- [Announcer 1] "By The River" is brought to you in part by, the University of South Carolina Beaufort, learning in action discovered, the ETV Endowment of South Carolina, Community Foundation of the Lowcountry, strengthening community, Osher Lifelong Learning Institute at USCB, the Pat Conroy Literary Center.

- [Announcer 2] A musicologist and researcher, Eric Crawford found his calling and researching and preserving "Gullah Spirituals."

In his book, "Gullah Spirituals," Crawford traces Gullah Geechee songs from their beginnings in West Africa to their height as songs for social change and black identity in the 20th century American south.

- I'm Holly Jackson, join us as we bring you powerful stories from both new and established Southern authors as we sit "By The River."

(upbeat music) Hi, there, it is such a beautiful day here at our Lowcountry studio here on the waterfront in Beaufort, beautiful Beaufort.

We appreciate you tagging along with us today, and this is our love letter to Southern writing.

Here we invite authors from South Carolina, new and established, also some from across the Southeast.

And today, we are pleased to have Dr. Eric Crawford.

He is the author of "Gullah Spirituals," and this is the sound of freedom and protests in the South Carolina Sea Islands.

Beautiful cover, I'm always impressed by what makes the cover.

So I really liked this.

- Thank you.

- Thank you so much for coming to Beaufort.

I know you're no stranger to this area.

- No.

- Because this is where so much of the research happened for the book, but I'm gonna let you do the explaining.

So tell us a little bit about what's inside and what readers can gather from this.

- Well, they see how on the island spirituals are already have the foundation for Negro spirituals.

And so when I first undiscovered that this document called "Slave Songs, the United States," this 1867 document, really at the beginning when they go spirituals and those who have studied will always quote that same book, was from here.

And so my question in 2006 or so was to figure out all those songs to being done here and have they changed over time?

And this has been over 150 years, of course.

And so when I came here, I discovered, yes, they are still here.

And I've found four main singers on the island, Deacon James, Garfield Smalls, Minnie Gracie Gadson, Rosa, and Joseph Murray who were singing these wonderful songs.

And so I became their interviewer, I guess, and just Rick humbling about the songs and why they kept these songs alive after centuries, you never really.

- Tell us a little bit about your background, where you come from and why this interest and passion grew inside of you.

- I'm old, piano player, (laughs) and I was at Norfolk State University, and I had a master's student, Miranda Rice who was doing this pieces on "Gullah Spirituals" in the public schools.

And I said, "Gouda, what's that look?

Gullah, Gullah?"

And so as I began to look into this term and word, I realized how truly foundational, how important it was just in general to the American story, from civil rights to slavery, of course, and even now.

And so for me, it became really a sense of finding my own past, my own cultural past.

I recall going to my mother or my grandmother's church in the country and old white church and hearing these songs and hearing them be tapping of the feet or the clapping and hearing this word Geechee, not knowing what it meant, but when I first came to the island, I went to this small structure, it was called Ian praise house.

And the older members say per house where they would go to, and I heard James Garfield Smalls began singing, and I could quickly think back to my own childhood and hearing those same songs, and I realized I'm at the home where they came from.

- Must've been a neat feeling.

- Oh, yes, it was, it was, it was, it made sense.

- Right, I was really fascinated whenever I read that you attended at HBCU, but all throughout your time there, you never heard anything about the Gullah culture.

Why do you think that is?

- That's scary to say that, but yes, I think, and not probably up until 2000, Gullah Geechee was a badge of being ashamed of one's past.

Even the actor Aaron days says that his mother would say to them, "Don't speak Gullah."

It meant that you weren't educated.

And so I think that was the case.

I was in the choir and I would hear these over down quarters who would say, "Well, for this word, we'll say, duh or dad, or go say water, " but there's no kind of a reason why, they were trying to interpret this language, that we now know has certain rules, but back then to them, it was just, we know, let's make it sound this way.

And over time, understanding how important this west African language is and our culture is, I became fascinated with, can I go back and impact in a book?

At the end, there's a songbook.

And I asked Aaron days to write five songs as they might've been done by a slave and pure Gullah Geechee, because I think that's an important language that we'd seen to omit, the Fisk Jubilee singers did so much for us in terms of singing these songs in the 1800s and making them really palatable to white audiences, but they use standard English 'cause of course, that was understood and they discarded that language.

And so my quest now is less kind of reconnect the old Gullah Geechee language to the spirituals, and, go ahead, sorry.

- Yeah, so I guess what may have been, as I was reading the initial visit to St. Helena, you decided to go to one of these churches expecting to hear these songs and did not.

So again, why do you think?

You mentioned the shame that may have thrown around, do you think that's what it was?

- I think for me and churches now, gospel, and has become the norm now.

And because, once in fact, it's kind of once said, a Lomax said, "Once you had choirs now, formal choirs who would sing, the congregation now would sit and listen, no longer was there a communo, whose side are you leaning on?

Response by them leaning on the Lord side?

Now the choir was performing.

And so there was no longer a need for a spiritual, 'cause the spiritual is built on a leader and response.

Now we had a performance and now I'm sitting there.

And so many of the old singers will say in church, there is no longer a need for us to sing the old songs.

We have professional singers now.

And so those songs were no longer being done.

- But eventually, you did find that place.

- I did, I did.

- And tell me about that experience.

- And primarily, most of a singles are from Ebeneezer Baptist Church.

They have found a way to still cling to those old songs.

And so there are all three singles here up on that church.

And so they found a way to still include that, those old songs and their everyday Sunday service.

And because of that, many visitors are said, if they ask, "Where can I hear these old songs, or hear an old service?"

They'll be told to go to heaven to listen to that.

- And I'm really excited that we have something very special to our guests to sit down today and tell us who you've brought, and why you've brought them and what they're gonna do for us.

- Well, I think the best way to truly enjoy these songs, is it hidden being done, especially live, of course, but it couldn't be done 'cause then you can really hear the paddles and you can sense they share history and the background of how the songs were first forged.

As I say in my book, there was nothing pretty about slavery.

And when you can hear this song, you can instantly hear the song with the pain, and yet the victory of those who were enslaved.

- Okay, and if you would introduce who's here with us and they can just come on up and we'll get started.

- Oh, yes, we have Minnie Gracie Gadson.

- And I know one of these people is very special to you because you basically lived in their backyard.

- I lived in her backyard in this trailer.

- That was your research process.

- It was my research process, and it was my ethnographic experience there.

And she would come every morning with the best food and fish.

And Rosa Murray is here with her husband, Deacon Joseph Murray, and they have taught me so much.

In fact, every time I'm with them, I learned something new.

For example, there's a popper clap that's called a B plus B plus two clap Laureate, the Charleston clap.

I was doing, (claps) for years, just having the best time.

Deacon Murray says to me, "Eric, the men don't do that."

- Uh-oh, (laughs) - A single clap, (claps) So all of his time, and suddenly he tells me that, but anyway I believe they're gonna each sing a song, I believe it was talking to her phone.

We see doing her famous app in a garden.

- You want me to do "Adam?"

- I think, yeah, "Adam" is a young shouting song that it was probably the most famous one because it's a story of Adam who discovers that he's now a naked.

And so the song goes, Oh, Eve, where is Adam?

And response, Adam en the gaardian picking up leave.

And so when you would do this shouting, this dance counter anti-clockwise, and you would move down as it did picking up these leave.

- Okay.

- And so she'll sing that, which is a song that she's known for.

- Right.

- If she's mine.

- And we'll notice that we get louder and faster, right?

- Well, if she gets the spirit- - If she gets, we'll see what happens.

- We'll see.

- Okay, well, I'm excited about this.

All right, so you do whatever you need to do when it comes to time in terms of leading or getting involved.

Okay, all right, let's do it.

♪ Oh Eve, ♪ ♪ wehs Adam ♪ ♪ Oh Eve, Oh ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ A-Pickin up, a-pickin up, a-pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Satan mad and I'm so glad ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ That's a soul he thought he had ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ My mother has you work on the floor ♪ ♪ Adam in de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Pick that snip and you saw that loss ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ When in a valley one day to pray ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ So that happy I stayed all day ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ My mother has to work on the floors ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Pick that slip and saw that loss ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Oh Eve, wehs Adam ♪ ♪ Oh Eve, ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ A-Pickin up, a-pickin up, a-pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ When in a valley one day to pray ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ So that happy I stayed all day ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ ♪ Oh Eve, wehs Adam ♪ ♪ Oh Eve ♪ ♪ Adam een de gaardian, pickin up leave ♪ - Thank you, beautiful.

Is there another we wanted to share?

- Let's do Rosa and she's gonna do, "I'm Bound fo Mt.

Zion."

- Okay.

♪ I'm bound fo Mt.

Zion ♪ ♪ Way out on a hill ♪ ♪ Oh, I'm bound fo Mt.

Zion ♪ ♪ Way out on a hill ♪ ♪ I'm bound fo Mt.

Zion ♪ ♪ Way out on a hill ♪ ♪ If anybody make it surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will, Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will, Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will, Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will, Surely I will ♪ ♪ If the mother made it ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ If the mother made it ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ 'Cause surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ If the father made it ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ If the father made it ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ If Madidan made it ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ Surely I will ♪ ♪ I'm bound fo Mt.

Zion, ♪ ♪ Way out on a hill ♪ ♪ I'm bound fo Mt.

Zion ♪ ♪ Way out on a hill ♪ ♪ I'm bound fo Mt.

Zion ♪ ♪ Way out on a hill ♪ ♪ If anybody make it surely I will ♪ - There's one found song, which to me speaks to the Gullah Geechee language is called, "Hey Nevah Look-a-day."

(laughs) That's a pure gula pretty much.

And then the Deacon will explain its origins.

- Okay.

- Okay, let me explain it.

Then before I start blowing a little bit.

On the plantation where I were born and raised up at, that had prayer house on the plantation, and then all the time people had prayers every Sunday, every Tuesday, and every Thursday night.

Well, a certain time of the year when you come down in the month of December, there's the how to praise the cold watch night.

They all gather for that classroom or prayer house, whatever you wanna call it.

And you sing and they praise God, from the time they meet the 10 o'clock down there until they're brought clean the next morning, and then dear start to clean and the sun coming up, then somebody catch a song in our classroom, and this the song they catch.

♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Day-duh-Clean ♪ ♪ Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Day-duh-Clean ♪ ♪ Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Day-duh-Clean ♪ ♪ Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Day-duh-Clean ♪ ♪ Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Day-duh-Clean ♪ ♪ Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Day-duh-Clean ♪ ♪ Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ ♪ Hey Nevah Look-a-day ♪ - Beautiful, thank you so much.

Thank you so much.

This is such a treat.

- As you saw he was doing a single clap.

- Right, I noticed, I noticed right.

You know what to do now, right?

(all laughing) - And this lady did now.

- Grand years later.

(all laughing) - Thank you so much.

- All right.

- We really appreciate that.

This is wonderful, quite a treat.

It's one thing to talk about it, but a whole other experience.

So just watch it.

- And just feeling that, and you could tell that it goes beyond notes to read their lived experience and a passion for it.

It just comes across.

- I wanted to make sure I touched on something that I heard you say in some of my research, if you do in a presentation, fascinating, you talked about a secret code that can be found and that would go in, whether it was slow or fast that, well, what do you mean about the secret code for those of us who have no idea what that means?

- Well, oftentimes we think about spirituals and wade in the water, meaning go in the wars with dogs can smell your scent, and which is probably true, but I think part of the secret codes were in their language.

They can take a dull quickly from standard English to this Gullah language and disguise what they were saying.

And one of the best examples, probably all these boats songs that are in my chapter one, and you would have these rowers who were all the towns would be doing these heavy loads for days.

And they would perhaps do busy incidents of someone named Ralph who's drunk, gets on a boat in Charleston, and he's really haggling the rowers.

And so as a push off to begin, there's a leader called a Patroon who says, "Hey, boy's gonna leave Charleston."

And so they get off, they go singing, and then as they go along, he says, "Hey, Ralph, he naughty, he's not gonna let us rest at all."

And this goes into the song, then now commenting on this white passenger and his song, and so this is one of these incidents that this slave is... - And this is a foreign language to that white passenger.

- Foreign Language, right, right.

And so they can protest through their own language or just through the fact that they're on rowing and the award's going perhaps, and the wind's going, and we can talk about and sing about how we are frustrated, and there's one song, it's called "Lay Your Body Down," in which white passengers come and these slaves are asleep.

They're tired and they're yet forced to row.

And they at the end say, lay this and they use the inward down 'cause they're so tired, but they're still forced to a row and to work.

And so these songs, and both songs were ways to really comment on their conditions, yeah.

- Talk about the way this book is laid out and what you have in the beginning and the end.

- Right, so I began with both songs and at the end comp or at the chapter four or five come the civil rights songs because these same songs that served them during slavery essentially later were called upon the civil rights movement.

And Martin Luther King would come to Penn Center here, of course, and the songs like this may be the last time, I don't know, that song served as a variety of times because oftentimes when summer of 64 in Mississippi, these white teenagers were coming down to voting rights and there was uncertainty, of course, some were killed.

And that song was this sense of, this maybe it will last time, tomorrow wasn't promised though.

And of course, Sea Islands gave us and we shall overcome as well, but these songs that, again, this communal sense, and we can do calm response and these songs would keep them, despite the dogs being on there more, or being jailed, there was still the sense of assurance that what we're doing is right, we are correct.

And in the end, be it in Zion, be it over Jordan will be victorious at some point.

- Who do you hope reads the book, and what do you hope they take away?

- From five top?

- Yeah, yeah, (laughs) - Just how this history has been forgotten or lost, and how hopefully now we'll capture someone's fancy.

And so I didn't realize this, so let's go back and revisit and retell history according to what's honestly, because oftentimes we forget the contributions to arise in South Carolina, from the slaves and their skills, and how food, Southern food, there is Gullah Geechee food, sometimes clothing, this Southern food thinking.

There's so many contributions that are Gullah Geechee yet we don't hear Gullah Geechee.

- And this was an eight year project for you.

- I started in 2012, and now it's nine years, (laughs) - Oh, wow, okay.

- But it's funny each year.

- Now are we talking about everyday you're researching and reading, or here and there.

- I spend most of my time doing interviews.

I would travel to someone's homes when they're in the country, and just get to know, I've done probably about 40 interviews throughout South Carolina, and I enjoy going to these isolated places and really hearing their stories, and singing of course, but just come learn about just how important oral histories are, too often we don't record people until they're gone.

James Garfield Smalls who's not here, died in October at 100 years old.

And every day with him was just a joy.

He knew so much.

- And you gained a lot of friends through this, I can tell, at least three good ones right here in the city.

So this has been really cool.

Let's quickly tell what you do professionally now so that our viewers can know.

- I'm at Bendict College in Columbia, South Carolina.

I'm a Director of the Honors Program now.

And it's exciting being able to hopefully inspire, challenge this younger generation to really assume control and study and embrace their culture, for me, that's exciting.

- And I think you will, because you can tell you have the passion.

And I think that's the very beginning of that.

So our time is up.

I can't believe that we've... - Oh, so soon!

- I know, I've had a lot of fun and I've learned a lot.

And this been really special today, especially to have the singers here.

- Oh, thank you.

- So thanks so much for joining us- - And thanks for having me.

- And thank you all of our viewers for joining us here on "By The River."

I'm your host, Holly Jackson.

We're gonna leave you now with a look at our Lowcountry Poets Corner.

We'll see you next time, "By The River."

(gentle music) - I met America at a neighborhood bar.

He offered me a shot of rum, and I reminded him that Captain Morgan was a slave owner.

So the bartender awkwardly slipped.

Another liquid lie down my throat.

I ordered another drink and was channeled by dark spirits.

The courage of black ghosts who haunt American dreams.

I told him I loved him and I wanted him to sleep well, but I know I've been in your nightmares, I said.

I want to be your friend, but only if it's a deep relationship, only if you show me that you are not scared of your baggage, bring your whole history to the table.

America cracked, open and other beer.

As a tear, ran down his face.

He said, I was born in a house, not my own.

And my father has demanded that their portraits hang on every wall.

White paint covers each brown brick.

And our backyard is a museum of unmarked graves.

Despite this a garden grows, I said, every home can be torn down and rebuilt again, but I've been told I shouldn't completely let you in, he said.

Some people in my family stand in the doorway, blocking the entrance.

He left before I could tell him that my people have a history of finding ways inside broken spaces and making them whole again.

- As the artists publish, it goes through St. Helena island spirituals by one, the last glimpses of slave life of America, who was singing of the song.

One is exposed to this strange Patois of Gullah, the hip jerking of a ring shout, portamento vocal singing, hand clapping, foot stomping, and most important, the hopes, desires, and suffering of those in bondage.

- [Announcer 1] "By The River" is brought to you in part by the University of South Carolina Beaufort, learning in action, discovered, the ETV Endowment of South Carolina, Community Foundation of the LowCountry, strengthening community, Osher Lifelong Learning Institute at USCB, the Pat Conroy Literary Center.