>> "DONNYBROOK" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETS.. THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.

>> THANKS FOR JOINING US FOR THIS EDITION OF "DONNYBROOK".

LET'S SEE WHO'S ON THE PANEL ON THIS WASHINGTON BIRTHDAY.

WENDY WIESE COHOST OF THE JENNIFER AND WENDY SHOW ON BIG 550 KTRS.

AND SARAH IS THE EXECUTIVE EDITOR OF THE RIVERFRONT TIMES AND SISTER PUBLICATIONS AND THE HOST OF THE LEGAL ROUNDTABLE ON ST. LOUIS PUBLIC RADIO.

RAY HARTMANN FROM THE RIVERFRONT TIMES.

HE FOUNDED THAT YEARS AGO AND ON SUBSTACK, AND A FOUNDER OF "DONNYBROOK".

SPORTS C.. WITH YOUR ST. LOUIS AMERICAN, WHO ALSO NOT ONLY WAS THE HOST WITH THE MOST LAST WEEK BUT EMCEED A GREAT LUNCHEON.

>> MADE GREAT REMARKS.

I WASN'T THE EMCEE.

>> HE DOES A GREAT JOB.

>> YES, HE DOES.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR HELP LAST WEEK.

ATTORNEY IN ST. LOUIS AND REPRESENTING HOMEOWNERS WHOSE PROPERTY IS NEAR SPRING AND CHEROKEE, I BELIEVE, IN SOUTH ST. LOUIS.

DO I H.. >> EXACTLY WHERE IT IS.

>> ANYWAY, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF SUDANESE REFUGEES WHO HAVE UNBELIEVABLY BEEN LIVING OUTSIDE THEIR HOUSE ON THE SIDEWALK FOR ABOUT TWO YEARS ACCORDING TO PUBLISHED REPORTS.

THE CITY HASN'T DONE ANYTH.. ABOUT IT.

THEY..

THEY USE THE LOCAL SEWER FOR THE REST ROOM.

THEY WALK AROUND NUDE APPARENTLY.

AND VIVA SAYS ..

THEM.

THIS PANEL PROBABLY AGREES THEY DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT TO LIVE THERE.

.. HUMAN BEINGS FROM A SIDEWALK?

>> YOU REMOVE THEM CAREFULLY.

AS AWFUL AS IT MAY SOUND FOR SOME PEOPLE, YOU ARE RUNNING THE RISK OF A MAJOR PUBLIC HEALTH PROBLEM FOR THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THE AREA.

THE BIKERS ARE NOT -..

BIKERS -- PEOPLE HAVE TO NAVIGATE THEIR WAY AROUND THIS ENCAMPMENT ACCORDING TO MR.

SHOCK WHO HAS BEEN INTERVIEWED BY EVERY MEDIA OUTLET.

THE ST.. TO ME, IT'S A PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUE.

IF YOU HAVE ..

BELIEVE THEY WOULD BE VERY HUMANE.

.. HAVE TO -- NOT ARREST THEM.

WHATEVER YOU HAVE TO DO, YOU HAVE TO REMOVE THEM FROM THE SITE AND DEMOLISH THE SITE, IN MY OPINION.

>> I DON..

VERY CONTROVERSIAL, I MEAN, IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY -- YEAH, IT'S PRETTY OBVIOUS.

IT'S A DIFFICULT SITUATION.

ON THE ONE HAND GIVE CREDIT TO THE CITY.

THEY ATTEMPTED TO GET THIS PERSON TO THE SERVICES.

AGAIN, IT FEEDS BACK TO SOMETHING I BEAT PEOPLE OVER THE HEAD WITH.

YOU HAVE TO HAVE MORE RESPECT FOR THE NEIGHBORS AND THE RESIDENTS OF THE CITY.

IT SHOULD NOT HAVE TAKEN THIS LONG AND SHOULD NOT TAKE A LAWSUIT THREAT TO GET THIS DONE.

IT'S LIKE REMOVING TRESPASSERS OR PEOPLE OF THAT -- THAT ARE JUST NOT WHERE THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BE.

ISSUE.

I THINK THE POLICE CAN DO IT.

I THINK A BUGGER ISSUE IS TRYING TO GET THEM, IN NECESSARY, FORCEFULLY, TO SERVICES WHERE THEY CAN BE WELCOMED AND SO FORTH.

BUT RESIDENTS SHOULDN'T HAVE TO WAIT TWO YEARS.

>> I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE HAND WRINGING.

I DO.. WRINGING.

>.. YOU USED THE WORD FORCEFULLY.

LET'S SAY THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE THERE JUST RAZEED THAT PLACE, SET EVERYTHING ON FIRE AND PHYSICALLY USHERED THEM ON OUT.

THEN THE HOMEOWNERS ARE IN TROUBLE.

THE CITY IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT RAZES THE PLACE, AND SOCIAL MEDIA, THERE WILL BE EVERY KIND OF TALE THEY BEAT UP THE WOMEN AND KIDS AND DRAGGED THEM DOWN THE STREET.

NO, THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

IT WAS UNDER THE COVER OF DARKNESS.

YOU .. TRANSPARENT, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.

THEY HAD NO IDEA PEOPLE WERE LIVING ON THE SIDEWALK BUT THE SECOND THEY THROW THEM OUT, THAT'S SO CRUEL.

THAT'S SO TERRIBLE.

>> WE HAVE TO HAVE LEADERS THAT ARE.

I'M JUST THROWING THAT OUT THERE, BECAUSE THERE COMES A TIME, AND IF I WERE THE MAYOR THERE WOULD BE TIMES WHERE I WOULD SAY BLAME ME, KIND OF LIKE TOMMY LEE JONES IN THE FUGITIVE.

BLAME ME.

I THOUGH..

I WOULD BE THAT PERSON -- NOT SHOOT HIM.

BUT I WOULD LITERALL.. JUST BLAME ME.

I HAD THEM THROWN OUT.

>> IT COULD BE DONE TWO YEARS AGO.

>> WHAT .. THAT THIS COUNTRY HAS A BROKEN SYSTEM OF DEALING WITH MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES WHERE IT'S VERY HARD TO GET SOMEBODY COMMITTED AGAINST THEIR WILL.

IT'S PARTICULARLY HARD HERE, BECAUSE THERE'S A LANGUAGE BARRIER.

..

IT'.IT GOES TO THE TERRITORY OF BEING A REFUGEE.

NOBODY WANTS TO COME IN AND BE THE BAD GUY.

THEY ARE GOING TO HA..

IN AND BE THE BAD GUY.

THE QUESTION IS IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN GET THESE PEOPLE THE SERVICES THAT THEY NEED.

THE WAY THE LAWS ARE IN THE COUNTRY, MAYBE THEY CAN DO 28 DAYS IN A HOSPITAL WHERE THEY ARE GOING TO BE MISERABLE.

THERE'S NOT A GOOD ANSWER.

>> THEY HAVE ALREADY BEEN OFFERED HOUSING BY THE CITY.

THAT'S WHAT THE COURTS HAVE SAID.

APPEALS SAID YOU CAN REMOVE A HOMELESS PERSON IF YOU PROVIDE HOUSING.

THERE'S NO EXCUSE, IN MY OPINION, FOR THE CITY TO HAVE DRAGGED ITS FEET THIS LONG.

>> PARALYSIS, IN MY OPINION.

>> RAY, I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT ANOTHER GROUP.

DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISTS OF ST. LOUIS CALLING -- THEY ARE ASKING WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY TO MAKE PAYMENTS IN LIEU OF TAXES, SPECIFICALLY THEY WANT WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY TO PROVIDE MONEY FOR ELECTRIC VEHICLES, FOR VENTILATION FOR SCHOOLS AS WELL AS TEACHERS.

AND SOLAR PANELS IN SCHOOLS AND UNIVERSITY CITY AND IN THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS.

COERCE, BEING A 501(C)(3), WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY DOESN'T HAVE TO PAY SALES TAXES OR PROPERTY TAXES.

WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY DOES HAVE ABOUT 15,000 STUDENTS WHO EACH BRING ABOUT $45,000 A YEAR TO THE AREA.

SO THERE'S THAT, WHICH IS ONLY $675 MILLION.

I CALCULATED THAT TODAY.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

DOES WASH-U OWE THE SCHOOLS?

>> I BROUGHT THIS UP THREE WEEKS AGO, I THINK IT WAS, ON MY POPULAR DRIVE TO SUPPORT THE CLAYTON SCHOOL DISTRICT AND MADE THE POINT EVERYBODY WAS WRINGING THEIR HANDS ABOUT CLAYTON WAS GOING TO TAKE 9 ACRES OF PROPERTY OUT OF CIRCULATION OR OUT OFF THE TAX ROLLS AND SAID WHY ISN'T ANYBODY TALKING ABOUT WASH-U TAKING MULTIPLES OF THAT?

WE ARE TALKING NOW -- SOCIALISTS ARE TALKING ABOUT THE CITY WHICH IS WHERE YOU HEAR THE MOST.

BUT CLAYTON HAS A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF THIS AS WELL.

I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'S GOING TO HELP TO HAVE A GROUP CALLED THE DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISTS BACKING THEM INTO A CORNER.

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT WOULD WORK OR NOT.

BUT .. YEAH, I WOULD LIKE TO LOOK, AND MAYBE WE NEED TO TAKE A BROADER LOOK AROUND THE COUNTRY TO SEE HOW MANY INSTANCES -- I THINK YALE WAS CITED IN THE STORY, WHERE PILOTS ARE MADE.

I RAISED THE THE SAME THING ABOUT THE SOCCER STADIUM.

PAYING PILOTS TO THE SCHOOLS.

THAT'S A GOOD MIDDLE GROUND.

>> HOW ABOUT THE ART MUSEUM, HISTORY MUSEUM, SCIENCE CENTER, EVERY CHURCH, EVERY SYNAGOGUE, EVERY PIECE OF NONTAX PROPERTY.

>> YOU ARE MIXING PUBLIC INSTITUTIONS WHEN YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT THE ART MUSE.. >> THERE ARE PRIVATE.

>> YOU MAY NOT LIKE THAT, BUT WE DID AGREE TO DO THAT.

IT TAKES THEM OUT OF THAT LOOP.

THEY ARE ON NONTAXABLE PROPERTY AND NOT PAYING ANY PROPERTY TAXES.

>&g.. A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT GOES TO THEM ACTUALLY DOES COME FROM THE PEOPLE, AND WE COULD DECIDE WE ARE NOT GOING TO DO THAT ANYMORE.

SO THAT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT.

HOWEVER, HOW ABOUT WE ADDRESS THESE GIGANTIC CORPORATION ITSELF THAT ARE GETTING A TAX BREAK.

IS -- WE WILL LEAVE YOU ALONE BUT AS SOON AS WE GET IT STRAIGHT WE HAVE GOT TO QUICK GIVING AWAY THE FARM TO THE DEVELOPERS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THEN WE WILL MOVE ON TO ASKING WASH-U AND IN PARTICULAR I AM NOT THE DEVIL SITTING HERE, BUT CHURCHES AND THE CASH FLOW, AND A LOT OF IT IS CASH.

PEOPLE DON'T KNOW.

AND I'M LIKE BOY, IF I'M WASH-U, WHAT ABOUT OUR INSTITUTIONS OF FAITH.

>> I UNDERSTAND EVERYBODY IS TRYING TO CHANGE THE SUBJECT.

BUT THIS IS WHY THE DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISTS OF AMERICA IS BRINGING IT UP BECAUSE WASH-U IS LIKE THE THIRD RAIL THAT NO ONE WANTS TO TOUCH IN THE TOWN BECAUSE THEY ARE SO POWERFUL AND EMPLOY SO MANY PEOPLE WE REALLY LIKE.

BUT THEY ARE AN EXTRAORDINARILY WEALTHY INSTITUTION.

THE KIDS IN U CITY TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH SOME OF THE PROBLEMS THEY ARE DEALING WITH IN THAT SCHOOL DISTRICT AND WASH-U NOT TO WANT TO VOLUNTARILY COUGH UP MONEY TO HELP THAT PARTICULAR SCHOOL DISTRICT WHERE THEY ARE TAKING MONEY OFF THE TAX ROLLS.

>> IF I MAY DEFEND MYSELF HERE, TAKE WASH-U OFF OF IT, THE NAME OFF.

I'M SAYING UNI.. GENERAL, LIKE YOU SAID ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, BECAUSE YOU COULD SAY THE SAME THING ABOUT THE UNIVERSITIES EVERYWHERE, NO MATTER HOW SMALL, THEY ARE NOT PAYING, AND YOU CAN'T MAKE WASH YOU COUGWASH-U COUGH IT UP.

>> THEY ARE NOT SAYING CHANGE THE TAX CODE FOR WASH-U.

AND WASH-U, THEY ARE JUST PRINTING MONEY.

>> IT IS SO ARBITRARY.

IT REALLY IS.

I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE SAYING ABOUT IT'S NOT FAIR.

BUT THIS IS GOING TO BE REALLY FASCINATING, BECAUSE WE ARE GOING TO FIND OUT HOW PROGRESSIVE PROGRESSIVES ARE.

>> I DO AGREE -- THAT'S WHY I MADE THE REFERENCE, GETTING HATE MAIL NOW FROM SOCIALISTS, AND IT'S NOTHING NEW.

>> SOME OF THEM ARE SMART.

>> SOME OF MY BEST FRIENDS ARE SOCIALISTS.

THE POIN..

STRATEGICALLY, YOUR POINT ABOUT ARBITRARY THAT SOCIALISTS TELLING WASH-U YOU SHOULD DO THIS ONE IS NECESSARILY A PRODUCTIVE STRATEGY, BUT I DO THINK IT'S WORTH LOOKING AT THE BROADER PICTURE.

>> TODAY COIN COINCIDENTALLY HAPPENS TO BE THE BIRTHDAY OF WASHINGTON.

170 YEARS AGO.

AND I WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT CAR RCARACARKARA SPENCER AND A CONSUME OF TOURISTS WERE KILLED IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS BY A RECKLESS DRIVER.

SHE SAYS IN HER LEGISLATION THAT THE RECKLESS DRIVER SHOULD LOSE HIS OR HER CAR ON THE SPOT, THAT POLICE RESPONDING TO THE SCENE OF THE RECKLESS DRIVER'S ACCIDENT, WHATEVER, SHOULD PUT A BOOT ON IT AND PREVENT THAT DRIVER FROM DRIVING FURTHER IN THAT DANGEROUS MACHINE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

>> I MEAN, I THINK THAT OPENS UP TOO MANY LEVELS OF WHO GETS TO DECIDE WHAT'S RECKLESS DRIVING.

ALL RIGHT.

I'M .. HAVE TO SWERVE, AND I HIT A FIRE HYDRANT AND WATER IS SHOOTING UP IN THE AIR.

SO I GET BOOTED.

THE NEXT PERSON COMES ALONG AND THEY DO SOMETHING ELSE AND THEY DON'T GET THE CAR BOOTED.

WHY ME?

NOT THEM.

>> WILL POLICE PUT BOOTS ON THEIR OWN CAR?

>> IT WILL BE ALL OF A SUDDEN IT WILL BECOME ABOUT THIS CAR IS NICER THAN THAT CAR.

THIS PERSON IS DIFFERENT THAN THAT PERSON.

IT WILL ALL JUST -- I THINK IT'S A GOOD THOUGHT, BUT IT WILL NOT WORK.

>>..

HATE TO BRING UP THE OBVIOUS.

HOW MANY REPEAT DWI OFFENDERS DO WE HEAR ABOUT?

THEY COULD EASILY FIND A WAY TO DRIVE ANOTHER CAR JUST AS RECKLESSLY AS THEY HAVE BEEN DRIVING THE ONE WITH THE..

IT.

..

CONCERNS HERE, WHICH I THINK ARE HUGE, I DON'T WANT THE POLICE TO HAVE THE POWER.

CAN YOU IMAGINE CITY ADMINISTRATORS PROPERLY ADMINISTERING THE URN RETURN OF THE CAR?

IN THIS CITY, IT WOULD BE A NIGHTMARE.

BUT ..

I JUST LOST MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT.

>> I MEAN, RAY, WE ARE GOING TO TALK ABOUT A MEASURE THAT GRETCHEN BANGERT, STATE REPRESENTATIVE, REPRESENTING FLORESCENT AND HAZEL WOOD PUT FORWARD, IF YOU DON'T HAVE A LICENSE ON YOUR CAR OR AN EXPIRED TAG, UNDER HER BILL, YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO GET YOUR CAR REPAIRED AT AN AUTO REPAIR SHOP.

I'M THINKING WHY NOT PUT BOOTS ON CARS THAT HAVE EXPIRED TAGS LIKE THEY DO IN NEW YORK CITY, THAND MAKE SURE PEOPLE HAVE TAGS AND LICENSES ON THEIR CAR.

>> YOU STOLE MY LINE ABOUT HOW MANY COP CARS ARE GOING TO BE BOOTED?

>> TWO AT LEAST WE K.. >> A LOT MORE THAN THAT.

FIRST OF ALL.

>> BECAUSE THE MECHANIC, ACCORDING TO THE LEGISLATOR.

>> I THINK THIS IS NOT A GREAT IDEA FOR A LOT OF REASONS.

NO.

1, MOST PEOPLE WHO -- I HAPPEN TO BE LAW ABAIDING IN THIS RESPECT.

BUT MOST PEOPLE HAVE CARS ON WARRANTIES THAT BUY NEW CARS.

PERHAPS WE OUGHT TO HAVE THE OPTION FOR PEOPLE TO SPREAD THEIR PAYMENTS FOR THEIR SALES TAX OUT OVER A REASONABLE AMOUNT OF TIME.

I THINK THAT WOULD BE A NICE THING.

YOU AR.. TELL MECHANICS.

HOW ARE YOU GOING TO ENFORCE THAT WITH MECHANICS.

BUT LIKE I SAY, I'M SURE THERE WAS A REFERENCE IN THAT STORY ABOUT $100,000 TRUCKS AND CARS, AND THOSE PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO HAVE A PROBLEM GETTING THEIR CARS FIXED.

>> THEN THERE'S THE BABY WITH THE BATH WATER COMPONENT HERE.

I THINK GRETCHEN BANGERT IN THE ARTICLE DID POINT OUT ONE OF THE PROBLEMS IS THAT EVEN IF YOU HAVE -- LET'S SAY YOU HAVE A SICK CHILD, AND YOUR LICENSE PLATE, YOU HAVE DONE EVERYTHING TO DATE CORRECTLY, BUT IF YOUR LICENSE PLATES ARE EXPIRED IN THE NEXT TWO DAYS AND NEED A CAT LIT CATALYTIC CONVERTER, YOU ARE NOT GOING TO GET IT.

>> LET ME GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

>> ENFORCE THE LAW.

>> EARLY IN MY LIFE THERE WA.. TIME -- I WENT A COUPLE MONTHS IN WHAT YOU SHOULD CALL RIDING DIRTY WHERE THE TAGS WERE EXPIRED.

.. BECAUSE IT WAS NOT GOING TO PASS INSPECTION.

I CO.. AND GET MY BRAKES FIXED.

I'M ALL RIGHT.

SMOKE AIN'T COMING OFF ME YET, BUT I CAN HEAR THEM GRINDING.

TIME TO GET MY BRAKES FIXED.

WHAT DO I DO IF THEY WON'T FIX THEM BECAUSE MY TAG IS EXPIRED?

>> DO WE WANT TO INCENTIVIZE DADS DRIVING AROUND WITHOUT BRAKES?

>> THERE ARE T.. YOU CAN HAVE A CAR TOWED.

THINK ABOUT THE AMOUNT OF VANDALISM THAT WOULD BE ON BOOTED CARS.

THAT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN IN ST. LOUIS.

&g..

THE ROAD AND DOESN'T HAVE A LICENSE PLATE, THEY PUT A BOOT ON IT, AND THEN YOU HAVE TO CALL AN 800 NUMBER.

GIVE THEM THE CREDIT CARD.

THEY GIVE YOU THE CODE TO TAKE THE BOOT OFF.

THAT'S HOW IT WORKS.

>> I WANT TO GO BACK TO THIS.

I APPRECIATE THAT PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO BE VERY SERIOUS ABOUT THE RECKLESS DRIVING HERE.

BUT LET'S FACE IT.

A LOT OF THE RECKLESS DRIVING IS ACTUALLY STOLEN CARS.

THIS IS NOT GO.. THAT.

.. >> I WANT TO GO TO YOU, SARAH, ON A STORY THAT JEREMY KOHLER HAD THIS PAST WEEK.

HE TOOK A LOOK ONCE AGAIN AT THE WAY THE CHIEF IN THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS IS REIMBURSED OR COMPENSATED.

HE G.. AND THEN THE ST. LOUIS POLICE FOUNDATION, NOT-FOR-PROFIT, DIGS INTO ITS OWN POCKETBOOK, ITS OWN WALLET AND GIVES ANOTHER $100,000.

SOME A..

EVIDENCE, THAT THIS IS GOING TO RESULT IN FAVORITISM THAT THE POLICE CHIEF IS GETTING BETTER POLICE SERVICES TO THOSE WHO CONTRIBUTED.

DO Y..

THIS ARRANGEMENT?

>> I THINK IT ..

QUESTIONS.

ONE ..

AWARE OF, UNTIL I READ THIS STORY, IS THIS IS UNPRECEDENTED.

THEY LOOKED ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, COULDN'T FIND ANYONE ELSE DOING THAT.

ANY TIME ST. LOUIS BECOMES AN INNOVATOR DOES MAKE ME NERVOUS.

SHARON TYUS HAD A GREAT STORY.

SHE SAID WHAT IF THE CRIMINALS GET TOGETHER AND TRY TO HIRE A POLICE CHIEF.

WHILE I GET THAT'S ABSURD, I THINK WHOEVER IS PAYING PART OF YOUR SALARY HAS YOUR EAR.

WE ARE ALL IN WORKPLACE SITUATIONS WHO UNDERSTAND PEOPLE WHO ARE FUNDING US CAN GET TO US AND HAVE AN IMPACT ON HOW WE DO OUR JOBS IN WAYS THAT THE PERSON WHO IS NOT PAYING OUR SALARY DOES NOT.

I CAN SEE TH.. >> I MADE THAT POINT.

WE TALKED ABOUT THIS SOME TIME AGO.

BUT THERE'S ELEMENTS.. STORY THAT ADVANCED IT.

ONE, WHICH I HADN'T PAID ATTENTION, I THINK I FORGOT IS THE FIRE CHIEF HAD TO PAY THE SAME.

AND DENNIS SAYS APPARENT.. NOT -- THE QUESTION IS -- DOES HE GET PAID -- DOES HE GOT AN ARGUMENT ABOUT THE FOUNDATION PART?

AND ALSO POINTED OUT.. OFFICIALS ARE ACTING LIKE THIS IS JUST A GIFT.

THE FOUNDATION WASN'T INVOLVED DIRECTLY.

THEY..

THE WAY CHIEF TRACY IS NOT THE ISSUE HERE.

YOU CAN'T BLAME HIM AT ALL.

BOB TRACY HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS.

>> EXCEPT HE CASHES THE CHECK.

>> IT'S NOT ON HIM.

NO, IT'S NOT ON HIM.

>> THAT'S REALITY.

>> SHE DID.

>> THIS IS NOT ABOUT BOB TRACY.

>> IT COULD BE SUBTLE.

I THOUGHT THAT JEREMY DID A TERRIFIC POINT -- DID A TERRIFIC JOB OF POINTING OUT THAT IT IS NOT ONLY UNPRECEDENTED, BUT -- I HAVE ALSO LOST MY TRAIN OF THOUGHT.

>.. >> I WANT TO SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THIS.

ISN'T HERE.

THE PRIVATE SECTOR IN THIS T.. HAS CONSISTENT -- DON'T TELL ME THERE AREN'T ISSUES ABOUT HIRINGS OR FIRINGS OR THIS ONE OR THAT ONE THAT DON'T MATTER TO PEOPLE IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR.

>> HE WAS MAKING THE POINT THAT FOR THE FIRST TIME IN ITS HISTORY WE HAVE GONE OUTSIDE OF THE CITY OF ST. LOUIS.

APPARENTLY WE DIDN'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT.

>> OKAY.

THE MONEY SHOULD COME FROM.. CITY, FINE.

BUT IF THE CIT.. GIVE HIM 275, WHICH IS WAY TOO LOW, AND THAT'S WHAT MOST SUPERINTENDENTS MAKE IN THIS AREA, AND WE JUST FOUND OUT THAT THE ATHLETIC DIRECTOR AT MIZZOU, WHOSE BUDGET IS MUCH SMALLER THAN THE POLICE CHIEFS WAS MAKING 1.25 MILLION.

>> THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

>> I DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH THIS WHATSOEVER.

THE ONLY THING THAT HAS TO DO WITH BOB TRACY IS THIS.

YOU ARE KIND OF IMPUGNING HIS CHARACTER.

I'M .. YOU ARE KIND OF IMPUGNING HIS CHARACTER BY SAYING IT'S FAVORITISM JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE GETTING THIS MONEY.

I'M NOT GOING TO PUT THAT ON HIM.

I DON'T ..

THE HIGHEST PAID PUBLIC EMPLOYEE AT THE STATE IS THE FOOTBALL COACH.

BUT THAT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THAT.

>> I THINK IT DOES.

>> NOT IMPUGNING BOB TRACY TO SAY THE STRUCTURE LENDS ITSELF, THE STRUCTURE.

I SAID IT.

I DON'T THINK IT'S ABOUT HIM AT ALL.

>> LET M.. FIRST OF ALL A LOT OF THIS MONEY FROM THE POLICE FOUNDATION ISN'T EVEN CLOSE TO ST. LOUIS.

IT COMES FROM ST. CHARLES, FROM ST. LOUIS COUNTY.

ALL OF THESE PEOPLE.

THEY ARE NOT GOING TO EVER DEAL WITH THIS GUY IN ANY WAY.

ALSO, SOME PEOPLE ARE IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS.

BUT THERE'S NO EVIDENCE, SAR..

THERE'S NOT INCREASED POLICE PRESENCE IN DOWNTOWN ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI IN 2024.

>> WE KNOW ST. CHARLES HAS WAYS THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE THINGS CHANGE IN ST. LOUIS.

THEY HAVE AN AGENDA.

>> THEY WANT A QUALITY POLICE CHIEF WHO'S PAID A DECENT SALARY.

>.. AGAIN, I THINK -- THE FIRE DEPARTMENT THING IS THE SAME.

>> SARAH PENSKE IS GOING TO TALK ABOUT A STORY SHE RAN THIS WEEK WRITTEN BY SHULA NEWMAN WHO TOOK A LOOK AT THE LEGACY OF CHARLES LINDBERGH WHO ALMOST 100 YEARS AGO WAS THE FIRST PERSON TO FLY ACROSS THE ATLANTIC SOLO IN ST. LOUIS.

>> THIS WAS NOT AN ARGUMENT TO CANCEL LINDBERGH OR REMOVE HIS NAME FROM THESE THINGS.

BUT SHULA NEWMAN WHO TOOK THE LEAD ON THIS PROJECT AS WELL AS THE RIVERFRONT TIMES, SHE DID A GOOD JOB OF SAYING WE HAVE NOT PROBED THIS LEGACY OR QUESTIONED ANTISEMITISM IN THE UNITED STATES.

AND .. LINDBERGH WAS A PART OF.

I HAVE TO SAY, AS SOMEBODY THAT CAME ALONG WITH THE LATTER QUARTER OR LATTER HALF OF THE 20th CENTURY.

>> NOW YOU.. YOU ARE MAKING ME SOUND YOUNGER THAN I AM.

I WAS SHOCKED TO REETD ABOU READ ABOUT THE RESTRICTIVE COUGH ANYONES AFFECTING THE JEWS AND CODIFIED INTO COLLEGES AND CLUBS AND ALL THESE THINGS.

IT'S A.. AND SHULA MADE A GREAT ARGUMENT THAT THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO BE TALKING ABOUT AND ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT.

>> PEOPLE WANT TO DISCUSS THIS AND ALL THAT.

I'M NOT KIDDING YOU.

I THINK IT WAS 9 YEARS OLD.

AND CHARLES LINDBERGH FLEW OVER.

HE WAS A NAZI, YOU KNOW, DON'T YOU?

&g.. >> IN THE LATE 1960s, SOMEONE ACTUALLY SAID THAT TO ME.

I'M LIKE -- IT'S ALMOST LIKE PEOPLE ARE ACTING AS THOUGH THIS ALL JUMPED OUT OF THE CLOSET.

>> HE RECOVERED AND WENT BACK.

VERY QUICKLY.

>> COMBAT MISSIONS IN WORLD WAR II.

AND SAVED HIS REPUTATION FOR THE TIME BEING.

>> BUT HE HAD A COMFORTABLE FAMILY.

>.. WEDLOCK IN GERMANY.

>> THAT WAS A HECK OF A STORY.

RIVERFRONT TIMES, ALWAYS ADMIRED THE PAPER, VERY GOOD.

IT WAS A GOOD STORY, REALLY GOOD STORY.

ONE, THIS GUY WAS A HORRIBLE PERSON.

I'..

HE MAY NOT HAVE BEEN A NAZI.

BUT THE POINT IS HE WAS A HORRIBLE GUY.

HE WASN'T FROM ST. LOUIS.

THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS IN THE STORY -- HE ONLY LIVED HERE FOR LIKE A YEAR.

FOR WE -- FOR US -- I DON'T THINK WE NEED TO RENAME STUFF.

IT'S TOO LATE.

BUT TO HONOR THIS GUY, AND JUST BECAUSE HE PUT ST. LOUIS ON THE AIRPLANE, HE WAS NOT FROM HERE.

HE WAS HERE A REACH AND WANTED A BUNCH OF RICH PEOPLE TO GIVE HIM SOME MONEY.

>> SARAH AND I AREN'T FROM HERE EITHER.

WE ARE FROM CLEVELAND.

>> WE GREW UP IN KIRKWOOD.

>> LET'S GO TO THE MAIL BANK AND SEE WHAT PEOPLE HAD TO SAY ABOUT LAST WEEK'S PROGRAM.

IF POLICE DEPARTMENTS ACROSS THE COUNTRY CAN'T ATTRACT OFFICERS, SALT LAKE CITY SHOULD BE THE EXCEPTION, AND EXP AND NENGSLY INCREASE THE PAY.

WE ALSO HEARD FROM MIKE OF KIRKWOOD WHO WROTE YET ANOTHER TRAGEDY OCCURRED TO VISITORS OF OUR CITY CAUSED BY AN OUT OF CONTROL DRIVER, THIS TIME TAKING THE LIVES OF A MOTHER AND DAUGHTER VISITING FROM CHICAGO.

THERE'S ONLY ONE ISSUE, THE RAMS SETTLEMENT MONEY SHOULD BE SPENT ON, AND THAT IS MAKING THE CITY A SAFER PLACE.

KATHERINE GLAZER OF BRIDGE TON WROTE THANK, ALVIN REID FOR LEADING THE DISCUSSION.

CHARLIE BRENNAN NEEDS TO RETIRE FROM HIS JOB, TOO.

I HATE THE SMIRK HE HAS ON HIS FACE, AND I CAN TELETHINKS HE'S BETTER THAN EVERYONE ELSE.

WRITE US IN CARE OF NINE PBS 655 OLIVE STREET.

ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI 63.. LOVE THOSE E-MAILS.

"DONNYBROOK" AT NINE PBS.ORG AND SOCIAL MEDIA USE HASHTAG.

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APRIL 13th IS OUR NEXT DONNYBASH.

-- IT'S APRIL 11th.

I'M SORRY.

IT'S NINE PBS.ORG.

STARTING TO AGREE WITH KATHERINE.

I NE..

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US.

WE..

THIS TIME.

>> "DONNYBROOK" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE SUPPORT OF THE BETSY AND THOMAS PATTERSON FOUNDATION AND THE MEMBERS OF NINE PBS.