Welcome to Forum 360.

Thank you for joining us for our global outlook with a local view.

This is Leslie Ungar, your host today.

Elections are the foundation of our democracy.

How secure is that foundation?

We hear differing views every day in the news and casual conversations about election security.

Today, we are going to take a closer look at a question that matters to every voter.

Can we trust the system that counts our votes?

From cybersecurity to voting technology to foreign intervention and misinformation.

We are going to concentrate on something most fundamental, the facts.

Our guest today, our Board of Elections Deputy Director Pete Zeigler and Kelly Saunders, experienced poll worker.

So, you have some exciting 50 days ahead of you, don't you?

And probably days after that also.

- Oh, yes.

No.

Well, first of all, I mean, we're barely out of the period where people use to ask if— What the Board of Elections do with the rest of the year.

It takes a monumental effort to put on an election.

We are already hard at work at getting contracts and for polling locations, getting absentee ballot requests processed, preparing equipment, staffing up with seasonal folks.

This is a big endeavor and we're already working full time at this, and pretty soon it'll be overtime, so.

- What does election security actually encompass beyond just protecting the voting machines?

What does election security mean to you?

I will ask each one of you.

- Okay.

Well, in our process in Ohio and especially in Summit County, everything is bipartisan.

I'm the deputy director of the board.

The board has a director.

Neither of us can touch a ballot without a member of the other party present.

Different tasks require Democrat and Republican workers to work together and work on them.

You can't.

No person can touch a ballot, can enter the tabulation room.

Enter any of the rooms where we keep electronic equipment and election equipment without a member of the opposite party.

We have key access that requires both parties to be present to even enter those spaces.

That's a big part of the way that we maintain security as well.

You've got the same thing at the polls.

We don't, we have to have equal representation of both major parties at every polling location.

And a lot of security starts at the individual level.

Everyone is watching each other.

- Now you were talking about training before we started.

So that's something that might surprise us.

So you're a volunteer poll worker?

- Correct.

- As a volunteer, what kind of training addition— In addition, like, we just think you show up that day and you give it up a day, which we thank you for and I've always admired people for giving up that day.

But we just think that you give up that day to sit there when I sign in.

So what does training mean?

- Actually, I just completed training just this past week.

It's a two hour procedure where we review everything that we've already gone over, how to set up the machines, what the proper procedures are.

Down to the color of bags that are being used, what needs to go on, what we're supposed to be doing, what we're checking for, what the parameters are of what it's acceptable.

For example, if I may, signatures can vary.

How you sign something at 18 may not be how the signature looks at 25.

- My bank, when I sign just to take cash out like I used to have to sign like twice because the signature can change in, like, 30 seconds.

It can be different than how I, how I signed it 30 seconds earlier.

- So it's all a safety procedures of what we're doing to ensure that.

- Right.

- That is correct.

- And then feature certain election law facts like, identification roles.

- Identifications must be valid I.D.’s.

These are the procedures.

We know what are acceptable forms of I.D., which he would be much better versed on.

- Now, so that people think about this, whether they're going for early voting or going on Election Day.

What do they need to have with them?

And has that changed?

- Oh, no, that has not changed.

The rules are you must have a valid ID for voting, which consists of.

It can be a Ohio driver's license, a Ohio interim drivers license.

An Ohio state I.D., a passport, a military identification card, which is the only electronic form of ID that we accept.

But for most people, it's a driver's license or a state I.D.. That's what you need to bring to the polls.

- Now, what are you know, we hear a lot about, you know, hacking or foreign intervention and all kinds of things.

But what are the biggest threats to election integrity locally today?

- Well, I think to start with, we're not as concerned about hacking because voting machines in Summit County and frankly, across the state of Ohio never touch the internet.

They are never connected to the internet.

There are removable sticks that the poll workers, of course, are very familiar with.

- Yes.

- They're the most important thing on election night, because that's what has the results that you see on election night.

We put them into the system and upload them in a closed, basically a closed server to the Secretary of State's office.

- So that's how, you’re the results in, say, Summit County, get to the state secretary.

By Secretary of State, by how?

- Basically there is a closed system between us, well, between every board and the Secretary of State's office, just for the transmission of election results.

- What would you say to someone who believes like, okay, so you're a poll worker and you tell friends somewhere rather that, you know, you're going to, you know, you're a poll worker and they say, you know, I wouldn't trust elections.

I don't vote, I wouldn't trust elections.

What do you say to someone who believes the system can't be trusted?

- Actually, I was that person.

And one of the reasons that I became involved was having lived in Northeast Ohio my entire life, I had no idea that you did— There were areas or states that you did not have to produce identification.

I was very surprised.

But of course, with media access, we're hearing how awful everything is.

And I thought, can that possibly be true?

And just because I look it up with Google or the internet somehow doesn't mean that that's actually... That it's providing me with the truth.

And I felt that the best use of my time would be to, instead of pouring over the internet, would be actually volunteering and actually seeing for myself what was going on, not with the intent that I could change anything with the exception of my perception.

- And you were asking about threats and you touched on what one of them is, and that is misinformation on the internet, and especially as we go into an AI revolution, there's more and more information from more and more sources.

You have to be very careful about what sources you trust.

- So what do you tell someone?

How do you deal with, there's got to be more misinformation out there.

Gets out there faster than you can get correct information out.

What do you do as a Board of Elections?

- Well, it starts on an individual level because we get those calls and we spend time talking to folks.

We use our social media to put out accurate information.

The Secretary of State's office puts out information.

It's a constant effort to try to combat misinformation, frankly, in this county we've been very fortunate that most folks actually don't take the bait.

They tend to understand that this is a serious, legitimate and transparent process.

I think it goes to the bipartisan nature of the work we do, from the polling locations to the board members itself.

It's a 4/4 board, so nothing happens unless everybody's working together.

- If there was one thing.

I want to ask this for both of you, if there was one thing that you wanted a voter out there to know about election security, what would that one thing be?

- Oh, I said it already that none of our voting equipment ever touches the internet.

- Okay, that's your one thing.

What is one thing you would want voters to know?

- Ohio really has a very secure system as an outsider looking in, even though a part of.

And actually, I believe on more than one occasion, Ohio is considered a gold standard for its security.

And that's important.

- Now, a current topic among this world of current hot topics has been mailin ballots.

Can you speak to the effort that has now been underway to limit mail in ballots?

What do you want voters to know but trust about mail in ballots?

- Well, when it comes to mail in ballots, they're actually checked probably more closely than voting at the polls are.

A voter must provide and identify verification number with the last four of the social security of the driver's license number.

They have to sign both the application include that information when they send back the ballot.

That same information is requested in the signatures requesting we verify the signature and the signature they have on file.

When it comes to what the board does, it's a remarkably secure way to vote.

We can't speak for the post office, but from our perspective, it's a bipartisan process in verifying these things.

And we're, we take very seriously.

So only the registered voters can get them.

And if it's not the voter it was sent to, it won't be accepted.

- And I think that's an important thing to remember.

Now come Election Day and people have decided to wait and vote on Election Day rather than vote by ballot or vote in early voting, will there be ICE represented at any polls in Summit County?

And how should voters see their presence?

- Well, obviously ICE hasn’t lead us to their game plans.

We are having some initial meetings with local law enforcement to determine ways to handle it.

Now, that being said, I would not let anyone intimidate you from going to the polls and making your voice heard, because at the end of the day, ICE is going to do what ICE is going to do.

We can't control that.

Local law enforcement can play a role in making sure that Ohio law and boundaries are respected.

And we obviously are going to do what we can to ensure that voters are able to vote without intimidation and pretty freely and easily.

- We are talking about the security of our local elections with our guests today, Board of Elections Deputy Director Pete Ziegler and Kelly Saunders, a volunteer poll worker.

Early voting.

So if someone's thinking about is it safer or is my vote protected in early voting the same way that it would be.

And they're saying, “Gee, should I go for early voting and maybe not stand in line, or maybe stand in line?” And, “Should I wait till Election day?” What advice, do have any advice for someone about early voting?

- I am a big one in the early voting.

- Because?

- One, because as much as we try to plan our lives out and hope that on the first Tuesday after the first Monday in November we’re free, life happens.

Things can get in the way, and all of a sudden you've missed your one chance to vote.

When you've got better part of a month before that.

But you can come in any weekday and a couple of weekends and make your voice heard.

It's the same process as, will happen at your voting location.

And you'll check in the same way.

You'll show the same identification, and you'll feed the ballot into the same type of tabulator that you have at the polling locations.

We just at the early vote center, we can serve every precinct in the county as opposed to a voting location where you have, you have three precincts at your location?

- Yes.

There are three precincts.

Yes.

- Now, you as a volunteer poll worker, does that then mean you just work on the day, the election day, or do you work in any early voting?

- I do not work at any early voting, only the election day.

However, I do vote early.

- Okay.

- To ensure.

- It is election day and you are working.

How do you distinguish between a genuine security threat and just, you know, insecurity or worry, like how do you identify a threat or an inconsistency?

- I believe it's up to the individual dealing with the individual that may be a cause of concern.

It becomes a very tight knit group that works the polls.

We all have to rely on each other to follow up.

So if someone has— It would not be uncommon if we were sitting side by side checking identification to get people ballots to go, “Little concerned here,” under our breath.

And without going, “Hey, this is...” He could be a threat.

It's not that.

It's very discreet.

The Board of Elections has always been very responsive to any of the poll workers needs that are going on, as well as law enforcement can be relied on.

- And our training features de-escalation.

Because you'll find every once in a while they're voters who might be upset.

They're not a security threat, so to speak.

But you still want to de-escalate the situation, try to resolve things as peacefully as possible.

So we dedicate time and our poll worker training to, teach de-escalation.

- You know, de-escalation.

It's funny.

In my real job as an executive coach, I say you can either be the pyromaniac and you can fan the fire, or you can be the fireman, and you can be putting out, or firewoman, and putting out the fire.

So kind of the same thing here.

- Very much so.

- So as you think about being a poll worker and as that, you know, day gets closer, is there anything that keeps you up at night in worry about being a poll worker?

- It has not arisen so far.

I've been very, I'm very comfortable.

I feel very safe, secure, observed and that I’m safe.

- Great.

That's... - Which is perfect.

- Yes, it is.

As it should be.

We just kind of always took that for granted.

Just always took going to Election Day for granted.

As a deputy director, you know, is there something or some things that keep you up at night as you get closer to early voting and Election Day?

- Well, like I said, I'm very proud of our system here, but weather events lay close to Election Day.

We've dealt with that before in this county where we've had power outages across reasonably large swaths that we would have to move three or four locations in the couple days before Election Day.

That's something that's always a concern.

In terms of logisitics... If a setup gets delayed or and we rely on the good graces of a lot of public and private entities to let us in and vote at their locations, well, all it takes is one person who's supposed to let us in to set up, to not be there in the setup time.

All of a sudden, that can slow things down.

Or if we have an arrangement with said schools, a lot of times the custodial staff will do a lot of the setup for us.

Well, if you have a new custodian in place that creates an interesting election morning, but we are well prepared for that.

We have teams equipped to go out first thing election morning.

Well before you guys get there and you guys get there plenty early.

And to handle that kind of thing.

Those are the kind of things that worry me.

And then you've always got in the back of your mind the security issues.

It's just the nature of the society we’re in.

But we also are prepared as well as we can be for that.

We have ongoing relations with local law enforcement agencies.

We communicate with them and work well with them.

- Now, you talked about getting the results, you know, from Summit County to the Secretary of State.

- Right.

- Then somehow they have to get to the federal level.

Right?

Or does it stop at the... - Well... - Or does it stop at the Secretary of State?

- From our perspective, it stops at the Secretary of State.

Now for federal races, the Secretary of State, in theory, would have to transmit certificates of election to, well, for Congress.

Each of the houses of Congress, they're the judges of their own eligibility, so.

But yeah, and then electoral college for a presidential that's handled in Columbus as well and then sent down to Washington, D.C.. - Now, you mentioned AI and AI just continues to be a topic in many, many different ways.

How do you see it potentially affecting or what are they worries about it affecting voting?

And is there a worry at the poll level it affecting?

- Well, my concern is the information that it provides to voters, which can be correct if you get the right source, if you get the wrong source, you can get the wrong information.

And that's very important that people have the correct information, or else they... - And they can get that correct information at your website.

- At our website, the summitcountyboe.gov.

- Okay.

Okay.

So from your perspective, it's the misinformation before.

It's not the day of voting or anything afterwards that... - Right.

They are voting and actually almost the month after voting is extremely transparent.

And there are observers who are and can be appointed by political parties, groups of candidates, issue committees, and you'll often find them at polling locations.

You’ll find them at the early vote center.

You'll even see them for the post-election audit.

And obviously, if any recounts were to happen, you'd see observers in that as well.

- Are we ever going to vote from our phone?

- I'd be surprised, particularly here in Ohio.

- Yeah.

- I mean, and frankly, I'm happy about that.

Summit County, we are a paper ballot county and I think for the foreseeable future we will remain such and there's a value in that it provides its own audit trail, because you've always got the actual ballots that you can go back and count.

- Now, early voting gives you a lot more options to vote.

And mail in gives you options to vote.

Every four years or so we hear talk about that there should be one more day off, you know, because National Potato Day is not enough where there should be one more day off.

Election day should be a day off so that everyone can go vote and not worry about work or anything.

What do you think about that?

- I love the idea.

The more people that vote, the better.

- I agree completely, make it a holiday.

Make it so that's part of the appeal.

- And do you think that would increase voting?

- I think it would increase voting and I think would increase the pool of workers.

- Of workers as well.

Yes, absolutely.

- Now, are you in a position, you may be more in a position to hear.

But, why people don't vote?

Because statistically we still have a pretty low percentage, right?

Overall, as a country, do you hear reasons like when you say you're a poll worker or at the poll, do you hear reasons people give for why they don't vote?

- Not true reasons, I hear, “Oh, it takes too much time.” “I don't want to stop.” “I don't like where my polling place is.” I can't get a solid answer as to why people don't want to vote and any, any other reasons - An any other reasons you can share with us.

- Well, a lot of it comes to how a voter feels about their place in the community and if they feel that casting their vote can make a difference, they're far more likely to vote.

And that's true it can change by election to election.

This election coming up has every indication of being competitive, which we're seeing increased interest already in absentee applications.

- Good, good.

- That's good.

- In the minute or so I have left, I'm going to ask you a couple questions for just 1 or 2 answers that just kind of tell our viewers a little bit more about you, just us as human beings, not just the election people.

I'm a big fan of Northeast Ohio, but what is something that you like about Northeast Ohio besides its great election security?

- Access to museums.

Music venues.

We have a world class orchestra.

We have amazing museums, and it's endless.

And the green spaces.

- Both Summit and Cuyahoga County, great dining.

There are fantastic restaurants and a wide variety of them.

- Do you use AI in your life at all?

Not consciously.

- Not on purpose.

How about you?

- Oh, not consciously, but you can't avoid that.

- No you can't, that's true.

Is there an app on your phone that is a favorite app that you use?

Like, I must check the weather ten times a day.

- I have to agree.

Weather.

- Is there a favorite app that you use?

- Well, weather and then, well, Facebook Marketplace.

- Oh okay.

Okay.

For me it's weather and counting my steps.

Few things are more fundamental to our democracy than the ability to cast a vote, but the confidence that the vote will be counted accurately and securely.

Today, we took a closer look at the security of our local elections with a member of our Summit County Board of Elections, Deputy Director Pete Ziegler and poll worker Kelly Saunders.

In the last few elections, voting has become a sometimes charged topic.

Today, we look beyond the headlines, sound bites and cyber conspiracies to focus on the facts at our local levels.

Our topic today has been local election security, but it could just as well have been how do we earn and maintain public confidence?

Today we learned how you can trust your vote.

I'm Leslie Ungar.

Thank you for joining us today on Forum 360 360 for a global outlook with a local view.

Forum 360 is brought to you by John S. and James L. Night Foundation, the Akron Community Foundation, Hudson Community Television, the Rubber City Radio Group, Shaw Jewish Community Center of Akron, Sisler McFawn Foundation, Electric Impulse Communications, and Forum 360 supporters.