(bright music) - I'm Norm Silverstein, glad you're with us.

My company today is Dr. Elizabeth McAnarney.

Dr. McAnarney is professor of pediatrics and chair emerita of the department of pediatrics at the University of Rochester Medical Center.

She's devoted her life to improving care for our youngest citizens.

We're so pleased that you're with us today.

- Thank you, Norm.

- I know that everyone in town calls you Dr. Lissa McAnarney.

- That's correct.

- May I call you Lissa?

- Yes, please do, thank you.

- Okay, great.

You know, you've been a key player in pediatrics in this community for some time and instrumental in some pretty big changes, including the Golisano Children's Hospital.

So let me start by asking, how did you decide to choose pediatrics as a career?

- Well, I always knew that I wanted to work with children, either in an educational capacity, meaning taking care of teaching basically, the little ones, because most of the women in our family were teachers.

But as I went through college, I realized I wanted ever more challenges.

I loved biology.

So the combination of the educational aspects, as well as working with children, as well as biology and inquiry, just fascinated me.

- You were the first woman to chair the Department of Pediatrics.

Did you feel like a pioneer at that time?

- No, I've never felt like a pioneer because there were five women in my class of 100 in medical school.

And I felt it's such a privilege to be a part of the medical profession and to be asked to step up and serve that I didn't see myself as any different.

And actually people remind me of that.

And I say, oh yes, that's true, historically.

- Well, you were someone who brought a very special focus to pediatrics.

Your areas of interest were eating disorders and adolescent pregnancy.

How did you choose those?

- Yes, so we go back to the late 1960s when I came here.

There was an adolescent program, one clinic per week that was here.

And I became fascinated because adolescents were underserved.

And I always wanted to work with populations who did not have optimum services.

And I was given this opportunity by our then chair, Dr. Robert Haggerty, in a very young age to take over our adolescent program in 1971.

And I just had this opportunity and our chairs who followed Dr. Haggerty were very supportive.

So I felt that I was in the right place at the right time.

And nationally, we were able to forge some changes.

And now I'm proud to say adolescents are a part of pediatrics.

And we've done a lot of research and been interested not only in youngsters with specific issues, but also adolescents in general.

- You mentioned Dr. Haggerty.

I understand he's one of the reasons you came to Rochester.

- He is, he is the reason.

And I had been in Syracuse with our former Surgeon General, Dr. Julius Richmond, who sent me west with 20 cents in my pocket and said, go study with Dr. Haggerty.

And at that time, Dr. Haggerty was introducing this wonderful concept way ahead of his time of placing us in the community.

And some will remember Dr. Haggerty was instrumental in working on the original plans for the Anthony Jordan Health Center.

He was very helpful to us when we began to work on Threshold Center for Alternative Youth.

And so we were on Sundays and Saturdays, he went to places of worship and talked with people about children's development.

So he was very far thinking, and I love that, 'cause it was pushing the boundaries, which I think is something I've always been interested in.

- When you were chair of the Pediatrics Department, you were central to the creation of what I guess was called a hospital within a hospital.

- [Elizabeth] That's correct, mm-hmm, yes.

- Why was that an improvement over- - Oh, that was a huge step forward.

And it was modeled on Johns Hopkins Hospital within the hospital, which was the most well-known.

And I was able to interact with Dr. Jay Stein, who was then our CEO.

He understood the importance of children's hospitals because he happened to have been in Oklahoma when that tragedy occurred, and the Oklahoma Children's Hospital saved many of those children's lives.

So he didn't need any initiation as to the concept of what was being done around the world, really.

And when I went to him and said, "We'd really like to move this further ahead," he said, "Well, what will it take?"

And that's when the discussions began.

I must say, though, my predecessor, Dr. Robert Huckelman, really worked very hard to establish the concept.

What we wanted was the naming opportunity to call it a children's hospital.

- Well, you've been very successful with that naming opportunity, twice convincing Tom Golisano to be a lead donor to help make these hospitals a reality.

So I have to ask, how did you convince him that this was something worth his support?

- So this is about teamwork, as it is here in the station.

And it wasn't I, it was a group of us, and everything sort of aligned at the right time.

And I was given the opportunity to meet Mr. Golisano, and it wasn't I who convinced him, so it was a team effort.

But I have such great respect for him because of his altruism and his caring deeply about children.

And I think the children probably did more in this effort than any one individual.

- Well, now you're involved in an effort to put up a new building, a new hospital.

What can we look forward to?

- Yes, and again, I'm privileged to be involved.

We have a chair who succeeded me who is spectacular.

And so I try to stay out of that part of the involvement, but I've been given the opportunity to co-chair the campaign for the children's hospital.

So I can keep my finger in without doing any directing or leading.

It's really a spectacular opportunity.

What we're looking forward to is, first of all, the building will be separate, even though it'll be connected.

So we still have the advantage of being part of the greater university.

Secondly, there'll be private rooms for all the children who are admitted there.

And that's most important in our neonatal intensive care unit.

- We don't have that now?

- No, we don't.

We do in the new pediatric intensive care unit that was built about 10 years ago.

And we've sort of had an opportunity to have a dry run as to what this will be like.

But the state of care currently nationally is private rooms for every child.

And the other issue that's so critically important here is family-centered care is our major theme.

That is a quest for excellence of top flight care.

And that's not that we're not providing it now.

We are, but within the constraints of our environment.

So what we'll be able to do now is have the most up-to-date technology, be able to recruit ever better faculty.

We have a spectacular faculty and providers and wonderful people in the community.

But it's always that creating the future and making sure that every child with whom we have the privilege to care and their family have the best care possible.

- And that sounds like a terrific addition to the community.

- It will be spectacular.

As I noted, this is a $145 million facility with the universities being really very, very much involved in all of our activities.

And as is the leadership of the Strong Memorial Hospital and our medical center, most of the leaders, I think, are pretty well known to this community like Dr. Burke and Mr. Goldstein and Dr. Parinello and a whole host of people who work very closely with us.

We're all integrated.

It's a team effort.

- You've mentioned a number of people who have been influential in your life.

Do you have a medical hero?

- Yes, I do have a really... My greatest hero is Sam Irwin, who's not a medical person.

It just used to be say he was a country lawyer.

And I just think that that was just something that appealed to me.

A medical hero would be a combination of people.

It's going to sound a bit local and provincial, but I don't mean it to be so because every one of them is a national figure.

And it's starting out with Dr. Haggerty, who is still active with us.

And then Dr. Smith, his team created the Haemophilus influenzae vaccine, which is similar to the polio vaccine in terms of what it's done for children around the world.

And Dr. Huckelman, whom I probably knew the longest and best and then Dr. Richmond in Syracuse.

So they all have had a major impact on my thinking and on the physician I'm trying still to be.

- Well, you're known as a pretty humble person, but you're also known as one of the most dynamic physicians in this community.

And I have to ask you, because I hear this about you, where do you get your energy?

- I think it's genetic.

- Genetic.

- And such a love for life and life has been very good.

I just say to me, but I've been very fortunate because I've had these opportunities to grow up in a small town where we knew everybody where it was a much more secure world at that time.

We had freedom to learn and to do and to be part of the community.

And then to be given the best of education from undergraduate through still, I'm still learning.

And to be in contact with really people who cared so deeply about our patients.

And that's what I love about the medical center.

The patient comes first.

- Well, you mentioned growing up in a small town that was Watkins Glen.

- Yes, as we used to say four on the floor and three on the tree.

And that means the road races.

- You were there when the road races.

- Oh my yes, it started in 1947 and we went every year to the races.

My father was active on the board there for a while.

And still a part of the identity of the community.

But before they came, it was an idyllic kind of place on the Finger Lakes and I still love the Finger Lakes.

Still part of my genetic code too, I think.

And grew up, we had both a home and a cottage.

So I had the advantage of being on the Finger Lakes.

And so I love the community and the people.

Some of whom are still there.

Now, most of the people that I grew up with and went to high school at school there, many have moved away.

But the elders, they're just some of the elders are still left and I love to go back and see everybody.

And we still maintain a family home there too as well.

- A summer home on the lake.

- Well, yes, where my sister lives actually.

But I love to go down there 'cause it's our original home.

It's where our father was born and it's where our grandparents first went as newlyweds.

- You mentioned your father and your grandfather.

I understand that you've said behind every great woman is a good man.

- Oh yes.

I feel really strongly.

And there's a wonderful bit of history about Elizabeth Blackwell, who was one of the first women physicians.

She went to the Geneva Medical College, which is right down the road in Geneva, New York.

And it came to her graduation.

And the gentlemen in her class would not let her in the front door of the Episcopal Church in Geneva.

Her brother said to us, said to her, "Let's go in the side door."

He accompanied her into the side door and she received her diploma with her class.

And I think that is in the medical world, a classic example of how supportive the men have been to the women who were really fairly alone for many years.

But we never thought, I never thought of it because I had so much support.

It didn't matter to me.

It was about becoming a physician and the best physician that I could become.

- I understand that many members of your family are teachers.

- Yes.

- So how do you end up then being the pediatrician?

- Yes.

Well, it's all about children.

And I knew I wanted a career with children because we believe strongly children are our most important assets in our society.

And secondly, I liked the idea that I could be an educator for life, both as a physician on a one-to-one basis, but then in the medical center, of course, we teach medical students, we teach residents who are post MD, we teach fellows, we have the opportunity to interact with our nursing colleagues, social work colleagues.

So we're all hopefully learning and teaching simultaneously.

- I understand working with fellows is one of the things that you enjoy the most.

- Oh, yes, because they're at a level of beginning to really now define finally their careers and what they wanna do and to see the young devote their lives to teenagers.

When I remember when we had no providers and to see what wonderful things they've done.

And they always, I used to say, I still believe this, that the young people should achieve far more than we do on behalf of our patients.

It's evermore, it's Meliora, it's our university.

- Yes, you are truly dedicated to the U of R. - Yes, because it's been a wonderful environment and I've looked many times, Norm, at other positions and what it came back to was the fact that I was allowed at a time when other institutions might not have supported the work in adolescent health because it was sort of on the edge, it was new, it was different.

People are still concerned, sort of worried about teenagers.

That was supported and people didn't say, you can't do this, you can't do that.

I've had tremendous academic freedom for which I'm very grateful.

- Well, you've had academic freedom, but you've certainly been a leader in so many ways.

I had a list of awards that you've won and we would spend the next 30 minutes talking about them.

But I think one of the ones that I understand you're most proud of is the Athena Award and you've recently won another national award.

- Yes.

- Tell us about that.

- The Athena Award was a complete surprise.

I was dumbfounded when I received it because I never expected, I knew I was invited as one of the 20 finalists and the surprise of that and the fact the community was able to nominate me to do that meant a great deal.

Forget the award, I never thought I was gonna get it so I'm still stunned about that and I'm very grateful for that too.

But the last award that I just received in May is called the John Holland Award and that's to a pediatrician from across the countries from the American Pediatric Society who has contributed to pediatrics in a meaningful way and I sort of said, "Why me?"

and they said, "It's because of the adolescent medicine work."

- Well, that's terrific.

- But it's all about our team though, it's no one person.

- You've been here almost, is it almost 40 years?

- Yeah, I'm starting my 46th year at the University of Kansas.

- Wow, what kind of changes have you seen over those years in pediatrics?

Well, what's been the biggest change?

- The biggest change has been the impact of immunizations and antibiotics on children's outcomes.

That is, we used to lose a lot of children with polio, the infectious diseases and as there's been the better immunizations, excuse me, that have been developed like what Dr. Smith did and better antibiotics, we're saving those children.

The second issue, which is very exciting is children born with congenital conditions live.

Children who used to die when they were five or six now live.

Those are children with congenital heart disease, cystic fibrosis, they're living into their adulthood.

Every patient is unique.

When I started, 20% of children who had acute lymphoblastic leukemia lived.

Now 90% live, 90%.

What a blessing for those young people and their families.

So we've seen spectacular changes.

A lot of the care of children and adolescents now is outside the hospital.

So about 10% of children have chronic illness, about 90% are well.

- Is this something that really drove you in your career?

- Yes.

- Seeing how many children died, probably unnecessarily because- - It wasn't so much unnecessarily, it was because we didn't have- - We didn't have the advances.

- The science or the advances and it's true in adult medicine as well.

And Dr. Haggerty's philosophy as well as Dr. Richmond's and then subsequently mine was about preventing illness.

Pediatricians are all about prevention, have been for years.

That's why we're excited that we may see some changes for our adult care too now with regard to more emphasis on prevention.

- Really, can you tell me a little more about that?

- Yes, well, there are many conditions.

I mean, most of the very serious conditions of any population is a combination of genetics and environment.

There are a lot of conditions for which environment, let's say tobacco smoking, has an adverse effect on our outcome.

People who smoke cigarettes have greater incidence of certain cancers.

They may have lung disease, not cancer.

Well, they could have cancer in the lung, but it may be obstructive pulmonary disease.

And the idea that we wanna get patients in earlier when they're first symptomatic, wanna make sure that the adults have their immunizations.

I mean, think of the immunizations we now have for shingles.

Think of what we have now for the pneumococcal disease.

Pneumococcal disease stalked the elderly and never stopped in the olden days.

And many of our grandparents and great-grandparents died from pneumococcal pneumonia.

There's now a preventive mechanism through immunization.

- You know, we've been talking about prevention.

We've been talking about children.

So I have to ask you, what kind of kid were you?

- Full of energy and life.

Our family expected us to be respectful of others.

And we emphasized a lot about doing for others.

There were times in school when I think the teacher would have hoped that I didn't like to talk about all these ideas and everything.

And they were very good about knowing when to draw the line, by and large.

There were a couple that I had some problems with.

But otherwise, we always knew that we had to do our best and that when you're in the classroom, the teacher was in charge.

- That was post-World War II in Watkins Glen.

- [Elizabeth] Yes, yes.

- It had to have been a little more conservative.

- Yes, very much in upstate New York and particularly in the rural areas where we were was quite conservative.

And we didn't realize that.

The thing is because our family was educated and had seen the world outside Watkins Glen.

And there were three daughters for whom they had aspirations of as much education as we wanted.

And so our father and mother both said, "We'll support you as long as we can for education."

They knew that education gave us wings.

And it's been true.

I'm very grateful for that too.

- I've heard you described as a true New Yorker, born in New York City, raised in Watkins Glen.

You went to Vassar, to Syracuse for your medical training and then to Rochester for all these years.

What keeps you here?

- But I travel.

So in my professional life, I've traveled extensively all over the world.

And I see a wonderful base here.

The world is out there to appreciate.

But as I said earlier, I looked at a number of positions, Norm, in other places.

And I kept coming back to the fact that I'd compare when I'd go out, compare the chairs of the other departments.

Oh, no, they can't be people here.

I remember coming back and saying to Dr. Haggerty, I was looking at this position, but I'm here, I'm staying because I need to learn from you.

I needed that kind of direction and creativity.

And somebody, Dr. Smith said, "Ideas are free, Lyssa, keep them coming."

And that's very special when somebody has all this responsibility for his own work and as well as leading all department.

So I love the freedom, as I've said, but I love the fact there was some structure.

And I love this community.

I think Rochester is just wonderful.

- Well, you're working now with Dr. Brad Burke, CEO.

- [Elizabeth] Oh, very special, yes.

- Yeah, very special man.

And Dr. Burke has talked about transforming the University of Rochester Medical Center to a place that is patient-centered and family-centered.

- Yeah, and we're very much on board for that.

And that's part of the evolution of the new Children's Hospital and that it will be very strongly family-centered.

I must say with all due respect that pediatrics in general nationally and locally has to be patients or family-centered.

The little ones, when they're really we, as we know, can't speak for themselves.

So we're used to involving family and we've been used for years to have family come and tell us what their feedback is.

Some of my earlier work that I actually reported upon in Washington from the 1970s was going into the home of the pregnant adolescents to see what they thought about our services.

We didn't do that 'cause we were providing the care, but we had independent evaluators go and evaluate it.

And we made changes in our program that we thought about.

We didn't just make changes that they had suggested.

So family-centered care is extremely important.

I'm glad we're really, and we're doing a great job.

There's been great improvement that's happened.

- It sounds like there's a lot to look forward to also.

When the new hospital opens, how's it gonna be laid out?

Will there be special areas?

- Everything's special.

So when one walks into the main area, there's an atrium and it's all gonna be child-friendly.

Everything will be there.

The themes that have been chosen for the floors, which is where the youngsters are hospitalized, are gonna be upstate New York themes, water, wilderness, so that everything will be coded to be gentle, gentling, there'll be a lot of child-friendly opportunities.

So it's like the great children's hospitals.

When you walk in the door, you're transformed into another world.

It's the world of children.

Everything, the little seats and all the good things you see in pediatrician's offices.

This is gonna be a world that's gonna be separate, but connected.

And we have the wonderful part about the way the hospital is set up is we can call, there's certain circumstances with the older children where we might be helped by getting a consultation from an adult, a physician who takes care of adults.

So we have all that available to us.

And the children then can have the best of pediatric and the best of adult care.

- This is where Tom Golisano first started becoming a major donor to children's hospitals.

And now you can go around upstate New York and Florida and other parts of the country and see Golisano Children's Hospitals.

Have you ever thought about what you might've begun?

- No, I don't think we began.

I think once he saw on the ground, as it were, what can be done with some resources for children, it's true of everything for whatever the arts or whatever else.

I think he then realized that this could be transformative.

And I actually was in Syracuse visiting the Golisano Children's Hospital because I'm an alum there from there, both medical school and my residency.

And I had this great privilege of going back and visiting for three days.

That's a magnificent facility.

And then the Fort Myers program, I drive by that every winter on my way out to the islands in Florida.

And I'm so excited about that.

And then he has named also the museum in Naples, the Golisano Children's Museum.

And he supported that.

So I think that reflects his love.

And I think it was there.

Remember the Golisano Foundation has supported children who have special needs for many, many years before the donation to the Children's Hospital.

- So what's next for Lisa McAnarney?

- Yeah, so it's not prescribed at this point.

We expect the new Children's Hospital to open in March, 2015.

And then we'd expect there'll be a phase two, but we're still gonna be finishing up the campaign till 2017.

And we would hope to go into phase two where we'll be able to have a new pediatric intensive care unit in the new building and a new suite of operating rooms just for children.

And then we're hoping there'll be a phase three when there's a floor that won't be complete on the highest level to grow into that, depending upon what happens with the demography and the referral network, because we're reaching now in some of our programs outside of Rochester, as far as Albany.

And we received some referrals for very specialized programs from Buffalo.

And so I'll just sort of play it by ear and ask for a reevaluation every year by the people in charge.

And when they feel my batteries are getting a little low, I'll go on to enjoy many opportunities in the community.

- That would be hard to imagine.

But you have dedicated your life to this cause.

And we started off talking about that.

You've had to, in some ways, sacrifice some of your personal life.

- Yes, absolutely.

And I knew that early on because first of all, the pressure on women at that time was to do very well or there are all sorts of rumors in medicine that women were there to find a husband, for example, or if a mistake were made, well, it's just, you know, it's just being female.

So I felt if I were going to do this, I were gonna do it to the best of my ability.

And I really feel strongly from when in my own ethos that patients' lives are always on the line in some way.

And if I were going to have that privilege of taking care of children and taking care of patients, then I want to give it my all.

And so I've had great freedom.

I mean, from every kind of decision we make, there are advantages.

So I've been able to go all over the world, not have to worry about a spouse or children, not saying that that wouldn't have been very nice, but I've never thought anything.

'Cause sometimes the students say, "Well, how can you work in pediatrics and not have children?"

And I said, "That was the way it was.

"That's what I wanted to do."

And I feel so privileged.

- And I think the community has been privileged to have you as such a significant leader here.

- Well, I'm very fortunate.

And I feel I owe everybody who has contributed so greatly some people whom I'll never know who've done that.

I owe them that I shall fulfill the Hippocratic oath to the best of my ability, as long as I can do that.

- Well, Lisa, I always ask my guests the same three questions at the end.

So you don't escape that.

- Good.

- The first one is, if you could change one thing about this community, what would it be?

- That isn't going to sound hackneyed.

My greatest wish is that we have improvement in our education of our children in the city.

I had hoped when I took on the chair that I could affect some change.

I must tell you, Norm, I tried.

But the response I got by the then leadership was minimal.

And I had so many things I was dealing with at the medical center, I had to go back and say, "You know, I'm here to carry out this mission "in the medical center."

It breaks my heart that we're in this community that does so much for children, that culturally, look what the station here does for children.

It's magnificent.

And we have this great health facilities.

We have great schools in some parts of the city, or in some parts of the county.

And yet our little ones in the city, I think, need much more.

And it's just gonna sound very hackneyed, but I feel very strongly about them.

- It's almost difficult to ask this follow-up, but what do you love most about Rochester?

- I love about Rochester is my original roots were here from the 1850s.

And it's a city of culture.

I believe in most instances, a city of integrity.

The people are absolutely delightful and real.

And I love real people.

You can walk into any place, airport, Wegmans, wherever, and you see people whom you know.

And the most wonderful thing now is my former patients are popping up all over the place.

And I love it 'cause they are vital adults.

So it's a little selfish.

The living is good and opportunity great.

- You may have already answered this, but what do you think is Rochester's best kept secret?

- So many of them.

I think it's the cultural aspect of our city.

We're sophisticated.

We hear people from outside come and say, "I had no idea this is such a sophisticated city."

Educationally sophisticated in most instances, culturally sophisticated.

We have a plethora of really good things and particularly bringing it back to where my interest is and it's all selfish is if children are exposed to this wonderful city, they'll grow up to be very good citizens.

- Well, Dr. Elizabeth McAnarney, thank you so much for being with us today.

- Thank you, Norm, for your time and for the station.

I'd like to say thank you because as I told you, I listened to XXI and 91.5 and I listened to 1370 and I love your programs on television and I am very grateful for the programming too.

- And we love your hospital.

- Thank you.

Yes, come over when it opens.

- My son was treated there.

- Is that right, Norm?

- That's right.

He was a high school swimmer and got cut at the pool once and we went right to the Golisano Children's Hospital and they took care of him.

- Well, I hope so.

And I hope he's doing okay now.

- And he's doing great.

- Great.

Thank you so much.

- And thank you.

And thank you for watching.

If you missed any of today's show, you can find a podcast online at WXXI.org.

And we'll see you next time on "Norm & Company."

(soft music) (gentle music)