WELCOME TO "AMANPOUR & CO." HERE'S WHAT'S COMING UP.

THE U.S. UPS ITS PRESSURE ON ISRAEL TO PROTECT CIVILIAN LIVES.

I GET A REPORT ON THE GROWING DESPAIR IN GAZA.

AND TALK TO NOT A ISRAELI ANALYST AND PALESTINIAN ACTIVIST ABOUT THE HARD WORK OF MAKING PEACE.

THEN CASSANDRO JOINS ME ON HIS TRANSFORMATION TO THE GAY WRESTLER WHO CHANGED LUCHA.

PLUS THE "WASHINGTON POST" REPORTERS TALK ABOUT THE MOST SIGNIFICANT LEAKS IN HISTORY.

>>> "AMANPOUR & COMPANY" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- THE ANDERSON FAMILY FUND.

JIM ATTWOOD AND LESLIE WILLIAMS.

CANDACE KING WEIR.

THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LAYLA AND MICKI STRAUSS.

SETON, CHARLES ROSENBLUM.

COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG.

ADDITIONAL SUPPORT PROVIDED BY THESE FUNDERS AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU, THANK YOU.

>> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, EVERYONE.

I'M IN NEW YORK SITTING IN FOR CHRISTIANE AMMANPOUR.

PRESIDENT BIDEN'S LATEST MESSAGE TO PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, A CLEAR SIGN HE'S GROWING MORE AND MORE VOCAL AND B THE MOUNTING CIVILIAN DEATH TOLL.

TO DRIVE HOME THE URGENCY, THE NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER JAKE SULLIVAN WAS DISPATCHED TO THE REGION TASKED WITH WALKING THAT TRICKY LINE OF SUPPORTING ITS ALLY ISRAEL, BUT ALSO TRYING TO REIN IT IN.

>> WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF A HIGH INTENSITY PHASE WITH MILITARY OPERATIONS IN BOTH THE NORTHERN HALF AND THE SOUTHERN HALF OF GAZA.

BUT THERE WILL BE A TRANSITION TO ANOTHER PHASE OF THIS WAR.

ONE THAT IS FOCUSED IN MORE PRECISE WAYS IN TARGETING THE LEADERSHIP.

WE'RE NOT HERE TO TELL ANYBODY, YOU MUST DO X, YOU MUST DO Y.

WE ARE HERE TO SAY THIS IS OUR PERSPECTIVE AS YOUR PARTNER AND FRIEND.

THIS IS WHAT WE BELIEVE IS THE BEST WAY TO ACHIEVE YOUR TACTICAL AND STRATEGIC GOALS.

>> WHILE WASHINGTON IS EAGER TO SEE A MORE PRECISE PHASE OF THE WAR, THERE IS NO TELLING WHEN THAT COULD BE.

IN GAZA, SHEER AGONY AND HOPELESSNESS ARE BURSTING INTO PLAIN VIEW AS PARENTS STRUGGLE TO TAKE CARE OF THEIR CHILDREN.

JOMANA KARADSHEH BRINGS US THIS REPORT AND A WARNING, SOME OF THESE IMAGES ARE GRAPHIC.

>> Reporter: THESE ARE THE DESPERATE CRIES OF A FATHER LEFT WITH NOTHING BUT HIS VOICE.

A FATHER WHO CAN NO LONGER PROTECT HIS THREE VULNERABLE CHILDREN.

I CAN'T SURVIVE.

THEY DESTROYED MY HOUSE, HE SAYS.

I CAN'T GET FOOD.

I HAVE NO ONE TO SUPPORT ME.

I SPEND THE NIGHT MOVING FROM TENT TO TENT.

FOR MORE THAN 60 DAYS, HE'S TRIED TO STAY STRONG.

UNTIL HE COULD NO MORE.

HIS DISABLED CHILDREN HOMELESS, HUNGRY, HURTING FROM GAZA'S WAR.

WHAT DO YOU DO WHEN YOUR CHILD NEEDS YOU?

WHEN YOU HAVE GOT NOTHING LEFT TO GIVE.

HAVE MERCY ON US, HE SAYS.

NO MERCY FOR THE PEOPLE OF THIS BESIEGED LAND, IT SEEMS.

BRING A BLESSING, THEY SAY.

NOW IT ONLY BRINGS MORE DESPAIR.

FOR THOSE FORCED OUT OF THEIR HOMES, LIFE HAS BECOME THIS MISERABLE EXISTENCE AS THE FLOODS IN THE CAMPS AND THE HARSH WINTER IS ONLY JUST BEGINNING.

SHE SHOWS US THE TINY TENT SHE LIVES IN WITH 11 OTHERS, HER TWO DAUGHTERS AND GRANDCHILDREN.

SHE SPENT THE NIGHT TRYING TO CATCH THE RAIN THATDRIPPED THROUGH THEIR ROOF IN THE FLIMSY SHELTER.

THIS IS HUMILIATION, SHE SAYS.

I HAVE THESE CHILDREN WITHOUT A FATHER.

I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE.

EVEN CHILDREN NOW HATE LIFE, SHE SAYS.

IT'S JUST TOO MUCH FOR PARENTS TO BEAR WHEN YOU CANNOT EVEN KEEP YOUR CHILDREN DRY, WARM AND CLEAN AS DISEASES START TO SPREAD AND THE AID THEY SO BADLY NEED, NOW A WEAPON IN THIS WAR.

I WANT TO PROTECT MY CHILDREN, THIS MOTHER SAYS.

THE BOMBINGS AND DESTRUCTION ARE NOT ENOUGH.

ON TOP OF THAT, WE HAVE THE RAIN, COLD, AND ILLNESSES.

TO BE A PARENT IN GAZA IS A BLESSING TURNED INTO TORTURE FOR THOSE WHO NO LONGER WONDER IF BUT HOW THEY AND THEIR CHILDREN WILL DIE.

HE SAYS HE WAS SITTING, THINKING OF HOW HE'LL FEED HIS CHILDREN WHEN AN AIRSTRIKE HITS.

WHERE DO I TAKE MY CHILDREN, HE SAYS.

I FLED AND CAME HERE TO DIE.

I GAVE MY CHILDREN MY EVERYTHING.

WHO WILL TAKE CARE OF THEM IF I DIE?

LIKE MANY IN GAZA, IT'S NOT ONLY ISRAEL THEY BLAME.

THEY WANT HAMAS TO STOP A WAR FOR WHICH THEY PAID THE PRICE.

ABANDONED, ALONE AS THE WORLD WON'T STOP THEIR PAIN.

6-YEAR-OLD LANA WAS UNDER THE RUBBLE OF HER HOME FOR THREE DAYS.

MOMMY AND DADDY ARE UNDERNEATH IT, SHE SAYS.

I JUST WANT MAMA.

I WANT BABA.

I WANT MY FAMILY, SHE CRIES.

TO BE A PARENT IN GAZA IS TO LIVE IN THE FEAR OF THIS.

THAT YOU NO LONGER ARE THERE WHEN THEY NEED YOU THE MOST.

>> SO DIFFICULT TO WATCH.

AS FIGHTING CONTINUES IN GAZA, THE ULTIMATE IMPACT OF THE WAR ON MIDDLE EAST POLITICS IS UNCLEAR.

THE FAILURES OF CURRENT LEADERS ARE MANIFEST.

WILL THERE BE A CHALG OF THE OLD GUARD?

ISRAEL PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU IS LOSING POPULARITY.

IN THE WEST BANK, ACCORDING TO PSR POLLING, PUBLIC OPINION IS TURNING SHARPLY AGAINST PALESTINIAN PRESIDENT MAHMOUD ABBAS AND SUPPORT FOR HAMAS, MEANTIME, IS SURGING.

GAZA RESIDENTS WHO LIVE WITH HAMAS ARE MORE CRITICAL, HOWEVER.

SO HOW WILL THE LEADERSHIP CRISIS BE RESOLVED?

WHAT IMPACT WOULD NEW LEADERSHIP HAVE ON EFFORTS TO MAKE PEACE?

NIVINE SANDOUKA WITH MIDDLE EAST PEACE SAYS IT WON'T COME FROM THE TOP DOWN.

JOINING HER IS FORMER KNESSET MEMBER KSENIA SVETKIVA WHO IS A MEMBER OF THE ALLIANCE.

I'M SO GLAD TO SEE YOU SITTING THERE TOGETHER TALKING TO US ABOUT THIS REALLY CRITICAL MOMENT IN THE REGION DURING THIS WAR AS YOU SEE JAKE SULLIVAN, NATIONAL SECURITY VILESOR, MEETING WITH ISRAELI OFFICIALS YESTERDAY IN THE WEST BANK, TODAY.

LET ME ASK YOU FIRST.

WHAT IS THE REACTION IN ISRAEL OF WHAT APPEARS TO BE A GROWING RIFT BETWEEN ISRAEL AND ITS CLOSEST ALLY, THE UNITED STATES?

NOT ON THE CONTEXT OF GOING AFTER HAMAS, BUT HOW IT IS BEING PURSUED, AND MORE SPECIFICALLY, WHAT THE DAY AFTER LOOKS LIKE?

>> WELL, I CAN TELL YOU, FIRST OF ALL, THERE IS AN ORGANIZATION THAT ISRAEL WILL HAVE TO END THE ACTIVE PHASE OF ITS MILITARY OPERATION IN GAZA IN A FEW WEEKS' TIME.

I CANNOT TELL YOU WHETHER IT IS FOUR WEEKS OR SIX WEEKS BUT THE CLOCK IS TICKING AND IT IS CLEAR TO JUST ABOUT EVERYONE.

AND WHILE THE RIFT BETWEEN THE U.S. AND ISRAEL IS WIDENING, I THINK THAT THE CAMP OF THOSE IN ISRAEL WHO WERE CRITICAL BEFORE THE WAR IN GAZA OF THE PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU AND THE DECISIONS THAT HE MAKES, THEY BECOME IMPATIENT AND THERE IS GROWING ANGER AGAINST HIM.

THE UNITED STATES RIGHT NOW IS THE ONLY COUNTRY THAT OPENLY SUPPORTS AND SUPPORTS IN EVERY INTERNATIONAL ORGANIZATION OF ISRAEL AND THE CONTINUATION OF THIS UNFORTUNATELY NEEDED MILITARY OPERATION.

SO IN THIS REGARD, I THINK THAT WE WILL SEE MOUNTING PRESSURE ON NETANYAHU.

NOT ONLY FROM HIS, FROM PEOPLE WHO USUALLY CRITICIZE HIM FROM THE CAMP OF THOSE WHO PROTESTED AGAINST HIM FOR THE LAST YEAR.

AND EVEN MORE.

BUT ALSO FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE VERY REALISTIC ABOUT EVERYTHING FROM HIS OWN CAMP, FROM THE LIKUD PARTY, THERE IS A LOT OF DISSENT AND UNDERSTANDING THAT HE IS RUINING ISRAEL FOR HIS OWN GOOD, FOR HIS OWN NARROW POLITICAL INTERESTS.

>> WE ARE HEARING FROM WAR CABINET MEMBERS WHO SPOKE OUT THIS WEEK AGAINST NETANYAHU AND THAT, QUOTE, THERE ARE THOSE WHO ARE ENGAGED IN CREATING FAKE DISPUTES IN THE NATION AND HARMING THE IMPORTANT RELATIONS WITH THE UNITED STATES, SUGGESTING THAT NETANYAHU IS MORE FOCUSED ON HIS POLITICAL FUTURE THAN THE FUTURE AND WELLBEING OF THE COUNTRY.

NIVINE, LET ME ASK BUT THE MEETINGS BETWEEN JAKE SULLIVAN AND THE P.A.

AS NOTED IN THE INTRODUCTION, SUPPORT FOR MAHMOUD ABBAS HAS SHARPLY DECLINED.

NOT ONLY DUE TO THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT'S ATTEMPTS TO KEEP THEM THAT WAY, AND TO LOWER THEIR HOLD OVER THE REGION, BUT ALSO, INTERNALLY AMONGST THOSE IN THE WEST BANK WHO SAY THEY HAVE LOST FAITH WITH THEIR LEADERSHIP.

THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE A CHANGING OF THE GUARD.

SO WITH THAT IN MIND, DO YOU SEE ANY PRODUCTIVE NEWS OR HEADLINES COMING OUT OF MEETING WITH JAKE SULLIVAN AND CURRENT LEADERSHIP OF THE >> I THINK THERE IS BOTH THE P.A.

AND THE AMERICAN ADMINISTRATION IN GENERAL, ALL AGREE THE P.A., THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY, NEEDS TO BE REVIVED.

THE BIG QUESTION IS HOW IT WILL BE REVIVED AND WHO IS THE NEXT PALESTINIAN PRESIDENT?

AND THE GOOD THING IS THAT SINCE THERE IS THIS AGREEMENT WITHIN THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY AND THE AMERICAN ADMINISTRATION, IT KIND OF GIVES HOPE TO THE PALESTINIANS AMIDST THIS DESPAIR THAT WE ARE LIVING AS PALESTINIANS THESE DAYS.

THE LACK OF SOURCES FOR THE PALESTINIANS, WHAT IS HAPPENING IN GAZA.

ALL OF THOSE GIVE US A LOT OF DESPAIR.

BUT IF THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY WILL ACTUALLY BE WILLING TO REVIVE AND AT LEAST NOMINATE ANOTHER LEADER, THAT WILL GIVE US HOPE FOR A NEGOTIATED AGREEMENT WITH ISRAELIS.

>> AND THAT'S A BIG IF.

WE SAW HIM GIVE AN INTERVIEW YESTERDAY, USING THE DIPLOMATIC SPEAK WHEN ASKED DIRECTLY ABOUT THE DISAGREEMENTS BETWEEN WHAT THE DAY AFTER LOOKS LIKE WITH NETANYAHU PUBLICLY DECLARING THAT IT WON'T INCLUDE FATAH AND THE UNITED STATES SAYING THAT IT SEES LEADERSHIP OF BOTH THE WEST BANK AND GAZA UNDER THE P.A.

HE TALKS ABOUT THIS AND WITHOUT DIRECTLY GOING AFTER NETANYAHU.

TAKE A LISTEN TO WHAT EM.

>> LOOK, I CAN'T OBVIOUSLY SPEAK FOR THE PRIME MINISTER.

WHAT I CAN DO IS ON BEHALF OF PRESIDENT BIDEN, LAY OUT HOW WE LOOK AT THIS ISSUE.

THE WAY WE LOOK IT A IS THAT ULTIMATELY, GOVERNANCE OF THE WEST BANK AND GAZA NEEDS TO BE CONNECTED AND IT NEEDS TO BE CONNECTED UNDER A REVAMPED AND REVITALIZED PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY.

>> WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

THAT'S SOMETHING THAT REQUIRES INTENSIVE CONSULTATIONS WITH THE PALESTINIANS FIRST, AS WELL AS WITH THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT.

IT WILL REQUIRE A REFORM.

IT WILL REQUIRE AN UPDATING OF HOW THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY APPROACHES GOVERNANCE.

>> THAT SOUNDS QUITE AMBITIOUS AT THIS POINT.

IS THIS SOMETHING THAT CAN BE ACHIEVED WITH THE CURRENT GOVERNMENT IN PLACE?

NETANYAHU PERHAPS HIMSELF SAYING SOMETHING PUBLICLY AND ACTING DIFFERENTLY BEHIND CLOSED DOORS, GIVEN THE U.S. PRESSURE, OR WILL IT REQUIRE A NEW ISRAELI GOVERNMENT TO REALLY SEE SOME OF THIS IMPLEMENTED?

>> THIS RADICAL RIGHT WING GOVERNMENT WILL NOT ALLOW SPACE FOR NETANYAHU FOR ANY KIND OF CONSULTATIONS, NEGOTIATIONS, DELIBERATIONS.

ALL OF THIS IS IRRELEVANT TO THE EXTREME ONES THAT HE DECIDED TO BUILD A GOVERNMENT WITH.

THERE WILL BE NO PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY.

THERE WILL BE NO FATAH.

AND I'M TELLING YOU, THIS IS, IT IS A DAY DREAM THAT HE TRIES TO SELL TO SOME PEOPLE IN HIS CAMP THAT ARE NAIVE ENOUGH TO BELIEVE THAT THERE COULD BE SOME KIND OF SOLUTION THAT WILL EXCLUDE THE AUTHENTIC LEADERSHIP OF THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE WHO IS RECOGNIZED BY THE WHOLE WORLD, WHICH IS OF COURSE, THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY.

ANYBODY WHO WILL RIGHT NOW TRY TO IMAGINE SOME FOREIGN FORM OF LEADERSHIP GOVERNMENT WHATSOEVER, PEACE KEEPING FORCE THAT WILL JUST LAND FROM, I DON'T KNOW, OUTER SPACE AND WILL GOVERN THIS PLACE THAT NOBODY REALLY WANTS BUT THE PALESTINIANS THEMSELVES.

HE IS DAYDREAMING AND HE'S LYING.

HE'S LYING TO THE ISRAELIS, FIRST OF ALL.

IT IS TIME THESE WORDS WERE ACTUALLY UTTERED BY THE ADVISER FOR NATIONAL SECURITY TO THE GOVERNMENT IN, AS LATE AS, I BELIEVE, THE BEGINNING OF NOVEMBER.

HE SAID IN HIS OWN WORDS, THERE IS A NEED FOR PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY TO BE REINSTATED IN GAZA STRIP.

WE KNOW THAT IT HAS ISSUES BUT THERE IS NO OTHER WAY.

WITH THIS GOVERNMENT, I DO NOT SEE ANY WAY TO MOVE FORWARD.

THIS GOVERNMENT IS UNABLE TO GIVE THE ADEQUATE RESPONSE TO THE GREAT CHALLENGES OF THIS WAR, OF THE DANGERS, YOU KNOW, OF THE STATE OF ISRAEL.

I THINK IT IS QUITE CLEAR.

PEOPLE DO NOT BELIEVE ANYMORE THE HEAD OF STATE AND THE GOVERNMENT.

>> I'M SURE YOU'VE SEEN THIS NEW POLL THAT'S GETTING A LOT OF SUBSTANTIAL BY THE PALESTINIAN CENTER FOR POLICY AND SURVEY RESEARCH SHOWING A STRONG MAJORITY BELIEVE HAMAS WAS CORRECT TO LAUNCH THE OCTOBER 7th ATTACKS.

THAT'S 72%.

A PORTION OF PEOPLE HAD A SUPPORT THE ARMED STRUGGLE AS THE MOST EFFECTIVE MEANS AGAINST THE OCCUPATION ROSE 10% FROM SEPTEMBER TO NOW 63%.

AND MOST INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, AND ALARMING, IS THAT SUPPORT FOR HAMAS HAS INCREASED SIGNIFICANTLY.

ESPECIALLY IN THE WEST BANK.

NOT AS MUCH IN THE GAZA STRIP, GIVEN WHAT WE'RE SEEING WHAT DO YOU READ INTO IT?

>> LET'S REMEMBER IT DIDN'T HAPPEN IN A VACUUM.

IT HAPPENED BECAUSE OF MORE THAN 50 YEARS OF OCCUPATION.

IT HAPPENED FOR MORE THAN 15 YEARS OF SIEGE.

AND THE PALESTINIANS ALL THIS TIME -- >> THAT DOESN'T EXCUSE IT.

>> NO.

THE PEOPLE SHOULD BE HELD RESPONSIBLE AS WELL.

BUT IF WE READ INTO THE STATISTICS THAT YOU RIGHTLY MENTIONED, IF YOU THINK WHY ARE THE PALESTINIANS IN THE WEST BANK HAVE A HIGH PERCENTAGE OF SUPPORT IN HAMAS, IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MAY NOT THEY WANT THE GOVERNMENT OR AN ISLAMIC STATE TO BE THE FUTURE PALESTINIAN STATE.

YOU NEED TO READ INTO THE PSYCHOLOGY OF THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE AT THIS STAGE.

THE PSYCHOLOGY IS SAYING THAT WHAT IS HAPPENING IN GAZA WITH ALL THESE CALLS FOR DISPLACEMENT AND BECOMING REFUGEES ACTUALLY BRINGS BACK TO THE PSYCHOLOGY OF THE PALESTINIAN, THE CATASTROPHE OF 1948.

AND IF YOU SAY THAT, IF YOU LOOK AT WHO IS RATE NOW DEFENDING THE PALESTINIANS, THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY IS HELPLESS.

IT IS TALKING TO THE UNITED NATIONS.

IT IS TALKING TO OTHER GOVERNMENTS.

NOBODY IS TRYING, STOPPING THE OFFENSIVE IN GAZA AND IT SEEMS FOR THE PALESTINIAN, THE ONLY PARTY THAT IS ACTUALLY DEFENDING AND PREVENTING IT FROM HAPPENING IS HAMAS.

THAT'S WHY THE PSYCHOLOGY OF THE PALESTINIAN IN THE WEST BANK IS YES, LET US SUPPORT THEM.

THEY PRESENT THESE DAYS RESISTANCE TO THE OCCUPATION.

THAT DOES NOT NECESSARILY MAY NOT THAT THEY WANT ISLAMIC GOVERNMENT.

JUST ONE MORE STATISTIC THAT IS IMPORTANT.

IF HE RUNS AGAINST THIS MAN, WHICH MEANS REPRESENTING FATAH AND THIS MAN REPRESENTING HAMAS WILL WIN WHICH SHOWS THAT WE WANT A MODERATE PALESTINIAN STATE TO BE IN PLACE, RATHER THAN AN ISLAMIC STATE.

>> THERE WAS AN ANALYSIS TRYING TO BREAK DOWN THE RATIONALE BEHIND THIS POLLING.

AND IT SUGGESTED THAT LIKE IN ISRAEL, WHERE YOU'RE NOT SEEING AS MANY OF THE IMAGES OF THE DEVASTATION AND THE HUMANITARIAN CRISIS IN GAZA AS WE'RE SEEING THE REST OF THE WORLD.

THE SAME IMAGES AS TO WHAT HAPPENED.

THE TRAGEDY AND HORRORS OF ACT WHEN OCTOBER 7th WERE NOT RESONATING AND PLAYING IN THE WEST BANK.

DO YOU THINK THAT HAD AN IMPACT ON THE POLL NUMBERS?

AS YOU KNOW, HAMAS HAS SEEN A RISE IN POPULARITY BUT NOT AMONG THOSE IN GAZA.

>> YEAH.

I THINK IN GAZA THEY'RE PAYING THE HIGHEST PRICE.

WE SAW IT WITH CIVILIANS.

AND THEY ARE NOT ABLE TO PROTECT THE PEOPLE IN GAZA AND THEREFORE, THERE IS A DROP IN THE SUPPORT FOR HAMAS.

BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE WEST BANK SPECIFICALLY AGAIN AS I MENTIONED, THE HELPLESSNESS, THE LEVEL OF HELPLESSNESS THAT IS INCREASING, THAT IS ONE REASON FOR THE SUPPORT FOR HAMAS'S INCREASED POPULARITY.

>> JUST FROM A PSYCHOLOGICAL STANDPOINT, YOU SEE JUST THE TRAUMA THAT ISRAEL IS STILL DEALING WITH.

I TOUCHED ON THIS EARLIER ABOUT JUST NOT SEEING THE IMAGES OF WHAT IS HAPPENING IN GAZA, THE WAY THE REST OF THE WORLD IS SEEING.

ISRAEL IS DEALING WITH ITS OWN SHOCK AND ITS OWN TRAUMA.

HOSTAGES, OVER 100 STILL REMAINING THERE.

I'M JUST WONDERING, IS IT CONSTRUCTIVE AT ALL, TORN QUITE BLUNT, TO BE HAVING THESE CONVERSATIONS WITH PALESTINIANS, WITH ISRAELIS AT A MOMENT WHEN THERE IS STILL SO MUCH EMOTION?

THAT'S ONE ARGUMENT I'M HEARING, TOO.

>> UNFORTUNATELY, TOMORROW THAT EVERYBODY IS DISCUSSING, IT IS TODAY.

THERE IS NO TIME.

AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE QUESTION OF WHO WILL RUN GAZA, IT'S NOT A THEORETICAL DISCUSSION.

THIS IS NEXT MONTH.

THIS IS TODAY.

THE DISTRIBUTION OF HUMANITARIAN AID, THE SEWAGE, THE EDUCATION, THE RELIEF FOR THE REFUGEES, YOU KNOW, THE REBUILDING OF GAZA.

THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE CANNOT POSTPONE, UNFORTUNATELY.

I BRING IN THE ORIGINAL PERSPECTIVE IN THE ORGANIZATION.

THE ORIGINAL ORGANIZATION FOR PEACE AND SECURITY.

WE STRONGLY BELIEVE THE PALESTINIANS HAVE TRIED TO REACH A SOLUTION AND WE BELIEVE ONLY INTEGRATION IN OUR REGION, IN THE MIDDLE EAST, WHICH WE ARE PART OF, AND BOTH THE NATIONS WERE SECLUDED FOR REASONS IN THE PAST.

BUT THERE IS NO PLACE FOR THIS TODAY.

TODAY THE CONVERSATION SHOULD BE LED BY THE REGION ITSELF.

AND WE JUST HEARD THIS WEEK.

IN THE "WALL STREET JOURNAL" THE IRAQI MINISTER SAID THERE IS NO WAY THAT THE COUNTRIES WILL BE INVOLVED IF THERE WILL BE NO ISRAELI OBLIGATION TO THE TWO-STATE SOLUTION.

IT MEANS THERE IS A TRI-LATERAL DISCUSSION THAT SHOULD BE HELD WITH THE SUPPORT AND HAD THAT OF THE AMERICANS AND THE EUROPEANS.

BUT THERE IS NO WAY TO LEAVE IT IN THE BILATERAL LEVEL TODAY.

AND THERE IS ALSO NO LUXURY OF DEALING WITH THIS TOMORROW WHEN WE FEEL BETTER.

WE ARE SUFFERING FROM POST TRAUMA LIKE WE DID AFTER THE SECOND INTERFADDA.

IT DOESN'T MEAN WE CAN FORGET ABOUT IT AND FOR NOW CONCENTRATE ON THE PAINFUL.

>> THE CONSENSUS APPEARS TO BE THERE WILL BE NO PEACE, NO SOLUTION, UNTIL BOTH ISRAELIS AND PALESTINIANS HAVE HOMES OF THEIR OWN, SIDE BY SIDE IN PEACE.

THANK YOU BOTH SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING YOU'RE DOING DURING THESE TURBULENT TIME IN MAIN DETAINING YOUR WORK TOGETHER AS WELL.

I KNOW IT IS VERY IMPORTANT.

>>> UP NEXT, TO BRIDGE BUILDING OF ANOTHER SORT.

IN MEXICO, LUCHA LIBRE, HOME GROWN PROFESSIONAL WRESTLING, IS WILDLY POPULAR.

LUCHADORES ARE SUPER STARS.

ENTER CASSANDRO WHOSE REAL NAME PERFORMS IN DRAG.

AND DOING SO, IT RISES TO INTERNATIONAL STARDOM BREAKING CULTURAL TABOOS EVERY STEP OF THE WAY.

GAEL GARCIA BERNAL HAS WRAPPED UP A LONG LIST OF LEADING ROLE.

I SPOKE TO HIM ABOUT CAPTURING THE ATHLETICISM AND THE INNER LIFE OF TODAY SAND, CASSANDRO.

>> THE MOVIE CASSANDRO, I'VE LEARNED SO MUCH.

FIRST TELL US ABOUT THE WORLD OF LUCHA LIBRE.

>> IT BECAMAL PHENOMENON IN THE 20th CENTURY.

IT GOES BACK TO THE 19th CENTURY.

SO I GREW UP WITH A REVAMPING OF THE LOOMPA LIBRE.

IT STARTED TO GET TELEVISED IN MEXICO.

I GREW UP WITH THEM.

THE AMAZING WRESTLERS, AND I USED TO LOVE WATCHING THAT.

WATCHING THE LUCHA LIBRE.

>> SO WE LEARNED ABOUT IT.

AND WE LEARNED ABOUT THE EXOTICO ELEMENT.

WALK US THROUGH THAT.

>> THE EXOTICOS HAVE BEEN THERE A LONG, LONG TIME.

IT WAS IN THE '90s THAT CASSANDRO AND OTHER EXOTICOS, THEY KIND OF SUBVERT OR ACCOMPANY, THE THE TODAY LISTS OF A CHANGE THAT SOCIETY WAS GOING THROUGH.

IT INCORPORATED THE EXOTICOS INTO THE MAIN TITLES OF THE LUCHA LIBRE.

SO THEY STARTED TO WIN.

THEY STARTED TO BECOME VERY PROMINENT AND PEOPLE STARTED TO LOVE WATCHING THEM WRESTLE.

>> AND THEY WERE CHEERING FOR THAT.

THESE WERE THE PEOPLE THAT PEOPLE WERE HOPING WOULD WIN AND WERE AIMING FOR.

AND YOUR CHARACTER AT THE BEGINNING, HOW DOES HE EVOLVE INTO CASSANDRO?

>> THAT'S SOMETHING THAT ALL WRESTLERS GO THROUGH.

MAYBE IT'S LIKE A LITTLE BIT LIKE A PLAY ABOUT THE CHARACTERS FINDING THEMSELVES, YOU KNOW.

ALL WRESTLERS START OUT WITH A KIND OF A CONCEPT.

MOST OF THE TIME IT DOESN'T WORK THE FIRST TIME.

SO MY CHARACTER, THE ONE THEY INTERPRET SAUL, HE COMES UP WITH A CHARACTER TO WRESTLE AND THIS MUST BE THE FOURTH OR FIFTH TIME THAT HE'S TRYING AND NOTHING WORKS.

NOTHING PUTS IT TOGETHER.

WE CAME UP WITH THAT IDEA.

LET'S CALL THIS GUY THE MOLE.

AND HE GOES INTO, AND INKORMTS THE EXOTICO PERSONA THAT IS INCREDIBLY FLAMBOYANT AND TRIES THROUGH THAT CHARACTER TO FIND THE CHARACTER THAT CONNECTS WITH PEOPLE AND IT DOES.

>> AND WE'LL TALK ABOUT SAUL'S RELATIONSHIP WITH BOTH HIS MOTHER AND HIS FATHER.

ESPECIALLY HIS MOTHER IN PARTICULAR IS QUITE BEAUTIFUL.

WE HAVE A CLIP OF CASSANDRO'S DEBUT.

>> THIS IS A LIFE-CHANGING MOMENT.

A LIGHT BULB GOES OFF WHEN HE SEES WHAT HE CAN DO BUT ALSO THE SPECTATOR'S RESPONSE TO THE PERFORMANCE.

>> YEAH.

A LOT CHANGED WHERE THE PARTICIPANT OF THIS KIND OF CHANGE, PEOPLE STARTED TO, LUCHA LIBRE BECAME A CONTACT SPORT.

PERHAPS THE ONLY ONE I CAN THINK OF.

I'M HERE TO BE CORRECTED ALSO, BUT I CAN'T THINK OF A CONTACT SPORT THAT HAS OPENLY GAY ATHLETES COMPETING.

SO LUCHA LIBRE, BECAUSE OF ITS THEATRICAL PART, WAS ABLE TO THE NOT SUSTAIN THOSE MAYBE SUPERFICIAL DEFINITIONS OF WHAT IS SEXUALITY OR SEXUAL ORIENTATION.

KIND OF LIKE STARTED TO INCORPORATE THEM WITH A MUCH MORE EASINESS AND FLOW AND ALSO, CARING FOR THAT, TAKING EVERYONE INTO CONSIDERATION.

SO YEAH, AFTER THIS MOVIE, I'M EVEN MORE PROUD OF LUCHA LIBRE AND LATCHA LIBRE MEXICO.

IT'S A GREAT SHOW.

>> YOU ADDRESS SO MANY FAFACETS.

HIS OWN RELATIONSHIP WITH HIS SEXUALITY AND WITH ANOTHER MAN WHO HE CAN'T FULLY CALL HIS OWN, WHO HAS A SEPARATE LIFE.

TALK ABOUT THE CHALLENGES IN GIVING ENOUGH ATTENTION AND ENOUGH DEPTH TO ALL OF THESE DIFFERENT RELATIONSHIPS WHILE TELLING THE VIEWERS ABOUT THIS SPORT.

>> IN THE CASE OF THE MOTHER, THE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE MOTHER AND HIS LOVER, BOYFRIEND, IT WAS MORE LIKE A SECRET.

A SECRET, YOU KNOW.

SO IN THE FILM YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE IS SEVERAL DUALITIES.

IT HAPPENS AT THE BORDER WHERE YOU HAVE TO PLAY THAT.

YOU'RE IN TOUCH WITH THAT DUALITY.

YOU'RE CROSSING THE BORDER ALL THE TIME.

AND THAT CREATES A VERY PARTICULAR CULTURE.

>> YOUR CHARACTER IS FROM EL PASO.

>> HE'S FROM EL PASO.

>> CROSSING THE BORDER.

>> IT'S LIKE PEOPLE ON THE BORDER CROSS BACK AND FORTH ALL THE TIME BECAUSE THEY HAVE FAMILY OR WORK OR WHATEVER IN DIFFERENT SIDES.

AND THEY HAVE TO IGNORE THAT STUPID WALL THAT EXISTS THERE IN ORDER TO, WELL, IGNORE IS THE WRONG WORD.

>> IT'S AN OBSTACLE.

>> THEY HAVE TO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE THE WALL TO COME BACK AND FORTH.

IF YOU REALLY TAKE THAT WALL INTO CONSIDERATION, IF YOU STEP A LITTLE ASIDE AND YOU SEE THAT WALL, YOU CAN'T LIVE WITH THAT HORRENDOUS IMPOSITION THAT IS THERE.

IT IS SO RIDICULOUS.

IT TRIES TO STOP PEOPLE FROM CROSSING FROM ONE SIDE TO THE OTHER.

SO CASSANDRO'S SAUL, THE CHARACTER, IS USED TO THIS DUALITY.

TO PLAY THE DIFFERENT ROLES DEPENDING ON WHERE HE IS.

WITH HIS BOYFRIEND AND WITH HIS MOTHER.

HE ALWAYS PLAYS THIS SECRET LIFE, YOU KNOW.

YES, VERY, VERY LOVING AND VERY SUPPORTIVE.

BUT IT IS A SECRET.

IT CAN'T BE KNOWN, YOU KNOW?

SO CASSANDRO IS KIND OF THE DETONATOR FOR ALL THAT.

DOESN'T WANT TO BE IN SECRET ANYMORE.

AND THAT WAS NICE TO WALK THAT PATH.

AND LIVE THAT AND PORTRAY THAT.

>> CASSANDRO WAS A REALLY PERSON.

A BY AOGRAPHER I INTERVIEWED ONCE SAID HE WILL ONLY UNDERSTAND PEOPLE HE CAN UNDERSTAND AT THE END OF THE DAY WHAT WAS INSIDE THEIR CORE, HAD A THEY WERE.

AS SOMEONE WHO HAS PLAYED REAL LIFE CHARACTERS IN THE PAST IN OTHER FILMS, DO YOU FEEL LIKE YOU HAVE TO ACHIEVE THAT YOURSELF IN ORDER TO REALLY GET THIS CHARACTER RIGHT?

>> WITH CASSANDRO IT'S DIFFERENT.

IT'S SAUL.

HE CREATED A CHARACTER IN ORDER TO, A CHARACTER WHO IS NOT HIMSELF.

THIS CHARACTER IS VERY OPEN, DEPENDING ON THE MOMENT.

THAT HAPPENED WHEN I PLAYED, WHEN HE WAS A KID, I UNDERSTOOD HIS LIFE'S JOURNEY.

ACTING IN IT ALLOWED ME TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY WENT THROUGH.

WHAT THEY SAW.

WHAT THEY DISCOVERED.

>> THAT WAS IN MOTORCYCLE DIARIES.

TALK ABOUT THE TRAINING THAT WENT INTO IT AND THE ATTENTION YOU GAVE TO THE PHYSICALITY OF THE SPORT, WHICH IS ALSO, YOU KNOW, AN AFRLT.

>> YEAH, YEAH.

IT IS.

ALSO VERY HIGHLY SKILLED.

VERY TOUGH SPORT.

SO I TRAINED, THE FIRST THING I DID WAS GAIN MUSCLE AND SORT OF STRENGTH SO I ATE A LOT.

>> WAS THAT FUN?

>> THAT WAS FUN.

THAT PART WAS AMAZING.

IT WAS LIKE EVERY DAY EXERCISE AND HAVING FUN SO I WOULD EAT WITH A LOT OF HUNGER AS WELL.

AND FEELING GOOD, YOU KNOW.

AND THEN TWO MONTHS BEFORE STARTING TO SHOOT, WE START TOO TRAIN THE WRESTLING.

I STARTED TO TRAIN WITH REAL WRESTLERS, THE BECOMING WRESTLERS.

MY TEACHERS WERE CHESS MEN.

VERY PROMINENT.

>> HAVE YOU EVER WRESTLED BEFORE?

>> NO, NO.

>> AS A KID BUT NOT AS A SPORT.

>> NOT AS A SPORT.

AND YOU HAVE TO LEARN THE BASICS, YOU KNOW.

HOW TO FALL, FOR EXAMPLE.

OR HOW TO USE THE ROPES.

IT IS A PARTICULAR THING.

A LOT OF FLEXIBILITY.

HOW TO GET INTO THE RIM.

JUMPING THIS, HOW TO FALL, HOW TO DO THIS.

IT IS A MIXTURE OF JADDO AND YOU HAVE TO PERFORM.

SO TO DO THE THEATRICALITY OF IT, YOU HAVE TO SELL THE KICK THAT YOU'RE DOING AND THE KICK THAT TAKES YOU TO THE NECK OF SOMEONE.

IT'S FANTASTIC.

>> THE TWISTING OF THE ARM.

>> WHAT IS NICE, I HAVE TO SAY THAT WE MIGHT THINK THAT WRESTLING IS LIKE A SPORT THAT IS ARRANGED, YOU KNOW.

NO.

IT'S A COMPLETE -- THE COMPARISON I GAVE IS LIKE, I DANCE SALSA SINCE I'VE BEEN A KID, GROWING UP IN MEXICO AND EVERYTHING.

BUT I'VE SEEN PEOPLE THAT DO NOT KNOW HOW TO DO SALSA SEE PEOPLE WHO DO SALSA AND THEY THINK THESE GUYS KNOW EACH OTHER.

THEY REHEARSED.

NO.

THAT'S THE THING.

ONCE YOU LEARN, YOU KNOW, YOU JUST IMPROVISE ALL THE TIME.

AND WRESTLING IS A BIT LIKE THAT.

LUCHA LIBRE IS A BIT LIKE THAT.

IMPROVISATION.

SO THAT WAS NICE TO LEARN AND TO GET THE HINT OF IT.

TO GET THE HANG OF IT A LITTLE BIT.

IT WAS REALLY NICE.

>> MY FINAL QUESTION TO YOU.

WHAT I ALSO REALLY APPRECIATED IN THIS FILM, AND I THOUGHT WORKED VERY SEAMLESSLY.

THE BACK AND FORTH BETWEEN ENGLISH AND SPANISH.

WASN'T JUST THE CONCEPT OF LEARNING ONE LANGUAGE.

HOW DID YOU FEEL ABOUT IT?

>> THAT'S HOW PEOPLE TALK BORDER.

>> WE DON'T SEE THAT IN MOVIES.

>> NO.

WE DON'T SEE THE BORDER BEING PORTRAYED AT ALL.

WITH WE TALK ABOUT THE WALL, ALSO IT IS TO BUILD IT.

TO CREATE A BIGGER WALL.

BUT WE DON'T SEE ANY CRITICISM OF THE WALL OR ANY QUESTIONING OF THE WALL.

AND FROM THE MEXICAN SIDE, WE SEE VERY LITTLE.

BUT FROM THE UNITED STATES SIDE, EVEN LESS, YOU KNOW?

AND IT IS SOMETHING THAT IS THERE.

IT IS RIGHT HERE.

AND WE WANTED TO PORTRAY THIS BORDER CULTURE BECAUSE IT IS FASCINATING FOR ME.

I'VE ALWAYS BEEN INTERESTED IN THE BACK AND FORTH, YOU KNOW.

IN THE CULTURE THAT HAS BEEN GROWING THERE THAT IS NOT EVEN MEXICO, NOT EVEN THE UNITED STATES.

IT IS A MIX.

AND IN THE CONSTANT SORT OF ANGST OR JOURNEY THAT PEOPLE ARE HAVING THERE, WORKING THERE ON THE BORDER, IN THE DOCUMENTARY A FEW YEARS AGO, ONE OF THE NICEST -- ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL THINGS I HEARD WAS IT WAS A SECOND GENERATION, A THIRD GENERATION CHICANO.

SHE WAS GOING AND SHE WANTED TO GO TO CERTAIN UNIVERSITIES IN MEXICO CITY.

YEAH, YOU KNOW, WHAT I WANT TO DO, I FEEL THAT THE UNITED STATES IS LIKE THE FATHER THAT DIDN'T RECOGNIZE ME AND MEXICO IS THE MOTHER I NEVER KNEW.

SO I WANT TO GET TO KNOW WHAT IS THERE, YOU KNOW.

AND THAT I THINK KIND OF ENCOMPASSES THE VISION OF THE PEOPLE.

WHEN THEY SAY NEITHER HERE NOR THERE.

>> A SUBTLE YET REALLY EFFECTIVE REFERENCE TO THE ISSUE THAT YOU SAID IS NOT GETTING NEARLY ENOUGH ATTENTION.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

CONGRATULATIONS ON THE FILM.

I LEARNED SO MUCH AND IT IS JUST BEAUTIFULLY SHOT.

THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.

THANK YOU.

>> THAT WAS SUCH A FUN INTERVIEW.

>>> WE TURN NOW TO ONE THE MOST SIGNIFICANT LEAKS IN YEARS.

THIS WEEK AIR NATIONAL GUARD TOOK DISCIPLININGARY ACTION AGAINST 15 SERVICE MEMBERS FOR FAILING TO PREVENT 21-YEAR-OLD GUARDSMAN JACK TEIXEIRA FROM ALLEGEDLY SHARING HUNDREDS OF CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS ONLINE.

HE'S CURRENTLY PLEADING NOT GUILTY AS HE AWAITS TRIAL.

NOW THE FRONTLINE DOCUMENTARY THE DISCORD LEAKS EXPLORES HOW THE GAMING PLATFORM BECAME A CENTER NOT ONLY FOR SECURITY BREACHES BUT ALSO FOR UNMODERATED EXTREMISM.

>> THANKS.

SAM OAKFORD, SHANE HARRIS, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

KIND OF BRING OUR AUDIENCE BACK UP TO SPEED HERE.

WHO WAS THE INDIVIDUAL AT THE CENTER OF ALL THIS?

>> JACK TEIXEIRA, THE 21-YEAR-OLD AIR NATIONAL GUARDSMAN FROM MASSACHUSETTS IS THE PERSON ULTIMATELY SUSPECTED OF DOING THESE LEAKS, RIGHT?

SO WE CAN GO BACK TO APRIL WHEN SHANE AND I STARTED ON THIS STORY.

THERE WAS INTELLIGENCE TRICKLING OUT.

IT TURNED OUT IT CAME FROM DISCORD.

WE WERE ABLE TO OBTAIN SEVERAL HUNDRED IMAGES THAT WERE TIED TO TEIXEIRA.

WE SPENT THE LAST SIX, EIGHT MONTHS TRACKING DOWN THE PEOPLE HE INTERACTED ON DISCORD, THE PLATFORM WHERE HE START TO SHARE THESE OVER AER WHY AGO.

>> I'LL GET TOM IN A SECOND.

PUT THIS IN PERSPECTIVE.

HOW SIGNIFICANT OF A LEAK OF CLASSIFIED AND TOP SECRET INFORMATION WAS THIS?

>> IN TERMS THE QUANTITY, IT WAS VERY SIGNIFICANT.

IT WAS ONE OF THE WORST LEAKS IN RECENT YEARS IN U.S. INTELLIGENCE.

WHAT DISTINGUISHED THIS FROM OTHERS WAS THE BREADTH OF IT AND THE TIMELINESS.

TEIXEIRA WAS ALLEGEDLY TAKING DOCUMENTS FROM HIS WORK PLACE THAT COVERED JUST ABOUT EVERY CONCEIVABLE GLOBAL HOT SPOT YOU COULD IMAGINE.

THE WAR IN UKRAINE, THING GOING ON IN CHINA, RUSSIA, ASIA, A GLOBAL LOOK AT WHAT THE INTELLIGENCE WAS COLLECTING.

AND IT WAS VERY TIMELY.

HE WAS SHARING UPDATES ABOUT WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN UKRAINE WITH HIS FRIENDS SO IT IS THE BREADTH OF THIS.

IT IS LIKE A SAMPLE OF EVERYTHING THE INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY WOULD BE LOOKING AT AT A GIVEN POINT IN TIME.

>> SO SAM, THIS INDIVIDUAL HAD ACCESS TO THIS BECAUSE OF WHERE HE WORK, THE TIME OF JOB THAT HE DID.

TELL US ABOUT HOW HE WAS SHARING THIS INFORMATION.

HOW WOULD HE GET THE TOP SECRET FILES OUT OF THE OFFICE ON TO DISCORD.

FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T USED DISCORD, WHAT IS SO SPECIAL ABOUT THAT PLATFORM?

>> THE AIR FORCE RELEASED THE SUMMARY OF A REPORT THIS WEEK WHICH SHED MORE LIGHT ON HOW HE MIGHT HAVE BEEN GAINING ACCESS TO THE MATERIAL.

HE HAD TOP SECRET CLEARANCE TO BEGIN WITH.

HE WAS MORE OF AN I.T.

WORKER AND THAT DIDN'T NECESSARILY MEAN THAT HE NEEDED TO SEE ALL THE MATERIAL.

THE AIR FORCE REPORT DETERMINED THAT THIS BASE, THE AIR NATIONAL GUARD BASE IN CAPE COD, WAS ACTUALLY SHOWING PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T NEED TO KNOW.

WE DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW AT ALL TIMES HE WAS BRINGING IT HOME OR SHARING IT BUT IT CHANGED OVER TIME.

HE WAS POSTING TEXTS.

HE WAS SHARING THINGS, CASUALTY COUNTS RELATED TO THE UKRAINE OR HE STARTED TO MAKE THOSE UPDATES A LITTLE MORE ELABORATE.

AND THEN TOWARD THE END OF LAST YEAR, WE'VE BEEN TOLD HE WAS TAKING IMAGES.

HE WAS TAKING THEM TO HIS HOUSE.

HE WAS CAUGHT SEVERAL TIMES BY HIS SUPERIORS AT THE BASE BUT THAT DID NOT INTERRUPT HIS LEAKING, AS IT TURNED OUT.

AND DISCORD ITSELF IS A CLOSED PLATFORM THAT A LITTLE DIFFERENT FROM WHAT NOT PEOPLE MIGHT HAVE IMAGINED.

IT WAS A PRETTY RACIST AND HOMOPHOBIC NAME AND THAT'S WHERE HE WAS LEAKING THE DOCUMENTS WITH THE CLOSE-KNIT COMMUNITY.

AND HE ALSO LEAKED ON A SEPARATE SERVER AND NEITHER WERE NOTICED BY DISCORD ITSELF.

>> SO SHANE, HOW DO WE GET FROM HIM LEAKING IT IN THIS OTHERWISE PRIVATE COMMUNITY.

IT IS NOT LIKE POSTING IT TO FACEBOOK OR INSTAGRAM AND IT GOES VIRAL.

SHARE WITH US ABOUT HOW IT WENT FROM THE CHAT ROOM TO YOUR RADAR AND THE WORLD.

>> SOMEBODY IN THIS TIGHT-KNIT CIRCLE, AND WE SHOULD SAY THESE ARE MOSTLY TEENAGE BOYS WHO ARE THE FOLLOWERS.

ONE OF THEM TOOK A CHUNK OF THESE DOCUMENTS, ABOUT FOUR DOZEN OF THEM AND SHARED THEM TO ANOTHER ONE AND THEY'RE REPOSTED.

THE MEMBERS OF THE SERVER, THEN THERE'S AN UNWRITTEN RULE.

DON'T SHARE THIS.

THAT'S WHAT SETS OFF THE CHAIN REACTION IN LATE FEBRUARY OF THIS AREA.

APRIL IS WHEN U.S. OFFICIALS AND OTHERS START TO NOTICE THAT THESE DOCUMENTS ARE NOW POPPING UP ALL AROUND THE INTERNET, AND THAT'S WHEN JOURNALISTS LIKE SAM AND MYSELF BECAME AWARE OF IT AND TRIED TO FIGURE OUT WHERE THESE DOCUMENTS HAD COME FROM AND WHO HAD POSTED THEM.

>> SO SAM, TELL US A LITTLE ABOUT HOW YOU GO ABOUT FIGURING OUT WHO THIS INDIVIDUAL IS BEFORE THE DETAILS ARE RELEASED IN AN INVESTIGATION OR ANYTHING.

HOW DO YOU FIGURE OUT WHO HIS FRIENDS ARE TO GET YOU TO TALK WITH HIM FOR THE STORY AND THE FRONT LINE SPECIAL.

>> Reporter: IN APRIL, THEY WERE POPPING UP ON TELEGRAM, ON TWITTER, AND OTHER PLATFORMS THAT ARE MORE FRINGE.

IT QUICKLY BECAME CLEAR THEY WERE COMING FROM DISCORD.

THEN WE STARTED TO GET CLUES ABOUT WHO HIS FRIENDS MIGHT BE AND ULTIMATELY, SHANE AND I WERE ABLE TO TALK TO MEMBERS OF THE CLOSE-KNIT SERVER VERY EARLY ON AND WE PUBLISHED SOMETHING WITHIN DAYS BEFORE TEIXEIRA WAS ARRESTED.

SO WE HAD THAT WITH THE COMMUNITY WHICH IS SOMETHING WE'VE USED THE LAST SIX MONTHS TO PAINT A PICTURE OF TEIXEIRA THAT.

>> DID THESE PEOPLE WANT TO SPEAK TO YOU?

ESPECIALLY VIDEO FORMAT?

>> IT WAS TRICKY.

THESE WERE KIDS THAT HAD SPENT THE PANDEMIC REALLY STARVED FOR INTERACTION.

THAT REALLY PLAYED A ROLE IN THE DYNAMIC.

HE TOOK ON THIS ALMOST UNCLE-LIKE ROLE.

HE WAS DISSEMINATING KNOWLEDGE.

THAT WAS HOW HE FRAMED THIS INFORMATION.

THEY WERE EAGER TO TELL THEIR STORY BECAUSE I THINK IN SOME CASES, THEY REALLY WERE TRYING TO WORK THROUGH WHAT HAD HAPPENED.

>> GORE WAS POSTED ON, PICTURES OF JIHADI BEHEADINGS OR CARTEL KILLINGS.

DUDE, LOOK AT THIS GUY GETTING HIS HEAD CHOPPED OFF.

IT WAS COOL.

>> WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THIS NOW?

>> I'M DEFINITELY NOT PROUD OF IT AT ALL.

SITS EMBARRASSING AND HUMILIATING TO SPEAK ABOUT IT NOW BUT I'M WILLING TO.

>> YOU MENTIONED THIS WAS NOT THE FIRST TIME OR THE FIRST INSTANCE OF TEIXEIRA GETTING IN TROUBLE ON HIS JOB.

SO HOW MANY OPPORTUNITIES MISSED WERE THERE BEFORE WE GET TO THIS POINT WHERE ALL THESE DIFFERENT SECRETS ARE OUT?

>> THERE WERE MANY MISSED OPPORTUNITIES AND THAT'S ONE OF THE KEY FEATURES WHERE THERE'S A LOT OF ACCOUNTABILITY ON THE DEFENSE DEPARTMENT TO ANSWER FOR THIS.

THERE ARE AT LEAST FOUR INSTANCES THAT HAVE BEEN DOCUMENTED SO FAR BY AIR FORCE INVESTIGATORS OF TEIXEIRA BEING INVESTIGATED BY HIS SUPERIORS IN THE SECURE FACILITY WHERE HE WORKED AT THAT AIR NATIONAL GUARD BASE.

READING CLASSIFIED DOCUMENTS, TAKING NOTES ON THEM IN SOME CASES AND HE WAS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE DOING THAT.

AND HE'S REPRIMANDED FOR IT.

WHAT YOU SEE IS WHILE HE'S BEING SCOLDED, NO ONE PULLS HIM OFF THE LINE OR RESTRICTS HIS ACCESS.

WHAT THIS NEW INVESTIGATION HAS FOUND THIS WEEK NO, ONE IN HIS CHAIN OF COMMAND REPORTED HIM TO THE RELEVANT SECURITY OFFICIALS WHOSE JOB IT IS TO STEP IN WHEN SOMEONE VIOLATES THOSE RULES AND SUSPEND THEM OR WITH HOLE THEIR CLEARANCE.

THAT JUST NEVER HAPPENED.

AND THEY FAULTED THE AIR NATIONAL GUARD FOR WHAT THEY CALLED A CULTURE OF COMPLACENCY ABOUT TEIXEIRA AND THEY FOUND OTHER INSTANCES IN WHICH PEOPLE WERE LOOKING AT CLASSIFIED INFORMATION THAT THEY DIDN'T NEED TO SEE.

NONE OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE ACCUSED OF LEAKING IT.

THERE WAS AN ENVIRONMENT THAT WAS QUITE PERMISSIVE.

THE NORMAL RULE ABOUT HOW TO YOU HANDLE CLASSIFIED INFORMATION WERE NOT FOLLOWED.

>> WERE THERE OTHER MEMBERS OF THE MILITARY HELD ACCOUNTABLE?

>> SO FAR THE AIR FORCE THAT THEY DISCIPLINED 15 PEOPLE IN CONNECTION WITH THIS, WHICH IS A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT NUMBER.

PERHAPS MOST NOTABLY, THE COLONEL IN COMMAND OF THE 102 INTELLIGENCE WING WHERE TEIXEIRA WORKED HAS BEEN RELIEVED OF HIS COMMAND WHICH IS A RATHER SEVERE PUNISHMENT.

SO FAR IT HAS REALLY FOCUSED ON THIS PARTICULAR UNIT WHERE THIS HAPPENED.

I THINK WHAT WE FOUND IS THE SECURITY CLEARANCE PROCESS AND OTHER MECHANISMS PUT IN PLACE TO UMBRELLA SOMETHING LIKE THIS DON'T SEEM TO BE WORKING AND CAPTURING WHO THE NEXT TEIXEIRA MIGHT BE.

IT IS NOT BEING DONE IN THIS ONE SIMPLE INVESTIGATION.

>> I UNDERSTAND THE DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE CANNOT PERFORM THE TIME OF FORENSIC DEEP DIVE THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE.

BUT IT IS KIND OF ASTOUNDING TO ME THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO FIND SO MANY DIFFERENT CONNECTIONS TO JACK, WHAT HE'S BEEN POSTING, WHERE THE OTHER PLATFORMS WHERE HE MIGHT HAVE BEEN ACTIVE.

AND THE MILITARY COULD NOT.

IS THERE SOMETHING IN OUR INTAKE SYSTEM?

SOMETHING IN OUR VETERANING PROCESS, SOMETHING THAT GETS PEOPLE A CLEARANCE THAT IS JUST BROKEN?

>> THERE IS VERY LITTLE VISIBILITY ABOUT WHAT JACK WAS DOING ON THE INTERNET.

HE WENT THROUGH WHAT SHOULD BE A VIGOROUS BACKGROUND CHECK FOR GETTING THIS TOP SECURITY KREERNS.

WHAT WE CONFIRMED WAS THAT THE MILITARY DOES NOT REALLY LOOK AT PEOPLE'S ONLINE ACTIVITY IN A MEANINGFUL WAY.

FOR SOMEONE LIKE TEIXEIRA, APPARENT OF HIS AGE WHO IS THE KIND OF PERSON WHO WOULD BE POPULATING THE LOWER RANKS OF THE MILITARY EVERY DAY, RIGHT?

THEY ARE SPENDING THEIR ENTIRE LIVES ONLINE.

IF THEY'RE GAMERS, OUTSIDE THEIR JOBS, THERE WERE RED FLAGS IN HIS HISTORY GOING BACK TO HIS HIGH SCHOOL YEARS WHERE HE WAS SUSPENDED FOR MAKING THREATS OF VIOLENCE AND RACIST COMMENTS AT SCHOOL.

THAT WAS OVERLOOKED BUT THEY WERE AWARE OF IT.

THEY WERE NOT AWARE OF ANY OF THE ACTIVITY THAT HE ENGAGED IN ONLINE.

HE WAS ALREADY RACIST AND INVOLVING THREATS OF VIOLENCE AT SCHOOL.

SO THAT'S THE ORIGIN OF THE TOTAL LACK OF VISIBILITY WHICH WAS THEN FOLLOWED BY A CASCADING A SERIES OF FAILURES THAT SAM DESCRIBED.

>> WITHOUT NECESSARILY REPEATING SOME OF THE EXPLICIT STUFF, CAN YOU GIVE US AN IDEA OF WHAT THESE COMMUNITIES WERE LIKE ON DISCORD WHERE JACK TEIXEIRA WAS SHARING IT?

>> MANY PEOPLE USE DISCOURT THAT AREN'T LIKE WHAT THESE KIDS WERE DOING.

MANY.

THESE KIDS SPENT TIME IN PLACES LIKE WHERE THE LANGUAGE CAN BE REALLY TOXIC, REALLY ANTISMITHIC.

THE WAY DISCORD IS STRUCTURED, YOU CAN CREATE A COMMUNITY IN THE WAY YOU WANT IT TO BE.

THAT'S A SELLING POINT.

ANOTHER KEY ASPECT OF DISCORDS IS THAT THEY DON'T REALLY MONITOR WHAT IS GOING ON OUTSIDE NARROW CASES.

FOR INSTANCE, A CHILD'S SEXUAL EXPLOITATION.

IF THERE'S MATERIAL LIKE THAT, THEY MIGHT CATCH IT.

IF YOU'RE RUNNING A SERVER WHERE YOU'RE MAKING RACIST COMMENTS OR IN HIS CASE, POSTING VIDEOS MAKING COMMENTS LIKE THAT.

THEY DON'T APPEAR TO BE CATCHING THAT.

WE FOUND THEY VIOLATED OTHER THINGS.

HATE SPEECH, IMAGES OF GORE.

THREATS OF VIOLENCE.

THESE ARE ALL THINGS WE'VE DOCUMENTED.

WERE WERE THESE PARTICULAR KIDS ALLOWED TO KEEP SHARING THIS KIND OF MATERIAL FOR MORE THAN A YEAR?

>> THIS COME DOWN TO OUR ABILITY TO IDENTIFY WHAT IS HAPPENING IN THESE SPACES.

WE RELY ON THIRD PARTIES TO HELP US WITH INTELLIGENCE.

NONE OF THAT HAPPENED HERE.

>> NONE OF IT WAS LIKELY TO LAMB.

IF ONE OF THEM OBJECTED TO RACIST ANTISEMITISM COMMENTS, IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN FLAGGED BUT THEY DIDN'T BECAUSE THEY WERE ALL IN ON IT.

YOU'RE SAYING THE COMPANY HAS NO WAY OF MONITORING FOR THAT ON ITS OWN?

>> WE REQUIRE THAT PEOPLE ARE HELPING TO KEEP DISCORD SAFE.

WE DO SCAN IF PARTICULAR FOR CHILD SEX ABUSE MATERIAL.

THAT IS UNAMBIGUOUSLY BAD.

WHEN IT COMES TO OTHER CLASSES OF ABUSE, WE ALL NEED TO COLLECTIVELY THINK ABOUT, ARE WE JUST DIVING INTO SOMEONE'S PRIVACY?

>> WE HAVE IN THE LAST 15 TWIRG YEARS, LIVED THROUGH VERY HIGH PROFILE LEAK SITUATIONS.

WHETHER IT IS SQUEAKY LEAKS OR EDWARD HE SNOWDEN OR CHELSEA MANNING.

AND OFTEN AFTER ANTIACTION REPORTS, THEY SAY HERE'S HOW WE'LL BUCKLE DOWN.

HERE'S HOW WE'LL PREVENT IT IN THE FUTURE.

WHY ARE WE BACK HERE?

WHO KNOWS WHAT IS BEING SHARED TODAY?

>> THEY ALL HAVE SOMETHING IN COMMON WITH WHAT TEIXEIRA IS ALLEGED TO HAVE DONE.

SOMEONE WITH TOP SECRET CLEARANCE AND HAD ACCESS TO ALL THIS INFORMATION ABUSED THE PRIVILEGED ACCESS THEY HAVE.

THE MILITARY COME IN AND TRIES TO TWEAK THE SYSTEM TO MAKE IT LESS LIKELY THAT WOULD HAPPEN.

FUNDAMENTALLY, THERE IS NOT A CHANGE TO THIS SORT OF THE BASIC ARCHITECTURE OF THE SYSTEM.

THAT POST 9/11, THE INTELLIGENCE COMMUNITY, THE GOVERNMENT AS A WHOLE MADE A DECISION TO MAKE CLASSIFIED INTELLIGENCE MUCH MORE WIDELY AVAILABLE TO A BROAD VARIETY OF PEOPLE WHO HAVE CLEARANCES.

AND THERE WAS A REASON FOR THAT.

BEFORE 9/11, INFORMATION WAS SILOED.

IT WAS OVERPROTECTED.

PEOPLE AT THE FBI DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THE CIA KNEW ABOUT 19 PEOPLE WHO WERE ABOUT TO GET ON AIRPLANES.

SO THEY TRIED TO CORRECT THAT BY SPREADING OUT THE ACCESS.

WHAT THEY'VE NEVER DONE IS TRIED TO REGULATE ON AN INDIVIDUAL LEVEL WHO GETS TO SEE CERTAIN DOCUMENTS AND WHO DOESN'T.

WE'VE TALKED TO PEOPLE INCLUDING LAWMAKERS IN OUR REPORTING WHO SAID, LISTEN, THERE'S TECHNOLOGY AVAILABLE THAT COULD ESSENTIALLY MAKE IT SO A GUY LIKE JACK TEIXEIRA WHO IS JUST THE MAINTENANCE PERSON, IF HE'S SPOTTED LINGERING ON DOCUMENTS, CALLING UP DOCUMENTS, SEARCHING FOR THEM, THAT COULD FLAG SOMEONE TO SAY, WAIT A MINUTE.

IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE YOU'RE DOING SOMETHING THAT TRACKS WITH WHAT YOUR JOB RESPONSIBILITIES ARE.

WE REALLY DON'T HAVE A SYSTEM ON A PERVASIVE SYSTEMWIDE LEVEL TO GATE THAT ACCESS.

AND WHY THE MILITARY IS NOT DOING IT?

IT COULD BE HARD, IT COULD BE CUMBERSOME AND THERE'S A LEVEL OF BUREAUCRATIC INERTIA HERE.

THIS IS THE WAY THEY'RE DOING IT FOR 20 YEARS.

WITH EVERY ONE OF THESE LEAKS, IT IS THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS.

WE'LL ALWAYS HAVE AN INSIDER THREAT LIKE THIS.

THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY DON'T LEAK INFORMATION.

WHEN THEY DO, IT CAN BE INCREDIBLY DAMAGING.

REPORTERS FROM THE "WASHINGTON POST" BUT ALSO CO-PRODUCERS OF THE FRONT LINE DOCUMENTARY CALLED THE DISCORD LEAKS.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>>> FINALLY, WE MARK THE FINAL DAY OF HANNUKKAH WITH A LITTLE MIRACLE TO CELEBRATE THIS HANNUKKAH SEASON.

THE 99-YEAR-OLD HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR CO-FOUNDED THE HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR BAND ABOUT TEN YEARS AGO.

THIS WEEK HE GOT THE GIG OF A LIFETIME.

FULFILLING A PERSONAL DREAM AT THE WHITE HOUSE WITH THE U.S. MARINE BAND.

TAKE A LISTEN.

♪♪ AND WE'RE WISHING SAUL A VERY HAPPY HANNUKKAH.

THAT DOES IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.

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JOIN US AGAIN NEXT TIME.