS AMOUNT OF WATER OVER THERE.

DEWATERING, PREPARATORY TO GETTING PERMISSION TO START THE MINE PROCESS, YOU KNOW, AND THEY'VE ALREADY DUG THE 7,000-FOOT TUNNEL, AND THEY'RE GOING TO TUNNEL UNDERNEATH THE ORE BODY AND START COLLAPSING THE ORE BODY UPON ITSELF.

THAT'S WHERE THE CONFLICT COMES IN BECAUSE EVENTUALLY OAK FLAT WILL TURN INTO A GIANT CRATER AND WILL NO LONGER BE A PASSABLE OR USABLE BY PEOPLE.

TED: AND PROBABLY STILL CONSIDERED SACRED BY AMERICAN INDIAN TRIBES.

TALK TO US ABOUT WHY THIS PARTICULAR LAND IS CONSIDERED SACRED?

AND I WANT TO GET BACK TO THE IDEA OF IT BEING IN TONTO NATIONAL FOREST.

YOU DON'T SEE NATIONAL FORESTS BE USED FOR GROUND ZERO OF COPPER MINING.

BEFORE WE GET, THERE TALK ABOUT THE SACRED NATURE OF THE LAND.

>> OAK FLAT IS CONSIDERED SACRED TO SEVERAL BANDS OF APACHE PEOPLE, AND CULTURALLY IMPORTANT TO OTHER PEOPLE INCLUDING THE YAVAPAI, TO A LESSER EXTENT CONSIDERED TO BE ONE OF THE PRINCIPAL HOMES OF THE MOUNTAIN SPIRITS KNOWN AS GAN.

THESE RELIGIONS ARE LAND BASED RELIGIONS, AND IF THE PIECE OF LAND OR THE ROCK FORMATION OR THE SACRED GROVE OR THE MOUNTAIN GOES AWAY, THAT SPIRITUALITY GOES AWAY, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE FIGHTING.

TED: OKAY, AND AGAIN, THE TONTO NATIONAL FOREST, THE FEDERAL NATURE HERE, THAT'S WHAT McCAIN, WHAT THAT WAS ABOUT?

>> YEAH, YEAH, SUPPOSED TO BE A LAND EXCHANGE.

RESOLUTION BOUGHT IT BUT PARCELS OF OTHER ENVIRONMENTAL SENSITIVE LAND WHICH IT INTENDS TO SWAP TO THE FOREST SERVICE FOR OAK FLAT.

TED: WHERE IS THAT OTHER LAND?

>> IT'S SCATTERED THROUGHOUT THE STATE.

SOME AROUND SAN PEDRO AND SOME OF IT IS FARTHER UP NORTH, BUT IT'S A CLOSED, PRIVATE LAND GAPS WITHIN PUBLIC LANDS.

TED: WHAT WAS THE REASONING BEHIND THE 9th CIRCUIT PUTTING THIS STOP ON FOR NOW?

>> THE COURT ARE VERY SENSITIVE TO ALLOWING PEOPLE THEIR DAY IN COURT, WHETHER OR NOT THEY RULE FOR THEM OR AGAINST THEM.

IT'S LIKE THEY WANT THEM TO HAVE THEIR DAY IN COURT, AND THE LATEST APPEAL, THEY DID SPECIFICALLY MENTION THEY'RE NOT ADJUDICATING THE MERITS OF THE CASE RIGHT NOW.

THEY'RE JUST GIVING THEM AN OPPORTUNITY.

TED: OKAY.

SO THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT THEY'RE SAYING.

MORE TIME FOR MORE WHAT WE HAVE TO SAY?

>> YEAH, YEAH.

TED: HOW IS THE COPPER COMPANY HANDLING THIS?

>> I THINK THEY'RE TAKING A DEEP BREATH.

THEY'RE JUST KIND OF MOVING FORWARD WITH WHATEVER PLANS THAT THEY CAN DO, SINCE THEY DON'T HAVE THE LAND.

I HAVE BEEN OUT TO SEE SOME OF THE EMORY OAK RESTORATION THEY'VE BEEN DOING.

THEY HAVE HIRED A LOT OF PEOPLE TO BE CULTURAL MONITORS.

THEY'VE HIRED SOME OTHER APACHE PEOPLE FROM ANOTHER BAND TO HELP OUT WITH CULTURAL STUFF, AND SO -- AND THEY'RE JUST -- I BELIEVE WHAT THEY TOLD ME LAST TIME, WE'RE JUST KEEPING THE LIGHTS ON.

TED: YEAH, YEAH, BUT THE RESTORATION PROJECT IS GOING ON TO A CERTAIN DEGREE?

>> YEAH, THERE'S EMORY OAK GROVES EAST OF OAK FLATS THEY'RE RESTORING.

OTHER EMORY OAK GROVES NORTH OF THE SITE THEY'VE BEEN WORKING ON.

SOME UP AROUND CAMP VERDE TOO, IN THE MOUNTAINS IN THERE.

TED: THIS WAS LIKE TWO DECADES OF LEGAL BATTLING, IS THAT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE?

>> YEAH.

THE ORIGINAL BILL WAS FLOATED, I BELIEVE, IN 2004, AND IN TEN YEARS LATER, THEY DID THE LAST-MINUTE RIDERS.

DECEMBER 2014.

TED: IN YOUR STORY, YOU INTERVIEW PEOPLE WHO SAY, EVERYTHING ELSE, YES, BUT THIS MIGHT NOT BE VIABLE MINING OPERATION.

>> THAT WAS HARRY WINTERS.

HE'S THE LAST PERSON TO BE IN CHARGE OF REHABBING THE OLD MAGNA MINE, WHICH IS WHAT RESOLUTION HAS RIGHT NOW, A LITTLE PLOT OF PRIVATE LAND, AND HE SAYS THAT, IF YOU GO TO THE FOREST SERVICE AND LOOK AT ALL THE GEOLOGY REPORTS, THAT RESOLUTION MAY NOT BE ABLE TO DO IT BECAUSE THAT LAND MIGHT NOT SUBSIDE UPON ITSELF OR SOME OF THE GEOLOGY RUNNING A CERTAIN WAY, IT MIGHT END UP AFFECTING APACHE LEAP, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE SAYING IT'S NOT GOING TO AFFECT APACHE LEAP, WE'RE GOING TO BE VERY CAREFUL.

TED: INTERESTING, LAST QUESTION, WHAT'S NEXT IN ALL THIS?

>> A THIRD LAWSUIT FILED BY FOUR APACHE WOMEN, AND THEY'RE USING A RECENT SUPREME COURT DECISION WHICH SAYS THE PARENTS HAVE THE ABSOLUTE RIGHT TO INSTRUCT THEIR KIDS IN THE RELIGIOUS BELIEFS AND SAY IF OAK FLAT GOES AWAY, THEY WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FULFILL THEIR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT OF INSTRUCTING THEIR KIDS.

WE'RE GOING TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

TED: SOUNDS LIKE A DIFFICULT EMPLOYMENT PLAN, IT KEEPS YOU GOING, DOESN'T IT?

>> IT DOES.

TED: YOU ARE DOING A GREAT JOB ON THIS.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR SHARING THE INFORMATION.

GOOD TO HAVE YOU HERE.

>> GOOD TO BE ON AGAIN.

MAYBE SOMEDAY WE'LL BE ABLE TO SAY IT'S ALL OVER.

TED: WE'LL SEE ABOUT THAT.

>> YEAH.

.

TED: A NEW PIPE LIKE IS SET TO DELIVER NATURAL GAS TO ARIZONA SPECIFICALLY TO THE LARGEST UTILITIES WITH THE GOAL OF MEETING ARIZONA'S EVER GROWING ENERGY DEMANDS AMID THE STATE'S EVER GROWING POPULATION.

WE WELCOME IN DANNY SEIDEN FROM THE ARIZONA CHAMBER OF COMMERCE AND DEPARTMENT OF INDUSTRY.

GOOD TO HAVE YOU.

>> GOOD TO SHARE GOOD NEWS ABOUT AN EXCITING PROJECT THAT HELPS US PLAN FOR THE FUTURE WITH OUR ECONOMY AND POWER.

>> TALK ABOUT THE PROJECT, INTERSTATE NATURAL GAS PIPELINE STARTS WHERE, ENDS WHERE?

>> STARTS IN WEST TEXAS, ENDS IN ARIZONA, AND IT IS ABOUT 500 MILES, IT'S AN EXPANSION COMING THROUGH NEW MEXICO, AND IT'S ABOUT $5.3 BILLION PROJECT, THOUSANDS OF CONSTRUCTION EMPLOYEES, THOUSANDS OF UTILITY WORKERS WILL GET WORK OUT OF THIS AND RESULT IN SIGNIFICANT SUPPLY OF NATURAL GAS INTO THE STATE.

WE DON'T PRODUCE, WE HAVE TO HAVE OUR NATURAL GAS DELIVERED.

TED: THERE ARE PIPELINES, WHAT HAPPENS TO THOSE PIPELINES?

>> THOSE PIPE LINES ARE NEEDED FOR WHERE WE'RE AT RIGHT NOW.

NATURAL GAS POWERS 46% OF HOUSEHOLDS AND BUSINESSES IN ARIZONA.

THIS NEW PIPELINE READY IN FOUR YEARS IS HELPING MEET THE CURRENT DEMAND WE'RE AT RIGHT NOW.

TED: HOLY SMOKES.

>> EVERYTHING IS GOING TO BE RUNNING.

TED: I READ NINE COMPRESSOR STATIONS WILL BE IN ARZ.

WHAT ARE THE COMPRESSOR STATIONS.

>> HOW THE GAS IS PROCESSED AND DELIVERED AROUND THE STATE.

OUR UTILITIES ARE GOING TO DEVELOP THOSE.

THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE SURE WHAT WE PAY FOR GAS IS DETERMINED ABOUT THE BE EFFICIENCY, IF I'M IN A COMMUNITY, I'D BE WELCOME TO HAVE ONE, I'M GOING TO GET CHEAP RELIABLE ENERGY COMING INTO MY HOUSE.

>> I WAS GOING TO ASK ABOUT THAT.

HOW DOES THIS SECURE ARIZONA'S ENERGY FUTURE?

>> AS I STATED, 46% OF OUR STATE IS POWERED BY NATURAL GAS.

WE'RE A TOP FIVE GROWTH AREA, FOR US TO POINT TO THIS PIPELINE AND SAY THIS IS HOW WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO MEET OUR DEMAND, THIS IS ANOTHER ONE OF THE MANY SOLUTIONS, WE'RE DOING SOLAR, STILL DOING WIND AND ESPECIALLY STILL DOING NUCLEAR.

THAT'S NOT GOING AWAY.

THIS JUST ADDS TO THAT, AND IT'S NOT GOING TO HIT RATEPAYERS ANY TIME SOON, THE FACT THEY'RE WILLING TO INVEST AND BRING THE PROJECT IN SHOWS THAT WE HAVE THE HOT ECONOMY WITH MANUFACTURING AND WE NEED THE POWER.

TED: I WANT TO GET BACK TO THAT, DOES IT COME TO THE EXPENSE OF OTHER ENERGYS?

>> I WOULD ARGUE ABSOLUTELY NOT.

THIS IS A PRIVATE INVESTMENT.

OUR UTILITIES MAINTAINED ALL OF THE ABOVE APPROACH.

YOU'RE SEEING THE FACT THAT ARIZONA HAS A BALANCED PORTFOLIO WHERE, WE TAKE FROM MULTIPLE GENERATIONS, NATURAL GAS IS PROVEN TO BE CHEAP AND RELIABLE, AND RIGHT NOW, IF YOU ASK MY MEMBERS, IF YOU ASK A HOME OWNER, THEY CARE ABOUT AFFORDABILITY AND RELIABILITY.

I'LL ADD ONE MORE, AVAILABILITY.

WE'RE GROWING SO FAST.

AND NATURAL GAS ANSWERS THE QUESTIONS.

TED: BACK TO WHAT YOU REFERRED TO EARLIER.

YOU MENTIONED THIS SIGNALS TWO BUSINESSES TO OTHER PARTS OF THE COUNTRY THAT ARIZONA WAS IN BUSINESS?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I WILL BE MEETING WITH A LOT OF NEW COMPANIES LOOKING TO EXPAND OR GROW TO ARIZONA, AND THE NUMBER ONE QUESTION, TED, THE NUMBER ONE, IS NOW ENERGY.

DO WE HAVE THE POWER.

IS IT RELIABLE?

WHAT DOES IT COST?

TED: INTERESTING.

>> VERY INTERESTING.

TED: BUT WE'RE STILL TALKING FOSSIL FUELS, AND STILL TALKING GREENHOUSE GAS EMISSIONS.

HOW DO WE GET AROUND THAT?

>> I WOULD SAY IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE, NATURAL GAS BURNS A LOT CLEANER THAN PEOPLE REMEMBER.

THE TECHNOLOGY HAS EVOLVED, THE GAS COMPANIES HAVE DEVELOPED 24/7 PIPELINE MONITORING SO LEAKS HAVE BEEN SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED IF ELIMINATED, THEY USE DRONE TECHNOLOGY NOW.

AND THE THING AGAIN, IF THE TECHNOLOGY, WHICH WE NEED TO CONTINUE TO INVEST IN, WE HAVE TO GET OUR STORAGE CAPACITY CONTINUING TO INVEST IN, SO THAT'S THE WAY OF THE FUTURE.

GAS IS A BRIDGE.

NATURAL GAS IS A BRIDGE UNTIL THAT TECHNOLOGY IS FULLY DEVELOPED BUT WE HAVE TO KEEP INVESTING IN ALL OF THE ABOVE.

TED: THE CRITICS SAY IT SHOULD BE A BRIDGE AND COULD BE A BRIDGE, THAT'S AN EXPENSIVE BRIDGE.

>> I WOULD ARGUE, NOT FOR THE CHEAP BRIDGE, AN EXPENSIVE BRIDGE WOULD BE MANDATING MORE AND MORE CLEAN ENERGY, WHEN REALITY, NUCLEAR IS THE CLEANEST THERE IS, WE'VE BEEN DOING WELL WITH SOLAR, HAVE TO DO BETTER WITH THE STORAGE SIDE OF IT.

PEOPLE SAY THERE'S 300+ SUNNY DAYS IN ARIZONA, THERE'S 365 UNSUNNY DAYS AT NIGHTTIME.

WE HAVE TO BE ABLE TO STORE THE ENERGY.

TED: DOES IT GET HINDERED?

>> ABSOLUTELY NOT.

WE CANNOT LOSE THE RACE WHEN IT COMES TO ENERGY PRODUCTION AND STORAGE, AND EVEN IN THE ONE BIG, BEAUTIFUL BILL, IF YOU LOOK AT THE TAX TREATMENT COMING OUT OF WASHINGTON, D.C., THE EFFICIENCY PROGRAMS SURVIVED MORE THAN PEOPLE THOUGHT THEY WOULD.

BATTERY STORAGE, HOME EFFICIENCY CREDITS ARE STILL AROUND.

TED: WHAT ABOUT THE VOLATILITY OF GAS PRICES?

HOW MUCH IS THIS GOING TO COST CONSUMERS?

WE HAVE CRITICS SAYING YOU AIN'T SEEN NOTHING YET AS FAR AS THE PRICE OF THIS THING.

>> I'M AMUSED BY WHAT CRITICS SAY.

ECONOMISTS LOOK AT THE PAST.

NATURAL GAS ISN'T CHEAP.

HOMES POWERED BY NATURAL GAS SAVE 1100 ANNUALLY RATHER THAN TRADITIONAL ELECTRIC.

BUSINESSES THAT USE NATURAL GAS SAVE ABOUT $500 BILLION.

IT'S CHEAP, RELIABLE, IT'S BEING PRODUCED RIGHT HERE IN THIS COUNTRY AND WE CAN TRANSMIT IT EASILY.

WE'RE A NET EXPORTER TO EUROPE AND ELSEWHERE.

TED: TIMETABLE FOR THIS THING?

>> FOUR YEARS UP AND RUNG.

THREE YEARS LOT OF RIBBON CUTTING AND MAYBE FASTER WITH THE ADMINISTRATION.

TED: I GOT CONSTRUCTION STARTS IN 2028, PERMITTING PROCESS, ENVIRONMENTAL STUFF?

>> ALL BEING WORKED OUT RIGHT NOW.

I KNOW PRESIDENT TRUMP'S ADMINISTRATION IS EXCITED ABOUT THIS, EXCITED ABOUT US GENERATING MORE ENERGY TO POIR MANUFACTURING AND POWER JOBS HERE IN THIS COUNTRY.

I IMAGINE A LOT OF EXPEDITING GOING ON.

TED: LAST QUESTION BEFORE YOU GO, AND I KNOW PEOPLE IN YOUR GROUP, YOUR MEMBERS ARE EXCITED ABOUT THIS, BUT THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT WATCH THE PROGRAM THAT ARE NOT WHEN THEY HEAR ABOUT GREENHOUSE GAS, VOLATILE PRICING, HOW DO YOU PUT THEM AT EASE?

>> PUT THEM AT EASE WITH THIS: GO TO THE CORPORATION COMMISSION, THOSE SAME PEOPLE WHEN THEY HEAR WHAT PEOPLE ARE SCARED OF, THE COST OF ENERGY, ARE THEY GOING TO HAVE A BLACKOUT OR BROWNOUT, WE WANT OUR AC TO RUN AND BUSINESSES TO RUN, NATURAL GAS IS THE CLEANEST, CHEAPEST, MOST RELIABLE ENERGY WE CAN USE AS A BRIDGE, NOT COUNTING NUCLEAR WHICH WE ARE STILL DEVELOPING OR HYDRO, OR SOLAR OR WIND, WE'VE DONE ALL OF THE ABOVE AND GOING TO DO IT IN ARIZONA.

TED: WE'RE GOING TO TALK ABOUT NUCLEAR IN THE COMING MONTHS.

GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN.

THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION ON THIS.

AND TAKE CARE.

>> THANKS, TED.

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

.

TED: THERE'S A CAFE IN PHOENIX WHERE YOU CAN ENJOY YOUR FAVORITE COFFEE DRINK AND VISIT WITH AND PERHAPS ADOPT A CAT.

IT'S CALLED ODDLY ENOUGH, THE PHOENIX CAT CAFE.

AND JOINING US IS KERRY SCHWARTZ, CEO OF THE PHOENIX CAT CAFE.

JOINED BY FRIENDS.

I'LL LET YOU DO THE INTRODUCTIONS?

>> I HAVE MR. CAD BURRY AND THAT IS HIS STEPBROTHER JELLY BEAN.

TED: YOU'RE A GOOD BOY, YOU HEARD GOOD BOY, SNIFFING, LITTLE PURRING, HE'S OKAY.

THE PHOENIX CAT CAFE.

HOW DOES IT WORK?

>> A NONPROFIT CAT CAFE DOWN THE STREET AT 2nd STREET AND GARFIELD.

WE HAVE FULL SERVICE COFFEE SHOP AND CAT ADOPTION LOUNGE WHERE YOU CAN COME AND HANG OUT HOPEFULLY FALL IN LOVE, ALL THE CATS ARE ADOPTABLE.

TED: I'LL TAKE A LATTE AND A TABBY, DO YOU INTRODUCE THE CATS TO THE PERSON?

DOES THE PERSON INTRODUCE THEMSELVES?

>> A LITTLE BIT OF BOTH.

THEY GET TO MEET THE CAT IN A NATURAL ENVIRONMENT, THEY'RE FREE ROAMING, CLIMBING ON SHELVES, PLAYING, INTERACTING HOW THEY WANT TO, AND AS PEOPLE HOPEFULLY LOVE THEIR PERSONALITIES, WE DO OUR APPLICATION PROCESS AND MAKE SURE IT'S A GOOD FIT FOR EVERYBODY IN THE HOME.

>> THE CATS OFTEN, THEY ADOPT YOU MORE THAN YOU ADOPT, DO YOU HAVE CATS RUN OVER TO PEOPLE AND SAY HI FUTURE FAMILY MEMBER?

>> SOME DO.

ESPECIALLY SOME OF OUR SHY KIDS, FUN TO SEE THEM PICK THE PERSON THAT THEY TRUST.

TED: OKAY.

SO THIS IS A GOOD -- THESE ARE GOOD CATS.

>> THEY ARE.

TED: JELLY BEAN, YOU'RE A GOOD CAT, YOU'RE DOING WELL.

WHERE DO THE CATS COME FROM?

>> BOTH OF THESE GUYS CAME FROM THE PHOENIX STREETS.

JELLY BEAN WAS FOUND JUST OVER AT BRETT TARVER LEARNING CENTER WITH HIS MOM.

SHE GOT TRAPPED AND FIXED AND SHE WAS TOO MEAN TO KEEP INSIDE SO, HE CONTINUED LIVING INSIDE, AND CADBURY AND HIS FOURTH OTHER BROTHERS WERE FOUND AT HORSE PROPERTY IN GILBERT.

TED: THEY COME FROM DIFFERENT PLACES, BUT I UNDERSTAND THESE ARE THE BEST OF FRIENDS?

>> THEY ARE, THEY LOVE EACH OTHER.

WE HAVE SO MANY PICTURES OF THEM CUDDLING AND PLAYING TOGETHER AND TAG AND CHASE, THEY'RE A CUTE LITTLE BONDED PAIR.

TED: DO YOU PARTNER WITH A SHELTER AT ALL?

>> WE DON'T.

WE ARE A 501(C)(3) NONPROFIT PRIVATE RESCUE OURSELVES.

ALL OF THE CATS ARE RESCUES.

TED: DO YOU ACCEPT CATS FROM OWNERS WHO CAN'T KEEP THE CATS ANYMORE?

>> MOST CATS COME FROM TRAP NEUTER RETURN PROJECTS, THEY ARE TOO FRIENDLY TO BE ON THE STREETS OR UNSAFE ENVIRONMENT, AND THAT'S WHERE WE FOCUS.

OFTENTIMES WE WILL GET A COUPLE OF OWNER SURRENDERS, BUT THOSE ARE USUALLY FEWER AND FAR BETWEEN.

TED: JELLY BEAN SAW SOME OF THE CATS ON THE BIG MONITOR.

>> HE SAW HIMSELF, I THINK.

TED: HE SAID WHAT'S GOING ON OVER THERE.

YOU HAVE CAT YOGA, I HAVEN'T HEARD ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND WHAT IN THE WORLD IS CAT YOGA?

>> THE CATS LOVE CAT YOGA, THEIR FAVORITE EVENT.

WE MOVE ALL OF THE FURNITURE IN THE MAIN CAT LOUNGE.

PEOPLE BRING THEIR YOGA MATS, LAY DOWN.

WE DO A LOT OF FLOOR WORK, NOT A LOT OF BALANCING BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO FALL ON THE CATS AND THE CATS HAVE FREE ROAM TO CLIMB ON PEOPLE, CLIMB ON A MAT.

DON'T BRING YOUR BEST MAT BECAUSE THEY WILL SCRATCH ON IT SOMETIMES.

TED:O, SURE.

>> RUB ALL OVER IT.

TED: THERE IS ALSO PAINTING WITH CATS.

WHAT IS THAT?

>> YEAH, WE DO PAINT NIGHT WITH CATS.

USUALLY WE'LL PICK DIFFERENT THEMES DEPENDING ON THE HOLIDAY OR THE SEASON.

THAT ONE IS DANGEROUS BECAUSE THE CATS LIKE TO WALK ON THE TABLES, KNOCK OVER THE PAINT OR STICK THEIR HEAD IN THE WATER OR HELP YOU WITH THE PAINTING.

TED: IT'S MODERN ART.

>> YES, YES.

TED: I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'LL HOST A PARTY WITH CATS?

>> YEAH, WE DO PRIVATE RESERVATIONS SO PEOPLE CAN RENT THE LOUNGE.

WE GET A LOT OF BIRTHDAY PARTIES, BACHELORETTE PARTIES OR FAMILIES WANT THAT TO HANG OUT BY THEMSELVES.

TED: YOU WERE FORMERLY A FOR-PROFIT AND WENT NONPROFIT, WHAT WENT ON THERE?

>> BEEN A NONPROFIT SINCE 2020.

THE FOR PROFIT WAS MY CO-FOUNDER STARTED A FOR-PROFIT IN A DIFFERENT CITY AND HER AND I CAME TOGETHER IN 2020 AND DECIDED THAT WE COULD HELP A LOT MORE CATS BY BECOMING A NONPROFIT, SO IN 2020, WE STARTED AS A NONPROFIT, AND NOW WE'RE OUR OWN RESCUE.

TED: WHEN YOU GO THERE FOR COFFEE AND KITTIES, YOU CAN JUST HAVE THE COFFEE?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I WOULD SAY 75% OF OUR VISITORS JUST COME INTO GET A CUP OF COFFEE AND HANG OUT WITH THE CATS AND DON'T HAVE ANY INTENTION OF ADOPTING AND THAT'S FULLY FINE.

LOTS OF SOCIALIZATION.

>> THE PRICING INVOLVED FOR ALL OF THIS, EVERYTHING FROM A LATTE TO A CAT.

WHAT'S INVOLVE HERE?

>> EVERYTHING IS A LA CARTE.

OUR COFFEE PRICES ARE COMPETITIVE WITH THE OTHER LOCAL COFFEE SHOPS AROUND, AND THEN WE DO CHARGE A FEE TO GET INTO THE LOUNGE AS WELL.

$16 IF YOU BOOK ONLINE OR $18 IN PERSON JUST TO HELP US KNOW OUR NUMBERS A LITTLE BIT EASIER, BUT YEAH, THAT REALLY HELPS TO PAY FOR ALL OF THE BASIC CARE FOR THE CAT.

TED: IS THERE A WEBSITE TO LEARN MORE?

>> YEP.

PHX CAT CAFE.ORG.

TED: CADBURY LOOKS LIKE HE'S IN HEAVEN.

JELLY BEAN LOOKS LIKE WHO IS THIS PERSON HOLDING ME AND WHY IS HE SCRATCHING MY HEAD?

MUST BE REWARDING FOR YOU.

THIS MUST BE A VERY REWARDING OPERATION.

>> ACTUALLY FINDING THE HOME AND SEEING THE EXCITEMENT.

THE OWNERS AND GETTING THE UPDATES A COUPLE MONTHS LATER ONCE EVERYBODY IS SETTLED INTO THE HOME AND EVERYTHING LIKE THAT.

TED: CONGRATULATIONS ON THIS, AND, AGAIN, THESE TWO GOT TO GO TOGETHER NOW.

>> THEY DO.

THEY'RE A BONDED PAIR.

TED: TWO PEAS IN A POD.

GOOD TO HAVE YOU HERE.

CADBURY, NICE TO HAVE YOU HERE.

JELLY BEAN, THANK YOU FOR NOT MAKING MY LIFE MISERABLE DURING THE INTERVIEW, AND BEST OF LUCK.

>> THANK YOU.

TED: THAT'S IT FOR NOW.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

YOU HAVE A GREAT EVENING.