>> "DONNYBROOK" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETSY AND THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION, AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.

>> JUNE IS BUSTING OUT ALL OVER.

OUR FIRST EPISODE FOR JUNE, TWO WEEKS AWAY FROM DONNY BASH.

MORE DETAILS ABOUT THAT LATER.

FIRST, LET'S MEET THE PANELISTS.

STARTING WITH WENDY WIESE OF THE JENNIFER AND WENDY SHOW ON THE BIG 550KTRS, BILL McCLELLAN, COLUMNIST WITH THE "ST. LOUIS POST DISPATCH" AND STLTODAY.COM.

RAY HARTMANN FROM RAY HARTMANN ST. LOUIS INSIDER, WHICH WE CAN FIND ON SUBSTACK AND EDITOR AND COLUMNIST WITH THE "ST. LOUIS AMERICAN" ALVIN REID.

HEY, A LITTLE PROGRAM NOTE, HALFWAY THROUGH, WESLEY BELL, ST. LOUIS COUNTY PROSECUTING ATTORNEY WILL JOIN US ON "NEXT UP."

BILL AND WENDY WITH THE QUESTIONS.

HOPE YOU TUNE IN.

WENDY, I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT BIG NEWS FROM THE ST. LOUIS ARCHDIOCESE BUT NOT AS BIG AS SOME PEOPLE EXPECTED.

AT ONE POINT, IT WAS SUGGESTED THAT MAYBE HALF OF THE ARCHDIOCESE'S 178 PAR ISHDS WOULD WOULD BE CLOSED.

INSTEAD 35 ARE CLOSED, 15 BEING CONSOLIDATED.

IS THIS REALLY BIG NEWS FOR THE REGION OR ONLY FOR CATHOLICS?

>> OH, GOSH, THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.

I THINK IT'S CERTAINLY BIG NEWS FOR CATHOLICS.

IT'S CERTAINLY BIG NEWS FOR THE CATHOLIC CHURCH.

IT'S NOT SURPRISING BECAUSE THEY ROLLED THIS IDEA OF ALL THINGS NEW OUT A COUPLE YEARS AGO, SO PEOPLE HAVE BEEN EXPECTING IT.

WHAT TO EXPECT WAS THAT WAS OBVIOUSLY THE MYSTERY, BUT IT IS -- WHILE IT IS INCREDIBLY SAD FOR THE PEOPLE WHOSE PARISHES HAVE BEEN IMPACTED, AND FOR THE PEOPLE WHO, JUST THE IDEA OF A NEIGHBORHOOD PARISH HAS BEEN IMPACTED, ARCHBISHOP ROZANSKI SAID FOR THE FIRST TIME SINCE THE 1960s, THE NUMBER OF CATHOLICS HAS DIPPED BELOW 500,000, AND THE CITY, THE ARCHDIOCESE OF ST. LOUIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN ONE OF THE LARGEST ARCHDIOCESE IN THE COUNTRY.

SO IT'S SORT OF JUST THE REALITY OF THE SITUATION, SOMETHING HAS TO CHANGE, AND THIS IS HOW THEY HAVE CHOSEN TO DO IT.

I KNOW THAT DOESN'T BRING ANY COMFORT AT ALL TO THE PEOPLE SADDENED BY A LIFELONG AFFILIATION ENDING, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU JUST HOPE THAT THINGS ARE RESOLVED IN A SUITABLE WAY, AND A COMFORTABLE WAY FOR EVERYBODY.

>> AS A NON-CATHOLIC, AND IN FACT, AS AN ORANGEMAN, I THINK THAT IT'S REALLY BIG NEWS, THE DECLINE OF THE CHURCH IN THE CITY, AND THE COUNTY, IN THAT THE CHURCH HAS BEEN SUCH A PART OF THE FABRIC OF ST. LOUIS, AND THE CATHOLIC SCHOOLS HAVE BEEN SO IMPORTANT THAT THE DECLINE OF THE CHURCH IS A BIG STORY, I THINK.

>> OH, IT DEFINITELY IS, BUT YOU LOOK AT SMALLER FAMILIES.

LOOK AT HOW MUCH THE CHURCH HAS CHANGED, AND NOT JUST IN ST. LOUIS, EVERYWHERE, ALL DENOMINATIONS ARE SEEING THESE TYPES OF NUMBERS, AND I THINK EROSION IN THE NUMBER OF MEMBERS, BUT WHEN HE SAID THAT STATISTICALLY WE SHOULD BE SEEING SOME KIND OF MOVEMENT, BECAUSE WE'RE HAVING MORE BIRTHS AND FEWER FUNERALS, SO BUT HE SAID THAT'S NOT HAPPENING.

>> AT ONE POINT, THE ST. LOUIS ARCHDIOCESE ENCOMPASSED 17 STATES, IT WAS A HUGE THING.

TIMES HAVE CHANGED.

THE ONE THING THAT CONCERNS ME IS THE OUTREACH, BECAUSE A LOT OF THESE PARISHES DO GOOD WORK IN THE COMMUNITY AMONG THE POOR AND OTHERS.

>> SENIORS.

>> IT'S A SOCIAL SPOT, ST. PETER'S FOR THE SPRING FEST OR THE FISH FRIES AND THERE WAS A HARVARD PROFESSOR WHO WROTE A BOOK HOW WE'RE ALL FRAGMENTED, BUOYING ALONE.

TO SOME EXTENT IT IS BRINGING THE CHURCHES TOGETHER.

>> THE ROCK STREET CHURCH IS DOWN THE STREET FROM US AND IT'S HARD-PRESSED TO CLOSE ANY CHURCH IN AN AREA WHERE MOST OF THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE AROUND IT ARE, I WON'T SAY POOR BUT ARE NOT ON THE OHIOHIGOHIHIGHER END OF THE ECONOMIC SCALE.

THEY'RE PROVIDING AN ANCHOR IN THE COMMUNITY YOU'RE TAKING AWAY BE .

WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN TO THE MARVELOUS CHURCH AND BUILDING RIGHT THERE?

WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN JUST TO THAT LITTLE PART OF LIKE NEAR NORTH ST. LOUIS?

IF THERE'S NOENCE A, THAT'S REALLY SAD.

>> IF I HAD A BUSINESS SCHOOL, I WOULD HAVE A COURSE ON THE CATHOLIC CHURCH THAT THIS IS THE LONGEST-STANDING BUSINESS, I CAN IMAGINE, OVER 2,000 YEARS OLD AND IT JUST KEEPS CHUGGING ALONG.

SO I THINK THAT THE CHURCH WILL FIND A WAY FORWARD.

>> LET ME ASK YOU, BILL, WHILE WE HAVE YOU, WHILE YOU HAVE THE MICROPHONE, I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT A COUPLE OF VETOES BY THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE SAM PAGE THIS WEEK.

ONE WAS THE BILL WE TALKED ABOUT A LITTLE BIT EARLIER THAT WOULD HAVE PROHIBITED PEOPLE FROM WALKING ON COUNTY ROADS UNINCORPORATED ST. LOUIS COUNTY IF THERE IS A SIDEWALK.

HE VETOED THAT, AND THEN THE OTHER WAS A BILL THAT WOULD HAVE REVERSED SOME OF THE RESTRICTIONS ON SELLING CIGARETTES NEAR DAY CARE CENTERS AND SCHOOLS.

HOW'D YOU FEEL ABOUT THOSE?

>> I THOUGHT SAM PAGE WAS INCORRECT ON BOTH.

I HAD -- YOU KNOW, NOT WALKING ON THE STREETS WAS AN EFFORT TO STOP THE PEOPLE WHO SOLICIT BETWEEN CARS AND -- >> WITH CHILDREN SOMETIMES.

>> AND I'M AGAINST THAT.

I THINK THAT'S DANGEROUS, AND THEY THREW IN THE JOGGING, JUST TO MAKE IT SEEM LIKE THEY WEREN'T PICKING ON ONE GROUP AND I WAS DELIGHTED.

I THOUGHT DO SOMETHING ABOUT THESE JOGGERS ON THE STREETS.

GOOD IDEA.

AS FAR AS THE CIGARETTES GO, IF YOU HAVE A CONVENIENCE STORE AND ONE OF YOUR BIG ITEMS IS CIGARETTES, YOU SHOULDN'T BE RESTRICTED JUST BECAUSE YOU'RE NEAR A SCHOOL OR A DAY CARE CENTER.

IF KIDS ARE GOING TO SMOKE, THEY'RE GOING TO SMOKE.

I MEAN, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THE NEARBY CONVENIENCE STORE HAS CIGARETTES.

>> I AGREE.

YOU'RE HURTING THE MERCHANTS.

YOU'RE HERT AURTING THE MERCHANTS.

>> YES.

>> THE CHILDREN FROM THE DAY CARE ARE NOT GOING TO BE COMING INTO THE CONVENIENCE STORE TO BUY CIGARETTES.

THE CHILDREN FROM THE SCHOOLS ARE NOT -- I MEAN, DO WE REALLY WANT TO -- DO WE WANT TO SET THE BAR THAT HIGH?

WE CAN'T HAVE CIGARETTES IN THE VICINITY -- WHAT ABOUT THE PARENTS WHO PICK UP CARPOOL WITH CIGARETTES IN THEIR ASHTRAY OR THEIR, YOU KNOW, THEIR CONSOLE?

>> IF THERE'S AN ORDINANCE THAT SAYS, OKAY, YOU CANNOT SELL CIGARETTES WITHIN THIS DISTANCE FROM MY SCHOOL, THEN I THINK WE SHOULD BACK THAT UP.

>> OH, MY GOSH, IT'S NOT A STRIP CLUB, THOUGH.

THESE ARE JUST CIGARETTES.

>> THEY'RE A LOT MORE DANGEROUS THAN A STRIP CLUB.

>> THEY ARE KILLERS AND THE NUMBER OF SMOKERS CONTINUES TO DECLINE.

>> SO LET'S KEEP IT DECLINING.

>> OH MY GOSH -- >> CAN I -- >> NO, I JUST DON'T SEE THE -- >> HE CAN'T SPEAK.

>> THAT'S APPARENTLY MY PROBLEM.

I WOULD SAY MY FELLOW FOUNDER IS HALF RIGHT.

I HAVE TO, BECAUSE I THINK SAM PAGE WAS RIGHT TO VETO THE BILL THAT WOULD TARGET PEOPLE -- FIRST OF ALL, THERE'S ALREADY AN ORDINANCE, I THINK TIM FITCH ACTUALLY TWEETED THERE'S ALREADY AN ORDINANCE ON THE BOOKS THAT SAYS YOU GOT TO WALK ON THE SIDEWALK WHEN YOU CAN.

SO BUT THE BILL ITSELF WAS TERRIBLY WRITTEN, AND IF THEY WANT TO SPECIFICALLY TARGET PEOPLE WHO ARE COMING UP TO CARS IN AN ERA OF CARJACKING THAT'S ONE THING.

>> BUT THEY CAN'T.

>> SO THEN THEY HAVE THE RIGHT.

YOU HAVE TO RESPECT THE LAW AND YOU CERTAINLY -- THE MESSAGE THAT WAS SENDING TO DISABLED PEOPLE WAS TERRIBLE.

IT WAS A BAD IDEA.

ON THE OTHER SIDE, ON THE CIGARETTE THING, AND I'M BIG ON RAISING TOBACCO TAXES AND A LOT OF OTHER THINGS TO REDUCE SMOKING AS BEST WE CAN, IF SOMEBODY OWNS A BUSINESS NOW, AND CONVENIENCE STORE, IT IS GROSSLY UNFAIR TO THEM TO COME ALONG WHEN THEY'VE BEEN OPERATING IT AND THEIR TOBACCO LICENSE IS A BIG PART OF THEIR ASSET, AND BASICALLY IT'S -- I DON'T THINK IT WOULD HOLD UP IN COURT.

THE IDEA YOU COULD TAKE THE VALUE OF THEIR BUSINESS AWAY, ONE, AND AGAIN, THE WHOLE IDEA IS, THIS ISN'T ABOUT PEOPLE SELLING HEROIN ON PLAYGROUNDS.

A THOUSAND FEET IS THREE BLOCKS.

I MEAN, IT'S NOT THAT CLOSE, AND LET ME ASK YOU THIS.

YOU THINK -- I'LL BET YOU THERE'S SHNOOKS AND JIBBERS THAT ARE WITHIN A THOUSAND FEET OF A SCHOOL OR DAY CARE.

>> WE'LL SEE.

I THINK THERE'S ALL KINDS OF BUSINESSES WHERE SOMEBODY HAS HELD A LICENSE AND THEY SAID WHEN YOU ARE NO LONGER THE OWNER OF THIS BUSINESS, WHOEVER BUYS IT, WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SELL X, Y, Z, OR YOU CAN'T SMELT HERE ANYMORE ON YOUR JUNKYARD, BUT WE'RE DONE WITH THE SMELTER.

>> ALVIN, YOU'RE RIGHT.

"THE POST DISPATCH" -- >> THANK YOU, JUDGE BRENNAN.

I DON'T THINK SO.

HE THINKS IT'S FINE TO -- >> THERE WERE FOUR BUSINESSES THAT WENT IN FRONT OF THE COUNTY COUNCIL, AND THEY MADE YOUR PLEA, AND THEN THE HEALTH DIRECTOR FOR THE COUNTY WHO WAS ONLY RELYING ON FACTS, SHE NOTICED THAT THOSE BUSINESSES HAD LIKE 14 VIOLATIONS OF SELLING TO MINORS IN THE LAST TWO YEARS, AND THE POINT IS, THESE BUSINESSES ARE SELLING TO MINORS, AND IF YOU KEEP THEM FURTHER AWAY FROM A SCHOOL, ESPECIALLY -- I AGREE WITH YOU, WENDY, I DON'T THINK TOO MANY KIDS IN PRESCHOOL ARE BUYING CIGARETTES LEGALLY OR SMOKING.

I DON'T SEE IT TOO OFTEN.

>> YOU GET ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF HISTORY, RAY.

SMOKING -- >> I -- >> IF A KID WANTS TO SMOKE, CIGARETTES ARE LEGAL, THE KID IS GOING TO -- >> NOT FOR KIDS.

>> THAT'S A GOOD POINT.

>> LET'S MOVE ON.

I'M SORRY.

BRING IT UP WITH WESLEY.

>> THEY'RE AVAILABLE FOR PURCHASE.

>> EXACTLY.

>> ALVIN, I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT THOMAS ABT, THE AUTHOR OF "BLEEDING OUT" AND 2019 STORYBOOK ABOUT FOCUSED DETERRENCE, WHICH IS A WAY HE BELIEVES VIOLENT CRIME CAN BE REDUCED IN CITIES, AND HE SAYS IT'S BEEN DONE IN BOSTON AND OAKLAND AND ELSEWHERE.

SO THIS PAST WEEK, THE EAST-WEST GATEWAY COUNCIL OF GOVERNMENTS VOTED UNANIMOUSLY TO START NEGOTIATING WITH HIM TO BRING HIS PROGRAM TO ST. LOUIS.

THIS IS JUST A COUPLE YEARS AFTER WE WENT WITH ANOTHER PROGRAM CALLED CURE VIOLENCE OUT OF CHICAGO.

SO WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THE REGIONAL LEADERS DECIDING TO GO WITH ANOTHER PLAN TO FIGHT CRIME?

>> WELL, WHILE THEY'RE NEGOTIATING, I HOPE THEY FIGURE OUT A REALLY LOW PRICE FOR THIS.

MY BIGGEST PROBLEM IS, HE WAS AT THIS CRIME SUMMIT AND MADE A PRESENTATION.

THAT'S POINT "A."

AND NOW ABOUT TO GET HIRED.

WHEN YOU GO FROM POINT "A" DIRECTLY TO POINT "B" AND POINT "B" IS SOMEBODY IS GETTING PAID THAT TROUBLES ME.

THAT NEVER SITS RIGHT WITH ME.

IS HE THE ONLY PERSON IN THE WORLD THAT COULD DO THIS?

DID WE CHECK ANYPLACE ELSE?

WHY HIM?

WHY NOW?

WHAT IS THIS AMOUNT OF MONEY?

I DON'T KNOW.

THAT JUST DOESN'T SIT TIGHT.

>> HE'S GOT CREDENTIALS.

HE WORKED FOR THE OBAMA JUSTICE DEPARTMENT, HARVARD PROFESSOR.

>> I MADE A PRESENTATION.

WE TALKED ABOUT THE PRESENTATION LAST WEEK AND SO -- >> NOW HE'S HIRED.

>> LITERALLY 12 DAYS AGO.

>> TRANSFORM -- >> LET'S NOT DELAY.

CRIME'S A PROBLEM.

>> BUT CURE VIOLENCE WAS GOING TO BE THE SOLUTION.

SORRY, RAY.

>> NO, KNOCK YOURSELF OUT.

THIS WAS -- THIS GUY, I'M SURE HE'S A FINE GUY.

>> HE IS.

>> GREAT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS OUR CIVIC INFERIORITY COMPLEX AGAIN, GOING TO OUT-OF-TOWN EXPERTS.

HE'S APPARENTLY, BEST I CAN TELL, A COMPETITOR TO CURE VIOLENCE, HAS A COMPETITIVE VIEW OF THE SAME STUFF.

IF HIS STUFF IS SO GOOD, ALL WE HAVE TO DO IS FIND THE CITY THAT IS USING IT, AND SEND A DELEGATION TO THAT CITY.

>> WAIT, THERE WAS A PROBLEM WITH CURE VIOLENCE, BECAUSE ONE OF THE CURE VIOLENCE EMPLOYEES WAS ARRESTED FOR COVERING UP A MURDER.

>> TERRIFIC.

THIS ISN'T ABOUT -- >> CHARLIE, THAT'S TOO HARSH.

>> THE BOTTOM LINE IS, I DON'T CARE WHICH -- THE THING IS THIS, THE STORY -- THE BIG THING WITH THE CRIME SUMMIT AND BILL GOT MAD AT ME.

>> I THOUGHT YOU WERE UNFAIR TO JACOB, THE REPORTER.

>> HE'S A GOOD REPORTER, I NOTED AND I STILL THINK IT'S RIDICULOUS THAT THE "POST DISPATCH" DIDN'T POINT OUT THE MEDIAS AKICKED OUT.

>> WE DID.

TONY MESSENGER WAS THERE, SO YOU HAD PULITZER PRIZE WINNING COLUMNIST AND REPORTER.

>> THIS WAS SECRETED FROM THE PUBLIC.

BY THE WAY, RANK-AND-FILE POLICE OFFICERS WEREN'T INVITED EITHER, JUST THE BRASS.

>> I AGREE WITH YOU ON THAT.

>> MY POINT IS IT WAS A JOKE OF A CRIME SUMIT TO START WITH AND FOR A FEW HOURS, IT WAS PREDICTED IN THAT STORY ACCURATELY THAT IT WAS, WHAT DID HE CALL IT?

>> AUDITION.

>> AUDITION.

>> AUDITION, THE POINT IS, THE GUY MAY BE FINE BUT WE HAVE GOT TO GET OVER OURSELVES WITH GOING WITH AN OUT-OF-TOWN EXPERTS.

>> WE HAVE TO BRING IN OUT-OF-TOWN EXPERTS BECAUSE IT'S NOT WORKING LOCALLY.

HAVE YOU NOTICED?

>> BUT CURE VIOLENCE DID NOT WORK LOCALLY, CORRECT?

>> IT WAS OUT OF CHICAGO.

>> THAT DIDN'T WORK IN CHICAGO.

THAT'S THE THING.

>> WAIT, BUT BY THEN, SO YOU'RE SAYING -- >> I'D RATHER HAVE A PRIVATIZED POLICE, SECURITY FIRMS COME IN HERE, FRANKLY AND JUST KEEP CONTINUING THIS CYCLE OF WE KEEP TRYING TO DO THE SAME THING.

>> I HAVE A BETTER IDEA FOR SOMEPLACE ELSE.

I THINK IT'S NOT GOOD THE POLICE CHIEF DOESN'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT SAFETY.

>> I AGREE >> WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME REGIONAL LEADERS VOTED UNANIMOUSLY ON ANYTHING.

>> THAT'S ANOTHER.

>> STEVE EHLMANN WAS NOT -- >> I MEAN TRACY I'VE HEARD NOTHING BUT GOOD THINGS ABOUT HIM.

>> YOU THINK IT'S A 90-MINUTE SHOW?

LET'S MOVE ON.

OKAY, NOW YOU, FRIEND OF BABO LACKLAND, ONE OF THE TOP HOTEL OPERATORS IN TOWN, HE CAME OUT LAST WEEK IN A COLUMN, I THINK JACOBS KERNS' STORY IN "THE BUSINESS JOURNAL."

O'LOUGHLIN SAYS WE NEED MORE HOTELS AND NEED TO REFORM THE GUN LAWS.

NICK DESIDERI SAYS HE COULD SPEND MORE ON PUBLIC SAFETY.

HE SPENT MORE THAN $1 MILLION ON LIGHTS IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS AND MAYBE HE COULD HELP REDUCE POVERTY AROUND ST. LOUIS.

WAS THAT A LITTLE BIT FLIP AND SNARKY ON BEHALF OF CITY HALL?

>> FIRST OF ALL, BOB IS IN MY MIND, NO QUESTION, I WAS ON THE TOURISM COMMISSION WITH HIM 40 YEARS AGO, AND HE'S ONE OF THE -- I THINK HE'S UNPARALLELED AS AN ENTREPRENEURIAL SUCCESS IN THIS TOWN.

I THINK WE OUGHT TO AT LEAST LISTEN TO HIM AND HIS POLITICS AND MINE ARE VERY DIFFERENT BUT I'LL SAY THIS.

SO HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO SAY WHAT HE SAID ABOUT DOWNTOWN AND IT'S ONE OF THE CONSTITUENCIES THAT NEEDS TO BE LISTENED TO ALONG WITH THE CONDO OWNERS BUT AS FAR AS NICK DESIDERI, YOU KNOW, HE MADE A POINT THAT -- HE'S A VERY ACCESSIBLE SPOKESPERSON.

HE'S A REALLY GOOD ONE, AND HE MADE A THROW-AWAY ABOUT WELL IF HE WANTS TO, MAYBE HE OUGHT TO BE HELPING US IN DOWNTOWN.

I DON'T REALLY AGREE WITH HIM SUBSTANTIVELY.

>> RA I DON'T THINK IT WAS A BIG DEAL.

>> RAY, I JUST DON'T SEE THAT POKING THE BEAR, WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR A LARGE PART OF THIS REGION'S ECONOMIC ENGINE, POKING HUM AND SAYING ESSENTIALLY BY INVESTING IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS IN TERMS OF UNION STATION, THE WHEEL, THE AQUARIUM, YOU HAVEN'T DONE ENOUGH BECAUSE THAT'S HOW THATBY INVESTING IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS IN TERMS OF UNION STATION, THE WHEEL, THE AQUARIUM, YOU HAVEN'T DONE ENOUGH BECAUSE THAT'S HOW THATESSENTIALLY BY INVESTING IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS IN TERMS OF UNION STATION, THE WHEEL, THE AQUARIUM, YOU HAVEN'T DONE ENOUGH BECAUSE THAT'S HOW THAT READ TO THIS PERSON AND A LOT OF OTHER PEOPLE WHO READ IT.

THAT IS LOW BROW, AND IT CANNOT HAPPEN, BECAUSE BOB O'LOUGHLIN MIGHT BE OUT THERE DISASSEMBLING THE WHEEL BEFORE WE KNOW IT AND MOVING IT OUT TO WESTPORT AND I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE WOULD BE OKAY WITH THAT.

>> ALRIGHT, WELL I'LL STAND ALONE HERE.

I'M JUST KIND OF LIKE ALRIGHT, APPRECIATE EVERYTHING YOU'VE DONE, OKAY?

BUT IF I COME AT YOU, YOU COME AT ME AND I COME BACK AT YOU, I DON'T WANT -- I DON'T LIKE THE ARGUMENT, LOOK WHAT ALL I'VE DONE FOR ST. LOUIS.

WELL, OKAY, MAN, IT AIN'T FREE.

YOU'RE MAKING SOME MONEY OFF YOUR INVESTMENT.

YOU COULD PROBABLY MAKE MORE.

I UNDERSTAND THAT.

>> NOT IF PEOPLE ARE AFRAID -- >> BUT I HEAR YOU, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I AM NOT GOING TO BE LECTURED TO BY PEOPLE WHO HAVE MONEY INVESTED IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS, BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN RIGHT ALONG WITH EVERYBODY ELSE WHEN THE WHOLE PLACE WENT TO HELL.

SO I MEAN, I JUST KIND OF JUST -- GOD BLESS THEM ALL.

>> ARE YOU INFERRING WE CLIMBED OUR WAY OUT OF -- >> NO.

>> IT'S NO BIG DEAL FOR -- >> WE'VE ALL BEEN IN THE SAME ARC AS IT JUST LISTED OR WHATEVER.

AND I DON'T THINK ANYBODY GETS A RIDE -- >> THAT'S JUST NOT SMART.

>> IT'S BALL PARK HILL, CHESHIRE INN.

>> THFRZ A HUGE MISTAKEN, ALAN.

>> NICK IS A GOOD SPOKESPERSON, RETURNS PHONE CALLS AND HE'S NEW TO THE AREA.

THIS IS A MAN OF SOME SUBSTANCE SAYING WE NEED MORE POLICE.

>> AND HE'S INVESTED -- >> WE NEED MORE LAW AND ORDER.

I DIDN'T THINK THAT WAS OUT OF LINE, OUTLANDISH.

>> YOU MEAN WHAT O'LOUGHLIN SAID.

>> ALL DUE RESPECT BUT THIS COMING BACK AT NICK WITH HOW DARE YOU, I -- >> IF HE IS -- BOB O'LOUGHLIN DIDN'T.

WE ARE.

>> I'M SAYING IT, TOO.

>> THE REACTION IS SUCH THAT I DON'T THINK ANYBODY SHOULD SAY LIKE, OH, HOW DARE YOU TALK TO HIM LIKE THAT?

I'D SAY LIKE NO, YOU SAY ANYTHING YOU WANT TO AND LET HIM FIGHT HIS OWN BATTLE.

>> I THINK YOU CAN HAVE BOTH AT THE SAME TIME.

DO NOT THINK IT WAS A PARTICULARLY GREAT THING FOR HIM TO SAY.

>> THANK YOU.

>> BUT TO ALVIN'S POINT, SO WHAT?

EVERYBODY BE GROWNUPS.

YOU SAY IT IN THE PUBLIC SECTOR.

>> WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE CLAMORING TO GET DOWNTOWN RIGHT NOW.

>> EXCUSE ME, WENDY -- >> SORRY, TO HAVE YOU GUYS SAY HE ALWAYS RETURNS HIS PHONE CALLS.

THAT'S HIS JOB.

THAT'S HIS JOB.

>> I AGREE.

>> I'M THE ONE THAT SAID THAT BUT I'LL SAY THIS.

HE CRITICIZED BOB O'LOUGHLIN, HE'S GOING TO LEAVE TOWN.

THESE ARE BIG BOYS.

THEY SAY THINGS IN PUBLIC, IF SOMEONE WANTS TO RESPOND, FINE.

>> NOBODY'S SAYING THAT, NOBODY'S SAYING -- >> WENDY SAID HE WAS -- >> I SAID -- >> WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A COUPLE OF FAILURES ON THE PART OF GOVERNMENT, BILL, IN MY VIEW.

ONE WOULD BE THE STATE LAST YEAR GOT FEDERAL MONEY, ADMINISTERS THE FOOD STAMP PROGRAM, THE SUPPLEMENTAL NUTRITION ASSISTANCE PROGRAM AND IT GOT ABOUT $240 MILLION TO GIVE TO 600,000 KIDS LAST SUMMER.

TO DATE, IT HASN'T GIVEN A DOLLAR OUT IN THAT PROGRAM.

IT'S THE ONLY STATE IN THE UNION TO BE IN THAT CATEGORY.

BUT THEN, CLOSER TO HOME, IN THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS, IT WAS ONE YEAR AGO TODAY THAT THEY APPROVED $37 MILLION FOR THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR GRANTS PROGRAM, NORTH ST. LOUIS, LET'S FIX UP, WEST FLOORIS AND MARTIN LUTHER KING AND OTHER STREETS.

IT TURNS OUT THE $37 MILLION PROGRAM IS A ZERO MILLION-DOLLAR PROGRAM BECAUSE NOT ONE PENNY OF THAT HAS BEEN SPENT YET.

>> WELL, LET'S GO G FIRST TO THE STATE.

I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY HUNGRY CHILDREN.

>> WELL -- >> EVERYTHING IS UP TO DATE IN MISSOURI.

WE'RE DOING FINE.

I CAN'T UNDERSTAND WHY THEY HAVEN'T SPENT THAT MONEY.

AS FAR AS THE CITY, THAT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE DIFFICULT, BECAUSE YOU CAN'T SPEND EVERYTHING RIGHT AWAY.

I MEAN, I THINK THAT YOU CAN'T BE TOO DOWN ON THE MAYOR FOR NOT SPENDING IT AS SOON AS SHE GETS IT.

BUT THE STATE, I DON'T KNOW WHY THEY DIDN'T SPEND IT.

>> APPARENTLY THE STATE DOES A DATA -- >> THE STATE IS BEING RUN BY PEOPLE WHO DON'T BELIEVE IN GOVERNMENT.

I MEAN THAT'S THE ANSWER THERE.

AS FAR AS THE CITY GOES, YOU KNOW, THE ONLY THING WORSE THAN NOT SPENDING IT IS SPENDING IT HASTILY AND IN A CARELESS MANNER, AND SO I THINK YOU GOT TO GIVE THE ADMINISTRATION A CERTAIN AMOUNT, AS YOU'RE SAYING -- >> YOU ALSO WENT THROUGH THE PROCESS OF GOING TO 28 ALDERPEOPLE AND I THINK THAT HELD THAT WHOLE THING UP.

IT HAS TO NOW, THEY WERE JUST SWORN IN -- >> WEEKS AGO.

>> LITERALLY WEEKS AGO.

NOT THAT, I JUST THINK THAT NOW LET'S GET IT DONE QUICKLY.

I REALLY DO THINK THAT WAS ON HOLD UNTIL YOU GOT YOUR 14.

>> IT'S ADMINISTERED BY THE SLDC, NOT THE ALDERMEN ALTHOUGH THE ORIGINAL LEGISLATION SAID YOU HAD TO HAVE THE ALDERMEN SIGN OFF FOR IT AND LEWIS REED AND OTHERS WERE CONVICTED OF BRIBERY, POLICE SAID MAYBE WE SHOULDN'T HAVE THE ALDERMEN SIGNISIGN ING OFF.

>> SIX MONTHS, YOU COULDN'T DO ANYTHING, YOU WERE LOCKED.

>> THEY HAVE TAKING APPLICATIONS, AND HUNDREDS HAVE COME IN AND NOT A DOLLAR HAS GONE OUT.

I MEAN, IT'S JUST -- >> THEY ACTUALLY PROBABLY REVIEWED THE APPLICATIONS.

>> WITH SOME FORETHOUGHT.

>> HERE'S WHAT I THINK.

FIRST OF ALL, AT THE STATE LEVEL, IT'S THE DEPARTMENT OF ELEMENTARY AND SECONDARY EDUCATION, WHICH HASN'T GOT THE BALL ROLLING HERE.

THEY'RE ACTUALLY ADMINISTERING THIS SUMMER LUNCH BENEFIT.

>> YES.

>> THEY SAID WE DON'T HAVE A DATA COLLECTION PORTAL.

>> RIGHT.

>> LET'S MAKE ONE.

LIKE EVERY OTHER STATE IN THE UNION.

>> I THINK THE STATE AND I THINK THEY HAVE AFFECTED LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE IN TERMS OF MANPOWER.

I MEAN, THE EMPLOYEES, THEY'RE DOWN, TOO.

>> I JUST DON'T THINK GOVERNMENT WORKS AROUND HERE.

>> I THINK THAT'S -- BY THE WAY, I THINK IT'S A VERY FAIR QUESTION TO ASK AND FOR THE MEDIA TO STAY ON.

AND MAYBE I HAVE A DOUBLE STANDARD BECAUSE IT'S WHATEVER, BUT THE STATE, TO ME, A SOCIAL SERVICES RELATED PROGRAM IS JUST NOT GOING TO BE GIVEN A GREAT DEAL OF URGENCY BY THIS PARTICULAR STATE GOVERNMENT.

>> WE HAVE TWO MINUTES TO GO, BILL.

LET ME GO TO YOU ON THIS ONE AND TRY TO SUMMARIZE THIS AS QUICKLY AS POSSIBLE.

THERE IS AN ORGANIZATION THAT'S BASED IN ST. PETERSBURG AND IN ST. LOUIS.

IT'S CALLED THE AFRICAN PEOPLE SOCIALIST PARTY.

ONE OF THEIR AFFILIATED GROUPS IS THE AFRICAN PEOPLE'S EDUCATION AND DEFENSE FUND, WHICH HAS JUST BEEN ALLOWED TO BUY SOME PROPERTY FROM THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS' LRA.

WELL, AS IT TURNS OUT, THE CHAIRMAN OF THE ORGANIZATION, WHOSE NAME IS OMALI YESHITELA, HAS BEEN INDICTED ON BEING AN ILLEGAL RUSSIAN AGENT, ILLEGAL FOREIGN AGENT, IN OTHER WORDS ACCORDING TO THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT, HE'S A PART OF SOME EFFORTS TO SOW DISSENT AND SPREAD PROPAGANDA, INTERFERE IN ELECTIONS.

DO YOU THINK WE SHOULD BE SELLING PROPERTY TO THIS ORGANIZATION?

>> YEAH, SURE, I DO.

IF THEY HAVE A PLAN TO DO SOMETHING, AND THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT DOING SOMETHING IN NORTH ST. LOUIS, I SAY SURE, LET THEM TRY.

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR SOWING DISSENT AND TRYING TO SPREAD -- >> TIKTOK APPARENTLY IS DOING THAT ALL THE TIME, ACCORDING TO JOSH HAWLEY.

>> HOW DO YOU DESCRIBE HIM AS A RUSSIAN AGENT?

SOUNDS LIKE HE'S PART OF THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN.

>> EVERYONE WAS UPSET WHEN TRUMP WAS ALLEGED LL LLY LL LL LLY COLLUDING.

I DIDN'T LIKE WHEN TRUMP WAS UNFAIRLY MALIGNED IN THAT CASE.

HE WASN'T EVEN INDICTED ON THAT.

>> IF RUSSIA BOUGHT NORTH ST. LOUIS AND BUILT A DISNEYLAND, WE'D ALL BE GOING.

>> NO, NO, COME ON.

>> HOLD ON.

>> LET THE PERFECT -- >> HE'S ON YOUTUBE AND SPOUTING THE RUSSIAN TALKING POINTS ABOUT UKRAINE EVEN THOUGH RUSSIA IS BOMBING DAY CARES AND HOSPITALS.

IT'S REALLY NO THAT FUNNY.

>> WE HAVE TO WRAP UP, I'M SORRY.

UNFORGIVING CLOCK.

TIME TO GET TO THE LETTERS AND SEE WHAT YOU HAD TO SAY ABOUT LAST WEEKS PROGRAM.

JAILED PARENTS OF TRUANT KIDS.

ALL PARENTS HAVE TO DO IS HOMESCHOOLING THEIR CHILDREN, NO RULES, NO TESTING AND NO ACCOUNTABILITY FROM MARY GARRETT OF ST. PETERS.

WHY ARE WE HAPPY TO HEAR THAT REPORTED CRIMES ARE DECREASING?

WE CAN ELIMINATE ALL CRIME IF WE SIMPLY QUIT ANSWERING ALL 911 CALLS.

THAT FROM EVERETT LEWIS OF RICHMOND HEIGHTS.

PRESIDING JUDGE ED SPILLANE OUT OF COLLEGE STATION, TEXAS, LONG-TIME FAN AND LISTENER IN TEXAS, USUALLY ON RAY SIDE BUT NOT ON THE SIDE OF HOLDING PARENTS RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR TRUANT CHILDREN.

I'M WITH EVERYONE ELSE.

WRITE US CARE OF 9 PBS, 3655 OLIVE STREET, ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI, 63108.

DON'T FORGET EMAIL, DONNYBROOK @9PBS.ORG AND TWEETS, DONNYBROOK STL.

LISTEN TO US ON YOUR FAVORITE PODCAST SOURCE, APPLE, SPOTIFY, TUNE-IN AND GOOGLE PLAY.

THAT'S IT FOR THE FIRST HALF, BUT STAY TUNED, BECAUSE IN JUST A MOMENT, IT'S "NEXT UP" WITH ST. LOUIS COUNTY PROSECUTING ATTORNEY WESLEY BELL JOINING BILL AND WENDY.

I HOPE YOU JOIN US.

THAT'S NEXT.

>> "DONNYBROOK" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETSY AND THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.