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♪♪ >>> IT'S REPORTERS' ROUNDTABLE.

I'M DAVID CRUZ.

WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.

WELL, YOU MAY HAVE HEARD ABOUT THE PENDING-EVICTION CRISIS.

75 TO 80,000 EVICTION FILINGS, IN THE COURT PIPELINE RIGHT NOW.

WITH MORE THAN 190,000 EXPECTED, IN 2022.

IT'S SOMETHING, THAT THREATENS THE STABILITY OF MANY COMMUNITIES, AND HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF INDIVIDUALS.

THERE IS AN EVICTION MORATORIUM IN PLACE, BUT ONLY THROUGH JULY.

STACY BERGER IS PRESIDENT AND CEO OF THE HOUSING AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT NETWORK OF NEW JERSEY.

SHE IS HERE TO TALK ABOUT THAT, WITH US.

STACY, THANKS FOR COMING ON.

YOU KNOW, WE TALK ABOUT 190,000 FILINGS IN 2022.

THAT REPRESENTS WAY MORE THAN THAT, IN ACTUAL PEOPLE, RIGHT?

LET'S JUST START WITH, WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS OF THAT NUMBER ON THE PUBLIC, AT LARGE?

>> DAVID, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME, TODAY.

THAT IS CORRECT.

THOSE -- THOSE FILINGS REPRESENT HOUSEHOLDS AND, IN MOST CASES, THERE IS TWO OR THREE OR FOUR OR FIVE FOLKS IN THOSE HOMES.

AND SO, WE KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE WILL BE POTENTIALLY, JUST DOING THE MATH, THERE WILL BE A MILLION PEOPLE WITHOUT A PLACE TO LIVE.

AND NEW JERSEY DOES NOT HAVE THAT KIND OF HOUSING STOCK AVAILABLE, WHERE PEOPLE CAN SIMPLY MOVE TO ANOTHER PLACE.

AND ARE -- CERTAINLY, OUR SOCIAL-SERVICE SYSTEM CAN'T ABSORB A MILLION PEOPLE BEING HOMELESS, ALL, AT ONCE.

SO, WE NEED A POLICY SOLUTION THAT IS GOING TO ALLOW PEOPLE TO STAY SAFELY AND STABLY HOUSED IN THE HOME THEY ARE IN NOW, AS THE ECONOMY PICKS BACK UP.

AND AS FOLKS GET VACCINATED AND ARE ABLE TO GO OUT AND DO THE THINGS WE USED TO DO IN THE BEFORE TIMES SO THAT WE ARE ABLE TO, YOU KNOW, RESTORE OUR ECONOMIC STABILITY AND OUR HEALTH STABILITY.

BUT I WILL SAY, THIS WAS A PROBLEM, PRIOR TO THE PANDEMIC.

WE DID HAVE AN ENORMOUS RENTAL-HOUSING CRISIS, EVEN BEFORE COVID HIT.

AND WE CAN TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT, IF -- IF YOU WANT TO HAVE SOME OF THE DATA ABOUT WHERE FOLKS WERE STRUGGLING, PRIOR.

>> SURE.

IN TERMS OF AFFORDABILITY, BEFORE ALL OF THIS HAPPENED, LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE COURTS.

WE -- YOU AND I SPOKE EARLIER THIS WEEK.

I DID A STORY ON HOW THE COURT SYSTEM IS TRYING TO GET ON TOP OF THIS.

THEY ARE TRYING TO PUT A -- A -- A PLAN IN PLACE.

BUT THEY COULD BE OVERWHELMED, THE COURT SYSTEM, NO?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I THINK, EVERYONE IS LOOKING AT THIS SITUATION WITH -- WITH TREPIDATION BECAUSE THEY KNOW THAT THE COURTS ARE NOT ABLE TO HANDLE THAT INCOMING FLUX OF EVICTIONS.

THEY KNOW THE PEOPLE BEING AFFECTED CAN'T HANDLE IT.

AND THE NEIGHBORHOODS AND COMMUNITIES THAT ARE GOING TO SUFFER, AS WELL, ARE JUST NOT PREPARED.

AND FRANKLY, WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING, BESIDES MAKE SURE THAT PEOPLE ARE EVICTED.

THE EVICTION MORATORIUM THAT YOU MENTIONED EARLIER IS TIED TO THE PUBLIC-HEALTH EMERGENCY.

AND SO, IT IS GOOD FOR 60 DAYS AFTER THE END OF THE PUBLIC-HEALTH EMERGENCY.

THERE IS, CURRENTLY-OPEN EMERGENCY RENTAL ASSISTANCE PROGRAM AT THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY AFFAIRS.

IT IS PROBABLY NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO HELP EVERY SINGLE FAMILY THAT NEEDS RENTAL ASSISTANCE.

BUT CERTAINLY, EVERY SINGLE FAMILY THAT NEEDS RENTAL ASSISTANCE SHOULD APPLY BECAUSE THAT HELP IS AVAILABLE FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, THROUGH THE STATE, AND IN MANY COMMUNITIES AND COUNTIES AROUND NEW JERSEY.

SO, THERE -- THERE ARE SOME-FINANCIAL RESOURCES THAT CAN HELP PEOPLE PAY BACK WHAT THEY OWE AND POTENTIALLY PAY WHAT THEY MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO PAY, GOING FORWARD.

SO WE WANT EVERY SINGLE FEDERAL DOLLAR THAT COMES TO THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY, SO IF FOLKS NEED HELP, THEY CAN GO TO OUR WEBSITE.

HOUSINGHELPNJ.ORG.

THAT WILL HELP GET THEM IN TOUCH WITH THE RENTAL ASSISTANCE PROGRAM, AS WELL AS COUNSELORS AND MEDIATORS WHO CAN HELP THEM NOW.

>> AND THEN, THERE IS THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN EVICTED, RIGHT?

WHO -- WHO IS GETTING EVICTED?

LET'S TALK ABOUT WHO THIS IS, THAT IS FACING THIS CRISIS.

>> SURE.

SO, IN NEW JERSEY, WE KNOW THAT THERE IS ABOUT 300,000 EXTREMELY-LOW-INCOME FAMILIES, AS OF LAST YEAR, PRE-PANDEMIC, WHO WERE PAYING MORE THAN 50% OF THEIR INCOME FOR RENT.

THAT MEANS THEY ARE SEVERELY RENT BURDENED.

THERE IS ONLY ABOUT 32 APARTMENTS AVAILABLE FOR EVERY-HUNDRED FAMILIES WHO NEED THEM.

WHICH MEANS OUR HOUSING MARKET AND IS VACANCY RATE ARE REALLY, REALLY TIGHT.

SO THERE IS NOWHERE FOR FOLKS TO GO.

AND BASED ON THE DATA THAT THE PRINCETON LAB EVICTED, RATHER, PROFESSOR DESMOND AT EVICTED -- AT THE EVICTION LAB WROTE THE BOOK "EVICTED."

WE KNOW THAT A BLACK MOM IS FIVE-TIMES MORE LIKELY THAN A SINGLE-WHITE MALE HEAD OF HOUSE HOLD TO BE EVICTED.

AND IN NEW JERSEY, THOSE NUMBERS PRETTY MUCH PAN OUT IN THE SAME WAY.

ABOUT 80% OF WHITE FOLKS OWN THEIR HOMES.

BUT NOT -- THAT IS NOT TRUE FOR BLACK AND LATINO FAMILIES AND FOLKS OF ETHNICITY.

SO WE KNOW FOLKS ARE MORE LIKELY TO BE RENTERS IF THEY ARE PEOPLE OF COLOR AND THEY ARE MORE LIKELY TO HAVE FELT IMPACT FROM THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC.

SO, COMMUNITIES OF COLOR AND RESIDENTS OF COLOR ARE REALLY AT HUGE RISK FROM THE EVICTION CRISIS.

>> CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN, TO PEOPLE, WHAT THE LONG-TERM IMPLICATIONS ARE FOR SOMEONE WHO'S BEEN EVICTED?

WHAT IMPACT THAT HAS ON THEIR ABILITY, GOING FORWARD?

>> SURE.

AS WE DISCUSSED EARLIER IN THE WEEK, DAVID, AN EVICTION FILING DOESN'T EVEN HAVE TO BE CONFIRMED BY THE COURT.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO ACTUALLY BE EVICTED FOR THAT EVICTION FILING TO MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT FOR A LANDLORD TO RENT TO SOMEONE.

SO, IF LANDLORDS CHECK TO SEE WHO'S HAD AN EVICTION FILING MADE AGAINST THEM.

AND WHETHER THAT EVICTION IS ACTUALLY APPROVED BY THE COURT.

OR -- OR REMOVED BY THE COURT, A LANDLORD WILL ACTUALLY USE THAT AS A WAY TO KEEP PEOPLE OUT OF A NEW APARTMENT.

ADDITIONALLY, YOU KNOW, IT CAN IMPACT SOMEONE'S CREDIT REPORT FOR SEVEN-TO-TEN YEARS.

AND SO, IT HAS LONG-TERM, POTENTIALLY-LIFETIME IMPACT ON FAMILIES, WHO ARE THEN UNABLE TO FIND A NEW PLACE TO LIVE.

AND -- AND SO, IT'S REALLY A CYCLE OF POVERTY AND HOMELESSNESS AND HOUSING INSECURITY, THAT MOVES THROUGHOUT SOMEONE'S LIFE.

IT CAN, YOU KNOW, KEEP -- PULL KIDS OUT OF SCHOOLS, WHICH DISRUPTS THEIR ENTIRE-EDUCATIONAL EXPERIENCE.

IT JUST HAS LONG-TERM SUFFERING FOR FAMILIES.

>> YEAH.

IT'S JUST AS BAD AS A BANKRUPTCY, REALLY.

LANDLORDS ARE AFFECTED BY THIS, TOO.

AND I'M THINKING, PARTICULARLY OF SMALLER LANDLORDS.

SHOULD THE STATE OR THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAVE DONE SOMETHING, LIKE, MAYBE, CREATED A PPP PROGRAM FOR LANDLORDS?

SOMETHING LIKE THAT?

>> WELL, LANDLORDS CAN ACCESS THE PPP PROGRAM AND SOME DID.

THERE WAS, ALSO, A STATE PROGRAM THAT WAS DIRECTED TO SMALL LANDLORDS TO HELP THEM MAKE UP THE DIFFERENCE.

THEY CAN, ALSO, GET A MORTGAGE FORBEARANCE, WHICH MEANS THAT THEY COULD, THEN, PUT -- PUT THE DIFFERENCE OF THEIR MORTGAGE TOWARDS THE END OF THAT PAYMENT.

AND POTENTIALLY, AMORTIZE IT OVER THE COST OF THEIR LOAN SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR IT UPFRONT.

AND IN THE PEOPLE'S BILL, WHICH HAS BEEN PASSED BY THE ASSEMBLY, AND REMAINS IN THE SENATE WAITING FOR A VOTE.

THERE IS A TAX-CREDIT PROGRAM THAT WOULD ALLOW SMALL -- SMALL HOMEOWNERS, RATHER, TO -- SMALL LANDLORDS, RATHER -- TO -- TO BE ABLE TO TAKE A DEDUCTION ON THEIR -- ON THEIR PROPERTY TAXES.

>> HAS THE ADMINISTRATION AND THE LEGISLATURE REALLY DONE ENOUGH TO HELP HERE?

>> WE ARE WAITING FOR A FINAL-POLICY SOLUTION.

WE THINK THE GOVERNOR HAS DONE A GREAT JOB, BY MAKING SURE THAT NO ONE CAN BE EVICTED.

WE KNOW THE LEGISLATURE IS LOOKING AT A NUMBER OF SOLUTIONS, AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO WORKING WITH ALL THE STAKEHOLDERS TO MAKE SURE EVERYONE STAYS SAFELY AND STABLY HOUSED AND THAT NO ONE IS EVICTED, AS A RESULT OF THE COVID-19 CRISIS.

WE, YOU KNOW, ASKED PEOPLE TO STAY HOME TO KEEP EVERYONE SAFE.

AND NOW, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT EVERYONE CAN STAY, SAFELY, HOME.

>> ALL RIGHT.

STACEY BERGER, WE ARE GOING TO KEEP WATCHING THIS.

THANKS FOR COMING ON WITH US.

GOOD TO SEE YOU, AGAIN.

>> THANKS SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME.

GOOD TO SEE YOU, TOO.

THANK YOU.

>> ALL RIGHT.

ONTO OUR PANEL, NOW.

CARLY CITRON IS THE EDUCATION REPORTER FOR "POLITICO" NJ.

MATT KATZ IS REPORTER WITH WNYCU RADIO.

AND BRENT JOHNSON IS POLITICS REPORTER FOR NJ ADVANCED MEDIA.

AND A PROUD, NEW PAPA.

CONGRATULATIONS, SIR.

>> THANK YOU, APPRECIATE IT.

>> SO, PANEL, WELCOME TO ALL OF YOU.

WE JUST HEARD FROM STACEY BERGER THERE ABOUT THIS VERY REAL EVICTION CRISIS.

BRENT, I FEEL LIKE THIS IS A STORY THAT IS GOING TO DOMINATE THE NEWS CYCLE, COME THE NEW YEAR.

IS THE ADMINISTRATION ON TOP OF THIS?

>> IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S DEFINITELY -- THAT'S -- THAT'S AT THE FRONT OF THIS CRISIS RIGHT NOW.

AND IT WOULD -- MURPHY BEING IN A RE-ELECTION YEAR, SOMETHING YOU ARE DEFINITELY GOING TO HEAR ABOUT THROUGHOUT -- THROUGHOUT THE NEXT-FEW MONTHS.

SO WE WILL SEE HOW IT PLAYS OUT BUT YEAH, IT'S DEFINITELY ONE OF THE BIG CRISES OF THE CORONAVIRUS PANDEMIC RIGHT NOW.

>> CARLY, THIS WOULD IMPACT LOCAL-SCHOOL DISTRICTS.

BUT I MEAN, IS IT EVEN ON THEIR RADAR?

DO YOU HEAR MUCH TALK ABOUT THIS?

>> NOT MUCH.

I MEAN, IT'S -- IT'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING THAT PARENTS AND FAMILIES ARE CONCERNED ABOUT.

AND SOMETHING THAT DEFINITELY IMPACTS THE OUTCOMES OF, YOU KNOW, THOUSANDS OF KIDS IN THE STATE.

SOMETHING THAT LEADERS ARE HAVING TO KIND OF DEAL WITH, ON AN INDIVIDUALIZED BASIS.

AND JUST, KIND OF, UNDERSCORES THE NEED FOR MORE PERSONNEL IN SCHOOLS, MORE COUNSELORS, ADDRESS.

WHICH WOULD PROVIDE KIND OF ALL THE NEEDS THAT -- THAT, YOU KNOW, IN THE CASE OF A LESS-STABLE HOUSEHOLD.

>> ALL RIGHT.

THE OTHER, BIG STORY THIS WEEK, IS ESSEX COUNTY.

IT'S GOING TO END ITS CONTRACT WITH I.C.E.

THEY ARE -- THEY HAVE A CONTRACT WITH I.C.E.

TO HOLD UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS.

MATT, YOU HAVE BEEN ON THIS STORY.

WHAT HAPPENED IN ESSEX COUNTY?

AND THEN, GIVE US AN UPDATE ON THE SITUATION IN HUDSON COUNTY, WHICH IS STILL UNFOLDING.

LET'S START WITH ESSEX.

WHAT HAPPENED THERE?

>> YEAH.

IT WAS A TOTAL SURPRISE.

KIND OF, CAME OUT OF NOWHERE LAST WEEK.

ESSEX COUNTY EXECUTIVE ANNOUNCED THAT THEY WERE ENTERING INTO A SERVICE AGREEMENT WITH UNION COUNTY TO TAKE THEIR INMATES.

THEIR REGULAR, CRIMINALLY-CHARGED INMATES AT THE ESSEX COUNTY JAIL.

I STARTED WONDERING, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THERE IS SOMETHING GOING ON HERE WITH THEIR HUNDREDS OF I.C.E.

DETAINEES THROUGHOUT THE JAIL.

AND SURE ENOUGH, THIS WEEK, JOE D ANNOUNCED THAT THEY WERE NOT GOING TO OFFICIALLY END THE I.C.E.

CONTRACT BUT WHAT HE CALLED DEPOPULATE THE -- THE JAIL OF I.C.E.

DETAINEES.

SO THERE HAVE BEEN AS MANY AS 800 I.C.E.

DETAINEES AT ANY GIVEN TIME.

DURING THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, THAT CAUSED A TON OF CONTROVERSY AMONG ANTI-I.C.E.

ACTIVISTS.

BECAUSE THEY WERE JAILING PEOPLE FOR I.C.E.

AND THESE WERE DEMOCRATS.

THE POPULATION HAS DWINDLED SUBSTANTIALLY.

AND NOW, THEY ARE GOING TO BE OUT BY -- BY AUGUST.

SO, THAT HAPPENED JUST A COUPLE DAYS AGO.

AND THEN, IN A MATTER OF HOURS, HUDSON COUNTY, WHICH AFTER BIDEN WAS ELECTED REVERSED A PROMISE TO END THEIR I.C.E.

CONTRACT BY 2020.

AND THE HUDSON COUNTY COMMISSIONERS ACTUALLY VOTED IN DECEMBER TO EXTEND THEIR CONTRACT FOR TEN YEARS.

SUDDENLY, JOE D GETS OUT, ESSEX IS OUT.

AND HUDSON COUNTY COMMISSIONER CHAIRMAN ANTHONY IS LIKE -- HE SAID AT A COMMISSIONER MEETING.

YOU KNOW, I AM RETHINKING THINGS AND WE ARE HOPING TO BE DONE WITH OUR I.C.E.

CONTRACT, BY THE END OF THE YEAR.

AND GET OUR I.C.E.

PRISONERS OUT AND ENTER INTO SOME SORT OF ARRANGEMENT TO MAKE UP FOR THE REVENUE.

AND -- AND THIS IS A MAJOR CHANGE.

THEY HAVE BEEN DEFENDING THIS, WE NEED THE REVENUE.

WE TREAT THEM WELL.

THAT'S ALL DONE AWAY WITH AND NOW, THERE SEEMS TO BE REVERSING THEIR STANCE.

ESSEX COUNTY EXECUTIVE CHIEF ALSO TOLD JERSEY JOURNAL THEY WERE ALSO LOOKING TO GET OUT.

SO VERY INTERESTING.

AND THEN, ONE LAST THING, DAVID.

THE BERGEN COUNTY IS THE THIRD COUNTY IN THE STATE THAT HOLDS I.C.E.

DETAINEES.

AND THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE TOLD US, LAST NIGHT, THAT THEY ARE NO LONGER TAKING ANY NEW I.C.E.

DETAINEES.

WHICH MEANS THEY ARE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO TAKE THE ONES WHO GET RELEASED FROM ESSEX.

SO WHERE DO THESE DETAINEES GO?

TRY TO CONVINCE I.C.E.

TO RELEASE THESE PEOPLE?

IT'S A FLUCTUATING-MOVING STORY.

AND IT CAME OUT OF -- CAME AS QUITE A SURPRISE, THIS WEEK.

>> REALLY, VERY, VERY CURIOUS, PARTICULARLY IN HUDSON, WHERE PRETTY MUCH THE HARD LINER ON KEEPING THE I.C.E.

CONTRACTS GOING.

I MEAN, DO YOU CARE TO CONJECTURE AS TO WHOSE HAND IS AT PLAY HERE?

IS IT -- IS IT THE TWO-U.S.

SENATORS PUTTING PRESSURE ON THE COUNTIES?

>> I -- I MEAN -- I -- I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING BEHIND THE SCENES.

BUT BOB MENENDEZ CALLED THESE CONTRACTS BLOOD MONEY, A COUPLE MONTHS AGO.

AND THAT CAUSED MAJOR-RIPPLE EFFECTS THROUGHOUT THESE LOCAL-COUNTY ORGANIZATIONS, PARTICULARLY IN HUDSON.

OBVIOUSLY, WHERE BOB MENENDEZ COMES FROM.

SO, IT -- THAT -- THAT HAS A MAJOR -- THAT IS A MAJOR FACTOR HERE, ALSO, CORY BOOKER IS AGAINST THESE CONTRACTS.

AND PHIL MURPHY'S NEVER REALLY CHIMED IN.

HE'S ALWAYS KIND OF AVOIDED THIS TOPIC.

SO, HE'S NOT A PLAYER HERE.

SO, YOU HAVE TO ASSUME THAT MENENDEZ HAS HAD SOME ROLE.

EITHER, JUST HIS PUBLIC COMMENTS OR PRIVATELY.

BOB MENENDEZ WANTS TO BE THE FACE OF IMMIGRATION REFORM, NATIONALLY.

YOU KNOW, HE -- HE IS THE GUY WHO IS PUSHING COMPREHENSIVE-IMMIGRATION LEGISLATION.

HE DOESN'T WANT I.C.E.

DETAINEES LOCKED UP.

GUYS WHO HAVE NOT BEEN CRIMINALLY CHARGED, SOME OF THEM, WITH ANYTHING.

THEY ARE JUST HERE UNDOCUMENTED.

PEOPLE THAT BOB MENENDEZ WANTS TO LEGALIZE AND MAKE THEM CITIZENS, EVENTUALLY.

HE DOESN'T WANT THEM LOCKED UP IN HIS OWN COUNTY.

IT'S -- IT'S A BAD LOOK.

AND IT -- AND, YOU KNOW, I THINK, IT GIVES HIM A LITTLE LESS STANDING, MAYBE, NATIONALLY.

SO, I THINK THAT HAS TO BE SOMETHING GOING ON HERE.

YOU KNOW, THERE -- THERE IS A FINAL THING.

YOU KNOW, THERE IS A PRIVATE FACILITY IN ELIZABETH, DAVID, AS YOU KNOW.

AND THERE HAVE BEEN MANY PROTESTS OUT THERE, BEFORE.

IT'S RUN BY CORPS CIVIC.

SO WE ARE LOOKING AT A SCENARIO THAT, BY THE END OF THE YEAR, THERE ARE ZERO-I.C.E.

DETAINEES LEFT IN NEW JERSEY.

AND WE HOUSE -- NEW JERSEY HOUSES I.C.E.

DETAINEES FROM NEW YORK, TOO.

SO, THAT'S A MAJOR SHIFT AND IT PROVIDES AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION TO REALLY, LIKE, CHANGE HOW WE -- AND WHETHER PEOPLE WHO ARE HERE UNDOCUMENTED SHOULD GET JUST LOCKED UP WHILE THEY AWAIT THEIR DEPORTATION PROCEEDINGS.

>> YEAH.

WOW, WHAT A DIFFERENCE A YEAR MAKES.

BRENT, THOSE I.C.E.

CONTRACTS ARE FEDERAL.

BUT THE POSSIBILITY THAT THEY COULD GET CANCELLED, IS THE RESULT OF A LOT OF PRESSURE COMING FROM IMMIGRANTS' RIGHTS GROUPS, AS WELL.

I MEAN, THEY ARE HAVING AN IMPACT HERE.

THIS WEEKEND, LICENSES FOR THE UNDOCUMENTED WILL BE LEGAL.

AND STILL, HUNGER STRIKERS ARE PUTTING PRESSURE ON THE GOVERNOR TO COME UP WITH SOME FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE IN THE LIGHT OF COVID.

NOW, THAT'S ATTRACTING NATIONAL ATTENTION.

WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THAT?

THE HUNGER STRIKERS HERE IN NEW JERSEY.

>> THE HUNGER STRIKE IS STILL GOING ON.

AND IT'S ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT'S KIND OF BEING PLAYED OUT IN THE BACKGROUND OF ALL THIS COVID STUFF GOING ON IN THE STATE.

AND, YOU KNOW, THE STATE IS MANY MOVING IN THE MORE PROGRESSIVE DIRECTION, NOW THAT MURPHY IS GOVERNOR.

SO THESE KIND OF THINGS ARE COMING TO THE FOREFRONT BECAUSE YOU HAVE ADVOCATES WHO BELIEVE A PROGRESSIVE GOVERNOR SHOULD BE ABLE TO GET THIS DONE.

SO, THERE IS A LOT MORE PRESSURE ON MURPHY AND THE LEGISLATURE TO ACT ON THESE TYPE OF THINGS.

SO THE HUNGER STRIKE IS STILL GOING ON AND MURPHY'S TEAM SAYS THEY ARE WORKING ON IT.

BUT YEAH, THAT'S DEFINITELY AN ISSUE THAT -- THAT'S PLAYING OUT RIGHT NOW IN NEW JERSEY.

>> THE LATEST ON COVID, NOW.

NEW YORK CITY ANNOUNCING 100% REOPENING, ON JULY 1st.

WE HAD DECLAN ON CHAT BOX THIS WEEK, URGING GOVERNOR MURPHY TO GO 100%, TOO.

CARLY, 80,000 AT THE MEADOWLANDS FOR SPRINGSTEEN THIS SUMMER?

>> I MEAN, IT'S STILL REALLY UNCERTAIN.

I MEAN, THOUGH THE GOVERNOR LIFTED SOME RESTRICTIONS FOR LARGE GATHERINGS FOR THINGS, LIKE GRADUATION AND PROMS.

YOU SEE BIG SCHOOLS LIKE RUTGERS, PRESIDENT JONATHAN HALLOWAY SAID IN A BUDGET HEARING THIS WEEK, YOU KNOW, HE STILL IS STANDING BY HIS DECISION TO HOLD COMMENCEMENT VIRTUALLY.

AND THAT'S JUST DOESN'T FEEL SAFE YET.

AND SO, I DO THINK KIND OF THIS LINGERING FEELING MAY BE BECAUSE IT'S JUST BEEN SO LONG THAT WE HAVE ALL BEEN KIND OF CONFINED TO OUR SMALL GROUPS OR INDOORS, THAT IT MAKES YOU NERVOUS TO THINK OF REALLY BIG, KIND OF, UNMASKED GATHERINGS.

THOUGH, THE VACCINATION RATE IS INCREASING SUBSTANTIALLY, SO THINGS COULD LOOK VERY DIFFERENT BY THE MIDDLE TO THE END OF THE SUMMER.

TRADITIONALLY, THE MURPHY ADMINISTRATION HAS LIKE DELAYED NOT UNTIL THE LAST-POSSIBLE SECOND.

UNTIL THINGS -- YOU WOULDN'T EXPECT HIM TO BE OUT IN FRONT, DECLARING A FULL REOPENING.

I THINK HE'S TENDED TO PLAY IT, KIND OF, VERY SAFE IN -- IN ENLISTING RESTRICTIONS.

>> GO AHEAD.

>> ONE THING, CONNECTICUT HAS REOPENED AND NEW YORK CITY IS HAS ANNOUNCED THEY ARE GOING TO REOPEN.

THERE IS GOING TO BE MORE PRESSURE ON MURPHY BECAUSE THOSE ARE DENSELY-POPULATED AREAS RIGHT IN OUR BACKYARD.

SO YOU WILL SEE PRESSURE INCREASE ON MURPHY TO AT LEAST GIVE A TARGET DATE.

THAT'S SOMETHING REPUBLICANS HAVE WANTED AND AT LEAST TELL US WHEN WE CAN EXPECT SOMETHING TO HAPPEN.

>> AND, CARLY, ARE ALL THE COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES IN NEW JERSEY GOING TO, PRETTY MUCH, REQUIRE YOU TO HAVE A VACCINE IN ORDER TO ENROLL?

IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S GOING THAT WAY?

>> I MEAN, THE TIDE MAY TURN.

BIG SCHOOLS, INCLUDING, YOU KNOW, RUTGERS WAS THE FIRST.

MONTCLAIR HAS ALSO SAID THEY WOULD MANDATE IT BUT THERE ARE SOME HOLDOUTS.

AND I THINK THERE ARE LINGERING QUESTIONS ABOUT THE -- NOT THE LEGALITY BUT THE -- KIND OF, THE QUESTIONS ABOUT CAN YOU MANDATE A VACCINE THAT IS EMERGENCY-USE AUTHORIZATION?

AND SO, A COUPLE OF SCHOOLS TOLD LAWMAKERS DURING BUDGET HEARINGS THAT WAITING FOR SOME GUIDANCE FROM THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE TO SAY, YOU KNOW, IS IT OKAY THAT WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS?

AND IT DOES SEEM, AS THE DAYS GO BY, MORE AND MORE SCHOOLS ARE SAYING, YOU KNOW WHAT?

WE ARE JUST GOING TO GO FOR IT.

IT'S THE SAFEST OPTION, WE BELIEVE, AND -- AND SOMETHING THAT WE WANT FOR ALL STUDENTS ON CAMPUS.

BUT THERE ARE SOME HOLDOUTS.

>> YOU HAD AN INTERESTING PIECE, THIS WEEK, ON HOW SOME COLLEGE PRESIDENTS SAY THEY ARE -- THEY ARE BRACING FOR 20 YEARS OF -- OF COVID REPERCUSSIONS.

TELL US ABOUT THAT.

>> THERE IS A LOT OF CONCERN THAT NEW JERSEY'S REMEDIATION RATES.

SO, KIDS ENTERING TO RETAKE OR BRUSH UP ON SOME OF THEIR HIGH SCHOOL SKILLS, CONCERNED THAT COULD SKYROCKET.

AND NEW JERSEY'S RATE HAS ALREADY BEEN PRETTY HIGH.

AROUND 15% OF ALL STUDENTS NEED TO TAKE A REMEDIAL COURSE, AT SOME POINT.

SO THERE ARE FEARS, THIS IS GOING TO GO ON FOR TWO DECADES.

AND THE KIDS WHO ARE, YOU KNOW, 8th GRADE, 7th GRADE NOW.

BY THE TIME THEY ARE IN COLLEGE, THEY ARE GOING TO BE MISSING SOME SKILLS FROM THESE YEARS, AND HAVE TO MAKE THOSE UP.

THE COMMUNITY COLLEGE LEADERS ARE SAYING, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE OF THIS LOSS OF LEARNING OR UNFINISHED LEARNING.

THEY ARE ANTICIPATING THAT THEY ARE GOING TO BE THE ONES -- AND THAT ARE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE UP A LOT OF GROUND.

AND THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S GOING TO [ INAUDIBLE ] FOR EXAMPLE.

OR PERFORM WELL ON -- ON ENTRY TESTS.

>> BRENT, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ARE BACK AT THE BRIEFINGS, YET.

BUT WHAT HAVE YOU SEEN ON THE VACCINE PROGRAM?

IT SEEMS LIKE EVERYBODY WHO IS ELIGIBLE WILL HAVE A SHOT AVAILABLE FOR THEM.

BUT PEOPLE SEEM TO NOT BE TAKING ADVANTAGE?

>> YEAH, IT WAS ALL -- IT WAS ALL OF A SUDDEN, WE HAD NOTHING BUT PEOPLE SCRAMBLING TO GET APPOINTMENTS, FOR WEEKS, FOR MONTHS.

AND THEN, ALL OF A SUDDEN, YOU SEE DEMAND, KIND OF, START TO DWINDLE.

AND, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE SAYING THEY WERE EXPECTING THIS POINT.

MURPHY'S TEAM SAID THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS GOING TO BE SOME HESITANCY.

AND THEY EXPECTED THEY'D HAVE TO STEP OUT, AND TRY AND DRIVE UP NUMBERS.

AND THAT'S WHAT THEY SAY THEY ARE GOING TO DO MONDAY.

THEY SAY THEY ARE GOING TO ANNOUNCE, ON MONDAY, SOME NEW STEPS TO TRY AND DRIVE UP VACCINE ELIGIBILITY BECAUSE THEY WANT TO GET TO 70% OF ADULTS IN THE STATE TO BE VACCINATED BY THE END OF JUNE.

THEY ARE A LITTLE MORE THAN HALFWAY THERE.

SO THEY HAVE SOME WORK TO DO WITHIN THE NEXT FEW WEEKS AND WE WILL SEE WHAT -- HOW THAT IS GOING TO PLAY OUT.

>> GO AHEAD, MATT.

>> I WAS GOING TO SAY SOMETHING HAPPENED WITH REPUBLICAN-VACCINE HESITANCY IN THE MEDIA THIS WEEK.

"THIS AMERICAN LIFE" THE RADIO SHOW AND PODCAST DID AN EPISODE OF REPUBLICAN-FOCUS GROUP WHO DIDN'T WANT TO GET THE VACCINE.

AND THEY ARE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO REACH REPUBLICANS WHO SO THEY ROLL OUT ALL THESE PEOPLE TO TALK TO THE FOCUS GROUP.

A DOCTOR, AN EXPERT, ET CETERA.

FINALLY, CHRIS CHRISTIE COMES ON, AND -- AND THESE PEOPLE WERE NOT CONVINCED.

CHRIS CHRISTIE COMES ON, TALKS ABOUT HOW HE GOT COVID AT THE WHITE HOUSE.

HOW HE WAS EXTREMELY SICK.

HOW HIS COUSINS JUST DIED.

AND THESE PEOPLE, IN THE FOCUS GROUP, FLIPPED.

THEY ALL SAID THEY WANTED THE VACCINE, NOW.

IT WAS A REALLY, KIND OF, REMARKABLE EPISODE THAT PEOPLE CAN CHECK OUT.

AND I DON'T KNOW IF A PSA FROM CHRIS CHRISTIE WOULD DO ANY GOOD IN NEW JERSEY, WHERE HE LEFT WITH HISTORICALLY-TERRIBLE APPROVAL RATINGS.

BUT HIS -- HIS COMMUNICATION SKILLS MIGHT HAVE -- BE SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO CONVINCE SKEPTICAL REPUBLICANS TO GET THIS JOB.

THEY MIGHT WANT TO LOOK TO HIM FOR SOME ADVICE, ON THIS FRONT.

>> WELL, THANK YOU FOR BRINGING UP CHRIS CHRISTIE.

I WANTED TO ASK YOU WHAT YOU THOUGHT OF, LAST WEEK, THERE WAS THIS HULLABALOO OF SOME OF CHRIS CHRISTIE'S FRIENDS SUGGESTING HE MAY RUN FOR PRESIDENT.

SHOCKER.

>> I LITERALLY FOUND A HEADLINE, THAT WAS ALMOST WORD-FOR-WORD IDENTICAL, FROM 2011, WHEN HE WAS, LIKE, RIGHT AFTER HE WAS FIRST ELECTED GOVERNOR.

TALKING ABOUT, HOW HIS FRIENDS WERE SAYING THAT HE IS CONSIDERING RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT.

FIRST OF ALL, OF COURSE CHRIS CHRISTIE'S GOING TO TRY TO RUN FOR PRESIDENT.

I MEAN, UNLESS THERE IS JUST ABSOLUTELY SOMETHING HAPPENS THERE, THAT HE -- THAT HE HAS NO SHOT, HE WANTS TO RUN FOR PRESIDENT.

HE'S MADE THAT ABUNDANTLY CLEAR.

IT'S, ALSO, CLEAR THAT HIS TRACK RECORD IS QUITE POOR.

AND IN THE CURRENT-REPUBLICAN PARTY, IT'S HARD TO IMAGINE THAT HE HAS A PATH FORWARD.

HOWEVER, HE HAS, AS I MENTIONED, EXCEPTIONAL-COMMUNICATION SKILLS.

SECONDLY, STRANGER THINGS HAVE HAPPENED, AS WE HAVE SEEN.

AND THIRDLY, THE NATIONAL MEDIA, JUDGING BY THAT HEADLINE THAT BLASTED ALL OVER THE PLACE, THAT CHRIS CHRISTIE, MAYBE, IS CONSIDERING TO RUN FOR PRESIDENT.

CONTINUES TO BE FASCINATED BY HIM SO HE WILL CONTINUE TO GET THAT KIND OF FREE PRESS, AND HE WILL RIDE IT ALL THE WAY, YOU KNOW, TO 2024.

BUT IT IS -- IT IS HARD TO IMAGINE THAT THINGS MIGHT -- WOULD SHAKE OUT MUCH BETTER THAN IT DID FOR HIM IN 2020.

EXCUSE ME, 2016.

>> ALL RIGHT.

MATT KATZ, CARLY CITRON, BRENT JOHNSON.

GOOD TO SEE YOU GUYS.

THANKS FOR COMING ON.

>> THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU, DAVID.

>> THANKS.

>> ALL RIGHT.

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