Funding for To the Contrary provided by the E Rhodes and Leona B Carpenter Foundation.

The Park Foundation and the Charles A. Frueauff Foundation Our clergy are celebrating.

Our churches are celebrating.

Our Ladies.....

Right now, I'm in Alaska, where this region's women's group is meeting the United Women in Faith.

They are all celebrating.

I am relieved and overjoyed that those who have gifts and graces to serve the church can do so, regardless of how they self-identify.

Love wins.

And I stand here today with joy in my heart to say that when we say all as a denomination now.

All truly means ALL.

Can we say Amen to that people?

(MUSIC) Hello, I'm Bonnie Erbe.

Welcome to a documentary edition of To the Contrary.

The United Methodist Church is charting the future as part of a growing number of Protestant denominations that fully welcome members of the lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, queer and questioning community known as LGBTQ plus.

After a half century of conflict, the UMC is taking a bold step to allow ministry to officiate at same sex weddings and ordain LGBTQ plus clergy.

The decision leaves the UMC, a smaller church, and has dramatically impacted congregants in a very personal way.

My son is trans, and he he did leave the United Methodist Church because he's called to ministry, and at the time, he wasn't allowed, to be a clergy person.

Laure Mieskowski has been an active member of the United Methodist Church of Grand Rapids for 32 years, many of which she served as director of Christian Education.

But the rejection of her son had her thinking about finding another church.

We considered leaving, for a time, but our church created a worship service.

right a day or two after, of lament, and our son came with us and worshiped with us, and we were able to really, lament and cry and acknowledge how hurtful that decision had been.

And that was a really turning point for him and for us.

The unconditional love he received in our congregation was overwhelming.

the denomination did not allow him to pursue becoming clergy, but our congregation embraced him, with, an incredible amount of love and acceptance.

And my husband and I said, no, we're staying.

We're going to we're going to continue to advocate for people like our son.

The battle over homosexuality in the UMC goes back a half century.

In 1972, delegates to the UMC General Conference added the following sentences to the Book of Discipline.

Quote.

We do not condone the practice of homosexuality and consider it incompatible with Christian teaching.

And quote, we do not recommend marriage between two persons of the same sex.

End quote.

The Book of Discipline lays out the law and doctrine of the denomination before adding that change.

There was no mention of homosexuality in the Book of Discipline since then, homosexuality has been the subject of debate and protest at each of the churches general conferences So eventually what was a statement of social witness became church law due to the UMC global presence.

The church, although declining in the US, was growing very fast in Africa, where the churches were very traditional and very conservative.

Mark Tooley, president of the Conservative Institute on Religion and Democracy in Washington, D.C., says it was an important alliance.

So US evangelicals and United Methodist Church became allies with the growing African Church and had a legislative majority at the governing general Conference of the termination, which precluded the denomination from following other mainline Protestant denominations that liberalized their teachings on marriage and sexuality.

Thanks to this, alliance between American evangelicals and African churches had continuously reaffirmed traditional teachings about marriage and sex that precluded any celebration of same sex marriages and required the clergy to be celibate if single or monogamous, and male female marriage.

Otherwise, clergy could be held up on charges and defrocked.

Anyone could bring charges against a pastor in a church.

So, for instance, if someone in Michigan, married a gay couple in their church, somebody in Texas or California could bring a charge against that clergy person, even if they weren't part of the congregation, even if they didn't even know any of the people involved.

Mountain Sky conference Bishop Karen Olivero was the first openly gay and married bishop in the United Methodist Church, when the Methodists banned homosexuals from ministry in 1984, Oliveto was already going through the ordination process.

Now there are three openly gay and married bishops in the denomination.

I've been in ministry for 42 years.

Every single day in 42 years.

I woke up thinking, is I worried?

Is this the day my ordination will be stripped?

United Methodist Church became America's biggest Protestant domination, and then it became America's third largest religious body in the 1960s.

So it was a tremendously influential, cultural political institution in American society that really helped to shape American democracy almost from its start.

And so many of us were, felt blessed and privileged to be a part of that culture, shaping the institution dating back generations.

As society evolved, the United Methodist or anything but united when it came to LGBTQ plus church rights.

In 2019, traditionalists won an extremely tight vote banning LGBTQ plus clergy and same sex weddings.

They put in place penalty fees for those who violated the rules, but they also passed a provision allowing churches to disaffiliate while keeping their houses of worship.

Those were churches individual denominations already owned.

Many of us had dreaded any formal schism in the denomination, because the vast majority of United Methodist congregations are not strictly conservative, not strictly progressive.

The vast majority were a combination of conservatives, liberals, moderates, and so a schism was going to be very, very messy.

And to exit, you had to have that two thirds vote.

So, you know, a well-funded group and I mean, well-funded group of people really sought to divide the church and weaponize we who are LGBTQIa and weaponize our our bodies, our faith expression, and pitted marginalized groups against each other.

How can you build a church based on who you're leaving out?

It makes me wonder, are you even inviting Christ into a church like that?

So?

So stay.

If these are your beliefs, live by them and let that attract people to you.

The UMC General Council was to address the issue at its 2020 General Conference.

The pandemic caused that gathering to be canceled, but repercussions from the 2019 vote were already beginning.

It's been painful when 2019 happened, the US church said.

We don't recognize our church anymore, and there was so much pushback that the group that thought it would be remaining the more traditionalists wound up having to leave, saying we can't.

We can't live in a church that has this kind of diversity.

So when the conservatives and the US realized that even though the official policies were on their side, but those policies were not going to be endure, we're not going to be upheld by the U.S. church's progressive leadership.

And when they realized they had this narrow window of several years to leave the denomination with their property, conservative resolve to exit and mass.

We didn't create the off ramp.

The one to push the more traditionalist decisions in 2019 created an off ramp for those of us who wanted inclusion, and again, because they went too far and restrictions and the U.S. church pushed back.

They found that they were actually a minority voice.

Theologically conservative churches that supported the ban were the ones who left some 25% of UMC churches in the United States have disaffiliated Half of those churches, mainly larger independent churches, remain unaffiliated, while the other half have joined the newly formed, more traditional, conservative Global Methodist Church.

To the contrary, we reached out multiple times to the Global Methodist Church to learn more about the split and what comes next.

They respectfully declined to be interviewed.

Reverend Keith Boyette, chief correctional officer of the GM church, sent us this email, quote I am familiar with.

To the contrary, and the fact that the program has aired a previous episode on events in the United Methodist Church.

I have no connection with the United Methodist Church, and I am unwilling to comment on any of its activities.

The Global Methodist Church began operations on May 1st, 2022.

We are completely forward looking, focused on our mission to make disciples of Jesus Christ who worship passionately, love extravagantly, and witness boldly.

The local congregations of the GM church have been through a lengthy process of discernment that has led them to depart from the United Methodist Church at great cost for them.

The issues which have led to their departure, and what might continue to unfold in the UMC, are no longer a topic of discussion.

They are moving on.

Under no circumstances would I choose to comment on what has transpired or what is transpiring in the United Methodist Church end quote.

The churches that remained with the UMC also went through a process of dialog and voted to stay.

It started out with just having, face to face conversations about our lives and the people we love.

We use curriculum and, we studied the Bible and talked about different ways to interpret scripture.

But I think the thing that that changed people's hearts the most was inviting folks from the LGBTQ community and their families and and just having them share their stories, share their stories about, how they feel that they are a beloved child of God, but how the church has harmed them in this process.

When a person says they don't accept people who are gay and then their own child or someone that they love and with whom they have had relationship, their entire life comes out to them.

There is some real cognitive dissonance that they need to get around.

So something has to give.

Either they have to reject that person that they have known and loved for their entire life, or they have to recognize that maybe there is something wrong with what I have been told my whole life.

And that's that is a tough pill to swallow.

Because most people now know queer people.

It's their kids, their grandkids that their choir director.

So it's that proximity.

I think that really changed people's attitudes.

We United Methodists, we believe in a God of grace.

We believe in love before law.

We believe in relationships, before regulations.

I think hearts are just changed when you share your story and and not talk from your heart.

I was ordained an elder in the United Methodist Church in 1996, and I served several churches.

And when I met, my beloved and knew that I would be committed to a same sex relationship.

I knew that I would no longer be appointable.

And so I chose to retire because really, I had no choice.

It was a sad decision, for sure.

But Sue Petro, associate pastor at the First United Methodist Church of Grand Rapids, is back at the pulpit.

She was invited to return even before the church updated its social principles.

God really invited me back and provided a supportive and welcoming congregation that I could serve a full year before the General Conference came out with their decision to be a fully inclusive church.

I wasn't looking to come back.

I wasn't even sure I wanted to come back.

but as God would have it, I ran out of ways to say no.

and decided to give it a try.

And, you know, the truth is, I needed a better ending in the church.

Did, too.

For seven years, I did what I could to heal from religious trauma, and I could only go so far because a communal wound needs communal healing.

In 2019, when the decision came to, double down on all of those restrictions.

First United Methodist Church absolutely was concerned that a time would come in the near future when we would need to just affiliate from our beloved tradition.

and we were exploring options in that way.

The vote was nearly unanimous to stay with the United Methodist Church.

The church had been progressive for years, and most of the more conservative parishioners had already left.

It is incorrect to exclude people from clergy missionhood because of who they are and when we put our foot down.

Some people left quietly.

Some people put up a small protest and then left relatively quietly.

and thankfully there there wasn't a big, a big exodus by any means.

It was just a few, few people who believed that the Bible should be taken word for word.

By the time the postponed 2020 General Conference was held in 2024, the more progressive Methodists were able to repeal and replace anti-LGBTQ language such as, quote, the practice of homosexuality is incompatible with Christian teaching.

End quote.

This came out of its social principles.

This has been truly a historic conference, particularly around, the removal of restrictive prohibited have language in a book of discipline, that marginalizes LGBTQ queer persons.

One of the key changes was eliminating a ban on using United Methodist funds to promote acceptance of homosexuality, end quote.

In 2016, General Conference delegates referred to that ban in not supporting the funding of suicide prevention efforts for LGBTQ+ youth.

The rate of of lgtbq kids who try to commit suicide is very high.

when you're told that in your church, that is just one more place that that tells you you're not worthy and that harms people psychologically at harms, people's ability to, advocate for themselves.

it, it just, there's no excuse for churches doing that.

And, I don't want to ever be part of a church that would tell someone, God doesn't love you.

Religious narratives that exclude people, that hoard the blessing.

There's so many people who have been deeply wounded by the church.

and we have to be honest about that and to address that and to attempt to heal that.

I have no ill will towards the United Methodist Church.

They were the ones who raised me and my family, and I began attending Christ United Methodist Church when I was about five years old.

The church was a great fit for my family, so we began attending church on a regular basis every Sunday.

I was confirmed into the United Methodist Church when I was 13.

Annie Elburn was influential in her family's decision to leave the church.

The overwhelming majority of our church community decided to disaffiliate with the United Methodist Church, though our church name is still officially Christ United Methodist Church.

It's just unfortunate that the fact.

that the disaffiliation process is harming the LGBTQ plus community that essentially harms women, harms trans people, harms so many people.

To keep churches in places such as Africa, the UMC included what it calls regionalism in the plan it gives churches in more conservative nations or areas autonomy to make their own rules.

Churches decide whether to accept LGBTQ plus clergy and or officiate same sex weddings.

Despite that provision, at least one African country has disaffiliated from the UMC the Ivory Coast, which is home to about 1 million Methodists.

The decision to welcome LGBTQ+ clergy and perform same sex marriage was greeted by members of the UMC with many emotions.

I wasn't even all that excited or happy at the moment.

I was just, I was just like, finally, we're doing the right thing.

But then a few days later, we had a worship service here at the church, and that's when I really could feel the joy as we celebrated together.

Laure Mieskowski's son will be ordained in the United Church of Christ after he finishes seminary.

I don't I don't wake up anymore with that fear.

I'm going to get to retirement without worrying is someone going to bring me to trial for this?

That is incredible.

And then I think for 42 years I've had to carry this burden.

And what was the cost both to my soul but also to the ministry I had to offer the church.

It is slightly disappointing to me that there are United Methodist Churches out there who who can turn people away and couples away.

that breaks my heart a little bit, but we know that we here at First Methodist Church will be able to carry on without threat of, being having any charges brought upon us, and, that our pastors can continue to do what they need to do without fear of losing their livelihood.

Naysayers predict the move would be a death knell for the UMC.

Church members say it has formally split a church already divided and created a smaller United Methodist Church.

The United Methodist Church has finally taken a big, dangerous step, and it cost us something.

But it also gifted us.

With many things and I'm proud of that.

I am proud of the courage that the church revealed in this decision.

It affects our capacity to to do ministry in the way that we used to as a connectional church.

I mean it a lot of things will change.

We're not a dying congregation.

We have a lot of young families with children.

And I do think that our progressive stance, we have a, gay pride flag that hangs on our church all the time.

And we do have a lot of young folks with children that come to our church.

We we have seen some people who have left their own church because of a disaffiliation and who have been looking for a congregation to land in that is welcoming and and loving.

I try to keep in touch with our young people.

They are over the moon.

I see young people who had been at talking about, I want to go into ministry, but I don't want to serve a church that that is anti-gay.

And they are now saying, you know, I think I can I think I can live out my call.

Although painful and messy and in some cases destructive at the local church level, I do think the schism was ultimately for the best, for everybody.

The denomination had become dysfunctional.

It was locked in perpetual conflict with very different visions of what the church was called to be.

And I think there's a release regardless of what side you're on.

and that we can move forward, finally.

There's something about the conflict that holds you in a particular place and takes your energy and your focus.

And certainly for those of us who have stayed, in the church, you know, we have the ability to, exhale a little bit for sure and to share the good news and to serve our neighbors locally and globally.

The plan now is to look ahead.

I'm still attending United Methodist Church.

I hope to help to found a new Global Methodist congregation in Washington, D.C., where currently there is none.

So that's a vacuum that needs to be filled.

So I hope that, I think that maybe my calling.

Our highest calling is to introduce folks to that God who can cherish them and delight in them.

I feel grateful that I get to be a part of that new chapter and to provide some leadership, because it's going to take a while to live in to this decision.

The energy that we spent arguing with each other, between churches.

Now, we can use that energy to do good work in the world, to continue to feed those that are hungry and advocate for those that need a voice and walk alongside folks.

as as we look for social justice and work for social justice around the world.

And I'm really excited that, actually that a lot of our brother and sister churches in, Africa and other places around the world are staying United Methodist.

This is a moment for us to to put our money where a mouth is.

Over the years, we've put less and less money into working with young people.

In part, we have policies that young people didn't approve of.

They don't want to go to a church that says their friends aren't welcome, that they themselves are welcomed.

It's okay if we are now that church.

Let's make sure we are putting resources into into gatherings for young people, into our camps and and campus ministries so that young people can be touched by this understanding that God loves them no matter what.

(Music) You're watching PBS.

Funding for To the Contrary provided by the E Rhodes and Leona B Carpenter Foundation.

The Park Foundation and the Charles A. Frueauff Foundation Our clergy are celebrating.

Our churches are celebrating.

Our Ladies.....

Right now, I'm in Alaska, where this region's women's group is meeting the United Women in Faith.

They are all celebrating.

I am relieved and overjoyed that those who have gifts and graces to serve the church can do so, regardless of how they self-identify.

Love wins.

And I stand here today with joy in my heart to say that when we say all as a denomination now.

All truly means ALL.

Can we say Amen to that people?

(MUSIC) Hello, I'm Bonnie Erbe.

Welcome to a documentary edition of To the Contrary.

The United Methodist Church is charting the future as part of a growing number of Protestant denominations that fully welcome members of the lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, queer and questioning community known as LGBTQ plus.

After a half century of conflict, the UMC is taking a bold step to allow ministry to officiate at same sex weddings and ordain LGBTQ plus clergy.

The decision leaves the UMC, a smaller church, and has dramatically impacted congregants in a very personal way.

My son is trans, and he he did leave the United Methodist Church because he's called to ministry, and at the time, he wasn't allowed, to be a clergy person.

Laure Mieskowski has been an active member of the United Methodist Church of Grand Rapids for 32 years, many of which she served as director of Christian Education.

But the rejection of her son had her thinking about finding another church.

We considered leaving, for a time, but our church created a worship service.

right a day or two after, of lament, and our son came with us and worshiped with us, and we were able to really, lament and cry and acknowledge how hurtful that decision had been.

And that was a really turning point for him and for us.

The unconditional love he received in our congregation was overwhelming.

the denomination did not allow him to pursue becoming clergy, but our congregation embraced him, with, an incredible amount of love and acceptance.

And my husband and I said, no, we're staying.

We're going to we're going to continue to advocate for people like our son.

The battle over homosexuality in the UMC goes back a half century.

In 1972, delegates to the UMC General Conference added the following sentences to the Book of Discipline.

Quote.

We do not condone the practice of homosexuality and consider it incompatible with Christian teaching.

And quote, we do not recommend marriage between two persons of the same sex.

End quote.

The Book of Discipline lays out the law and doctrine of the denomination before adding that change.

There was no mention of homosexuality in the Book of Discipline since then, homosexuality has been the subject of debate and protest at each of the churches general conferences So eventually what was a statement of social witness became church law due to the UMC global presence.

The church, although declining in the US, was growing very fast in Africa, where the churches were very traditional and very conservative.

Mark Tooley, president of the Conservative Institute on Religion and Democracy in Washington, D.C., says it was an important alliance.

So US evangelicals and United Methodist Church became allies with the growing African Church and had a legislative majority at the governing general Conference of the termination, which precluded the denomination from following other mainline Protestant denominations that liberalized their teachings on marriage and sexuality.

Thanks to this, alliance between American evangelicals and African churches had continuously reaffirmed traditional teachings about marriage and sex that precluded any celebration of same sex marriages and required the clergy to be celibate if single or monogamous, and male female marriage.

Otherwise, clergy could be held up on charges and defrocked.

Anyone could bring charges against a pastor in a church.

So, for instance, if someone in Michigan, married a gay couple in their church, somebody in Texas or California could bring a charge against that clergy person, even if they weren't part of the congregation, even if they didn't even know any of the people involved.

Mountain Sky conference Bishop Karen Olivero was the first openly gay and married bishop in the United Methodist Church, when the Methodists banned homosexuals from ministry in 1984, Oliveto was already going through the ordination process.

Now there are three openly gay and married bishops in the denomination.

I've been in ministry for 42 years.

Every single day in 42 years.

I woke up thinking, is I worried?

Is this the day my ordination will be stripped?

United Methodist Church became America's biggest Protestant domination, and then it became America's third largest religious body in the 1960s.

So it was a tremendously influential, cultural political institution in American society that really helped to shape American democracy almost from its start.

And so many of us were, felt blessed and privileged to be a part of that culture, shaping the institution dating back generations.

As society evolved, the United Methodist or anything but united when it came to LGBTQ plus church rights.

In 2019, traditionalists won an extremely tight vote banning LGBTQ plus clergy and same sex weddings.

They put in place penalty fees for those who violated the rules, but they also passed a provision allowing churches to disaffiliate while keeping their houses of worship.

Those were churches individual denominations already owned.

Many of us had dreaded any formal schism in the denomination, because the vast majority of United Methodist congregations are not strictly conservative, not strictly progressive.

The vast majority were a combination of conservatives, liberals, moderates, and so a schism was going to be very, very messy.

And to exit, you had to have that two thirds vote.

So, you know, a well-funded group and I mean, well-funded group of people really sought to divide the church and weaponize we who are LGBTQIa and weaponize our our bodies, our faith expression, and pitted marginalized groups against each other.

How can you build a church based on who you're leaving out?

It makes me wonder, are you even inviting Christ into a church like that?

So?

So stay.

If these are your beliefs, live by them and let that attract people to you.

The UMC General Council was to address the issue at its 2020 General Conference.

The pandemic caused that gathering to be canceled, but repercussions from the 2019 vote were already beginning.

It's been painful when 2019 happened, the US church said.

We don't recognize our church anymore, and there was so much pushback that the group that thought it would be remaining the more traditionalists wound up having to leave, saying we can't.

We can't live in a church that has this kind of diversity.

So when the conservatives and the US realized that even though the official policies were on their side, but those policies were not going to be endure, we're not going to be upheld by the U.S. church's progressive leadership.

And when they realized they had this narrow window of several years to leave the denomination with their property, conservative resolve to exit and mass.

We didn't create the off ramp.

The one to push the more traditionalist decisions in 2019 created an off ramp for those of us who wanted inclusion, and again, because they went too far and restrictions and the U.S. church pushed back.

They found that they were actually a minority voice.

Theologically conservative churches that supported the ban were the ones who left some 25% of UMC churches in the United States have disaffiliated Half of those churches, mainly larger independent churches, remain unaffiliated, while the other half have joined the newly formed, more traditional, conservative Global Methodist Church.

To the contrary, we reached out multiple times to the Global Methodist Church to learn more about the split and what comes next.

They respectfully declined to be interviewed.

Reverend Keith Boyette, chief correctional officer of the GM church, sent us this email, quote I am familiar with.

To the contrary, and the fact that the program has aired a previous episode on events in the United Methodist Church.

I have no connection with the United Methodist Church, and I am unwilling to comment on any of its activities.

The Global Methodist Church began operations on May 1st, 2022.

We are completely forward looking, focused on our mission to make disciples of Jesus Christ who worship passionately, love extravagantly, and witness boldly.

The local congregations of the GM church have been through a lengthy process of discernment that has led them to depart from the United Methodist Church at great cost for them.

The issues which have led to their departure, and what might continue to unfold in the UMC, are no longer a topic of discussion.

They are moving on.

Under no circumstances would I choose to comment on what has transpired or what is transpiring in the United Methodist Church end quote.

The churches that remained with the UMC also went through a process of dialog and voted to stay.

It started out with just having, face to face conversations about our lives and the people we love.

We use curriculum and, we studied the Bible and talked about different ways to interpret scripture.

But I think the thing that that changed people's hearts the most was inviting folks from the LGBTQ community and their families and and just having them share their stories, share their stories about, how they feel that they are a beloved child of God, but how the church has harmed them in this process.

When a person says they don't accept people who are gay and then their own child or someone that they love and with whom they have had relationship, their entire life comes out to them.

There is some real cognitive dissonance that they need to get around.

So something has to give.

Either they have to reject that person that they have known and loved for their entire life, or they have to recognize that maybe there is something wrong with what I have been told my whole life.

And that's that is a tough pill to swallow.

Because most people now know queer people.

It's their kids, their grandkids that their choir director.

So it's that proximity.

I think that really changed people's attitudes.

We United Methodists, we believe in a God of grace.

We believe in love before law.

We believe in relationships, before regulations.

I think hearts are just changed when you share your story and and not talk from your heart.

I was ordained an elder in the United Methodist Church in 1996, and I served several churches.

And when I met, my beloved and knew that I would be committed to a same sex relationship.

I knew that I would no longer be appointable.

And so I chose to retire because really, I had no choice.

It was a sad decision, for sure.

But Sue Petro, associate pastor at the First United Methodist Church of Grand Rapids, is back at the pulpit.

She was invited to return even before the church updated its social principles.

God really invited me back and provided a supportive and welcoming congregation that I could serve a full year before the General Conference came out with their decision to be a fully inclusive church.

I wasn't looking to come back.

I wasn't even sure I wanted to come back.

but as God would have it, I ran out of ways to say no.

and decided to give it a try.

And, you know, the truth is, I needed a better ending in the church.

Did, too.

For seven years, I did what I could to heal from religious trauma, and I could only go so far because a communal wound needs communal healing.

In 2019, when the decision came to, double down on all of those restrictions.

First United Methodist Church absolutely was concerned that a time would come in the near future when we would need to just affiliate from our beloved tradition.

and we were exploring options in that way.

The vote was nearly unanimous to stay with the United Methodist Church.

The church had been progressive for years, and most of the more conservative parishioners had already left.

It is incorrect to exclude people from clergy missionhood because of who they are and when we put our foot down.

Some people left quietly.

Some people put up a small protest and then left relatively quietly.

and thankfully there there wasn't a big, a big exodus by any means.

It was just a few, few people who believed that the Bible should be taken word for word.

By the time the postponed 2020 General Conference was held in 2024, the more progressive Methodists were able to repeal and replace anti-LGBTQ language such as, quote, the practice of homosexuality is incompatible with Christian teaching.

End quote.

This came out of its social principles.

This has been truly a historic conference, particularly around, the removal of restrictive prohibited have language in a book of discipline, that marginalizes LGBTQ queer persons.

One of the key changes was eliminating a ban on using United Methodist funds to promote acceptance of homosexuality, end quote.

In 2016, General Conference delegates referred to that ban in not supporting the funding of suicide prevention efforts for LGBTQ+ youth.

The rate of of lgtbq kids who try to commit suicide is very high.

when you're told that in your church, that is just one more place that that tells you you're not worthy and that harms people psychologically at harms, people's ability to, advocate for themselves.

it, it just, there's no excuse for churches doing that.

And, I don't want to ever be part of a church that would tell someone, God doesn't love you.

Religious narratives that exclude people, that hoard the blessing.

There's so many people who have been deeply wounded by the church.

and we have to be honest about that and to address that and to attempt to heal that.

I have no ill will towards the United Methodist Church.

They were the ones who raised me and my family, and I began attending Christ United Methodist Church when I was about five years old.

The church was a great fit for my family, so we began attending church on a regular basis every Sunday.

I was confirmed into the United Methodist Church when I was 13.

Annie Elburn was influential in her family's decision to leave the church.

The overwhelming majority of our church community decided to disaffiliate with the United Methodist Church, though our church name is still officially Christ United Methodist Church.

It's just unfortunate that the fact.

that the disaffiliation process is harming the LGBTQ plus community that essentially harms women, harms trans people, harms so many people.

To keep churches in places such as Africa, the UMC included what it calls regionalism in the plan it gives churches in more conservative nations or areas autonomy to make their own rules.

Churches decide whether to accept LGBTQ plus clergy and or officiate same sex weddings.

Despite that provision, at least one African country has disaffiliated from the UMC the Ivory Coast, which is home to about 1 million Methodists.

The decision to welcome LGBTQ+ clergy and perform same sex marriage was greeted by members of the UMC with many emotions.

I wasn't even all that excited or happy at the moment.

I was just, I was just like, finally, we're doing the right thing.

But then a few days later, we had a worship service here at the church, and that's when I really could feel the joy as we celebrated together.

Laure Mieskowski's son will be ordained in the United Church of Christ after he finishes seminary.

I don't I don't wake up anymore with that fear.

I'm going to get to retirement without worrying is someone going to bring me to trial for this?

That is incredible.

And then I think for 42 years I've had to carry this burden.

And what was the cost both to my soul but also to the ministry I had to offer the church.

It is slightly disappointing to me that there are United Methodist Churches out there who who can turn people away and couples away.

that breaks my heart a little bit, but we know that we here at First Methodist Church will be able to carry on without threat of, being having any charges brought upon us, and, that our pastors can continue to do what they need to do without fear of losing their livelihood.

Naysayers predict the move would be a death knell for the UMC.

Church members say it has formally split a church already divided and created a smaller United Methodist Church.

The United Methodist Church has finally taken a big, dangerous step, and it cost us something.

But it also gifted us.

With many things and I'm proud of that.

I am proud of the courage that the church revealed in this decision.

It affects our capacity to to do ministry in the way that we used to as a connectional church.

I mean it a lot of things will change.

We're not a dying congregation.

We have a lot of young families with children.

And I do think that our progressive stance, we have a, gay pride flag that hangs on our church all the time.

And we do have a lot of young folks with children that come to our church.

We we have seen some people who have left their own church because of a disaffiliation and who have been looking for a congregation to land in that is welcoming and and loving.

I try to keep in touch with our young people.

They are over the moon.

I see young people who had been at talking about, I want to go into ministry, but I don't want to serve a church that that is anti-gay.

And they are now saying, you know, I think I can I think I can live out my call.

Although painful and messy and in some cases destructive at the local church level, I do think the schism was ultimately for the best, for everybody.

The denomination had become dysfunctional.

It was locked in perpetual conflict with very different visions of what the church was called to be.

And I think there's a release regardless of what side you're on.

and that we can move forward, finally.

There's something about the conflict that holds you in a particular place and takes your energy and your focus.

And certainly for those of us who have stayed, in the church, you know, we have the ability to, exhale a little bit for sure and to share the good news and to serve our neighbors locally and globally.

The plan now is to look ahead.

I'm still attending United Methodist Church.

I hope to help to found a new Global Methodist congregation in Washington, D.C., where currently there is none.

So that's a vacuum that needs to be filled.

So I hope that, I think that maybe my calling.

Our highest calling is to introduce folks to that God who can cherish them and delight in them.

I feel grateful that I get to be a part of that new chapter and to provide some leadership, because it's going to take a while to live in to this decision.

The energy that we spent arguing with each other, between churches.

Now, we can use that energy to do good work in the world, to continue to feed those that are hungry and advocate for those that need a voice and walk alongside folks.

as as we look for social justice and work for social justice around the world.

And I'm really excited that, actually that a lot of our brother and sister churches in, Africa and other places around the world are staying United Methodist.

This is a moment for us to to put our money where a mouth is.

Over the years, we've put less and less money into working with young people.

In part, we have policies that young people didn't approve of.

They don't want to go to a church that says their friends aren't welcome, that they themselves are welcomed.

It's okay if we are now that church.

Let's make sure we are putting resources into into gatherings for young people, into our camps and and campus ministries so that young people can be touched by this understanding that God loves them no matter what.

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