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♪ >>> HELLO, AND WELCOME TO "CHAT BOX" WITH DAVID CRUZ, AS YOU CAN SEE, I'M NOT DAVID CRUZ.

I'M JOANNA, FILLING IN FOR DAVID THIS WEEK.

MANY AROUND THE STATE ARE WONDERING WHEN THEY CAN EVER EXPECT TO BUY WEED LEGALLY, AS WAS PROMISED WHEN THE STATE LEGALIZED IN 2018.

NEW JERSEY'S BEEN SETTING UP A MARKET POLICE, BUT IT'S BEEN A SLOW ROLLOUT, AND MANY FACILITIES THAT HAVE BEEN WAITING TO SELL THEIR PRODUCT ARE GOING IMPATIENT.

I'M JOINED RIGHT NOW BE I THE CHAIR OF THE NEW JERSEY CANNABIS REGULATORY COMMISSION TO DISCUSS THE TIMING OF IT ALL.

WELCOME, DIANA.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME, JOANNA.

>> TELL US WHAT IS HAPPENING AT THE CRC, THE CANNABIS REGULATORY COMMISSION, WHEN IT COMES TO APPROVING SOME OF THE APPLICATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN RECEIVED FOR SOME OF THE MEDICAL MARIJUANA DISPENSARIES TO START SELLING RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA.

>> YEAH, SO, THE CRC, THE CANNABIS REGULATORY COMMISSION, HAS ACTED REALLY QUICKLY TO GET A LOT ACCOMPLISHED IN LESS THAN A YEAR, SO WE'VE SET UP OUR INITIAL RULES THAT WOULD GOVERN THE ADULT USE CANNABIS INDUSTRY.

BACK IN AUGUST.

THOSE RULES WERE MEANT TO LOWER SOME OF THE BARRIERS TO ENTRY AND ALSO GIVE SOME GUIDANCE FOR OUR ALTERNATIVE TREATMENT CENTERS OR ATCs THAT MIGHT WANT TO EXPAND THEIR OPERATIONS TO INCLUDE ADULT USE CANNABIS OPERATIONS.

SO, WE ARE -- I'M REALLY HOPEFUL THAT WE'LL SEE RETAIL SALES BEGIN SOON, BUT IN ORDER TO GET TO THAT POINT, THE STATE NEEDS CERTAIN SAFEGUARDS IN PLACE.

FIRST AND FOREMOST, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE OUR PATIENTS WILL REMAIN A PRIORITY AND THEY WILL CONTINUE TO HAVE ACCESS TO THEIR MEDICINE, AND WE NEED TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE SUFFICIENT NUMBER OF BUSINESSES ACROSS THE STATE THAT ARE READY TO OPEN UP TO THE PUBLIC.

>> SO, SOME OF THESE ATCs, THESE ALTERNATE TREATMENT CENTERS, SAY THEY'VE COMPLETED THEIR APPLICATIONS.

THE STATE IS SAYING -- THE CRC IS SAYING THAT SOME OF THOSE APPLICATIONS ARE NOT COMPLETE.

WHAT IS THE DISCONNECT THERE WHEN MANY ARE SAYING THEY HAVE THE PRODUCT, THEY FILLED OUT THE APPLICATION, AND THEY'RE READY TO GO?

>> WELL, AS LATE AS LAST WEEK, THERE WERE STILL A LOT OF MISSING INFORMATION.

OUR STAFF HAVE BEEN IN COMMUNICATION WITH THE -- THOSE WHO HAD SUBMITTED MATERIALS FROM THE ALTERNATIVE TREATMENT CENTERS, AND SO ONCE EVERYTHING -- ONCE ALL THE INFORMATION HAS BEEN PROVIDED, REVIEWED, AND INVESTIGATED BY THE COMMISSION STAFF, THEN WE CAN GET TO A POINT WHERE WE CAN CONSIDER WHETHER OR NOT THE STATE AS A WHOLE IS READY FOR ADULT USE CANNABIS OPERATIONS TO BEGIN.

>> TALK ME THROUGH, IF YOU CAN, WHAT STEPS THE STATE NEEDS TO TAKE BEFORE IT BEGINS APPROVING THOSE APPLICATIONS.

>> SURE.

WELL, AS WRITTEN INTO OUR LAW THAT'S BEEN ON THE BOOKS NOW FOR ALMOST A YEAR, ALTERNATIVE TREATMENT CENTERS HAVE TO PROVIDE ASSURANCES THAT THEY WILL CONTINUE TO SERVE PATIENTS AND THAT THEY HAVE ENOUGH MEDICINAL CANNABIS SUPPLIES TO MEET THE DEMANDS OF OUR PATIENT COMMUNITY.

>> SO, IS THIS A SUPPLY ISSUE, AS YOU HAD SAID EARLIER?

FOR THE STATE TO BE READY TO OPEN THE MARKETPLACE, THE ISSUE REALLY FOCUSES ON SUPPLY?

>> SUPPLY IS JUST ONE OF SEVERAL THINGS THAT THE STATE IS LOOKING AT, BECAUSE NOT ONLY ARE WE LOOKING AT THE SUPPLIES OF AN INDIVIDUAL ALTERNATIVE TREATMENT CENTER, WE'RE LOOKING AT SUPPLIES ACROSS THE STATE.

BECAUSE AGAIN, WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE SETTING UP AN INDUSTRY THAT IS STRONG AND READY AND CAPABLE OF SERVING THE PUBLIC WHILE CONTINUING TO MEET THE NEEDS OF OUR PATIENT COMMUNITY.

IF WE RUSH INTO THINGS TOO QUICKLY, WITHOUT MAKING SURE THAT THOSE SAFEGUARDS ARE IN PLACE, THEN WE RISK SEEING PATIENTS LOSE ACCESS TO THEIR MEDICINE.

WE RISK SEEING REALLY LONG LINES AND WAIT TIMES AT BUSINESSES, AND ULTIMATELY, WE RISK RUNNING INTO AN IMMEDIATE SUPPLY CRISIS THAT COULD FRUSTRATE OUR ADULT USE USERS.

>> SO BEYOND THE ATCs, THERE ARE OTHER BUSINESSES THAT HAVE APPLIED FOR -- TO SELL ADULT USE CANNABIS.

THIS WEEK, CONGRESSMAN DONALD PAYNE SAID THAT AS OF NOW, NO BLACK-OWNED BUSINESSES -- I'M NOT SURE HE SAID MINORITY-OWNED BUSINESSES BUT NO BLACK-OWNED BUSINESSES HAVE BEEN APPROVED.

THE CRC SAYS THAT'S FALSE AND ONE OF THE INTENTIONS OPENING UP THIS MARKETPLACE WAS TO HAVE MINORITY-OWNED BUSINESSES OPERATING WITHIN IT.

BREAK THAT DOWN FOR US.

HAVE THERE BEEN MINORITY-OWNED BUSINESSES APPROVED SO FAR?

>> WELL, I CAN'T PROVIDE THE DETAILS OF SPECIFIC APPLICATION MATERIALS OR OWNERSHIP OF THE AWARDEES.

WHAT I CAN SAY IS THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS NOTION THAT THERE IS NO DIVERSITY AMONG OUR MEDICINAL CANNABIS BUSINESS AWARDEES IS SIMPLY FALSE.

I'M NOT SURE WHERE IT'S COMING FROM, BUT WE ARE WORKING TIRELESSLY TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE PROVIDING A MEANINGFUL OPPORTUNITY FOR ANYONE IN NEW JERSEY WHO WANTS TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS INDUSTRY CAN DO SO.

AND SO, WE HAVE WORKED REALLY HARD TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE REALLY LOW APPLICATION FEES, THAT WE STREAMLINE THE APPLICATION PROCESS ITSELF SO THAT PEOPLE DON'T FEEL LIKE THEY HAVE TO SPEND THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS JUST TO SUBMIT AN SPAPPLICATION.

WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE PROVIDE A SPACE WHERE INDIVIDUALS CAN PROVIDE THEIR BUSINESS PLANS AND PUT THEIR BUSINESS PLANS TO THE TEST IN THE REAL WORLD.

>> AND YET, DIANA, AS I'M SURE YOU KNOW, MANY OF THESE BUSINESSES WHO HAVE APPLIED HAVE TO SECURE THE SPACE, HAVE TO PAY FOR THE RENTAL WHILE THEY WAIT TO SEE IF THEY WILL EVEN BE GREEN LIGHTED TO START, TO OPEN THEIR BUSINESS.

AND SO, THAT DOES BECOME, ONE, A DIVIDE IN TERMS OF WHO HAS AND WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE MONEY TO PUT IT OUT IN THAT WAY.

DO YOU AGREE THAT THAT'S -- COULD BE AN INHIBITOR TO GETTING SOME MINORITY-OWNED BUSINESSES OFF THE GROUND?

>> WE CERTAINLY HAVE HEARD THAT FROM A NUMBER OF STAKEHOLDERS AND INTERESTED INDIVIDUALS WHO WANT TO PARTICIPATE IN THE CANNABIS INDUSTRY.

AND WHILE THE LAW REQUIRES APPLICANTS FOR AN ANNUAL LICENSE TO PROVIDE INFORMATION DOCUMENTING SITE CONTROL OR PROPERTY CONTROL, THE CRC HAS MADE SURE THAT ITS RULES PROVIDE SOME REAL PATHWAYS THROUGH THE CONDITIONAL LICENSURE PROCESS SO THAT PEOPLE WHO DON'T YET HAVE ACCESS TO A SOLID PROPERTY OR WHO ARE STILL LOOKING FOR MUNICIPAL APPROVAL, THEY CAN STILL APPLY THROUGH THE CONDITIONAL LICENSING PROCESS, AND THAT REALLY IS MEANT TO BRING SOME OF THESE BURDENS DOWN AND SO THE CRC IS DOING EVERYTHING IT CAN TO LISTEN TO THE OBSTACLES OR CHALLENGES THAT PEOPLE ARE FACING AND DO WHAT IT HAS THE POWER TO DO TO LAOWER THOSE OBSTACLES.

>> VERY QUICKLY, JUST A FEW SECONDS LEFT, CAN YOU GIVE US A SENSE OF THE TIMELINE, WHEN WE MIGHT SEE THE MARKETPLACE OPEN?

>> I'M HOPING WE'LL SEE IT OPEN REALLY SOON.

AS WE KNOW, THERE ARE A LOT OF FACTORS THAT GO INTO PLAY HERE, AND WHILE THE CRC HAS PUT OUT ITS RULES BACK IN AUGUST, SO THAT EVERYBODY WAS ON NOTICE OF WHAT WOULD BE REQUIRED, WE ARE STILL WAITING TO SEE WHETHER BUSINESSES ARE GOING TO BE READY FOR OPENING UP.

BUT ABOVE ALL ELSE, WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR PATIENT COMMUNITY IS SERVED AND THAT THEY CONTINUE TO SEE THE BENEFITS THAT THE MEDICINAL CANNABIS PROGRAM WAS MEANT TO OFFER THEM.

>> DIANA HOUENOU, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

>> NO PROBLEM, GREAT TALKING WITH YOU, JOANNA.

>> NEW YORK'S PUBLIC SCHOOL HAS BEEN A POINT OF CONTENTION SINCE 2008.

MANY GOVERNORS HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF NOT FULLY FUNDING SKOOLGZ ACCORDING TO THE FORMULA AND THAT ALLEGATION CONTINUES TODAY IN A REPORT RELEASED THIS WEEK BY NEW JERSEY POLICY PERSPECTIVE.

I'M JOINED BY NJPP'S BRUCE BAKER TO TALK ABOUT THAT REPORT AND WHAT IT MEANS FOR OUR STUDENTS.

WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, BRUCE.

>> WELL, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME, IT'S GOOD TO BE HERE, TALK SCHOOL FUNDING A LITTLE BIT.

>> THIS REPORT SAYS THAT SCHOOL FUNDING HAS NOT INCREASED, ACCORDING TO THE INCREASES IN EXPECTATION FOR OUR SCHOOLS.

JUST BREAK THAT DOWN A BIT, AND EXPLAIN THE DISPARITY.

>> OKAY.

SO, ONE OF THE BIG ISSUES IS THAT WE ADOPTED THIS NEW -- IN NEW JERSEY, WE ADOPTED THIS NEW SCHOOL FUNDING FORMULA STRUCTURE AND IT WAS ADOPTED IN 2008, AND IT BEGAN IMPLEMENTATION IN 2009, AND THAT FORMULA WAS ACTUALLY CALIBRATED OR BUILT ON SOME ANALYSES OF WHAT IT WOULD COST TO ACHIEVE THE OUTCOMES THE STATE WANTED TO ACHIEVE, ACTUALLY, IN THE KIND OF EARLY TO MID-2000s, 2003, '4, '5.

BUT NOT ONLY HAVE WE NOT FULLY FUNDED THAT FORMULA DUE TO A VARIETY OF REASONS IN THE DECADE AND A FEW YEARS SINCE.

WE'VE ALSO NOT REVISITED AND RECALIBRATED THAT FORMULA TO ADDRESS THE COSTS OF WHAT WE EXPECT OF SCHOOLS IN NEW JERSEY HERE AND NOW, WHICH HAVE INCREASED.

WE'VE CHANGED THE TESTS.

WE'VE SET HIGHER TARGETS.

WE EXPECT MORE OF SCHOOLS IN TERMS OF THE BREADTH OF WHAT THEY NEED TO ACHIEVE AND IN TERMS OF THE LEVEL THAT WE EXPECT KIDS TO ACHIEVE.

BUT WE HAVEN'T RECALIBRATED THE FUNDING TO MEET THOSE GOALS.

>> AND SOME OF THAT FUNDING WOULD BE FOR MORE QUALIFIED TEACHERS, RIGHT, TO HELP STUDENTS GET TO THOSE POINTS, AS ONE SMALL MATTER?

>> RIGHT.

WELL, I MEAN, THE APPROACH IS ABOUT FIGURING OUT, WELL, WHAT DO DIFFERENT KIDS IN DIFFERENT SETTINGS NEED TO GET TO THESE OUTCOMES -- OUTCOME TARGETS THAT WE'RE SETTING, BE IT TEST SCORE OUTCOMES, GRADUATION REQUIREMENTS, OR SO ON, AND TO FIGURE OUT THOSE DIFFERENT COSTS BUT THE MONEY THAT IS GENERATED BY ANY FORMULA BASED ON THOSE COSTS GOES INTO DOING THINGS LIKE HIRING MORE QUALIFIED AND MORE TEACHERS TO PROVIDE SMALLER CLASSES, SMALLER CLASSES WITH MORE QUALIFIED TEACHERS, ALL THE BASIC STUFF THAT WE NEED IN SCHOOLS TO GET THE JOB DONE.

>> AND SO, THE FUNDING FORMULA DOES PROVIDE FOR DISPARITIES THAT EXIST BETWEEN URBAN AND SUBURBAN COMMUNITIES, RIGHT?

AND THERE'S A MATHEMATICAL EQUATION TO FIGURE OUT IF THERE ARE ENGLISH LANGUAGE LEARNERS IN A DISTRICT VERSUS A DISTRICT THAT HAS MORE AFFLUENT COMMUNITY THAT'S MORE ABLE TO RAISE A TAX BASE FOR ITS SCHOOLS.

JUST EXPLAIN THAT A BIT.

>> RIGHT.

SO, THESE SCHOOL FUNDING FORMULAS, WHICH, OF COURSE, SEEM LIKE JUST PAINFULLY COMPLICATED, MORE SO THAN THEY SEEM LIKE THEY SHOULD BE, REALLY STRIVE TO ACHIEVE -- THEY HAVE TWO DIFFERENT PARTS.

ONE PART IS KIND OF FIGURING OUT, WELL, WHAT'S THE OVERALL TARGET AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT'S NEEDED IN ONE DISTRICT VERSUS ANOTHER TO ACHIEVE THE GIVEN SET OF OUTCOME GOALS, AND HOW DO THOSE COSTS PER PEOPLE VARY FROM NEWARK TO IRVINGTON TO MILL BURN TO, YOU KNOW, TO OTHER DISTRICTS AROUND THE STATE?

AND THOSE COST TARGETS WILL VARY BASED ON THOSE DIFFERENCES THAT YOU JUST RAISED, THAT THERE ARE HIGHER CONCENTRATIONS OF CHILDREN IN POVERTY IN SOME DISTRICTS, HIGHER CONCENTRATIONS OF ENGLISH LANGUAGE LEARNERS, THOSE ARE BIG FACTORS IN DETERMINING THOSE COST TARGETS.

THE SECOND PIECE OF THE PUZZLE IS FIGURING OUT AND HOW MUCH OF THAT MONEY SHOULD BE CONTRIBUTED BY THE LOCAL COMMUNITY VERSUS HOW MUCH SHOULD BE THEN PROVIDED BY THE STATE TO KIND OF LEVEL IT UP THE REST OF THE WAY.

OFTEN, THERE'S A BIT OF A RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THOSE TWO, IN THAT A LOT OF THE COMMUNITIES WITH THE HIGHER COSTS AND NEEDS ARE ALSO COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE LOWER CAPACITY TO RAISE THEIR OWN REVENUES TO HIT THOSE TARGETS, BUT THAT'S NOT A PERFECT RELATIONSHIP, WHICH IS WHY WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH THOSE TWO PARTS SEPARATELY.

>> WHAT IS THE SOLUTION OFFERED HERE, AND IS IT LEGISLATIVE?

IS IT COMING FROM THE MURPHY ADMINISTRATION?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING.

I MEAN, YOU POINTED OUT, LIKE A MINUTE AGO, THAT SFRA HAS A LOT OF THE RIGHT PARTS.

IT HAS THESE KIND OF LEVERS IN IT THAT LET US ADJUST THE AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR CONCENTRATIONS OF CHILDREN IN POVERTY, ENGLISH LANGUAGE LEARNERS AND SO ON, AND IT HAS A RATIO BUILT INTO IT TO DETERMINE THE STATE AND LOCAL SHARE, SO THE LEGISLATION, THE STRUCTURE OF THE FORMULA ITSELF, KIND OF, IT HAS THE RIGHT PARTS TO GET THE JOB DONE.

IT JUST -- AND IT WAS DESIGNED AROUND GETTING THE JOB DONE THAT WAS, YOU KNOW, THE JOB OF SCHOOLS AS DESCRIBED 15, 17 YEARS AGO.

SO, IT REALLY -- THE LEGISLATED STRUCTURE COULD REMAIN THE SAME, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE RECALIBRATED, SET TO ACHIEVE THESE HIGHER GOALS, AND SET TO, YOU KNOW, BETTER ADDRESS THE NEEDS OF CHILDREN IN POVERTY, CHILDREN WHO ARE ENGLISH LANGUAGE LEARNERS.

A LOT OF THAT CAN ACTUALLY BE DONE THROUGH KIND OF REGULATORY ADJUSTMENT TO THE STATUTE WITHOUT CHANGING THE STATUTE ITSELF.

OF COURSE, THE FIRST STEP IS TO FULLY FUND THE STATUTE THAT WE HAVE, EVEN WHILE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO RECALIBRATE IT.

WE OUGHT TO AT LEAST GET BACK TO THE FULL FUNDING OF THE INTENDED FORMULA AS IT WAS ADOPTED ALL THOSE YEARS AGO.

>> I'M SURE YOU HEARD RECENTLY, SIX JERSEY SHORE DISTRICTS HAVE BROUGHT SUIT AGAINST THE MURPHY ADMINISTRATION, SAYING THAT THERE IS NOT TRANSPARENCY IN TERMS OF WHERE THE MONEY IS GOING AND IN TERMS OF WHO KIND OF THE WINNERS AND LOSERS ARE THROUGH THIS FUNDING FORMULA.

FROM WHAT YOU HAVE SEEN, HAS THERE BEEN ENOUGH TRANSPARENCY FROM THE MURPHY ADMINISTRATION?

>> WELL, I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE TRANSPARENCY GETS TRICKIER -- AGAIN, IT'S ONE OF THOSE ANSWERS, IT'S COMPLICATED, SADLY, AN ACADEMIC RESPONSE.

IT GETS TRICKIER IN THESE TIMES WHEN WE GET KIND OF THROWN A LOOP LIKE COVID AND ALL OF A SUDDEN WE'RE NOT JUST FULLY FUNDING THE FORMULA AND PRODUCING ANNUAL RUNS OF THE DETAILED DATA OF WHO GOT WHAT AND WHY AND BASED ON WHAT CALCULATIONS.

THAT TYPE OF INFORMATION REALLY DOES NEED TO BE PUT OUT THERE ANNUALLY.

WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WHO IS UNDERFUNDED WITH RESPECT TO THE FORMULA, AND WHO, FOR THAT MATTER, IS OVERFUNDED WITH RESPECT TO THE FORMULA IN CLEAR, PLAIN RUNS OF DATA.

THAT'S BEEN HARDER WHEN TIMES GET A LITTLE CHAOTIC AND WHEN THE STATE BUDGETING DOESN'T COME THROUGH AS PLANNED.

I THINK IT'S -- WE'VE BEEN KIND OF BACK AND FORTH ON THAT OVER THE YEARS.

>> I'M GOING TO ASK YOU FOR A REALLY QUICK ANSWER TO THIS, NOT A QUICK QUESTION.

I BELIEVE IT DOESN'T WARRANT A QUICK ANSWER, BUT IS THERE FUNDING AVAILABLE TO INCREASE, AS YOU SAY, TO MEET THE NEW REQUIREMENTS, TO MEET THE STANDARDS?

DOES THE STATE HAVE THE MONEY?

>> I THINK THE STATE JUST NEEDS TO LOOK CAREFULLY AT THE BALANCE OF THE TAX POLICY SIDE AS WELL AND FIGURE OUT HOW CAN WE RAISE THE REVENUE TO SUPPORT THIS FORMULA AND ALSO REALIZE THAT THE PROPORTION OF OUR ECONOMIC CAPACITY WE SPEND ON SCHOOLS IN NEW JERSEY NOW, THE PERCENT OF GROSS STATE PRODUCT OR AGGREGATE PERSONAL INCOME IS ACTUALLY LOWER THAN IT'S BEEN IN THE PAST.

WE'VE SPENT A LARGER SHARE OF OUR ECONOMY IN THE PAST.

IT'S NOT UNREASONABLE TO ASSUME THAT WE COULD MOVE BACK TOWARD THAT IN THE FUTURE.

>> BRUCE BAKER, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> THANK YOU.

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> GOVERNOR MURPHY SAID THIS WEEK THAT WE ARE SHIFTING FROM A PANDEMIC TO AN ENDEMIC, AND WE'RE SEEING GOVERNMENT LEADERS ACROSS THE COUNTRY START TO ROLL BACK VACCINE AND MASK MANDATES.

I'M JOINED RIGHT NOW BY DR. CHRIS PARNELL FROM UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL TO TALK ABOUT WHAT THIS MEANS IN NEW JERSEY AND IF THIS IS WHERE WE SHOULD BE.

WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.

>> GOOD TO BE HERE.

>> FIRST QUESTION TO YOU.

ARE WE ON THE RIGHT TRACK IF WE'RE STARTING TO SEE ROLLBACKS OF VACCINE AND MASK MANDATES?

>> YOU KNOW, I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT THING FOR THE PUBLIC TO UNDERSTAND IS THAT WE NEED REMAIN VIGILANT.

YES, IT APPEARS THAT THE OMICRON SURGE IS ABATING, MEANING THAT WE'RE SEEING A REDUCTION IN THE NUMBER OF POSITIVE CASES, WE'RE SEEING A REDUCTION IN THE HOSPITALIZATIONS, BUT THOSE WHO ARE UNVACCINATED AND THOSE WHO ARE NOT BOOSTED OR HAVE NOT COMPLETED THEIR VACCINATION SERIES REMAIN AT RISK.

SO IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT WHILE WE HAVE FAVORABLE SIGNS THAT WE ARE WITNESSING, THAT WE REMAIN ON GUARD, AND WHAT I MEAN BY THAT, CONTINUING TO MASK WHEN WE'RE IN PUBLIC INDOOR SITUATIONS OR CROWDED OUTDOOR SITUATIONS, AND TO ENSURE THAT EVERYONE IN OUR HOUSEHOLD IS FULLY PROTECTED WITH VACCINATION AND BOOSTING.

>> WE LOOKED AT -- THE GOVERNOR SAID THIS WEEK THAT ABOUT 90% OF NEW JERSEYANS HAVE AT LEAST GOTTEN THEIR FIRST SHOT.

THOSE ARE SIGNIFICANT NUMBERS, BUT IT SEEMS THAT THE HOLDOUTS ARE JUST NOT EVER GOING TO COME ALONG, AT LEAST NOT WITH THE OFFERINGS ON THE TABLE RIGHT NOW.

THERE'S A NEW VACCINE THAT WOULD NOT BE AN MRNA THAT'S POTENTIALLY BEING CONSIDERED BY THE FDA.

DO YOU BELIEVE THAT SOMETHING LIKE THAT COULD GET THAT LAST 10% OR MORE TO COME TO THE OTHER SIDE?

>> YOU KNOW, THE FIRST THING I WANT TO SAY IS THAT WE SHOULD NEVER GIVE UP ON ANYONE.

I FOUND IN MY PRACTICE, AND SPEAKING WITH PEOPLE IN COMMUNITIES, SPEAKING WITH PEOPLE HERE AT UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL, THAT THAT CONSISTENT DIALOGUE WITH PEOPLE AS THEY FALL DIFFERENT PLACES AND POINTS ALONG THE DECISION JOURNEY IS SO NECESSARY FOR US TO TRULY BEAT BACK THIS PANDEMIC.

AND YES, IT'S HELPFUL THAT WE HAVE MORE TOOLS IN OUR PRECHBS T PRE PREVENTION TOOL KIT, SO I WELCOME VACCINES THAT ARE DIFFERENT VECTORS OR DIFFERENT VACCINE TECHNOLOGY AND I THINK THAT COULD BE ENCOURAGING FOR PEOPLE WHO THOUGHT THAT THE MRNA VACCINE WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS TOO NEW OR EXPERIMENTAL.

ALTHOUGH, THAT IS NOT TRUE.

IT'S BASED ON SOLID RESEARCH IN THE LAB FOR OVER DECADES.

THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE WHO THOUGHT THAT.

>> GOVERNOR MURPHY SIGNALLED THIS WEEK THAT MASKS WILL VERY LIKELY COME OFF OF STUDENTS AT SOME POINT DURING THIS SCHOOL YEAR.

WHAT IS THE METRIC AT WHICH YOU BELIEVE IT IS SAFE FOR MASKS TO COME OFF STUDENTS?

>> YOU KNOW, WHAT I WANT TO SEE IS THAT THE IN-SCHOOL TRANSMISSION RATE HAS PLUMMETED DRASTICALLY.

I WANT TO SEE THAT THE CASES AMONG STUDENTS, AS WELL AS AMONG STAFF, HAS PLUMMETED AS WELL AS REMAINING VERY LOW.

WE ARE ON A DOWNWARD TRAJECTORY, BUT WE MUST, AT THIS PRESENT TIME, CONTINUE OUR MULTILAYERED MITIGATION STRATEGIES BECAUSE OMICRON IS STILL OUT THERE.

THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE STILL GETTING INFECTED SO I KNOW PEOPLE ARE TIRED AND I KNOW PEOPLE ARE FRUSTRATED BUT I JUST CAUTION EVERYONE TO HOLD THE LINE AND TO REMAIN STEADY BECAUSE I WANT TO ENSURE THAT ALL OF OUR FAMILY MEMBERS AND THE MOST VULNERABLE AMONG US ARE TRULY PROTECTED AND THAT INCLUDES OUR KIDS.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I HAVE HEARD ABOUT IS THIS IDEA THAT THERE IS HERD IMMUNITY NOW THAT SO -- OR I SHOULD SAY SOME INCREASED LEVEL OF IMMUNITY BECAUSE PEOPLE HAVE CONTRACTED DELTA OR OMICRON BUT ALSO DATA COMING OUT SAYING OMICRON IS NOT PROVIDING THE STRONGEST ANTIBODIES.

PUT THAT INTO PERSPECTIVE FOR US, AND IS THERE A LEVEL OF PROTECTION IF SO MANY HAVE CONTRACTED THE VIRUS?

>> VERY, VERY GOOD QUESTION.

THE FIRST THING THAT I WOULD SAY IS THAT HYBRID IMMUNITY IS ACTUALLY WHAT WE CONSIDER AMONG THE BEST PROTECTION IN IMMUNITY, AND WHAT IS HYBRID IMMUNITY?

MEANING IF YOU HAVE PREVIOUSLY BEEN INFECTED WITH CORONAVIRUS AND HAVE NATURAL IMMUNITY, THEN COMPLETING YOUR VACCINATION SERIES AND BOOSTING, GIVES YOU A GOLD STANDARD OF PROTECTION.

IF YOU HAVE NEVER BEEN INFECTED, MOST CERTAINLY YOU SHOULD GET VACCINATED AND BOOSTED BUT I WANT PEOPLE TO UNDERSTAND THAT JUST HAVING AN INFECTION IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH, BECAUSE WE ARE NOT SURE OF WHAT ADDITIONAL VARIANTS MAY EMERGE AND AS LONG AS WE HAVE CONSIDERABLE AMOUNTS OF A POPULATION AROUND THE GLOBE WHO ARE UNVACCINATED, THE POSSIBILITY THAT CONCERNING VARIANTS COULD EMERGE WILL BE WITH US CONSISTENTLY, SO VACCINATE IF YOU'RE NOT VACCINATED.

BOOST IF YOU'RE NOT BOOSTED, EVEN IF YOU HAD A PREVIOUS INFECTION.

>> IT'S THE BOOSTERS HERE IN NEW JERSEY THAT ARE STILL LAGGING.

GIVEN THAT 90% NUMBER THAT GOVERNOR MURPHY MENTIONED, BOOSTERS ARE FAR BEHIND.

I SAW SOME NEWS REPORTED THIS WEEK THAT A NEW NASAL FORM OF A BOOERS MIGHT BE AVAILABLE.

EXPLAIN WHAT THAT IS.

>> SURE.

SO, WE'RE THINKING ABOUT WHERE IS THE VIRUS REPLICATING OR WHERE DO YOU HAVE HIGH VIRAL LOAD?

AND WE KNOW THAT WITH OMICRON, THERE HAS BEEN SOME DIFFERENCES THAN WHAT WE SAW WITH DELTA, AND THE THINKING IS THAT IF YOU COULD HAVE A NASAL BOOSTER WHERE YOU HAVE VIRUS PROLIFERATING AND THEN THAT VIRUS IS ABLE TO BE TRANSMITTED, YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO HEAD OFF SPREAD.

AND SO THE MORE THAT WE HAVE THESE DEVELOPMENTS IN THE SCIENCE, THE BETTER FOR US TO BE ABLE TO FINALLY, FIRMLY BEAT BACK THIS PANDEMIC.

SO I CONSIDER ALL OF THAT TO BE ENCOURAGING, AND AGAIN, ON THAT BOOSTER NEWS, YES, ROUGHLY ABOUT 50% OF THOSE WHO ARE ELIGIBLE TO RECEIVE A BOOSTER HAVE GOTTEN THEIR BOOSTER.

THAT IS SOMETHING TO CAUSE, YOU KNOW, CELEBRATION THAT WE HAVE ACHIEVED THAT MILESTONE, BUT WE NEED TO GO FURTHER.

THERE'S SO MUCH MORE WE CAN DO TO ENSURE WE HAVE THE BEST LEVEL OF PROTECTION ACROSS THE WIDEST SWATH OF THE POPULATION.

>> TELL US WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IN THE HOSPITALS RIGHT NOW, BECAUSE IN YOUR HOSPITAL IN PARTICULAR, WE'VE SEEN THE NUMBERS START TO GO DOWN.

WE SAW SOME SIGNIFICANT DROPS EARLIER IN THE WEEK, AND THEN THEY'RE KIND OF CREEPING BACK UP, BUT HOSPITAL LEVELS, IT SEEMS THE NUMBERS HAVE REMAINED PRETTY STEADY.

WHAT ARE YOU SEEING AT UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL?

>> ACTUALLY, WE'RE SEEING A DECLINE HERE AT UNIVERSITY.

AS YOU KNOW, WE WERE HIT VERY HARD IN THIS LATEST SURGE DUE TO THE OMICRON VARIANT, NOT ONLY DID WE SEE A SURGE ON OUR EMERGENCY DEPARTMENTS AND IN PATIENTS WHO WERE POSITIVE WITH CORONAVIRUS INFECTION, BUT WE HAD A CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT OF STAFF WHO WERE IMPACTED AS WELL.

CURRENTLY, WE SEE THAT WE HAVE LESS THAN 25, AROUND 20 OR SO PATIENTS, WHO HAVE ACTIVE CORONAVIRUS INFECTION.

THAT NUMBER IS HIGHER, IF YOU THINK ABOUT THOSE WHO WERE ONCE POSITIVE AND HAVE RECOVERED, AND THAT'S COMING FROM A HIGH OF 150, SO WE'RE MOVING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE ARE VERY, VERY HAPPY ABOUT, BUT WE CONTINUE TO REMAIN ON GUARD BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT AS LONG AS WE'RE IN A PANDEMIC, THINGS CAN CHANGE QUITE FREQUENTLY.

SO THIS IS ENCOURAGING AND WE'RE JUST HOLDING THE LINE.

>> HOSPITALS HAVE PUT IN PLACE VACCINE MANDATES, AND SOME HOSPITALS HAVE -- AND YOURS HAS AS WELL -- SOME HAVE LOST STAFF BECAUSE OF THAT.

BUT THERE IS A HOSPITAL WORKER SHORTAGE RIGHT NOW.

PUT THOSE TWO THINGS IN PERSPECTIVE, AND DO YOU BELIEVE THAT THE SHORTAGE WAS IN ANY WAY BECAUSE OF THOSE VACCINE MANDATES?

>> YOU KNOW, AT THE HOSPITAL, WHAT YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE IS HAPPENING IS THAT YOU HAVE THE SAFEST ENVIRONMENT POSSIBLE, THE SAFEST ENVIRONMENT FOR OUR PATIENTS AND THEIR FAMILIES AND COMMUNITY AND THE SAFEST ENVIRONMENT FOR OUR WORKERS.

THAT'S WHY WE HAD THOSE REQUIREMENTS AROUND VACCINATION, BECAUSE PEOPLE COME HERE TO GET BETTER.

WE DON'T WANT THIS TO BE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR SPREAD TO PROLIFERATE, AND ACTUALLY, WHEN WE PUT THOSE REQUIREMENTS IN PLACE, WE DIDN'T SEE A PRECIPITOUS LOSS AROUND THE NUMBER OF STAFF.

WE HAD A HANDFUL OF STAFF THAT WE LOST BECAUSE OF THAT REQUIREMENT, SO I'M REALLY ENCOURAGED BY THAT.

AND I APPLAUD OTHER INSTITUTIONS THAT HAVE STEPPED FORWARD AND SAY, LOOK, WE'RE GOING TO FOLLOW THE PUBLIC HEALTH GUIDELINES AND THE PROTOCOLS THAT WE KNOW WILL KEEP THE MAJORITY OF US SAFE AND PROTECTED, AND THAT'S WHAT I WOULD ENCOURAGE AND SAY FOR OTHERS TO STAY THE COURSE AND CONTINUE TO DO.

BUT YES, WE ARE SEEING A HEALTHCARE WORKER SHORTAGE, AND I DON'T THINK IT CAN BE ATTRIBUTED SPECIFICALLY TO VACCINE REQUIREMENTS.

IT'S BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE BELEAGUERED OR FATIGUED OR EVEN FRUSTRATED.

WE'VE BEEN IN A PANDEMIC FOR OVER TWO YEARS, AN UNPRECEDENTED PUBLIC HEALTH CRISIS, AND THAT IS REALLY CAUSING PEOPLE TO REIMAGINE AND RECONSIDER HOW THEY WANT TO WORK AND HOW THEY WANT TO LIVE OUT THEIR LIVES, SO WE JUST HAVE TO ENSURE THAT WE'RE CREATING THE SAFEST AND MOST POSITIVE WORK ENVIRONMENT POSSIBLE.

>> WELL SAID.

DR. CHRIS PARNELL, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> THANK YOU.

>> AND THANKS TO ALL OF OUR GUESTS FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK ON "CHAT BOX."

THAT'S ALL WE'VE GOT.

I'M JOANNA GAGIS.

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