- This is a production of WEDU PBS, Tampa, St.

Petersburg.

Sarasota.

[music] - Coming up, Governor Ron DeSantis is taking a victory lap in the controversy over Hope Florida.

The social service initiative tied to First Lady Casey DeSantis.

What's next in the probe over allegations that millions of taxpayer dollars were funneled into a political campaign to keep recreational marijuana use illegal at the Capitol?

A proposal is advancing that would give the state's sweeping authority to label organizations as domestic or foreign terrorists.

The questions being raised about government power, due process and who decides?

Plus, where property tax cut proposals stand, where does this leave local municipalities and millions of renters in Florida?

And the latest twist in a new stadium for the Tampa Bay Rays and the future of Tropicana Field.

All that and more is next on Florida This Week.

[upbeat music] Welcome back everybody.

I'm Lissette Campos.

Joining our panel today is Jeff Brandis of the Florida Policy Project and a former state senator, Mike Van Sickler political editor of the Tampa Bay Times.

And Ashly Anderson, director of growth and senior project manager at Envision Advisors.

We begin with new developments in the 11 month controversy surrounding the Florida Foundation.

Governor Ron DeSantis is declaring victory amidst the probe, targeting the social services organization that was led by his wife, Casey DeSantis.

His administration is citing an anonymous source in the US Justice Department, claiming that federal charges will not be filed.

Questions still remain and a criminal grand jury investigation does continue.

Take a look.

Hope Florida is a state initiative launched under Governor Ron DeSantis and championed by First Lady Casey DeSantis.

It's designed to connect Floridians in need with faith based and community services instead of traditional government assistance programs.

The program came under scrutiny after millions of dollars from a state Medicaid settlement were routed through the Hope Florida Foundation to political activities, activities that critics claim may have ultimately supported the governor's agenda and his allies.

The trail of payments were laid out in financial records and documents obtained by the Tampa Bay times and the Miami Herald in April of last year.

Now, governor DeSantis says the case is effectively closed, citing an anonymous source within the US Department of Justice, who spoke to the Floridian press.

The source told the online publication, quote, no further action is anticipated on the matter.

End quote.

Governor DeSantis took to X, calling the probe a hoax manufactured by Florida rhinos and leftist media.

Rhino is an acronym that stands for Republican in name only.

The Justice Department has yet to comment on the governor's claim or the story in the Floridian press.

Meanwhile, questions remain from state lawmakers from both parties and watchdogs about how the money moved, who approved it, and whether laws governing public funds were followed.

The probe is also still under investigation by a criminal grand jury, who has yet to conclude its deliberations.

And, Mike, I'd like to start with you.

So many folks are talking about this story in Tallahassee.

Typically, you know, an anonymous source in a newspaper story does not have this effect.

But when the governor includes it in a post on his social media account, then it becomes big news.

How do you see all of this?

What are people saying?

- Uh, well, I mean, as a representative of the news outlet that, uh, has spent months looking into this, our Tallahassee bureau has done fantastic work, um, spending, uh, quite a bit of resources getting to the bottom of this.

Um, and it's not nothing.

There is something there.

Uh, I was struck by the article.

Um, it was written by a political consultant.

Um, it was an anonymous source in the US Department of Justice site.

Basically, there were blind, quote, saying that there was no federal investigation.

We have never reported that there was a federal investigation.

We've we haven't confirmed that there is one.

So that just seemed to be unrelated to what we've been reporting.

What we've been reporting is that there is a state investigation.

A grand jury has taken a look into this situation.

We don't know the status, so I'm not predicting the future.

I'm not saying that there will be an indictment, but it does seem to be ongoing.

The state attorney would not comment.

So for the governor to come out based on an anonymous source, to declare that it's all a hoax seems at this moment to be incredibly premature.

- And what are the documents that you all have asked for?

Many, many documents.

You were able to look at, emails you were able to look at discussions with the attorneys that were involved with Centene and the state representatives.

There's quite a bit of information that the investigators are going through.

- Quite a bit.

And we don't know what they're going to determine.

So who knows.

But what we've been able to report is, uh, you know, up to $35 million of state money has been redirected to political campaigns.

That's not, uh, you know, I'm not to determine if that's legal or not, But there's a lot of people who who will be making that determination.

- Jeff, as a former state senator, I mean, there are so many aspects to this story that as a legislator, you you would be looking at one of the things that we have been asked by our viewers is, why isn't more attention being paid to the fact that here you have the largest manager of Medicaid in the state of Florida admitting that they overbilled taxpayers on medications by $67 million was just the settlement here in Florida.

Um, you know, there are so many aspects of that that raise more questions of how much more is being done behind the scenes with Medicaid that we don't know about.

- Well, I think there's fraud, waste and abuse everywhere in the system.

And I think people see that all the time, whether it's, you know, what's going on in Minnesota with, uh, you know, hospice care or child care or even in the state where we're settling claims for, for Medicaid fraud.

I think there's there's all kinds of issues.

But I think to go back to, to something Michael talked about.

Listen, the governor spent the last year being dragged through the mud by the Florida legislature.

And just because there is not criminal charges doesn't mean the legislature found that that activity was appropriate.

I don't think anybody thinks that that was it was appropriate to misuse funds like that.

And whether it's illegal, it's definitely a misuse of funds.

And I think that's what the legislature called out.

And I think the legislature is trying to do things this year to make sure that never happens again.

- Is there someone is there a group in particular that we as voters can rely on to make sure that things that should be investigated are?

- Well, I mean, that's that's the role of the media.

It's the role of the legislature to hold people accountable in, in the various branches of government.

I think that's why we have this balance of power in, in Florida and frankly, throughout the United States.

But it's the role of the legislature to do these deep dives, to do these investigations and to ask the tough questions.

And it's often at the prompting of the media that the legislature gets the information to make those changes.

- Thank you for that.

Turning now to the issue of property tax cuts after four weeks of the regular session.

Still, no policy talks between lawmakers in the state House and the Senate.

Multiple constitutional amendments have cleared key committees in the House and are headed for the floor votes.

The plans include phasing out over ten years non-school property taxes for homesteads.

Another expands homestead exemptions for all homeowners with property insurance.

And a third proposal would create exemptions for seniors.

The Senate has yet to debate any tax cut legislation.

Meanwhile, the governor has yet to submit to lawmakers a concrete, detailed proposal of his own.

This as he continues to call for a repeal of property taxes in Florida.

Um, a number of senators, we understand have made proposals, but they have not been moved forward to committee.

- Yeah, there's overall there's 14 ballot proposals.

Um, but the two chambers, the House and the Senate, have not discussed them in any great detail.

A lot of that has to do with the governor coming out early, saying he wants a special session that seems to have affected, um, the Senate president, Ben Albritton.

Ben Albritton.

And for him to he seems to agree with that.

So that's a very go slow approach on the Senate right now.

Meanwhile, the House, uh, you know, speaker very much wants to let's get going.

We're halfway through the session now.

And really, no real discussion has been had.

He's frustrated with.

- That.

The governor has said that he's looking towards perhaps calling a special session to discuss this as well.

And the Senate president, Ben Albritton, has said that this is something that merits more discussion to that.

He wants this to be done, quote, the right way.

- I have heard rumors like there's going to be maybe a $50,000 additional homestead exemption that's going to be tacked on.

It's not going to be to as broad, perhaps, as just an elimination of all property taxes that are our school board related.

Um, but we really don't know because we haven't had that discussion.

So it's a lot of whispers in the hallways, a lot of just, um, people speculating.

- Jeff, you you came out with a very strong, um, guest column that you wrote in Florida Politics where you talked about that there is no silver bullet.

There's no one thing that there are many different things that should be considered in the legislature to help increase housing affordability.

Um, and you talked about changing the regulations, perhaps at the local and the and the and the county level.

Can you share some of that with our viewers?

- I think specifically on the issue of property taxes, where we are right now is that we're headed towards a special session.

Again, the governor has not released any of his plans.

He's kind of holding it close to the vest.

He said, very soon we will have a very substantial and meaningful plan.

Um, nobody knows what any of that means.

He's had a year.

He has a thousand people who work for him.

They have not produced one back of the napkin calculation to show how the math works.

I think this is a tax shift.

I don't think it is a tax cut.

I think I think you have 411 cities and 67 counties that will all react differently.

He has come out publicly and said, yes, I know it will bankrupt some of the cities and counties, and that will require the state to backfill those funds.

But also people don't recognize that the state doesn't have the funds to backfill them.

Yes, they're running a surplus this year, but for the next two years, at least as far out as really they're modeling.

They're looking at multi-billion dollar deficits.

So where are they going to cut?

What services are going to be cut?

They've said they've come out and said we're not going to require people to fire police and firefighters, but they don't say, okay, well that just probably means they also aren't going to hire them.

So instead of if they have 20 positions to fill, they fill eight.

Well, that's just quietly kind of leaving positions open.

And so I think that's where I am concerned about even moving into a special session.

What my history with special sessions is.

Oftentimes, the legislature will find out what they're voting on in a special session because it's been negotiated with the House and Senate leadership.

Oftentimes days, sometimes hours before we actually go into special session at the end of the day.

That seems like a wildly crazy way to do public policy, dealing with the foundation of the state of Florida's tax system.

Listen, if you want to do this, be open and honest.

The governor vetoed the million dollars that could have gone into studying this issue and laying out a plan.

We had a year.

He could have easily had a full plan.

They've chosen not to do this.

- And speaking of studying your your organization nonpartisan does research on different aspects.

And you all have said that housing affordability is one of the major priorities.

- We know that.

And so you all have identified, um, perhaps rezoning, taking a look at.

- Smaller lot sizes, rezoning, accessory dwelling units.

These are the things that the state needs to be pushing.

Look, my big takeaway after 12 years in Tallahassee is that everything in Tallahassee is tactical.

There is no strategy and no area.

Is there probably really less of a strategy than our housing plans?

We have the ship and sail program, but we have no rudder in the state.

That's really directing the state on on housing.

And so we're working with a coalition of 30 different organizations to bring a bill called the Starter Homes Act to the legislature that will focus on allowing for smaller lot sizes, allowing for lot splits, accessory dwelling units, all of those things are part of the solution.

Again, there is no silver bullet in housing.

There is only lead bullets and you got to fire them all.

- And moving on.

All this week, key players in the Tampa Bay Rays saga have made headlines, weighing in on what may turn out to be the first real solution in more than five years.

It's a developing story with major implications for the local economy as well as taxpayers.

Take a look.

Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, Major League Baseball commissioner Rob Manfred, the Hillsborough Board of County commissioners and St.

Pete Mayor Ken Welch.

These heavy hitters have had plenty to say on the proposed new ballpark for the Rays on the land now occupied by Hillsborough College.

Developments.

This week, the Rays pledged to pay for at least 50% of the stadium cost, cover construction cost overruns and fully fund future repairs, maintenance and renovations.

The governor removed the land use hurdle, announcing the state owned land could be transferred to Hillsborough College, which in turn would offer the Rays a 99 year lease agreement.

- This land is basically owned by the state.

Hillsborough College is able to operate, uh, you know, we're going to be conveying, uh, the land to the college and then they'll be able to negotiate, use, uh, with the Rays in ways that I think will be mutually beneficial.

- And the Hillsborough Board of County Commissioners is considering the Rays request to use public funds from several funding sources under its control, including a tourist development tax and a portion of the Community Investment tax.

- The ballpark is the driver for a generational mixed use development that will be funded with an overall 8 to $10 billion direct investment by the team.

- The flurry of activity comes after the January 20th non-binding Memorandum of Understanding, approved by Hillsborough College's Board of Trustees and the Rays.

It stipulates that Hillsborough County will retain ownership of the new ballpark if any public funds are used in the project.

- One thing that has been consistent during my time as commissioner, um, was my view that Major League Baseball belongs in Tampa Bay.

- It's a road the St.

Pete Mayor Ken Welch has traveled before after years of Rays negotiations to redevelop Tropicana Field and revive the historic gas plant.

District Nine proposals without the Rays are now in the hands of St.

Pete leaders.

They plan to transform the neighborhood the Rays have occupied since 1998.

- We'll have a public forum where the developers will present to to our community.

We'll have the community benefits process as well.

And then I will select one of those developers.

- And actually I'd like to start with you.

You know, your company has a very interesting perspective.

You all have worked on the Tropicana Field project.

You all work on the major urban development projects.

What are the different aspects of this story that we as taxpayers should be looking at?

It's not it's not a simple thing.

- It's not.

It's very similar to what Jeff just mentioned with the affordable housing problem is this is an economic development proposal for both communities.

So for the Tampa site with Hillsborough College and for the future of the trop site.

But I think the most exciting thing is that we have to do it with good urban design in mind.

The outcome needs to be the start, so we need to imagine what both those sites should look and feel like.

What major economic development impact it has, and then what are the more complicated impacts that people will be frustrated with as we grow?

We are becoming a world class city and this is a world class problem.

It's a good problem to have.

But we know keeping the Rays in Tampa is essential for some of that economic growth.

- As we're here in the studio.

The Rays have just released some images of the proposed ballpark.

Um, it's on the corner that's closest to Raymond James Stadium.

It has multi-use, um, on on the property.

Um, what what are the different layers of the project?

And is it really feasible for the Rays to say that they want to complete these negotiations in six months or so?

- So the negotiations part will be left to the attorneys.

Right.

But what my recommendation is a development professional is, is the development agreement that that the county, the state and whoever else in the parties goes into with the Rays needs to guarantee that that phased mixed use lifestyle district that's promised.

We heard Commissioner Hagan just say 8 to $10 billion of private development, in addition to approximately 2 million or $2 billion stadium is that that needs to be phased but planned for ahead of time.

We've seen this happen already.

Well, we've seen it happen in other communities, like the battery in greater Atlanta and Cobb County, where the MLB was very supportive of a lifestyle oriented ball field, and then growth spurred from it.

But we've also seen it on a more hyperlocal level, with the impacts of Water Street and the ownership of the lightning under Jeff Vinik, and what happens when the cementing of having that economic hub or that draw entertainment portion mixed with lifestyle needs, also mixed with the affordability needs of having a college that really serves a population that we don't want to see, not served with education.

So you truly could make, in a perfect world a nucleus of that.

But it's not going to be easy.

So it has to be done in the right way.

Design will be very key here.

- And critics have said it's not going to be easy and it's not going to be cheap.

And many critics say they don't want to pay for that.

Correct.

I'd like to ask Jeff and Mike to weigh in on this.

- Well, I think the key question that I have is who ends up with the developer rights?

And I think that's one that everybody needs to be thoughtful about and concerned about is how this plays out and who ends up with the rights.

It's not just the stadium, it's all of the land around the stadium.

And who has the rights to develop that.

That's a key question that I think is still in the air, and that has been undecided.

And I think it's something that we all need to watch.

- Mike.

- Well, I think there's so many unanswered questions.

I'm amazed that the renderings came out today because it's like there's still so many questions.

Um, but among them is like, this is twice the price of what the project was in St.

Petersburg just a couple of years ago, and still no clear sense of where that money is going to come from.

Having said that, despite all those unanswered questions, it was a really positive week because the governor was there.

I mean, who can remember the last time.

- The governor.

- Major League Baseball coming down.

- Side by side?

They were singing off the same songbook and they were, um, I mean, I think Charlie Crist was the last governor to come out in support of the stadium back in 2007 when it was in St.

Petersburg.

- But again, this is the governor's last year.

I mean, he may be there for the groundbreaking, but he's not going to be there for the ribbon cutting.

- And that's the point that you also have to factor in is like, he is a lame duck.

This is his last year.

And affordability is going to be a big question.

This is a governor who has been traditionally against ballparks.

And his argument is we shouldn't be spending taxpayer money on ballparks.

- The legislature has has largely echoed that.

- And it's certainly a story that we're going to continue to follow.

Stay tuned for more.

Of course, we turn now to a set of bills that's aimed at labeling domestic terrorist groups in Florida, and that is raising questions about civil liberties and due process.

The proposed legislation is House Bill 1471 and Senate Bill 1632.

The measures would give Florida officials the power to designate an organization as a terrorist group.

The reasons for the label include activities that are dangerous to human life, intend to intimidate or coerce a civilian population, influence the policy of a government by intimidation, or affect the conduct of government by mass destruction.

The bills also make it possible to expel students who, quote, promote a designated foreign or domestic terror organization, end quote.

One group recently labeled by governor DeSantis as a terrorist group is the Council on American-Islamic relations, better known as CAIR.

And that group spoke against the bills during the annual Muslim Day at the state Capitol.

- We have an administration today that can target based on their agenda specific groups.

But tomorrow it will be a different administration.

Tomorrow a different group of individuals may be targeted and that's what we want to stop.

- If the bills pass as is, any terrorist designation would require the approval of the state cabinet to become effective.

Mike, I'd like to start with you.

Is this censorship?

- This is the same governor who a few years ago, was very adamant that social platforms were censoring people from free speech.

He was very, uh, very eloquent in, in, uh, kind of defending free speech rights without, you know, without, you know, splitting hairs.

Uh, a private company has every right to say you can't say that on a private platform, which is exactly what Facebook is and Twitter.

So, um, that argument was a little muddled.

And this is government censorship.

Government, according to the Constitution, cannot restrict free speech and the freedom of assembly.

And I do wonder how the governor and the legislature is going to navigate that issue.

- Jeff, what would be the ramifications of having something like this become law?

- Well, I think one I think you're right to point out the constitutional questions that this raises, right?

We do have the right to associate with who we choose to associate with.

I think, you know, you you can it doesn't go if you think about it long enough and you say, all right, well, where does this go wrong?

Right.

Well, I mean, it wasn't many years ago.

Pro-Life groups were, you know, going after abortion clinics.

Well, what happens if the state were to turn Democrat and pro-life groups were now to be considered domestic terrorist organizations?

I think these are the things that, like, you don't think about the ripples of these types, ripple effects of these types of legislation until way down the road.

And so, you know, tread lightly and tread carefully.

- Thank you for your insight.

Now it's time for the other big stories of the week.

Jeff, I'd like to start with you.

- I think the big the big story is what's going on in transportation, right?

We've seen the growth of self-driving and automated vehicles Miami has announced and now has full self-driving vehicles down in Miami.

Waymo has also announced Orlando and Tampa.

I think that Florida will be the largest state of deployment of self-driving vehicles within the next 2 to 3 years.

I think it's exciting.

It's going to give more people more options.

And I think this is just kind of going along the lines of Uber and Lyft and all the ebikes and everything else that we're seeing playing out in in Florida.

I think it's a great story for Floridians and just providing more people transportation options.

I think really is going to help drive a lot of the development down the road.

- Ashly.

- Yeah.

So mine's tied kind of to what we just talked about with the race stadium and related to the reports about success of Florida Doge.

And I think the key here is our perception on big public infrastructure projects, big building projects that are largely funded by local governments that need some outside oversight from professionals.

Even the Rays now are seeking, through the request of Hillsborough County and the Sports Commission to have construction firms owners, representatives.

Look at the construction numbers and put a real critical eye to them.

I think that kind of oversight is what's needed to help satiate the desires of people who are more conservative for a kind of a DOGE approach, and people who want to see public investment and their tax dollars going to build things.

- Mike, you have a big story that's going to be published soon about our attorney general.

- Our homegrown attorney general, Pam Bondi.

She's from Tampa.

So we have always taken special attention to Pam Bondi.

This week marks her first year as U.S.

Attorney General.

So we're taking a look back and assessing, um, you know, how that year shaped up.

And, uh, I did appreciate that she's kind of in a tight spot because obviously everybody's remarking about the, you know, the division between the White House and the Department of Justice is kind of eroding, but she's getting pushed from the right, saying you're not moving fast enough.

So it's a it's a difficult job.

- Thank you.

Thank you for joining us today.

I really appreciate your expertise and your perspective, all of you.

Before we go, Mike is sticking around to join us for a rundown of stories on the legislative session that we didn't have time to cover on the show.

Join us for the discussion on that on WEDU YouTube channel.

Thank you to our panelists, Jeff Brandis, Ashly Anderson, and Mike Van Sickler.

Be sure to join us on YouTube anytime, and we'll see you next week right here on WEDU.

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