>> Announcer: DONNYBROOK IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETSY AND THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US FOR DONNYBROOK, OUR FIRST FOR THE SUMMER.

WE ARE A BIG SHOW COMING YOUR WAY AND TAULBY ROACH, THE PRESIDENT AND CEO OF BI-STATE, THE OPERATOR OF METROLINK, WHICH MIGHT NORTH AND SOUTH, WILL BE WITH RAY AND WENDY ON THE SECOND HALF.

WE CALL THAT NEXT UP, BUT FIRST BEFORE WE GET INTO SOME OF THE BIG TOPICS THIS WEEK, LET'S MEET OUR ESTEEMED PANEL.

OR ARE THEY STEAMED GIVEN THIS WEATHER?

WE WELCOME BACK WENDY WIESE, COHOST OF THE JENNIFER AND WENDY SHOW.

MR. BILL McCLELLAN FROM STLTODAY.COM AND THE ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH.

RAY HARTMANN FROM RAWSTORY.COM, ST. LOUIS IN THE KNOW ON 550 KTRS AND THE RIVERFRONT TIMES.

AND MR. ALVIN REID, WHO IS THE EDITOR AND SPORTS COLUMNIST FOR YOUR ST. LOUIS AMERICAN.

WELL, I WAS KIND OF UNUSUAL.

I THOUGHT IT WAS ACTUALLY QUITE SAD WHERE FORMER GOVERNOR ERIC GREITENS HAD A CAMPAIGN COMMERCIAL AND IN THIS CAMPAIGN COMMERCIAL, WENDY WIESE, HE COMES OUT GUNS ABLAZING, HEAVY FIREARMS AND LOOKING FOR RINOS, REPUBLICANS IN NAME ONLY.

OUR VIEWERS HAVE BEEN ASKED TO A TWITTER POLL DID THEY FIND IT HUMOROUS BECAUSE FORMER ERIC GREITENS SAID HE MEANT IT TO BE HUMOROUS.

YOU CAN GO TO @DONNYBROOK ON TWITTER AND MAKE YOUR OPINION KNOWN.

WHAT WERE YOUR IMPRESSIONS OF AN AD JUST AFTER UVALDE AND -- >> AND BUFFALO.

>> DID YOU FIND THIS HUMOROUS?

>> NOT IN THE LEAST.

I FOUND IT DEEPLY TROUBLING AND IT'S WHERE WE ARE TODAY.

I THINK THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE FORMER GOVERNOR AND THE FORMER PRESIDENT THAT HE SEEMS TO BENT TO EMULATE IN EVERY WAY, IN ANY WAY HE CAN POLITICALLY FOR THE RED MEAT VOTERS, IS THAT THE PRESIDENT, WHETHER YOU LOVED HIM OR ABHORRED HIM, HE HAD BEEN A -- HE HAD BEEN A PART OF OUR CULTURE FOR DECADES.

SO THERE WAS LIKE A SORT OF BUILT-IN KIND OF FAMILIAR LATER, COMFORT LEVEL, OH, THERE HE GOES AGAIN, THAT'S JUST HIM BEING -- THAT'S DONALD TRUMP BEING DONALD TRUMP.

PEOPLE DON'T HAVE THAT KIND OF SENSE WITH ERIC GREITENS.

HE DOESN'T FEEL FAMILIAR.

HE FEELS, I THINK TO A LOT OF PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY WITH THIS AD, I THINK HE FEELS SCARY.

I MEAN, REALLY SCARY.

AND THE FACT THAT HE AT FIRST CALLED IT FAUX OUTRAGE AND THEN SAID THAT HE WAS JUST BEING FUNNY, IT WAS JUST SORT OF HUMOROUS, TELLS ME THAT NOBODY IS RUNNING -- YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK ANYBODY KNOWS WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE GREITENS CAMPAIGN.

>> I THOUGHT IT WAS FAUX OUTRAGE.

I THOUGHT ALL OF THE REPUBLICANS WHO ARE OUTRAGED BY IT ARE PEOPLE WHO DON'T LIKE ERIC GREITENS AND WANT HIM TO LOSE.

JESS BOGAN HAS A STORY IN THE POST-DISPATCH TOMORROW ABOUT ALL THESE PEOPLE OUT-STATE ENJOYING IT AND SIGNING UP TO GET THE LITTLE RINO TAGS AND EVERYTHING.

I REMEMBER WHEN TRUMP IN 2016, WHEN HE WAS SAYING IF SOMEBODY ATTACKED ONE OF THE PROTESTERS, HE'D PAY FOR THEIR LEGAL DEFENSE, AND THEN JAMIE ALMOND, REMEMBER WHEN HE HAD HIS SHOW, SAYING HE WAS GOING TO TAKE A HOT POKER UP THE DER RIER OF SOME HIGH SCHOOL KIDS, AND IT REALLY WASN'T -- AND, OF COURSE, HE DIDN'T SAY DERRIER BECAUSE THAT'S NOT MANLY ENOUGH FOR THE REPUBLICANS THESE DAYS, BUT I DIDN'T THINK ALMOND SHOULD BE FIRED.

I THOUGHT NOBODY'S TAKING THAT SERIOUSLY, AND I DON'T THINK THAT -- >> I THINK PEOPLE DO TAKE IT SERIOUSLY.

HE WAS FIRED.

>> I THINK DOZENS OF DEAD CHILDREN IN A CLASSROOM AND THEN TO HAVE THIS -- THIS -- I MEAN, IT'S SO CLEARLY A TONE-DEAFNESS THAT WE HAVE HAVEN'T SEEN, AND I UNDERSTAND WHAT -- >> ALL I'M SAYING IS I DON'T -- I AGREE WITH YOU IT'S REVOLTING, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S TAKEN TONE-DEAF.

THAT'S HIS AUDIENCE.

HIS AUDIENCE IN OUT-STATE MISSOURI -- >> THIS IS THE PARTY OF ABRAHAM LINCOLN.

>> GO AHEAD, ALVIN.

>> I AGREE WITH WENDY.

A LOT OF TERMS HAVE BEEN TOSSED AROUND FOR ERIC GREITENS AND HE'S TRYING NOT TO, YOU KNOW, WALK DOWN THAT LANE, BUT THIS ONE TOOK ME, YOU KNOW, ACROSS THAT LINE.

I THINK THERE ARE SOME THINGS NOT RIGHT WITH THE CANDIDATE, AND JUST THE COMMERCIAL ITSELF, IN THE TIMES THAT, YOU KNOW, WE ARE LIVING IN NOW, THE WHOLE FAUX OUTRAGE AND THEN I WAS JUST JOKING, BUT -- ALL RIGHT.

>> HE'S WALKING IT BACK.

WHEN HE SAYS I WAS JUST JOKING, SOMETHING HAPPENED.

>> BUT ERIC GREITENS IS IN THE MIDDLE OF LITIGATION INVOLVING HIS CHILDREN, AND IF YOU WOULD PUT THAT OUT ON TV AND IT WOULD -- MIGHT COST YOU VISITATION RIGHTS, YOU KNOW, WITH YOUR CHILDREN?

THERE'S SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOU.

>> GOOD POINT.

THERE IS SOMETHING ABSOLUTELY -- >> IT'S RECKLESS.

>> I'M NOT TAKING THE BAIT.

WITH NO DISRESPECT, I'M NOT TAKING THE LIBERAL DEBATE FOR OUTRAGING I'M JUST NOT.

>> I'M NOT A LIBERAL.

>> I'M NOT SAYING -- I'M JUST SAYING, I'M NOT TAKING THE BAIT.

FIRST OF ALL, I THINK ERIC GREITENS IS FULLY UNDER CONTROL, KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT HE'S DOING.

HE'S DUMB LIKE A FOX IF YOU WANT TO SAY THAT.

HE IS NOT -- JUST THE FACT THAT HE PORTRAYS HIMSELF AS JUST OUT OF CONTROL GUY, YOU KNOW, STORMING A HOUSE WITH -- WANTING TO KILL RINOS -- >> BUT DO YOU HOW EXPLAIN THE LOOSE TOOTH THAT HIS EX-WIFE SAYS -- >> ALL THIS CAN BE HELD IN THAT COURT.

>> I THINK ERIC GREITENS IS ONE OF THE SCUMMIEST PERSONS THAT EVER WALK THE EARTH.

I'M NOT DEFENDING HIM.

I'M SAYING I DON'T THINK HE'S OUT OF CONTROL WITH THIS AD.

I THINK IT'S CALCULATED TO REACH THE TRUMP BASE.

>> BUT -- >> LET ME FINISH.

TO BILL'S POINT, I THINK IT'S PROBABLY -- IT'S THE ONLY WAY IT BACKFIRES, I THINK IN THE SHORT RUN IT HELPS HIM AND THE ONLY POSSIBILITY OF THIS BACKFIRING ON HIM IS IF DONALD TRUMP -- >> FIZZLES.

>> HIS ENDORSEMENT IS THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS.

HOOMP HE ENDORSES, IF HE DOES, WILL WIN THIS RACE.

PERIOD, END OF REPORT.

>> I DON'T THINK -- >> OH, ABSOLUTELY.

LITTLE QUESTION IS WILL THIS MAKE IT LESS LIKELY THAT EL ENDORSE GREITENS OR AN OPPONENT.

IF THAT HAPPENS, IT WILL BACKFIRE, BUT OTHERWISE IT WON'T HURT HIM AT ALL.

>> BUT IF I CAN JUMP IN HERE -- >> YOU KNOW, WASHINGTON POST HAD A STORY ON LUCAS KUNZ THIS PAST WEEK AND HE'S NOT BRAND DISHING FIREARMS THAT I'VE SEEN, BUT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE DOING THAT NOW.

JASON KINDER RAN FOR OFFICE AND HE SHOWED HOW EVERYONE CAN PUT TOGETHER AND DISASSEMBLE A FIREARM.

WE HAVE A GUY -- YOU HAVE JD VANCE, A COOL GUY RUNNING FOR SENATE IN OHIO AND HERE IN MISSOURI, WE HAVE THIS LUCAS KUNZ WHO'S IMPRESSING LABORERS BECAUSE HE'S ABLE TO CLIMB THIS APPARATUS WITH HIS HANDS AND RING A BELL AT THE TOP AND EVERYONE SAYS WE'RE GOING TO VOTE FOR HIM.

YOU LIKE THIS MACHO MAN CAMPAIGN WITH GREITENS AND EVERYONE ELSE IN THE COUNTRY NOW?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, CANDIDATE McCLOSKEY WAS UPSET WITH THE GUNS -- >> McCLOSKEY?

>> I'M NOT -- I DON'T WANT TO GO DOWN THE PATH OF THE WHOLE, YOU KNOW, HEY, HEY, HEY, * MACHO, MACHO MAN THAT DEFINITELY DOESN'T APPEAL TO ME.

THUS, I WOULD SAY RUN ON YOUR MERIT.

DON'T RUN ON THAT, LUCAS KUNZ, BUT WITH THAT BEING SAID, I -- MAYBE I GET IT.

LIKE WHERE HE'S SAYING CRAZY LIKE A FOX.

IT ISN'T UP TO ME TO SAY IT DOESN'T APPEAL FOR ME, BUT IF IT APPEALS TO ENOUGH PEOPLE, BUT NO.

>> YOU KNOW WHAT I THINK IS HAPPENING?

I THINK THESE ARE ALL IVY LEAGUE GUYS TRYING TO OVERCOMPENSATE.

>> YES, YES!

>> KUNZ WENT TO YALE, FEDDERMAN WENT TO HARVARD OR YALE -- >> YOU'RE MISSING THE POINT.

FIRST OF ALL, LUCAS WAS A MARINE.

HE DID SOME NEGOTIATING OF ARMS DEALS.

HE'S A SERIOUS CANDIDATE IN THAT RESPECT.

HE DID PARODY AD AT THE BEGINNING OF HIS, SHOWING UP WITH A GUN MAKING FUN OF THE GREITENS AD.

HE LOVES TO TALK ABOUT HOW I'VE HAD ALL MY FILL OF ASSAULT WEAPONS WHEN I WAS A MARINE AND I LEARNED NOT TO -- HE TALKS DOWN AND DON'T FORGET, ERIC GREITENS DID THE SAME KIND OF GUN AD IN '16 AND VICKY HARTZLER AFTER UVALDE, EVERYBODY GOT A MAILER SHOWING HER -- >> WAIT, WAIT, LET'S GO BACK.

WHO WAS HE HUNTING BACK WHEN HE RAN?

>> IT WASN'T THE SAME AD OBVIOUSLY.

>> BUT WHO WAS HE HUNTING?

>> I DON'T REMEMBER.

>> ISLAMIC TERRORISTS OR WHATEVER.

NOW HE'S AFTER WHITE PEOPLE AND OH, MY GOD.

>> HERE'S MY POINT.

LUCAS KUNZ IS SPEAKING A LANGUAGE -- I'VE WRITTEN ABOUT THIS FOR OVER A YEAR WHEN I MET HIM.

WHETHER HE PULLS IT OFF OR NOT, I DON'T KNOW.

IT REMINDS ME OF 1976 WHEN I WAS WORKING TO KIT BOND AND JOE CHEESEDALE RAN A SUCCESSFUL POPULIST CAMPAIGN AND BEAT US.

I THINK THE KEY POINT OF LUCAS KUNZ IS POP PULL LINCH AND SPEAKING -- >> THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE ALL DOING.

>> THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE ALL DOING.

>> NO, NO -- [ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> THE THING GOOD LUCAS KUNZ THOUGH, HE GOES TO YALE -- >> HE'S AMERICAN.

>> ACCORDING TO BILL DONAHUE AND THE WASHINGTON POST, HE'S DROPPING F-BOMBS ALL ALONG THE TRAIL.

NOT BEHIND THE SCENES.

HE'S TALKING TO CROWDS DROPPING F-BOMBS.

>> NO, HE DOES ON IT TWITTER.

WHAT I'M TRYING TO TELL YOU IS HE ANYWAY WIN, HE MAY LOSE -- >> IT'S AN ACT!

IT'S THE WWE IS WHAT IT IS.

SERIOUSLY.

>> YEAH , RIGHT.

>> IF YOU WANT TO CAMPAIGN LIKE ALL THE STATEWIDE DEMOCRATS THAT LOST BY 20 POINTS, INCLUDING NICOLE GALLAWAY, IF YOU WANT THAT KIND OF THING -- LUCAS KUNZ MIGHT WIN WITH IT IS WHAT I'M SAYING.

>> YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT THE ELECTORATE.

WHEN I MOVED HERE AND THIS WAS A BELLWETHER STATE, THE ONLY TIME THE ELECTORATE DIDN'T GO WITH A WINNER WAS IN 1956 WHEN WE WENT TO ADLAI STEVENSON.

THE INTELLECTUAL AGAINST THE POPULAR INCUMBENT GENERAL DWIGHT EISENHOWER.

THOSE DAYS ARE GONE.

>> SO LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT A CANDIDATE, JOHN F. WOOD, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY FROM WESTERN MISSOURI, AND WHO IS CURRENTLY THE CHIEF INVESTIGATIVE COUNSEL FOR THE JANUARY 6th CONGRESSIONAL COMMITTEE.

AND JOHN DANFORTH AND HIS ORGANIZATION HAVE PUT HIS NAME FORWARD AS AN INDEPENDENT CANDIDATE, BILL, IN THE FALL WHO WOULD RUN AGAINST THE WINNER OF THE DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY AND THE REPUBLICAN PRIMARY FOR THE SENATE SEAT THAT ROY BLUNT IS GIVING UP.

JOHN F. WOOD.

HOW WOULD YOU HANDICAP THAT?

>> I DON'T THINK JOHN F. WOOD HAS A CHANCE.

THIS IS -- YOU KNOW, SENATOR DANFORTH IS LIKE ONE OF THESE OLD MIAMI EXILES IN MIAMI, YOU KNOW, PLAYING DOMINOS AND THINKING THAT THE PEOPLE IN CUBA REALLY WANT THEM TO COME BACK.

THEY DON'T.

I MEAN, THERE'S -- THE IDEA OF A CENTRIST GUY WINNING IN MISSOURI, NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

THE ONLY QUESTION TO ME IS WHETHER HE WILL HURT LEWIS KUNZ OR THE DEMOCRAT OR WHETHER HE WILL HURT ERIC GREITENS.

IF ERIC GREITENS GETS THE NOMINATION, THERE WILL BE PEOPLE WHO -- REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO GO, I DON'T THINK I CAN VOTE FOR ERIC GREITENS.

AND SO WILL THEY VOTE FOR WOOD IN STEAD OF VOTING FOR KUNZ?

I'M NOT SURE HOW THAT WILL PLAY OUT.

>> I DON'T THINK HE HAS -- >> LOOK AT IT THIS WAY.

I THINK WOOD WILL BE GREITENS' ROSS PEROT OR RALPH NADER.

>> NADER, YEAH.

>> I THINK HE'LL TAKE JUST ENOUGH VOTES TO MAYBE TILT THE ELECTION.

ADL IOWA STEVENSON HAD A HOLE IN HIS SHOES.

I THINK THAT APPEALED.

>> YOU THINK IT WILL TILT IT TO THE DEMOCRATS?

>> YES.

>> I THINK IT'S A REAL POSSIBILITY, BUT MY FIRST INSTINCT WAS IF IT'S A BINARY CHOICE BETWEEN ERIC GREITENS AND LET'S SAY LUCAS KUNZ AND IT'S A BINARY CHOICE ABOUT GREITENS, MEANING I CAN EITHER STOMACH VOTING FOR HIM OR I CAN'T, IF THAT'S WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE, HAVING A THIRD-PARTY CANDIDATE ARGUABLY COULD TAKE AWAY FROM THE DEMOCRATS.

I CAN SEE IT SPLITTING EITHER WAY.

I DON'T EVEN KNOW.

I KNOW YOU POINTED THIS OUT IN A COLUMN.

JACK DANFORTH GAVE US CLARENCE THOMAS AND THEN HE GAVE US JOSH HAWLEY.

IT'S LIKE, COULD YOU SPEND FLOWERS OR CANDY NEXT TIME?

DON'T GIVE US ANY MORE GIFTS, YOU KNOW, AND THE IDEA THAT HE CAME UP -- >> HE'S TRYING TO MAKE UP FOR THAT.

>> ONE THING ABOUT JACK DAN FORTH IS HE REALLY INTENDS TO DO THE RIGHT THING.

>> THAT MAY BE, BUT COMING UP WITH SOME FOLLOW THAT SAYS, GEE -- SOME POLL THAT SAYS, GEE, AN INDEPENDENT WHO WANTS TO TALK POSITIVELY ABOUT THE ISSUES IS GOING TO WIN.

OH, REALLY?

>> EVERYBODY SAYS THAT.

>> IT'S NOT WORKING.

>> MAYBE HE'S LIKE -- >> I KNOW LUCAS KUNZ HAS SAID I'M A CONGRESSMAN INSIDE.

THROW ME IN THE -- I'M A GRENADE.

THROW ME IN THE SENATE AND I'M GOING TO BLOW IT UP.

IS THAT WHAT WE WANT?

>> WE ARE NOT THE ELECTORATE.

>> DANFORTH, FINE, KENNEDY EVEN, YOU'RE TALKING DECADES AND DECADES OF CONSISTENCY AND PEOPLE WHO APPEARED MOST OF THE TIME TO BE SELF-POSSESSED.

WE'VE GONE SO FAR IN THE OTHER DIRECTION, DID I MISIDENTIFY THE WRESTLING?

WAS IT WWE?

>> NO, YOU'RE RIGHT.

>> THAT'S WHAT IT FEELS LIKE.

>> WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT J.B. PRITZKER WHO HAD A SPEECH IN NEW HAMPSHIRE LAST WEEK AND PEOPLE CROSS THE COUNTRY ARE SAYING HE'S TESTING THE WATERS?

>> YOU THROW YOUR HAT IN THERE, YEAH, WE WANT THE EX-POE, BUT I THINK THIS IS MORE ABOUT RAISING MONEY.

HE'S GOING TO BE RE-ELECTED AS GOVERNOR OF ILLINOIS.

ILLINOIS HAS A LOT OF INCOME COMING IN.

ILLINOIS IS IN THE MIDDLE OF A BUNCH OF STATES THAT DON'T SEE THINGS THE WAY THAT ILLINOIS DOES.

HE'S IN A GOOD SPOT.

WHAT DO YOU DO?

GO OUT THERE AND RAISE SOME MORE MONEY.

I DON'T THINK HE REALLY THINKS HE'LL BE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, BUT -- >> WATCH THE TAPE OF THE PRESS CONFERENCE.

WHEN THEY ASKED HIM POINTBLANK WHETHER HE WAS GOING TO RUN, HE BLUSH LIKE A 6-YEAR-OLD SCHOOL BOY.

HE BLUSHD LIKE A 6-YEAR-OLD SCHOOL BOY.

I'VE ALWAYS SAID HE'S GOING TO RUN FOR OFFICE.

IT'S THE HIGHEST BILLIONAIRE, THE WEALTHIEST ELECTED OFFICIAL IN THE UNITED STATES.

HE'S GOING TO RUN.

>> I LIKE THE GUY, PEN -- PERSONALLY, BUT IF YOU ASSUME THERE'S A GOOD POSSIBILITY THAT AT AGE 82, JOE BIDEN BUSINESS NOT GOING TO SEEK RE-ELECTION, WHICH HE -- THAT'S NOT WHAT HE'S SAYING.

MAYBE THAT'S NOT WHAT HE'S THINKING, BUT IF YOU ASSUME THERE'S A POSSIBILITY OF THAT, WHICH I THINK YOU HAVE TO ACCEPT AS THAT, THEN I THINK IT'S A WIDE OPEN FIELD AND SOMEBODY WHO CAN ARGUE THAT HE, YOU KNOW -- AND AGAIN, PEOPLE WILL DEBATE, BUT HE'S DONE A GOOD JOB AS THE CHIEF EXECUTIVE OF A MAJOR STATE.

>> WELL, PEOPLE ARE FLEEING THE STATE.

HOW DOES THAT -- YOU'RE LOSING POPULATION -- [ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> OUR NUMBERS IN CHICAGO -- >> HE'S DONE WELL?

HAVE YOU SEEN THE ROADS ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE METROPOLIS?

WHAT A GREAT JOB.

>> WHAT ABOUT THE ROADS HERE?

>> LIKE ANYTHING ELSE, WE WAS BROKE BROKE.

NOW WE GOT A CASH FLOW PROBLEM.

>> CHARLIE, THANKS FOR THE REPUBLICAN TALKING POINT.

>> HE'S ACTUALLY HELPING ILLINOIS.

THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE IN ILLINOIS SUPPORT HIM AND HE'S GOING TO WIN THE RE-ELECTION, SO WHAT DO YOU DO?

>> I MEAN, SO HE SHOULD JUST APOLOGIZE.

THE POINT IS THIS -- >> I'M TELLING YOU, HE HAS NO CHANCE.

>> THAT'S NOT TRUE.

>> I HAVE THE SAME CHANCE AS J.B. PRITZKER.

>> WHAT CHANCE DID BARACK OBAMA HAVE IN 2016?

>> SOMEBODY HAS TO RUN AFTER JOE BIDEN.

GOVERNOR OF ILLINOIS?

>> HE HAS THE SAME CHANCE AS ANYBODY ELSE.

>> I THINK YOU HAVE BETTER LUCK BRINGING ADLAI STEVENSON BACK.

>> I'M SURE YOU PREDICTED THAT BARACK OBAMA WOULD BE A GREAT CHOICE.

>> BUT IT'S EASIER TO RUN WHEN YOU'RE A SENATOR THAN A GOVERNOR.

>> THAT'S NOT TRUE.

>> OH, IT IS TRUE.

>> I DON'T THINK THAT'S TRUE.

>> I THINK SO.

>> WELL, RONALD REAGAN WON.

>> AND BUSH -- >> BUT YOU HAVE A RECORD AS A GOVERNOR, RIGHT?

AND IT'S MEASURABLE.

>> BUT THAT COULD PUT THE CAMPAIGN TO AN END.

WE DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT MATTERS.

>> OKAY, IT WAS ANNOUNCED THIS WEEK THAT CENTENE, THE LARGEST CORPORATION IN OUR AREA BY FAR AND ONE OF THE LARGEST CORPORATIONS IN THE UNITED STATES, I THINK IT'S NUMBER 24 IN THE FORTUNE 500 LIST, RAY, ANNOUNCED THAT EVEN THOUGH SOME YEARS AGO WHEN IT GOT PLANS APPROVED FOR A $700 MILLION PROJECT, THAT IT WAS GOING TO BUILD AN AUDITORIUM AND A BOUTIQUE HOTEL.

SEVERAL WEEKS AGO WE FOUND OUT THE BOUTIQUE HOTEL IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN AND THIS PAST WEEK, CENTENE OFFICIALS RELEASED A STATEMENT SAYING NO MATTER WHAT PUBLIC INCENTIVE, WE'RE NOT BUILDING THAT AUDITORIUM WE PROMISED SEVEN YEARS AGO.

WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THIS?

>> WHAT I MAKE OF IT IS THAT IT'S REALLY REASSURING THAT WE HAVE CORPORATE LEADERS IN THIS TOWN THAT ARE SO COMMITTED AND SO CONSISTENT.

GOD FORBID THAT ANYBODY CRITICIZE THEM OR CRITICIZE GREATER ST. LOUIS OR ANYTHING ELSE BECAUSE IF THEY GET MAD, THEY'RE GOING TO LEAVE.

IT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH WHAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY GOING TO DO.

I THINK IT'S A SAD COMMENTARY AND ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH ST. LOUIS, I'VE BEEN ARGUING THIS FOR A LONG TIME, WE NEED CONSISTENT DEDICATED CORPORATE LEADERSHIP THAT CAN BE TRUSTED.

AS FAR AS THE ARENA, I CAN'T IMAGINE THAT WE NEED ANOTHER VENUE, BUT THAT'S -- I WOULD THINK THAT A LOT OF OTHER -- WE HAVE SO MANY GOOD VENUES IN THIS TOWN.

I DON'T THINK ANY OF THEM MIND IT, BUT YEAH, I THINK IT'S REALLY A SAD COMMENTARY ON THE STATE OF OUR CORPORATE LEADERSHIP.

>> EVEN IF WE DID NEED A NEW VENUE, THE NEW CEO, OH NO, BATTEN DOWN THE HATCHES, FOLKS.

HE'S KIND OF LIKE -- >> YEAH, MR. NEIDORFF IS GONE.

>> HE'S GONE AND THIS FOLDEROL IS OVER.

BUT IT'S NOT MEET THE NEW BOSS, SAME AS THE OLD BOSS.

NO, THIS IS THE NEW BOSS AND ST. LOUIS?

>> THEY'RE NOT EVEN GOING TO DISCUSS IT WITH YOU.

WE'RE JUST NOT DOING IT.

>> THEY DON'T HAVE ANY LOYALTY.

THE DAYS WHEN LIKE RALSTON PURINA STEPPED IN AND BOUGHT THE BLUES SO THEY WOULDN'T GO TO -- >> YEAH, SASKATCHEWAN.

>> YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT.

>> WELL, I WILL SAY THIS.

I THINK, RAY, YOU'RE ON TO SOMETHING.

I DON'T KNOW IF THE AUDITORIUM IS REALLY NEEDED.

>> EVERYTHING WE HAVE IS STRUGGLING.

>> BUT CLAYTON OFFICIALS, THEY WERE -- THEY HAD A MASTER PLAN AND THE CENTENE DEVELOPMENT DEFIED THAT, REALLY STRAYED FROM IT, BUT THE CARROT OUT THERE WAS WE'RE GOING TO BUILD A 20-STORY OFFICE TOWER AND HAVE A WHOLE ROW OF GARAGES ON FORSYTH, THAT'S NOT WHAT YOU WANT, BUT THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE AN AUDITORIUM TO BALANCE IT OUT.

NOW WE HAVE THE WHOLE ROW OF PARKING GARAGES ON FORSYTH, BUT WE DON'T HAVE THE AUDITORIUM ANYMORE.

>> BUT WE'RE NOT EXACTLY MISS AMERICA ANYMORE EITHER, CHARLIE.

I MEAN, WE WERE, BUT THOSE DAYS ARE OVER, I'M AFRAID.

>> YOU'RE RIGHT, BUT WE SHOULD HAVE ENOUGH SELF-ESTEEM TO EXPECT OUR CORPORATE LEADERS, WHATEVER YOU THINK OF CORPORATE LEADERS, THEY MATTER IN A CITY LIKE ST. LOUIS.

>> BUT HE'S NOT OUR CORPORATE LEADER.

>> WELL, THEY'RE THE BIGGEST COMPANY IN TOWN.

>> THEY'VE DONE GOOD THINGS.

THEY REALLY GOOD.

>> OF COURSE, THEY HAVE.

>> THEY'VE DONE GREAT THINGS, BUT -- >> BUT I THINK THIS TELLS US A LOT ABOUT THEIR INTENTION.

>> WHAT DOES IT TELL YOU WHEN THERE ARE TWO STORIES, THE BUSINESS JOURNAL AND THE KSDK'S CHRISTINE BYERS THAT THERE'S $512 MILLION IN A BANK ACCOUNT THAT'S GETTING 0.4 OF ONE PERCENT INTEREST AND SOME PEOPLE -- THIS MONEY SHOULD BE GAINING MORE INTEREST.

IN FACT, I THINK KSDK DID THE NUMBERS AND ON A YEARLY BASIS, IF YOU PUT THAT MONEY IN AT ONE PERCENT, THAT SHOULD BE $10 MILLION.

SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

>> THAT'S ABSOLUTELY CORRECT AND AT A TIME WHEN WE ARE DESPERATE FOR THE, AS YOU MENTIONED, BILL, THE POTHOLES THAT CAN SWALLOW YOUR ENTIRE SUV.

I DON'T UNDERSTAND IT, AND THEN SOMEBODY LIKE THE REVEREND NANCE WHO HAS SUCH A TRACK RECORD OF BEING, YOU KNOW, JUST SO COMPLETELY ABOVE BOARD, AND I'M NOT TAKING ANYTHING AWAY FROM THAT, BUT WHEN YOU READ THE ACTUAL TEXT OF HIM SAYING, I THINK THAT PEOPLE SHOULD BE ABLE TO CONDUCT THIS -- THESE QUESTIONS AND THESE MEETINGS IN PRIVATE AND WITHIN SECRECY, THAT PEOPLE SHOULD BE -- I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT.

THERE'S ZERO ACCOUNTABILITY.

>> LET ME SAY THAT MONEY AT ONE PERCENT WOULD BE $5 MILLION.

>> DOESN'T YOUR CHECKING ACCOUNT DO BETTER THAN THAT?

AND THE BALTIMORE RAVENS OVER-UNDER IS 9 1/2 GAMES.

GIVE ME 50 MILLION AND WE'LL TURN IT INTO SOMETHING.

YOU CAN DO BETTER.

[ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> AND PARALYSIS OF ANALYSIS?

WHY WOULD THEY BE SO RELUCTANT TO MAKE DECISIONS?

>> OR SAY WE'RE NOT GOING TO SPEND ANY OF THIS MONEY FOR 18 MONTHS AND PUT IT IN T-BILLS OR WHATEVER AND SAY WE'LL BE BACK IN 18 MONTHS.

>> THERE'S A POT OF MONEY THAT ANYONE -- >> BALTIMORE RAVENS AT 9 1/2%.

>> HOW DID YOU FEEL THAT KANSAS CITY IS GOING TO BE ONE OF THE CITIES HOSTING THE WORLD CUP IN 2026?

>> I WAS IN WASHINGTON, D.C., I LIVED THERE WHEN THE WORLD CUP CAME TO NORTH AMERICA LAST.

IT WAS ALL OF NORTH AMERICA.

NOW IT'S SPLIT BETWEEN CANADA, THE UNITED STATES, AND MEXICO.

THIS IS A BIG DEAL.

NOT THAT WE HAVE THE FACILITIES OR HOTEL ROOMS TO HOST IT, BUT WE GOT TO LOOK ACROSS THE STATE AND SAY MY OH MY BECAUSE THE WORLD DOES COME TO THIS THING.

I WAS THERE, I WITNESSED IT.

IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO PLAYS, I DON'T CARE HOW SMALL THE COUNTRY, I DON'T CARE WHERE THEY'RE COMING FROM, THEY WILL HAVE SO MANY PEOPLE COMING IN.

THEY'LL BE HOTELS ROOMS FILLED BACK WEST TO DARN NEAR -- >> YOU SAID IN D.C., RIGHT?

>> IN D.C., RIGHT.

NO, IT IS -- THIS IS IMPORTANT.

>> HOW LONG AGO WAS, THIS ALVIN?

>> '92, I THINK.

>> THINK OF HOW MUCH MORE POPULAR IT IS TODAY.

>> YES, YES.

>> YOU KNOW, THAT'S ALMOST 30 YEARS.

>> AND THIS -- PUT THAT ON THE CHECKLIST OF NOT TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, MATCH EVERYTHING THAT'S UP TO DATE IN KANSAS CITY, BUT MAN, THEY'RE BEATING THE PANTS OFF OF US RIGHT NOW.

>> I READ THE KANSAS CITY STAR EVERY DAY, IT'S MY FAVORITE PAPER FOR MY WORK, AND I WILL SAY THAT KANSAS CITY, WHICH WAS SO -- FOR SO LONG, KIND OF JEALOUS OF ST. LOUIS AS THE BIG BROTHER -- >> WHEN I WAS IN COLLEGE, YES.

>> AMIE GOSH.

>> AND IN THE PLILT WORLD, I CAN TELL YOU THERE'S STILL SOME RESENTMENT WE DON'T ALL SEE FROM KANSAS CITY AIMED AT ST. LOUIS, BUT I'LL TELL YOU, THEY HAVE FROM A -- THEY HAVE PROBLEMS LIKE WE DO, BUT THEY HAVE THE SENSE OF KIND OF -- >> TOGETHERNESS.

>> TOGETHERNESS AND CORPORATELY AGAIN THAT THEY WORK TOGETHER, AND WE DON'T HAVE IT.

AGAIN, I DON'T CARE IF IT'S A BROKEN RECORD.

IT HAS TO START WITH THE FOLKS, IT HAS TO START WITH THE COMPANIES, AND IT CANNOT -- WE CONSTANTLY LOOK TO GOVERNMENT THAT ARE OWNED BY THESE INTERESTS.

WE CAN'T SYMPATHY LIKE THAT.

THEY'VE GOT IT TOGETHER.

>> BUT YOU PUT A LOT OF PRESSURE ON THE BUSINESSES WHO LOOK AT IT AND SAY WE NEED SOME HELP FROM GOVERNMENT.

>> THAT'S WHAT THEY THINK IN THIS TOWN AND IT DOESN'T WORK.

>> IF GOVERNMENT IS INCOMPETENT, YOU CAN'T EXPECT BUSINESSES TO PONY UP ALL THE TIME.

>> HAVE YOU HEARD OF THE BRIBERY SCANDAL?

>> THAT WAS $2,000.

>> THERE WAS A TIME IN THIS COMMUNITY, AND I CRITICIZE A LOT OF THEM, WHERE THE CIVIC PRIDE -- THE CITY BACK IN THE '60s AND '70s, WHERE THEY TOOK OWNERSHIP OF THIS AND IT WAS THEIR TOWN.

IT'S GONE.

>> BUT YOU MADE A LIVING CRITICIZING THEM RIGHT FROM THE BEGINNING.

[ ALL SPEAKING AT ONCE ] >> NO, I'M TALKING ABOUT THEIR PREDECESSORS.

I CRITICIZE THEM FOR THEIR JUDGMENT CALL.

>> WE HAVE TO WRAP HERE BECAUSE NEXT UP IS JUST AROUND THE CORNER-TAULBY ROACH IS IN THE GREEN ROOM AND RAY AND WENDY ARE TALKING TO HIM.

WE HOPE YOU WRITE US AND SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS.

CARE OF NINE PBS, 3655 OLIVE STREET, ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI 63108, AND THE SWEETS AT #DONNYBROOKSTL.

AND YOU CAN FIND US ON YOUR FAVORITE PODCAST SOURCE.

GREAT TO HAVE WENDY BACK IN THE ROOM AND SHE WILL BE TALKING TO TAULBY ROACH ALONG WITH RAY HARTMANN.

IT SHOULD BE A FASCINATING DISCUSSION.

>> Announcer: DONNYBROOK IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETSY AND THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.