♪ Hey, hey, hey (upbeat Latin music) ♪ Hey, hey, hey ♪ Hey, hey - Good evening, and welcome to "Horizonte," a show that takes a look at current issues through a Hispanic lens.

I'm your host Catherine Anaya.

Elizabeth Camarillo Gutierrez was just 15 years old when she experienced a life situation that would break most people her age.

Her undocumented parents were forced back to Mexico, but Elizabeth made the brave decision to stay in Tucson where she was responsible for not only finishing school, but finding shelter.

With sheer persistence and determination, she graduated high school at the top of her class.

Then, from an Ivy League University, worked on Wall Street and became the legal guardian of her brother, all before the age of 25.

She also gave a TED Talk, which led to a memoir that Elizabeth has written about her life changing experience and decision, and how it has shaped her views on the immigration system in this country, the importance of family and achieving the American dream.

Please welcome Elizabeth Camarillo Gutierrez to "Horizonte."

So nice to see you, Elizabeth.

- It's nice to see you.

Thank you so much for having me.

- Thank you for joining us.

That Ted talk that I referred to it was titled, "What's Missing from the American Immigration Narrative?"

about your family's life changing experience.

Did you ever expect that that TED Talk would go viral and explode the way it did?

- I don't think I did.

Maybe not to the extent that it did.

I mean, we hear about TED Talks, but then you go onto the webpage, and there's only a few that kind of show up right away.

So I figured it would kind of merge into the background.

But the response was amazing, and it kind of snowballed into the book deal, which is kind of beyond what I even imagined would happen.

- The book is called "My Side of the River," and yes, you write about your experience that I alluded to, you know, a little bit.

But I wanna talk more in depth about that, because from the outside looking in, that decision that you made at just 15 years old is such a very brave, bold decision for somebody so young to make.

What led you to make that decision and your parents being so supportive of it?

- Yeah, I mean, it's funny when I look back at it, the emotions that I had as a 15-year-old, and it's not like it was completely logical, but I was a very angry teenager.

I was angry at the system.

I was angry that there wasn't any legal path for my parents to become citizens at that point.

And so for me, them having to go back to Mexico was a very defeated moment.

I knew that I had a chance, I knew that I had opportunities in the United States, I had good grades.

And so it was really rage that made me stay.

I told my parents, you know, and it's really hard for Mexican parents to be like, "Yeah, let my daughter go and live with strangers so she can pursue high school."

And so it was really hard for everyone.

But I will say that it just like the sheer determination of an angry teenager.

And now when I look back at it, I'm surprised that I was even able to do that.

- (chuckles) But when you look back at everything that you've been able to accomplish in a matter of 13 years, was that ever in your vision when you made that decision?

Was any of this ever in your vision, or even for your parents?

I mean, were they thinking, "Let's just get her to graduate high school," or were you always thinking big, all of you?

- (chuckles) Honestly, I was always thinking big.

I think my parents were a bit delusional.

They thought I was a prodigy from a very young age, and so they had always kind of instilled that in me.

You know, it wasn't, "If you go to college when I was growing up, it was when you go to college."

And it wasn't "how am I going to pay for it?"

it was, "there's always a way to get you that education because an education is priceless."

And so they dreamt big and they had big expectations.

I had big expectations for myself.

And the only person that I was disappointing at the end of the day was myself.

And so why not shoot big and see what happens?

And then that's kind of where things led.

So I'm not gonna say I wasn't ambitious because I think ambition is the core of who I am.

And even still though, it's not like I expected or grew up thinking I'm gonna write a book, or you know, I'm gonna go do these things on TV and be featured and all these things.

It kind of just, you know, spiraled.

And I feel like these things happen when you continuously push yourself to be in the right room at the right time.

- I wanna put people in your situation at that time, because after your parents left, you became what's described as an unaccompanied homeless youth, one of the thousands of children affected by family separation due to the broken immigration laws.

This had to have been incredibly emotional, logistically overwhelming.

What was life like for you at that time?

And what did you focus on to get through it?

- Yeah, I mean, it was a logistical nightmare, to be quite honest.

I was 15, I was a US citizen.

I still am a US citizen.

I was born in the United States.

And you know, the system doesn't track US citizen children of immigrants when their parents are deported or when there is a separation that occurs for whatever reason.

And so there was no safety net in place for me.

There was no social workers or anything that kind of came up to me and were like, "What are you going to do?"

It was me kind of looking for resources, and it was me going to my local elementary school and talking to the teachers and finding a family that would take me in.

And then when I was in high school, it was my educators, my counselors, who realized that I was actually considered homeless because I was bouncing around from place to place.

And that put me into the programs that I needed to be in, like the free lunch program, as well as one called Youth On Their Own, which helps at-risk homeless youth in Arizona.

- Thank goodness for a village, right?

Because it really took a village to help you get through this.

I know you talked about education always being a priority for you and for your family.

But did you personally feel like you had to work harder because of the way you saw your parents treated in this country?

- I did, I mean, I hated that my parents and people like my parents were used as scapegoats for the American system.

You know, politicians, they love to put immigrants in one of two ways.

You're either the super immigrant, and this is something I talk about in my TED Talk.

You're the super immigrant that, you know, is the quote-unquote, "backbone to American society," or you're the scapegoat, you're the dishwasher, you're the person that people look down upon that is quote-unquote, "stealing American jobs."

And so I hated both of these perspectives, but I knew that, you know, being the super immigrant or being that poster child was going to get me places.

And I figured that if these narratives exist, I'm going to exploit it so that I can get to where I need to be so that I can help my family and also my community.

- So let's talk a little bit more about the book and how you explain in the book how this experience has shaped and influenced the way you see immigration in this country, and referring to your TED Talk, you know, what is missing from the American immigrant narrative in this country?

- Yeah, I mean it, it's hard because, you know, when I wrote the book, it's not like I had a solution to the immigration problem, right?

It's so complex, and even now coming up to the election, you see so much polarization even among Latino communities, where you see a group of people kind of pushing away from the immigrant background that a lot of us have and trying to assimilate in a way that might be contrary and kind of hurts people that are kind of starting out in the country.

And so it's very disheartening to see that.

And I think that, for me, what I was trying to do with these narratives is show that there's people along different parts of it.

And that doesn't mean that they should be dehumanized.

That doesn't mean that they don't have human rights.

And so my goal was to provide, I guess, a vision into what our lives were and why we're still human, we're flawed, we're beautiful, and we deserve, you know, basic human rights.

- What kind of an impact do you think your book has made so far in creating some of those perspectives or encouraging conversations about it?

- I think that among a lot of students that I've gotten to talk to, they feel like their place or where they are matters.

I've met a lot of students in college or in high school that, you know, they feel they're trying to do something and they feel a lot of guilt for pursuing their education.

They feel a lot of guilt for leaving their families when they go to college.

But now because they've read the book, they know that it is because it is the only way for them to become the voice of their family or of their community.

And I think it allows them to kind of be selfish in a way, because getting ahead is what gets all of us ahead.

And so that was one thing that I know has been really positive from a lot of feedback that I've gotten.

But also from educators who have come to me multiple times, and they've told me, "I have a group of 16 undocumented students, and I've never known how to talk to them."

Or, "I had the student that was facing the same thing, and I didn't understand the signs until I read your book and realized that this is what they were going through."

- That's really remarkable.

You've been traveling the country talking to, like you mentioned, a lot of different Latino students and educators.

What is your biggest piece of advice for some of these students that you talk to who may have similar backgrounds, who may not have mentorship in their lives, or may not have parents who have the resources to support them?

What is your biggest piece of advice for staying the course?

- I think one thing is be loud and (indistinct) ask for what you want and see what happens.

My mom always told me that, "You already have a no in your pocket, so why don't you go for a yes?"

There's no harm in shooting big and asking for things and being proactive and advocating for yourself.

My parents always told me too, when I didn't understand something in class, they're like, "Well, isn't that the teacher's job to make sure that you understand?

So you follow up with that teacher and make sure that you understand and make sure that they know your name."

I think that being vocal and, you know, getting out of the shadows is really, really important.

I think that in a lot of our culture, people are very submissive to authority.

And I always fought against that, one, because I was a very rageful, ambitious child, but also because I saw that it actually led to things that I wanted.

So it's a really important tool.

I think people need to use it more, and I think asking for what you deserve and for what you need is super, super valuable.

- Well, speaking of support, having support in your life, you were just 23 years old when you became the legal guardian of your brother.

- Yes.

- What was that like?

Because I know the, the purpose and the motivation was really to give him the same opportunities you got.

- Exactly.

I mean, when I graduated from college, I was, quite honestly, looking for different boarding schools that would take him in.

I did not want to be a 23-year-old taking legal guardianship of a 16-year-old teenager.

I was like, "My life is over.

I'm going to become a mom to a teenager.

How am I going to do this?"

But those things didn't work out, and so I always told him, "You're going to come back to the United States with me.

It is not an option.

I'm not giving you a choice.

You're coming because I think that you are a good student and that I think you have opportunities."

So it was honestly navigating these systems together and making sure that he was placed in the right school, that he had the right support, and that he got ESL guidance and support because it was an entitlement to him.

And it was really hard to get, actually, even in a city like New York where it's so diverse, it was really hard to get him ESL help.

But we ended up doing that, and he learned really valuable lessons like speaking up for yourself and advocating for yourself.

And knowing to trust your gut when something feels wrong, you stand up and you say something.

- [Catherine] Absolutely.

So he's doing well, your parents are doing well?

- Yeah, my brother is actually a senior at Middlebury College.

He's studying art history, and he's actually doing his thesis on the immigration system through an art lens.

I think there's a bunch of people that are really working with, like, the border crisis, and they're trying to kind of share that through this different lens that I don't fully understand.

I mean, I work in tech.

(both chuckle) But he's doing really well.

And my parents, they just got their green cards.

So when I, you know, became an adult, I had the opportunity to do that.

And so as soon as I had the resources, I started that process.

They just got their green cards, and they're actually here in New York.

They've been here for a while.

So hopefully they give me some space soon, but I still love them.

(chuckles) - [Catherine] Well, they must be so proud of you.

Any chance that you'll write another book?

- I hope so.

I think right now my goal is to see what happens with the election.

For me, like I said, I'm very filled by rage and inspiration.

So as soon as I feel something isn't just, I get inspired to say something.

And I think, honestly, I'm waiting to see what happens with the election.

I'm trying to figure out how I can support in the upcoming days, but just kind of get a sense for where the country is at, and then figure out what I wanna do next.

You can't write two memoirs in a row, so I'm looking into something like nonfiction maybe for younger students, but we'll see.

- [Catherine] Well, you are inspiring.

Congratulations on the book, and much continued success to you.

It's been a pleasure chatting with you.

- Thank you so much.

- Thank you.

And that's our show for tonight.

For "Horizonte" in Arizona PBS, I'm Catherine Anaya.

Have a great night.

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