The landscape of Pennsylvania is changing.

The Latino community has reached one million, according to the last census in the state of Pennsylvania.

Places like Redding, Lancaster and Allentown, the two twenty two corridor reveals the growing numbers in the Latino community.

Today, we will discuss the growth, the challenges and the exciting things that are happening here in the state of Pennsylvania.

Joining us today on courageous conversations is Norman Bristol Cullen.

He's the special assistant for Community Affairs and development at Pennsylvania Department of Community and Economic Development.

He is the past executive director of the Governor's Advisory Commission on Latino Affairs, and he is the founder and chairman of the PA Latino Convention.

Hello, my name is Pastor Phil Davis, the host of Courageous Conversations.

Welcome to the show.

Don't go anywhere.

We'll be right back.

Norman, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedule to come and spend some time with me today.

We're really honored to have you here.

So, so, so often I want to jump right in.

So often people look at the Latino community as a monolith and and they think, you know, there's just one group of people.

Can you talk a little bit about the diversity within the Latino community and help our viewers understand how diverse your community is?

Well, you know, when we have 62 million Latinos in the United States, over one million Latinos in Pennsylvania coming from 21 different countries, including the island Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, you know, the community is going to be very, very diverse.

And when you go to places like Allentown and Bethlehem and Redding Lancaster, you see that diversity in the past.

It was a predominantly Puerto Rican community, right because of the U.S. citizenship.

It was easier to for Puerto Ricans to travel to the to Pennsylvania right after 19 17 and do the jobs that many Pennsylvanians didn't want to do.

Sure.

But now it's more and more diverse than ever before the community.

And you see it in in in the restaurant industry, you know, you no longer have a Puerto Rican restaurant, you have multiple Restaurants in every community.

It feels like which is, which is amazing.

How do you, as a community leader, bring unity to a community that is so diverse?

And do you have challenges really kind of organizing and bringing folks to a common space to really see a more sustainable future?

Well, there are always challenges, especially when you have so many diverse voices.

So, so many different experiences.

A lot of Latinos can come from peaceful nation.

A lot of them come from nations that have been into war for so many years.

So they bring different experiences to the table.

The common denominator for me has always been it is only one Latino agenda.

That's good, you know, an agenda that we can all embrace when it comes to education.

You know, we want all our kids to graduate from high school, right?

And we want all of them to to have the opportunity to go to college if they decide to go there.

You know, when it comes to economic development, we want everyone to own a house and to have a decent paying job.

So once you find that common denominator in the agenda, it is easier to bring people together.

Sure, all people want pretty much the same things, right?

The American dream, if you will.

And it's amazing when you think about the challenges and the diverse issues that are presented to our communities, we realize that there are disparities, right?

Economic disparities, educational disparities within the Latino community.

Can you talk a little bit about some of those disparities that that exist in?

How do you, as a state government leader, really help to address some of those issues?

You know, we are growing.

And in Pennsylvania, for the past 20 years, you know, two decades paint Latinos have accounted to more than 50 percent of Pennsylvania's population growth between 2000 and 2020.

I didn't know that.

But you know, when you look at the growth in other areas, it is not there.

The community has been lagging behind in so many aspects.

You know, when you look at providing health care to the Latino communities, the highest uninsured community in Pennsylvania.

When you go and you look at higher education and you still go to any of the 14 state universities or any of the private universities in our Commonwealth, and you don't see the Latino presence or you don't see the Latino professor.

You know, as of today, we only have one Latina superintendent in the entire Commonwealth out of 500 superintendents.

We don't even have a Latino president of a university.

So even when the growth has been there, we are lagging behind in so many important aspects because remember that when you see a Latino superintendent, that kid is going to identify with that individual.

So eventually we are seeing the process going and growing to see future Latino superintendents.

But that is not that is not happening.

In addition to that, if you go to especially places where poverty is so high, the the pockets of poverty in our Commonwealth, you see that are mainly African-American and Latino barrios.

And we need to change that dynamic.

We have to end and eradicate Latino poverty in Pennsylvania because at the end of the day, it is my my strong belief.

Will Latinos succeed in Pennsylvania?

We also see in Pennsylvania, especially if it is the population that is growing.

You know, when it comes to unemployment, high unemployment rates, and it's not because they don't want to have a job, it's because when they have a job, they cannot sustain it because of mistreatment and racism and discrimination.

So those are the issues that are impacting our community today.

Yeah.

And it seems that the African-American community in the Latino community.

Have very similar journeys right here here in America, one of the things that you were very involved in was making sure that there was an accurate census count.

Why was that important and what will that bring to to the Latino community and communities across the state of Pennsylvania?

You know, it was important to make sure that we had a complete and accurate count, first and foremost of every single Pennsylvanian independently of the race.

But it is our republic as an as a republic, the nation, supposedly it should be representative of the people.

So depending on the count of the census, that will let me and others decide how the the Pennsylvania is going to be represented when it comes to the federal government to district and senatorial districts in Pennsylvania.

So having a complete count of African-American, for example, in the city of Philadelphia and in the city of Pittsburgh, where we have, you know, strong pockets?

It was extremely important because that is changing the leadership of that area because one district, if we are going to be defining district from the one and especially in redistricting, we are looking at the numbers and that will possibly create a newly senatorial African-American district in Pennsylvania because it's all about political representation in the Lehigh Valley.

You know, we don't have any in the 222 corridor.

We only have one Latino state representative in Redding out of five hundred thousand Latinos that live in the 222 corridor.

So now with the census, we can decide and say redistricting is important.

Representation matters.

How are we going to be deciding on those districts based on the numbers of the population?

Right, right.

And you yourself ran for office in Lancaster?

Talk a little bit about that.

And how did you inspiration?

How did you inspire the next generation to to maybe engage themselves in the political process?

You know, I have been involved in Pennsylvania politics since my years at Penn State, and it was important for me to throw the hat.

Ok, you know, I keep asking people, run for office, do this for the community, and then people were asking me, So when is your time?

So I I did it, and it was an amazing journey, I learned.

I became a better human being, a better professional.

But also I inspire others because when I was running for office, it was only, you know, few Latinos, about three or four of us.

Now you see elections are twenty five Latinos.

Thirty five Latinos are running for office in Allentown.

The two political candidates running for mayor on both sides of the aisle, that's right, are identified themselves as Latinos.

So, so for me, it was the sacrificial lamb to make sure that we would build better tomorrows when it comes to political activism in the Latino community.

And now, with done no, you know, we have one million forty nine thousand six hundred and fifteen Latinos in Pennsylvania.

That should be a sense of political power and influence.

Sure, sure.

You heard me mention in the in the opening that the 220 to quarter corridor really speaks to the growth and development of Latino families and communities.

What what relevance does that play in the overall picture of the state of Pennsylvania?

Well, when you look at the two two corridor for us, we have been working in trying to brand the Latino 222 corridor, OK, since, you know, since twenty years ago.

Ok, so you go to Eastern Bethlehem, Allentown, Redding, Lancaster, Lebanon, York, Harrisburg and in almost every single one of those cities, the Latino community is already the majority of the minority.

And it is important for us when we look at Philadelphia, you know, we have two hundred and fifty thousand Latinos in Philadelphia.

But in that two twenty two corridor, we have 500000 Latinos.

The the influence is there.

The numbers are there.

So it is important for us and for the entire Commonwealth to know that if this is the the community that is growing, investing in the 222 corridor in all aspect, public housing, economic development, workforce development, it is important if we are in the business of ensuring that better days are ahead for all Pennsylvanians.

We need to make sure that where we are growing, we are investing there.

That's amazing.

When you think about that, the growing population requires attention.

It requires support.

But there are some movements in the state of Pennsylvania to kind of redistrict now right to to change the landscape and to almost fix the fight, if you will.

How does how does that affect the community overall?

Well, it will have a direct impact on us because at the end of the day, we live in the not the perfect democracy because we are not a perfect nation.

I understand that, and sometimes I want to say that we are the perfect nation, but we are not.

But we are the strongest democracy even when we have been facing so many challenges in the past few years.

Yes.

The United States, to me, it is it is still the beacon of hope and opportunity, but many times in our Latino barrios, we are facing the enormous challenge to find some representation and especially when it comes now to redistricting if we allow.

This process to play out the way some individuals want.

We will never achieve Latino political representation in Pennsylvania.

We will not have the potential of having a Latino state representative from Allentown or Bethlehem, a Latino state representative from Lancaster.

And the numbers are there, right?

You know, we have the numbers.

There are congressional, you know, we have from from eighteen.

Now we are going to have 17 members of Congress.

Only one of them is an African-American from Philadelphia.

And for us, the way it is playing out right now, we will not have a political a Latino member of Congress in Pennsylvania, at least in the next 20 years.

So that's why it is important that we that we are part of the discussions of the table because at the end of the day, if we are not sitting at the table, our values, our agenda, our issues are not going to be discussed.

So it's so important when you think about that whole idea of taxation without representation becomes real, and it has been a problem within our community for many years.

We just did a show on voter suppression a couple of weeks ago and we realized that there is an agenda to suppress that vote and not to allow that vote to happen.

But organizations like yourself, leaders like yourself can really help to bring change.

Which brings me to the issue of immigration.

How does the issue of immigration impact from the federal level to the state level, the demographics and the level of just acceptance within the United States for the Latino community?

You know, in Pennsylvania, I have to be very blunt and say, when it comes to immigration, we are not a border state.

Right?

So don't use the immigration issue to really penalize a community that is growing here.

The great majority of Latinos in Pennsylvania, the great majority of us are U.S. citizens.

You know, in the case of Puerto Ricans, we are U.S. citizens, even if we are born in Puerto Rico.

And more than a hundred years of that relationship between Puerto Rico and the United States, I still have to let people in Pennsylvania know we are fellow Americans as well.

So the immigration dilemma in the United States, it has been good for Pennsylvania.

When you go to, you know, where a farming state and when you look at the numbers of migrant and seasonal farm workers in Pennsylvania and more than 80 percent of them are Latinos, then they are impacting economically in the multimillion dollar industries in Pennsylvania and doing the jobs that nobody wants to do, you know, and they bring work ethics and they are committed to to make sure that as a Commonwealth, we're moving ahead when it comes to education.

You know, our immigrant students are the ones that are performing many of the native students.

So at the end of the day, if we are once again in the business of ensuring that we have a strong Commonwealth, I want those scientists and I want those engineers and I want all those doctors and a lot of them have been immigrants in Pennsylvania.

Yes.

Can you talk a little bit about the demographics, right?

So is it a younger growing population or is it an aging population?

Because we saw in the last census that certain communities are in decline, but the Latino community is is growing.

So I'm assuming that it's a younger population that that is growing in our communities.

Yeah.

Well, you know, we have just to give you a general overview and then I'll go to your to your question.

We have one point five million African-Americans in Pennsylvania.

We have about 500000 Asian and Pacific Islanders in Pennsylvania.

And then we have over one million Latinos out of 30 million Pennsylvanians, three million are people of color.

Wow.

And that's why it is important for every single community, not only in the Lehigh Valley.

But it's important for the 67 counties of Pennsylvania to really look into this demographic and ensure that they have an agenda that is inclusive.

That is diverse because when you include people, they outperform anybody else.

Yes, and it is important for any industry to include that diversity in there when it comes to the Latino community.

It is the youngest community in the Commonwealth.

The median age for Pennsylvanians is about forty one in the Latino community is twenty five.

Twenty six.

Ok. Now, when you go to a place like Redding, about eighty four percent of the student population are Latinos in Redding.

Big number of youngsters.

Yes, that median age for the city of Redding.

If you take into consideration that eighty four percent of the student population becomes even younger at the age of 19.

The median age.

So it is a very young community.

Vibrant community in Pennsylvania and and that is the case also at the national level, the youngest community in the United States is also the Latino community.

What does the graduation rates look like?

Because we know there's a disparity in education as well.

So so how are our kids faring in regards to education?

It's the graduation rate where it should be?

Or is there room for improvement?

Oh, there's definitely room for improvement.

Latinos are lagging behind Asian and African Americans when it comes to graduation rates, and not only in places where we see a large number of Latino students, but it's happening all across the state.

So we need to do a better job when it comes to graduating Latino students in Pennsylvania schools.

So at the national level, we have seen big increases.

It is good to to report to you that when it comes to college enrollment rates and graduation rates, that growth in Pennsylvania and in the nation's Latino community is also showing in the increase on college enrollment and college graduation.

So there are there are some movement, but just like in the African-American community, we talk about the prison, the school to prison pipeline, right, and the graduation rates definitely needing some, some some work, right?

And I think it's on the schools as well as on the families to make sure that the children are getting the type of education that is going to allow them to be successful right here in America.

You have an organization that that you started called the Latino Convention.

Can you talk a little bit about that and what are the goals and and tell us a little bit about the convention?

Well, the convention we we founded in 2018, it was the right time and the hashtag for the convention was one million strong because we knew that by Census 2020, Latinos will reach the one million mark in Pennsylvania.

And the convention is an independent entity, bipartisan because we we want to continue a Latino agenda independently of who occupies the governor's office independently of who is the U.S. senator from Pennsylvania.

So it's not connected to any political party is more inclined to really draft a comprehensive and inclusive Latino agenda in the economy, in education, in health, cultural.

Yeah.

And of course, in the most important issues that are impacting the community, the convention.

You know, we draft a white paper every year that we then share that with all members of the Pennsylvania Legislature in hopes that they will see what we are seeing, that they no longer ignore it, that they act on it, and that they do some public policy that will have a direct impact in the community.

The Latino community of Pennsylvania, which is the community that is growing the most.

Right, right.

And so so it's data driven.

It's research driven in that white paper can ultimately affect policy.

Absolutely.

And I think that's so important because often it's a very emotional conversation about the disparities in the area of, you know, income, education, housing, you know, in the areas of even incarceration.

But when you look at the numbers, the data, the research of the impact of the poverty that's happening within our communities, it should give our policymakers some level of empathy and a willingness to bring that necessary policy change that's going to help uplift our people.

So, so the convention.

How many folks are involved in the convention?

Are they from all over the Commonwealth and and you just had a wonderful gathering.

Can you talk a little bit about that and what the impact of that was?

Well, we have individuals coming to the convention from all over the nation.

Oh, nation, we have individuals representing the president of the United States that have been at the convention and in Lancaster, we have over one thousand five hundred individuals in Bethlehem the second year.

We have about 1000 in Redding, even in in in the crisis that we are facing today.

We have over 350 individuals attending, but it is a gathering of of of the minds to ensure that when we come together, yes, we are going to be honest because we have to be authentic in not having conversations about the reality of the Latino community.

So we are going to be honest, we are going to have those authentic conversations where we are doing good, where we are doing bad and who's responsible for it.

Because at the end of the day, I don't want to say that the system is responsible, even though many times they are.

But we we must also assume the responsibility as Latino leaders in Pennsylvania.

So, so the convention becomes this epicenter of Latino minds in a way that we are not going to ignore what have been happening and we are going to call it out.

You know, we're going to be honest with everyone, even with ourselves, but also by letting you know that we are calling you out.

We are also giving you not only the problem, but the solution.

This is what we think.

You should be acting on, especially when it comes to the Latino community and something that is so important is what you said a few few seconds ago.

Taxation without representation, that is so profound because it is exactly what is happening in communities of color in Pennsylvania and all across the nation, not only in Washington, D.C. or not only in Puerto Rico.

You know that that movement is happening.

You know, the taxation without representation.

It is happening in our own communities.

Our peoples are the ones that have been sustaining urban America.

Absolutely.

But then when urban America, that urban center is growing and is standing up, they want to kick us out.

So it's taxation without representation.

When you go to places where you know, like like in Allentown, fifty four percent of of the population is Latino, but you only have few representative IT taxation without representation because you have people that are working paying taxes, but they are not represented in the decision making process of those cities in Pennsylvania.

Yeah.

And when you're not at the table right, you're not considered.

You said something about the convention that it is not politically driven.

So is it?

It's agenda driven, right?

It's about results.

And I guess when you connect yourself to a political party, then you come, you become beholden to them.

Why keep it by why?

Why keep it bipartisan or partisan?

Why not connected to to a political party?

Well, I believe that both sides of the aisle bring good things, and that's why they have been in assistance.

I might have my own belief, but in the comprehensive bill, in the collective view of any political party, the two of them, they have good things.

And I think that it is important that we entertain and that we embrace those good things, but that we also reject the bad things that both parties are doing.

And by bringing them to the table, it is better for us to build bridges rather than walls.

That's good.

Growing up in in in Puerto Rico, my father used to take us to the Puerto Rico capital and I will go and see it on the gallery, in the Capitol building looking down and I will see the exchange and the debates and you know, the the the nastiness of the conversation.

But then we will go out for lunch and those individuals that were down there discussing they were having lunch and calling themselves my friends, my companion.

And to me, I learned the art of statesmanship early on in my life.

So having the convention that is representative of both sides of the aisle.

It is such a rewarding experience for me because I can say I may disagree with you, but I am a statement, right?

You know, and that is something that we are losing so much in our nation today, and the Latino Convention cannot be, cannot be a part of the division.

You know, we are going to be completely the opposite.

It's about unity.

And that's why we bring Democrats and Republicans together to discuss one agenda the Latino agenda and how they are going to do it.

Mm hmm.

Mm hmm.

How do we how do we, as minority groups work together?

You talked about the percentages of African-Americans and Latinos.

How how do we build bridges within our communities so that there can be a united voice around very similar issues in both communities?

You know, and I I am a man of numbers because numbers don't lie.

I've noticed that.

Yeah, yeah.

Numbers don't lie.

And and even those some people can manipulate those numbers.

When you do the right research, you know the right numbers.

And when you look at the African American community with a purchasing power in our nation of about one point three trillion dollars, when you have a Latino community with the purchasing power of one point seven trillion, you unite the community at the national level and it's one of the top 10 world's economy.

Even even when I can tell you that they also represent the largest segment of poverty in our nation, so true.

But then when you collectively see those numbers together, we are powerful.

Yes.

You know it is.

It is an economy that is larger than any country in the Americas, with the exception of the United States.

So finding common ground is looking at those numbers and say our purchasing power that is over two point three trillion dollars.

That is powerful, that's powerful.

Over a hundred million individuals, you know, a hundred and ten individuals in the United States in a nation of three hundred and forty thousand.

That is powerful, which means that no one, no one can make it to the White House without us.

That's true.

If we find those common denominators, there is so much that we can do and accomplish together.

You know, based on those numbers in Pennsylvania, when you look at the two twenty corridor, for example, the African-American community is the second minority group in in.

The 222 corridor, but when it comes to Pennsylvania, it's the largest minority ethnic group, so I cannot draft a Latino agenda without consulting and without working with my African-American brothers and sisters because at the end of the day, I will not accomplish anything.

So I think that we can find a lot of common ground when it comes not only to the issues of of racial discrimination, but also on housing.

Yeah.

You know, when it comes to employment and underemployment because our community are underemployed, it's not that they are unemployed.

They are underemployed.

They have to to do five six jobs just to make amends.

So our community really need to to to have that workforce development in a way that collectively we can attack poverty together and based on those numbers.

That's amazing.

You know, Norman, I could I could listen to you for an hour.

Honestly.

Our time is running out and I hope you'll come back and visit with us again because we really want to dig deep into some of those numbers of disparity.

Because courageous conversations is about uplifting those issues and then having solutions on on how we can work together and how we can make a more perfect union.

So thank you for joining me today on behalf of everyone here at PBS.

Thirty nine, I'm Pastor Phillip Davis and I'd like to thank Mr Cullen for coming and you the viewing audience, for joining us today.

May God bless you and may you keep being courageous.

All right, we'll see you next week.