>>ANNOUNCER: REPORT FROM SANTA FE IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY GRANTS FROM THE NATIONAL EDUCATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF NEW MEXICO, AN ORGANIZATION OF PROFESSIONALS WHO BELIEVE THAT INVESTING IN PUBLIC EDUCATION IS AN INVESTMENT IN OUR STATE'S ECONOMIC FUTURE, FROM THE NEW MEXICO MUNICIPAL LEAGUE, A BETTER NEW MEXICO THROUGH BETTER CITIES AND FROM >>LORENE: I AM LORENE MILLS AND WELCOME TO REPORT FROM SANTA F. WE HAVE A VERY TIMELY AND IMPORTANT SHOW TODAY AND WE ARE LUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE AN ESTEEMED BIOLOGIST, ECOLOGIST AND DISTINGUISHED SCHOLAR AT ITHACA COLLEGE, SANDRA STEINGRABER.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

>>STEINGRABER: MY PLEASURE, THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>>LORENE: WELL, WE DID AN INTERVIEW YEARS AGO AND YOU HAVE DONE SO MUCH.

ONE OF THE GIFTS THAT YOU HAVE IS YOU ARE A SCIENCE WRITER AND A SCIENTIST, AN ECOLOGIST, BIOLOGIST, BUT YOU ARE ABLE TO PUT ALL THIS SCIENCE IN PLAIN ENGLISH SO THAT PEOPLE CAN REALLY UNDERSTAND IT.

AND YOU ARE ABLE TO PUT THE CONCERNS, YOU HAVE GOT SCIENCE ON SIDE AND YOU ARE TRANSLATING FOR THE AVERAGE PERSON AND YOU HAVE GOT ACTIVISTS THAT ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THINGS.

YOU ARE ABLE TO HELP THE SCIENTISTS UNDERSTAND AND SO YOU ARE REALLY A BRIDGE TO MOVE US FORWARD AND I AM VERY GRATEFUL TO YOU, THANK YOU.

>>STEINGRABER: WELL THANK YOU, THAT IS WHERE I LOCATE MY WORK IN THAT KIND OF INTERSECTION BETWEEN SCIENCE AND ACTIVISM.

I AM REALLY INTERESTED IN BRINGING THE QUESTIONS THAT PEOPLE HAVE THAT NEED SCIENTIFIC ANSWERS TO THE SCIENTIFIC COMMUNITY TO SAY, "HERE ARE LINES OF INQUIRY THAT PEOPLE WANT ANSWERS TO."

AND THEN I AM INTERESTED IN BRINGING THOSE FINDINGS BACK OUT TO PEOPLE ESPECIALLY PEOPLE IN FRONTLINE COMMUNITIES WHO ARE BEARING THE BRUNT OF CLIMATE JUSTICE AND ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE PROBLEMS.

>>LORENE: WELL, YOU ARE AN INTERNATIONALLY RECOGNIZED AUTHORITY ON THE ENVIRONMENTAL LINKS TO CANCER AND HEALTH.

I READ ONE OF YOUR EARLY BOOKS WAS CALLED LIVING DOWNSTREAM AN ECOLOGIST'S PERSONAL INVESTIGATION OF CANCER AND THE ENVIRONMENT .

CAN YOU GIVE FOR OUR AUDIENCE A LITTLE BACKGROUND ABOUT HOW YOU LEARNED HOW IMPORTANT THIS WORK WAS BECAUSE YOUR HEALTH DEPENDED ON IT.

>>STEINGRABER: YEAH, SO I WAS DIAGNOSED WITH BLADDER CANCER SHORTLY AFTER MY 20TH BIRTHDAY IN BETWEEN MY SOPHOMORE AND JUNIOR YEARS OF COLLEGE.

AND THAT DIAGNOSIS WAS KIND OF LIKE A CANE THAT CAME OUT ON STAGE AND PULLED ME OFF STAGE AWAY FROM MY OTHER BIOLOGY MAJOR FRIENDS AND COHORTS.

AND WHILE I WAS LYING THERE IN THE HOSPITAL, STILL EXHALING ANESTHESIA FROM SURGERY, MY DIAGNOSING PHYSICIAN ASKED ME A SERIES OF QUESTIONS, LETTING ME KNOW THAT THE KIND OF CANCER I HAD JUST BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH IS CONSIDERED A QUINTESSENTIAL ENVIRONMENTAL CANCER WITH A LINK TO ENVIRONMENTAL EXPOSURES.

AND HE ASKED ME A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT MY POSSIBLE EARLY LIFE CHILDHOOD EXPOSURES TO THINGS LIKE ALUMINUM SMELTERS AND VULCANIZED TIRES.

AT FIRST I WAS ALMOST OFFENDED LIKE, OKAY, YES, I GREW UP IN THIS INDUSTRIAL WORKING CLASS COMMUNITY BUT I AM, YOU KNOW, THE ELK'S CLUB SCHOLARSHIP WINNER.

I HAVE ESCAPED FROM THERE AND NOW I AM THIS HIGH ACHIEVING BIOLOGY MAJOR GOING ON TO MEDICAL SCHOOL.

OF COURSE I AM NOT OUT VULCANIZING TIRES.

BUT I DID LIVE ACTUALLY DOWNWIND OF AN ALUMINUM SMELTER AND 30 OTHER DIFFERENT INDUSTRIES.

SO YEARS LATER, AS A POST DOC AT HARVARD, I BEGAN THE RESEARCH THAT BECAME THE BOOK LIVING DOWNSTREAM, WHICH REPRESENTS MY BEST ATTEMPT AS A BIOLOGIST TO UNDERSTAND THE LINKS BETWEEN TOXIC EXPOSURES AND CANCER, BUT THAT I ALSO MOVED INTO MY SISTER'S BASEMENT THE NEXT YEAR AND BEGAN A VERY PERSONAL DETECTIVE STORY, INVESTIGATION OF THE TOXIC WASTE DUMPS IN MY OWN TOWN AND ALSO UNCOVERED THE FACT THAT I WAS JUST ONE DATA POINT IN A CLUSTER OF CANCERS IN MY HOMETOWN THAT HAD BEEN KIND OF COVERED UP.

SO THAT STORY BOTH THE SCIENTIFIC STORY AND MY PERSONAL STORY AS A CANCER PATIENT IS THAT IT IS KIND OF TWO, A MEMOIR AND A SCIENTIFIC REPORT KIND OF BRAIDED TOGETHER.

AND THAT BECAME THE WORK OF LIVING DOWNSTREAM , WHICH WAS THEN HAPPILY TURNED INTO AN AWARD WINNING DOCUMENTARY FILM THAT I PLAYED A ROLE IN WHICH GAVE IT A NEW LIFE.

I THINK A FILM IS A DIFFERENT MEDIUM THAT KIND OF BRINGS PEOPLE TOGETHER, RIGHT?

WHERE AS READING A BOOK IS A VERY PRIVATE THING AND I BELIEVE STRADDLING IN BOTH OF THEM, BUT I AM HAPPY TO HAVE THAT STORY OUT THERE.

SO, YES, THAT EVENT WAS KIND OF PIVOTAL IN MY LIFE AND THAT RATHER THAN TO GO TO MEDICAL SCHOOL, I BECAME VERY INTERESTED IN DOING BIOLOGY IN THE SERVICE OF ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH.

>>LORENE: SO ONE OF THE THINGS, BECAUSE I DO LOVE THAT BOOK, WAS THAT YOU MENTIONED THERE WERE OTHER MEMBERS OF YOUR FAMILY THAT ALSO HAD THE SAME THING.

AND THE PEOPLE JUST POUNCED ON IT, "OH, IT'S GENETIC, IT'S INHERITED," AND WHAT GAVE THE LIE TO THAT ASSUMPTION.

>>STEINGRABER: WELL, YEAH THAT'S PART OF THE STORY OF LIVING DOWNSTREAM .

SO YES, I WAS NOT THE FIRST MEMBER OF MY FAMILY TO BE SO DIAGNOSED WITH CANCER, IN FACT, MY MOM WHO WAS IN HER MID-40S, 44, I THINK AT THE TIME, SHE HAD METASTATIC BREAST CANCER AT THE SAME TIME.

SO MY MOM AND I WERE ACTUALLY CO-CANCER PATIENTS TOGETHER AND HER PROGNOSIS WAS ALWAYS WORSE THAN MINE.

AND THEN MY AUNT WENT ON TO DIE OF THE SAME KIND OF BLADDER CANCER I HAD AND THEN I ENDED UP HAVING SUBSEQUENTLY COLON LESIONS AND MY COUSIN WHO IS EXACTLY MY AGE, WAS DIAGNOSED WITH STAGE THREE COLON CANCER.

SO I HAVE A LOT OF CANCER IN MY FAMILY AND A LOT OF PEOPLE WHEN THEY HEAR THAT STORY ASSUME THAT THEREFORE CANCER RUNS IN GENES.

BUT THE PUNCHLINE TO MY STORY IS THAT I AM ADOPTED, SO I AM NOT RELATED TO MY FAMILY BY CHROMOSOMES.

AND I THINK THAT MY IDENTITY AS AN ADOPTEE ACTUALLY PLAYED A ROLE AS WELL AS MY IDENTITY AS A CANCER PATIENT IN UNDERSTANDING WHAT ELSE FAMILIES HAVE IN COMMON BESIDES CHROMOSOMES, WHICH IS VERY OFTEN, YOU KNOW DRINKING WATER WELLS, AIR, FOOD, THINGS THAT COME TO US FROM THE ENVIRONMENT.

SO THAT BECAME THE FOCUS OF MY RESEARCH.

>>LORENE: YOU ARE A MUCH SOUGHT AFTER ENVIRONMENTAL EXPERT.

YOU HAVE TESTIFIED TO THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT TO UN, CONGRESS, THE PRESIDENT'S CANCER FUND AND YOU HAVE ACTUALLY BEEN TESTIFYING ABOUT A BILL IN SANTA FE, IT'S SB149, WE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT IN A MINUTE.

BUT I AM JUST GOING TO GO THROUGH IN TURBO SPEED.

SOME OF YOUR AWARDS SO PEOPLE WILL REALIZE THE CALIBER OF EXPERT THAT WE GET TO HAVE HERE TODAY, YOU WERE NAMED MS. MAGAZINE'S WOMAN OF THE YEAR, THE BREAST CANCER FUND HERO, UTNE READER MAGAZINE CALLED YOU ONE OF THE 25 VISIONARIES CHANGING THE WORLD.

YOU GOT THE HEINZ AWARD FOR EXTRAORDINARY SERVICE TO THE ENVIRONMENT, THE SIERRA CLUB CALLED YOU THE NEW RACHEL CARSON AND THEN CARSON'S ALMA MATER GAVE YOU THE RACHEL CARSON LEADERSHIP AWARD.

YOU GOT ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH CHAMPION FROM PHYSICIANS FOR SOCIAL RESPONSIBILITY, AND MY FAVORITE ONE BECAUSE I AM GOING TO STOP, IS THE ALTMAN AWARD AND THIS IS WHAT IT IS FOR, INSPIRING AND POETIC USE OF SCIENCE TO ELUCIDATE THE CAUSES OF CANCER.

SO NOW, YOU HAVE TESTIFIED BEFORE A COMMITTEE IN OUR HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, NO IT WAS THE SENATE AND THE BILL IS CALLED SENATE BILL 149 AND IT SIMPLY ASKS, YOU ARE GOING TO SAY THIS BETTER THAN I AM, BUT FOR A MORATORIUM ON THE DRILLING OF NEW HYDROLOGIC HYDRAULIC FRACTURING WELLS, JUST A PAUSE TO ALLOW TIME TO STUDY THE ENVIRONMENTAL AND HEALTH IMPACTS OF FRACKING ON NEW MEXICO'S LAND, WATER, AIR AND PEOPLE.

NOW WE ARE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT SCIENCE HERE, THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE BECAUSE SO MUCH OF NEW MEXICO'S INCOME FOR THE STATE IS FROM THE OIL AND GAS INDUSTRY, THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WOULD CHOOSE NOT TO LOOK AT THE SCIENCE, BUT YOU HAVE TALKED ABOUT WHAT YOU DID IN NEW YORK AND THE AMOUNT OF STUDIES THAT YOU HAVE AND THEN WOULD YOU TALK ABOUT SB149, IT CLEARED ITS FIRST COMMITTEE AND IT IS GOING TO BE UP AGAIN THIS WEEK THAT'S WHY WE ARE DOING THIS.

>>STEINGRABER: SO I WILL JUST SAY RIGHT UP FRONT THAT I TESTIFIED YESTERDAY IN SUPPORT OF SENATE BILL 149, WHICH THE NICKNAME FOR IT IS THE FRACKING PAUSE ACT, RIGHT.

AND SO YOU HAVE DESCRIBED IT VERY WELL, IT IS ACTUALLY EVEN MORE MODEST THAN IT SOUNDS, BECAUSE WHAT IT PAUSES IS ANY MORE NEW PERMITS FOR DRILLING, I MEAN THERE ARE STILL PERMITS THAT HAVE BEEN GIVEN FOR WELLS THAT HAVEN'T BEEN DRILLED YET AND THOSE WELLS WILL GO FORWARD.

SO IT IS A PRETTY MODEST PAUSE, IT'S CERTAINLY NOT A MORATORIUM ON ALL FRACKING AND I SUPPORT IT BECAUSE FOR MANY REASONS AND THEY ALL FALL INTO ONE OF TWO CATEGORIES.

FIRST OF ALL, FRACKING SWINGS A WRECKING BALL AT OUR CLIMATE SYSTEM AND SIMPLY WE ARE NOW AT A MOMENT OF HISTORY WHERE IT IS THE LAST POSSIBLE MOMENT AND WE NEED TO GET OFF FOSSIL FUELS RIGHT AWAY BEFORE OUR CLIMATE HITS THESE KIND OF RUNAWAY TIPPING POINTS BEYOND WHICH WE CAN NO LONGER REVERSE THEM AND THEN SOME REALLY CATASTROPHIC THINGS BEGIN TO HAPPEN INCLUDING THINGS LIKE POLLINATION SYSTEMS START TO DISINTEGRATE AND THEN WE DON'T, YOU KNOW, INSECT POLLINATION PROVIDES US ONE OUT OF EVERY THREE BITES OF FOOD THAT WE EAT.

PLANKTON IN THE OCEAN ARE IN TROUBLE, PLANKTON PROVIDES US HALF THE OXYGEN WE BREATHE.

SO THOSE ARE REALLY, WHEN WE SAY, "THE CLIMATE CRISIS IS AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS, THAT IS WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT," I AM TALKING ABOUT FOOD AND OXYGEN, SO THERE IS THAT PIECE OF IT.

AND THEN THERE IS THE PIECE THAT I STUDY PETTY THOROUGHLY AND HAS BEEN THE FOCUS FOR MY WORK FOR THE LAST 10 YEARS, WHICH IS THE DEPENDENCY OF FRACKING ON HIGHLY TOXIC CHEMICALS THAT ARE ADDED TO THE FRACKING FLUID FOR REASONS WE CAN TALK ABOUT, BUT ALSO BECAUSE THE DEEP BEDROCK UNDER OUR FEET WHERE THE OIL AND GAS ARE TRAPPED AS TINY BUBBLES, THAT IS A QUARRY OF FRACKING.

SO IN ORDER TO GET THOSE OIL AND GAS BUBBLES OUT OF THE EARTH, WE USE FRESH WATER AS A CLUB TO SHATTER THAT BEDROCK.

AND THE DEEP PART OF OUR PLANET, CONTAINS A WHOLE PERIODIC CHART OF OTHER ELEMENTS INCLUDING RADIOACTIVE ONES AND I THINK NEW MEXICO, OF ALL STATES, HAS THE MOST EXPERIENCE WITH THESE, RIGHT.

URANIUM, POLONIUM, RADON GAS, AND THEN ALL THESE OTHER KIND OF HEAVY METALS, BARIUM, STRONTIUM, ARSENIC, LEAD, MERCURY, THEY ARE ALL DOWN THERE IN THE BEDROCK NOT HURTING ANYONE JUST IN THEIR OWN LITTLE SUBTERRANEAN PERIODIC CHART DOWN THERE.

BUT WHEN WE BLOW THE BEDROCK UP USING FRESH DRINKING WATER AS A CLUB, THEY ARE MOBILIZED AND THEY COME UP TO THE SURFACE WITH THE FRACKING WASTE AND THERE IS NO GOOD WAY TO DISPOSE OF IT.

SO THAT'S WHAT THE IMPLICATIONS WHERE AIR AND WATER QUALITY AND HUMAN HEALTH FROM FRACKING IS WHAT I HAVE BEEN STUDYING REALLY THOROUGHLY.

NOW IN NEW MEXICO, UNLIKE NEW YORK, THERE IS A THIRD BIG ISSUE.

NEW YORK HAS PLENTY OF WATER, YOUR STATE WATER IS A VERY PRECIOUS LIMITING RESOURCE AND SO TAKING WATER OUT OF THE HYDROLOGIC CYCLE AND MAKING IT DISAPPEAR BY BURYING IT INSIDE THE SHARDS OF SHALE THAT WATER HAS JUST BLOWN APART IS BASICALLY ABSENTING WATER FROM THE HYDROLOGIC CYCLE, RIGHT.

SO LET ME BACK UP A MINUTE, WHEN YOU USE WATER TO SHATTER SHALE IN THE FRACKING OPERATION, SOME FRACTION OF THAT WATER WILL COME FLYING BACK UP OUT OF THE BORE HOLE AS SOON AS YOU RELEASE THE PRESSURE AFTER THE ROCK IS ALL BROKEN APART AND THAT IS NOW CONTAMINATED WITH ALL THESE THING WE ARE TALKING ABOUT, RADIOACTIVITY, HEAVY METALS, THERE IS BENZENE IN THERE, THERE IS BRINE FROM THE ANCIENT SEA THAT USED TO BE DOWN THERE.

SO ALL THOSE CHEMICALS COME OUT OF THE HOLE AND THAT IS A PROBLEM.

BUT THE OTHER PROBLEM IS SOME FRACTION OF THAT WATER DOESN'T COME BACK OUT OF THE HOLE, IT IS ACTUALLY TRAPPED DOWN THERE FOREVER, FAR BELOW OUR DRINKING WATER AQUAFERS, WHICH MEANS IT WILL NEVER EVAPORATE AND FORM A CLOUD, IT WILL NEVER COME BACK DOWN AS RAIN, IT WILL NEVER BE SNOWPACK, IT WILL NEVER BE FOG AGAIN, IT WILL NEVER BECOME OUR BLOOD PLASMA OR THE SAP OF A FRUIT OR THE SAP INSIDE OF TREES AND SO IT IS JUST GONE.

AND SO THE QUESTION I THINK THAT PAUSING FRACKING IN NEW MEXICO, THE QUESTION YOU MIGHT WANT TO TAKE UP WHEN YOU PAUSE IT TO GIVE YOURSELF TIME TO THINK ABOUT WHETHER YOU WANT TO GO FORWARD MORE WITH FRACKING, IS HOW MUCH WATER ARE YOU ACTUALLY MAKING DISAPPEAR OUT OF NEW MEXICO'S HYDROLOGIC CYCLE.

AND WITH THE AMOUNT OF DRILLING AND FRACKING PREDICTED FOR THE FUTURE, HOW MUCH MORE WATER ARE YOU GOING TO LOSE AND IS THAT OKAY WITH YOU.

BECAUSE ALREADY YOU HAVE GOT THIS PROLONGED DROUGHT THAT IS REALLY GRIPING NEW MEXICO AND ALL OF THE SOUTHWEST THAT IS A CONSEQUENCE OF CLIMATE CHANGE.

AND THE PREDICTIONS ARE THAT IS JUST GOING TO GET WORSE AND IN PREPPING FOR MY TESTIMONY I WAS READING ABOUT THAT SOME OF THE RESTRICTIONS EVEN PLACED ON YOUR FARMERS NOW WHO ARE ENCOURAGED NOT EVEN TO GROW CERTAIN THINGS BECAUSE OF LACK OF WATER FOR IRRIGATION.

SO IN THIS TIME OF WATER CRISIS, ALREADY EXACERBATED BY CLIMATE, DO YOU WANT TO MAKE MORE WATER DISAPPEAR FROM THE WATER CYCLE TO BRING MORE OIL AND GAS OUT OF THE GROUND, THE COMBUSTION OF WHICH IS GOING TO MAKE THE CLIMATE CHANGE EVEN WORSE.

>>LORENE: WE ARE SPEAKING TODAY WITH DR. SANDRA STEINGRABER AND THAT IS SUCH AN AMAZING THOUGHT TO ME BECAUSE IT IS TRUE.

IT IS HARD TO DISAPPEAR WATER, IT CHANGES FORMS, GAS, STEAM, LIQUID, SOLID BUT IT DOESN'T DISAPPEAR AND THROUGH THIS PROCESS OF USING THAT WATER FOR FRACKING WE ARE DISAPPEARING WATER FROM THE HYDROLOGIC CYCLE.

>>STEINGRABER: FRACKING IS THE ONLY THING HUMANS DO THAT MAKES WATER DISAPPEAR.

SO JUST TO KIND OF PAUSE FOR A MOMENT AND THINK ABOUT THAT ALL TOGETHER.

YES, THERE ARE HUMAN WATER USES THAT WE WORRY ABOUT, WE WORRY WHEN TOO MUCH WATER IS DIVERTED FOR IRRIGATION LET'S SAY, AND IF WE ARE PUMPING WATER OUT OF AQUAFERS AND IRRIGATING CROPS, WE ARE TRANSFERRING THAT WATER FROM GROUND WATER TO SURFACE WATER, SOME OF IT IS BEING TAKEN OUT BY THE CROPS THAT WE ARE GROWING, BUT OTHER MOLECULES OF THAT WATER ARE EVAPORATING INTO THE AIR FORMING CLOUDS AND THEY MAY DRIFT TO ANOTHER TIME ZONE AND THEN RAIN DOWN SOMEWHERE ELSE.

SO THAT WATER IS KIND OF LOST TO NEW MEXICO BUT IT ISN'T LOST TO THE WORLD.

WHEN WE DO SOMETHINGS THAT WE ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO DO LIKE LET THE TAP RUN WHILE WE ARE BRUSHING OUR TEETH, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, WE MIGHT BE TAKING GROUND WATER THAT IS OUR DRINKING WATER SUPPLY AND TRANSFERRING IT INTO THE SEWERS OF AMERICA, BUT EVENTUALLY THAT ENDS UP BACK IN A STREAM SOMEWHERE DOWNSTREAM FROM THE SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT, SO IT IS ALREADY LOST.

SO THE WHEEL OF WATER TURN GOES AROUND AND AROUND AND AGAIN YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU IRRIGATE A GOLF COURSE THAT'S A WATER USE BUT YOU ARE JUST MOVING WATER AROUND, YOU ARE NOT ACTUALLY MAKING IT GO AWAY.

BUT FRACKING IS THE ONLY THING I KNOW OF WHERE WE ARE TAKING LARGE AMOUNTS OF WATER, PULLING IT OUT OF THE WATER CYCLE AND BURYING IT A MILE BELOW OUR FEET WHERE IT IS NO LONGER PART OF OUR GROUND WATER SYSTEM AND IT IS JUST STUCK THERE FOREVER.

AND THEN, OF COURSE, IS THE OTHER FRACTION WE'VE BEEN MENTIONING WHICH IS THE POISONOUS FLOW BACK FLUID ALSO CALLED PRODUCED WATER OR LIQUID FRACKING WASTE IS ALL BASICALLY THE SAME THING AND WE HAVE PRODIGIOUS AMOUNTS OF THAT.

THERE IS NO TECHNOLOGY WE KNOW OF THAT CAN TURN THAT BACK INTO FRESH DRINKABLE WATER, SO BASICALLY, FRACKING MAKES WATER DISAPPEAR, THAT IS ONE THING IT DOES, BUT ALSO FRACKING TURNS WATER INTO POISON, THAT IS THE SECOND THING IT DOES AND THAT IS A ONE WAY CONVERSION, WE DON'T KNOW HOW TO FIX THAT.

AND NOW YOU HAVE THIS PRODIGIOUS AMOUNT OF LIQUID TOXIC WASTE THAT HAS TO BE COMPARTMENTALIZED SOMEWHERE KIND OF FOREVER MORE.

SO WHERE ARE YOU GOING TO PUT THIS STUFF AND IT IS ESPECIALLY AN URGENT QUESTION FOR THE PERMIAN BASIN WHICH IS THE PART OF NEW MEXICO THAT IS SHARED WITH TEXAS, WHICH IS THE HEART OF THE FRACKING FOR OIL, RIGHT?

SO THERE IS KIND OF TWO AREAS IN NEW MEXICO WHERE FRACKING REALLY DOES GO ON INTENSELY, ONE IS THE SAN JUAN BASIN WHICH IS MOSTLY BEING FRACKED FOR NATURAL GAS AND THEN THE PERMIAN DOWN BY CARLSBAD WHICH IS HEART OF THE WHOLE BIG PERMIAN BASIN IN WESTERN TEXAS, WHICH IS BEING FRACKED FOR OIL.

SO IN THE PERMIAN BASIN WHERE EVERY BARREL OF OIL YOU PULL OUT OF THE GROUND, SIX TO SEVEN GALLONS OF TOXIC FRACKING FLUID IS CREATED, RIGHT, SO ONE BARREL OF OIL, SIX BARRELS OF TOXIC STUFF THAT IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE SAFELY SEQUESTERED FOR A VERY LONG TIME, SO WHERE DO YOU PUT IT ALL?

AND THERE ARE NOT ANY GOOD SOLUTIONS AND AT LEAST IN NEW YORK STATE, WHEN WE CHOSE TO PUSH THE PAUSE BUTTON ON FRACKING AND THAT WAS IN RIGHT AROUND 2010, WE WERE IN THE SAME POLITICAL MOMENT AS NEW MEXICO IS IN NOW, RIGHT.

TEN YEARS AGO OUR GOVERNOR WAS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHETHER TO PERMIT OR PROHIBIT FRACKING, WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TO DO.

THERE IS A LOT OF, NOT SO MUCH OIL, BUT LOTS AND LOTS OF GAS IN OUR BEDROCK, SO MULTI-BILLION DOLLAR PAYDAY IF WE GOT IT OUT.

AND SO THE GOVERNOR MADE A WISE DECISION WHICH WAS TO PUSH THE PAUSE THE BUTTON AND NOT LET ANY FRACKING, WHICH IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN WHAT NEW MEXICO'S PROPOSING WITH SB 149.

BUT WE JUST DECLARED A MORATORIUM ON FRACKING AND THEN USED THE TIME THAT A MORATORIUM OFFERED US TO ENGAGE IN CLOSE STUDY AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE ARE TRYING TO STUDY IS, IS THERE A SAFE WAY TO DISPOSE OF FRACKING WASTE AND WE COULDN'T FIND ANY WAY AND SO THAT BECAME ONE OF MANY REASONS WHY THE TEMPORARY MORATORIUM TURNED INTO A PERMANENT BAN IN 2014.

BECAUSE IT TURNS OUT YOU CAN, IF YOU JUST STORE IT IN AN OPEN PIT, IT IS ALSO FULL OF THINGS LIKE BENZENE AND FORMALDEHYDE, WHICH ARE ALSO OTHER HYDROCARBONS THAT HAVE BEEN TRAPPED DOWN THERE IN THE BEDROCK FOR LO THESE MANY YEARS, RIGHT.

AND THEY WILL EVAPORATE AND CREATE TOXIC, HAZARDOUS AIR POLLUTION AND THAT HAS BECOME A REAL PROBLEM IN FRACKING SITES IN CALIFORNIA WHERE YOU HAVE THESE OPEN PITS.

IN THE CENTRAL VALLEY IT IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ACTUALLY A BIG PART OF THE TOXIC HAZARDOUS AIR POLLUTION THERE.

SO THAT IS NOT GOOD PLUS IF YOU STORE IT IN OPEN PITS, IT EVENTUALLY JUST LEAKS DOWN INTO THE GROUND WATER AND ALSO CONTAMINATES WATER.

ALRIGHT SO THE OTHER THING TO DO WITH IT IS TO INJECT IT BACK INTO THE GROUND IN THESE SO CALLED DISPOSAL WELLS, BUT THAT IS A PROBLEM BECAUSE ONE OF THE CHEMICALS USED IN FRACKING FLUID ARE THESE SURFACTANTS, WHICH MAKE FRACKING FLUID SLIPPERY AND THAT IS BECAUSE YOU ARE TRYING TO EXERT ALL THIS PRESSURE AND SHOVE WATER INTO CRACKS AND PUSH THE CRACKS OPEN INSIDE THE SHALE TO LET THE GAS COME OUT AND YOU KNOW THE BORE HOLES ONLY LIKE FIVE INCHES OR SO IN DIAMETER, SO YOU DON'T WANT A LOT OF FRICTION, SO YOU HAVE TO ADD CHEMICALS TO THE FRACKING FLUID TO MAKE IT REALLY SLIPPERY ALMOST LIKE A CONTACT LENS SOLUTION KIND OF STUFF.

SO WHEN THAT COMES BACK OUT OF THE GROUND AS TOXIC WASTE AND HAS TO BE DISPOSED OF THOSE SLIPPERY CHEMICALS ARE STILL PART OF THE MIX AND IF YOU REINJECT IT BACK INTO THE GROUND AS A KIND OF WAY OF SWEEPING IT UNDER THE RUG AND MAKING IT GO AWAY, YOU END UP LUBRICATING NATURALLY OCCURRING FAULTS AND FISSURES IN THE EARTH AND TRIGGERING EARTHQUAKES.

WE HAVE LIKE ONE HUNDRED PERCENT PROOF OF THIS CONNECTION FROM MULTIPLE NATIONS STATES ALL OVER THE WORLD AND, OF COURSE, MULTIPLE STATES, OKLAHOMA, KANSAS, OHIO, PLACES WHERE FRACKING WASTE IS DISPOSED YOU SEE EARTHQUAKES.

AND IN FACT THE PROBLEM WITH EARTHQUAKES AND FRACKING BECAME THE REASON THAT ENGLAND AND THE UK PERMANENTLY BANNED FRACKING BECAUSE THEIR SCIENTISTS DID A REPORT THAT BASICALLY SAID NO WAY OF INJECTING, NO WAY OF DOING FRACKING CAN PREVENT EARTHQUAKES, WE DON'T UNDERSTAND ENOUGH ABOUT WHAT TRIGGERS THEM TO PREVENT THEM.

WE DON'T KNOW WHEN THE EARTHQUAKES WILL BE CAUSED AND WE DON'T KNOW HOW FAR AWAY THE EARTHQUAKE CAN HAPPEN.

>>LORENE: WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO COME BACK TO THE BILL BECAUSE WE JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF MINUTES LEFT.

WHAT WE ARE ASKING FOR IN SENATE BILL 149, WHICH IS SPONSORED BY ANTOINETTE SEDILLO-LOPEZ AND PATRICIA ROYBAL-CABALLERO IS WE ARE JUST ASKING FOR A PAUSE AND TO STUDY THIS.

ALSO BIDEN ON A NATIONAL LEVEL HAS ASKED FOR A PAUSE ON OIL AND GAS LEASING ON FEDERAL LANDS, RIGHT NOW FOR NEW MEXICO THERE ARE ABOUT A THOUSAND PERMITS PENDING SO THOSE WON'T EVEN BE AFFECTED.

WE ARE ASKING FOR THIS PAUSE THAT WE CAN TAKE A LOOK AT ALL THE STUDIES THAT YOU REPRESENT AND MAYBE ANOTHER TIME THAT I CAN HAVE YOU EXPLAIN THE STUDIES MORE.

BUT TELL US WHY THIS PAUSE IS IMPORTANT.

>>STEINGRABER: SURE.

SO THERE IS EMERGING EVIDENCE ACROSS OUR NATION AND ALSO FROM OTHER COUNTRIES SHOWING THAT THERE ARE REAL PUBLIC HEALTH EFFECTS, TWO PEOPLE WHO LIVE NEAR FRACKING OPERATIONS AND WHAT CONCERNS ME MOST ABOUT ALL THESE AND THEY RANGE FROM HEART FAILURE TO ASTHMA, EMERGENCY ROOM VISITS, RESPIRATORY PROBLEMS AND SO ON.

BUT THE ONES THAT I AM REALLY LOOKING AT CLOSELY ARE THE HARM TO PREGNANT WOMEN AND SO THIS IS WHAT WE SEE IN MANY, MANY PLACES AND THE DATA ARE VERY CONSISTENT ON THIS, THAT WOMEN WHO LIVE CLOSE TO DRILLING AND FRACKING OPERATIONS ARE AT HIGHER RISKS FOR ESPECIALLY PERTERM BIRTHS AND LOW BIRTH WEIGHT BABIES AND ALSO BIRTH DEFECTS.

AND IN SOME CASES PEDIATRIC CHILDREN'S CANCER IS LINKED TO LIVING CLOSE BY.

SO YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE THE RELATIONSHIP, THE CLOSER A FAMILY LIVES TO A FRACKING SITE THE HIGHER THE RISK IN AS THE DISTANCE BETWEEN THE HOME AND THE FRACKING WELL PAD GROWS THAT RISK BEGINS TO FALL.

AND SO THE MESSAGE I WANT NEW MEXICANS TO UNDERSTAND ESPECIALLY SINCE IN YOUR STATE YOU ARE ACTUALLY FUNDING YOUR PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEMS WITH SOME OF THE REVENUE PROVIDED BY THE OIL AND GAS INDUSTRY, IS THAT THIS RELATIONSHIP DESPERATELY NEEDS TO BE UNWOUND.

NOT ONLY BECAUSE THE OIL AND GAS INDUSTRY IS STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN THROUGH CLIMATE CHANGE AND SO YOU ARE PREPARING CHILDREN FOR A FUTURE THROUGH EDUCATION THAT THE SAME INDUSTRY THAT IS HELPING TO FUND THAT IS ACTUALLY TAKING THE FUTURE AWAY, THAT'S A PROBLEM.

BUT IT IS ALSO THE CASE THAT PRETERM BIRTH IS THE NUMBER ONE CAUSE OF DISABILITY IN THIS NATION, IT IS VERY STRONGLY LINKED TO LEARNING DISABILITIES AND SO YOU ARE HARMING CHILDREN'S ABILITY TO LEARN, YOU ARE HARMING THEIR BRAIN DEVELOPMENT BY ALLOWING THEIR MOTHERS DURING PREGNANCY TO LIVE NEAR DRILLING FRACKING SITES.

SO THIS SEEMS TO ME SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD WANT TO JUST PUSH THE PAUSE BUTTON AND LOOK AT THESE DATA REALLY CLOSELY.

THAT'S WHAT WE DID IN NEW YORK DURING OUR TIME OF PAUSE IS A LOT OF THOROUGH SCIENCE AND THAT BECAME THE FIRST EDITION FOR MY LITTLE SHOP, CONCERNED HEALTH PROFESSIONALS OF NEW YORK OF THIS DOCUMENT , THE COMPENDIUM OF SCIENTIFIC MEDICAL AND MEDIA FINDINGS DEMONSTRATING THE RISK OR HARMS OF FRACKING .

THIS IS NOW OUT IN ITS SEVENTH EDITION AND THERE ARE NOW MORE THAN 2,000 STUDIES IN THE PEER REVIEW LITERATURE DEMONSTRATING THE RISKS AND HARMS OF FRACKING AS OPPOSED TO THE 400 STUDIES THAT WERE AVAILABLE TO US IN NEW YORK WHEN WE MADE THE DECISION TO STOP FRACKING IN OUR STATE, SO YOU HAVE FIVE TIMES AS MUCH INFORMATION AVAILABLE AND IT CAN BE FOUND IN OUR COMPENDIUM.

>>LORENE: OUR GUEST TODAY IS DR. SANDRA STEINGRABER, A BRILLIANT SCIENTIST AND WE COULD, YOU KNOW, I ASKED YOU FOR FACTS AND THE SCIENCE AND YOU HAVE GIVEN ME SO MUCH I WOULD EVEN LIKE TO DO IT AGAIN.

BUT THIS WEEK I WANT OUR AUDIENCE TO LOOK FOR SB149, SUGGESTING MERELY A PAUSE IN GRANTING NEW FRACKING LICENSES SO THAT WE CAN LOOK AT THE SCIENCE THAT YOU HAVE ONLY GIVEN US A HINT OF ALL OF THE SCIENCES AVAILABLE.

I'M SO HAPPY.

>>STEINGRABER: YEAH PEOPLE REALLY NEED TO MAKE THEIR VOICES HEARD BECAUSE IT HAS JUST PASSED THE COMMITTEE AND IT IS NOW ON TO THE JUDICIAL COMMITTEE.

SO NOW IS REALLY THE MOMENT FOR NEW MEXICANS TO GET IN TOUCH WITH THEIR STATE ELECTED OFFICIALS ABOUT THIS BILL, SENATE BILL 149.

>>LORENE: THANK YOU SO VERY, VERY MUCH AND THANK YOU FOR ALL THE WORK YOU DO.

AND I AM LORENE MILLS, I WOULD LIKE TO THANK YOU OUR AUDIENCE FOR BEING WITH US TODAY ON REPORT FROM SANTA FE.

>>ANNOUNCER: REPORT FROM SANTA FE IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY GRANTS FROM THE NATIONAL EDUCATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF NEW MEXICO, AN ORGANIZATION OF PROFESSIONALS WHO BELIEVE THAT INVESTING IN PUBLIC EDUCATION IS AN INVESTMENT IN OUR STATE'S ECONOMIC FUTURE, FROM THE NEW MEXICO MUNICIPAL LEAGUE, A BETTER NEW MEXICO THROUGH BETTER CITIES AND FROM