ALI ROGIN: College campuses are buzzing with# activity as students return after summer break.## But change is also in the air.

At more than# 400 colleges and universities, programs and## centers that promote diversity, equity and# inclusion have been eliminated or rebranded.

DEI programs have been under a microscope# since state laws and President Trump's## executive orders labeled them as discriminatory.# So what's the future of DEI in higher education?## Paulette Granberry Russell, president and CEO of# the National Association of Diversity Officers## in Higher Education, is here to tell us more.# It's part of our Rethinking College series.

Paulette, thank you so much for joining us.# Your organization is more than 20 years old,## which seems to underscore the fact that# these efforts to promote diversity on## college campuses is not new.

But do you think# that history is reflected in the current## national conversation we're having about DEI?

PAULETTE GRANBERRY RUSSELL, President and CEO,## NADOHE: As you reference, the organization that# I helped to lead has been around for 20 years,## but that is not representative of the effort# within our colleges and universities to become## a more welcoming, supportive environment# for students based on diverse backgrounds,## identities, lived experiences.

So we've had quite a bit of work over the,## I'd say the last 60 plus years to create a more# supportive environment for all of our students.

ALI ROGIN: And some of them have told# us about the ways in which these types## of programs help them get access# to specific scholarships program## centers designed to encourage diversity.# We spoke to one student at the University## of Texas Dallas to find out what these# programs on his campus meant to him.

ALEXANDER DE JESUS, Student, University of Texas# at Dallas: When I did have access to DEI programs,## they helped me a lot in being able to# find a community where there was none.## It's very easy as a Latino to feel very# lost, especially if it's -- you're coming## from a low income background like me.

That# helped me find a lot of common community## with people who genuinely cared about what# was going on around them and also helped me## find access to conferences and programs# that I wouldn't have known otherwise.

ALI ROGIN: So what are some of those# real world changes that you're seeing## now or anticipate happening in the future now# that some of these programs are going away?

PAULETTE GRANBERRY RUSSELL: I think across# the country we've seen efforts both at the## state level and certainly more recently with# the executive orders to dismantle diversity,## equity and inclusion efforts.

We are seeing# women's centers, we're seeing centers for## members of the LGBTQ community, other cultural# spaces that are being closed or defunded.

And it's clear, I think, as represented by# the student, that these spaces were built over## decades as a direct response to student needs.# And their disappearance is deeply troubling.

ALI ROGIN: And those disappearances, do you# anticipate that those are going to lead,## or perhaps they already have# to demographic shifts as## incoming students consider# where they want to apply?

PAULETTE GRANBERRY RUSSELL: Well, it# could.

And if those individuals do## not feel that campus is either respectful# or supportive of their needs, then it is## possible that they will seek support in other# colleges and universities across the country.

But what should be noted is that these centers# are not extras to campus life.

They act as vital## resources that ensure that all students, not just# some students, are supported in their education.

ALI ROGIN: The Trump administration this# week announced a $500 million increase## in funding to historically black colleges# and universities, while at the same time## cutting funding for colleges that mainly serve# Hispanic students.

How does that change fit into## this administration's agenda when it comes# to promoting diversity on college campuses?

PAULETTE GRANBERRY RUSSELL: At its core, our# perspective is that this is not a win for## students.

It is a zero sum approach.

Funding# resources are already scarce and potentially## results in these institutions being pitted# against each other.

And all of these institutions,## whether they are HBCUs, tribal colleges,# Hispanic serving, minority serving institutions,## they play a vital role in expanding# access and opportunity for all students.

ALI ROGIN: The Trump administration has# also said that getting rid of some of these## initiatives will lead to a society of, quote,# colorblind and competence based workplaces.## How do you think about that vision as# articulated there and what does it mean to you?

PAULETTE GRANBERRY RUSSELL: Well, I think# a colorblind employment environment,## while a noble goal, that is# not the reality of individuals,## lived experiences or their sense of community.# Our communities are diverse.

People are not## necessarily uncomfortable extending themselves# across communities.

But there are times when## in fact we do not anticipate, nor should we# expect that every community is going to be## welcoming and supportive.

That is not# the country that we live in currently.

We have a long ways to go and I think to# achieve a colorblind society or country,## while noble, I don't think that's# the reality, nor do I think## somehow diminishing culture and experiences# is truly what is valued about this democracy.

ALI ROGIN: Paulette Granberry# Russell with the National## Association of Diversity Officers in# Higher Education.

Thank you so much.

PAULETTE GRANBERRY RUSSELL: And# thank you, Ali, for this opportunity.