>> Eric: BEFORE THIS MORNING'S ECONOMIC NEWS, THE BIGGEST HEADLINES OUT OF D.C. LATE THIS WEEK WERE THE CONTENTIOUS SENATE HEARINGS WITH U.S. HEALTH SECRETARY ROBERT F. KENNEDY, JUNIOR, AND SEVERAL COURT RULINGS AGAINST ACTIONS TAKEN BY THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION.

LARRY JACOBS IS HERE.

HE HEADS UP THE CENTER FOR THE STUDY OF POLITICS AND GOVERNANCE AT THE U OF M'S HUMPHREY SCHOOL.

ANY FALLOUT FROM THE KENNEDY APPEARANCE YESTERDAY BEFORE CONGRESS?

>> I THINK PEOPLE WERE STUNNED.

YOU USUALLY DON'T HEAR A WITNESS, PARTICULARLY A SECRETARY, WHO IS USUALLY BEGGING THE CONGRESS FOR MONEY, USUALLY ON'T HEAR THEM CALLING OUT SENATORS AS LIARS.

THIS WAS AN EXTRAORDINARY HEARING.

I DON'T THINK I'VE EVER SEEN ANYTHING QUITE LIKE IT.

AND ALSO, I HINK, YOU KNOW, THERE WERE SOME SIGNIFICANT QUESTIONS RAISED ABOUT KENNEDY.

NOTHING'S GOING TO HAPPEN TO HIM.

BUT I THINK HIS STANDING IN THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION IS PROBABLY SLIPPED A LITTLE BIT.

>> Cathy: WHAT DID YOU MAKE OF SOME OF THE REPUBLICAN SENATORS PRETTY MUCH SAYING THEY HAVE BUYER'S REMORSE FOR APPROVING HIM?

>> WELL, OF COURSE SENATOR AND DOCTOR CASSIDY WAS THE DECIDING VOTE THAT APPROVED THE NOMINATION.

FOR SECRETARY DEAFNL.

I THINK -- SECRETARY KENNEDY.

I THINK HE HAS DEEP RESERVATIONS ABOUT KENNEDY'S EFFORTS TO ROSTERING BACK VACCINES AND THEIR AVAILABILITY.

AND SO I THINK THAT WAS JUST A GUT CALL.

THE PROBLEM FOR CASSIDY IS THAT HE IS FACING A TOUGH REELECTION BID AND HE CAME OUT AND VOTED AGAINST TRUMP IN THE IMPEACHMENT HEARING.

SO HE'S ON VERY THIN ICE.

AND SO I TOOK WHAT HE -- HOW HE PERFORMED YESTERDAY AS TRYING TO THREAD A NEEDLE BETWEEN HE KIND OF POLITICS AND ALSO HIS ETHICAL CONCERNS AS A DOCTOR.

>> Eric: GOVERNMENT SCHOENBERG AT THE END OF THE MONTH?

GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN AT THE END OF THE MONTH?

>> SEPTEMBER 30TH IS THE DATE AND THERE ARE A COUPLE THINGS GOING ON THERE.

YOU'VE GOT VERY DEEP DIVISIONS OBVIOUSLY AMONG DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS, DEEP DIVISIONS AMONG THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, AND THEN BIG CONVICTIONS BETWEEN REPUBLICANS IN THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE.

>> Eric: BUT WE HAVEN'T SEEN THE PRESIDENT'S DETAILED BUDGET YET, HAVE WE?

>> NO.

I THINK THEY'RE TRYING TO WORK OUT SOME KIND OF ARRANGEMENT OR AGREEMENT.

IT'LL JUST BE A TEMPORARY BILL TO GET THINGS THROUGH, MAYBE THE END OF THE -- INTO THE NEW YEAR.

BUT THIS IS NOT GOOD.

AND IT'S A SIGN THAT THE REPUBLICANS ARE REALLY STRUGGLING TO MOVE ON.

>> Cathy: I'M WONDERING ABOUT SOME OF THE COURT CASES THAT HAVE COME DOWN, LOWER COURT CASES, ON TARIFFS, DEPORTATION, THERE'S BEEN A BUN BUBUNCH.

ARE YOU SEEING ANY POTENTIAL CRACKS HERE WHEN IT COMES TO THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION?

OF COURSE THE SUPREME COURT HAS TO, YOU KNOW, WEIGH IN ON THIS ANYWAY.

BUT WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF SOME OF WHAT WE'RE SEEING HERE LEGALLY?

>> THERE HAS BEEN FRUSTRATION BY LIBERTARIANS, SOME CONSERVATIVES, AND A LOT OF DEMOCRATS ABOUT WHY THERE WASN'T FASTER ACTION BY THE COURTS, COURTS MOVE SLOWLY.

BUT SHIS THIS BUT SHIS T THIS IS THE COURTS MG AND WE'RE SEEING THE COURTS CHALLENGING DONALD TRUMP'S DECLARATION OF EMERGENCIES.

EMERGENCIES ON THE ECONOMY.

HE'S CLAIMING THERE'S AN INVASION WHICH JUSTIFIES DEPORTATIONS.

HE'S CLAIMING THAT THERE'S INTERNAL REBELLION THAT WOULD JUSTIFY SENDING TROOPS INTO L.A. AND THE COURTS ARE STEPPING IN AND SAYING, WAIT, I'M NOT SEEING THAT REALITY, AND THESE -- THE ACTS HE'S DRAWING ON DON'T ACTUALLY HAVE THE LANGUAGE THAT DONALD TRUMP IS CLAIMING.

SO I THINK IT'S SIGNIFICANT.

YOU KNOW, IT'S HARD TO PREDICT HOW THE SUPREME COURT'S GOING TO RULE.

BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S GOING TO BE A SLAM-DUNK FOR DONALD TRUMP.

I THINK THERE ARE JUSTICES, PARTICULARLY ROBERTS AND AMY CONEY BARRETT WHO HAVE VERY PARTICULAR VIEWS ABOUT JUICER PRUDENCE.

FOR INSTANCE, CONEY BARRETT IS AN ORIGINALIST.

I THINK HE'S GOING TO TAKE A VERY HARD LOOK AT THE LANGUAGE IN SOME OF THE STATUTES THAT DONALD TRUMP'S BEEN DECLARING TO MAKE THESE SWEEPING DECISIONS, LIKE, YOU KNOW, SETTING UP TARIFFS THAT WE HAVEN'T HAD FOR ALMOST A CENTURY ON HIS OWN, EVEN THOUGH CONGRESS HAS THE POWER TO TAX.

>> Eric: ON THE POLITICAL FRONT, I WONDER IF THE PRESIDENT IS -- WITH THE BOMBING OF THE VENEZUELAN DRUG BOAT AND GOING INTO D.C. WITH THE ATIONAL GUARD, IS HE PUTTING THE DEMOCRATS ON THE -- WE'RE PRO-DRUG DEALERS AND WE'RE PRO-CRIMINALS WHEN WE OPPOSE THAT?

>> I THINK THAT'S PART OF THE THINKING AND HE'D LOVE TO HAVE THE DEMOCRATS MIRED IN A CONVERSATION ABOUT THE CONSTITUTION, THE LAW, WHEREAS HE'S TAKING REAL ACTION.

BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE -- WHERE VOTERS ARE, IT VERY MUCH FOLLOWS FROM THE REPORT THAT MIGUEL MIGUCHRIS FARRELL GAVE.

THERE'S 38% APPROVAL OF DONALD TRUMP'S HANDLING OF INFLATION.

THAT IS THE STORY AND THOSE ARE THE BIG SALIENT ISSUES, MORE SO THAN CRIME.

SO IT'S UNDERSTANDABLE DONALD TRUMP IS TRYING TO FLIP THE SCRIPT.

I DON'T THINK IT'S GOING O WORK.

>> Cathy: BY THE WAY, SHOULD PEOPLE BE WORRIED ABOUT THE RENAMING OF THE DEFENSE DEPARTMENT, THE WAR DEPARTMENT?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, DONALD TRUMP RAN AGAINST WARS.

HE WAS AGAINST THE, YOU KNOW, NEVER-ENDING WARS.

SO YOU HAVE TO WONDER WHAT THIS IS ABOUT.

BUT, YEAH, THINK THERE SHOULD BE CONCERN.

IT'S SENDING A VERY STRONG MESSAGE ABOUT WHERE AMERICA'S GOING AND HIS INTENTION TO USE MILITARY FORCE.

>> Eric: THANKS OR COMING