(instrumental music) - [McIntyre] Ohio's curfew has been lifted.

Governor Mike DeWine made the call Thursday as COVID-19 related hospitalizations in the state trend downward.

The state has undercounted COVID 19 deaths by 4,000.

How could that happen?

Public transit funding takes a big hit in Governor DeWine's proposed two year budget.

Ideas is next.

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(instrumental music) (instrumental music) - Hello and welcome to Ideas.

I'm Mike McIntyre, ideastream's Executive Editor and your host.

Thanks for joining us, as we review the week's top regional and statewide stories.

Ohio is no longer under an overnight curfew as hospitalization numbers trend down.

That's good news.

But it comes on top of troubling news.

The state has somehow undercounted COVID-19 deaths, by 4,000.

Meanwhile, the field of people eligible to receive the COVID-19 vaccine continues to expand, even as vaccine supply lags.

Governor DeWine has proposed a massive cut in public transit funding.

Scammers continue to flood Ohio's unemployment system, with fraudulent pandemic assistance claims.

Leading to delays for some who are legitimately seeking assistance.

Joining me to discuss these stories and more, ideastream's managing producer of health, Marlene Harris Taylor, reporter Nick Castele and in Columbus, Statehouse News Bureau reporter Andy chow.

Let's get ready to round table.

Andy, in ending the curfew, did the governor have any concerns, that that might lead to another bump in cases?

- Well, there are several concerns and I think the, the biggest message coming from the state at this point is that although the curfew has been lifted, health officials are still calling for people to wear mask, keep their distance, maybe not even go out if you don't need to go out and then wash your hands.

But yes, there is still a concern that cases could rise again especially with, those new variants of COVID-19 that are out there.

And if it were to happen again, if there were to be a spike and we would see more people going to the hospital and hospital admissions going up, then the governor says that he is ready and willing to impose a curfew again.

And I also wanna say that, I believe and I could be wrong here, but I believe he, he emphasized yesterday that the last call order.

So people who, still wanna get a drink, after 10:00 PM, the bars and restaurants still have to not serve alcohol after 11:00 PM.

So they can stay open.

Maybe they can still serve food, but that last call order is still in effect.

- I had not heard that.

So that's, that's an interesting wrinkle to it.

Obviously will still be enforcement as well.

But these bars and restaurants, Nick Castele, they have been telling our reporters, telling the media in general and making, sounding the alarm to the state, that they need these extra hours to be open.

That be the restriction at 10 o'clock and then even at 11 has been really detrimental to their business.

- Well, bars and restaurants I think are probably sectors that have been hit very hard by the pandemic, by fewer people going out.

And of course also by restrictions that limited, when those institutions could be open.

That also, you know, is a big is a big economic hit to the people who work in bars and restaurants who maybe, you know, living on a relatively small pay anyway.

So I mean, the whole hospitality sector has really been hit very hard by this pandemic.

And so, I imagine they're all hoping for a better year this year.

Not just as these restrictions are lifted, but of course as more and more people are vaccinated and can begin to feel that they are able to go out safely and eat and drink and be in public again without the fear of spreading the virus.

- Let's move on to the error that was made by the Ohio Department of Health, the under-reporting of the number of deaths in Ohio.

Here's governor DeWine on that issue.

- We had a big surge in deaths.

They all did not get reconciled the way, it should have happened.

We found out about it recently and now they're being reconciled over the next few days.

And so you'll see a jump today, tomorrow, maybe the next day.

We're not sure exactly how many days it's gonna take but you're gonna see a distorted number in the number of deaths.

And we, we believe that that's gonna put us back on track to where we actually are.

- It's not just the jump, a massive jump.

We're talking about 4,000 deaths related to COVID-19 up to that or somewhere around that number have not been reported.

Late Wednesday, the Ohio Department of Health, late last night, the director there, Stephanie McCloud said, that a single employee might have been overwhelmed.

There were other factors too, the lack of technology in the office and other issues.

But that an employee that was supposed to take a look at this type of thing, didn't get it done.

Marlene, that's a, that's a surprising thing to hear - It, It really is Mike.

And when the state did share with the public as you said Mike, initially, it was through a news release, very late in the evening, to news organizations, right?

And then they didn't give all the information, initially.

And then the next day, there was a call with select news media organizations, with Director McCloud to share more information, because people were continuing to inquire about it.

And then that's when it came out, that there was supposedly this one employee, who was overwhelmed back in, you know, we have to remember what it was like back in November and December.

The that's when the surge was happening, we had a lot of deaths in the state, and that's what they're saying that that one employee was overwhelmed.

And, that their computer system was overwhelmed.

And Mike we know, that government technology is not the best, right?

We've learned that through like, say for example when we've been talking about people trying to file for unemployment claims in Ohio, has been a mess.

And so, government agencies are really behind in technology.

So it wouldn't be surprising if that part were true.

- Andy, I wonder what this does to the issue of trust in what we're hearing from the government as it relates to all the numbers from COVID-19.

Now we're suddenly hearing, not just a couple of cases but, you know a third of what already had been reported, a third more than that actually it might not be correct.

But a third of those numbers, 4,000 more.

What does that do to sort of the trust of people?

We already see a lot of skeptical folks in Ohio about all kinds of COVID information.

- You know, it's already a pretty fragile system, fragile trust to begin with.

There are a lot of people who don't trust the numbers.

One way or the other people who are skeptic about COVID-19, people who are skeptic about the government reporting on COVID-19.

So, there is already sort of the shaky relationship, to begin with.

And, the problem here is that there needs to be as much transparency as possible.

We're getting close, unfortunately, to basically the anniversary of COVID-19 being in Ohio.

And I remember, when this was first started, even before the virus had hit Ohio and had this first confirmed cases here in Ohio, the DeWine administration, along with Dr. Amy Acton, the former Department of Health Director, would say that one of the biggest things, perhaps the number one thing, in all of this, approaching this pandemic, has been to create accuracy and transparency.

And so, being this far into it and having this big of an issue come up, does cause some trust issues.

And, the other thing here is, there have been a lot of people, more people who have been sort of on the anti-COVID side of things, people who might want to deny how big of a deal all of this is.

Who have thought that there has been an over-reporting of numbers.

And there have been sort of conspiracy theories out there about over-reporting numbers.

And then when we find out, that in fact it's been an under-reporting of numbers and under-reporting of deaths.

And perhaps part of the problem there was that, because of wanting to make sure that all the numbers were correct, that it went under-reported.

- Yeah I just, I wanted to just chime in on that point too Andy.

You're, I was thinking about that, that the most of the distrust, at least around these COVID numbers, has come from folks, who feel like the government has been over-reporting.

That, you know, there's been this claim that hospitals make a profit, if they report that someone died from COVID.

So there's been these conspiracy theories that hospitals are over-reporting the numbers.

Well this whole incident, cuts against the grain of that.

It cuts against that argument, that, you know.

So why would they hold back the numbers if they make money off of it?

- There've been lots of problems with the vaccine rollout including a scarcity of vaccine.

Many who are eligible have been frustrated in efforts to get the vaccine.

Still, Ohio moves to further expand vaccine eligibility.

Next week it includes people who have certain high risk medical conditions.

This next priority group, Marlene, involves a number of restrictions, that's bound to cause some confusion because for example, it's diabetes but not just if you have diabetes.

It's if you have diabetes and were hospitalized and have a particularly bad incident and poor control with your diabetes.

So there's a lot that people are gonna need to sort through.

- Yes absolutely Mike.

It's really difficult and confusing for people.

Because, the state continues, you know, week after week, to allow more people into the pool.

Up to this point has been primarily people over 65.

And they've opened up a little bit more each week.

It started with people over 80.

Then it went down to 75 and so forth.

And, they took care of healthcare workers.

And then teachers have been in that mix.

Some, frontline, other frontline folks, have been in that mix.

But, what's happened, as they've opened it up to more and more people.

Since there aren't enough, there's not enough vaccine.

Then people try to get in line, and then they find out well I'm eligible, but I still can't get an appointment.

Then you do have these glitches that you talked about.

When we reported on some glitches in the, primarily the Ashtabula area but in certain concern, Cleveland too, that you had like some some vaccine that went into some older folks that had been spoiled.

And that Walgreens had given out some.

And so that adds to the confusion.

And then now to your point it's being opened up to people with these severe congenital and developmental medical conditions.

But then there's all of these, okay but if you have seizures, you used to have seizures because you have epilepsy.

If you don't have seizures right now, you're not part of that group.

- Right.

- So it's just gonna continue to add to the confusion, unfortunately, until there's enough vaccine for everyone.

And which probably at this point is looking like, maybe April.

We heard Dr. Fouche say, recently Dr. Anthony Fouche, who many people trust.

He said that April is going to be the month, where it's gonna finally, flood gates are gonna open and it's finally gonna be enough for everyone.

- We just heard on, we just heard on NPR today that the Biden administration has signed a deal for 200 million more doses of vaccine.

In the meanwhile though, we still have a lack of vaccine in the state, Andy chow.

And also as Marlene noted, a number of people, and I've seen this on social media, friends who are just so frustrated who said, listen I've signed up for my parents or for myself.

And, and they say, I've got a slot at a particular place and the next morning they call me and they say sorry you don't have it any more because we don't have any vaccine.

This really is, left to people individually.

There are people that are driving literally hundreds of miles to get their shots.

I'm not sure this is how it was envisioned.

- No and it is sort of a logistical maze at times.

Because, the way the system is set up, is that the state wanted it to be handled on a local level by local vendors with with community partnership.

And so if you live in one county, it might be done differently than if you live in a different county.

But then as Marlene just pointed out, this creates such a big puzzle of, okay well, do I go to this pharmacy's website to sign up or do I go to my local public health department?

And if there are no more vaccines available, from this vendor then I got to jump back into this vendor.

And there's just a whole issue there.

And so the problem that we're heading towards is, yes, it looks like Ohio is about to get more supply, more of the vaccine.

But, is that gonna be a good thing?

I mean yes of course it will be a good thing to have more vaccine.

But how is the state going to handle, opening up the flood gates to even more people?

We've already seen that.

There are so many logistical nightmares when it comes to filing for unemployment, when we have these under-reported deaths and now to have perhaps a bigger signup system statewide to get the vaccine.

Is that just going to cause even more headaches?

So, hopefully, the issues will be resolved and that there will be people who can create a, some type of portal to fix this logistical nightmare that's happening right now.

- Marlene I would think with uh a scarcity of vaccine that would add to some concerns about the equity of its distribution.

- Yes, as a matter of fact, the Cuyahoga County Board of Health, had a news conference recently where they talked about, that this it's a big problem.

They mentioned a stat, I'm probably gonna not get it exactly right but something like 90 to 95% of the vaccine in Cuyahoga County, in the areas they cover, which is outside of Cleveland, has gone to people who are white.

And so, they are making a commitment to set aside the vaccine that they get, 20% of their vaccines, the shots they get, for people in the minority, in the African-American community specifically, to make sure that those communities are covered.

Now, right now, the county's still trying to cover the original, first responders and healthcare workers.

They haven't even moved into the older people yet.

But when they do, they're pledging to make sure, they set this vaccine aside because, as we know Mike, there's this hesitancy in the African-American community.

You talked about that trust issue, big trust issue there.

So there's a combination of people not wanting to get the shot, because they don't trust it.

And then the people who wanna get the shot who can't get it.

So there's gonna be a push here locally to make sure that equity issue is taken care of.

Not sure how that's gonna be handled in other communities across the state.

(instrumental music) - Ohio's public transit agencies could see a sharp decline in state funding in the next two year budget, as in tens of millions of dollars.

This at a time when they say they're already woefully underfunded by the state.

Governor DeWine proposes cutting funding to public transit, down to about $7 million, from the current funding of about 70 million per year.

We see budget cuts Andy.

And you start to pay real attention when it gets into the 20, 30% range.

We're talking about, a whole lot more than that.

What's uh, what's the story with this?

- Well these are big big cuts and there are several factors going into it.

One being that that $70 billion from the past biennium budget, was, I believe set higher than historically it usually is.

So, that was seemed to be maybe more like one time money going into the fund and now kind of going, lower than usual, making the state pot lower than usual.

And, this tends to be a very big conversation, that takes place at the State House.

You have several people, usually Democratic lawmakers who start to advocate for more public transit.

Of course there are several reasons why people would argue that public transit is very important especially when it comes to equity issues.

And, this will, very likely be a big debate, point of debate, at the state House where, Democrats are gonna say it must, it needs to be larger than it is right now.

But the state's also operating on a pretty tight budget, trying to not spend too far out of its estimates to, to account for, still recovering from the pandemic created recession.

- Nick the transit agencies and transit advocates, say that there's far too little investment from the state, from the federal government, in public transit.

But, in, Ohio and at RTA in specific, they don't, they aren't relying very hard on Ohio money that, most of that is sales tax money right?

- Right and this has been a long complaint among transit advocates in Ohio.

The per capita share of state funding for transit in Ohio is very low compared with a number of other states.

Pennsylvania, our neighbor to the East, is beating us in that regard.

And so, you know, Ohio is pretty low on that list.

And what that means then, is that public transit agencies, like the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority, have got to rely on their own taxpayers to make up the difference.

So RTA, draws the majority of its revenue, not even from fare collections, but from sales taxes paid by all of us who buy things here in Cuyahoga County.

Now RTA certainly had a pretty challenging year last year because we saw a decline in sales tax collections with the pandemic.

Ridership was also, I think, down about half of its usual level because of the pandemic and because of people staying home or just avoiding, you know, smaller enclosed areas like a bus.

And so, RTA was able to make up for lost revenue, thanks to federal CARES Act money.

We're waiting to see now, what kind of money will be available at the federal level for public transit agencies going forward.

In the Biden administrations $1.9 trillion COVID a proposal, there is I believe $20 billion, that was supposed to be set aside for public transit.

So, as this proposal goes through Congress, that's one thing we're keeping an eye on.

Is there gonna be more federal aid made available for public transit agencies, while we are still obviously not out of this pandemic yet?

- That, that isn't sustainable though.

If we have aid from a, from a package, to prop up public transit.

We're talking the long-term and, the idea that, public transit is a necessity in a number of communities.

Here's a thought from Pat in Painesville.

The continued assault on the poor by the well-off who run the state and this nation is shameful and immoral.

Those who are disadvantaged who must rely on public transportation, are once again having their lives made more difficult, by those who could not care less, those in our state government, who are in the majority.

That's Pat's point of view but, beyond the politics of it, we really don't have a good answer to how we're going to continue to fund a public transit or whether it's a priority in Ohio, Nick.

- Well I mean one option that was discussed a couple of years ago was raising the sales tax in Cuyahoga County, which would bring in some more money.

I know that RTA has also looked to, you know, non-governmental or somewhat governmental community partners.

Naming rights have become a larger share of, of revenue for RTA over the past few years.

So if you remember the, the Cleveland State Line or the Metro health line, we've got these branded lines that are, in some ways getting support through naming rights from outside organizations.

So that's one way that RTA has sought to bring in some more money.

There's also a transit redesign.

That is, the goal at least is to sort of make it more efficient, increase frequency on some routes that could hopefully get more people onto the bus and make it a more sustainable system.

- And that redesign though is also driven by finances that they had to give a choice.

You either get expanded service to a large geographic area in Cuyahoga County and surrounding areas or you get more frequent service in a more tightly compacted area.

Obviously, with the right amount of funding, they would do both.

- Well I think, you know, yeah in a perfect world you'd say, I'd love to have both.

I want the bus to go everywhere and go everywhere all the time.

- Right (chuckling) - That would make the most sense for everyone.

But in the real world where you're trying to balance these different interests, you know, there was a a strong case made for more frequency because, then you can have some core lines where the buses are coming every 15 minutes let's say.

People know the bus is always gonna be there, they can rely on it and that might increase people's willingness to get on and you could see ridership go up.

- Last thought on this, I'm just into transportation.

Andy, what does it look like from the state level in terms of commitment to public transit?

Not only just in communities like we've just described, but the idea of being able to get from Cleveland to Columbus to Cincinnati on a rail line, for example, which was something that, John Kasich put the kibosh on a long time ago because he thought it was too expensive.

- Well before I say that, I wanna correct something I said earlier.

The previous budget did a lot for nearly 70 million as well.

So this is, even historically speaking, a very big cut to public transit.

And then to your point Mike, Ohio is at this, interesting stage right now where there, it's trying to sell itself as a state that people should come back to.

$50 million is going into an ad campaign, trying to get people, who may have left Ohio, to come back to Ohio.

And for a lot of people, especially for younger generations, a big selling point is a robust public transportation system.

So the fact, that the state is looking to cut its funding into that, might not bode well for people who are looking for a state that has good public transportation.

Not just, within the city, but from one city to another.

(instrumental music) - Scammers continue to bombard Ohio's Department of Job and Family Services with bogus unemployment assistance claims.

The department says it received 140,000 new claims last week and nearly 45,000 have been flagged for review.

That number could rise as more claims are reviewed.

So if they're tied up with this kind of thing, Andy, that means those who might have legitimate claims, could wait longer for their needed assistance.

- They will very likely be waiting longer for their needed assistance.

And that is, the whole issue here.

Even when and if the state is catching these fraudulent claims, it's diverting more resources away, from really filing and completing the legitimate claims.

And getting in the way of getting those checks to people who need it faster.

Really, and so what Lieutenant Governor Jon Husted is saying is that, the people who have legitimate claims they will get their checks, but it's just a matter of when.

And, at this point the big question is, what else can the state and local leaders be doing to sort of offset that lag time?

Does there need to be more rent assistance?

Does there need to be more food assistance available for people who have checks just waiting to get to them, but they don't have the money that they need right now to spend on much needed assistance?

- So, we wonder then, how this continues to be perpetrated.

Does the state have any plan right now at stopping things, flagging it, looking at it?

Is there anything they could do on the front end to stop it from happening?

- The encouraging news is that it seems like the state is doing a better job at catching these flagging fraudulent claims, you know.

Reaching out to businesses to confirm that this person or that person, has indeed been unemployed.

And so it does seem like they are catching it.

And right now the next step, is this public private partnership that the state is entering into, with certain members of the private sector, to really ramp up it's fraudulent claim center and its filing claim center.

To make sure that the state is hitting on all cylinders when it comes to running its unemployment department.

And it's just, of course, this has been an issue that's been going on for the better part of a year now.

Where people have been waiting and trying to file and they can't because of whatever.

Again, logistical nightmare that's happening, with the way they're trying to file.

And so this public private partnership, the hope is, from the state at least, is that the public private partnership will sort of get this moving a little bit better.

- And that's going to wrap up our show.

The Sound of Ideas team is taking Monday off for President's Day.

Coming up Tuesday, we kick off a series on a winter equity.

Making our parks and outdoor spaces accessible to all.

And discussing why you can and should get outside, even though it's cold.

I'm Mike McIntyre.

Thanks for watching and stay safe.

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