[upbeat music] - Hello, I'm Nido Qubein.

Welcome to Side By Side.

My guest today was the first female vice president of Chick-fil-A.

We're talking here about talent, culture and the importance of quality customer service with an author and a national keynote speaker, Dee Ann Turner.

- [Announcer] Funding for a Side By Side with Nido Qubein is made possible by.

- [Woman] Here's to those that rise and shine to friendly faces, doing more than their part.

And to those who still enjoy the little things.

You make it feel like home.

Ashley Homestore, this is home.

- [Man] The BuddGroup is a company of everyday leaders making a difference by providing facility solutions through customized janitorial landscape and maintenance services.

- [Voiceover] Coca-Cola Consolidated is honored to make and serve 300 brands and flavors locally.

Thanks to our team.

We are Coca-Cola Consolidated, your local bottler.

[upbeat music] - Dee Ann, I'm fascinated by the fact that every time I pass by a Chick-Fil-A, the lines are so long and yet the lines move readily fast.

What is the secret that Chick-fil-A has that perhaps others don't?

- I think it's a lot of things, Dr. Qubein, but I think especially is the leadership and that every single one of their franchises has a specially selected leader that has a longterm commitment and is interested in the development of their people.

And so the training is top-notch and the culture is amazing.

And then you add some other pieces that I think Chick-fil-A does really well, like their technology and like their systems, but it starts with having the people who can actually lead those systems and then execute them as well.

- [Nido] And people is something you know a lot about.

You've written books, you've given speeches, you've led seminars on, for example, selecting a person to come work in your enterprise.

Tell me what are the three most important qualities that you look for in interviewing and picking someone to work in an enterprise, any business profit, non-profit, a university, corporation, whatever it might be.

- Well, when I select talent, I start with character, always start how character.

- [Nido] How do you judge character Dee Ann?

In an interview, how do you judge character?

- Character that matches the organization.

So I'm looking for someone whose personal purpose, mission and values aligns with the organization.

That doesn't mean it has to match exactly, but align with the organization.

- [Nido] And how you know that their values match your organization.

I'm talking in an interview, - [Dee Ann] Sure.

- You're interviewing somebody and you wanna extract from that interview some deductions about their character, their values, you know, their views on things.

How does one do that?

How do you know when someone is telling you the truth or someone may be meaning to tell you the truth, but you know, it's an interview, so they're gonna frame it and dress it up.

- Well, there are two things.

The first one is the kind of interview that I'm gonna do.

I'm gonna do a behavioral interview with behavioral interview questions, and I'm gonna ask them to give me specific examples.

So they-- - [Nido] Give me an example of behavioral questions.

- Sure, so if they tell me that they have a core value, a core personal value of excellence, then I'm gonna say, "Tell me, give me an example of a time when that value has played out, whether they're a student at school, whether they've had a job, whatever their case is, give me an example."

And usually on a core value like that, I'm gonna ask for two or three examples.

And that's how I'm gonna know that they really have that core value.

I'm gonna ask them about a time that they didn't display it and what did they learn from that?

The second thing I'm gonna do is something that a lot of employers don't spend time on, and I'm gonna reference that candidate.

And when I talked to the reference, I'm gonna say, "You know, this candidate told me "that they have a core value of excellence.

Tell me about a time when you've seen that display."

- [Nido] But do people do that?

I mean, do you find that, you know, people usually are gonna give you the references where they, the employer loved them or it's their minister is their teacher.

How do you get a reference in this environment of privacy and all of that to tell you these things?

- Well, so first of all, I asked the candidate, I'd like to have three to six people, depending on what the role is, a people you've been accountable to.

Ideally it's a past supervisor, but sometimes they're employed and they can't give you their supervisor's name.

So I want somebody they've been accountable to.

I mean, they've been a little league coach, they were accountable to a commissioner - I see.

- in their community.

- [Nido] Yes.

- So that's where we start.

And then I go to those people, I asked them the behavioral type questions.

I let them know that I like to set an appointment with them.

It might take 30 to 45 minutes for this interview.

And I ask them these questions.

If I can't get that information, then I go back to the candidate and I explain, "You know what?

This is what we need.

We need people you're accountable to that will talk to us that aren't concerned about all the things where people sometimes don't wanna do a reference."

And you know what?

99% of the time I'd never had that problem.

They give us the people-- - Really?

- That people are willing to talk about that, and we get the information that we need.

- [Nido] All right, so I interrupted you.

The first one was character.

- Sure.

- What's the second one.

- Second one is competency that matches the roles.

- [Nido] Skills.

- Exactly, and experiences, and the combination of all that.

But this is the important thing about competency.

Don't just look for something or for those skills that are going to be for the role you have today.

But you're looking into the future.

What bench strength do you need?

Is this somebody who can fill a future role too when you see the potential in them?

- [Nido] That's a great point.

- And then third, chemistry that matches the team.

- Chemistry that matches the team.

- And let me tell you what, it's not, it's not about us joining arms and singing kumbaya, and everybody gets along and you take personality tests and how do they match up.

Here's what I think has great chemistry.

Great chemistry is when an individual can come to the table with a diverse point of view, collaborate with the team in a way that influences the team.

That's great chemistry, and that's what I'm looking for in talent.

- Wow, that's a great point.

How do you, tell me how you measure that in an interview in a screening process?

- So a couple of different ways, some is observation.

And so it's back to those behavioral questions.

I'm still asking about those examples.

You know, I would ask that kind of question, "You know, tell me about a time when you had a different point of view than everyone else.

How did you influence the rest of the team?

What was their response?

What feedback did you get from them?"

The second thing is some observation about chemistry.

And this, one of my things that I would do when I was leading talent is I would have the interview and then I would go and talk to other people who met the candidate.

It might be for instance, the receptionist.

And I would ask how the candidate was treated by that person or the person who drove them from the airport, because sometimes the candidate might assume that person has no involvement in the interview process.

And that would be a mistake because in an organization with a strong culture, everyone is important and everyone matters.

And so that would tell me a lot about chemistry.

Two, is how they treated people they didn't perceive for part of their interviewing process.

- Do you give any importance or how much importance do you give to first impressions?

Do they, are they dressed properly?

Are the shoes shined?

You know, those kinds of things?

- Sure, I think all of those things are important and, you know, shining shoes I learned this from one of my mentors.

He always looked to see if the shoes were shined or they were new shoes.

And back in those days, if somebody was wearing a watch.

Now we tell time different ways than having a watch on our arm, but he would always think that was a sign that they had someplace to go and they wanted to be there on time.

But all, I think all those impressions are important.

So if you're interviewing for a job and you're not sure, you know, especially these days where you're not sure if it's business dress or casual dress, go on the website, see how people are dressing.

You dress one level above that to make a good first impression.

- So we've talked about the selection process.

So talk to me about retaining employees.

We have all observed labor shortages in America, we've already seen tremendous amount of turnover.

Some companies have 20, 30% turnover, which is both costly and disruptive to the chemistry and the culture that you speak of.

What did you do, what do you do, what do you teach and consult about how to retain employees?

- So most of where these labor shortages are occurring among millennials and Gen-Z.

And of course we're saying something we've never seen before, so we're all learning.

But here are three things those generations are looking for.

Number one, they're looking for a remarkable culture to work in.

Part of that remarkable cultures is number two.

They wanna be about something bigger than themselves.

And the third thing is that they want learning and development opportunities.

They wanna build their skills.

- [Nido] This are wonderful attributes.

We should honor them for having those kind of outlooks on employment.

- Exactly.

That's, so that if that's what they want, that's what every employer should be focused on.

And ideally you want to focus on those things before you're in a crisis.

So when you get to a crisis point, like we are now, people will stay, but if you're not there already, then those are the three things to focus on.

- [Nido] So in the end it's not about money.

- [Dee Ann] People work for money, but you know, a lot of times that it is within some range usually, and it's pretty much the same so-- - [Nido] In a competitive scenario.

- Yeah, in a competitive scenario.

So yes, these things are differentiators.

- So you were the first female officer in a large corporation.

We all talk about equality and diversity and inclusivity, all these important elements in society and among people.

How did you get that position?

You earned it clearly, but how did you do that?

How did you feel when you got that?

And more importantly, what is it that the internal has done to ensure that those who follow her have those opportunities?

- One of the most important things is to have a champion or an advocate.

You know, when you think about it, all the most important decisions about your career are made when you're not in the room.

you're not in the room when your boss decides to select you.

You're not in the room when somebody decides to promote you, or when somebody decides you've reached your peak.

So the implication is clear if you're not in the room, then you have to have an advocate in the room for you.

So it's very important to build relationships.

And I was just, I was very fortunate that the president of our company took a special interest in me And he helped champion me through that process.

So that's one of the ways that that happened.

And by the way, champions don't mean that you're not held accountable.

In fact, I think I was held more accountable than most anyone.

He really pushed me very, very hard because he knew that was gonna be a hard hurdle to get over.

How I felt about it.

I felt an immediate responsibility that I paved the way for others that would come behind me and that, you know, yes, I was first, but there would be others trying to get there too, and I would need to help them.

And so I've always tried to be a champion of women to be able to accomplish those things.

And in the organization, I worked, I'm glad to say that they've really, really ground and so many others have had that opportunity since then.

- What is it that, and I'm asking, because I think it's a very important subject.

What is it that, you know, either gender it has to do to become successful and valuable to an organization, but in this context, because you are the first officer of a large, first female officer for a large corporation, what are some of the pieces of advice you would give someone maybe they're young in years, maybe they're young and experience, M=maybe they're re entering the marketplace after rearing a family for example, what would you say to that person if you were mentoring that person, what would you say to them that they have to do to excel, to propel their career forward, to have a sustainable, successful life?

- The first thing is people have a tendency to get so focused on the promotion or the next step that sometimes they don't stay focused on what they're doing right now.

And to get promoted, to move ahead, you have to be successful at the role you have right now.

- [Nido] You must provide value.

- [Dee Ann] Exactly.

Add value as John Maxwell says.

- Yeah, a and others must, and others must valuate that value, quantify it in a way that is consistent with the organization's goals.

What else?

- [Dee Ann] So by that, I mean, work hard, get focused on just working hard and succeeding and producing results.

- [Nido] But Dee Ann lots of people work very hard, it doesn't mean they get ahead.

- Right?

So next is to, you wanna add value by taking on more responsibility and as you add to that responsibility and you produce results, you want to also be sure that you're communicating exactly what those results are not in a way that's egotistical, because that oftentimes will turn people off.

But in a way that just almost with a calm nature, this is what we've accomplished and continuing to build relationships across the organization and be sure that you're connecting with people at all levels of the organization, building those relationships so when you're not in the room, people be talking about very positive.

- [Nido] An advocate.

That's a very strong point by the way, it's always assume you're not gonna be in the room Who is advocating your position.

At the end you were with a company for 33 years, that's a long time, right?

- Yes.

- [Nido] It's a small company that became a large company.

- Oh, very much so.

- And why did you stay there for 33 years?

Why didn't you have the desire to do something else?

What kept you there?

What retained you there for so many years?

- It was definitely the culture-- - What is the culture.

- And there was a very-- - [Nido] I mean, when you, we all use the word culture, give me an example of what a healthy culture in an organization like.

- So for me, it's three things.

They have a meaningful purpose.

And so the organization, I was at their meaningful purpose, included being a positive influence and a faithful steward of resources.

And I really bought into that.

And then to have a challenging mission, a big goal that the organization is going after.

- [Nido] I see.

- And then the third element for me is demonstrated core values.

And you notice, I said, demonstrate it.

So it's not just a list of values on a wall or in a screensaver, but they're demonstrated by every level of dualization - It's elivered.

- [Dee Ann] Exactly.

- Others must see it and experience it.

- So that was the culture, but there was one element about that culture, and it was the care that organization had so much care.

In fact, my father died in 2013 and at the funeral home, it was the people from my organization.

It wasn't even my church or my neighbors, or my best of friends.

- [Nido] Your colleagues and associates.

- It was my colleagues from work that came and made sure I was taken care of, that was one example.

So over the years it was that care, it was that atmosphere of people, I mattered to people.

- [Nido] And let's talk about why people fail.

You know, we always want to talk about how people succeed, what's a great culture, what makes someone valuable to an organization?

What are some of the causes that create failure in personal and perhaps professional performance?

- I think the number one thing to both of those is a lack of self-awareness - Awareness.

- Yes.

Not recognizing, you know, you have an intent, but not recognizing what the impact actually is.

And I think about one of my favorite books is Integrity by Dr. Henry Cloud and he talks about the wake we leave.

And you know, that wake, when we look behind us, is that a positive wake or negative wake?

And do we have enough awareness to see it and know what it is.

- [Nido] What does that mean, wake relief?

- [Dee Ann] You know, the wake behind a boat, - Oh, I see, I see.

- when you think about the weight is behind a boat.

- Yes.

And when you look behind there, you know, is that a positive or is that a negative thing?

And if you don't have self-awareness, then you've got to get that.

So how do you get that?

Well, you want to get feedback from other people and whether that's trusted advisers, or that's a mentor and executive coach, find people who can tell you the truth.

So you know corrections to make.

I'll give you a quick story.

- [Nido] Yes.

- So I always said that I had an open door policy and that my staff could come in my office anytime, except when I was interviewing, they could email me, call me at home, whatever they needed to do to get in touch with me.

I thought that was enough.

And then one day, one brave soul says to me, "Well, what we really want is for you to walk down the hall and sit down in our office."

I didn't have that awareness.

And that's just a little thing, sometimes there are huge blind spots in self-awareness.

So that's one reason that people fail.

I think another reason is that when given the opportunity, they don't know how to manage feedback, they don't know how to respond to negative feedback.

Feedback is always a gift, even if it's negative, because it tells us what we need to improve.

In some people, they get emotional, they shut down, they can't manage that feedback in a way that's helpful.

- [Nido] My friend, Ken Blanchard says that it's gotta be one minute reprimand, but also one minute, you know, a compliment.

- Right?

- So the feedback has to be balanced if you want people to respond to you.

- Absolutely.

And then I think, you know, the third one is probably character related.

And I was talking to a moment ago about my favorite book, integrity.

And it's when people lose their integrity, they don't do what they say they'll do When they say they'll do it, how they say they'll do it.

I think that's a third reason that people fail personally and professionally.

- So we've talked about how you select employees, how you retain employees, how you train them and educate them and how you measure their performance, both personal and professional based on these three points you just made, what role does the customer play in all of this?

I mean, the customer at the end of the day is the one where the legal tender that they exchange for the product or service.

How do these two somehow merge one with the other?

- So you're right.

The customer is everything and needs to be the central focus of everything that you do.

I think organizations who succeed are ones that focus on the fact that everyone in the organization serves someone.

So if you're not serving that customer, you should be serving someone who is right in your organization, and-- - I never thought of it that way.

Say that one more time so everybody is serving the needs of somebody else, whether it's the front as a customer or an internal back of the room operartions.

- [Announcer] Exactly.

If you're not serving the customer, you need to be serving someone who is.

- [Nido] Yes.

So I think the best organizations have that mindset when you think about some of the great customer service organizations that you can think of.

They have that mindset and they select people who have a heart for service.

I think that, so I think number one, that is the most key thing when you think about that.

And when you create a remarkable culture, you don't just engage your employees in it, you end up engaging your customers and they become your biggest advocates, they become your advertising.

- So, you know, when we talk about employees, Dee Ann as you very well know, there are those who are in management positions, they are well-paid, they're incented, they're highly motivated because they have major responsibilities.

What about the dishwasher?

What about the person unloading the truck?

What about the person who's doing repetitive tasks all day long?

How does an organization motivate and inspire that group?

- So I think about that and, you know, I think all of those, everybody has their own unique role in the organization.

And I think they still want those same things I talked about earlier.

They may be washing dishes, but they wouldn't do that in a great culture in an organization, you know, if they're washing dishes in a restaurant, they wanna be in a restaurant that has a great culture that people care about them that they want to be part of something bigger than themselves.

You know, what is this particular restaurant doing with its profits?

Are they doing things to support others and help others in need?

And then lastly, they want opportunities to grow.

So is there something else they can do in that restaurant, is somebody recognizing their gifts and allowing them to grow and do something different?

I think they want the same things.

- And that's why companies have awards and recognitions and thank you notes, and those kinds of things.

- [Dee Ann] And here is the key about that recognition is finding what recognition they want.

I learned this lesson.

- That's the key, isn't it?

- Yeah.

What is it that really would register with that person?

- Is it the recognition and reward?

Do they really want 15 cents more an hour?

Or do they want some public recognition and a plaque on the wall that other people are able to acknowledge what they've accomplished?

And some people want public recognition and some don't and so it's important that you know, what it is that will motivate each employ.

What are their dreams?

- [Nido] I've made that mistake in my career.

I assumed everybody wants, you know, public recognition, they all wanna be applauded and lauded in front of their colleagues.

So the thing that sort of is complex today is this generational differences.

You refer to millennials and Gen-Z.

By the way, Gen-Z is what the ages that were born in.

- So about 19, about 1997, I'm thinking, - Yes.

- They're just going into the work force-- - Milennials about 20 years before.

- Yeah.

- So, right.

Something like that.

- Yeah.

So we talk a lot about people, don't wanna work hard.

You know, these generations are not as committed as you know, my generation, everybody wants to work a three day, four day week, they don't wanna work the fullness of it.

And you see a lot of organizations responding to that.

You see lots of organizations saying, "Well, you can work virtually", and so on.

What is your take on that?

You were an expert in being responsible for attracting and retaining talent for a large organization.

And you did it for a long time, and now you're helping others figure that out.

What do we do about all of that?

I mean, is the world gonna take over America because we're not as productive as efficient?

My words, I'm not sure what those are the deductions, but what is your take on that?

- I'll remain very positive about this generation.

And maybe the reality is the way we had to do work.

And you think about all the manual processes we have, it doesn't take as long.

I mean, they can do so much more with less amount of time.

- [Nido] Technology, et cetera.

- Exactly.

I mean, we could never think about being remote, we had to all be together.

Now I have a preference that I like people to work together in person, - Yes.

- but we had to work that way, we had no other choice.

Well, they can work from any place in the world because of technology.

They can do things.

I mean, the speed at which they can do things compared to when we were starting out our careers, it's just exponential.

I mean, I didn't even have a computer, even when I started in 1985, my career.

So I think they are working smarter.

And I think we need to give more support to that idea that it is possible to do it differently and still be successful.

- [Nido] Well, some of that is because global companies, by definition, don't have all their people in one location, right.

- Yeah.

- They're all over the place, doing all kinds of things.

People in sales and external sales have known that for years.

- Right.

They worked out of their car or an airplane, they had to travel and so on.

The term AI, Artificial Intelligence intrigues me because I always think of it as artificial intelligence is not the real thing.

So for me, there's no such thing as artificial wisdom.

do you agree with that?

- [Dee Ann] I do agree with that.

- How do you get wisdom versus just intelligence.

- [Dee Ann] Wisdom comes from experience and you have to have both successes and failures and learn from those failures, being willing to learn from failures.

And that I believe wisdom can only come from experience.

- [Nido] Yeah, Wisdom is about having a circle of influence that feeds your mind, heart and soul, right?

It's not about otherwise, your circle of concerns grows proportionately to the lack of the depth in your circle of influence.

You know, who we choose as friends, how we make decisions, those kinds of things.

It's fascinating to talk about your world and your experience.

It reminds me of Walt Disney's comments that he once said, he said, "We take care of our employees.

Our employees take care of our guests.

Our guests to care of our profits."

It makes a lot of sense, doesn't it?

- [Dee Ann] I think so.

And you know, so many have done that.

And the organization I worked for was very much like that.

If you take care, it will have that trickle down effect.

If you will take care of your employees, they will take care of the customers and everything else will fall into place.

But the secret is consistency.

- [Nido] Yes, - Somebody was asking me just this morning was talking about that, you know, why is it that some organizations can do that?

And I believe what it is is the consistency factor.

- I have to be consistent and have to be predictable.

- Yes.

- Deee Ann Turner, thank you very much for being with us in Side By Side.

I've learned so much from you today.

I wish you the very best, always.

- It's been my pleasure.

Thank you so much for having me.

- [Announcer] Funding for a Side By Side with Nido Qubein is made possible by.

- [Woman] Here's to those that rise and shine to friendly faces, doing more than their part.

And to those who still enjoy the little things.

You make it feel like home.

Ashley Homestore, this is home.

- [Man] The BuddGroup is a company of everyday leaders making a difference by providing facility solutions through customized janitorial landscape and maintenance services.

- [Voiceover] Coca-Cola Consolidated is honored to make and serve 300 brands and flavors locally.

Thanks to our team.

We are Coca-Cola Consolidated, your local bottler.