>> WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US FOR THE SECOND HALF.

WE CALL THIS NEXT UP, AND RAY AND I ARE PRIVILEGED TODAY TO TALK TO MY WIFE'S FIRST COUSIN, GREG STOHR, THE PRIDE OF THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FAMILY.

I GOT TO TELL YOU SOMETHING.

THIS GUY WENT TO ST. LOUIS UNIVERSITY HIGH SCHOOL, SLU FOR COLLEGE AND HE WAS A HARVARD LAW STUDENT, BECAME A HARVARD LAWYER AND NOW HE'S COVERING THE SUPREME COURT FOR BLOOMBERG, DOING THAT SINCE 1998, AND THIS IS SUCH A BUSY TIME.

WE THOUGHT WE'D INVITE GREG TO JOIN US IN HIS NATIVE ST. LOUIS TO TALK ABOUT ALL THINGS SUPREME.

WELCOME, GREG STOHR, TO NEXT UP ON NINE PBS.

HOW THE HECK ARE YOU?

>> I'M GREAT, CHARLIE.

IT'S GREAT TO BE ON WITH YOU.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US AND THIS IS A BUSY TIME AS STEPHEN BREYER ANNOUNCED HIS RETIREMENT.

HE'S BEEN THERE AT LEAST FOR 28 OR SO YEARS, AND NOW THERE'S A VACANCY.

GIVE US YOUR ANALYSIS OF WHAT'S GOING ON RIGHT NOW.

>> WELL, THE BREYER RESIGNATION/RETIREMENT WAS BASICALLY EXPECTED.

A LOT OF LIBERALS HOPED HE WOULD DO IT LAST TERM.

THERE'S CONCERN, OF COURSE, THAT DEMOCRATS HAVE THE SENATE ONLY BECAUSE THEY HAVE KAMALA HARRIS'S TIE-BREAKING VOTE, SO THE PRECARIOUS NATURE OF THAT MADE A LOT OF LIBERALS CONCERNED THAT, YOU KNOW, BIDEN MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO GET HIS NOMINEE THROUGH THE SENATE.

IT APPEARS HE'LL BE ABLE TO DO THAT AS LONG AS THINGS GO SMOOTHLY.

IT'S NOT A VAI KAEPS THAT'S GOING TO SHIFT THE COURT.

IT'S STILL GOING TO BE A 6-3 CONSERVATIVE COURT, BUT IT WILL SOLIDIFY LIBERALS ON THAT SEAT FOR POTENTIALLY 20, 30 YEARS.

>> YOU'VE BEEN COVERING THIS COURT FOR ALMOST A QUARTER OF A CENTURY, GREG.

IT REALLY DOES FEEL LIKE OUR OVERALL POLITICAL CLIMATE IS VERY DIFFERENT THAN IT WAS IN THOSE DAYS, AND THERE'S AT LEAST SOME SUGGESTION THAT THE COLLEGIALITY OF THE COURT IS NOT WHAT IT WAS EVEN A DECADE AGO.

IS THAT YOUR SENSE OF COVERING IT OR NOT?

>> WELL, THERE ARE SOME INDICATIONS THAT THAT IS THE CASE.

YOU KNOW, IT'S ALWAYS HARD TO TELL.

THEY ALWAYS, THE JUSTICES HAVE ALWAYS PROFESSED THAT WE DON'T RAISE OUR VOICES, WE ALL GET ALONG GREAT BEHIND THE SCENES, BUT YOU CAN CERTAINLY FEEL THE TENSION BOTH IN THE COURTROOM AND OUTSIDE THE COURTROOM WHEN THINGS ARE HAPPENING LIKE WHAT THE COURT IS DOING THIS TERM WHERE THEY ARE SEEMINGLY MOVING VERY QUICKLY TO SLASH ABORTION RIGHTS AND TO EXPAND GUN RIGHTS.

THEY'RE SUGGESTING THEY'RE GOING TO REALLY SCALE BACK THE EPA'S AUTHORITY TO TAKE ON CLIMATE CHANGE.

NEXT TERM, THEY'RE GOING TO TAKE UP A CASE THAT COULD ABOLISH COLLEGE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION, SO ALL THOSE THINGS ARE HAPPENING AND THE LIBERALS KNOW IT AND THEY KNOW THERE'S NOT VERY MUCH THEY CAN DO ABOUT IT.

THAT HAS A TENDENCY TO RATCHET UP THE TENSION.

>> DO YOU HAVE ANY INSIDE SCOOP ON WHAT WAS GOING ON WHEN NINA TOTTENBERG OF NPR REPORTED THAT ONE JUSTICE REFUSED TO WEAR A MASK AND IT CAUSED SONIA SOTOMAYOR TO WORK REMOTELY AND THE JUSTICES SAID THERE'S NOTHING TO THAT, WE GET ALONG FAMOUSLY.

WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT THIS?

>> IT'S A BIT OF A HEAD SCRATCHER.

THE OTHER JUSTICE IS NEIL GORSUCH, ONE OF THE COURT'S CONSERVATIVES, AND THEY SAY HE AND SONIA SOTOMAYOR ARE UNLIKELY FRIENDS ON THE COURT.

THEY SIT NEXT TO EACH OTHER, THEY'RE FREQUENTLY TALKING WITH ONE ANOTHER DURING ARGUMENTS, THEY'VE DONE JOINT APPEARANCES TOGETHER, EVEN THOUGH THEY DISAGREE VERY STRONGLY ON MAJOR ISSUES.

JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR IS A TYPE 1 DIABETIC.

THROUGHOUT THE PANDEMIC, WE SEE HER, SHE WAS THE ONE JUSTICE, FOR EXAMPLE, WHEN JUSTICE GINSBURG'S CASKET WAS IN THE GREAT HALL OF THE COURT, SHE'S THE ONE JUSTICE WHO WORE A FACE SHIELD WHILE SHE WAS THERE.

SHE'S CLEARLY SOMEBODY WHO DOESN'T WANT TO GET COVID AND IT'S HARD TO REALLY UNDERSTAND WHY JUSTICE GORSUCH, SEEMINGLY CLOSE FRIEND WITH HER, WOULD NOT EXTEND HER THE COURTESY OF WEARING A MASK, WHETHER OR NOT HE THINKS IT DOES ANY GOOD.

THEY'VE ALL BEEN VACCINATED, ALL GOTTEN A BOOSTER SHOT, BUT BRETT CARAVAN TESTED POSITIVE FOR -- BRETT CAVANAUGH TESTED POSITIVE AFTER HE GOT IT.

I TESTED POSITIVE AFTER GETTING A BOOSTER SHOT.

IT WAS A BIT OF A HEAD SCRATCHER THAT SHE WOULDN'T DO IT.

SHE DID WORK REMOTELY.

SHE HEARD ARGUMENTS FROM HER CHAMBERS DOWN THE HALL WHILE THE REST OF THE JUSTICES WERE IN THE COURTROOM AND SHORTLY AFTERWARDS, THE TWO OF THEM PUT OUT A JOINT STATEMENT SAYING THAT SHE HAD NOT ASKED HIM TO WEAR A MASK AND REPORTING TO THE CONTRARY WAS FALSE.

THAT ACTUALLY WASN'T WHAT NINA TOTTENBERG'S STORY SAID.

THE STORY SAID THAT THE CHIEF JUSTICE HAD SUGGESTED THAT HE WANTED THEM TO WEAR A MASK.

LATER ON, A FEW HOURS LATER, THE CHIEF JUSTICE PUT OUT HIS OWN STATEMENT SAYING I DIDN'T ASK ANYBODY TO WEAR A MASK, AND THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE ARE.

IT'S NOT CLEAR WHY HE WOULDN'T WEAR A MASK, HE'S GIVEN NO EXPLANATION.

YOU KNOW, MY SUPPOSITION IS THAT GOING FORWARD, JUSTICE SOTOMAYOR MAY WELL CONTINUE TO PARTICIPATE REMOTELY AT LEAST IF HER COLLEAGUES ARE NOT WEARING MASKS.

>> YOU MENTIONED JUSTICE, THE CHIEF JUSTICE JOHN ROBERTS, THERE IS TALK THAT HE HAS LOST CONTROL OF THE COURT, OF THE ROBERTS COURT.

HOW DO YOU READ THAT?

>> YEAH, THAT'S FAIR.

HE IS NOT -- UP UNTIL RUTH BADER GINSBURG DIED, HE WAS BOTH THE CHIEF JUSTICE AND THE JUSTICE WHO IS IDEOLOGICALALLY THE MIDDLE OF THE COURT.

HE WAS IN THE MAJORITY IN ALL THE CASES AND THAT'S NOT THE CASE ANYMORE.

THEY'RE MULTIPLE EXAMPLES OF CASES THAT ARE ARGUED AND EMERGENCY MATTERS THAT COME UP WHERE HE'S IN THE MINORITY JOINING THE COURT'S THREE LIBERALS AND SOME OTHER JUSTICE, MAYBE IT'S BRETT CAVANAUGH, MAYBE IT'S AMY CONEY BARRETT DEPENDING ON THE CASE, SEEMS TO BE THE ONE WHO CONTROLS HOW QUICKLY THE COURT GOES AND KIND OF THE ULTIMATE TEST OF THIS MAY BE IN THE CASE THE COURT HAS HEARD AND IS DELIBERATING OVER THAT COULD OVERTURN ROE V. WADE.

THIS IS THE CASE INVOLVING A BAN ON ABORTION AFTER 15 WEEKS OF PREGNANCY IN MISSISSIPPI.

JOHN ROBERTS IN ARGUMENT MADE IT SEEM LIKE HE WANTED TO FIND A WAY TO UPHOLD THE LAW WITHOUT OVERTURNING ROE, BUT IT SEEMED LIKE HIS MORE CONSERVATIVE PALS WANTED TO GO FURTHER.

SO WATCHING WHAT HAPPENS WITH THAT CASE WILL REALLY GIVE US THE ULTIMATE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION.

>> AND GREG, ARE THEY GOING TO DECIDE THAT CASE BEFORE THE END OF JUNE?

>> YEAH, THAT'S TO BE DECIDED THIS TERM, USUALLY AT THE END OF JUNE.

>> AND WHAT ARE THE RAMIFICATIONS OF THIS CASE ONE WAY OR THE OTHER?

>> WELL, THERE ARE -- YOU KNOW, A COUPLE DOZEN STATES, INCLUDING MISSOURI, THAT EITHER HAVE PRE-EXISTING BANS ON ABORTION ON THE BOOKS OR HAVE A LEGISLATURE THAT HAS SIGNALED THAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT, TYPICALLY REPUBLICANS WHO CONTROL LEGISLATURES AND GOVERNORS WILL PUT IN NEW RESTRICTIONS.

SO IF THE COURT GOES ALL THE WAY IN THIS CASE AND SAYS ROE V. WADE IS OVERTURNED, WE'RE GOING TO SEE ABORTION BANNED IN MUCH OF THE COUNTRY, PARTICULARLY THE SOUTH AND MIDWEST, AND, YOU KNOW, IT WILL STILLING LEGAL IN SOME PLACES AND CERTAINLY MANY WOMEN WILL BE ABLE TO TRAVEL TO PLACES TO GET ABORTIONS, BUT MANY OF THEM, ESPECIALLY THE POORER ONES, WILL NOT BE ABLE TO.

>> GREG, AS A REPORTER, HOW MUCH ACCESS DO REPORTERS LIKE YOURSELF HAVE TO THE JUSTICES THEMSELVES?

OBVIOUSLY, THEY CAN'T BE TALKING ABOUT CASES BEFORE THEM.

DO YOU HAVE A FAIR AMOUNT OF ACCESS TO GET TO KNOW THEM PERSONALLY AND INTERVIEW THEM, OR NOT?

>> NO, THERE ARE NOT VERY MANY ON-THE-RECORD INTERVIEWS.

THEY TEND TO COME WHEN A JUSTICE WRITES A BOOK, USUALLY THEY'RE TRYING TO SELL THE BOOK.

THERE'S A HANDFUL OF THEM.

THERE ARE MORE OPPORTUNITIES TO GET TOGETHER WITH JUSTICES ON OFF-THE-RECORD BASES, CASUALLY.

SOME OF THEM ARE MORE ACCESSIBLE THAN OTHERS.

THE CHIEF JUSTICE, FOR EXAMPLE, HAS A ONCE A YEAR LUNCH WITH THE PRESS CORPS TO TALK ABOUT VARIOUS THINGS, OFF-THE-RECORD LUNCH.

THERE'S BEEN LESS OF THAT HAPPENING DURING THE PANDEMIC.

I HAVE NOT -- WE HAVEN'T HAD THAT LUNCH IN A COUPLE YEARS.

HOPEFULLY IT WILL RESUME AND HOPEFULLY THE PANDEMIC WILL END SOON.

AND THEN, YOU KNOW, BEYOND THAT, IT'S KIND OF AN INDIVIDUAL THING.

THERE'S SOME JUSTICES I HAVE CLOSER RELATIONSHIPS TO THAN OTHERS.

SOME I'LL BE HONEST, I HAVEN'T MET AMY CONEY BARRETT YET BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC AND THE WAY THE COURT'S BEEN OPERATING RECENTLY.

>> IF I COULD FOLLOW UP REAL QUICK K -- REAL QUICK, I THINK YOU HAD A STORY YOURSELF ON NEIL GORSUCH WHO CERTAINLY SEEMS TO THOSE OF US IN THE PEANUT GALLERY, TO BE VERY DIFFERENT THAN ONE MIGHT EXPECT WHEN HE WAS CONFIRMED IN 2017, IN HIS PERSONA, BUT HE'S GIVING A SPEECH IN FLORIDA, I GUESS IT'S TOMORROW?

>> YEAH.

>> AND CLOSED IT TO THE -- I FORGOT WHO HE'S GIVING IT TO, LAWYERS.

>> YEAH, IT'S A CHAPTER -- THE FLORIDA CHAPTER OF THE FEDERALIST SOCIETY.

YEAH, THAT'S THE CONSERVATIVE GROUP THAT HELPS PUT TOGETHER THE LIST THAT DONALD TRUMP USED TO PICK HIS SUPREME COURT NOMINEES AND THEY'RE EXTREMELY INFLUENTIAL AND HE'S SPEAKING THERE IN THE SAME PROGRAM THAT MIKE PENCE AND FLORIDA GOVERNOR RON DeSANTIS ARE SPEAKING.

THEIR EXPERIENSPEECHES ARE OPEN TO THE PRESS AND JUSTICE GORSUCH'S IS NOT.

WE'VE NOT BEEN ABLE TO, WE'VE ASKED SEVERAL TIMES FOR ACCESS AND NOT GIVEN AN EXPLANATION FOR WHY IT'S NOT OPEN.

HE HAS NOT PROVIDED THAT.

THE FEDERALIST SOCIETY HAS A LOT OF EVENTS AND TYPICALLY THOSE ARE OPEN.

THEY HAVE A NATIONAL CONVENTION AND GORSUCH AND CAVANAUGH AHAVE ALL SPOKEN AT THAT AND THOSE SPEECHES HAVE BEEN OPEN TO THE PRESS.

FOR WHATEVER REASON, THIS ONE IS NOT.

>> SO IT'S UNUSUAL FOR A JUSTICE TO SPEAK AT AN EVENT LIKE THIS AND IT TO BE CLOSED TO THE PUBLIC.

>> IT IS.

OCCASIONALLY WE IN THE PRESS HAVE TO KIND OF PUSH TO GET IT OPEN MORE, LIKE PUSH, HEY, CAN YOU HAVE A LIVE STREAM OF THAT, BUT -- AND OFTENTIMES THEY WILL SAY IT'S OPEN, BUT YOU CAN'T HAVE CAMERAS THERE.

YOU CAN RECORD YOUR OWN NOTE TAKING PURPOSES, THAT SORT OF THING, SOME RESTRICTION, BUT TO HAVE IT BE COMPLETELY CLOSED LIKE THIS, A PUBLIC SPEECH, IS FAIRLY RARE.

I SHOULDN'T SAY A PUBLIC SPEECH, BUT A SPEECH TO SUCH A LARGE GROUP OF OBVIOUSLY INFLUENTIAL PEOPLE.

>> I KNOW YOU'RE A VERY NONPARTISAN REPORTER, WHICH AT LEAST YOU SHOULD BE, BUT IT REALLY DOES FEEL LIKE THE FEDERALIST SOCIETY, WHICH JUST HAD SUPREME COURT JUSTICES OUTSOURCED TO THEM, THE SELECTION TO THEM, IN A REALLY UNPRECEDENTED WAY IN THE PAST PRESIDENCY, IT FEELS INAPPROPRIATE TO ME FOR A SITTING U.S. -- I DON'T THINK IT'S MATERIALLY DIFFERENT THAN FOR ONE OF TFROF THE JUSTICES TO SPEAK TO THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE OR THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE.

THEY'RE SO CLEARLY ESTABLISHED AS A PARTISAN PLAYER IN THE CURRENT ERA, IS THERE ANY PUSHBACK OR TALK ABOUT THAT?

IT JUST SEEMS LIKE -- AND AGAIN, I'D FEEL THE SAME WAY IF IT WAS ON THE LEFT.

IT JUST SEEMS VERY INAPPROPRIATE FOR HIM TO BE AT SUCH A -- YOU MENTIONED WHO HE'S GOT ON THE DAIS WITH HIM OR IN THE SAME MEETING.

IS THERE ANY TALK -- >> THERE HAS BEEN A FAIR AMOUNT OF ATTENTION AND CRITICISM IN THE LAST COUPLE DAYS THAT THIS HAS COME OUT, THAT THIS SPEECH IS GOING TO BE BEHIND CLOSED DOORS.

THE -- YOU KNOW, IT SEEMS LIKE -- I SHOULDN'T SAY SEEMS LIKE.

IT IS THE CASE THAT JUSTICES USED TO MORE FREQUENTLY GIVE SPEECHES IN A LESS PARTISAN ENVIRONMENT.

JUSTICE BREYER AND JUSTICE SCALIA WOULD OFTEN -- THEY'D HAVE A TRAVELING ROAD SHOW WHERE THEY SHOW UP TOGETHER AND ESSENTIALLY DEBATE BY EACH'S VIEW OF THE CONSTITUTION AND HOW TO INTERPRET IT WAS BETTER.

>> THAT WOULD BE GREAT.

>> HMM?

>> THAT WOULD BE GREAT.

>> YEAH, INCREASINGLY, AND AS OF LATE, MORE OF THE CONSERVATIVE JUSTICES, BUT CERTAINLY NOT ENTIRELY THE CONSERVATIVE JUSTICES, MORE AND MORE JUST GIVING SPEECHES TO A FRIENDLY AUDIENCE AND, YOU KNOW, IT DOES CREATE THIS APPEARANCE PROBLEM AND NOW WE HAVE THIS NEW DYNAMIC OF IT BEING BEHIND CLOSE ED DOORS.

>> LET ME ASK YOU, GREG.

I KNOW PRESIDENT BIDEN HAS YET TO NAME HIS NOMINEE OF A VACANT POSITION ON THE SUPREME COURT.

SOME HAVE SAID THE COURT NEEDS MORE DIVERSITY, NO DOUBT, BUT THERE'S DIFFERENT WAYS TO MEASURE DIVERSITY AND SOME COMPLAIN THAT THE JUSTICES JUST SEEM TO COME FROM THE SAME LAW SCHOOLS, HARVARD AND YALE.

A LOT OF THEM WORKED IN WASHINGTON, D.C., THAT -- >> YOU BEEN TALKING TO MY DAD, CHARLIE?

>> I HAVEN'T TALKED TO HIM LIKE THIS.

IS HE THINKING LIKE THIS?

IS IT POSSIBLE TO GET SOMEONE WHO MIGHT HAVE GONE TO A STATE SCHOOL LAW SCHOOL, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, AS OPPOSED TO PEOPLE WHO -- THEY SEEM TO HAVE SIMILAR BACKGROUNDS.

ARE PEOPLE NOTICING THIS?

>> PEOPLE DO NOTICE IT AND, YOU KNOW, WHILE -- LET ME SAY THERE ARE THREE NAMES THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, SEEM TO BE AT THE TOP OF THE LIST FOR PRESIDENT BIDEN.

JUDGE JACKSON, CALIFORNIA SUPREME COURT JUSTICE KRUEGER AND MICHELLE CHILDS, U.S. DISTRICT COURT JUDGE IN SOUTH CAROLINA AND SHE WENT TO THE UNIVERSITY OF SOUTH CAROLINA LAW SCHOOL.

SO SHE DOES HAVE THAT DIFFERENT BACKGROUND.

>> JACKSON IS HARVARD, RIGHT, GREG?

>> YEAH, YEAH.

AND KRUEGER IS YALE AND IF ONE OF THE TWO OF THEM, THEN WE'LL STILL HAVE EIGHT OF THE NINE JUSTICES ON THE COURT HAVING GONE TO EITHER HARVARD OR YALE AND THE EXCEPTION IS AMY CONEY BARRETT WHO WENT TO NOTRE DAME.

SO IT'S ABSOLUTELY AN ISSUE.

YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT PEOPLE SAY, YOU KNOW, ATTRIBUTE A DIFFERENT AMOUNT OF IMPORTANCE TO IT.

YOU KNOW, AS YOU SAID, THERE ARE A LOT OF DIFFERENT FORMS OF DIVERSITY.

YOU CAN CERTAINLY MAKE A CASE THAT GEOGRAPHIC DIVERSITY IS SOMETHING THAT'S LACKING ON THE COURT.

AS I THINK ABOUT IT, THERE'S MAYBE ONE JUSTICE, GORSUCH, WHO'S A WESTERNER, A PARTIAL WESTERNER.

HE GREW UP IN COLORADO OR SPENT SOME TIME IN COLORADO.

HE ACTUALLY WENT TO HIGH SCHOOL HERE AT UC.

JUSTICE THOMAS IS FROM THE SOUTH.

BUT THERE IS AN AWFUL LOT, THERE HAD BEEN OVER THE YEARS AN AWFUL LOT OF JUSTICES FROM THE NORTHEAST CORRIDOR AND FOR A WHILE FROM THE FAR WEST.

>> IF I COULD JUST JUMP IN, YOU MENTIONED YOUR DAD.

HE WORKED AT MONSANTO AS AN ATTORNEY AND I THINK CLARENCE THOMAS DID TOO.

I NEVER ASKED THIS.

DID THE TWO OF THEM EVER MEET?

>> YES, THEY DID KNOW EACH OTHER.

>> WHAT A SMALL WORLD THIS IS.

>> YES, I ACTUALLY HEARD CLARENCE THOMAS'S NAME LONG BEFORE HE WAS A JUDICIAL NOMINEE.

>> HE WAS AN EXPERT ON FUNGICIDE AND RODENTICIDE LAW AS I UNDERSTAND IT.

RAY, YOUR TURN, I'M SORRY.

>> IS CLARENCE THOMAS FROM THIS AREA, IS HE ANY DIFFERENTLY PRIVATELY, CAN YOU SAY, THAN HE IS PUBLICLY AS FAR AS HIS DEMEANOR?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, HE'S AN INTERESTING GUY.

HE IS, MY EXPERIENCE TALKING TO HIM AND JUST FROM WHATEVER FOLKS SAY, ONE OF THE FRIEND LIEST PEOPLE AROUND THE COURTHOUSE.

JUST THE KIND OF PERSON THAT LIKES TO TALK TO EVERYBODY AND TAKES A GENUINE INTEREST IN THEM.

YOU KNOW, HE'S HAD AN INTERESTING COURTROOM PRESENCE IN THAT HE WENT -- AND NOW I'VE FORGOTTEN THE EXACT AMOUNT OF TIME, BUT MORE THAN TEN YEARS WITHOUT ASKING QUESTIONS.

>> RIGHT.

>> AND HE GAVE SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT EXPLANATIONS FOR EXACTLY WHY HE DID THAT, BUT IT BECAME CLEAR FOR A WHILE THAT IT WAS JUST -- HE WAS IN THE HABIT OF NOT ASKING A QUESTION.

WHEN HE DID, IT WAS SUCH BIG NEWS AND HE DIDN'T WANT TO DRAW ATTENTION TO HIMSELF LIKE THAT.

BUT SINCE THE PANDEMIC BEGAN AND THE COURT HAS MOVED TO THIS DIFFERENT FORMAT OF -- WELL, FIRST THEY WERE HEARING ARGUMENTS BY PHONE AND WHAT THEY WOULD DO IS THEY WOULD KIND OF GO IN ORDER.

THEY WOULD -- FIRST THE CHIEF JUSTICE WOULD ASK HIS QUESTIONS AND THEN THE MOST SENIOR JUSTICE, WHO IS JUSTICE THOMAS, WOULD ASK QUESTIONS AND HE STARTED DOING IT AND HE HAS CONTINUED DOING THAT EVEN AS THEY GO BACK INTO THE COURTROOM.

SO HE IS MUCH MORE ENGAGED PRESENCE IN THE COURTROOM AND, YOU KNOW, FREQUENTLY IS ASKING INTERESTING QUESTIONS THAT OTHER JUSTICES ARE THEN REFERRING BACK TO AND HELPING TO SET THE TONE OF WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT.

>> IT SEEMED LIKE A RATHER STRANGE CALLING CARD TO HAVE.

I GUESS -- DO THE JUSTICES, I MEAN, HOW DO -- THEY OBVIOUSLY HAVE TO KEEP THEIR HEAD DOWN WHEN IT COMES TO A NEW JUSTICE BEING NOMINATED.

IS THIS SOMETHING THEY'RE -- CHARLIE ALLUDED TO THE FACT THERE'S A LOT OF CONTROVERSY OVER PRESIDENT BIDEN'S STATEMENT HE'S GOING TO PICK AN AFRICAN AMERICAN WOMAN.

FOR THE LONGEST TIME, THE PRESIDENT WAS GOING TO PICK A WHITE GUY, BUT THEY JUST DIDN'T SAY IT.

IN FACT, WHEN DONALD TRUMP FIRST HAD HIS LIST TO REPLACE JUSTICE SCALIA, EVERYBODY THOUGHT IT WOULD BE A WHITE PERSON AND NOBODY SAID THAT WORD.

BUT DID THEY, LIKE YOU MENTIONED, WITHOUT DISCLOSING PRIVATE CONVERSATION, HOW MUCH ARE THEY KEYED IN TO THIS KIND OF -- THE POLITICS OF THIS OR DO THEY REALLY STAY WAY AWAY FROM IT?

>> LET ME, IF I COULD, FIRST ADDRESS THE ISSUE OF THE PRESIDENT HAVING SAID HE'S GOING TO NAME THE FIRST BLACK WOMAN TO THE COURT.

THE ONE THING FOLKS NEED TO KEEP IN MIND IS NO PRESIDENT HAS SAID EXACTLY THAT, BUT DONALD TRUMP SAID HE WAS GOING TO NAME A WOMAN TO RUTH BADER GINSBURG'S SEAT.

RONALD REAGAN SAID HE WAS GOING TO NAME A WOMAN TO THE COURT WHEN HE NAMED SANDRA DAY O'CONNOR.

DWIGHT EISENHOWER SAID HE WAS GOING TO NAME A CATHOLIC.

>> AND YOU CAN THROW IN THE FIRST GEORGE BUSH, HE WASN'T GOING TO PICK ANYTHING BUT A BLACK PERSON TO REPLACE THURGOOD MARSHALL.

>> YEAH, DIDN'T SAY THAT EXPLICITLY, BUT -- >> HE DIDN'T SAY IT, BUT A COINCIDENCE WHEN HE DID.

>> YEAH.

IN TERMS OF THE JUSTICES, I THINK THEY'RE -- YOU KNOW, THEY'RE DIFFERENT PEOPLE AND SOME OF THEM ARE MORE CLUED IN POLITICALLY THAN OTHERS AND PAY MORE ATTENTION.

SOME HAVE TWITTER ACCOUNTS AND FOLLOW STUFF RELIGIOUSLY AND SOME DON'T.

IN TERMS OF WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THE NEXT NOMINEE, IT WAS FASCINATING AND I DON'T YET KNOW THE FULL STORY, BUT WHEN ANTHONY KENNEDY RETIRED, NEIL GORSUCH USED TO CLERK FOR ANTHONY KENNEDY, AND HE REPLACED JUSTICE SCALIA WHO DIED.

AND KENNEDY SAW ONE OF F MIOF MY CLERKS, YOU KNOW, SUCCEEDED JUSTICE SCALIA.

KENNEDY HAS ALWAYS BEEN A BIG FAN OF BRETT CAVANAUGH, WHO'S ANOTHER KENNEDY CLERK.

KENNEDY RETIRED, CAVANAUGH GOT THAT SEAT.

WHAT CONVERSATIONS WENT ON BEHIND THE SCENES, I DON'T KNOW.

IN THIS CASE WITH JUSTICE BREYER, ONE OF THE PEOPLE WHO MIGHT SUCCEED HIM, KATAYNA BROWN JACKSON IS ONE OF HIS INFORM LAW CLERKS.

HE THINKS -- HIS FORMER LAW CLERKS.

HE THINKS HIGHLY OF HER, CERTAINLY PRAISED HER.

IT'S POSSIBLE HE HAS IT IN HIS MIND, IF I RETIRE NOW, THIS FORMER LAW CLERK WHO I THINK VERY HIGHLY OF WILL TAKE MY SEAT.

WE DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS OF THOSE CONVERSATIONS, BUT EVEN THOUGH THESE GUYS ARE IN AN UNUSUAL WORLD WHERE THEY'RE REMOVED FROM A LOT OF THE HULLABALOO OF POLITICS, THEY'RE AWARE OF WHAT'S GOING ON.

>> GREG, BEFORE THE SESSION ENDS, THERE ARE TWO MAJOR CASES, ONE INVOLVING THE EPA AND THE OTHER THE RIGHT TO CARRY.

CAN YOU GIVE OUR VIEWERS A SAMPLE OF WHAT MIGHT BE DISCUSSED OR WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THOSE TWO CASES?

>> THE GUN CASE HAS BEEN ARGUED.

THE COURT COULD RULE ON THAT IN THE COMING MONTHS.

THE COURT HAS NEVER SAID THAT THE SECOND AMENDMENT APPLIES OUTSIDE THE BIG GUN CASES IT'S HAD, THEY SAID YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO OWN A HANDGUN IN YOUR HOME FOR SELF-DEFENSE PURPOSES, SO THE QUESTION IS WHAT ABOUT THOSE STATES WHERE THERE ARE MAYBE SEVEN OR EIGHT OF THEM THAT MAKE IT VERY DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO GET A CARRY PERMIT BECAUSE THE STATES THINK THAT'S GOING TO MAKE THINGS MORE DIFFICULT WHEN YOU HAVE TO -- THEY REQUIRE PEOPLE TO SHOW SOME SPECIAL REASON WHY THEY NEED TO BE PROTECTED BY HAVING A HANDGUN ON THEIR PERSON.

AND THIS COURT FOR YEARS DIDN'T WANT TO TAKE UP THAT QUESTION.

NOW IT'S A MORE CONSERVATIVE COURT, WE HAVE AGREED TO TAKE IT UP.

THE ARGUMENTS, THIS IS A NEW YORK CASE.

THE ARGUMENTS STRONGLY SUGGESTED THAT THE COURT WOULD SAY THERE'S A RIGHT TO CARRY A HANDGUN IN PUBLIC.

MAYBE A STATE CAN LIMIT WHERE YOU CAN TAKE IT, CAN SAY YOU CAN'T TAKE IT INTO A COURTHOUSE FOR EXAMPLE OR A SCHOOL, BUT THAT PEOPLE HAVE A BASIC RIGHT TO CARRY A HANDGUN.

THE EPA CASE IS PROCEDURALLY A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED, BUT THE BASIC QUESTION IS WHETHER THE EPA CAN BROADLY ATTACK CLIMATE CHANGE BY TRYING TO SHIFT ELECTRICITY PRODUCTION AWAY FROM COAL-FIRED POWER PLANTS TO GREENER SOURCES OF ENERGY, AND THE COURT IS ESSENTIALLY HEARING AN ARGUMENT THAT CONGRESS DIDN'T GIVE THE EPA THAT MUCH POWER.

THE EPA CAN REGULATE PARTICULAR FACILITIES AND ESSENTIALLY SAY YOU HAVE TO INCLUDE THE TECHNOLOGY IN YOUR FACILITIES, THE POLLUTION REDUCTION TECHNOLOGY, BUT IT CAN'T ISSUE KIND OF THIS ECONOMY-WIDE RULE THAT WILL HAVE THAT SORT OF BROAD SHIFT.

THAT'S A CASE THAT WILL BE ARGUED IN A FEW WEEKS AND BOTH OF THEM WILL BE DECIDED BY THE END OF TERM.

>> I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE FEEL THE MOST IMPORTANT CASES, MOST IMPORTANT TOPICS THAT MIGHT COME BEFORE THE SUPREME COURT THIS YEAR HAVE TO DO WITH ANY POTENTIAL PROSECUTION OF DONALD TRUMP IN SOME FASHION, INCLUDING THE ARGUMENTS ABOUT PERHAPS EXECUTIVE PRIVILEGE THAT ARE NOW IN FRONT OF THE COMMITTEE IN CONGRESS THAT'S INVESTIGATING JANUARY 6th.

DO YOU HAVE ANY SENSE FOR -- THE COURT SURPRISED CERTAINLY THE FORMER PRESIDENT BY FAIRLY UNANIMOUSLY OR ALMOST UNANIMOUSLY REJECTING, TO THIS POINT, ANY OF HIS ARGUMENTS THAT THE ELECTION WAS STOLEN IN 2020 OR THAT THEY SHOULD REVIEW THAT.

DO YOU SENSE HOW THE JUSTICES MIGHT BE FEELING ABOUT GETTING THEMSELVES IN THE MIDDLE OF WHAT COULD ARGUABLY, SHOULD BE THE MOST EXPLOSIVE ISSUE OF 2022, ESPECIALLY IF CHARGES ARE COMING DONALD TRUMP'S WAY?

>> YES, SO, YOU KNOW, THIS IS OBVIOUSLY A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF SPECULATION, BUT I CAN TALK ABOUT WHAT THEY HAVE DONE AND MAYBE WHAT IT SUGGESTS.

YOU'RE RIGHT THAT THEY HAVE -- WHEN IT COMES TO DONALD TRUMP'S PERSONAL BEHAVIOR AS OPPOSED TO HIS POLICIES, THEY HAVEN'T BEEN ESPECIALLY FAVORABLE TO HIM.

THE MOST RECENT EXAMPLE HAD TO DO WITH THESE DOCUMENTS THAT THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES IS GOING TO TURN OVER TO THE SELECT COMMITTEE IN THE HOUSE THAT'S INVESTIGATING THE JANUARY 6th ATTACK ON THE CAPITOL AND THE COURT ALLOWED THOSE DOCUMENTS TO BE TURNED OVER.

TRUMP WAS CLAIMING EXEC FRIDGE AND TRYING TO BLOCK IT.

YOU CAN GO BACK AND LOOK A COUPLE YEARS AGO AT THE CASE INVOLVING A SUBPOENA BY THE MANHATTAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY FOR RECORDS THAT WERE BEING -- FINANCIAL RECORDS THAT WERE BEING HELD BY TRUMP'S ACCOUNTANT, AND THE COURT TOOK A LITTLE TIME, BUT ALLOWED THOSE RECORDS TO BE TURN OVER TO THE D.A.

>> YOU HAVE 30 SECONDS, GREG.

>> OKAY, SO THERE'S NOT A WHOLE LOT OF EVIDENCE THAT THEY'RE EAGER TO JUMP IN AND PERSONALLY RESCUE DONALD TRUMP FROM WHATEVER LEGAL PREDICAMENT HE MIGHT BE IN.

>> WELL, IT'S VERY INTERESTING.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME, GREG.

YOU COVERED THE SUPREME COURT FOR BLOOMBERG AND WE CAN FOLLOW YOU ONLINE AND ON TWITTER AND I HOPE IS ON YOU WORK IN WASHINGTON, D.C., YOU'RE STILL ROOTING FOR THE CARDINALS.

>> I ABSOLUTELY AM.

I HAVE MY BOBBLEHEAD BACK HERE.

>> SO WE NOTICED.

ABSOLUTELY.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

GO, CARDS.

THANK YOU, RAY.

THANKS, EVERYBODY.

THAT'S IT FOR NEXT UP.

WE'LL BE BACK NEXT WEEK AT THIS TIME.

DRIVE SAFELY AND STAY WARM.

HAVE A GREAT EVENING.

>> THANKS A LOT.

>> Announcer: DONNYBROOK IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETSY AND THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.