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RWJBARNABAS HEALTH.

LET'S BE HEALTHY TOGETHER.

AND BY NJM INSURANCE GROUP, SERVING THE INSURANCE NEEDS OF NEW JERSEY RESIDENTS AND BUSINESSES FOR MORE THAN 100 YEARS.

PROMOTIONAL SUPPORT IS PROVIDED BY NEW JERSEY BUSINESS MAGAZINE, THE MAGAZINE OF THE NEW JERSEY BUSINESS AND INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION, REPORTING TO EXECUTIVE AND LEGISLATIVE LEADERS IN ALL 21 COUNTIES OF THE GARDEN STATE SINCE 1954 >>> HI, EVERYBODY, WHERE CAN WELCOME TO "REPORTERS ROUNDTABLE."

I'M DAVID CRUZ, VERY HAPPY TO BE BACK WITH YOU THIS WEEK.

OUR THANKS TO COLLEEN O'DAY.

YOU MIGHT HAVE THOUGHT NEW JERSEY CLEARED ALL THE OBSTACLES NECESSARY TO GET CANNABIS OFF THE GROUND BUT A LOOK AT THE REGULATORY COMMISSION, THAT'S THE PANEL THAT'S GOING TO ESTABLISH THE GUIDELINES AND CREATE THE OPPORTUNITIES FOR SOCIAL JUSTICE AND EQUITY IN THIS INDUSTRY, YOU LOOK AT IT AND YOU FIND THAT THE CRC HAS ZERO REPRESENTATION FROM BLACK MEN, THE GROUP MOST ADVERSELY AFFECTED BY THE SO-CALLED WAR ON DRUGS.

WE START THE PROGRAM TODAY WITH A DISCUSSION ABOUT THE IMPLICATIONS OF THAT WITH THE PRESIDENT OF PRESIDENT OF NAACP NEW JERSEY CONFERENCE, RICHARD T. SMITH.

MR. PRESIDENT, GOOD TO SEE YOU.

THANKS FOR COMING ON WITH US.

>> GOOD TO SEE YOU, DAVID.

>> SO, THERE ARE REALLY A COUPLE OF POINTS BEING MADE HERE.

ONE IS ABOUT THE LETTER OF THE LAW, RIGHT, THE BILL SAYS, AND I'M GOING TO READ FROM THE BILL, IT SAYS, AT LEAST ONE MEMBER SHALL BE A STATE REPRESENTATIVE OF A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION OR STATE BRANCH OF THE NATIONAL ORGANIZATION WITH THE STATE ADMISSION OF STUDYING, ADVOCATING, OR ADJUDICATING AGAINST MINORITY HISTORICAL OPPRESSION, PAST AND PRESENT DISCRIMINATION, UNEMPLOYMENT, POVERTY, AND INCOME INEQUALITY AND OTHER FORMS OF SOCIAL INJUSTICE OR INEQUALITY.

THAT SEEMS ALMOST SPECIFICALLY TO DESCRIBE THE NAACP, FOR INSTANCE.

TELL US ABOUT THE LETTER YOU SENT TO THE GOVERNOR.

>> I AGREE.

AND YOU KNOW, IT'S A PART OF THE LAW, AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANT TO SEE THIS AS AN INTENTION SLIGHT, DAVID, I REALLY DON'T WANT TO SEE IT THAT WAY.

BUT I THINK SOMETIMES DECISIONS ARE MADE VERY, VERY SWIFTLY WITHOUT GIVING THOSE DECISIONS THE DUE DILIGENCE THAT A DECISION DESERVES.

WHAT'S DISTURBING HERE, THOUGH, DAVID, IS THE FACT THAT STRAIGHT OUT THE GATE, THE VERY FIRST OPPORTUNITY THOSE IN POWER HAD AN PUNT TO IMPLEMENT THE LAW, THEY IGNORE THE SOCIAL JUSTICE ASPECTS THAT WE HAVE BEEN FIGHTING FOR FROM THE VERY, VERY BEGINNING.

YOU KNOW, I SAID IT SEVEN YEARS AGO AND I SAY IT AGAIN TODAY.

BLACK NEW JERSEYANS WILL NOT BE THE POSTER CHILD PROVIDING THE NARRATIVE AS TO WHY MARIJUANA SHOULD BE LEGALIZED AND THEN WHEN IT IS, AND THE MONEY AND THE BENEFITS BEGIN TO FLOW, WE ARE THE FORGOTTEN ENTITY IN THE POWERS THAT BE GET CONVENIENT AMNESIA.

AND THIS WILL TURN INTO ULTIMATELY WHAT MANY HAVE PREDICTED TO BE A MONEY GRAB.

THE NAACP SAID IT THEN.

WE SAY IT NOW.

IT'S NOT THAT KIND OF PARTY.

YOU KNOW, THIS IS -- THIS IS SWEEPING LEGISLATION.

YOU KNOW, IT COVERS DECRIMINALIZATION, EXPUNGEMENT, A TAX STRUCTURE THAT SENDS MONEY BACK TO COMMUNITIES MOST HARMED.

IT'S HISTORIC.

IT'S THE LAW.

AND THE LAW NEEDS TO BE FOLLOWED.

THEY GOT TO FIX IT.

WE DON'T NEED MORE APOLOGIES.

WHAT WE NEED IS SAFER NEIGHBORHOODS, BETTER SCHOOLS, LESS PUNITIVE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM.

WE NEED BETTER HEALTHCARE, JOBS, AND MARIJUANA MONEY CAN TAKE US A LONG WAY DOWN THAT ROAD IF THE MONEY GOES TO WHERE IT'S SUPPOSED TO GO AND THAT REGULATORY COMMISSION IS SITTING THERE TO ENSURE THAT THE MONEY GOES WHERE IT'S SUPPOSED TO GO AND WE NEED TO HAVE A SEAT AT THAT TABLE AND OUR VOICES NEED TO BE HEARD.

>> AND THE LETTER THAT YOU SENT TO THE GOVERNOR ASKS HIM SPECIFICALLY TO EXPLAIN WHO ON THAT COMMISSION CURRENTLY FITS THE CRITERIA WE JUST TALKED ABOUT FROM THE LAW, RIGHT?

>> THAT'S CORRECT, DAVID.

YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO KNOW WHO ON THE COMMISSION AT THIS POINT, YOU KNOW, FITS THAT JOB DESCRIPTION.

NO OFFENSE TO ANYONE WHO'S ON THERE BUT WE JUST DON'T FEEL THAT THE LAW'S BEING FOLLOWED IN THIS PARTICULAR INSTANCE.

>> I'M THINKING THAT THEY'RE GOING TO SAY THAT DIANA, WHO IS BELOVED AND RESPECTED BY MANY PEOPLE, SHE'S THE CHAIRPERSON OF THE CRC.

THEY'RE GOING TO SAY, I THINK, THAT SHE'S A FORMER ACLU OF NEW JERSEY POLICY DIRECTOR.

DOES THAT NOT QUALIFY AS REPRESENTING A STATE BRANCH OF A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION, ET CETERA?

>> DIANA'S BELOVED BY MANY.

BY US AS WELL.

YOU KNOW, WE LOVE DIANA TO LIFE.

BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, DIANA DOESN'T CHECK THAT BOX.

DIANA'S BEEN A MEMBER OF THE MURPHY ADMINISTRATION FOR SOME TWO YEARS OR MORE.

FORMERLY, SHE WORKED FOR THE ACLU, BUT THAT IN NO WAY CHECKS THE BOX WHEN IT COMES TO WHAT THE LEGISLATION SAYS.

>> I'VE HEARD FROM A NUMBER OF PEOPLE CLOSE TO THE ADMINISTRATION.

THEY SAY THEY FEEL THE REPRESENTATION ON THE BOARD IS PRETTY DIVERSE, THREE FEMALES, ONE OF THEM BLACK, ONE OF THEM LATINA, A LATINO MAN AND A REPRESENTATIVE OF ORGANIZED LABOR.

ARE THEY WRONG?

>> NO, I MEAN, THERE'S DIVERSITY THERE.

BUT IT DOESN'T FIT WHAT THE LAW SAYS WE WERE SUPPOSED TO HAVE.

NONE OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS REPRESENT A STATE OR NATIONAL ORGANIZATION THAT'S BUSINESS IS TO FIGHT FOR CIVIL RIGHTS AND SOCIAL JUSTICE.

>> AND WE SHOULD BE CLEAR, TOO, RIGHT, THAT PART OF YOUR CONTENTION IS THAT THERE SHOULD BE SPECIFICALLY BLACK MEN ON THIS BOARD, YEAH?

>> WELL, DAVID, YOU KNOW, LIKE I SAID, WHEN THE NARRATIVE WAS OUT THERE OVER THE PAST SEVEN YEARS TALKING ABOUT HOW BLACK PEOPLE WERE THREE TO FOUR TIMES MORE LIKELY TO BE ARRESTED FOR MINOR MARIJUANA OFFENSES, LISTEN, LET'S BE CLEAR.

THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT BLACK MEN.

NOW, IT'S OKAY FOR US TO HAVE OUR LIVES RUINED, TO BE VICTIMS OF THIS FAILED WAR ON DRUGS, BUT NOW WHEN WE GET AN OPPORTUNITY TO SIT ON A COMMISSION TO RIGHT THE WRONGS THAT HAVE BEEN DONE TO OUR COMMUNITY, WE CAN'T GET NO BLACK MEN?

MAN, THIS IS CRAZY.

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY CRAZY.

AND THIS IS NOT A HARD FIX.

IT'S NOT A HARD FIX AT ALL.

I REALIZE HOW WE HAVE ALREADY ENCOUNTERED A STUMBLING BLOCK STRAIGHT OUT THE GATE.

LET'S GET THIS THING FIXED AND KEEP THE BALL MOVING BECAUSE WE GOT A WHOLE LOT OF OTHER STUFF THAT WE NEED TO TAKE TIME TO BE FIGHTING FOR IN NEW JERSEY BESIDES A HICCUP THAT IS CLEARLY COVERED IN THE LEGISLATION THAT WAS PASSED AND SIGNED.

>> I GOT JUST A FEW, MAYBE A MINUTE LEFT.

YOUR ATTORNEY, THAT IS, THE ATTORNEY FOR THE NAACP, SAYS THAT YOU WILL GO TO COURT TO CHALLENGE THIS IF NECESSARY, YES?

>> YES.

WITHOUT A DOUBT.

I MEAN, AGAIN, IT'S THE LAW.

THE LAW MUST BE FOLLOWED.

IT'S CRYSTAL CLEAR.

WE DON'T FEEL AS THOUGH ANYBODY CHECKS THAT BOX AND YOU KNOW, IF WE HAVE TO GO AND ASK THE JUDGE WHAT THEIR OPINION IS, WE'RE MORE THAN WILLING TO DO THAT.

WE DON'T WANT TO DO THAT.

WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO DO THAT.

THIS IS AN EASY FIX.

WE HAVE WORKED WITH THIS GOVERNOR ON MANY PIECES OF LEGISLATION, ON MANY INITIATIVES, AND LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK THAT THIS IS AN INTENTIONAL SLIGHT ON HIS PART.

HE HAS INDICATED OVER THE LAST COUPLE DAYS THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT WE WOULD BE COMMUNICATING.

I'M STILL WAITING TO HEAR FROM HIM.

BUT I'M HOPING THAT WE CAN RESOLVE THIS AND MOVE THE BALL FORWARD BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE HAVE TO ENSURE THAT WE STAY TRUE TO OUR WORD AND THIS FIGHT FOR US HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT SOCIAL JUSTICE AND EQUAL OPPORTUNITY AND RIGHTING THE WRONGS OF THOSE HARMS THAT HAVE BEEN DONE TO OUR COMMUNITIES FOR YEARS.

>> ALL RIGHT, RICHARD T. SMITH IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE NAACP NEW JERSEY STATE CONFERENCE.

GOOD TO SEE YOU, SIR.

THANKS FOR COMING ON WITH US TODAY.

>> YOU TOO, DAVID.

I APPRECIATE YOU.

THANK YOU.

>>> LET'S TURN TO OUR PANEL NOW, LILO STATEN IS THE HEALTHCARE WRITER FOR NJ SPOTLIGHT NEWS.

CHARLES STYLE IS POLITICAL COLUMNIST FOR THE RECORD "USA TODAY" NETWORK AND BRENT JOHNSON IS POLITICAL REPORTER FOR NJ ADVANCED MEDIA.

WELCOME TO YOU ALL.

CHARLES, GOING INTO AN ELECTION YEAR, THE ADMINISTRATION STILL STRUGGLING TO GET THIS MAJOR POLICY INITIATIVE BACKED BY TWO-THIRDS OF THE VOTERS NO LESS, STILL STRUGGLING TO GET IT OFF THE GROUND.

THE NAACP SAYS IT'S GOING TO GO TO COURT TO FORCE THE ISSUE IF NECESSARY.

CAN SOMETHING LIKE THIS REALLY DELAY THE IMPLEMENTATION OF A CANNABIS INDUSTRY?

>> IT COULD.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW, GOING DOWN AN UNCHARTED LEGAL PATH ON SOME OF THESE ISSUES COULD BE A PROBLEM.

I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF QUESTIONS AND DISCONTENT, FRANKLY, OVER HOW POLICE ARE TO APPROACH MINORS.

I THINK YOU'LL SEE A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT.

BUT I THINK THE OVERARCHING THING FROM AN ELECTION YEAR PERSPECTIVE IS THEY GOT IT DONE, AND THAT THEY NOW -- IT'S NO LONGER JUST THE LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL.

THEY CAN SEE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GETTING THROUGH THE TUNNEL AND WE'RE IN JERSEY, AND HE'S ABLE TO SAY, I PROMISED THIS INITIALLY IN 2017, AND I GOT IT DONE.

BUT I JUST THINK YOU'RE RIGHT.

I THINK YOUR QUESTION IS RIGHT.

THOSE THINGS COULD PRESENT SOME CHALLENGES FOR IMPLEMENTATION, NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.

>> IT'S LIKE THERE'S THIS ODD DISCONNECT.

TO ME, THAT'S A LIMBO THAT AT SOME POINT IS GOING TO BE AN ISSUE BUT I HAVEN'T FOLLOWED SORT OF THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS CLOSELY ON THIS BUT IT SEEMS TO ME FROM SORT OF A POPULATION, YOU KNOW, IN THE PUBLIC VIEW, THAT'S A DISCONNECT, RIGHT?

>> YEAH.

I MEAN, LIMBO IS A GOOD WORD TO USE BECAUSE IT BOTH DESCRIBES THE STATE OF THINGS AND THE DANCE THAT WE'VE ALL HAD TO GO THROUGH TO GET HERE, SO THANKS FOR GIVING ME THAT FREEBIE RIGHT THERE.

BRENT, IT WAS POINTED OUT TO ME THIS WEEK THAT THIS IS A GOVERNOR WHO GOT 94% OF THE BLACK VOTE A FEW YEARS AGO, BUT STILL HAD TO PLAY CATCH-UP ON REPRESENTATION IN THE CABINET AND NOW HAS SWUNG AND MISSED ON A HANGING CURVEBALL THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN HIT OUT OF THE PARK.

HOW'S THE GOVERNOR GOING TO FIX THE QUESTION OF REPRESENTATION ON THIS CANNABIS REGULATORY COMMISSION?

>> HE COULD START BY PUTTING SOMEONE ON THERE.

BUT YOU KNOW, IT'S AN INTERESTING ISSUE BECAUSE MURPHY IS AN AVOWED PROGRESSIVE WHO SAYS HE DOES THINGS TO LIFT UP COMMUNITIES OF COLOR AND THE PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE A VOICE IN THE STATE AND HE'S MADE A LOT OF STRIDES AS GOVERNOR IN IMPLEMENTING A MORE PROGRESSIVE AGENDA IN NEW JERSEY BUT THERE ARE STILL SOME BLIND SPOTS, AS ANY POLITICAL EXPERT WILL TELL YOU, AND THIS IS ONE OF THEM AND IT'S ANOTHER SPEED BUMP.

I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE OUTSIDE THE LITTLE TRENTON BUBBLE ARE STILL SHOCKED THAT MARIJUANA'S NOT LEGAL.

THEY THOUGHT, WE ELECTED MURPHY IN 2017 AND IT TOOK THIS LONG?

I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE REALLY SURPRISED.

SO, THIS WAS ANOTHER HICCUP.

IT ALL BECAME KIND OF AN AVALANCHE OVER THE LAST FEW MONTHS IF YOU FOLLOWED THE COVERAGE.

BUT YEAH, THERE'S DEFINITELY STILL SOME THINGS THAT FUMURPHY HAS TO WORK OUT, WHETHER IT WILL PLAY A BIG IMPETUS INTO ELECTION DAY, WHO KNOWS.

THERE'S STILL MANY MONTHS TO GO BEFORE VOTERS HEAD TO THE POLLS.

>> SO, HERE WE ARE IN THE FIRST DAYS OF MARCH.

MARKING THE FIRST YEAR OF THIS GLOBAL PANDEMIC.

LET'S GET OUR HEALTH REPORTER IN HERE.

BEFORE WE TALK ABOUT HOW THINGS ARE GOING TODAY, I WONDER IF YOU COULD JUST SHARE SOME THOUGHTS ON WHAT THIS PAST YEAR HAS MEANT TO SOMEONE LIKE YOU WHO'S BEEN HAVING TO COVER THIS PRETTY MUCH NONSTOP FOR A YEAR NOW.

I'M SURE IT'S BEEN MENTALLY EXHAUSTING.

WHAT'S IT BEEN LIKE?

>> IT'S INTERESTING.

I HAVEN'T DONE A SEARCH BUT I DOUBT THERE'S A STORY I'VE WRITTEN THIS YEAR THAT DIDN'T AT LEAST MENTION COVID, AND PROBABLY 99% OF THEM WERE REALLY ABOUT SOMETHING RELATED TO COVID.

IT'S BEEN FASCINATING IN SOME WAYS.

I DON'T THINK I'VE EVER WORKED AS HARD AS I HAVE THIS YEAR.

I USED TO JOKE, WHEN CAN I DO A PUZZLE?

WHEN CAN I LEARN HOW TO MAKE SOURDOUGH BREAD?

AND PEOPLE IN THE HEALTHCARE INDUSTRY ALWAYS LAUGH WHEN WE HAVE THESE CONVERSATIONS BECAUSE THEY'RE IN THE SAME KIND OF SITUATION, LIKE THEY'RE WORKING SO HARD.

I THINK THERE IS THIS UNPRECEDENTED -- I WAS WRITING ABOUT THE IMPACT ON COMMUNITIES OF COLOR AND IT WAS ONE OF THOSE DAYS WHEN GOVERNOR MURPHY WAS HONORING SOMEBODY AND IT WAS LIKE, YOU KNOW, IT WAS A PASTOR FROM A LOCAL COMMUNITY OR SOMETHING WHO WAS THE HEAD OF THE LOCAL NAACP CHAPTER, WHO WAS A HISTORY TEACHER IN HIGH SCHOOL, AND I JUST KEPT THINKING, THIS IS A DISEASE THAT IS DECIMATING COMMUNITIES AND NOT JUST IN THE INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE BUT IN WHAT THEY REPRESENT TO A COMMUNITY, TO YOUNG PEOPLE, TO YOUNG BLACK MEN, YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST AT A TIME WHEN WE NEED THIS LEADERSHIP SO MUCH, RIGHT, YOU KNOW, AND MAYBE MY HOPE IS IT'S NOT ABOUT ME BUT MY BIG HOPE IS THAT WE COME OUT OF THIS AND WE ACTUALLY -- WHEN WE TALK ABOUT ESSENTIAL WORKERS, WE GIVE THEM THE RESPECT AND HOPEFULLY SOME FORM OF PAY THAT THEY DESERVE, YOU KNOW, IF THEY'RE ACTUALLY ESSENTIAL, WE SHOULD TREAT THEM AS SUCH.

AND THAT WE, YOU KNOW, DO MORE FOR COMMUNITIES THAT FOR YEARS HAVE BEEN PROMISING, BLACK AND BROWN COMMUNITIES IN PARTICULAR, THAT HAVE BEEN PROMISING THAT HAVE NOT -- THOSE PROMISES HAVE NOT BEEN DELIVERED.

>> SO, EVERYONE SEEMS TO AGREE THAT THIS IS A NEW PHASE OF THE PANDEMIC.

WHAT ARE SOME OF THE POSITIVE SIGNS AND WHAT ARE SOME TROUBLE SPOTS THAT PERSIST OR MAY POP UP AGAIN?

>> IN TERMS OF THE VIRUS, YOU'RE SEEING THE RATE OF TRANSMISSION CREEPING UP AGAIN, CASES ARE STARTING TO RISE BECAUSE THERE'S UNCERTAINTY ABOUT THE NUMBER OF VARIANTS THAT ARE IN THE STATE BUT THERE'S STILL -- PEOPLE STILL ON UNEMPLOYMENT.

THAT STILL NEEDS TO BE WORKED OUT.

THAT SYSTEM'S STILL A MESS.

VACCINATIONS ARE STARTING TO RAMP UP IN THE STATE AND THEY SAY THE SUPPLY ISSUE WILL BE A LOT BETTER BY APRIL, SO WE'LL WAIT TO SEE IF THAT HAPPENS.

THIS CRISIS IS STILL ONGOING.

YOU STILL SEE THE GOVERNOR STILL HOLDING TWO TO THREE PRESS CONFERENCES A WEEK, NOT ONLY BECAUSE IT'S AN ELECTION YEAR BUT ALSO BECAUSE DOZENS OF PEOPLE ARE STILL DYING A DAY.

SO THIS IS SOMETHING THAT NEW JERSEY WILL CONTINUE TO GRAPPLE WITH.

I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG IT WILL -- HOW MUCH LONGER IT WILL BE A DAILY ISSUE, BUT IT'S -- WE'RE STILL IN THE MIDDLE OF IT RIGHT NOW.

>> LILO, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT YOU SEE THAT YOU CAN POINT TO THAT IS A POSITIVE?

>> YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THERE'S BEEN UNPRECEDENTED -- THERE'S SORT OF AN UNPRECEDENTED LEVELS OF PARTNERSHIPS THAT HAVE COME.

THIS IS WONKY BUT HOSPITAL SYSTEMS HAVE WORKED TOGETHER IN WAYS THEY NEVER HAVE BEFORE.

YOU KNOW, WE KNOW CLINICALLY, WE KNOW A LOT MORE ABOUT THE DISEASE THAN WE DID.

I THINK THE BIGGER PICTURE IS, I WOULD LIKE TO THINK WE HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF DISEASES IN GENERAL.

YOU KNOW, I WOULD LIKE TO THINK MORE PEOPLE WILL THINK ABOUT PUBLIC HEALTH AND SCIENCE.

THAT ALL SOUNDS REALLY BORING, I KNOW, BUT IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT, RIGHT?

I MEAN, WE RELIED SO MUCH ON PEOPLE LIKE, YOU KNOW, SYSTEMS LIKE CONTACT TRACERS AND I REMEMBER REALLY CLEARLY BEING ON A ZOOM CALL WITH WINE WITH SOME FRIENDS AND YOU KNOW, THEY WERE SAYING, SHE'S ON A SCHOOL BOARD AND SHE WAS SAYING TO ME, OUR CONTACT TRACER IS THE PRINCIPAL'S SECRETARY AND SHE'S A REALLY GREAT WOMAN AND SHE'S REALLY GREAT AT HER JOB, BUT THIS SHOULDN'T BE PART OF IT.

THIS IS NOT WHAT SHE WAS TRAINED TO DO.

THIS SHOULDN'T BE.

SO, WE NEED MORE RESOURCES.

AGAIN, IT'S A, YOU KNOW, IT'S A WAKE-UP CALL AND A PLEA FOR RESOURCES.

BUT -- AND I, YOU KNOW, I'D LIKE TO THINK A WAKE-UP CALL SORT OF FOR THE LARGER PUBLIC TOO.

HOW WE THINK ABOUT VACCINES, HOW WE THINK ABOUT PUBLIC HEALTH, HOW WE THINK ABOUT NOT JUST PROTECTING OURSELVES BUT EACH OTHER, RIGHT?

HOW WE'RE INTERDEPENDENT, HOW, YOU KNOW, HOW OUR BUS DRIVERS HELP INHERENTLY CRITICAL TO OUR LIFE BECAUSE WE STILL HAVE TO GET TO WORK.

THAT KIND OF THING.

I JUST HOPE THERE'S SORT OF A GREATER CONNECTIVITY OUT OF IT.

AND I WOULD LIKE TO THINK THERE IS.

>> CHARLIE, YOU WERE PROBABLY JUST A KID DURING THE LAST GLOBAL PANDEMIC IN 1918, BUT -- >> YEAH.

>> HOW MUCH OF THIS PANDEMIC CHANGED THE WAY THAT YOU DO YOUR WORK?

AND CAN IT SOMETIMES JUST BE A RELIEF TO WRITE ABOUT SOMETHING OTHER THAN COVID?

>> OH, ABSOLUTELY.

IT HAS CHANGED THE WAY I DO MY WORK DRAMATICALLY.

I MEAN, THREE, FOUR TIMES A WEEK I'D BE IN TRENTON OR ON THE SCENE SOMEWHERE TALKING TO PEOPLE IN PUBLIC LIFE DIRECTLY AND UNENCUMBERED AND NOW EVERYTHING IS ON PHONE.

I MISS THAT KIND OF INTIMACY, THE ABILITY TO ESTABLISH A RELATIONSHIP AND DRAW PEOPLE OUT.

IT'S VERY HARD.

I THINK A LOT OF THAT IS MISSING.

SO I'VE ADAPTED TO IT.

I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO GETTING BACK INTO THE SCRUM, I'M SURE BRENT AND LILO AS WELL.

THE ONLY GOOD THING ABOUT WORKING AT HOME IS I GO DOWNSTAIRS AND MAKE AN ESPRESSO AT 3:00 EVERY DAY.

>> IT IS INTERESTING BECAUSE SO MUCH -- YOU KNOW, SO MUCH POLITICAL REPORTING IS WORKING THE PHONES AND IT'S ALSO -- THERE'S A HUMAN ASPECT OF GOING TO THE STATE HOUSE ALL THE TIME AND SEEING PEOPLE, EVEN BEING AROUND YOUR COLLEAGUES TO, YOU KNOW, HAVE A SPRING BOARD FOR IDEAS AND BRAINSTORMING.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> YEAH, IT'S STRANGE.

IT'S JUST WEIRD.

AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE'LL EVER GET IT FULLY BACK.

YOU KNOW, THEY SAY SNOW DAYS HAVE DISAPPEARED BECAUSE OF THIS.

I DON'T KNOW IF THE OFFICE PLACE WILL EVER BE THE SAME.

BUT IT'S JUST ODD.

>> I THINK WHAT BRENT SAID ABOUT BRAINSTORMING IS SO IMPORTANT.

BEING AMONG YOUR COLLEAGUES AND SPITBALLING IDEAS.

IT'S REALLY HARD TO DO THAT, BUT YOU KNOW, THESE ARE SACRIFICES.

THIS IS A SMALL SACRIFICE.

PEOPLE ARE -- LIVES HAVE BEEN UPENDED, FAMILIES DESTROYED.

SO, I DON'T THINK ANYBODY'S GOING TO CRY TOO MUCH OR WORRY TOO MUCH ABOUT THE INCONVENIENCES OF REPORTERS.

>> GOOD POINT.

>> RIGHT.

THE LACK OF CAMARADERIE IN THE NEWS ROOM IS SMALL COMPARED TO WHAT'S REALLY HAPPENING OUTSIDE OF THE NEWS ROOM.

BRENT, YOU'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO GO TO A BOWL GAME THIS SUMMER.

GO METS.

DOES IT FEEL LIKE YOU'RE TURNING THAT CORNER?

ARE YOU GOING TO MISS THE GOVERNOR'S BRIEFINGS?

I MEAN, I REMEMBER A TIME WHEN WE ALL COMPLAINED ABOUT A LACK OF FACETIME WITH THE GOVERNOR.

>> YEAH -- >> AND BRENT HAS BEEN THERE.

YOU'VE BEEN THERE, LIKE, EVERY SINGLE DAY, RIGHT?

THAT HE'S DONE A BRIEFING.

HAVE YOU MISSED ONE?

>> I HAVEN'T -- THERE'S BEEN 170 OF THEM.

I THINK I'VE BEEN TO 70 -- WELL, AT LEAST MATT AND I HAVE BEEN TO ALMOST ALL OF THEM.

>> OH MY GOSH.

IT'S UNBELIEVABLE.

>> IT'S BEEN WEIRD.

I'VE LIVED PART OF MY LIFE IN THE BALLROOM OF THE TRENTON WAR MEMORIAL, ME AND A FEW GHOSTS.

BUT YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THEY DEFINITELY HAVE TURNED A CORNER.

THE SECOND WAVE IS WANING.

THERE'S STILL UNCERTAINTY ABOUT VARIANTS AND SO WE STILL HAVEN'T SEEN RESTRICTIONS COMPLETELY LIFTED.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED IN CONNECTICUT, BUT I DON'T SEE THAT HAPPENING IN NEW JERSEY IN THE NEXT NFEW WEEKS OR EVEN AMONGST.

THE VACCINATIONS HAVE TO INCREASE.

THEY SAY THE SUPPLY IS GOING TO GET BETTER.

THERE'S DEFINITELY A NEW REALITY.

I DO HOPE THAT BY THE SUMMERTIME, I WILL BE ABLE TO SEE PETE ALONSO AND THE METS IN PERSON AT CITI FIELD SO YOU KNOW, MAYBE WE ARE TURNING A CORNER.

THERE'S DEFINITELY BRIGHTER TIMES AHEAD, IT SEEMS LIKE THAT.

>> LILO, IS THE GOVERNOR OF TEXAS CRAZY TO LIFT COVID RESTRICTIONS RIGHT NOW?

>> WELL, MURPHY CERTAINLY -- GOVERNOR MURPHY CERTAINLY SEEMS TO THINK HE WAS CRAZY WHEN I -- YEAH.

I THINK IT WAS BRENT WHO ASKED OR SOMEBODY ASKED ABOUT IT THE OTHER DAY.

I FORGET.

BUT YEAH, I MEAN, PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICIALS CERTAINLY DON'T ADVISE AGAINST THAT.

I SAW AN INTERESTING PIECE ON SOME NEWS SHOW WHERE THEY INTERVIEWED A BAR OWNER WHO WAS SAYING AT LEAST GIVE US A COVER, AS A GOVERNOR, WE, IN THE BAR BUSINESS, ALREADY HAVE TO ENFORCE SO MANY THINGS.

WE'RE USED TO ENFORCING LIQUOR LAWS AND OCCUPANCY LAWS AND NOISE REGULATIONS AND ALL THESE THINGS AND GIVE US SOMETHING THAT WE CAN WORK WITH HERE.

OTHERWISE, IF WE HAVE TO ASK PEOPLE TO MASK UP WHEN THEY COME INTO THE BAR JUST BECAUSE WE WANT TO KEEP OUR WORKERS SAFE, THEY'RE GOING TO YELL AT US, AND WE HAVE NO -- SO THE SENSE THAT IT'S HELPFUL TO BUSINESS OWNERS SOMEHOW, I'M NOT SURE THAT THAT'S THE CASE.

I THINK -- I THINK IT SENDS THE WRONG MESSAGE.

PUBLIC HEALTH OFFICIALS SAY, WE REALLY NEED TO START THINKING ABOUT THE MASKS LIKE IN SOME ASIAN COUNTRIES WHERE PEOPLE WEAR MASKS WHEN THEY'RE NOT WELL OR THEMSELVES FOR OTHERS OR THEY WEAR MASKS ALL THE TIME TO PROTECT THEMSELVES AND THEIR FAMILIES AND IT'S JUST SOMETHING PEOPLE DO.

SO, IT DOESN'T REALLY HELP WHEN YOU DO THAT THIS EARLY IN THE CURVE.

>> I THINK IT'S NOT ONLY CRAZY.

IT'S INDEFENSIBLE, RECKLESS, AND DANGEROUS TO THE REST OF THE COUNTRY.

>> BECAUSE REALLY, THE BOTTOM - FOR YOUR PROTECTION BUT YOU PROTECTING THOSE AROUND YOU, AND I THINK THAT THAT WHOLE QUESTION HAS BEEN KIND OF MUTATED INTO THIS POLITICAL DISCUSSION ABOUT INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS AND SO ON.

BUT YOU KNOW, IF YOU COVER YOUR MOUTH WHEN YOU COUGH, WHAT'S THE POINT OF THAT?

AND HOW DIFFERENT IS THAT THAN A MASK?

>> EXACTLY.

I MEAN -- >> GO AHEAD, LILO.

>> IT'S MIND BOGGLING AND I AGREE WITH CHARLIE.

IT REALLY IS.

WHEN YOU CALCULATE THE DAMAGE FROM THE TRAJECTORY, SAY, OF ONE CASE, WHAT DOES THAT COST THE STATE AND THAT PERSON'S LOT -- JUST DO THE MATH.

LOST INCOME, HEALTHCARE COSTS, LACK OF PPE, ALL THESE THINGS, IMPACT ON THE FAMILY, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.

IT'S ON AND ON.

EVEN IF YOU'RE NOT SICK FOR THAT LONG, IT'S JUST -- I DON'T GET IT.

I DON'T GET IT.

>> I THINK FINALLY, THE LAST -- WHAT'S REALLY RECKLESS ABOUT IT IS YOU HAVE EVERY PUBLIC HEALTH EXPERT IN THE COUNTRY SAYING THAT YOU STILL NEED TO WEAR MASKS EVEN AFTER YOU'RE VACCINATED BECAUSE THERE'S STILL A RISK OF ASYMPTOMATIC SPREAD AND INFECTION EVEN AFTER YOU'VE BEEN VACCINATED.

SO, FORGET ABOUT THE DISCUSSION OF VARIANTS AND A DANGER AND THREAT.

YOU NEED TO WEAR A MASK AFTER YOU'VE BEEN VACCINATED SO FOR THE GOVERNOR OF THE LARGEST STATE IN THE COUNTRY TO POP OFF AND PANDER TO HIS BASE LIKE THAT, IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS, IT'S A CRIME, FRANKLY.

>> IT IMPACTS OTHER STATES.

TEXAS IS TEXAS, IT'S NOT ON OUR BORDER, BUT WE'RE A GLOBAL SOCIETY, NOT JUST A NATIONAL ONE, SO IT IMPACTS EVERYBODY.

>> YEAH.

I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY, WE HAD A LOT OTHER STUFF THAT WE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT BUT AGAIN, COVID DOMINATES THE CONVERSATION SO THAT'S ALL THE TIME WE HAVE FOR ROUND TABLE THIS WEEK.

THANKS TO RICHARD T. SMITH FOR JOINING US AND OUR PANEL, CHARLES, BRENT, LILO, GOOD TO SEE YOU KIDS.

THANKS FOR COMING ON WITH US.

YOU CAN FOLLOW ME ON TWITTER, @DAVIDCRUZNJ AND MAKE SURE TO SUBSCRIBE TO THE YOUTUBE CHANNEL TO GET MORE CONTENT LIKE "CHAT BOX," NJ BUSINESS BEAT AND NJ SPOTLIGHT NEWS.

IT'S BEEN A TERRIBLE YEAR IN A LOT OF RESPECTS BUT WE THINK THINGS ARE GOING TO GET BETTER, FOLKS.

WE'RE HANGING IN THERE WITH YOU.

AND WE APPRECIATE YOU HANGING IN THERE WITH US.

I'M DAVID CRUZ.

FOR THE ENTIRE CREW OVER HERE, THANKS FOR WATCHING.

WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

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