(upbeat music) (upbeat music continues) - Hey, y'all, I'm Kiara Butler, and welcome to "Generation Rising," where we discuss hard-hitting topics that our diverse communities face every day.

And today's topic is environmental justice.

I'd like to welcome Jesus Holguin, artist and activist, and Eugenie Belony, youth activist at the Providence Student Union.

Hey, y'all.

- [Both] Hey.

(chuckles) - How are you?

- We're here.

(Jesus laughing) - Y'all here, y'all out here in these streets.

- Thank you for having us.

Yes.

- Yes, thank you for coming.

- Of course.

- Mm-hmm.

- So tell our viewers, who are you, and what led you to environmental justice work?

- You wanna go first?

- Sure.

Hi, y'all, my name is Jesus, I'll give you my pronouns.

They are they/their or anything as long as there's not a negative intent.

And what brought me into environmental justice work is the goal to create holistically safe spaces.

- Mm-hmm.

- Specifically for Black and brown indigenous young folks, you know, divine masculine and fem folks and folks who are on the non-binary spectrum, just really making sure that they have spaces that they feel safe to be, express themselves, and also grow.

- What about you?

- I am a student.

I'm a current senior in high school, and I've been doing this work since, I wanna say, seventh grade in middle school, and I've worked with and started, I guess, my journey with Movement Education Outdoors, which I'll talk about a bit later.

Sunrise Movement and working with them over the years and being able to be in these spaces with other youth, and then seeing how, like, again, like, for my community and for my peers, a lot of the times in these spaces, we say, "Remember the empty chair," or, "Remember the empty seat."

And it's for those folks, for those youth, those parents, those community members who aren't in spaces like these, who aren't in public forums, who don't have access to that, and seeing how not only does that affect me, but it affects my friends, it affects my cousins and my younger cousins who are growing up now.

So being able to see how I can grow in this space and also impact the others that I work with, has really brought me to this new level of understanding environmental justice and how environmental justice is social justice.

- Mm-hmm.

- Mm-hmm.

- And Jesus, you said something, "Holistically safe spaces."

Tell me more about that.

What does that feel like, look like, taste like?

- Hmm, for me, holistically safe spaces is spaces that basically are acknowledging that we need spaces that are clean.

Folks need space, it's all about spaces where you live, work, play, and so you need spaces that are clean from environmental hazards, from toxins, from polluters, from even indoor toxins, like a lot of our schools have mold in it.

- [Kiara] Yeah.

- So making sure that all your spaces where you're learning and growing are clean.

You have access to clean air, clean water, not just clean spaces, but green spaces.

So, like spaces that are renewable, and, like, access to renewable energy at home.

It's also talking about affordable, making sure that, like, people are not getting kicked out of their neighborhoods because they can no longer afford to live there.

- Mm-hmm.

- It's about policing, right, it's about having a holistically safe space, it's making sure that folks don't feel policed for what they look like, who they love, or how they express themselves.

So when I think of holistic safe spaces, that's really the thought that I come with, is every piece should have a space where you're like, feeling safe, have space to grow, and is, like, affordable, green, and healthy, right, like that is really where it comes from.

- And I think oftentimes, when we think of that paradise, I'm gonna call it a paradise.

- Yeah.

- Right?

We think of co-leading and co-creating those spaces.

What does that authentically look like, to co-lead and co-create a space to make sure that it's environmentally just for marginalized people?

- I think it's just, in the terms of co-creating and co-leading, it's not just one person, not just one direct group of people, and especially for thinking of the broader aspect, we're thinking of community, we need all hands on deck, right, we need youth to come in, we need our elders to come into these space who have been doing the work, right, because when we start up new things or new tasks within environmental justice, we're like, I know there's a lotta people that were like, "I'm gonna change everything, like, with climate change, I'm gonna make this right."

But there's people who's been doing this work.

So in terms of co-creating and co-leading with them, it's, "Okay, who am I reaching out to?

Who are the people who have done this work?

How can we make it better?

How can we see that progress over time?"

And then being able to take that step back and see like, you know, take space, make space.

Where am I needed?

Where can I put my resources?

And also, who needs it as much as I do?

Or who's the next person that I can give that on to?

And I guess just growing from that space of being, I guess, working together and seeing where everyone lies and where all their strengths and weaknesses are just for greater good.

- Mm-hmm.

- Yeah.

And you mentioned youth.

Oftentimes, adults don't want youth in spaces, right?

We know it all, so how does that work?

Tell me more.

- Yeah, so I'll take it from the perspective of being at PSU.

So we are a youth-led organization, and when people hear youth-led, they're like, "Well, yeah, there's youth there, but there's, no."

Like, it is truly, and as a leadership team co-director, after our adult supporting staff, it's me and my other co-director who are the bosses of PSU.

We hold our leadership team, which is made up of 12 Providence Public High School students, including the Met High School, and we work together, and we create these campaigns, whether it's working on civics, whether it's working on CNC, which is our Counselors Not Cops campaign to remove SROs from school and replace them with more mental health resources and how that impacts students, especially after the pandemic.

And so in our hiring process, the youth are a part of who is going to be in our space in terms of adults, and one of the questions we ask is, "What do you know about adultism?

What do you know about that term?"

Because we don't want people to, I guess, dictate how students or how the youth are holding their meetings, holding what they wanna say.

We don't want them to feel like this space isn't for them when it is made for them.

- Mm-hmm.

- So when we take that outside of this youth-led space and bring it to the community, it's still the same idea.

We wanna make sure that youth have that opportunity to be like, "Oh, I have this idea that maybe my community, or maybe my ZIP code, if you live in 02909 or 02908.

Maybe we can start something here.

How do I help bring my councilmen or women into this conversation?

How do I find the people in my community who's already doing that work?"

Because a lotta times, I guess we're scared.

We're kinda sheltered away from seeking that knowledge and those resources from elders, or from older people in our communities, and it can be a bit, like, daunting to ask those questions, to see who has the answers to them.

So when we're working together and being able to incorporate youth, elders, like, everybody in the mix, it makes the whole process a lot easier.

- Yeah, and you're able to finally see the power of your voice, right?

You have that platform, and you're provided with those resources.

So were youth a part of creating the Racial and Environmental Justice Committee?

- No, they weren't.

The REJC, the Racial and Environmental Justice Committee, I was a part of the co-founding of it alongside the City of Providence, the Environmental Justice League Movement.

It was founded in, like, 2016 with community advocates, the City of Providence, Groundworks, Rhode Island, and One Square World.

And it was a collaboration to make sure that we were able to bridge community priorities with city policies, so really making sure that the folks who were pushing the city policies had access to like what the communities said their needs and their wants were.

- Mm-hmm.

And so what made you all come together?

Like, what was the problem that you really saw?

- The funny part about, like, what made us come together was actually the city had this idea around sustainability.

- Okay.

- And they were like, "We wanna do this.

You know, everyone's doing it, equal municipalities, and we wanna do it here in Rhode Island."

And they got the folks who were doing the environmental justice work.

They at least knew enough to, like, make sure that they were bringing frontline communities.

And what they found out really early when they were bringing frontline communities, was, like, there's a distrust with the city, right?

Like, there was a distrust with what are you gonna do with our capacity, with our time?

We're already, like, spread thin doing the work, and how is this gonna, like, not just pacify us, but also get the work that we wanna get done?

And so part of that whole initial process, the only reason why REJC came out, was because the city agreed to acknowledge the harm that it has caused, right, it agreed to acknowledge the state-sanctioned violence around gentrification, redlining, around policing, around the, like, enslavement of Black and brown folks, the taking of, like, Indigenous folks' lands, and just all those different processes, making sure that they were, like, acknowledging the harm that happened.

'Cause having these conversations around environmental justice, it's hard to have that conversation if folks don't start with that acknowledgement.

'Cause then, it's like we're doing history class instead of trying to heal or fix the harm.

- Yeah, and you used the terms redlining and gentrification in talking about the environment, and I just wanna make sure our viewers are following us.

So do you mind defining those for us?

- Yeah.

So redlining is a outdated system that cities had used in creating maps of their neighborhoods.

(alarm beeping) Really, and they were like, color-coded.

You know, green was, like, desirable land where you would wanna live.

Red was undesirable land, where you would wanna work.

And you'll see throughout history, the way that they were broken up was really where a lot of the, like, polluting sites would be.

So the red would be where the polluting sites.

And that red has, like, specifically moved in Providence, specifically, it used to be on the East Side where now India Point Park is, and it got moved to the Port of Providence.

And so at one point, the Port, India Point Park looked like the Port, but because that is also next to where the desirable land was, around where colonizers decided to settle and say like, "This is where we're gonna call home on the hill," because of war tactics.

(Kiara chuckling) They then had the power to say, "We don't want this in our community, and we want a park," and move it to the South Side of Providence, where it's predominantly Black and brown folks, where the highway was built on top of, like, Black and brown folks' homes, and different things like that.

So that is redlining, and then gentrification is part of, the second part of, like, redlining where people are being, can no longer afford to purchase homes or rent homes, and I think that's part of redlining too, that they didn't have access to buy the houses.

And those maps were set to determine, like, who got to buy houses in what neighborhoods, whether they got loans or not, and even up until, like, recently of 2015, you saw that, like, banks weren't giving Black people home loans.

- At their discretion.

- That's right, and so- - And that's happening still now, even in 2022- - It's still now, right.

- when it comes to the appraisals and things.

Is there anything you would add to that?

- I think after adding, like, the knowledge of redlining and the India Point Park in South Side, I took what's called a Toxic Tour with Monica Huertas, and we walked from Ives Street and, like, the Wickenden right at the port, and then walked all the way down, what is that, Atwells Ave?

And I used to live over there, right by where the salt mounds, the big metal scrapyards are, and then literally, on the second block, on New York Ave. And I have asthma, and so while I lived there, for the past seven years in that apartment, my asthma progressively got worse and worse and worse.

And what's right down the street?

The hospital.

So my mom's taking me to the hospital constantly, and then we moved to Silver Lake, and now, I'm a senior.

I haven't used my asthma pump since the end of sixth grade.

So what, six years?

- Wow.

- And so I wasn't thinking about that, I was like, "Oh, maybe just, you know, when you're younger, asthma can be a little harder."

And I take the Toxic Tour with Monica, and she's talking to us about all the gas that's in the air that is literally being put into these Black and brown communities, and I was living right across from all that.

And you literally, when you're driving, you can smell it in the air.

And I was like, "Oh, maybe it's just that.

It'll go away."

And then we were walking and she said, "You see those big, white drums over there?"

And we were like, "Yeah, it's about four of them."

And she said, "Yeah, those are a liquified natural gas, sitting right on our water.

There's big ships that are coming in across these, right through, little Providence, right, little Rhode Island.

And we have all these big things coming in right next to the hospital, right next to Women and Infants Hospital, right next to Hasbro in the Black and brown communities, and right on that street."

I drive by this all the time, and no one, I don't think if no one was to say, that you would know, but there's these two big, metal gate doors.

And she was saying that, say there was a big hurricane, or there was a big flood, right?

So it's a hurricane barrier, and I'm like, "Oh, okay, well, that doesn't mean.

I mean, it's not that it doesn't mean anything, but what does that have to do with anything?"

She said, "When they close that, who's gonna get flooded?

All of the South Side.

Who lives in the South Side?

- Child.

- Black and brown communities.

And who gets to live nice, freely, and dry?

The East Side, India Point Park, Downtown Providence, College Hill."

And so I was like, "I lived here half my life and I never understood why the reason that affected me."

And that's one of the other reasons why when you ask, like, why did I get into this work, it's because it really did impact me, and seeing that how it's impacting still my friends that live over there.

And even Monica, I think, lives over there still, and seeing how she was saying the soil, you can't even plant your own fruits and vegetables in that soil 'cause it's polluted.

- Yeah.

- Hmm.

The I-95 cutting across that, it's like, if you know about acid rain, it is the piece of, like, how, you know, carbon monoxide goes up from the cars, and then it just falls right down.

And again, that's like state-sanctioned violence because the government purposely built I-95- - Very true.

- in Black and brown communities.

- Yeah.

- And so yeah, that affects the soil.

- So how could we get more people on the Toxic Tour?

- Ask for it, right?

- Okay.

- I think that that's the...

There are a bunch of different Toxic Tours you can do.

Like I've done one, Monica does one, have a friend named Marco who does one, right, like, around even just the Black history- - Okay.

- in Providence.

And so I think asking for one, reaching out and being like, "Hey, we wanna do this.

This is something we wanna bring," either to a lotta the times, you know, schools and teachers would be like, "We wanted to bring our kids on a field trip, and we'll do a Toxic Tour around Providence."

- Liquified natural gas is actually fracked gas, right?

So fracking is the process in which they drill a hole into the ground, pump chemicals down to release gas from the rock so that it rises up.

So these chemicals stay into the ground and poison folks' drinking water, their land, so they're unable to grow anything on it.

- We've gotten CLF, right, they wanted to, CLF is Conservation Law Foundation.

They wanted some of their folks to, we wanted folks to experience it, right, and that's part of it, is that if you don't go and see what it looks like on a nice, hot summer day, you don't know what it smells like.

You don't know.

And those are the times where people are like, "Oh, my God.

Like, people live here?"

And it's like, "Yeah, this is.

And not just live here, but, like, I go to school here, right.

Like, I live, work, and play here, right?"

So all of those things.

- And I'm not originally from here, so now, it's something that I gotta look into.

Like, I need to go Google Toxic Tour 'cause I need to book one.

- Yeah.

- Can you tell our viewers more, like, what is the Just Providence Framework?

- The Just Providence Framework is one of the pieces that came out of the Racial Environmental Justice Committee.

It was probably, like, two to three years' worth of work, of community engagement around our community norms and the ways of working, generational principles just around the work.

Like Jemez Principle, the Black Panthers Principles, and so many, the Zapatistas.

Like, so many folks that have come before us, really trying to uplift that work as we were creating our idea of how do we wanna do this work and where the work really comes from.

Once we got through with that, we was left with like, I wanna say, like 11 principles where we were like, "This is where our work comes from and how we do it."

And when we got to see the end of it, it became a framework.

When we put all these things together, it became a framework of, like, what does a just Providence look like for community?

What does a just Providence look like for the folks who are working, the folks who are living, the children, like, at every step, what does it look like?

And yeah, I think I'll leave it there.

- Yeah.

Is there anything you wanna add to that?

- I don't think I could add to that.

- You good?

Okay.

And so what, in building that framework, did you identify any barriers that exist for, like, marginalized communities or people of color to get involved in environmental justice work?

- I think in terms of barriers, it's always, like you said, like, we're already spread so thin, and, like, everyone's doing something, and there's not enough time, there's not enough resources, and especially when you wanna involve the community, now who can work at this time?

Who's coming in, where can we get people?

Do people have cars or transportation?

Where's a central location where we can meet?

Can we hold a virtual option to have these community forums or these community meetings with each other?

And I think, like, there's always a new, there's always something that happens, right?

And we were like, "Oh, we're good.

We have a meeting due this Friday at 3:30," and then 10 people can't make it, right?

Now, you're like, "Damn.

Okay, can we reschedule?

All right, let's reschedule."

You know, there's always those things that come up, and it's always hard to work around it, but we find a way because, you know, community helps community.

You know, whether we're carpooling, whether we're like, "Okay, let's create a virtual option if that's easier," you know, after the pandemic, "Let's find a central location.

Maybe we can use the library if it's a nice day."

I know I've held many trainings at Dexter Park, or many meetings at Dexter Park, and just been outside in the community, where it's an easy-enough location for people to come to.

So I think barriers are like just the obstacles that we face in life in general.

And then also, if it comes to a barrier in which like, and policy makers where we're like, "Damn, we work so hard."

Now they like, "Stop," right?

And now we're like, "Well, we can't stop 'cause now we just brought 125 people with us.

And then we're gonna keep it going."

So I think coming to those road blocks, we have to find ways around them.

But we always try and find a way around it.

- Yeah, and I think I'll just add to that piece around, like, all the different pieces and trying to align them and just obstacles that that come with is, like, urgency.

And one thing at REJC that we always think about is, like, whose urgency is it, right?

And like, we wanna get these things done and we wanna make sure everyone's there.

How do we do it in a way that, like, we know not everyone's gonna make it to every meeting, at, like, right?

And so how do we work with community to make a grassroots space that folks can connect to, be a part of and bring their own urgency, and not the urgency of, like, because, yes, the work needs to happen, the work is gonna happen, but we also have to take the time to build the intention into the work that we wanna do.

And so even with working with the city, with, like, the Office of Sustainability, a lot of the times it's telling people they need to slow down because they wanna check the box, but they're not, they're, like, perpetuating the harm in the, like, urgency of keeping moving just to keep moving.

- Just to keep moving.

Just to say you are.

So what have you seen as, like, positive changes that have taken place because of your work?

I know there's a list, but if you could think of, like, one or two?

- I think, at least for me, is bringing more youth into these spaces, right?

Especially for, like, Providence students or Providence youth in general, like, it took me...

Started in 2016, so it took me, like, what?

Four years to be able to learn more and do the research and find out about Toxic Tours, be a part of these programs and bring my friends and bring my coworkers into these spaces.

And now it's like, "Oh, I didn't know we had this.

Oh, I just thought that was the Providence River, what's that?

Oh, I pass by these things all the time, what's that?"

So now I'm able to bring youth into these spaces and youth are, like, branching out on their own.

So I've worked with, like, the PVD Tree Plan, and I've started there and then my friends came in, now my friends are working with them and I'm still back here bringing more people in.

And, like, "All right, I'm gonna put you here, I'm gonna put you here, I'm gonna put you hear."

So I think bringing more youth into this space, and not just to be like, "Oh, I need you to work on this because we need more people, but I need you to understand that this is something that's happening and it affects you, it affects your parents, it affects your siblings, it affects everyone you love 'cause this is your community."

Whether that's your school community, whether that's your, like, your house community, where you're living.

You know, you said, we work, play, sleep, eat in these places and it definitely does impact everything we do and how we move from our day-to-day lives.

So bringing youth into these spaces and just educating them and having resources where they can reach out and be able to have these conversations with those folks, if I can't have the conversation with them.

- Yeah.

- Heck, yeah.

I agree with the awareness, right?

Like, making sure that folks are aware of their surroundings, the things that you usually make, like background characters to know that, like, oh, those are real players in their communities.

And you are also a real player in the community.

And have the ability to have autonomy to say how you want your community to look like.

And just that awareness in itself is really where, a friendlier environments are just as good as that piece of, like, you have autonomy to decide what your community looks like.

It comes with a big fight because of the obstacles of you not having, you know, all types of power, but, like, within just your community power, you have the ability to determine what it looks like.

- Thank you so much for sharing.

How can our viewers get involved and, like, how do we stay in touch with you?

- I will say, if you wanna connect with REJC, we have a info@rejc.com.

For me, you know, follow me on social media (laughing) @itookthewheel.

- [Kiara] Drop the handles.

What are your handles?

- No, that's, itookthewheel.

- itookthewheel, okay.

- In terms as the youth and the environmental justice part, movementeducationoutdoors on all social media platforms.

- Okay.

- And then pvdstudentunion.org, or pvdstudentunion on all social media platforms.

And then for me personally, you can reach me at @astro.-_eugenie, which is E-U-G-E-N-I-E.

I almost forgot how to spell my own name.

And then like you said, just reaching out, doing the research because we literally have it there, like, if you're search in your ZIP code, if you search in, like, some youth environmental justice in Providence or in Woonsocket or Central Falls, Pawtucket, all that information will be there for you.

And then just connecting through finding a friend, and then building your relationship through that and getting in the work.

- Can I just put a sneaky plug for Monica Huertas at The People's Port Authority.

If you're looking for those Toxic Tours, that plug in into community, hit her up and she will tell you where you need to be.

(Eugene and Jesus giggling) - All right, well guess what, y'all?

- What's that?

- We have run out of time.

It flew by, right?

- [Both] Yes.

- All right, well, for our viewers, you can watch past episodes any time on on watch.R-I-P-B-S.org, and be sure to follow us on Facebook and Twitter for the latest updates.

I would like to thank today's guests, Jesus and Eugene for their time and incredible work.

And we have started a tradition where you can leave your mark on our board.

I'm gonna have y'all grab some chalk and head on over.

(gentle serene music) (gentle serene music continues) (gentle serene music continues)