>> JUST AHEAD ON BLACK ISSUES FORUM, AN ANTI-CRITICAL RACE THEORY POLICY IN JOHNSTON COUNTY RELEASES MILLIONS IN SCHOOL FUNDING.

HOW LANDLORDS CAN REFUSE RENTAL ASSISTANCE PAYMENTS AND EVICT TENANTS ANYWAY.

AND HBCU FUNDING TAKES A BLOW IN THE RECONCILIATION BILL.

STAY WITH US.

♪ WELCOME TO BLACK ISSUES FORUM DEBORAH HOLT-NOEL.

IN AN EFFORT TO PREVENT THE TEACHING OF CRITICAL RACE THEORY A JOHNSTON COUNTY SCHOOL BOARD HAS INSTITUTED NEW ETHICS GUIDELINES IN EXCHANGE FOR THE RELEASE OF 7.9 MILLION DOLLARS THAT HAD BEEN WITHHELD BY THE COUNTY'S BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS.

THE SCHOOL BOARD UNANIMOUSLY UP APPROVED THE NEW POLICY BUT HERE'S SOME OF THE LANGUAGE FROM THAT POLICY IT SAYS STASH SHALL NOT TEACH SOCIAL THEORIES OUTSIDE OF NORTH CAROLINA STANDARDS OF ANY KIND TO STUDENTS UNLESS APPROVED BY THE NORTH CAROLINA STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION AND LEGISLATED BY THE NORTH CAROLINA GENERAL ASSEMBLY, NO EMPLOYEE OR STUDENT SHALL BE FORCED TO HAVE COMPELLED SPEECH OR ACCEPTANCE OF IDEAS THAT ARE CONTRARY TO THEIR BELIEFS.

NO STUDENT OR STAFF MEMBER SHALL BE SUBJECTED TO THE NOTION THAT RACISM IS A PERMANENT COMPONENT OF AMERICAN LIFE.

ALL PEOPLE WHO CONTRIBUTED TO AMERICAN SOCIETY WILL BE RECOGNIZED AND PRESENTED AS REFORMISTS INNOVATORS AND HE ROSE TO OUR CULTURE AS IF TEACHERS AREN'T UNDER ENOUGH TO ARREST OF COURSE THEY WILL BE FIRED OR DISCIPLINED IF THEY ARE DISCOVERED NONCOMPLIANT WITH ANY OF THESE POLICIES KNOW RIGHT NOW I WANT TO WELCOME CRAIG JAMES, A CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY AND MEMBER OF THE JOHNSTON COUNTY EDUCATION SUMMIT.

WELCOME.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

AND OPEN BY ASKING YOU FIRST SHARE WITH US WHAT IS THE AFRICAN AMERICAN EDUCATION -- WHAT IS THE SUMMIT RATHER?

>> THE JOHNSTON COUNTY EDUCATION SUMMIT IS A GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS THAT CAME TOGETHER SOME YEARS AGO, A COUPLE YEARS AGO.

WE CAME TOGETHER BECAUSE WE HAD A LONGSTANDING SCHOOL BOARD MEMBER AFRICAN AMERICAN LADY WHO WAS PREPARING TO RETIRE.

SO THE JOHNSON COUNTY EDUCATION SUMMIT IS MADE UP OF CONCERNED CITIZENS, CLERGY.

PROFESSIONALS, RETIRED EDUCATORS, BUSINESS OWNERS, PARENTS, JUST A CROSS-CULTURAL A COLLECTION OF INDIVIDUALS THAT ARE CONCERNED ABOUT EDUCATION.

>> AND WHAT ARE THE THOUGHTS OF THE SUMMIT GROUP ABOUT THIS RECENT POLICY?

>> OF COURSE, THE SUMMIT GROUP OIS SHOCKED, I'M VERY DISAPPOINTED THAT THE SCHOOL BOARD WOULD PASS SUCH A POLICY.

ON THE OTHER HAND WOULD NOT REALLY THAT MUCH SURPRISED BASED ON THE WAY THINGS HAVE BEEN GOING ON IN THE COUNTRY FOR THE LAST 4 OR 5 YEARS.

>> ALTHOUGH THE BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS WHICH CONTROLS THE BUDGET FOR THE SCHOOL SYSTEM IS AN ALL WHITE, ALL MALE, ALL REPUBLICAN COMMISSION BOARD.

WHEN I VISIT THE JOHNSTON COUNTY PUBLIC SCHOOLS WEBSITE, I SEE A VERY DIVERSE REPRESENTATION OF PRINCIPALS IN THE SYSTEM AND SCROLLING DOWN THE TWITTER FEED I SEE A REALLY BEAUTIFUL SITE WITH CHILDREN OF DIFFERENT GENDERS AND ETHNICITIES AND AND THEY'RE APPLAUDED, AND I SEE THAT THE SUPERINTENDENT OF JOHNSTON COUNTY PUBLIC SCHOOLS IS AN AFRICAN AMERICAN, YET THIS POLICY PASSED.

WHAT CAN YOU SHARE WITH US ABOUT HOW THE LOCAL EDUCATION COMMUNITY FEELS ABOUT THIS POLICY WHAT MORE CAN YOU SHARE?

>> WELL I'VE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO TALK WITH SOME EDUCATORS HERE IN JOHNSTON COUNTY.

MANY OF THEM FEEL AS IF THE COMMISSION FIRST OF ALL OVERSTEPPED ITS BOUNDS BY WITHHOLDING FUNDS THAT WERE THERE TO BENEFIT ALL CHILDREN, AND WE WITH THE JOHNSTON COUNTY EDUCATION SUMMIT BELIEVE THAT WE REPRESENT ALL CHILDREN.

ANY TIME, THERE'S AN ISSUE THAT'S GOING TO AFFECT THE EDUCATION OF OUR CHILDREN WE BELIEVE THAT WE WOULD BE THERE TO STEP IN TO BE A VOICED FOR THOSE CHILDREN.

AND THEN FOR THE SCHOOL BOARD TO SET SUCH A PRECEDENT FOR THE COUNTY COMMISSIONER COULD NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN IF THEY BELIEVE THAT THEY WANT SOMETHING DONE AND THEY CAN JUST COME BACK IN SAY OKAY, WE'RE GOING TO WITHHOLD FUNDS IF YOU DON'T DO X, Y OR Z.

THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN, THE SCHOOL BOARD SEEMS TO HAVE LOST DISCRETION AND THE ABILITY TO STAND ON ITS OWN AND MAKE GOOD DECISIONS FOR OUR CHILDREN.

>> WELL, IT JUST SEEMS AS THOUGH SUCH A REPRESENTATIVE GROUP WOULD HAVE MOUNTED SOME SORT OF PROTEST.

WOULD HAVE COME TOGETHER TO SAY SOMETHING.

DID THAT PROTESTER DID THEIR VOICES GET HEARD TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE.

AND IF SO WAS THERE A STRONG PROTEST AT ALL?

>> I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH CURRENTLY AROUND THE WORLD AROUND THE COUNTRY IS THIS PANDEMIC.

I THINK THIS PANDEMIC IS SPREAD A LOT OF PEOPLE OUT AND WE'RE NOT ABLE TO GET TOGETHER LIKE WE WERE DOING INITIALLY.

THE JOHNSON COUNTY EDUCATION SUMMIT, WE WERE GOING TO SCHOOL BOARD MEETINGS, WE WERE THERE, PRESENT, WE WERE A VOICE ADDRESSING THE BOARD BUT ONCE THE PANDEMIC HIT, OF COURSE WE HAD TO TAKE A STEP BACK.

MEETINGS ARE CLOSED AS FAR AS BEING A PHYSICAL AND BEING IN THE ROOM WITH THEM.

WE JUST CAN'T BE THERE.

HOWEVER, THERE WERE SOME PROTESTS WERE PEOPLE LIFTING THEIR VOICES BUT AT THE SAME TIME I THINK THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN MORE OF A PUSH BACK IF WE COULD HAVE GATHERED CROWDS OF PEOPLE AND FLOODED HALLS, AND FLOODED THE ROOMS TO LET THEM KNOW THAT WE WERE NOT HAPPY WITH WHAT THEY WERE CONSIDERING DOING.

>> SO AT THIS POINT THE NEW POLICY IS IN PLACE.

ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY RESISTANCE OR ARE WE JUST GOING TO -- IS THE ORGANIZATION -- IS THE SCHOOL SYSTEM TEACHERS, EVERYONE, JUST KIND OF ACCEPT THIS AND GO AHEAD AND TEACH IN THE WAY THAT THEY KNOW WILL EDUCATE AND EDIFY ALL THE CHILDREN, BUT CERTAINLY COMPLYING WITH THE RULES.

BECAUSE IS ALWAYS THERE ALWAYS CREATIVE WAYS TO TEACH THE TRUTH AND COMPLY WITH THE POLICY I WOULD THINK.

>> WE'RE NOT GOING TO STOP THE FIGHT WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO PUSH WE WANT TO CONTINUE TO PUSH BACK.

WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO RAISE OUR VOICES, WERE GOING TO CONTINUE TO MAKE DEMANDS, WE'RE GOING TO CONTINUE TO SHOW UP.

WE'RE NOT JUST GOING TO SIT BACK AND LET THIS JUST GO UNDER THE RUG OR JUST PASS EASILY AND CONTINUE ON THIS COURSE.

WE BELIEVE THAT THERE'S SOME THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE WE BELIEVE THAT WE ARE I GOING TO BE ABLE TO CHALLENGE SOME THINGS HOPEFULLY IN THE FUTURE, IN THE NEAR FUTURE.

>> WELL CERTAINLY AND JUST IN THE LAST FEW SECONDS YOU KNOW 7.9 MILLION IS A HEFTY LIFT FOR PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

WAS WAS THIS THEIR CONSIDERATION GIVEN TO WHAT THAT MIGHT MEAN IN TERMS OF A SACRIFICE.

IF THIS POLICY WAS NOT INSTITUTED?

>> WELL, I'M SURE WITH THAT AMOUNT OF MONEY ON THE TABLE, IT IN FLORENCE DECISIONS AS WE ALREADY CAN SEE THE DECISIONS WERE INFLUENCED.

KEEP IN MIND THAT 7.4 MILLION DOLLARS WORTH FOR WAS FOR EVERY STUDENT, WASN'T JUST FOR CERTAIN STUDENTS.

IT WAS FOR THE WHOLE SCHOOL PROGRAM AS A WHOLE THAT JOHNSON COUNTY EDUCATION AS A WHOLE AND TO WITHHOLD IT BASED ON THIS PARTICULAR ISSUE, IT WOULD HAVE HAD AN EFFECT ON THE ENTIRE SCHOOL POPULATION.

>> WELL I CERTAINLY WISH THE BEST TO ALL OF THE TEACHERS, EDUCATORS AND STUDENTS IN JOHNSTON COUNTY IN LEARNING THIS YEAR AND IN YEARS FUTURE.

CRAIG JAMES THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING A PART OF TODAY'S PROGRAM.

>> YOU'RE WELCOME AND THANK YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO SHARE.

A RECENT REPORT IN THE NEWS AND OBSERVER TELLS THE STORY OF A LANDLORD IN DURHAM WHO HAS REFUSED TO ACCEPT RENTAL ASSISTANCE FROM A 160 TENANTS THE ARTICLE GOES INTO DETAIL ABOUT ONE PARTICULAR RENTERS EXPERIENCE DEALING WITH THE COST OF CHILD CARE WHEN COVID CAUSED SCHOOL CLOSINGS, AN ACCIDENT THAT LEFT HER DISABLED, AND UNEMPLOYED MAINTENANCE ISSUES THAT CREATED EXPENSIVE UTILITY BILLS AND SUBSEQUENT BACK AND FORTH WITH A LANDLORD LEGAL AID AND A DURHAM RENTAL ASSISTANCE PROGRAM FUNDED BY FEDERAL COVID STIMULUS DOLLARS.

WHILE IT'S REPORTED THE COUNTY HAS MADE PAYMENTS ON BEHALF OF OVER 1400 HOUSEHOLDS, AND ONLY A HANDFUL OF LANDLORDS ARE MAKING THINGS HARD FOR RENTERS, THAT HANDFUL AMOUNTS TO 2100 APPLICATIONS OR POTENTIAL FAMILIES OUT ON THE STREET DUE TO EVICTION.

I WANT TO BRING OUR PANEL IN ON THIS WE HAVE POLITICAL ANALYST STEVE RAO LA'MESHIA WHITTINGTON OF ADVANCE CAROLINA AND ATTORNEY YOLANDA TAYLOR OF THE CENTER FOR COMMUNITY LAW EQUITY.

I WANT TO OPEN WITH YOU YOLANDA.

WITHOUT GETTING INTO THE WEEDS OF INDIVIDUAL STORIES, WHAT IS MOST DISCONCERTING TO YOU ABOUT THE RENTAL ASSISTANCE PROCESS IN TERMS OF KEEPING PEOPLE IN THEIR HOMES AND PROTECTING THEM FROM EVICTION?

>> WHAT'S MORE CONCERNING TO ME IS THAT YOU KNOW WE HAVE BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT WERE ALLOCATED TO SOLVE THIS ISSUE.

BUT YET EVEN DURING THE PANDEMIC WHEN WE'RE AT THE HIGHEST PEAK IN 2020 THERE WERE TENANTS STILL BEING EVICTED.

AS A FORMER LEGAL AID ATTORNEY AND MANAGING ATTORNEY AT LEGAL AID, I SAW FIRSTHAND HOW TENANTS WERE BEING EVICTED DUE TO CRACK THE PEOPLE PLEAD IS BACK LANDLORD ATTORNEYS REFUSING TO ACCEPT THE RENT EVEN WHEN ATTORNEYS TRIED VERY HARD AND WERE SUCCESSFUL IN OBTAINING THAT RENTAL AND UTILITY ASSISTANCE, SO IT'S CONCERNING TO ME THAT THE WAY THIS WHOLE THING WAS THOUGHT OUT WAS GIVE IT TO THE LANDLORDS, WHICH I THINK THEY DID THAT BECAUSE MAYBE THEY THOUGHT TEENS WERE NOT APPROPRIATED CORRECTLY.

SO AT BOTH LANDLORDS YOU KNOW WE'RE BECOMING FRUSTRATED IN 2020 BECAUSE OF THE SIMPLE FACT THAT THE BUREAUCRACY OF IT AND IT WAS A LONG TIME BEFORE THE TENANT ACTUALLY GOT APPROVED FOR RENTAL AND UTILITY ASSISTANCE AND THE TIME THAT MONEY OR THAT CHECK WAS ACTUALLY CUT FOR THE LANDLORD, SO COULD HAVE BEEN MONTHS.

SMALL MOM AND POP LANDLORDS UNDERSTANDABLY USE THIS MONEY FOR THEMSELVES SO THEY WOULD GET FRUSTRATED AS WELL, AND WILL GET BEHIND ON THEIR OWN BILLS, BUT EVEN AFTER 2020, AND EARLY 202 WE STILL WERE SEEING HOW SLOW THIS MONEY WAS MOVING EVEN THOUGH I WILL SAY THAT OUR STATE DOES TOUT THE FACT THAT THEY'RE NUMBER 2 IN THE NATION AS IT RELATES TO HOW FAST MONEY HAS MOVED, I KNOW THAT NATIONALLY THERE ARE SOME SLOW SPENDERS, BUT WHAT'S CONCERNING IS THAT BLACK WOMEN WITH CHILDREN ARE AT THE FOREFRONT OF THIS EVICTION CRISIS AND THAT WE SEE THEIR FACES TIME AND TIME AGAIN IN THE HEADLINES.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

AND I WANT TO BRING YOU IN HERE LA.

THIS TIES BACK TO OUR FEDERAL AND STATE LAWS ABOUT EVICTIONS.

WHAT ARE YOUR CONCERNS ABOUT THE MORATORIUMS AND THE IMPACT ON FAMILIES, ESPECIALLY WHEN THE BUREAUCRACY IS OUT THERE AS YOLANDA SAID AND LANDLORDS ARE REFUSING TO ACCEPT PAYMENT?

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

WELL FIRST WE SHOULD STILL HAVE EVICTIONS AND UTILITIES MORATORIUMS, WANT TO SAY THAT UP FRONT.

WE'RE STILL IN A PANDEMIC.

SO WHY IS THERE A DEADLINE ON PROTECTION WHEN THERE'S NOT A DEADLINE ON THE PANDEMIC?

THE CDC EVICTION MORATORIUM TOOK EFFECT ON SEPTEMBER 4 OF LAST YEAR TO PROTECT US FROM BEING EVICTED AS ATTORNEY TAYLOR REFERENCED AND WAS INITIALLY SET TO EXPIRE DECEMBER 31ST OF THE SAME YEAR.

BUT CONGRESS EXTENDED THAT TO THE TOP OF THIS YEAR IN JANUARY.

PRESIDENT BIDEN FURTHER EXTENDED THROUGH MARCH, JUNE AND JULY AND PROVIDED A TOTAL OF 46.5 BILLION DOLLARS FOR EMERGENCY RENTAL ASSISTANCE.

ERA.

BUT HERE'S THE ISSUE.

ONLY 3 BILLION DOLLARS OF THAT 46 BILLION HAS ACTUALLY BEEN SPENT BY THE END OF THE SUMMER.

WHY?

BECAUSE IT'S A LOT OF LEGAL RED TAPE AS ATTORNEY TAYLOR REFERENCED.

THE APPLICATION PROCESS IS NOT CLEAR.

THERE ARE NO CLEAR REGULATIONS OR STIPULATIONS OF HOW THAT MONEY SHOULD BE ALLOCATED, SOME COUNTIES AND STATES ARE HAVING TO FIGURE IT OUT, PIECE IT TOGETHER AND THAT CAN VARY DEPENDING ON WHO WAS ACTUALLY ELECTED AND IN CHARGE OF THE COUNTY.

THAT'S WHY YOU'RE SEEING DISCREPANCIES AND -- FOR INSTANCE, DURHAM COUNTY HAS BEEN ABLE TO MOVE FUNDING RAPIDLY VERSUS OTHER RURAL COUNTIES AROUND THE STATE MAY NOT BE MOVING AS FLUENTLY AND SO THERE'S RESEARCH SAYS UP TO 80% OF HOUSEHOLDS BEHIND ON RENT AND AT RISK OF EVICTION LIVE-IN COMMUNITIES WITH A 100% COVID-19 CASE GROWTH RATES AND THIS WAS FOUND IN JULY.

>> SO THE THING IS, YOU HAVE THE STATISTICS OUT HERE BUT BUT ITS PEOPLE AND IT'S ALSO THE MENTAL DURESS UP HAVING TO GO THROUGH ALL OF THAT BUREAUCRACY AND JUST A FEW REVEALS TO ME A LACK OF SENSITIVITY FOR JUST HUMAN BEINGS AND WHAT YOU'RE HAVING TO DEAL WITH ON A DAILY BASIS JUST TO GET GET THIS FUNDING, YOU KNOW, STEVE, YOU KNOW HOW DOES THE SITUATION YOU KNOW KIND OF TAKING A BIGGER LOOK AT IT REFLECT ON THE LARGER ISSUE OF PROTECTIONS FOR RENTERS AND FOR HIM AND FOR LANDLORDS.

>> WELL, I MEAN I THINK AT THE END OF THE DAY, MUCH HAS ALREADY BEEN SAID, I MEAN WE'RE IN THE MIDDLE OF A PANDEMIC, YOU HAVE IN NORTH CAROLINA THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS THAT ARE BEING EVICTED OR FACING EVICTION AND 54,000 NORTH CAROLINIANS OVER THIS LAST FEW MONTHS WHO ARE BEING DISCONNECTED FROM THEIR WATER THEIR BROADBAND OR ELECTRICITY.

AND SO NO CITIZEN SHOULD HAVE TO MAKE A CHOICE BETWEEN PAYING THE RENT AND THESE BASIC AMENITIES WE NEED ANY TIME IN OUR COUNTRY BUT PARTICULARLY DURING A PANDEMIC WHERE WE'RE TELLING PEOPLE STAY HOME, WE WANT YOU TO GET VACCINATED WE'RE TRYING TO FIGHT OFF COVID SO I THINK THE ANSWER IS WE JUST HAVE TO GET THE LANDLORDS TO WORK WITH US AND MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE EXTENDING THE RENT MORATORIUM THAT OUR GENERAL ASSEMBLY ISN'T MAKING IT HARD TO DO THAT WE SHOULD BE MAKING IT EASIER TO DO THAT.

WE'RE HEADING INTO THE END OF THE FALL AND SOON THE WINTERTIME.

AND PEOPLE WITHOUT A HOME, WHAT ARE THEY GOING TO DO?

THEY'RE GOING TO GET INFECTED AND SICK.

AND THE SECOND THING, I'LL SAY JUST TO CLOSE OUT IS THIS IS BROUGHT UP TO ME THE INCREDIBLE NEED FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT AT THE LOCAL LEVEL WE'RE ALWAYS PUTTING A BOND ON THE BALLOT.

BUT WE NEED MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN OUR COUNTRY.

PEOPLE ARE PAYING THESE EXORBITANT RENTS JUST TO LIVE THAT'S AN ISSUE FOR ANOTHER TIME, BUT I DO THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT I HAD TO SAY TODAY ON THIS PROGRAM.

>> AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS DIRECTLY TIED TO THIS ISSUE BECAUSE YOU'VE GOT SO MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE OUT THERE RENTING AND I DON'T KNOW IF THEY ARE AWARE OF THE BENEFITS OF HOME OWNERSHIP COURSE, THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES FOR HOME OWNERSHIP.

BUT YOLANDA, PULLING IN THIS BUILD BACK BETTER PLAN AND THE AREAS THAT THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION IS PLANNING TO INVEST AND DO THEY IT DOES IT ADDRESS THE NEEDS THAT ARE KIND OF MANIFESTING IN A SMALL KIND OF STORY LIKE THIS YOU GOT ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES YOU'VE GOT THE HOUSING AFFORDABILITY YOU KNOW WHAT DO WHAT DOES THE BILL THAT PLAN NEED TO BE REALLY EMPHASIZING THE FOLKS ABOUT THE VALUE EVERY SINGLE TIME YOU TAKE ANOTHER TRILLION DOLLARS OFF.

>> WELL, IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT WHEN BIDEN AND HARRIS RAN, THERE WAS HOPE FOR THIS WHOLE LIKE TURNOVER OF RACIAL JUSTICE EQUITY.

SO WHAT NEEDS TO BE BUILT INTO THIS PLAN IS RACIAL JUSTICE EQUITY BECAUSE BEFORE THE PANDEMIC BLACK WOMEN AND PEOPLE OF COLOR INDIGENOUS FOLKS THEY WERE ALREADY FACING AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING CRISIS, SO THE PANDEMIC HAS ONLY EXACERBATED THE NEED FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND BECAUSE MOST OF THEM ARE PAYING WITH A 30% OF THEIR TOTAL HOUSEHOLD INCOME TOWARDS HOUSING, WHICH MEANS THEIR COSTS BURDEN.

THERE'S SOME HOPE IN THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN AND AS IT RELATES TO THE MONEY THAT'S FLOWING FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, BUT AGAIN BUREAUCRACY CAN SLOW THAT DOWN I UNDERSTAND 100 MILLION DOLLARS TO SEPTEMBER 2022 IN RENTAL ASSISTANCE FOR VERY LOW INCOME TENANTS THOSE WERE THE TENANTS I USED TO HELP AT LEGAL AID, FOLKS WHO MAKE 30% OF THE AREA MEDIAN INCOME OUT IN A PLACE LIKE RALEIGH, SOMEONE THAT'S MAKING AROUND 24,000 FOR A FAMILY OF 4 ANUALLY.

SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WORKING PEOPLE WERE TALKING ABOUT ESSENTIAL WORKERS WERE TALKING ABOUT THOSE FOLKS THAT WE NEEDED TO GO BACK INTO THE ECONOMY SO THAT THE ECONOMY WILL NOT TOTALLY FALL ROCK BOTTOM, SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO NEED TO BE ABLE TO LIVE IN THE PLACES WHERE THEY WORK.

SO IT IS A HOUSING PANDEMIC I WILL CALL IT, BUT IT WAS A PANDEMIC FOR LOW INCOME TENANTS WAY BEFORE COVID.

>> AGREED THERE'S SO MANY DIFFERENT ASPECTS TO THIS AND IT DOES TIE BACK TO THIS CONVERSATION HAPPENING OVER THE INFRASTRUCTURE BILL, BOTH OF THE BILLS AND SO PEOPLE JUST NEED TO BE PAYING ATTENTION AND ENGAGED AND ACTIVE.

WHILE HEADLINES FOCUS ON WHETHER OR NOT BIDEN'S BUILD BACK BETTER PLAN WILL GET PASSED AT $3.5 TRILLION, OR $1.5 TRILLION, OR NOT AT ALL, THE DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS.

WHAT GETS CUT WITH THAT COMPROMISE?

HOW ABOUT $43 BILLION DOLLARS IN FUNDING FOR HBCUS?

FUNDING STARTED OUT AT $45 BILLION, BUT IT'S NOW BEEN WHITTLED DOWN TO $2 BILLION DOLLARS.

WHEN THE BILL WENT TO CONGRESS FOR RECONCILIATION, THAT WAS ONE OF THE CASUALTIES.

GEORGIA SENATOR DR. RAPHAEL WARNOCK AND NORTH CAROLINA CONGRESSIONAL REPRESENTATIVE DR. ALMA ADAMS BOTH PROTESTED THE MOVE IN WRITING, AND REP. ADAMS HAS SAID SHE WILL NOT VOTE FOR THE BILL IN ITS CURRENT FORM.

SO STEVE SOMETHING HAD TO GIVE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK THIS REDUCTION IS ALL ABOUT AND IS IT FAIR?

>> WELL FIRST OF ALL DEBORAH, LET ME SAY FROM THE OUTSET THAT YOU KNOW HBCUs ARE, AND HAVE ALWAYS BEEN THE DRIVERS OF THE ENGINE FOR ECONOMIC GROWTH AND OPPORTUNITY FOR BLACK AMERICANS AND ALSO A PLACE WHERE WE CAN BUILD THE LEADERS OF TOMORROW, AND VICE PRESIDENT KAMALA HARRIS WAS A GRADUATE OF AN HBCU AND SENATOR WARNOCK HIMSELF, THE FIRST BLACK MAN TO REPRESENT GEORGIA IN THE UNITED STATES SENATE.

AND SO I THINK IT'S SO IMPORTANT THAT WE INVEST AS MUCH AS WE CAN IN THESE UNIVERSITIES.

WHAT I WILL SAY IS THAT THE 45 BILLION DOLLAR NUMBER, I THINK THERE HAS BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF CONFUSION AND THAT MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT NUMBER WAS OVER A PERIOD OF TIME AND 27 BILLION DOLLARS WERE GOING FOR SUBSIDIES, ANOTHER BILLION FOR INSTITUTIONAL AID, A 2 BILLION FOR RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT, BUT THERE IS A 2 BILLION DOLLAR POT OF MONEY NOW THAT COULD BE USED AND REPRESENTATIVE ADAMS MIGHT HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT INVESTMENTS IN INFRASTRUCTURE AND THINGS LIKE THAT, BUT I THINK WHAT WE NEED TO DO IN MY OPINION IS SUPPORT THE CURRENT POT OF MONEY RIGHT NOW.

THE 2 BILLION.

DO EVERYTHING WE CAN TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF THAT MONEY IS BEING EARMARKED NOW TODAY FOR THE FOR THE HBCUs AND THEN MOVING FORWARD CONTINUE TO ADVOCATE TO THE LEADERS, INCLUDING THE PRESIDENT AND THE CONGRESS AND THE SENATE THAT IN THIS INFRASTRUCTURE PACKAGE, PARTICULARLY 3.5 TRILLION.

THE DEVIL IS IN THE DETAIL.

AND SO WHEN THESE BIG NUMBERS ARE THROWN OUT, IT'S OFTEN HARD FOR ORGANIZATIONS TO KNOW HOW IS THE MONEY BEING BROKEN DOWN.

SO THAT'S WHAT I WOULD SAY, BUT RIGHT NOW MOVING FORWARD, I THINK IT'S INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT PARTICULARLY THE FINAL THING, I'LL SAY IN THE MIDDLE OF A PANDEMIC AND ON THIS SHOW WE HAVE TALKED A LOT ABOUT SYSTEMIC RACIAL BIAS.

WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THE LACK OF HOME OWNERSHIP FOR BLACK AMERICANS ONLY 45% IN AMERICA OWN A HOME COMPARED TO 75 MILLION WHITE AMERICANS.

WE'VE TALKED ABOUT DISENFRANCHISED THE COMMUNITIES AND MINORITY BUSINESSES.

THE ONLY THING THAT CAN GET US TO LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD FOR MINORITIES IS EDUCATION.

>> EDUCATION IS KEY.

YOLANDA, WHEN WE SAY EDUCATION IS KEY, BUT WE SEE THESE REDUCTIONS TAKE PLACE IN FUNDING FOR HBCUs THAT CENTER WHAT DO YOU THINK IT SAYS ABOUT OUR VALUE AND APPRECIATION HBCUs AND BY THE WAY THEY'RE NOT ONLY BENEFICIAL FOR AFRICAN-AMERICANS BUT MAKING A MULTI-BILLION DOLLAR IMPACT ON AMERICA'S ECONOMY PERIOD.

>> I THINK IT SHOWS THAT WE UNDERVALUE HBCUs NEW UNDERVALUE THE HISTORY OF HBCUs, THE REASON WHY HBCUs HAD TO BE CREATED IN THE FIRST PLACE, AND WE UNDER VALUE, I GUESS THE CULTURAL EXPERIENCES IN HISTORY TO HBCUs CAN PROVIDE AND IN THE AFTERMATH OF THE WHOLE HANNAH-JONES DISCUSSION AND DEBATE.

WE KNOW THAT HER EXPERIENCE WAS I GUESS A SYMPTOM OF A LARGER PROBLEM WHICH IS WHEN WE LOOK AT HBCUs AND THEIR BEING UNDERVALUED, WE HAVE TO ASK OURSELVES WHAT IS PROGRESS FOR OUR COMMUNITIES?

WHAT IS PROGRESS FOR OUR COMMUNITIES, WE'RE CONSTANTLY - I LOVE TO SAY THIS - AT THE BACK OF THE BUS AT EVERY SYSTEM THAT WE PRODUCE THERE'S INEQUITIES IN THIS COUNTRY.

AND WHEN WE LOOK AT HBCUs WE SEE THAT THIS IS THE ONLY OPPORTUNITY FOR SOME STUDENTS TO EVEN OBTAIN A COLLEGE DEGREE BECAUSE MAYBE THEY'RE BEING EXCLUDED FROM PREDOMINANTLY WHITE INSTITUTIONS AND THEN WE ALSO LOOK AT THE FACT THAT FACULTY.

HANNAH-JONES FINALLY RESORTED TO THE FACT THAT I'M GOING TO TAKE MY TALENTS ELSEWHERE I'M GOING TO TAKE MY TALENTS WHERE THEY COULD BE USED IN AN HBCU.

BUT ACROSS THE NATION WE SEE THAT THE NUMBERS AS IT RELATES TO PROFESSORS OF COLOR, ARE VERY LITTLE AS IT COMPARED TO YOU KNOW OUR WHITE COUNTERPARTS SO I THINK THAT HBCUs HAVE BEEN CHRONICALLY UNDER FUNDED.

AND WHILE WE SHOULD ADVOCATE FOR THE 2 BILLION, I AGREE THAT WE SHOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH ADVOCATING THAT OUR HBCUs ARE VALUED AS MUCH AS OTHER INSTITUTIONS AND THEY'RE UNDER VALUED FOR MANY REASONS.

>> I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TOO RECOGNIZE LA THAT WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THIS BIG POT OF MONEY FOR HBCU FUNDING, IT'S NOT FUNDING FOR HBCUs IT'S FUNDING FOR HBCUs AND MSIs, MINORITY SERVING INSTITUTIONS, AND WE TALK ABOUT THE THE HUGE IMPACT OF HBCUs IS THAT SHARED WITH MSIs AND ARE THEY SHARING IN THE CREDIT THAT REALLY HBCUs ARE DOING THE WORK FOR?

>> IT'S SUCH A GREAT QUESTION.

AND SO WHAT CONGRESSWOMAN ALMA ADAMS WROTE HER LETTER IN STATING THAT 2 BILLION DOLLARS WAS JUST SIMPLY NOT ADEQUATE, THE CUTS WERE NOT ADEQUATE BECAUSE NUMBER ONE, SOME OF THE SCHOOLS ARE A 115, 116 YEARS OLD.

ONE OF THE FIRST TO SERVE THE BLACK COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES, LINCOLN UNIVERSITY WAS ACTUALLY FOUND IN 1854 BEFORE THE END OF THE CIVIL WAR, SO THESE INSTITUTIONS -- WHEN WE SAY HISTORICALLY THEY HAVE BEEN HISTORICALLY THE BEDROCK AND THE SAFETY AND PROTECTION AND INCUBATION OF OUR PEOPLE DURING PIVOTAL MOMENTS IN HISTORY, EVEN TO BIRTHING THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT THROUGH STUDENT NONVIOLENT COORDINATING COMMITTEE, THAT PROTEST HAPPENED HERE IN RALEIGH.

SO WHEN SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT THAT 2 BILLION DOLLARS, WE WOULD ACTUALLY AS HBCUs HAVE TO SHARE AND FIGHT FOR FUNDING BECAUSE THAT POT IS ONE POT FOR ALL HBCUs AND THE MINORITY SERVING INSTITUTIONS IT'S NOT ACTUALLY CLEARLY, STEVE MENTIONED, IT IS NOT CLEARLY EARMARKED AND THAT WAS CONGRESSWOMAAN ADAMS, THAT WAS HER STATEMENT.

SHE SAID, "IF I SUPPORT THIS.." BECAUSE WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE BILL PROCESS WE HEAR THIS VERY POLARIZING, "WE CAN'T VOTE FOR THIS BILL, CONGRESSWOMAN ADAMS IS PUTTING US AT RISK."

SHE'S SAYING, "NO, WE CAN ACTUALLY DO AMENDMENTS" AND THOSE AMENDMENTS SHOULD SAY IF WE'RE GOING TO USE THE 2 BILLION DOLLARS, THIS AMOUNT SHOULD BE EARMARKED FOR HBCUs WE SHOULD BE VERY CLEAR HOW MUCH HBCUs CAN RECEIVE SO IT DOESN'T GET "LOST IN THE SAUCE" SO TO SPEAK.

THAT'S THE CLEAR STIPULATIONS AND AMENDMENTS WE CAN ACHIEVE AND WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE IMPACT OF HBCUs HISTORICALLY IN CONTRAST WITH PWIs AND MSIs, HBCUs ACCOUNT FOR APPROXIMATELY 3% OF ALL COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES BUT WELL OVER 20% OF BLACK AMERICANS CONTINUE TO EARN DEGREES AT THESE SCHOOLS.

AND ABOUT 25% BLACK AMERICANS EARN THEIR STEM DEGREES AT HBCUs, AND THE LAST THING -- AND I LOVE MY STATS -- BECAUSE IT CLEARLY GROUNDS THE COMPARISON WHICH ONE IS BETTER.

IT ISN'T ABOUT WHO'S BETTER, IT'S ABOUT WHO'S CREATING RESULTS BECAUSE THE ENVIRONMENT IS FOR OUR CULTURE AND OUR SAFETY, AND YOU CAN'T PUT A NUMBER ON THAT BUT YOU CAN ABSOLUTELY QUANTIFY HOW MANY STUDENTS ARE SUCCESSFULLY MATRICULATING BECAUSE THEY'RE SAFE AND LOVED.

>> I COULDN'T AGREE MORE.

LA'MESHIA WHITTINGTON STEVE RAO AND YOLANDA TAYLOR, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR THOUGHTS TODAY.

>> THANK YOU DEBORAH.

I WANT TO THANK TODAY'S GUESTS.

WE INVITE YOU TO ENGAGE WITH US ON TWITTER OR INSTAGRAM USING THE HASHTAG #BLACKISSUESFORUM.

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