TIM: WELCOME BACK OUR GUEST THIS WEEK IS LAME DUCK GOP REPRESENTATIVE JACK O'MALLEY FROM UP NORTH.

OR LEAD STORY, COULD MICHIGAN BECOME REL VAN IN THE PRIMARY.

ON THE OTR PANEL, CRAIG MAUGER, EMILY LAWLER, AND RICK PLUTA.

SIT IN WITH US AS WE GET THE INSIDE OUT, OFF THE RECORD.

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>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

WELCOME BACK TO OFF THE RECORD FROM STUDIO C. WELL, MICHIGAN COULD BECOME RELEVANT.

WHAT IS GOING ON EMILY?

YEAH.

SO THERE HAS BEEN A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT SWITCHING OFF THE ORDER THEN MICHIGAN BASICALLY IS SLATED AT LEAST TO GET BUMPED TO THE GROUP OF EARLY STATES THAT TEND TO HAVE A LOT OF SWAY OVER THE CONTEST AND THE EARLIEST STAGES.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH IOWA?

YOU NO HE?

I THINK THERE IS COMPLAINTS THAT IOWA IS NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF THE POPULATION SO THERE IS THAT.

BUT ALSO, I THINK, THERE IS JUST SOME SENTIMENT THERE IS TIME FOR A LITTLE BIT OF SHAKEUP AND STATE LIKE MICHIGAN HAVE BECOME FAR MORE IMPORTANT.

TIM: THERE IS A REPORT THAT SAID MICHIGAN HAD BEEN ENDORSED BY THE.

TURNS OUT NOT TO BE TRUE?

>> WELL, WE HAVE BEEN ENDORSED BY THE PRESIDENT TO BE IN THE EARLY GROUP OF STATES TO VOTE, SOB WE ARE GOING TO -- TIM: YOU DESCRIBED MICHIGAN IN THE LETTER.

A DIVERSE GROUP OF PEOPLE.

YEAH.

RIGHT.

HE WANTS TO SEE MICHIGAN AMONG THE FIRST FIVE STATES TO CAST PAL LOTS ON WHO SHOULD BE THE NOMINEES FOR EACH OF THE PARTIES AND WHICH IS STILL A BIG CHANGE FOR US.

I MEAN RIGHT NOW WE ARE DOWN IN THE PACK IN THE VOTING ORDER THEN OSH A DAY WHERE OTHER STATES DONE GET AND WE'LL GET UP THE EARLY WINDOW BECAUSE WE ARE ONE OF THE LAMB ESTATES GOING EARLY THEN, THEN, VERY DIVERSE STATE THAT WE'LL SEE A LOT OF CANDIDATE VISIT I AM SURE.

DON'T FORGET THAT YOU KNOW, BEING EARLY STATED A JUST THE POLITICAL CONSTELLATION BECAUSE MICHIGAN POLL TEGSES EVEN DOWN TO LEGISLATURES WHO HAVE THEIR OWN SORT OF MONEY ORG MY GLASSES BECAUSE ALMOST A LOT MORE RELEVANT WHICH MEANS THAT YOU KNOW, THEY CAN SHORT OF YOU KNOW, MOVE UP, BECOME MORE PROMINENT AND JOIN THE, JONE THE GET A LITTLE BIT OF YOU KNOW NATIONAL ATTENTION WHICH YOU KNOW, IN SOME RESPECTS HELPS MICHIGAN IN THE HALLS OF CONE DRESS WHEN IT COPS TO INFLUENCING THEN ANY OF FOU A SECOND HEAVE THEY ARE GOING TO ARE OVER TO PLAY DEAD.

WE DONE KNOW WHAT ITS GOING TO DO.

IT IS MEETING THIS WEEKEND.

THINGS COULD CHANGE.

WE ALSO DON'T KNOW WHAT THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE IS GOING DO.

THEY COULD SAY, WE LOOK THE ORDER YOU ARE PROPOSING HERE.

WE DON'T LIKE THAT ORDER.

THEN WITH HAPPENS WHEN YOU HAVE TWO COMPETING SCHEDULES.

SOME OF THESE STATES.

AND ONE OF THE STATES RECOMMENDING TO BE IN THIS HE TOP FIVE.

WILL THE REPUBLICANS WHO CONTROL GEORGIA GO ALONG WITH WHAT THE DNC IS RECOMMENDING.

THIS IS FAS FROM FROM OVER.

EARLY STATES HAVE YOU KNOW, LAWS THAT SAY, IF SOMEONE MOVES THE CALENDAR WE ARE GOING TO MOVE OUR PRIMARY CAUCUS UP.

I THINK, TIM AND I HAVE THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO ARE OLD ENOUGH TO REMEMBER THE '87-'8 DRAMAS.

>> I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT I HAD FOR BREAKFAST.

MUCH EARLIER UP AND THEN INSTEAD OF BEING INFLUENTIAL IT BECAME SORT OF THE POLITICAL SCANDAL WHERE YOU KNOW IT ROUND UP IN COURT AND AND THESE DEALS THAT WERE CUT OVER WHAT THE DELEGATIONS TO THE NATIONAL CONVENTION WERE GOING TO BE.

WHICH BY THE WAY FOR THE SHEER DRAMA OF IT F. I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT GOOD GOVERNANCE, YOU KNOW?

AT ALL.

THAT I AM FOR IT.

>> I AM SURE THAT IS GOOD TO SWAY THE VOTE RIGHT THERE.

WELL, RIGHT I AM GLAD.

I THINK NEW HAMPSHIRE IN THE BUCKET OF HAVING A STATE LAW THAT SAYS THE EARLIEST STATES SO WE'LL SEE HO HOW THAT GOES.

IT IS SPEAKING TO MICHIGAN INCREASE PROM INNOCENCE IN OUR ROLE NAGGALLY HAS INCREASED THEN YOU KNOW, TO SOME EXTENT THIS IS A PRIMARY AND OBVIOUSLY, BUT TO SOME EXTENT I THINK WE CAN THANK 2016 AND THE DONALD TRUMP THAT IS A GOOD TO GET A FOOTHOLD IN EARLY AND THE NAM IS KNOWN IN MICHIGAN EARLIER IF YOU ARE YOU KNOW, HERE ON THE GROUND TALKING TO OR'S LECKED OFFICIAL A THEN GETTING ENDORSEPS REALLYIER I THINK WE ARE SEEING AS A STATE THAT IS FAR MORE IMPORTANT NATIONALLY THAN WE WERE 10 TO 20ER WHY AGO.

PREDICTION.

THIS WILL EXACERBATE GOVERNOR WITH IT MER'S PROBLEM VIS-A-VIS NOT RUN FOR PRESIDENT.

SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO GO TO IOWA.

SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO GO TO MU SHARE.

AM I RIGHT OR WRONG?

>> NATIONAL MEDIA WILL PIR ARE A CHUTE IN AND THAT WILL BE A CONSTANT QUESTION FOR HER AND I MEAN NOT JUST VIS-A-VIS PRESIDENTIAL ASPIRATIONS BUT, CABINET ASPIRATION, FUTURE POLITICAL ASPIRATIONS THEN IN TERMS OF CONGRESS AND SENATE SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

THAT IS WHAT CLOUDS OVER ALL OF THIS.

IF JOE BIDEN IS RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT AGAIN IN 2024 DOES ALL OF OF THIS MATTER?

I MEAN HOW MUCH DOES THIS MATTER IF HE REASONS AGAIN THEN DONALD TRUMP RUNS THEN NO ONE CHAL THERES THEM AND HAVE THE CONVERSATION THEN MIGHT NOT HAVE MUCH INFLUENCE OVER WHAT OH COARSE THEN JOE BIDEN DECIDES NOT TO REASON AGAIN THEN WE GOT MASS CHAOS IN THE STATE OF MICHIGAN THEN THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE THEN PETE BUTTIGIEG WHO IS NOW A MICHIGAN RESIDENT.

ALL RIGHT.

AND MORE.

YEAH.

MORE.

CERTAINLY OTHER POSSIBILITIES THEN, BUT I MEAN ONE THING WE SHOULD REMIND PEOPLE OF THAT I HAVE NEVER COVERED MICHIGAN GOVERNOR WHO AT SOME TIME DIDN'T TAKE SOME EVEN MODEST ABSES TOWARD AT LEAST EXPLORING.

>> EVEN IF THEY DIDN'T WE WROTE ABOUT IT.

WE WERE RUNNING JOHN LENGTHER FOR VICE PRESIDENT.

REMEMBER YEAH.

WELL, ALSO, PRESIDENTIAL EXPLORATIONS IT IS JUST YOU KNOW, AT SOME POINT, THE SPOTLIGHT ALWAYS SHOOP ON I MY GOVERNOR BECAUSE OF THE NATURE OF THE STATE, THE SIZE OF I, THE NUMBER OF ELECTORAL VOTES, IT IS JUST, IT IS A CONVERSATION THAT YOU CANNOT ENTIRELY TAP DOWN.

WELL, POTENTIAL PROBLEM FOR HER BECAUSE IT TAKES NOT HER EYE OFF THE APPROXIMATELY, BUT IF EVERYBODY ELSE IS WRITING ABOUT THAT, THEN, HOW DO YOU ADVANCE YOUR LEGISLATIVE AGENDA NOT A TERM THING.

OH.

YOU ARE NOT BUYING THAT.

NOT BUYING THAT.

WELL, I MEAN, CERTAINLY, IT IS POSSIBLE TO ADVANCE AGENDA THEN PES I WHEN YOU HAVE GOT DEMOCRATS IN CONTROL OF THE LEGISLATURE THEN, THEN, IN SOME WAYS YOU KNOW, MAYBE IT EVEN, YOU KNOW, INCREASING YOUR CLOUT A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE PEOPLE WANT TO JUMP ONBOARD.

IF I MAY DEBATE FOR YOU FOR A 27 AND WHAT ABOUT THOSE REPUBLICANS?

NO, MO, I LIKE YOU.

THOSE REPUBLICANS THAT THE GO FOR WE KNOW AND SHE IS GOING TO NEED TO PASS SOME BILLS, CAN I GET AMEN?

YEAH.

ALL RIGHT.

ALL RIGHT SO THEY SIT BACK AND SAY HERE'S THE GOVERNOR WHY THE HECK HOWLED WE HELP HER NOW THE WELL, I MEAN, THE HOUSE SPEAKER, THE CURRENT YOU KNOW, HOUSE SPEAKER HAS MADE YOU KNOW, COMMENTS AND THAT PARTICULAR DIRECTION.

THEN ITS JUST, THE IDEA OF ADVANCING A PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY SO THAT MICHIGAN IS MORE RELEVANT TO THE PROCESS IS LIKE, YOU OH, LIKE CATNIP LEGISLATURE THEY JUST A CANNOT AT LEAST YOU KNOW, GO IN AND NIBBLE AT THAT FOR YOU KNOW FOR SOME PERIOD OF TIME.

I WOULD I SAY THAT THE REPUBLICANS CAN SHE HE IS GOING TO BE COURTING IN LEGISLATURE ARE THE PRAGMATIC ONES WHO WANT TO GET QUICK WINS CHECKED OFF AND I DON'T THINK THE IDEAL WHO WOULD BE WORRIED ABOUT HER FUTURE ANALYTICAL PROSPECTS IF SHE WAS TO GET SOME MODEST LEGISLATION THAT IS BIPARTISAN PASSED AND ISSUES.

WELL, WE SEE THIS HAPPEN.

WE SAW THIS IN THE GUB TOIAL RACE AND ROBE CANS WERE TILL WORKING WITH GOVERNOR WHITMER UP TO ELECTION DAY AND THEY MADE A CHOICE AND JUMP THESE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PROJECT THEN OPPOSE IT AND THEY MADE THE ORCHIS AND KEEP WORKING WITH HER.

DON'T FORGET THAT WE HAVE GOT A LOT OF LEGISLATURES WHO ARE LEAVING LAPSING AND THEY GOT PROJECTS THAT THEY HAVE BEEN, WOG ON FOR AS LONG AS THEY HAVE BEEN HERE AND THAT HOW IMPORTANT IS IT TO YOU KNOW, TO GO HOME WITH THOSE KINDS AND AFTER THEY ARE DONE BEING LEGISLATURES THEN VERSUS, YOU KNOW, MEDDLING IN YOU KNOW, POLITICAL THINGS THAT YOU KNOW, MAYBE MAYBE BACK HOME PEOPLE DON'T CARE ABOUT.

>> WELL, LET'S SEGWAY TO WHAT THEY DOING IN LAME DUCK.

IT IS JUNK BALL.

WHEN WE SIT HERE WE HAVE IDEA WHAT IS GOING TOP PEP.

>> IT STOPPED US BEFORE.

YEAH.

YEAH.

HOW BADS THE RIM UP THE ODDS AS WE SIT HERE TODAY HAVE BEEN DOING ANYTHING SIGNIFICANT AND VERY LOW.

I MEAN, I JUST, IT SEEMS RIGHT NOW, THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE TERM LIMITED THEN LEADERSHIP POSITIONS WHO ARE READY TO GO HOME.

>> I MEAN, THAT IS MY READ ON IT.

COULD IT CHANGE?

IT COULD CHANGE.

THE SPANGER SET THE SIGNAL HE HAD 30 BILL WANTED TO WORK ON.

THAT IS NO AT GO HOME THING.

HE IS ONE OF THREE PEOPLE.

HE IS IMPORTANT ONE.

HE IS.

IF THOUGH OTHER WHO DON'T WANT TO GO ALONG TO ALONGING WITH THE LIST OF 30 WHERE ARE WE INWHAT IN TEN INCENTIVE DOES OF NOR WHITMER HAVE AT THE END OF THE DAY TO NEGOTIATE POLICIES WHEN WITH IT A MNT AND BE NEGOTIATIONING WITH WITHIN NY BRINK THE NATE.

>> LE, ESPECIALLY IF THE THINGS THAT THE LG LEGISLATURE YOU KNOW, GOING TO SEN HER AND ARE CONTROVERSIAL AND JUST DEST TENNED FOR JUST DEST TENNED FOR VETOES AND ANYWHERE THERE ARE SURPRISES YOU FOE IN LAME DUCK THAT PEOPLE ARE MOTIVATED TO TRY AND YOU KNOW, WRAP UP SOME ACCOMPLISHPS ON THE WAY OUT THE DOOR.

WE ARE LOOKING AT A LAME LAME DUCK OVERALL AND I WHOOP BE SUR PRIZEED IF THIS THERE ARE SPECIAL THINGS TO PUSH NOW THAN LATER YOU KNOW I WOULD PUT OUT THE BUSINESS GROUPS ARE RAISING FINISHES WITH MINIMUM WIJK AND IMPLEMENTATION IS SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN SO THE SOONER AND FEBRUARY THINK.

BUZZ OBVIOUSLY THE SOONER THE BETTER THEN TO CLARITY ON THIS AND WHIT NER SIGNALED SHE WOULD BE WILLING TO WORK WITH THE CURRENT AS THAT.

WHAT ABOUT THE GAG OF PEOPLE RUNNING FOR STATE REPUBLICAN PARTY CHAIR COULD THE LIST GET ANY BIGGER ARE ANY OF A YOU RUNNING?

YOU SAW THAT.

6:00.

>> WAY BUYING AER.

WHAT IS GOING ONEN THERE YEAH.

YEAH.

WELL, I MEAN, LOOK.

REPUBLICANS GOT SWAMPED IN MICHIGAN IN THIS ELECTION.

>> WELL SHALL THE SAME THING.

SWAMPED.

THEY ARE COMING BACK TO RUN THE PARTY?

>> WELL, EXPLAIN?

WELL, THE COMPLAINT IS THAT THE PARTY WAS NOT WELL MANAGED AND WAS NOT BEHIND THE TICKET GOING INTO NOVEMBER AND THEN, THE RESULTS WERE A NATIONAL HE BARRASMENT FOR MICHIGAN REPUBLICANS.

NOW, AS THE GAGGLE YOU PUT IT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE PRESENTING THEMSELVES AS YOU KNOW, POTENTIAL PARTY CHAIRS ARE THEY THE CURE FOR THE PROBLEM INLOOK.

WERE THEY PART OF THE PROBLEM IF.

>> WERE THEY PART?

>> A PARTY CHAIR HAS BASICALLY TWO PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITIES.

FUND-RAISING AND RECRUITING COUNTY CHAIRS TO ORGANIZE AND GET READY FOR THE NEXT ELECTION.

>> HERDING CATS OK.

TRYING TO PUT TOGETHER A PARTY THAT LOOKS LIKE IT IS UNITED EVEN IT IS IF NOT.

AT THE END OF THE DAY THESE ARE PEOPLE AND A LOT OF PEOPLE IN THE RACE ARE PEOPLE THESE DELEGATES LOVE AND SIT ON THE SIDELINES AND SAY THE PEOPLE HAVE LOST BUT THE PEOPLE JIP IN THIS RACE ARE LOVED BUY THE PEOPLE WHO VOTE ON THE ACTUAL WINNER THEN PITCH NOW.

THIS MAY BE ONE OF THE MOST ENTERTAINING AND DRAMATIC RACES V THAT WE HAD.

A KNOW BILLION'S CHANCE.

>> WELL, I MEAN, IT IS GENES IF YOU CAN SWAY DELEGATES I THINK THAT A LOT OF DELEGATES ARE INVESTED AND PEOPLE THEY HAVE ALREADY YOU KNOW, INVESTED TIME, EN ARE GO AND MAYBE A LITTLE BIT OF MONEY IN ALTHOUGH MONEY WAS NOT THEIR STRONG SUIT OR FUNERARY Z RAISING WAS NOT THE STRONG SUIT.

I THINK RON HAS BEEN PROPPING UP THAT PARTY FOON HI WE SAW THAT.

$5 MILLION.

>> EXACTLY.

EXACTLY.

YOU KNOW, THE PARTY CHAIR HAS TO BE A GOOD FUND-RAISER.

RON FILLED THIS A LITTLE BIT BY BEING A PERSON WITH MONEY TO THROW AROUND HIMSELF.

BUT NONE OF THE PEOPLE RUNNING HAVE ANY OF THOSE CREDENTIALS.

>> I MEAN, IN A FIELD THIS LARGE, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN ARGUE THAT ANY BOD AND EVERYBODY HAS A CHANCE.

ANYBODY AND EVERYBODY HAS A CHANCE.

OF THE GROUP, PETE HOEKSTRA HAS THE MOST EXPERIENCE IN TERMS OF HERDING CATS.

>> DOES IT MATTER?

>> YES, IT DOES.

NOT IF HE DOESN'T HAVE THE DELEGATES.

>> WELL, DO YOU THINK THE GEL GATES KNOW WHO HE IS?

AUTOS DO THE DELEGATE IN THE PARTY TODAY KNOW WHO HE IS?

HE ALSO IS NOT POSED TO MAKE THE ARGUEP, HEY, THESE GUYS LOST THEIR LAST ELECTION BECAUSE HE ALSO LOST.

>> THEY DON'T CARE.

THEY DONE CARE.

>> HE CAN MAKE THE ARGUMENT THAT MAY BE THEIR WEAKNESS.

I THINK HE IS IN A VERY DIFFICULT POSITION.

BUT THE MORE OF THESE CANDIDATES WHO RON THE DONALD TRUMP SIDE OF THE PARTY, THEY GET IN.

THAT GIVES HIM A LITTLE BIT BETTER OF A CHANCE BUT KEEP END MINE THE WAY THE CONVENTION RACES WORK AND GETS WHITTLED DOWN THEN YOU GOT TO GET 50% ON THE FINAL BALLOT SO SOME POINT IF HE HE IS GOING TO WIN, HE HAS TO FACE ONE OF THE CANDIDATES THEN DEFEAT THEM LIKELY ONE-ON-ONE.

DO YOU BELIEVE WHAT HE SAID ON THE SHOW LAST WEAK WILL GO TO DONALD TRUMP TO ASK HIM TO BE NEUTRAL IN THE RACE.

DID YOU BELIEVE HE COULD PULL THAT OFF?

>> I AM SKEPTICAL.

SKEPTICAL.

>> SKEPTICAL.

WHAT IS THE LAST TIME DONALD TRUMP TOOK ADVICE FROM ANYONE?

>> WITH, ONENG THING YOU CAN LOOK FOR, WELL, I MEAN, ONE OF THE THINGS YOU CAN HOPE FOR, THOUGH, IS THAT THIS YOU, KNOW, ON HE ONE HAND, TRY TO CLAIM YOU ARE AS TRUMP PI AS ANY WITHIN THE FIELD BUT DONALD TRUMP SPEND TENDS TO HANG BACK IF THERE IS NO AT CLEAR WINNER.

>> WELL, LOOKS LIKE SOLDANO DEPERNO TICKET WOULD BE THE WINNER.

>> THEY ARE THE FAVORITES NOW I WOULD SAY.

ALSO, I WOULD SAY DONALD TRUMP HAS HUNG BACK BEFORE.

THIS IS DIFFERENT DYNAMIC NOW DONALD TRUMP MAY NO BE THE STANDARD-BEARER OF THE PARTY THEN HE WILL WANT SOMEBODY IN THE PARTY CHAIR POSITION HE BELIEVES HE CAN RELY ON PHYSICIAN THERE HIS A COCONTESTED RACE FOR THE GOP.

I WOULD SUSPECT HE WETGETS INVOLVED IN.

>> LET'S CALL IN JACK O'MALLEY LAKE ANN HOW'S THE LAMB DUCK DOING IF.

>> ALL RIGHT.

JUST, YOU KNOW, COUNTING OUT THE DAYS HERE.

GOT A MONTH TO GO.

WE'LL SEE WHAT 2023 BRINGS.

>> ARE YOU READY TO VOTE YES ON A PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY REMOVING IT UP IN MY SNOW YEAH.

I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.

YOU KNOW?

YOU WERE CHATTING.

I LIKE TO SEE ALMOST AN END TO THE PARTY SYSTEM OF HO OUR ELECTED OH TESTINGS AS ARE NOMINATED T. LET'S LET THE PEOPLE DECIDE AS OPPOSED TO -- THIS HAPPEN AS I UNDERSTAND IT ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE.

WHERE WILL THESE LITTLE GROUPS OF LOCAL FOLKS ARE PICKING PEOPLE FOR SECRETARY OF STATE, ATTORNEY GENERAL, WHAT NOT.

LET'S LET THE PEOPLE DECIDE LIKE THEY DO FOR GOVERNOR.

THAT IS PROBABLY THE MOST DEMOCRATIC WAY OF DOING IT.

TIM: EMILY?

>> SO YOU, YOU RAN, OBVIOUSLY, IN A COMPETITIVE DISTRICT UNDER THE NEW MAP, YOU SHIFTED YOUR STANCE A LITTLE BIT ON ABORTION.

IT SEEMS LIKE THAT WAS ISSUE THAT WAS REALLY RESONATING WITH PEOPLE IN YOUR DISTRICT.

SHOULD MORE REPUBLICANS HAVE DONE THAT STATEWIDE INDO YOU THINK THAT OVERALL, THE REPUBLICANS STAND ON ABORTION AT THE TOP OF THE TICKET AFFECTS RACES LIKE YOURS?

>> YOU KNOW, WHAT IS FUN HERE IS I AM A DANGEROUS MAN.

I HAVE NOTHING TO LOSE RIGHT?

I AM NOT RUNNING FOR ANYTHING.

HELL YA.

PART OF THE PROBLEM IS -- FOR 50 YEARS, HOW YOU STOOD ON THAT TO YOUR BASE DIDN'T MATTER.

RIGHT.

ROE V. WADE WAS THERE.

WHAT THE REPUBLICANS NEED TO REALIZE, THIS IS NOT A RED STATE.

THIS IS A PURPLE STATE.

MAYBE EVEN ONE THAT IS LEANING A LITTLE BIT BLUE.

AND IF YOU ARE IN A 74% REPUBLICAN STATE, YOU CAN, YOU CAN SAY THINGS.

BUT WHAT ABOUT ONE WHERE IT IS 52-48 DOWN?

YOU HAVE TO -- IT DOESN'T MEAN YOU CHANGE THE CORE VALUES.

YOU HAVE TO DISCUSS HOW YOU MESSAGE THAT.

ONE THING THAT I WOULD LOVE TO CHALLENGE THE REPUBLICANS TO DO IS JUST FOR EXER SEES EXERCISE, ALL RIGHT, LET'S PICK A DISTRICT SAY IN ANN ARBOR.

WHAT DO WE VERY TO DO INHOW DO WE HAVE TO SAY THINGS TO WIN IN ANN ARBOR DISTRICT?

DO THEY AS EXERCISE.

IT REALLY HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THE FACT THAT PREACHING TO THE CHOIR IS NOT ALWAYS THE BEST THING IN THE WORLD THEN THE CHOIR IMMEDIATE KNEADS TO REALIZE, THAT THE MESSAGING JUST CAN'T BE READ MEAT LOOK YOU WAN IT TO BE IN A PURPLE STATE.

>> WELL, THERE WAS TIME WHEN YOU KNOW, BE THERE WERE YOU KNOW, PRO CHOICE REPUBLICANS THEN IN THE SAME WAY THERE WERE ANTIABORTION DEMOCRATS, SHOULD THE REPUBLICAN PARTY BE MORE WELCOMING SHOULD THERE BE A PRO-CHOICE REPUBLICAN CAUCUS?

IN THE LEGISLATURE.

WELL, THE CRAZY START DOES THAT REALLY EVEN MAT ARE NOW WITH PROPOSAL THREE AND IN THE LAW OF THE LAND.

BUT I DON'T DISAGREE WITH YOU.

THINK THAT YOU OH, I REMEMBER A FELLA I AM SURE YOU KNOW THE NAME A GUY THE NAME OF RONALD REAGAN.

HE HAS A THIS RY YOU HE IF YOU HAVE A PURITY TEST THAT IS NOT A GOOD THING.

BECAUSE WHAT IF WE AGREE ON 90 OR 90% BUT ONE THING WE DISAGREE ON.

THEN I BELIEVE THAT IS, I CAN'T PROVE THIS.

BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT HURT ME IN MY RACE BECAUSE I DID TAKE A MORE MODERATE CHANCE I AM SURE THERE WAS PRO LIFE PEOPLE WHO SAID I AM NOT VOTING FOR JACK WELL WE AGREE ON 80-90!

IF YOU ARE GOING TO VOTE AGAINST ME OR NOT FOR ANSWER ONE BECAUSE OF ONE ISSUE THEN, THEN THAT IS WHERE YOU NEED TO BOND HORIZONS A LITTLE BIT TO UNWHY STAN THE GAME IS BIGGER THAN THAT BECAUSE RIGHT NOW.

THE PRO LIFE SIDE, GOD LOVE THEM.

AM A PRO LIFE GUY BUT I UNDERSTAND THERE NEEDS TO BE CHOICES BECAUSE UL MALTLY THAT DECISION WHEN I HAD A 50ISH-YEAR-OLD REPUBLICAN WOMAN TELL ME THAT AFTER THE SUPREME COURT CAME LG AND FELT LIKE A SECOND CLASS CITIZEN AND TELLS ME SOMETHING.

SO, WE HEAD TO TOW REALIZE WE DON'T AGREE ON EVERYTHING, RIGHT THEN SO WE NEED TO WE NEED TO OPEN OUR HORIZONS A LITTLE BIT.

>> YOU ARE POINTING TO THE FRICTION WITHIN THE PARTY AND OVERALL IN MICHIGAN RIGHT NOW.

BUT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE POISED TO LEAD THE PARTY ARE VOICING ALMOST EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE THOUGHTS AS YOU ARE.

WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT?

THERE IS ROOM FOR SOMEONE LOOK YOU IN THE PARTY THEY ARE NOT LISTENING TO YOU RIGHT NOW.

WELL, WELL, YOU ARE RIGHT.

YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW, I WANT TO BE CAREFUL HERE.

THIS IS JUST DISCUSSION RIGHT M WHAT THE HELL DO I KNOW?

BUT YOU KNOW I THINK THE PARTY IN A SAD SORT OF WHICH HAS TO BURN ITSELF DOWN SO WE CAN REBUILD IT.

IF YOU ARE NOT LISTENING, LOOK WHAT HAPPENED IN THIS LAST ELECTION?

MY PARTY.

THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO AGREED WITH YOU ON MANY THINGS BUT NOT ON EVERYTHING.

THAT COMES BACK TO THEIR PURITY TEST.

AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH ME 1 PUN PUN-YOU KNOW, THEN, YOU ARE NOT PART OF THIS PARTY, THEN, WHEN I WAS THE 103 THE NEW 103 I GOT ASKED ABOUT ABORTION AND I GOT ASKED JUMP AND SA SAID I THOUGHT TRUMP WAS GREAT GY.

YEAH.

GOOD POLICIES THEN THEN I DON'T CARE HE HAS GOT GOOD POLICIES HE IS A JERK.

THAT YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THE BATTLE FIELDS YOU ARE ON AND IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND ALL OF THE NUANCES IN THE YOU WILL NOT WIN.

AND UNTIL THE STATE PARTYING IF GURS THAT OUT.

WE ARE IN TROUBLE.

THEN GOING TO THE PARTY CONVENTION TO PICK A CHAIR WHO WOULD THE CANDIDATE BE?

>> I WOULDN'T WISH THAT ON ANYONE RIGHT NOW.

WITH, YOU GOT TO PICK SOMEBODY.

>> HE IS A GOOD GUY.

>> HE HAS GOT, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER THE CHANCES IN THAT CONVENTION WHERE THE TRUMP ELEMENT WILL DOMINATE IN THE YOU KNOW, ALL RIGHT.

ALL RIGHT.

PUT MY HAT ON PROBABLY NOT REAL GOOD.

THINK YOU WERE RIGHT ABOUT THE DEPERNO-SOLDANO TICKET, THAT IS PROBABLY THE ONE THAT HAS THE MOST.

YOU KNOW?

WHO KNOWS?

A LOT BETWEEN NOW AND FEBRUARY OR MARCH OR WHENEVER THE HECK IT IS.

ARE YOU FED UP WITH THE PARTY?

>> I AM FED UP WITH A BIG CHUNK OF MY PARTY.

I AM A REPUBLICAN.

AM A MODERATE REPUBLICAN.

WOE.

THERE YOU GO.

WHEN I FIRST CAME THOUGH STATE LEGISLATURE I CONSIDERED MYSELF A CONSERVATIVE.

WHEN I GOT THERE THERE IS WHOLE OTHER WING AND ANOTHER ANOTHER WING OF DEMOCRATS THAT ARE FAR LEFT.

SO BOY REASON OF THAT, ISOCON SELFTIVE REPUBLICAN I GUESS I AM NOW A MODERATE REPUBLICAN.

SO YEAH.

OUR PARTY YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE THIS THE PARTY REGROWS TY I WE ARE RAIN LOW WEB HERE AND WELL A COME BACK TO YOUR POUND WE GOT TO FIGURE OUT HOW THIS WORKS AND THIS GROUP THAT AND I KNOW I AM PROBABLY NOT MAKING MANY FRIENDS IN THIS CONVERSATION, BUT I AM CALLING A SPADE A SPADE.

THERE IS SMALL THINKERS THEY ARE NOT THINKING BIG.

>> CAN I?

I AM SORRY.

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT PURITY TESTS, AND THE PARTY AS ITS NOW.

HOW HAS THAT AFFECTED YOU PERSONALLY?

HAVE YOU BEEN CALL ADRIAN KNOW AND MARGIN AALIZED WITHIN YOUR OH OWN PARTY TO SOME EXTENT?

>> YEAH.

YEAH.

I ALMOST PUT UP A NEW FACEBOOK PICTURE OF A RHINO BUT I THOUGHT I SHOULDN'T DO THAT.

YOU NO?

HE STICKS AND STONES MAY BREAK MY BONES BUT NAME!

NAPES WILL NEVER HURT ME.

YOU KNOW?

IT IS STUPID.

IT BOTHERS ME A LITTLE BIT.

OBVIOUSLY.

AND WHEN PEOPLE JUST WON'T LISTEN TO ANY OTHER POINT OF VIEW, IT IS VERY, VERY FRUSTRATING BUT I WILL SAY THIS, GUYS.

BASS I AM ON THE GROUND HERE.

YOU KNOW?

IF YOU GO BACK TO THE 2020 ELECTION.

YOU KNOW SHALL IT IS 50-50.

WAS IT STOLEN?

WHERE ARE WE AT NOT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT ARE IN THAT GROUP THAT ARE YOU MO, FOREVER TRUMPERS THEN, THAT ARE THE ELECTION WAS STOLEN, THAT YOU OH, WHATEVER.

IT IS SHRINKING THEN RIGHT NOW.

I THINK THAT IT IS, NO HE, IF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT 1 HP00% OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY.

IT IS A SMALLER PERCENTAGE MAYBE AT ONE POINT YOU KNOW, IT WAS THE VAST MAJORITY BECAUSE NOBODY KNEW WAS GOING ON AND MAYBE 10 TO 20P NOW AND UNFORT GNAT LE MOST VOCAL YOU KNOW?

THEN YOU KNOW IN A RAISEY SORT OF A WAY THEY ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING BUT NOT JUST NOT PAYING ATTENTION TO THE GREATER WORLD AROUND THEM.

>> WELL I HOPE THERE IS NOT ANY OBJECTION TO CHANGING TRACK A LITTLE BIT BUZZ FOR FROM YOUR PERCH ON THE HOUSE TRANSPORTATION COMMITTEE.

WHAT SHOULD MICHIGAN BE LOOKING AT IN TERMS OF THE FUTURE OF TRANSPORTATION FUNDING?

I AM ONE OF THOSE OWNERS AND I LOVE NOT PAYING ANY FUEL TACKS BUT THAT IS NOT A SUSTAINABLE SYSTEM FOR MAKING SURE THAT OUR ROADS ARE TAKING CARE OF AND APPROVED.

WELL, UNWITH EFP THIS IS AND THANK FOR BRINGING THAT UP.

BECAUSE AS CHAIR, I SPENT FOUR YEARS LEARNING ABOUT YOU KNOW THE WHOLE FROM WHAT IT TAKES TO BUILD A ROAD TO YOUR POINT OF WHERE ARE HEADED?

THE GAS TAX MODEL IS DELOOING ONE.

THEN EVEN IF GAS DOESN'T GO AWAY THEN WITH HYBRID THEN HIGHER EFFICIENCY VEHICLE THE AT OF MONEY WE COLLECT AT THE PUMP IS GOING TO DECLINE AND ALREADY STARTED SOD THE QUESTION IS -- THEN HOW TO GOY LIKE YOU WHO HAS THAT EV AND HOW DO WE GET FUNDS TO PAY FOR THE ROADS EN, HEN, THE REGISTRATION FEE IS NICE BUT ITS REALLY PROBABLY NOT THE BEST SITUATION AND YOU OH, IN LONG TERM, THEN, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE WHO SAY, OH, LIKE YOU KNOW, 2030 WE ARE ALL EV THAT IS PROBABLY NOT GOING TO HAPPEN IT COULD.

BUT YOU KNOW, EIGHT TO TEN YEARS OUT THAT IS FAR TO KNOW WHERE WE REGOING TO BE WITH TECH HOL LE IF I THEN I THINK THERE ARE MULTIPLE WAYS TO RAISE THE FUNDS TO TO PAY FOR OUR ROADS DO YOU FAVOR MILES DRIVEN?

>> THAT IS THE ONE THAT MAKES THE MOST SENSE.

VEHICLE MIKELE MILES TRAVELED WE CAN DO IT.

THEY DON'T, THERE IS WAYS TO DO IT WHERE THEY DON'T KNOW THAT YOU WENT THE CASINO THEN THE LIQUOR STORE AND WHEREVER.

YOU KNOW?

DO IT DID ANONYMOUSLY LET'S DO IT.

THERE IS OTHER STATES THAT HAVE DONE IT OTHER STATES THAT ARE STUDYING IT.

AND I THINK THAT IS JUST EASIERIST WAY TO GO.

CHARMING STATION?

>> HE, IF YOU WITH ARE DOING IT FOR MILES TRAVELED I DON'T KNOW IF WE NED TO DO THAT BECAUSE WE'LL JUST BE ABLE TO CALCULATE HOW MANY MIMES YOU DRIVE THEN, IN AND WAY WE GO.

SO THE OTHER QUESTION IS, CHARGING AT THE STATION, THEN MY HUNCH IS PROBABLY HAS HOME CHARGER AND HOW DO WITH HE CHARGE.

>> THAT WAS MEAN.

REPRESENTATIVE QUICKLY BETWEEN YOU AND RY ARE YOU GOING TO SEE I AM GOOD FRIENDS.

I KNOW WHERE HE HIDE HIS SUIT.

WHERE WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO GIVE ME?

[LAUGHTER] >> I GOT A WHOLE TRUCK LOAD OF COAL FOR YOU PURCHASE ROTHER.

[LAUGHTER] ON THAT JOYOUS HOLIDAY NOTE, MR. O'MALLEY GREAT WORKING WITH YOU AND KEEP US POSTED ALL RIGHT BUDDY.

>> WILL DO.

THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME ON.

ALL RIGHT.

>> SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

DON'T FORGET OUR EVENING WITH THE GOVERNOR PROGRAM IS GOING TO BE TAPED NEXT WEEK AND RIGHT HERE ON MICHIGAN PUBLIC TV SEE YOU THERE.

BIBOY.

BYE-BYE.

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