>>> OUR GUEST THIS WEEK ON THE RECORD, FROM VOTERS, NOT POLITICIANS, TRYING TO REFORM STATE GOVERNMENT.

LOTS OF LUCK.

LET'S TALK ABOUT THE GOVERNOR AND RESTRICTIONS BEING LIFTED MAYBE.

ON THE OTR PANEL, WE HAVE KYLE MALIN, RIM ALBIN AND LAUREN GIVENS WITH US AS WE GET THE INSIDE OUT "OFF THE RECORD."

> PRODUCTION OF OFF THE RECORD IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY THE FOLLOWING: BUSINESS LEADERS FOR MICHIGAN HAS A STRATEGIC PLAN TO MAKE # INDEX# A TOP 10 STATE IN THE NATION FOR JOBS, PERSONAL INCOME AND A HEALTHY ECONOMY.

NOW, THIS EDITION OF "OFF THE RECORD" WITH KIM SKUBIC.

>> WELCOME BACK TO "OFF THE RECORD."

WE APPRECIATE YOU TAKING TIME TO FIND OUT WHAT'S GOING ON LANSING AND WE WILL MEET THREE PEOPLE WHO KNOW EVERYTHING THAT'S GOING ON LANSING.

RICALBIN, KYLE AND LAUREN, GUYS ARE RESPONDING.

YOU DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING?

WHAT KIND OF JOURNALISTS ARE YOU.

THE GOVERNOR SORT OF BELLLIED UP TO THE BAR BUT DIDN'T ORDER ANYTHING.

>> YES.

IT LOOKS LIKE THE TRENDS ARE POSITIVE IN I HAVE # INDEX#, LEAST MORE POSITIVE THAN THEY HAVE BEEN.

VACCINATION RATES ARE GOING UP.

THE CASE NUMBERS ARE LOOKING BETTER.

AND WHILE THERE HAVE NOT BEEN RESTRICTIONSLIST, AS YOU SAID, IN THE LAST WEEK IT DID SOUND AS THOUGH THE GOVERNOR WAS HEADED IN THAT DIRECTION.

SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT HER INTEREST IN GETTING KIDS BACK TO IN-PERSON LEARNING SOONER RATHER THAN LATER.

WE ARE STARTING TO SEE A LITTLE BIT I THINK IT WOULD BE FAIR TO SAY IT'S LIKELY THAT MORE RESTRICTIONS ARE -- MORE RESTRICTIONS WILL BE LIFTED SOON.

>> KYLE, WHEN YOU READ THE TEA LEAVES, WHAT DO YOU SEE.

>> A FEW THINGS THAT ARE PROBABLY GOING TO BE THE NEXT UP, FIRST BEING NURSING HOME VISITATIONS.

THERE IS A REAL PROBLEM IN NURSING HOMES RIGHT NOW WHERE OLDER FOLKS HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO SEE LOVED ONES FOR MONTHS AND MONTHS AND MONTHS THEY ARE GETTING DEPRESSED AND LOSING HOPE.

I SEE THE GOVERNOR DOING SOME EASING UP ON THOSE AS LONG AS THE PEOPLE INVOLVED HAVE GOTTEN VACCINATED.

I THINK THAT'S COMING SOON.

I THINK WE WILL SEE MORE ON RESTAURANT CAPACITIES.

AT SOME POINT, WE WILL GET TO 50% CAPACITY.

I THINK AT SOME POINT, THE GOVERNOR IS GOING TO -- NOT THE GOVERNOR BUT THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES DIRECTOR WHO SIGNS ON OF ON THESE ORDERS AND WITH CAPACITY AND GATHERINGS AND HOW MANY YOU CAN HAVE ON A PARTICULAR SPACE MUCH THE THING ABOUT THIS PANDEMIC AND THE PUBLIC HEALTH ORDERS IS THAT FOLKS HAVE GOT THAT NEXT LEVEL OF THINGS TO OPEN UP.

THERE ARE STILL SEVERAL RESTRICTIONS OUT THERE ONCE THINGS START ROLLING.

THIS CASE, ROLLING DOWNHILL, NUMBERS ARE POSITIVE.

THERE IS ALWAYS GOING TO BE SOMETHING ELSE THAT CAN BE POINTED TO AS SAYING, HEY, WE COULD DO THIS NOW.

WE CAN DO GYMS AT 50% NOW.

I THINK WE WILL SEE A GRADUAL ROLEBACK AS NUMBERS COME DOWN.

>> LURKING IN THE BACKGROUND IS THE VARIANT OF THE VIRUS WOULDN'T IT BE SOMETHING IF SHE DID THESE ROLLBACKS AND HAD TO PUT THEM BACK ON BECAUSE OF THE VAIRNT?

THIS IS A ROLL OF THE DICE, ISN'T IT WE SHUT SOME THINGS DOWN OUT OF AN ABUNDANCE OF CAUTION.

AS THE PAJJISTS POINTS OUT, IF YOU GO BACK TO THE FALL, THINGS ARE BETTER BUT THESE VARIANT STRAINS.

IF THEY ARE MORE CONTAGIOUS WHAT DOES THAT MEAN IF I AM A RESTAURANT OWNER, AND YOU SAY I CAN GO TO 50%?

AM I I AM NOT SURE GOING TO 50% ET CETERA BETE 25% AND SOME PLACES WANT TO OPEN UP.

IF SOME ARE ROAMED BACK SEARS WILL SAY WHAT ABOUT US STRARNT STRAINS START TO SPREAD, YOU MIGHT HAVE TO CLOSE IT DOWN AGAIN.

THE ECONOMY OF THE STATE HAS TAKEN A BIG HIT.

STATE WILL TAKE A BIG HIT WHEN WE LOOK AT NUMBERS A YEAR FROM NOW.

>> DR. KHALDUN, THE NATIONAL MODELING IS BY THE END OF MARCH, VISA VU COVID WILL BE '117 FROM REBATE.

THAT WILL BE THE ONE DOMINATING, AND KYLE, THE GOVERNOR'S GOT A LITTLE PROBLEM WITH THAT COVID AID MONEY.

IS ANY PROGRESS BEING MADE THERE?

MORE MONEY FOR K-12, $450 PER STUDENT BOOST TO ALL SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN THE STATE.

IT'S NOT EVERYTHING THAT SHE WANTED.

IT'S STILL $4 BILLION MORE OR LESS THAN WHAT SHE WANTED.

BUT THE REPUBLICANS ARE CLAIMING THEY ARE BEING GOOD STEWARDS OF THE TACK PAIR MONEY.

THEY WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT EVERYTHING THAT IS BEING SPENT IS BEING SPENT APPROPRIATELY.

AND ONCE THEY SIGN THE CHECK AND GIVE EVERYTHING OTHER THAN TO THE ADMINISTRATION, THEY LOSE CONTROL.

THEY ARE SAYING EVERYTHING THAT THEY ARE SIGNING OFF, THE ADMINISTRATION IS WHAT WE NEED TELL.

IF THEY NEED ANOTHER BILL IN THE MONTH, THEY WILL DO ANOTHER BILL IN THE MONTH.

THEY DON'T SEE THIS AS A BIG DEAL.

BUT THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE AREN'T ON THE SAME PAGE THEY HAVEN'T TALKED TO THE BUDGET DIRECTOR.

THERE IS A LOT OF WORK TO BE DONE.

IT'S A SLOW CRAWL.

LET'S ASSUME THAT THE HOUSE AND SENATE GET TOGETHER AND SEND HER SOMETHING DOES THE GOVERNOR VE THE TOTE BECAUSE SHE WANTED 5.6 OR PUT PEN TO PAPER AND SAY I WILL TAKE THIS AND WE WILL WORK ON IT LATER?

WHAT'S THE MOOD?

I THINK IS IT REMAINS TO BE SEEN WHAT THE ACTUAL PACKAGE IS.

THE PACKAGES WERE PRETTY DIFFERENT, BUT I THINK IT WOULD BE HARD TO -- I THINK IT WOULD BE HARD TO VETO OUTRIGHT MONEY TO GO TOWARDS SOME OF THESE INITIATIVES, ESPECIALLY THINGS LIKE VACCINE DISTRIBUTION AND SOME OF THE OTHER THINGS THAT ARE INCLUDED ARE RENTAL ASSISTANCE, FOOD ASSISTANCE.

SO EVEN IF IT'S NOT THE FULL AMOUNT OF FEDERAL FUNDING AVAILABLE, I THINK IT WOULD BE PRETTY HARD TO VETO IT IF IT'S NOT THE PERFECT PACKAGE.

THAT SAID, THERE IS A LOT OF CONCERNS THAT HOUSE AND SENATE DEMOCRATS HAVE HAD WITH WHAT LEGISLATORS ARE TYING TO THIS MONEY WITH THE WAY THAT THE VACCINES WOULD BE -- WORK DISTRIBUTED AND ALSO, POTENTIALLY IN THE HOUSE, YOU SAW AN EFFORT TO TIE IT TO POLICY INITIATIVES THAT WOULD GIVE LOM HEALTH DEPARTMENTS MORE CONTROL OVER WHAT WOULD HAVE BEEN.

SO, I THINK THERE IS A LOT THAT STILL NEEDS TO BE WORKED OUT HERE BEFORE IT GETS TO THE GOVERNOR.

>> THE STICKY WICKETT WAS THE REMOVAL OF GRACE AS A FACTOR IN DETERMINING WHO GETS THE VACCINE.

>> THAT'S A LIGHTNING-ROD ISSUE FOR THIS GOVERNOR.

IS IT NOT.

>> IT IS.

IF THAT REMAINS IN THERE, I THINK THAT GIVES HER A MOTIVATION BEYOND THE DOLLARS AND CENTS TO VETO THIS PACKAGE IF IT COMES TO HER.

NOW, ABOUTR AS LAWRENCE SAID, WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE.

BY THE TIME THE HOUSE AND SENATE HARMZ SOMETHING OUT.

BUT THE OTHER PROBLEM IS, THEY WOULD LIKE TO GET SOME OF THIS MONEY OUT THERE SOONER RATHER THAN LATER.

SO WHILE IT IS HAPPENING, IT'S NOT HAPPENING VERY QUICKLY.

SERGE NOT THE AMOUNT OF THE GOVERNOR WOULD BE UNDER LIMITATIONS DEPENDING ON WHAT VERSION OF THIS GOES THROUGH.

SO, I GUESS I AM NOT AS CERTAIN THAT SHE SIGNS IT.

IF IT GETS TO HER WITH SOME OF THE THINGS THAT HAVE BEEN ATTACHED TO IT OR AT LEAST SOME OF THE THINGS THAT IF IT COMES TO HER IN A FORM THAT IS $4 BILLION SHORT, SHE MAY WELL BE ABLE TO JUSTIFY A VETO AND THE STATE OF THE LEGISLATURE WE NEED THIS MONEY AND NEED IT NOW THE STATE BUDGET DIRECTOR, MR. MASTERON HAS NOT HAVE.

A MEETING, BUT IT LOOKS LIKE THEY MIGHT HAPPEN THIS AFTERNOON.

IF THAT DOES HAPPEN, THEY HAVE THE THREE KEY PLAYERS IN THE ROOM WHO NEED TO WORK ALL OF THIS LANGUAGE OUT.

THE # INDEX# HOUSE PASSED A CHANGE IN THE LAME DUCK LEGISLATION AND EYES ARE GLAZING OVER RIGHT NOW IN TV LAND.

BUT WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IN THE HOUSE?

IT'S GOING TO GO TO THE SENATE AND THEY WILL HAVE TO APPROVE IT FOR IT TO GO ON THE BALLOT.

ANY BILL PASSED DURING THE LAME DUCK SESSION, THE SIX OR SEVEN WEEKS AFTER AN ELECTION, THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE TWO-THIRDS SUPPORT FROM BOTH CHAMBERS FOR A BILL TO GET SENT TO THE GOVERNOR FOR SIGNATURE THE.

THIS IS DESIGNED TO PREVENT BILLS THAT ARE OF A DIRECT PARTISANNATE TO GET SIGNED INTO LAW.

THE LAST FEW SESSIONS, AT LEAST 40% OF THE BILLS THAT BECAME PUBLIC ACT WERE PASSED IN THE LAME DID DUCK SESSION.

JASON WENTWORTH WANTS TO PRESENT THAT FROM HAPPENING IN THE FUTURE.

THE SOUNDINGS THAT WE ARE PICKING UP INITIALLY ON THE SENATE IS NOT EVERYBODY IS GOING TO GO, HEY, THIS IS A GREAT IDEA WHO HAS SAID: WE ARE NOT SO SURE.

LAUREN, WHAT'S YOUR READ?

>> YEAH.

THE FIRST THE STEP TO BRING MORE TRANSPARENCY BILLS TO THE FLOOR.

IT'S NOT THE FIRST TIME THE HOUSE HAS TRIED TO INITIATE TRANSPARENTS ISSUES.

WE SAW BILLS OPENING UP THE LEGISLATURE AND GOVERNOR TO SOME FORM OF PUBLIC RECORDS DISCLOSURE GOING THROUGH THE HOUSE LAST SESSION.

IT DID NOT MAKE IT THROUGH THE SENATE.

IT REMAINS TO BE SEEN SIZHE NEEDS ON TO HAVE THE FULL WEIGHT TO MAKE IT GO THROUGH: A LOT OF MOVING PARTS.

>> THE SPEAKER'S WEIGHT CARRIES.

IS THAT DOA IN THE NATURE?

THE REASON THIS IS NOT SUCH A GREAT IDEA AT A TIME WITH THE # INDEX# REPUBLICAN.

>> ANY OF US WHO HAVE BEEN IN THE CHAMBER AT 4:00 O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING CAN COME UP WITH AT LEAST SOME DOING AWAY WITH WHAT WE HAVE KNOWN IN THE PAST.

IN THE LAME DUCKCESSION, DIFFERENT.

NEXT IT'S NOT LIKELY TO GID SIGNED.

WHAT IT MEANS OVERALL, THE QUESTION IS: DO YOU WANT TO BRIDLE THE LEGISLATURE AFTER THEY HAVE STOOD, IN SOME CASES, FOR THEIR FINAL ELECTION FROM PASSING A BUNCH OF BILLS THAT HADN'T BEEN CONSIDERED PERHAPS BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T EXPEDIENT FROM A POLITICAL STANDPOINT.

IF YOU WANT THAT TO HAPPEN, YOU WANT IT TO BE MORE DIFFERENT FOR THOSE BILLS TO GET PASSED.

I HOPE IT WOULD BE A QUESTION OF PROCEDURE AND THE PROPER WAY TO LOOK AT GOVERANCE MORE THAN A MATTER OF WRESTING POWER AWAY FROM THE LEGISLATURE.

UNLESS YOU HAVE A GOVERNOR WHO IS GOING TO GO ALONG WITH YOU YOU DON'T HAVE THAT POWER ANYWAY.

RIGHT?

>> ON THIS POINT, THAT'S A GOOD SEGUE.

NANCY WHO IS WITH US.

THIS IS NOT DOA IN THE SENATE.

SOME WOULD ARGUE IT'S ON LIFE SUPPORT.

WOULD YOU AGREE WITH THAT ANALYSIS?

>> IMPORTANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE HERE THAT THE ISSUE IS NOT BEFORE THE SENATE TO PASS INTO LAW BUT RATHER THAT THEIR VOTE IS NEEDED TO PRESENT THIS ISSUE TO THE VOTERS I THINK WE WILL FIND THE VOTERS WILL OVERWHELMINGLY SUPPORT THIS.

LAME DUCK GIVES LAWMAKERS WHO HAVE BEEN TERMED OUT OR, YOU KNOW, JUST VOTED OUT FREE REIN TO USE A POLITICAL SYSTEM TO CRAM THROUGH BILLS THAT BENEFIT THEMSELVES AND THEIR SPECIAL INTERESTS.

WOULD YOU CONCEDE IT IS IN TROUBLE IN THE STATE SENATE VIS--VIS MR. SHIRKEY.

>> GIVEN THE ALMOST UNANIMOUS SUPPORT WE SAW IN THE HOUSE AND GIVEN THE POLITICAL LANDSCAPE RIGHT NOW, PUBLIC TRUST IN OUR POLITICIANS TO GET THINGS DONE THAT ACTUALLY BENEFIT US ARE AT AN ALL-TIME LOW.

IT INTRODUCES AND PASSES THESE KINDS OF RESOLUTIONS.

I WOULD HOPE THAT THE SENATE, YOU KNOW, THEY ARE AWARE OF THE POLITICAL REALITIES AS WELL.

WE FULLY EXPECT THAT.

>> LAUREN.

>> IT'S A PIGGY BACK.

WHAT IN YOUR MIND HAS CHANGED FROM LAST SESSION WHEN WE HAD THE SAME LEADERSHIP SFLTDNATE AND HE HAS BEEN HISTORICALLY HESITANT TO TAKE UP SOME OF THESE MEASURES PRESIDENT PAST SENATE LEADERS HAVE BEEN CONCERNED ABOUT THIS.

THE HOUSE HAS ALWAYS BEEN IN THE LAST WHAT'S CHANGED IN YOUR MIND?

>> I THINK WHAT HAS CHANGED IN MY MIND IS THE FACT THAT, YOU KNOW, GROUPS LIKE VOTERS,THA IS EMBLEMATIC OF THE TYPE OF PUBLIC DEMAND FOR THESE KINDS MUCH MEASURES.

IT IS TOP OF MIND.

THIS SUNDAYSCORES OUR COMMITMENT TO OTHER ETHICS AND TRANSPARENCY REQUIREMENTS I AM HOPING WE CAN TALK ABOUT TODAY I THINK POLITICIANS ARE REALIZING THAT.

THESE ISSUES ARE BEING DISCUSSED IN THE MEDIA YOU WILL HOMING POLITICIANS CAN SEE THE WRITING ON THE WALL AND SEE VOTERS ARE DEMANDING THIS.

WE ARE GOING TO HOLD ACCOUNTABLE THOSE LEGISLATORS THAT STAND IN THE WAY LOOKING AT VOTERS' BEST INTERESTS IN VOTING ON THESE BILLS.

>> KYLE?

>> NANCY, WHAT ARE YOUR MEMBERS TELLING YOU SPECIFICALLY THEY WANT TO SEE IN TERMS OF REFORMS?

>> WISH VOTER DRIVEN AND WE SURVEY THEM PERIODICALLY AND TIME AND TIME AGAIN, THE LAST FEW YEARS, SINCE 2018, YOU KNOW, THE TOP OF THE LIST IS ETHICS AND TRANSPARENTS AND ACCOUNTABILITY REQUIREMENTS.

SO THINGS LIKE GETTING, YOU KNOW, REFORMING LAME DUCK SO WE DON'T SEE DURING LAME DUCK.

WE WANT TO SEE CLOSING OF THE REVOLVING DOOR WHERE THESE EXAMPLES COME UP TIME AND TIME AGAIN WHERE YOU HAVE A LAWMAKER GO FROM BEING AN OFFICE -- IN AN OFFICE TO A LOW BACKING FIRM.

IT REINFORCES THIS IDEA THAT VOTERS HAVE THAT, YOU KNOW, LOBBYISTS OR LAWMAKERS ARE WORKING FOR LOBBYISTS AS OPPOSED TO THE VOTERS.

YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO SEE AND END TO KIND OF A BILL THAT ALLOWS ALL OF THE ACTIVITY THAT'S HAPPENING IN OUR LEGISLATURE.

WE WANT TO SEE OPEN RECORDS, FINANCIAL, YOU KNOW, PERSONAL FINANCIAL DISCLOSURES SO WE CAN SEE, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS REALLY DRIVING LAWMAKERS?

ARE THEY VOTING ON BILLS TO PUT CASH IN THEIR OWN POCKETS EVEN THOUGH IT HURTS THEIR CONSTITUENTS?

WE WANT CONFLICTS OF INTERESTS LAWS.

NOT THIS GUIDANCE THAT LAWMAKERS ARE KIND OF, YOU KNOW E, ENCOURAGED NOT TO THE VOTE ON THINGS WHERE AGAIN TOO PROHIBIT THEM AND PUTTING VOTERS' INTERESTS TOP OF MIND FOR THEM INSTEAD OF THEIR OWN.

WE NEED AN INDEPENDENT ETHICS BODY TO ENFORCE THOSE LAWS BECAUSE EVEN IF YOU HAVE LAWS.

AND LAWMAKERS SOMETIMES CAN'T RESIST THOSE AND WANT TO BREAK THOSE.

WE THINK THEY ARE NECESSARY BEGIN THE FACT THAT # INDEX# REALLY IS AN OUTLIER THESE DAYS SOME OF THESE HAVE PERSONAL FINANCIAL CLOSURE.

48 OUT OF 50 STATES HAVE THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE SO BASIC TO, YOU KNOW, CUSHING OR PREVENTING CORRUPTION AND SELF DEALING AND IN TIME, TIME AND TIME AGAIN, IN SOME OF THESE FLASHL SURVEYS, 50TH OUT OF 50 IN ETHICS AND STATE GOVERNMENT SO IT'S BEYOND -- IT'S HIGH TIME FOR US TO KIND OF REFORM IT AND REBUILD PUBLIC TRUST IN OUR GOVERNMENT AND OUR INSTITUTIONS AND LAWMAKERS.

>>RICH REQUIRING, JUMP IN.

>> I AM SURE SOME OF THE PEOPLE IN YOUR GROUP ARE AWARE BUT THE PUBLIC ADDS A WHOLE.

MY NEIGHBORS WHAT LAME DUCK WAS NOT BECAUSE THEY ARE UNEDUCATED.

THEY DON'T WATCH THE LEGISLATURE AS CLOSELY AS WE DO.

HOW DO YOU CONVINCE THOSE FOLKS.

>> RIGHT.

SO, YOU KNOW, QUESTION WORKED TO END GERRYMANDERING AND PUT A CONSTITUTIONALALEDMENT IN PLACE TO PUT CITIZENS IN CHARGE OF REDISTRICTING.

AT THE TIME WE TOOK UP THIS CAUSE IT WILL BE ZOOM TO ZOOM.

WE HELD TOWN HALLS AND ONE OF OUR MODELS WAS GIVE US 10 SECONDS AND WE WILL CONVINCE YOU.

I THINK.

THOSE WHO ARE NOT ACCOUNTABLE TO VOTERS WHO CAN PUSH THROUGH LAWS THAT BENEFIT THEMSELVES AND MANIPULATE TO SERVE ON R THEIR DONORS AND SPECIAL INTERESTS OR DO YOU WANT DURING THAT LAME DUCK SESSION FOR THESE LAWMAKERS ONLY TO BE ABLE TO PASS LAWS THAT BENEFIT ALL VOTERS THAT ARE NOT CONTROVERSIAL AND ENJOY A SUPPORT WITH BOTH PARTIES PEOPLE WOULD UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS IS ABOUT: LAW MAKERS BEING HELD ACCOUNTABLE TO THE VOTERS.

JUST LIKE GERRYMANDERING, VOTERS UNDERSTAND THIS IS A PROBLEM AND WOULD FULLY VOTE TO SUPPORT IT IF IT WERE ON THE BALLOT.

>> NANCY, GIVEN THE DELAY IN THE CENSUS DATA COMING IN, WILL # INDEX# NOT HAVE NEW VOTING DISTRICT LINES IN TIME FOR 2022, OR ARE YOU GOING TO GET THAT DONE?

THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT 90% OF THE LEE DISTRICTING PROCESS IS REALLY KIND OF -- AN ESPECIALLY UNDER OUR CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT NOW WHERE IT'S THE CITIZENSHIP COMMISSION.

90% OF THE JOB REALLY IS TO GO AROUND THE STATE.

THEY ARE STARTING TO DO THAT NOW, TO TAKE INPUT FROM COMMUNITIES TO UNDERSTAND WHERE THE COMMUNITIES ARE BECAUSE THEY NEED TO DRAW MAPS THAT KEEP OUR COMMUNITIES INTACT AND SO, THEY ARE HOLDING PUBLIC HEARINGS, TAKING THAT INPUT RIGHT NOW.

AND THEN THERE IS GOING TO BE A PART, YOU KNOW, OF COURSE, WHERE YOU DO THE BEST YOU CAN WITH, YOU KNOW, DATA THAT YOU HAVE INCLUDING CENSUS DATA THAT'S AVAILABLE FOR 2010.

BUT THERE ARE ALSO OFFICIAL DATA THAT'S AVAILABLE FOR 2018 AND 2019, AND THEN YOU CAN PUT THE MAPS TOGETHER IN THIS WAY THAT'S SORT OF LIKE, I DESCRIBE IT AS IF YOU HAD POOR EYESIGHT, YOU ARE LOOKING AT THIS MAP AND IT'S FUZZY AROUND THE EDGES, YOU CAN GET THE GIST OF WHERE THE LINES WILL BE.

COME SEPTEMBER 30TH, WHICH IS WHEN, YOU KNOW, THE CENSUS BUREAU SAYS WE WILL BE THE LAST DATE BY WHICH WE COULD GET THE CENSUS DATA, THEN IT'S A MATTER OF, YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC HAVING BEEN PRIMED FOR THESE CONVERSATIONS WHICH MAT IT WILL BUT DOESN'T TAKE US AS LONG.

WHAT WE ARE HOPE IS, I GUESS GOING BE TO BE A COURT THAT SHIFTS THE DEADLINE.

IN ORDER FOR US TO ABIDE BY THE CONSTITUTIONAL DEADLINE WHEN THERE IS A CONFLICT THERE.

IS ALL THAT IS NEEDED AND ABSOLUTELY, WE FULLY EXPECT THERE IS THE GOING TO BE MAPS IN TIME IN PLACE TO BE USED FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THE AUGUST 2022 PRIMARY.

>> LET ME BE CLEAR HERE WE ARE GOING TO GO TO THE COURTS ON ACCOMMODATE THE LATE ARRIVAL TO THE CENSUS DATA.

IS THAT A FAIR STATEMENT?

>> YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK IT WOULD BE IF IT'S NOT POLITICIANS.

IT'S IN THE CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT.

I THINK IT WILL HAVE TO BE A MATTER FOR THE COURT TO RESOLVE, ONLY TO THE EXTENT OF MOVING IT SLIGHTLY THE COURT'S ROLE WOULD BE TO EXTEND THE DEADLINE SLIGHTLY SO ALL CAN BE MET.

THIS IS ARE A MATTER OF PROCEDURE, I WOULD SAY, WHEN YOU HAVE A CONFLICT LIKE THIS IS IT SAYS THE ECONOMIES HAS TO RELEASE A FINAL SET OF MAPS IT'S GOING TO VOTE ON BY SEPTEMBER 17TH.

IT WON'T BE ABLE TO HAVE THE FINAL MAPS WITHOUT THE CENSUS DATA.

IT'S A MATTER OF WEEKS OR A FEW MONTHS THANKS TO KYLE AND WARN AND RICK.

RIGHT HERE NEXT WEEK ON THE NEXT EDITION OF OFF THE RECORD.

>> PRODUCTION MUCH "OFF THE RECORD" IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY THE FOLLOWING: BUSINESS LEADERS FOR # INDEX# HAS A STRATEGIC PLAN TO MAKE # INDEX# A TOP-10 STATE IN THE NATION FOR JOBS, PERSONAL INCOME AND A HEALTHY ECONOMY.

LEARN MORE AT # INDEX#'S ROAD TO TOP 10.ORG.

FOR MORE OFF THE RECORD, VISIT WKAR.ORG PUBLIC TELEVISION STATIONS HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO THE PRODUCTION COSTS OF OFF THE RECORD WITH TIM SCUBIC.